MercoPress. South Atlantic News Agency
Obama is right: much to learn from CFK re-election; final vote count 54.11%
Argentine President Cristina Fernández obtained over 54% of votes in the presidential elections, according to the definitive vote count released Thursday by Interior Minister Florencio Randazzo. Read full article
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Disclaimer & comment rulesObama indeed has much to learn from CFK. For example how to get suitcases of money from overseas to help steal eletions, how to confiscate the pensions of the people and how to run the printing press to win an election. Also using thugs (piqueteros/SEIU) to muscle out dissent. Socialist totalitarians are all cut from the same cloth.
Nov 04th, 2011 - 10:09 am - Link - Report abuse 0All countries should learn from the Argentinian presidential election; there is much that should be absorbed and understood.
Nov 04th, 2011 - 12:13 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Obama and the rest should learn but should definitely not emulate.
what is it to be learned ? No opposition means , no division of power, no division of power , no check and balances. One party ruling the whole thing becomes a monarchy ,in this case “ El Pinguinato del Rio de la Plata” continues :(
Nov 04th, 2011 - 01:56 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Interesting. CFK has agreed along with all the G20 members not to implement protectionist policies and to roll back any recently implemented protectionist policies.
Nov 04th, 2011 - 02:07 pm - Link - Report abuse 0There is some confusion regarding the current situation.cfk won because millions voted for her.seiu/piqueteros is only a grouping like any other which probably had little influence in the total picture.what it does highlight is that in the near future an authoritarian reaction to the issues of the working class while cfk bends to the needs of capital is in prospect.over concerned emphasis on the role of seiu/piqueteros indicates that she only needs to win over a few of her own supporters(those who expect a bright future for their vote)to have support for repressive measures.Obama knows all about this,compare Iraq with Libya where there was no apparent yank involvement.in his own country he has a different scenario but there is nothing to learn here
Nov 04th, 2011 - 02:20 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Cristina & B.H.Obama are different persons in different projects.
Nov 04th, 2011 - 02:37 pm - Link - Report abuse 0B.H.Obama is from M.L.King obsessed CIA tooled since 1960th years by his mum was activated CIA in Indonesia.
Nestor & Cristina couple is not long period period project &planned before persons,but who put into effect from the beginning the year 2001.
@1 Obama already was taught by Bill Clinton how to get suitcases of money from overseas to buy elections. That money came from China and the BCI bank which was a front for the Peoples Liberation Army.
Nov 04th, 2011 - 03:17 pm - Link - Report abuse 0And, believe me, the printing presses are running full speed printing dollars; thats why dollars are becomming worthless. The american left and the democrat party have their union thugs. Pension confiscation is in the works. So, CFK was probably mentored by the socialist in sheeps clothing, BHO.
The similarities between the two Totalitarian Socialists is astounding. Both use “get the rich” rhetoric to fool jealous boobs, both use thug groups (piqueteros/SEIU) to stifle dissent and strong arm the opposition. Obama relies on a lapdog media, CFK uses the media law to hobble opponent media. Both have little respect for property rights and reward cronies with lots of cash from government projects at the expense of the taxpayer. CFK took illegal campaign cash to help win election. With Obama this remains to be proven
Nov 04th, 2011 - 03:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The similarities between the two totalitarian socialists are amazing ....
Nov 04th, 2011 - 04:50 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Pathetic and sad. We really are sick, is full of hatred and resentment against Argentina. You have no ability to make critical judgments with something so obvious. Despite all the shortcomings both the U.S. and Argentina they can not compare, no case with totalitarian states. These totally wrong.
First time that I agree with you Raul
Nov 04th, 2011 - 04:54 pm - Link - Report abuse 0** 6 Ed
Nov 04th, 2011 - 06:04 pm - Link - Report abuse 0BUT
these two persons have own maybe integral missions,
like that(1)
she could be very dangerous person ...
Cristina.F.Kirchner visited at the beginning of 2010 to Middle East
subsequently..
Egypt/Libya/Syria ...events started up....why?
like that(2)
Barry Obama was made President to the mission of to set up
independent Kurdistan and Iran operation...no result yet ! why ?
maybe Turkey/N.Iraq underground tunnel has not been finished
to make logistic support...., they need to have Japan tech to dig tunnel..!
I continue to be astounded how Argentina can keep shooting itself in the foot. With its great breadbasket, navigable waterways and educated population it should be a world power rivaling the USA. Instead it has run its franchise into the ground. As a foreigner, to me it appears to be Juan Peron that started this slide into poverty, obscurity and loss of freedom. The citizens continue to elect incompetent thieves again and again suggesting that the current State of affairs is well deserved. CFK herself appears to be a crook, liar and totalitarian of the first rank. Sadly the USA may be following this unillustrious path also.
Nov 04th, 2011 - 06:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 0pardon !!
Nov 04th, 2011 - 07:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0she visited at beginning of this year (2011) not 2010 !!
Wesley really what planet do you live on.La Nacion and Clarin are implacably opposed to Cfk.That is the two most important newspapers as is Canal 13 the most popular tv station.Yet unlike Blair and Cameron in England she doesnt lick ass of the Murdoch types and the people still vote her in WHY ITS THE ECONOMY STUPID ARGENTINAS GROWTH OVER KIRCHNER RULE HAS ONLY BEEN SURPASSED BY CHINA
Nov 04th, 2011 - 09:55 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@ 9 Mary Magdalene, you are the example of what a human being should not be. The government of Cristina de Kirchner and yourselves Kirchnerist fascists promote hatred and resentment against people and after you complain about hate speech and resentment against Argentina? WHAT THE F*CK DO YOU THINK THAT PEOPLE ARE STUPID? You have it inside Raúl.
Nov 05th, 2011 - 12:48 am - Link - Report abuse 0xbarilox.Fascists dont do elections or human rights or allow most of the media oppose them.CFK far from turning people against each other has just WON THE BIGGEST VOTE IN DECADES.The problem with u and anti fascist is u need to look in the mirror and look at the hate filled figure u have become
Nov 05th, 2011 - 06:55 am - Link - Report abuse 0Agree with o'gara on how jealous selfish viewpoint do affect people's judgement.if cfk turned into the leader of capitalist re-adjustment the same people would have a criticism and would express it violently.it's a fact the she was elected in a democratic election which was legitimate,the problem is,because it's a capitalist election,she doesn't have to deliver on her platform.therein lies the issue!
Nov 05th, 2011 - 10:26 am - Link - Report abuse 0“ . . . because it's a capitalist election,she doesn't have to deliver on her platform.therein lies the issue! ” Yul #17
Nov 05th, 2011 - 11:32 am - Link - Report abuse 0Just a little tease, Yul,
but in what 'non-capitalistic' types of elections would she have to deliver on her promises?
History doesn't seem to be providing me with ready answers ;-)
Are you saying hu jintao is not following the decisions of the national congress or that he won the presidency in a capitalist election.where in any recent capitalist election was support for the opposition in Libya an issue and where was banking reform spelt out.only a coalition of issue appear the other issues are left out,such unions having too many rights when labor costs need allocating to capital eg cfk
Nov 05th, 2011 - 01:25 pm - Link - Report abuse 0(#) 11 Amigo
Nov 05th, 2011 - 02:13 pm - Link - Report abuse 0F.dela Rua&some guys had some interrelations with H.Mubarak(Egypt)
2002- kicking him off (by helicopter)operation was successful ?wasn't it?
CFK won because it's been 8 years of stability and growth. She's been working hard since 2008. She survived attemps to destabilize our country by economic and mediatic corporations & monoplies. When she lost 2009 legislative election, the opposition had the chance to show whet they got. What they got was poor, they haven't managed to create alternatives because they only focused on opposing goverment plans. CFK like her late husband, make distribution of wealth one of the most important objetives of their plans, they reduce the Gini index, they created 4 millions jobs, she keeps industrializing Argentina.
Nov 06th, 2011 - 02:46 am - Link - Report abuse 0Our country changed a lot for well since 2003, that's why people vote for her. I'm very proud of CFK, she's the best we've ever had in decades. EEUU has ages of history, our country is younger, but seriously, she's better than Obama, he has much to learn from her, definitely.
** 21 Federico
Nov 06th, 2011 - 09:56 am - Link - Report abuse 0of course that the Argentine Construction Sector needs a “ Socorro ” plan
BUT
of course that could be very hard with like rakish Ivo guys...!!
well put Federico.She will have new challenges with the European implosion in the years ahead but she will do better than most
Nov 06th, 2011 - 10:01 am - Link - Report abuse 0What creates wealth over time are property rights and economic freedom. Argentina lacks in both. It functions as a crony reward system. The country is on a current easy money sugar high. As von Mises has pointed out this will all end badly with a “crack up boom”. That will be a disaster Argentines will remember. What perplexes me is that given CFK's track record of using foreign money to steal elections, nationalizing pensions and suppressing opposition media that she got even 10% of the votes
Nov 06th, 2011 - 12:08 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Jorge the only thing that creates wealth is labor,property rights gets money that can be used to bribe electors or get more property or some other form of investment.and economic freedom is a method to pervert the labor process for one's own benefit so that the theft in the labor exchange can take place.for all this to happen you need some power which the possession of money(capital) gives you.so to win an election by bribery is just another form of investment to increase your capital.why would cfk not do this? Only if she fails or is otherwise unable.
Nov 06th, 2011 - 04:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Economic freedom creates wealth? oh no, the economic freedom in Argentina only brought poverty and dependence, that was the reason our country crashed in 2001. We're not stupids to fall again in the same trick, not us. Don't worry, that won't be a disaster for Argentina, we've been hearing that type of predictions since 2003, it's been 8 years and nothing big happen, in 2008/9 the world suffered a crisis, and we didn't feel much, in other times world crisis like that impacted negatively in our country. I know there's things to fix, I'm not trying to sell a “perfect goverment” or something like that, I think that doesn't exists either. We found a way, and we're not going to return to the old trickery of “economic freedom”.
Nov 06th, 2011 - 08:20 pm - Link - Report abuse 0And also, don't worry about “foreign money to steal elections”, that was part of a ferocious campaign, she won legitimately, I was part of the voting counting.
“Nationalizing pensions” allowed the goverment to increase minimal pensions, and stop the AFJP stealing system. Oh, and by the way, corporation media like Clarín & La Nación were part of the AFJP stealing system, one of the reasons they use their media (newspapers, webpages, journals, tv, radio) to invent campaigns like Antonini, amongst others.
Argentina has not had economic freedom in recent history. If it did it would be wealthy. It is poor because it lacks property rights and economic freedom. Its simple as that. The richest countries (AngolSaxon, Switzerland, Singapore, HongKong) have economic freedom and that is why they are rich. Since Argentina has had multiple devaluations in the past it surprises me that you cannot see the upcoming one. Its current affairs are that of cronyism on the part of the Peronists
Nov 06th, 2011 - 10:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“ . . . because it's a capitalist election,she doesn't have to deliver on her platform.therein lies the issue! ” Yul #17, from #18 & 19
Nov 07th, 2011 - 10:37 am - Link - Report abuse 0'Just a little tease, Yul,
but in what 'non-capitalistic' types of elections would she have to deliver on her promises?'
Perhaps in Cuba, Venezuela, North Korea, China? No, a lot of exhortation and 'official bombast' around, but do these national leaders actually *have to* deliver on their promises? What happens to them if they fall short?
Geoff,your view on what should be delivered by a leader is that the economy should take precedence,and the capitalist economy is not something anyone can predict over a term of a presidency.if the economy goes well all the pledges to improve health,infrastructure,living standards etc might get delivered.however should the economy under preform they will not unless you borrow or print money.none of this happens in the economies you highlighted as the president has to adhere to the congress and the central committee makes the day to day decisions.The president does not promise to deliver what will get the party s/he represents elected whether it is feasible or not but they do have greater control of economic activity nationally and are therefore better informed than in other countries.it is interesting for the future,how much of china'seconomic future is tied to the trade it does abroad, as this is a new departure,but china has most certainly grown and is distributing the wealth created without property rights or economic freedom
Nov 07th, 2011 - 03:04 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Yul,
Nov 07th, 2011 - 07:11 pm - Link - Report abuse 0you are right in the sense that governments of the far-right and far-left tend to be authoritarian and do not have to answer to the people. The closer to a dictatorship you get the less you have to promise to deliver and the less any shortfall on delivery is important to the maintenance of power.
And, of course, it helps if you have total control of the media.
The nearer to the politics of the middle-ground you are - especially in a democracy - the more meaningful your promises become and the more you can be held to account.
Checks and balances.
Naked power is a great way of control in a far-left or far-right command economy,
but 'By the people, for the people' is the language of the centre-ground democracies - however much the competing parties converge on the centre whilst declaring their difference.
I know which type of national management I prefer . . . I know one or two people here call me a neo-liberal, perhaps this is what they mean.
I know what you are saying in#30 Geoff and that it's what you believe ,the only thing I can highlight to you,is that it is not the electorate which takes precedent when difficulty arises.an example here is how the electorate in Greece is being dealt with at present,ie they are irrelevant because the demands of capital is prioritised.And in the present circumstances I can understand that it will have to be done somehow,but it will be the poorest that will pay and the knowledgeable ones will protect themselves.in every crises of this kind a new capital power will be formed.the fear is that cfk will face a similar event,that is a political crisis where she will have to address capital's needs at the expense of the poorest.I don't know how you could avoid this type of solution when or if this crisis manifests itself in Argentina.therefore you will see I am more concerned with who a government represents,the 'people' or capital,national and international than the type of government it is.o'gara recognises the crisis is likely but that cfk will handle it better but I don't think Obama looked that comfortable with her in Cannes,so I don't understand how he can predict she will handle any better than who knows.
Nov 07th, 2011 - 10:05 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Thanks, Yul.
Nov 08th, 2011 - 12:07 am - Link - Report abuse 0Good chat.
And now, as they say in England - 'time to turn in'.
#32....point 1/I fully agree....point2/can't comment but have a good day.
Nov 08th, 2011 - 01:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Commenting for this story is now closed.
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