Massive protest in central London against public spending cuts and higher taxes
Thousands of British protesters marched through central London on Saturday against public spending cuts and tax rises enacted by a government fighting accusations it is run by an upper-class elite that ignores the plight of recession-hit voters.
Blowing horns and whistles, protesters filed past the Houses of Parliament behind a banner declaring “Austerity is Failing”, calling on Prime Minister David Cameron to do more to revive Britain's struggling economy.
The march comes at a time when Cameron's Conservative-led coalition is reeling from the resignation on Friday of a senior minister accused of calling police “plebs”, a class-laden insult for working people.
Cameron's party has faced a barrage of negative headlines over the departure of Andrew Mitchell - the “Chief Whip” or party enforcer - four weeks after he swore at police guarding the gates to Cameron's Downing Street office.
A separate row involving Finance minister George Osborne, who sat in a first class train carriage with a standard class ticket before paying for an upgrade, added ammunition to critics who say the Conservatives are privileged and out-of-touch.
“Who Do They Think They Are?” asked the Daily Mail newspaper in a front page headline, while the Financial Times said the bad news over Mitchell and Osborne capped a “dismal week for the Tories”, the centre-right party that is trailing in the polls.
Under grey autumnal skies, demonstrators waved banners saying “No Cuts”, “Tax the Rich, Teach the Poor” and “Plebs of the World Unite”, poking fun at Mitchell's resignation.
Others handed out leaflets decorated with Wild West-style “Wanted” posters bearing Cameron's picture and the message: “Running a government by and for millionaires”.
Nurses, cleaners, librarians and ambulance drivers were among tens of thousands who joined the march and a rally in London's central Hyde Park, in one of the biggest anti-austerity protests this year. Marches were also scheduled to take place in Belfast, Northern Ireland, and Glasgow, Scotland.
Trade union leaders are trying to use the rally to pile more pressure on Cameron, telling protesters the government's economic plan has failed and only prolonged Britain's recession.
“Austerity isn't working. It is hammering the poorest and the most vulnerable,” Brendan Barber, head of the Trades Union Congress, an umbrella group which represents 54 unions, will say in a speech at the rally.
“Ministers told us that if we only accept the pain, recovery would come. Instead we have been mired in a double-dip recession.”
The coalition government has responded to calls from unions and the opposition Labour Party to do more to increase growth by relaxing planning laws and boosting lending to businesses.
But its latest attempt to ease the pressure on squeezed households backfired this week when Cameron said the government would legislate to force energy companies to give customers their lowest tariff. The announcement appeared to take his own ministers by surprise and sowed confusion over what he meant and whether it would actually happen.
Cameron's party staked its 2010 election campaign on the austerity program, calling for deeper cuts to welfare spending in the years to come while dismissing the idea of a tax on the wealthy.
In an emergency budget announced after winning power, his coalition government said it would cut most departmental budgets by an average of around 20% over four years. It announced a public sector pay freeze; set a new ceiling on the total state benefits any family can receive and cut tax relief on pensions. It has also raised the VAT sales tax to 20% from 17.5%, increased taxes on alcohol and tobacco and raised payroll taxes for employees.
Opposition Labour leader Ed Miliband said the government's policies had damaged the economic recovery. “They told us austerity would help our economy grow. But our economy has not grown. It has flat-lined,” he will tell the demonstration in a speech.
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Chuckle chuckle©... I luuuuuuv British humor......
It's time to leave town Came-moron, and when you do, take your little b*tch Nick Clegg with you.
They have some good points.
Strangely enough, you lot seem to care much more when the Argentines are protesting...
For those of you that can read Spanish.....
www.pagina12.com.ar/diario/elpais/1-206036-2012-10-21.html
Most of the world- certainly the freeworld- has been guilty of the same thing- spending beyond income - for too many years - and now reality has come home to roost! There is no painless answer.
Us plebs with our personal credit cards are just as guilty!
We all need to learn- if you have not got it - do NOT spend it!
And alternance is the only way to stop corruption, that of this gov is very high. Nice boat of the architect of our Queen in Sta cruz, for ex.Obviously it is on Perfil, not in P12. I dont see richness been distributed on the contrary I see lot of gov using Vuitton and living in Puerto Madero.
As for the demonstrations, well that's the right of these people. However I did see interviews with some of them on the news, and while a few came across as concerned, well read people, some of the others sounded like they came from cloud cuckoo land.
When asked what they would do to reduce the deficit, most of them looked stumped and couldn't answer beyond taxing all the millionaires, which will really help the economy - not!
Some interviewed though, had thought it through a bit more, but even they were stumped at what they would actually do if they were in power.
The simple truth, that all of the political parties in the UK seem to agree on is that you can't spend your way out of debt, and that cuts are inevitable. They only differ on what will be cut and how quickly.
The recession in the late 70's was far worse than this, with rampant inflation, sprialling costs, and decreased productivity, and a huge increase in unemoployment.
Most of the people protesting have never really had it difficult in their lives. Those of us that are older, just shrug our shoulders and try to reassure people that, like all recessions it will pass, and the good times will come again.
Okay, so you can't afford your designer clothes, or you x-box, iPod etc, so what? It's when you can't afford to eat, that's when these people will truly be in financial straits. I don't see that happening anytime soon.
You don't speak for the British people, troll.
You are an Argentine troll pretending to be British.
Whatever profits the British Overseas Territories make belongs to them, not to the UK, and always will.
Why don't you troll on the Ghanaian threads and tell them how they're being too harsh to the poor Argentines? Isn't that what La Campora are paying you to do?
Cameron keeps throwing the disabled and young generations to the wolves.
1973 rich British living in Argentina(8000 miles from UK) keep sucking money from UK.
The price about Malvinas attitude will be so expensive.....
These protesters are just selfish people wanting more than what they already had before the economic problems started in 2008.
Yes some of the governments plans appear like they are going to effect the poor the most, where the poor pay more than the rich pay. Sure the rich should be made to pay a bigger share than they already are, but under the conservatives that simple is not going to happen any time soon.
Personally, all these cuts and higher living expenses have had little to no impact on myself or my family and its likely similar to for the vast majority too. Off course our bills and food prices have gone up, but its well with in manageable for the majority of us Brits. Put it this way Guzz, must Brit families with 2 children still have a good £600 - £1,000 left over each month, after paying bills and for food, and that's on lower income too. Which is more than what you would earn in Argentina in 2 months - After all category a national minimum wage per month is 2,271 peso which is equal to £299.56 British pounds.
Serious Guzz the issue the UK are tackling are nothing compared to the complete economic collapse that your country is experiencing - which most of us here warned your fellow Argentina's about months ago.
And Marcos, your forgetting something, your country relies on AID given to it by UK and other countries. Oh and every country in the world that was effected by the economic problems have seen an increase in soup kitchens, its is something to be expected. So making a big issue out of it makes you look a fool.
I'm in Denmark, and they are still doing better than you lot as well. I would believe I could get that amount of the Danes without even working, should I want to, so don't play Richie Rich, you are a nobody in that behalf as well.
Still, do you feel it? Companies moving to Asia, taking working places with them, a constantly bigger amount of pensionists, a constanly smaller amount of hands to take care of them, unpaid pensions that are impossible to fund in the future...
Good luck mate, you'll need it.
Now it's time to courageous Gvts. to take the measures to retrieve the budgets to the real level that they never should be lost according with the incomes they had.....No country can stay healthy if its people works too few hours a week, have retirement to young with too high pension level or with too much dismissals guaranties....like Greece, Spain and others.....At the end the bill must be paid with the sacrifice that it involves as we are watching daily......
Of course, those that felt their rights to get incomes and privileges without hard works or used to spend much more that they can have the right to protest “peacefully” any time they whish....and offer different smart ways to recover the health to the economy, not just with the brainwashed banner “up the rich's taxes” as the only solution.....
Time to live their lives at the real level they can and not with a borrowed level....That is it all the matter.
@9 And you're always full of crap.
@10 Don't read the gibberish of the poor.
@13 Argieland's problems can be solved in 24 hours. Politicians. Plaza de Mayo. Wooden blocks. Axes. Chop, chop, chop, chop, chop.
@15 Argie children are already dying of malnutrition. Government ministers suggest feeding children pigeons. Or is that feeding children to pigeons?
@16 Did you know that there is a reasonable, detectable scenario? An argie faggot is a faggot is a faggot is a faggot. Got the idea, faggot?
@18 Meanwhile, argies are short of certain inessentials. Food, water, power, toilets, jobs.
@19 Here's a tip, tosspot. You should get your rowboats to set “sail” right now. I estimate that you can now land your 80 troops 200 miles offshore. Protected by your biplane air force. Think on. Rowing 400 miles takes a while. Meanwhile, as the “united kingdom” commes to collapse, dropping a concrete block in a rowboat has an effect. “pakis”? You know how things work. Free one-way air tours. Skydiving lessons. Cave exploration. Really deep diving (These concrete blocks overcome natural buoyancy).
@21 Still skiving then. Otherwise known as stealing. Working on identifying you to Danish immigration authorities. Every effort must be made to identify and eliminate terrorists. Let's take no chances. Shoot on sight! Or, to put it another way, if it's argie, kill it!
Government spending is rocketing away and is greater now than before the mythical cuts.
How can that be? Either the government is cutting back or they are spending more.
Where are they spending, if indeed they are?
Things in the public sector got out of hand when New Labour (NL) were in power with them ‘stuffing’ their own supporters into local government, hoping to always be in power as a result. Clearly these people were not as stupid as NL thought they were.
Retrenchment back to core capacity is what is desperately needed but the coalition of prats that is there now is unable to do it.
I have been in Berlin the past few days enjoying the sunshine and some history, some of these clowns could do with checking out for themselves what a 'workers paradise' is really like
Soup kitchens? Your evidence?
Oh you haven't got any have you? Well let me inform you, Marcos, that the poor of Britain earn the same as the middle class in Argentina.
Yes people protested, as is their right, but what is more telling is how many didn't protest. If British people were truly that upset by the spending cuts, millions would be on the street, not a few thousand.
This recession is nothing, really, I mean I've lived through 3 recessions and this is nowhere near the worst.
What you have is a generation of people who used to spend money like it was going out of fashion now realising that they may have to do without a few things for a while
They'll get used to it. Recessions don't last forever.
@24 - lightthink
Why should the Scots be exempt? The Scottish Parliment get their share of the natnional tax money to spend as they please. Since they are still part of the UK it would be unfair to increase the tax of the English Wesh and Irish, but not of the Scots. It may lead to bad feelings.
In regards to Scottish independence, well the last opinion poll put it at 30% in favour and 58% against independence. Why? Because the SNP won't tell them how an independent Scotland would run. They've basically said that an Independent Scotland would either be the EU's biatch or the UK's biatch, but they would also be worse off because their economic policies would be restricted by the interest rates set by either the European central bank or the Bank of England.
So most Scots are asking, what's the point of independence, when we will be worse off and not actually fully independent anyway?
@27 - Brasileiro
It's UK not England.
Corruption? Well yes every country has some, but let's see where our respective countries lie on the corruption index:
UK -16
Ghana - 69
Brazil - 73
Argentina - 100
I think Brazil still has a way to go before they can lecture the UK on corruption.
Top spot is held by New Zealand, so perhaps we should get them to teach us.
You are so corrupted that you come 16th even in your own lists??? That must be truly bad...
“Soup kitchens? Your evidence?”
Why? Do you need a plate or a job?
Job Vacancy
“The Soup Kitchen requires a part-time Manager/Cook for 5 mornings a week starting from mid-October”
www.amchurch.co.uk/soup_kitchen.htm
www.guardian.co.uk/society/2012/jun/19/breadline-britain-hungry-schoolchildren-breakfast
Secondly. You clearly are well behind on the latest news in global business and economics aren't you! You see for the last 3 years companies have been leaving China and returning to the UK and Europe leaving thousands of once vibrate factories in china empty and stripped of all machinery. Why? Simple, because it more expensive to produce in china, ship to Europe or other continents, then it is to actually produce goods in the UK or Europe. Off course certain goods are cheaper to produce elsewhere, such as producing in Indonesia where the monthly wage is $100 less than it is in china for the average worker.
Seriously check you facts before sprouted utter outdated rubbish.
Oh and another thing. I don't know where you got that crap about pensions not being paid, but its a load of rubbish like the rest of the crap your sprouted. after all i think we would have heard about it here in Britain and have been on the streets protesting in disgust, before you even read about it in the news.
And last but not least. Most modern nations are experiencing the same problem of growing number of pensioners, not just the UK. Why? Because more and more people are simply living longer compared to 50 years ago.
I'm sorry for the people.
Well since demonstrations and strikes happen nearly every day in Argentina perhaps you save your sympathy for your own people.
The people who protested have had their say, given the government something to think about, but at the end of the day those people will go back to their normal lives and get on with it.
A few thousand people protested. Millions didn't. A small minority care enough to voice their discontent with the government cuts. Millions don't like the cuts but recognise that you can't spend your way out of debt. So we have anew bad years of having to tighten our belts s bit, and not buying designer gear. That's were it's really biting people in their disposable income.
As for people on benefits, so some of them are having their benefits reduced. Well so what? Everyone has had to take paycuts and pay freezes over the last few years. Those on benefits had been exempt, now they're not, and they can join the rest of the people in being unable to buy the stuff they want, instead of just buying hat they actually need.
I'm sorry for the people as well.
These mofos in utter denial tends to forget that while the middle class is being scavenged and the poor are getting poorer, the rich ones are hitting the jackpot...
Many times has it happened in Europe that people stopped spending because of fear of the market. Always has the balanced itself after a while when the fear loosen up. But never did the companies move to China en masse before...
@35 Denial - Lol Guzz, no one here is in denial about anything, yes the poorest are being hit the hardest by the government cuts i acknowledged that myself earlier. I also acknowledged that the rich should pay more, that includes myself, but unless the government do anything to change it then all i can do is donate to charities that support the most vulnerable.
I agree with you the richer are getting richer and the poorer getting poorer, but then its not just Europe its the same in every nation including Argentina. Just look at how much money CFK has made compared to those living in the BA slums.
In your country,teaboy,there are 1m young people with no jobs.I find it a terrible indication of greed and selfishness to not think that it is not a serious failure of the economy and the politics of the country.
As I understand the idea of saying one gives to charity is a way of being selfish and uncaring because many many people claim they give but really they don't. To be clear about where you are in the situation,did you take part in the demonstration or were you one of those who didn't.It is important because people associate not attending with disagreeing with the sentiments.The silent majority isn't it?Using the same logic I could claim(rather than highlight),support for keeping so many young without work,and with all the other negative aspects of the situation in the UK.Wouldn't you agree?
I don't think LEP the font of opinion would,but you can quite easily assess people can't you.
I truly don't care about “you vs us”, I spent most of my life in Europe and have seen what is done good as well. And that's a lot, the German effectivity, the Scandinavian organisation, and yes, even the British strength of will. Uruguay has other attributes that I think are just as important, as does Argentina. But we are not made up by those attributes and in every country, all of them are represented. No one has patent on abilities, and no one should have patent on life either. I don't pretend to believe that we can all be born equal, but as someone said, at least give us the equal right to be different.
As for the rich vs poor it's a whole other matter. That is the eternal battle between right and left, individual vs community, at the end of the day, right vs wrong. I believe this would be the only time where left is right and right is wrong, but that is not for me to decide...
You are always very critical of people who are charitable, aren't you?
Are you a miser than refuses to help the less well off than yourselves?
In the UK we admit we have problems, but compared to Argentina we're on cloud 9.
Tell me Yuleno, what happens to a socialist government when the labour unions that used to support them start giving them ultimatums?
@40 - Guzz
Yes you live in that wonderful world when everything is black and white.
Why is the 'right' always perceived (in your mind anyway) as wrong?
Some of the worst dictators in history have been on the left, so maybe the left isn't as 'right' as you'd like it to be.
The left support lots of ideas that I myself support, however, they don't act financially responsible in such matters.
As Margaret Thatcher once said: The main problem with socialism is that they will eventually run out of other people's money.
That is what happened in the UK. The left spent and spent and spent, and then borrowed and spent that, and while in the short term it helped a lot of people, in the longer term they are now feeling the cost of that false economy.
I find it amusing that those who are protesting easily forget who exactly got us into this mess. If the Labour (socialist) government hadn't created such a huge deficit by borrowing and spending irresponsibly, then the UK wouldn't have been so badly placed when the world wide recession hit.
That is why these austerity measures are needed. The Public Sector and Private Sector workers are already taking pay freezes and pay cuts. Well it's time for those on benefits to share some of that burden too.
In an ideal world it wouldn't have to happen, but none of us live in an ideal world (except of course for your United SoAm Socialist Republic, Guzz).
Less than 1% of the UK population protested. The rest just accept that austerity has to happen to pull the UK back into the black, when the 'good' times can start again.
Meanwhile the puppet of the Monarch and bankers performs his best cuts like “Scissorhands”.
GB is like a big gunpowder magazine waiting for the right spark to blow up.
1-Serious financial and economic problems.
2-Income inequity, where rich are getting richer and poor getting poorest.
3-Social exclusion and racial tension.
@Teaboy2
In 2009 in Britain more than 3m people were at risk of malnutrition and getting worse. The thing you don’t get it in the news, don’t make you malnutrition free.
More than 3m Britons at risk of malnutrition, reports says.
www.guardian.co.uk/society/2009/feb/10/malnutrition-health-social-exclusion
Britain's poorest families facing malnutrition in recession
www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/britains-poorest-families-facing-malnutrition-386415
www.trust.org/alertnet/blogs/alertnet-news-blog/britains-silent-epidemic-of-hunger-malnutrition-and-food-insecurity
“There’s an estimated 350,000 children living in severe poverty in London, many a stone’s throw from the Olympic Village, but it’s in our state schools where deprived children are being noticed in ever increasing numbers. Nearly 90 percent of the schools we surveyed said poor nutrition was impacting their children, 5 schools said that over 70 percent of their pupils were affected by food insecurity, 4 schools told us that over half their children are malnourished and 5 schools reported that over 60 percent of their children are being affected by hunger. Childhood food insecurity, hunger and malnutrition are now a silent epidemic, an inconvenient symptom of a confluence of top down failures.”
Meanwhile KaMoron announces...
“That he has committed himself to reducing child malnutrition rates in poor countries ”
www.guardian.co.uk/global-development/2012/aug/13/uk-hunger-summit-global-malnutrition
@LEPWrong
Do be silly please...
Every country blames their government, but what they fail to see is that this “financial crisis” isn't a response to the bankers robbery and speculation on the market. That was just the hyenas eating before famine. They lost control of the market, and the capitalistic run was won by a communist state. Because the market doesn't care, it wants profit, it lives and dies for profit. Making people's lives dependant on a force that you can't control within certain limits, is not wise, as you will see a global development that will responde to the market as countries do today, with winners and loosers. The problem arises when the looser isn't a person anymore, but a whole country, as happens in Greece today.
The solution is local production, that would kill 2 flies in 1 hit, as the costs of transportation today (I'm talking about emissions) is just ridiculous.
Well the UK has been through much worse recessions than this and survived. This time will be no different.
However, it really is a case of the pot calling the kettle back when you own country can even cough up a mere US$20 million to get it's 'ickle sailing ship back.
That's embarrassing! That humiliating!
So some people used their right to protest! It happens quite often, and very rarely are their enough people to effect change.
Yup, after the next general election there may be a new government, that's democracy for you.
But all the policitcal parties in the UK have stated that they would have to make cuts, it's just that the coalition government have to put their 'bad guy' hats on now and actually make the cuts. If Labour got in, then they'd be the 'bad guys' again.
You all sound rather young. The world goes through these financial crises every now and then. But guess what? The world keeps on turning.
Oh and Guzz, if communism was so great how come they had to murder more than 20 million of their own people to keep control?
@40 - i think leprecon did enough to respond to your post.
@42 - Atleast post a link that actually works and shows an article that actually exists.
@43 - Yes “report says” Funny though that the report was based on assumed future predictions that never actually came about as it failed to take into account how people would cut back on other luxuries such as holidays, and stay in rather than go out at weekends to the pub - Over here poverty is not defined as the same way poverty is defined in Argentina or third world countries, its defined as lower class, which get housing benefit and child benefits to feed and clothe their children - Yet despite all your links not one child has died of or been hospitalised for malnutrition as a result of being poor. Only time a child has died of malnutrition here in modern times is through anorexia or at the hands of evil parents.
@45 - Doesn't matter when they are due. What matters is the UK is expected to pull out of the double dip recession by the end of this week. In other words, what the government is right for the economy and growth is expected by the end of the year. Whilst Argentina's growth is in free fall decline. You should be more worried about whether you will ever get to see another election in Argentina, because if the law makers there get their way CFK will be president for life and her fat controller son will likely be her heir.
You post are just BS, UK is falling apart like Spain but asynchronous.
50% of economy turnover in certain region within UK was a result of govt. spending, KaMoron is cutting and cutting worsening economy activity that slowly will hit everyone while pumping money into fraudulent banks.
What do you think will be the result of this policy?
Don’t bother to make work you 2 poor neurones left, the answer will be a complete collapse of the UK economy.
www.debtbombshell.com/
@52 - Find if they want to leave the UK let them. Oh but then without the financial spending from the UK Government to pay for their public services, they would each go broke in a relatively short period of time. Must product and industry and population (tax payers whom fund the cost of their public services) live in? Yeah you guessed it, in England.
As for debt bombshell, well its nothing compared to the total debt of 200% of the GDP that we had at the end of world war 2 - Which was paid back in full without ever defaulting. And the moment the Debt is only around the 60% of GDP mark so its just a drop in the ocean compared to what we have been through in the past. Which makes you and your fellow Argentinea look even more stupid with all your doom and gloom hysteria. lol
Do the rest of the world a favor. Get an education, learn maths and economics and above all learn to act like adults instead of little kid the either cry or get hysterical about something that is actually nothing when seen in the wider picture.
I never ever mentioned communism, even though I don't think you can blame an ideology for what people has done in its name. Nowhere in the communist manifest does it say you need to kill 20M, and I wouldn't blame all those millions dead as a consequence of capitalism, would I?
It would seem to me that you ran out of responses and went for the usual solution, mentioning communism/socialism/terrorism/narco trafficking...
That's always your final life-line, isn't it? Spread lies and rumour, de-qualifying people and destabilising nations. Got news for you, old man, and I understand if its difficult for you to grasp, but internet and smartphones made it a lot harder for you lot to lie and decieve. Not that you don't do it anymore, it's just that nobody believes you anymore...
The Falklands don't 'costings' the UK taxpayer anything. They are a completely self-sufficient British Overseas Territory.
The defence of the Falklands costs the UK less than 3% of the defence budget.
Is that embarrassing for you, Maldives? That less than 3% of the UK defence budget counters 100% of Argentinas defence budget?
You are the only one that feels naked when not spending too much cash on scrap metal. Nobody is ashamed or embarrassed for the weaponry they lack or for some pirates backed by westeners hiding in the cayman islands trying to steal a ship.
That's common behaviour for you lot, nobody expected less of you...
British population: 62,262,000 (UK) - 2.563 (Malvinas)
2.563 islanders equals 0.004% of the British population.
3% of the Defence budget wasted to “defend” 0.004% of a VIP population from mighty (?) argentine navy (whose ships can barely float).
I repeat... I wonder what these protestors think about the UK spendings to maintain a colonial outpost in Argentina...
Excellent article by Chantal Mouffe: “We must Americanize Europe latino”
www.pagina12.com.ar/diario/elpais/1-206036-2012-10-21.html
Cristina Fernandez de Kirchner is right “are still a crude colonial power in decline”.
World public opinion and can not be fooled. England already has the red card for a long time. The IMF and World Bank turns a blind eye to their plight and sinks like a big powder keg waiting for a spark to explode.
1 - High levels of internal and external corruption linked to the global economic crisis, the IMF, the U.S. banks and the World Bank.
2 - Serious financial and economic problems by neoliberal policy and arms. While Argentina commitment to peace and international law, England bet to violence, colonialism and imperialism. We demonstrate the humanitarian bombing civilians in Iraq, Libya and Afghanistan and supporting the rebels in Syria with their kills. It is very clear that bet to distract domestic public opinion by sending destroyers to the Malvinas but failed in his deception.
3 - Income inequality, where the rich get richer and the poor poorer. In its policy of protecting banks and private financial crisis caused a level all its economic model and its imperialist colonialist plunder piracy, extraction, plundering and exploitation of natural resources in the world that do not belong becoming a danger to world peace.
4 - Social exclusion and racial tension. The history of racism in England is well known to the world and the consequences of social exclusion has been turned against him. The Republic of Ireland is Northern Ireland recover. Wales and Scotland want to be separated from the UK. This is not a minor detail to consider. The colonialist and imperialist Europe increasingly divides while South America joins growing (OAS, CELAC, UNASUR and MERCOSUR. Britain is reaping what it has sown and increasingly this only for its colonialism and imperialism.
Most of those protesters would probably support the Falklanders right to self-determination, and would be glad to ensure it by any means necessary. After all, where Britain stations its military on its own territory is no concern of yours.
Face it, the 3% spent on the Falklands is nothing, plus we get to train our forces in different terrains and weather conditions. More than worth it.
Once again Maldives, the Falklands are a British Overseas Territory, they have never belonged to Argentina. British claim 1690. Argentine claim 1833, which is really strange as Argentina didn't exist until 1853.
If you had any serious evidence or your claims you would've taken them to the International Court of Justice years ago. But you don't, and the Falklands will still be British territory long after Argentina as ripped itself apart through civil war due to the corruption of your leaders.
So Guzz. The millions murdered by Stalin were killed because they were capitalists. Hmm. No they were killed for various reasons, especially anyone who was considered a threat to him. Face it Guzz, communisum is about oppressing people, not equalising them.
You also say you don't need the military to achieve your dreams. Well good for you, since your military is practically non existent. However, your dreams will never include the Falklands, will it?
True... then move Mount Pleasant to British territory and there´ll be no issue.
“We get to train our forces in different terrains and weather conditions.” Are Malvinas conditions that different from UK´s?
“The Falklands are a British Overseas Territory, they have never belonged to Argentina.”
Maybe you can then explain why the UK government negotiated sovereignty with the Argentine dictatorship a few years before the war. Was it charity? Maybe you can also axplain why despite of the argentine lack of “serious evidence” the UN understands there´s a sovereignty dispute (and not a case of self-detemination).
I'll have to repeat myself;
Every country blames their government, but what they fail to see is that this “financial crisis” isn't a response to the bankers robbery and speculation on the market. That was just the hyenas eating before famine. They lost control of the market, and the capitalistic run was won by a communist state. Because the market doesn't care, it wants profit, it lives and dies for profit. Making people's lives dependant on a force that you can't control within certain limits, is not wise, as you will see a global development that will responde to the market as countries do today, with winners and loosers. The problem arises when the looser isn't a person anymore, but a whole country, as happens in Greece today.
The solution is local production, that would kill 2 flies in 1 hit, as the costs of transportation today (I'm talking about emissions) is just ridiculous.
Why do you suddenly feel tyhe need to talk about communism? And Stalin???
I wonder what these protestors think about the UK spendings to maintain a colonial outpost in Argentina...
Teaboy are you still checking your profit to forecast figures.You are still trying to convince that you know what you are talking about.Perhaps you might re-check the debt to GDP ratio as I think you'll find you could be wrong.Its nice to know you are still giving to charity at this time.
Are thére wc cocks in Látin American countries toiléts ?
Sure mate, have a seat...
1-Britain defaulted on loans in the ’30 and many times on its history.
2- The UK problem is not the public debt AKA domestic debt which is denominated in British Pounds, the real problem is the debt that it is kept in other “account” called debt external what its made of the debt of the public sector + the privates (mostly bankers). Without a strong economy activity how is the govt and privates to get the $$ to repay their debt? How is the State to get revenues from taxation?
And the toxic debt?
Privates will start to default on their loans and bankers will not get $$ to pay foreigner lenders, what will cause a massive run on banks and financial collapse.
Northern Rock and SBS caused a big hole on UK finances there were talks in August a complete nationalisation the banks. www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/banksandfinance/9445618/Cabinet-discusses-full-nationalisation-of-RBS.html
Can you imagine what would be a complete financial collapse?
3-Now guess how bad is the situation of indebted economies that the IMF is proposing to get rid of the fractional banking system and replaced it by state money creation.
This sure will sound as a crazy idea if Hugo Chavez will think on something like that, I wouldn’t even imagine if Queen Cristina would even mention something like that, but IMF????
www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/comment/9623863/IMFs-epic-plan-to-conjure-away-debt-and-dethrone-bankers.html
There is no way out of the financial mess caused by bankers in US and UK under the current system, so you have to default or get rid of the bankers.
Now imagine what would be UK without a private banking system?
Yes, like Greece but with bad weather.
The British police also emptied a magasine on a Brazilian student that was in a hurry to catch the tube... Shot him dead on the spot...
1 - What you refer to a default in the 1930's was not actually a default, it was an enforced cut in the coupon on war loan that took place in 1932, from 5pc to 3.5pc. The prospectus for the original war loan gave the Treasury the right to redeem the stock at any time. Given that interest rates had at that time sunk significantly below the original rate, all the Debt Management Office was doing was exercising its right to refinance the debt at a lower rate - Therefore no default ever occurred, as all Britain did was exercise its right to keep interest down to that of current interest rates at the time.
2 - I never mentioned anything about public debt. Only that current level of debt is around 60% GDP a far cry from the 200%+ of GDP it was at the end of world war 2. Oh and for the record, Government debt is repaid using taxpayers money, why do you think they have cuts in spending on public services in the first place. Off course government income from other sources also partly go towards debts too. Their is no government Toxic debt either as we pay in full with interest on all our debts.
3 - Reference your alleged talks of discussions to buy out the remaining stakes of NR and RBS - That's a load of rubbish, even the article you linked to stated in the first sentence, that they played down reports in a the financial times, in fact all they were actually discussing was how to get banks to increase lending, You should learn to read the articles before jumping to assumptions from the titles alone!
As for your assumption that their is no way out of the financial mess the UK and US are in and we would have to default. Well your assumption is a poor one. We were in a 3 times worse situation in the late 1940's with 200%+ Debt of GDP and it took us to the early 1980's to fully recover, but we did all while kicking Argentina back side - It will only take us 10-15 years to bring the debt back to down to what it was pre 2008. Unlike Argentina!
Why even bother responding to these silly malvinistas?
1) UK may not be perfect but its light years in front of Argentina.
2) The Argentines will never get their grubby thieving hands on the Falklands.
Thats all we need to know to counter their stupidity.
Peace♥
Well i can't answer for Leprecon, but i personally love to see the Muppet's scramble about trying to pull even more rubbish out of their hats. Its clear they post links to articles purely because of the articles title without taking the time to read the actual article which only helps to make them look even more stupid and ignorant about real facts :)
1- Well this is a default because Britain was unable to meet the legal obligation in full.
2- This is just public debt or internal debt its not the whole debt.
“Public debt: the cumulative total of all government borrowings less repayments that are denominated in a “country's home currency”. Public debt should not be confused with external debt, which reflects the foreign currency liabilities of both the private and public sector and must be financed out of foreign exchange earnings.”
Can you see the “country's home currency”?
“Debt – external: the total public and private debt owed to nonresidents repayable in internationally accepted currencies, goods, or services”
So 2011 public debt of UK was 86.3% of its GDP and this is borrowed at home in local currency in this case British Pounds.
www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/geos/sp.html
Now you have external debt, that is 10 trillions owed to foreigners in others currencies that UK govt. cannot print and this total (10 trillions) is made by govt debt plus private debt issued by bankers.
Now lets see a simple example, privates companies that took loans from a private banks because of the recession cannot pay back to the bank if the bank cannot collect debts cannot pay to foreigners the money they borrow from lenders. The bank goes into default and the govt have to save it because otherwise the panic will make another 10 to fail. Foreigner lender will not lend to the govt anymore if they don’t back private banks, etc, etc.
So in the end taxpayers will face the bill as happen with NR and RSB. This is not new and have been happening since the middle age.
Toxic assets are in the hands of the govt since the took over 2 banks NR and RSB
No you live in fantasyland UK has never being in this situation, the external debt is astronomical.
Spain didn’t have a big public debt 68.1% in 2011 and now is collapsing, do you know why? For the external debt of $2.57 trillion 2011.
Meanwhile the bankers area laughing all the way to the Caymans.
lol, these people are doomed, which such twisted values. as I've been trying to tell them.
As long as the bankers somehow manage to nettle Argentina (that's all they can do really, they are powerless otherwise), they cheer them on. Meanwhile they are getting fornicated over by the same bankers, their whole society.
That's what Muppets have done to them, they get that fist deep up their personal space.
Of course, they will attack me for calling them Muppets, but the ultimate irony is that this is not my name for the British people, or the French, or Germans, or Spanish, or Italians, and the rest, that is the word of their OWN BANKERS (and I'm sure the politicians at as well, who profited alongside with them!).
These are the same forelorn individuals who then accuse argies of blindly being lead on by CFK.
This kind of stupidity can't be made up.
Why are the gvt going to make further cuts if the debt has come down to the ratio figure you are quoting.Do please re-check you information,I'd hate to think you might get a wrong notion when you check your multi-million(turnover) company profit.
Warning that the next generation may have to live with the consequences of past excesses “for a long time to come”, he said Britain’s banks needed to drop the “pretence” that their debts will be repaid.
“I am not sure advanced economies in general will find it easy to get out of their current predicament without creditors acknowledging further likely losses, a significant writing down of asset values, and recapitalisation of their financial systems,” he said.”
“He compared the situation to the “pretence that debts could be repaid” in the 1930s and added: “We must not repeat that mistake.””
23 Oct 2012 Sir Mervyn speech to South Wales Chamber of Commerce.
Pretty scary isn’t it?
The preamble of UK financial collapse perhaps?
Somos mejores que ellos, quiero creer que somos mejores que ellos.
Personalmente no le deseo la miseria a nadie...
1 it was not a default! Think of it this way, under the terms of the loan Britain had the legal right to cut it from 5% to 3.5%
As for the rest of your post, well it is you that assumed i was talking about public debt. i never stated public debt or external. Am talking about national debt, which last time i checked, granted a few months ago was around 60% of GDP.
So carry on trying to put words in my mouth and making your assumptions if you like!
@81 - For a start i don't do any of those things - i employ people for that such as accountants. Only thing i know is the amount i donate to charity and the amount i have in the bank and whats owed to me by the company.
As for more cuts, well its likely just to keep spending at an affordable amount without the need to borrow more than what the government can afford!
Seeing as you have to be coaxed for information,what is a few,as in a few months.
As for not checking your company's profit figure you previously claimed to that you did check it constantly.When did you stop,because you said your company was a multi-million pound company,when you said you personally checked it.
Of course in view of the fact that you banded a debt figure and later clarified that it was irrelevant for purpose,what profit figure are you referring to in the multi-million profit statement.
You are inventing stuff mate, about the default of GB in the ’30. Never mind...
1345 Britain defaulted against the Florence Banks.
1932 War Loan gilt Britain has to issue 3m letter “form” over night to restructure the whole debt (compulsory haircut, Argentina 2005 style). Chamberlain did it...
hansard.millbanksystems.com/commons/1932/jun/30/me-chamberlains-statement
1932 Britain defaulted on inter-allied debt
“After the November 1932 election of Franklin D. Roosevelt, France and the United Kingdom resurrected the link between reparations and war debts, tying their Lausanne Conference pledge to cancel their claims against Germany to the cancellation of their debts to the United States. The United States would not accept the proposal. By mid-1933, all European debtor nations except Finland had defaulted on their loans from the United States.”
history.state.gov/milestones/1921-1936/Dawes
About your Public, national, or whatever debt...
You simple have no a clue about what you are talking about because if you do you should know that Public debt (denominated in the country’s local currency) is always given as a % of GDP.
Now the total debt of the UK public sector, what involves any dependency and any loan owe by the state and branches for what have liabilities it is close to...
2 trillions owed domestically in British Pounds + another 2 trillions US dollars or more owed to foreigner lenders (the borrowing to save banks the banking sector) and growing...
www.zerohedge.com/sites/default/files/images/user5/imageroot/2011/12/World%20debt%20to%20GDP.jpg
#1-3 Great comments =)
#19 Your wrong, Scotland will most likely vote to stay and there is no existential problem with the Asian community except in the minds of Britain's worst bigots. We probably agree about opposing the militarisation of the South Atlantic but I'm afraid you're no expert on the domestic situation in my country =(
#60 “We must Americanize Europe latino”
What a great name for an article! I take it she doesn't mean US American =)
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