MercoPress. South Atlantic News Agency
Paraguay becomes observer of the Alliance of the Pacific, despite Brazil and Mercosur
The Alliance of the Pacific announced this week that Paraguay had been accepted as an observer of the regional group. Colombian president Juan Manuel Santos chair and host of the alliance summit in Cali made it official during the reading of the final declaration. Read full article
Comments
Disclaimer & comment rulesYay this´s great, I am very happy :-)
May 25th, 2013 - 05:32 am - Link - Report abuse 0Uruguay has been an observer in PA for a while now, as Chile, Colombia and Peru are observers in Mercosur.
May 25th, 2013 - 09:51 am - Link - Report abuse 0This is a non-news...
Indeed, but it isn´t easy to become a full member of the PA, for that each country needs FTA with all members and lift of visas. That isn´t done in a few days or even months, but being an observer also helps countries to get an idea of what the PA is about and decide if it want´s to begin the process to get full membership or not. Anyway, I get Uruguay may as well seek to be the bridge between PA and Mercosur by becoming a full member of both of them. http://www.lr21.com.uy/politica/1105680-uruguay-busca-convertirse-en-miembro-pleno-de-la-alianza-para-el-pacifico but this´s just a theory, same with Paraguay.
May 25th, 2013 - 10:00 am - Link - Report abuse 02 Stevie . It is not “ no news ” . It is very much “ real ” news . The countries of PA came forward to support Paraguay . Against the wishes of the “ all powerful Brazilian empire ” . Ofcourse it will take time to complete negotiations ,but it is a start .
May 25th, 2013 - 01:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@2 Of course it's non-news. It's totally irrelevant. So why did Brazil lobby against it?
May 25th, 2013 - 01:29 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Considering that Chile has given Paraguay freeport status, which means the now have free access without any tariffs or duties on the Pacific coast, this is real news. Paraguay is playing the political trade game extremely well. Meanwhile, the newest member of Mercosur has run out of toilet paper and blames it on the people eating too much... ...why o why would Paraguay want to begin looking for another trade block to belong to???
May 25th, 2013 - 01:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0So much for the all powerful Mercosur, wasn´t it supposed to be the next BRICS??? Completely agree that it´s become a 2 member club & with the introduction of Venezuela more of a political alliance than a trade alliance
May 25th, 2013 - 03:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The Pacific Alliance will soon become the prominent trade group in S.A. & only needs the introduction of the U.S. & Canada to complete the group!!!
5 Conqueror . Have a good weekend and think why it was good news Paraguay being accepted in PA . Perhaps you could read 6 slowly .
May 25th, 2013 - 04:38 pm - Link - Report abuse 08 Baxter
May 25th, 2013 - 05:17 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I think you have misunderstood Conquerors post!
He is taking the piss out of Stevie, the left winger who wants total unison within SA which seems more and more remote now AND the fact that Brasil came out against it. Brasil were the forerunners in castigating Paraguay for acting democratically and getting rid of the deluded Lugo in short time.
This frightened Dilma, TMBOA and regrettably Pepe joined in. They obviously thought that if Paraguay could ‘get away’ with getting shot of the crap in this manner, they might be next (especially TMBOA).
I still remember the ludicrous photo of the three of them joining hands and dancing. Really good example of acting like a president – NOT.
9 Chris R . Many ,many thanks for clarifying situation . I could not agree more with your comments .
May 25th, 2013 - 07:42 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@9 Quite so. I'm a little surprised that Baxter couldn't see the obvious sarcasm. Perhaps English isn't his first language. It's worth noting that many of us have been advising Paraguay to join the Pacific Alliance ever since the mercosur intervention.
May 25th, 2013 - 10:04 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@10 What about your comment @8? You could have started by considering how I was supposed to read the comment @6, at whatever speed, when my comment was @5 and 23 minutes earlier. I assume that you haven't been here to long but you need to recognise that “Stevie” is a juvenile with little experience or knowledge of the real world. We have to grant him a brain since he “appears” to engage in mentation, but he “thinks” with his gonads rather than a mind. With respect, might I suggest that was you that should have “read slowly”. I rather wonder what significance, if any, you placed on the sentence “So why did Brazil lobby against it?”
11 Pray explain to a poor fool like me , university education apparently wasted , but please do not tell my father who paid for it , WHY o WHY did Brazil lobby against it . Could it be that if the PA approved observer status it would be a recognition of the current government ! As you will no doubt remember Mercosur does not recognise this Government . All the Ambassadors left in June last year . Now PA has joined EU , USA and a host of other counties who accept the current administration . A blow to Brazil' s image .
May 26th, 2013 - 02:09 am - Link - Report abuse 0Baxter
May 26th, 2013 - 04:37 am - Link - Report abuse 0What are you talking about? Mercisur does indeed recognize Paraguays government, they merely demand that Paraguay accepts Venezuela in Mercosur before letting them talk in the big scene again.
Paraguay can join North America if they wish. Asia too. That doesn't change the fact that the country is landlocked and dependant on Brazil like no other country in South America.
Do I want it to be like this? No.
Is it a fact? Yes.
13 Stevie
May 26th, 2013 - 07:24 am - Link - Report abuse 0While you are right in saying that atm Paraguay still has a close relationship with Brasil and mercosur, this fact doesn´t mean they can´t improve their economy by both diversifying economic partners/developing infraestructure, and making more complex their economy, in all this being associated with the PA can help them. This doesn´t mean it will take little time, most of this most probably will take years but if Paraguay do chose to stay and become a full member like Costa Rica is about to do, then yes, I think they have great future oportunities.
Elena
May 26th, 2013 - 07:32 am - Link - Report abuse 0I hope they do join the PA.
I hope whole of Mercosur joins the PA, or the other way around, it matters little.
The important part is that SA is united, not if the unity is called Mercosur or Pacific Alliance.
Agreed :-) but I would say Latam unity is the priority.
May 26th, 2013 - 07:40 am - Link - Report abuse 0Nothing would kill the Pacific Alliance quicker than letting countries like Brazil, Argentina or Venezuela having influence.
May 26th, 2013 - 11:31 am - Link - Report abuse 0Thankfully they're not interested and believe their own economic model will be more successful.
Even more thankfully, the current members of the Pacific Alliance recognise that the model that Brazil, Argentina and Venezuela follow is doomed to lower long term prosperity than their current models will deliver.
South America is not united. And it doesn't need to be.
Anglolatino
May 26th, 2013 - 11:35 am - Link - Report abuse 0South America is uniting.
And that annoys you.
We know.
;)
Stevie
May 26th, 2013 - 12:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0First off I didn't say that South America ISN'T uniting. I keep thinking and saving your posts have degenerated recently and you prove it continually.
“South America is uniting. And that annoys you.”
Nice to see that while you are so very easy to read and predict, you actually know nothing about me.
Wrong again Stevie, must be a familiar feeling by now.
South America is not united. And it doesn't need to be.
South America is uniting, and that fact is indeed annoying you.
May 26th, 2013 - 12:16 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You lot try to divide us in Mercosur - PA, North - South, East - West, but we will embrace anything you lot can come up with.
Everything you see as a posible divisor, we'll use as a reason to unite even more.
Just like your posts in MP, they make me love my neighbours more and more everytime I read your drivel.
;)
Stevie. Stevie how sorry I feel for you . If Mercosur does not have Ambassadors in Asuncion it means ,in simple diplomatic terms , that it does recognise the Government . This played to Paraguay' s favour in the case of PA .iIf it not recognised by Mercosur it can join PA . Clever for a poor country surrounded by somewhat unpleasant neighbours . By the way the new Government will find it very difficult to recognise Venezuela , especially Maduro . He was the character who ran around the city inciting the army to rebel . Followed by funnies from Brazil , Argentina and Uruguay . Not a pleasant memory for a poor but proud people . When Cartes made a move in that direction , accepting Venezuela , the public outcry was deafining . He has now changed course .
May 26th, 2013 - 01:48 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Baxter
May 26th, 2013 - 02:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Being a member of Mercosur doesn't mean you can't be a member of the PA
http://www.lr21.com.uy/mundo/1106149-mercosur-debe-negociar-en-bloque-con-alianza-del-pacifico
So much for your “Brazilian lobbying”...
;)
Oh , Oh , let us stop this somewhat useless discussion , especially on a , here anyway , a beautiful Sunaday morning . Your statement that bring a member of Mercosur does not mean that you cannot be a member of PA . The rules of Mercosur clearly establish that ANY negotiations with any other group or alliance must be done as a GROUP and not individually . Get it . All together . What Paraguay has done , which is brillant , is take advantage of its current exclusion from Mercosur and approached , successfully it seems , PA .
May 26th, 2013 - 03:17 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Incidentally Brazil is obviously following the same path with the EU and USA. They now realize that with Argentina in the group , a deal will never be made with the EU .Uruguay too seems to be champing at the bit , quick trip to China ?
What makes it more worrying for Brazil is a possible trade deal between EU and LAFTA . That will be a show stopper !
Baxter
May 26th, 2013 - 03:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Uruguay has been an observer in the PA for a while now, nothing Paraguay has done goes against any Mercosur “rule”. You are talking bullocks ;)
Thank you Stevie , I always appreciate good manners . I could say the same to you but my education will not allow that . Certainly not on a Sunday .
May 26th, 2013 - 06:35 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Baxter
May 26th, 2013 - 06:50 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I never insulted you, you ARE talking bullocks, I'm sorry to say...
Has little to do with my manners.
26 I was referring to Paraguay obviously . In the case of Uruguay they are indeed observers in the PA . What they tried to do in the last meeting was change status from observer to active .This peeved Rousseffs advisor who reminded all and sundry that only as a group could they negotiate with any group . Be it PA , EU or anything else .
May 26th, 2013 - 09:29 pm - Link - Report abuse 0If I remember rightly all this began with Brazil' s lobbying or otherwise . In the case of Uruguay their pressure worked since Uruguay withdrew its application . In the case of Paraguay it did not . Perhaps the four countries felt that Paraguay deserved a fairer treatment from the rest of Latin America .
Baxter
May 26th, 2013 - 09:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Did you read my link?
The “Brazilian lobbying” is a product of your imagination...
Stevie Stevie Stevie
May 26th, 2013 - 10:03 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Seems your recent lull to regroup your thoughts hasn't done you any good.
“South America is uniting, and that fact is indeed annoying you.”
It is a characteristic of your posts that you keep misrepresenting someone else's posts. So as per usual I will have to rectify your infantile attempts AGAIN. Remember that this reflects badly on YOU because everyone sees the paucity of your own arguments when you blatantly ignore what is said:
“First off I didn't say that South America ISN'T uniting”
Now repeat after me:
I DIDN'T SAY THAT SOUTH AMERICA ISN'T UNITED!
I didn't say it wasn't, hasn't or won't. I didn't say it.
“You lot try to divide us”
You lot? Who is your lot? The global cabal?
South America divides ITSELF, not anyone outside South America or even Latin America for that matter.
The Pacific Alliance has been formed for a reason. Mercosur doesn't work as well as it could.
“they make me love my neighbours more and more everytime I read your drivel.”
Stevie, you don't live in South America. Repeat after me:
I AM LYING WHEN I PRETEND I LIVE IN SOUTH AMERICA!
I AM LYING WHEN I PRETEND I LIVE IN SOUTH AMERICA!
I AM LYING WHEN I PRETEND I LIVE IN SOUTH AMERICA!
I AM LYING WHEN I PRETEND I LIVE IN SOUTH AMERICA!
I AM LYING WHEN I PRETEND I LIVE IN SOUTH AMERICA!
Lying shows that your posts are untruthful. It permeates all your posts. Most of which are crap. You don't live there. They are not your neighbours. You don't even live in Latin America.
The most enjoyable part about this is that you have no answer for that. Drivel is all anyone can expect when you are confronted with the fact that you keep lying about your background and location.
Again, you have proven beyond doubt that you don't know anything about me when you say that I don't want or try to hinder regional integration. You inability to read me is actually pleasing.
I will say again, South America is not united.
It doesn't need to be.
Please try to twist my words again
28 and 29 . Anglotino. You made my Sunday . I thought I was alone dealing with this somewhat unusual person !
May 26th, 2013 - 10:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Stevie , read El Pais , Montevideo . It stares quite clearly that Brazil “ es un escollo para que Uruguay entre en AP ” . Yesterday or today . But how stupid of me , people like you do not read serious , even handed , journals like that .
Anglolatino
May 26th, 2013 - 10:13 pm - Link - Report abuse 0South America is uniting, and that hurts you.
No need for you to repeat after me.
We know. ;)
Baxter
Your problem is that you read El Pais...
Stevie
May 26th, 2013 - 10:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Brazil indeed was lobbying to keep Paraguay out of PA and to get the entire Mercosur as observer or even member of PA. But given the process to become a member of the PA is made individually by FTA and lift of Visas, Paraguay indeed could enter as observer and Mercosur as a bloc can´t enter, each country must do their own process to get in. Uruguay is a similar case, they are interested in being a member but aren´t sure if the actual regulations of Mercosur would allow that especially as it allowed Venezuela in.
1.- http://www.taringa.net/posts/noticias/16764652/Brasil-quiere-bloquear-a-Uruguay-su-presencia-en-la-Alianza.html
2.- http://www.taringa.net/posts/noticias/16764652/Brasil-quiere-bloquear-a-Uruguay-su-presencia-en-la-Alianza.html
3.- http://www.taringa.net/posts/noticias/16764652/Brasil-quiere-bloquear-a-Uruguay-su-presencia-en-la-Alianza.html
Now being united doesn´t neccesary mean all must be members of the same economic bloc, in fact most interegional talks could be done already inside CELAC. As things stand right now, I don´t see Brazil or Argentina really interested in being part of the PA and the PA has very particualar inmediate process in which it´s focusing right now: more diverse trade with Asia and a more profound integration between members. http://www.taringa.net/posts/noticias/16764652/Brasil-quiere-bloquear-a-Uruguay-su-presencia-en-la-Alianza.html
If the process of both these bloc result in a greater interegional trade and cooperation then I think this will be great for the region as a whole IMO.
I am delighted that Latin America is uniting. But not if one group tries to impose its ideology . One which has proven to be a disaster .
May 26th, 2013 - 10:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Not only do I read El Pais I also read Economist , Clarin , Telegraph , Mail , Express , Guardian ( though I never agree with its editorial policy ) El Pais Madrid, Yahoo news ,Fox , CNN and so on . To understand you better I will now read Gramma and North Korea News , English version obviously .
Elena
May 26th, 2013 - 11:04 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I agree with you on your last statement, but I still don't think Brazil is “lobbying” against any nation wanting to join any trade bloc. That they wish to negotiate as a bloc is no secret, but Paraguay entering the PA is their own decision and up to the PA to accept them. Has little to do with Brazil, and other than disagree, they can't do much more.
And if you read your own links, you'll see that all Brazil is doing, is having an opinion. In no way whatsoever they are telling Uruguay or Paraguay what to do.
Most Latam countries don´t like either for a bloc, country or group to impose over them, I get the feeling that one of the reasons Paraguay was allowed in so quickly have to do with Brazil doing lobying in that way, which only probe to be counter productive in the end IMO.
May 26th, 2013 - 11:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Damn Baxter.... You should stop filling your head with all that crap...
May 26th, 2013 - 11:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 0No wonder you are so negative...
”El informante comentó que la diplomacia de Itamaraty hizo un fuerte lobby ante los países fundadores del bloque económico para frustrar el ingreso paraguayo a la Alianza, invocando y queriendo seguir al pie de la letra el párrafo cinco de la Decisión 26/2012 de los Jefes de Estado de la Unión de Naciones Suramericanas (Unasur), que obliga a “Promover la suspensión de la República del Paraguay en los foros y mecanismos de diálogo y concertación” This to me doesn´t sound as just an oppinion
May 26th, 2013 - 11:12 pm - Link - Report abuse 032 35 Sorry Elena missed your first one , 32 , as always common sense . If I had seen it I would not have wasted my time replying to Stavie .
May 26th, 2013 - 11:21 pm - Link - Report abuse 0What is really surprising is the way Brazil is acting now . It used to have one of the best diplomatic services in the world . Now , starting with Lula , it seems to have lost its way . Could be this awful character who advised Lula and now Dilma . To have tried to force Mercosurs way into PA was not sensiblec, certainly not with Venezuela in tow . When all the world begins to doubt even more about the legality of the election .And trying to block Paraguay was not diplomatic .
@31 Stevie
May 26th, 2013 - 11:24 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You seem to believe that if you repeat something enough it becomes true. Again, a reflection your intelligence level, not mine.
The enjoyable thing is that (to me at least) you keep devaluing your own time on here.
“South America is uniting, and that hurts you.”
Hurts me how? With the extreme high standard of living and trade my country has, how would it “hurt” me? Increased living standards and economic size can only be a win for an open trading economy like mine. Regional integration can only be a win for my country unless it is protectionist, which is what Mercosur is and the reason it has so few trade agreements.
I have never claimed that South America is NOT uniting. Where did you get such a STUPID idea from? Why do you keep making stuff up? Parts of South America ARE uniting. But that doesn't mean South America IS united. Two regional organisations have formed, Mercosur and Pacific Alliance. They are centred around incompatible economic models. One failing (Mercosur) and one not (Pacific Alliance). Different countries will choose one or the other. Some countries may even jump between the two, but countries cannot be members of both due to the incompatibilities of their economic systems.
The Pacific Alliance has done so much in a just a year and Mercosur has had 20 years to get where it is.
I am a real believer in time telling the success of something. And time will tell. There is no rush. The economic model espoused by Argentina is not economical viable in the long run.
You should perhaps ask me what I last studied at university Stevie... what my major was! Then you would realise how foolish you are sounding at the moment.
Glad to see that you are so predictable that you don't even try to pretend you are Uruguayan when you reply to my messages that highlight how you lie.
@30 Baxter
Yes, Stevie is fun! I am so glad he decided to hang around after I outed him from his consistent lying over several months.
Elena and Anglotino . We deserve a good drink now ! Stevie in full retreat . He seems to really believe the Nazi theory - repeat a lie often enough and people will believe you !
May 26th, 2013 - 11:36 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Baxter, he ain't! He keeps coming back for more. He will just wait and then say the same lies again in the future and hope no one remembers to pull him up on them.
May 26th, 2013 - 11:45 pm - Link - Report abuse 0But back to Stevie's claim in Post 20 “You lot try to divide us in Mercosur - PA, North - South, East - West, but we will embrace anything you lot can come up with. Everything you see as a posible divisor, we'll use as a reason to unite even more.”
Here is a list of regional integration projects in South or Latin America that are supposedly frustrated or prevented by outside parties.
Amazon Cooperation Treaty Organization (ACTO)
Andean Community of Nations (CAN)
Andean passport
Association of Caribbean States (ACS)
Bank of the South (BancoSur)
Bolivarian Alliance for the Americas (ALBA)
Caribbean Community (CARICOM)
Caribbean Court of Justice
Caribbean Development Bank
Caribbean Free Trade Association (CARIFTA)
CARICOM passport
CARICOM Single Market and Economy
CARIFORUM
CARIPASS
Central America-4 Border Control Agreement
Central America-4 passport
Central American Integration System (SICA)
Community of Latin American and Caribbean States (CELAC)
Corporación Andina de Fomento (CAF)
Dominican Republic–Central America Free Trade Agreement (CAFTA-DR)
Eastern Caribbean Currency Union
Free Trade Area of the Americas
G3 Free Trade Agreement
Initiative for the Integration of the Regional Infrastructure of South America (IIRSA)
Inter-American Development Bank (IDB)
Latin American Economic System (SELA)
Latin American Integration Association (ALADI)
Latin American Parliament
Mercosur
Mercosur Parliament
Organisation of Eastern Caribbean States (OECS)
Organization of American States (OAS)
Organization of Ibero-American States (OEI)
Pacific Alliance
Petrocaribe
Rio Group
South American Parliament
SUCRE
Union of South American Nations (Unasur).
Seems our attempts to stop integrating is failing or are many of these failures anyway?
PMSL@ Stevie!
38 Thanks Baxter, just wanted to clarify the situation, and I agree, this doesn´t sound like Brazil usual method of diplomacy hope they change it soon, especially inside Mercosur as that could help the Bloc, Mercosur is not a bad idea on itself IMO, is just that lately it has not really been acting as a bloc and that has a lot to do with actual diplomacy of head of state in both the larger countries. I think Stevie is just stating his oppinion, that´s all. Greetings :-)
May 27th, 2013 - 12:01 am - Link - Report abuse 041 I agree Latam as a whole has too much associations that fell victim to too much discourse over substance , in a way Pacific Alliance is a response to trying and reverse that situation, but thel ist you put are not actual active organitzations of the region, not all, some aren´t even integration mechanisms but groups of defense from the times of the ditatorships and civil wars in south and central america, Grupo Rio was born that way, now Grupo Rio doesn´t exist anymore, it became CELAC and this political association is precisely trying to simplify and deal with regional different associations as well as developing more interegional dialogue and cooperation.
I think you covered most of them ! They certainly try . But one does feel that the PA will really succeed . Hope so anyway .
May 27th, 2013 - 12:04 am - Link - Report abuse 0I hope so too :-) what I liked more about PA was their no- non sense aproach to matters and their way of getting done concrete things in each meeting, that is exactly why it has been capable of advancing so much in such little time, so most countries that are interested in jouning are certainly aware of hwat you need to get done in order to keep advancing the whole group. As a Mexican I like this group a lot and have great hope for it too.
May 27th, 2013 - 12:12 am - Link - Report abuse 0Totally agree with you . I spent five happy years in your country in the 70' s and enjoyed every minute . I have an idea that your new President is moving in the right direction .
May 27th, 2013 - 12:24 am - Link - Report abuse 0Five years , that is great, thanks for your kind words :-) heh don´t let my countrymen hear you ;-) now a days it seems to be in vogue to not like your head of state, I don´t like his party much but I will not be as close minded to deny what has been done right. Imo they are good at making agreetments but not so much at making stronger institutions. But we will wait and see what happens next :-)
May 27th, 2013 - 12:29 am - Link - Report abuse 0I know what you mean ! What I liked was that he made a clever deal with various opposition parties ! Hope he manages to improve the lot of the poor . Which is what we want from all our leaders .
May 27th, 2013 - 12:59 am - Link - Report abuse 0Indeed, I liked that too, especially as that helps put ppl at ease about his approach to Gov. and it also helps to get ideas from the other two parties into new legislations and reforms that are needed. In fact he is following on initiatives from past Gov. on the diplomatic and economic sense.
May 27th, 2013 - 01:16 am - Link - Report abuse 0As a ppl we like political initiatives that helps get things done and persons on the street can feel benefice them, be it from Right, Center or Left political policies, so this agreetment is a good method to get it done. But also, a priority of mine would be stronger and more independent institutions as this helps develop not only economic realities but social, security, political and cultural too.
All in all, I think we are improving but not just because of one determined politician or party but because of mutual cooperation between cilvil and political forces, and if one gets serious about it, that´s really the only way to get things done.
Completely agree , especially strong , independent instituitions . Vital in any true democracy . It is also important that honest , decent patriots can , despite party loyalties , work for the common good .
May 27th, 2013 - 01:53 am - Link - Report abuse 0indeed :-) I think politization of almost everything as well as too much ideology can harm not only national politics but international too. especially as it seems sometimes that ppl get too much into the ideology be it from bussines, political or economic, that we forget what´s really important, the well being of all the community. From my pov economy should not be above people, economy is there to serve ppl, and both extreme right or left policies often forget this, reason why a multipolar political pov regulated by strong institutions becomes neccesary in national and international context.
May 27th, 2013 - 02:10 am - Link - Report abuse 0I finish the day by agreeing with you completely . I await for Stevie , who is suddenly very quiet , or Anglolatino to opine ! Good night . By the way a new article has just appeared on Paraguay / Mercosur . Waiting for Stevie to give his objective and unbiased opinion .
May 27th, 2013 - 02:30 am - Link - Report abuse 0heh Ok ;-) Greetings and Good night to you too :-)
May 27th, 2013 - 02:37 am - Link - Report abuse 0Sorry Elena and Baxter
May 27th, 2013 - 04:32 am - Link - Report abuse 0I had to drive home from work and then catch a tram to uni. As an Australian, I totally agree that an economy should be guided and the worst excesses should be limited so as to serve society as a whole.
Governments should mower people to create wealth but then people should accept that they must contribute to society as a whole and that includes an intelligent and fair distribution of wealth to those that need it: the old, young, disabled or less abled.
Thankfully our major political parties oscillate around the centre. We don't put up with a different “ism” every decade. There is no chavism, Peronism, lulaism or whatever.
I think the Pacific Alliance is a new concept in regional integration. So far, it is top heavy or grandiose. It just wants to increase economic growth and integration amongst certain countries. The movement if goods and people will deepen that integration and create scales of economies that smaller countries in populatiom such as Chile can expand further. And countries with smaller GDP such as Peru can grow more cans then there's those that have both, Paraguay and countries in Central America.
Mercosur is inward looking and the Pacific Alliance isn't. Inward looking countries don't prosper. North Korea, pre-1980s China, pre-1990s India, the Soviet Union and perhaps up till now...... Paraguay.
Australia is an observer state to the PA. Whether it will be a full member I am unsure. We have one of the world's strictest and widest visa regime. However we have a lot in common with members if the PA. We are a colonial creation built on the dispossession of native lands and have to deal with the legacies of that. We are resource rich and are building closer ties with the entire Pacific region. And none of us will be more than a medium power and need to find a way to adjust to that.
Considering the rapid increase in Mexican, Colombian and Chilean students in Australia, some integration is already occurring.
Anglotino . Great to read your comment this lovely Monday morning . I do not think that anybody can dispute your clear views in the third para. of your note . In the UK we tend to follow that policy . The able and ready can move ahead while the Gov. protects the weak and needy .
May 27th, 2013 - 01:24 pm - Link - Report abuse 0With regard to PA am in total agreement . They are moving along in a sensible , pragmatic way with no , as you put it , “ isms ” !
With regard to Paraguay. The shock after being ousted from Mercosur , in a totally illegal way , has forced to look further afield . No longer inward looking .
Like all who live in this area , blessed with so many natural resources , one only hopes that , eventually , we will all unite and work for the common good . Use our natural resources to obtain enough income to reduce , at least , if not obliterate poverty .
By the way I have always admired Australia . A beacon of democracy and common sense in a , shall I say , difficult area !
All of Latin America joining the PA what a load of crap is that is today the representative from Mexico question the Bolivarian countries in their motive basically in their backward economic system of protectionism Argentina and braz.il
May 27th, 2013 - 03:07 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Brazil only wants to be the dominant power in South America but they failed, Their president is an incapable leader (She was a terrorist she killed people) She is as stupid as all the Bolivarian leaders trying to control prices and profits telling the private companies what they can charge and how much they can profit I know this because we are doing business in Brazil we will pull out and go to Colombia.
No Bolivarian country should Join the PA they are a political alliance not and economic alliance Paraguay should not be part of such group of backwards economies.
There will be an economic disparity in Latin America among the Bolivarian countries and the Pacific Alliance Countries and then and only then their citizen will revolt against their leaders.
Poor Argentina runs by demented dysfunctional and utopian people (La Campora)
55 cornelius . If I gave the idea that I thought that all would join PA I apologise . What I was trying to put in words was a dream , that all would unite for the common good . As you say that is impossible now . While Mercosur goes the Bolivarian route no way ! Heavens sake who wants to be without toilet paper . Who wants to hear a President talk for hours in prime time . Who wants price fixing and then find no products .
May 27th, 2013 - 08:31 pm - Link - Report abuse 053 Hi Anglotino , sorry to take time answering
May 28th, 2013 - 03:28 am - Link - Report abuse 0Great way of pointing out our similarities, is also good to know how similar is our pov :-)
Pacific Alliance countries and Australia have excelent reasons to work together. IMO while the VISA system is indeed important, PA is still a young group, I think even as an observer Australia can participate well with the group first with trade and second with infraestructure proyects. VISAS are still being talked by current and future member countries, there´s still a lot of things to talk and work out before saying we have a fully functioning system of free flow of people, so Australia should not feel pressured about it right now, in my oppinion, Australia is a country on the Asia- Pacific zone with strong institutions and a large economy, that alone makes it a priority for the Alliance to approach, same with Japan and New Zealand.
I feel this will be a gradual proccess, it´s great what you talked about Mexican and Colombian students, because with this type of healthy integration and trade, we could very well see in a near future the pacific becoming a motor for growth on it´s own right and economic progress that beneficies ppl which I think is good news for everybody.
Greetings :-)
“plus the fact it opens an incredible window to the Pacific and to Asia”
Jun 03rd, 2013 - 12:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Astori is off his rocker! Seems to me that this Pacific Alliance is more about ideology than geography...
#9 “I still remember the ludicrous photo of the three of them joining hands and dancing. Really good example of acting like a president – NOT”
That's a bit Calvinistic for an atheist, no?! Remember the old joke about Calvinists - why are they against sex standing up? Because it might lead to dancing!
@58 BSK
Jun 03rd, 2013 - 05:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Yes, the old ones are the best.
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