MercoPress, en Español

Montevideo, September 25th 2018 - 07:55 UTC

It's official: Nisman was murdered, and his ex secretary is charged as accessory to the crime

Wednesday, December 27th 2017 - 08:21 UTC
Full article 116 comments

Alberto Nisman, the Argentine prosecutor who was found dead days after accusing former President Cristina Fernandez of covering up Iran’s role in the 1994 bombing of a Jewish community center, was murdered, a federal judge said on Tuesday Read full article

Comments

Disclaimer & comment rules
  • Chicureo

    This is an icon of Argentine incompetence and corruption from the following morning of his death. There are several cc cameras in the area, including the building, yet no recordings have been released.

    Dec 27th, 2017 - 11:45 am - Link - Report abuse +6
  • British_Kirchnerist

    This is clearly a murky case and we don't know how it all fits together yet. He seem to have been in a suicidal state of mind, for reasons unclear, on the eve of presenting a baseless and easily discredited set of allegations against Cristina, and now his colleague is being charged as an accessory for publicising this by the increasingly Stalinist purge courts, yet some other evidences may indeed point to murder. The least plausible, least explanatory solution to all of this is the sensationalist rubbish that Cristina killed him, peddled by those who often also think she killed Nestor. I'm just so sorry for her that in trying to serve the people she's been ensnared in these deep waters on top of her bereavement and often fragile health, but she's a tough potra with many loyal comrades so I'm confident she'll overcome this evil that is trying to envelop her

    Dec 27th, 2017 - 12:25 pm - Link - Report abuse -11
  • imoyaro

    @Chicureo

    She's “La Asesina.” There were over 20 cameras in the building, and strangely, they were all turned off. Equally strange, so were the cameras monitoring the rear of the Casa Rosada on the same night. ¡Qué casualidad!

    Dec 27th, 2017 - 01:12 pm - Link - Report abuse +8
  • Lightning

    BK

    “...clearly a murky case... ”

    Great statement BK!

    What's CLEAR is that CFK et al had a lot to lose when Nissan was suddenly and violently removed as a threat, and all evidence was conveniently destroyed or rendered MURKY.

    Dec 27th, 2017 - 02:25 pm - Link - Report abuse +5
  • Chicureo

    This is clearly NOT a murky case, but instead a clearly botched assassination that was obvious to nearly everyone in the world.

    Typically in civilized countries of law, evidence is carefully examined and suspects are investigated to find the murderer. But then again, this occurred in Argentina...

    BritishKirchnerist parrots the idiotic theory that Nisman was in a suicidal state of mind, the night before he was to expose CFK running a rouge criminal government.

    Dec 27th, 2017 - 04:21 pm - Link - Report abuse +4
  • British_Kirchnerist

    Cristina had no motive, in fact the exact opposite of a motive. Nisman's allegations were easily debunked, and even more crucially already in the public domain so not covered up by his death. All he could have done further with his allegations if he'd lived was to undermine them, if he said he'd changed his mind or that he'd discovered he'd been fed faulty evidence. Plus his death gave them undeserved dramatic weight. I've always thought it likely he was killed by Cristina's enemies to frame her. As for which enemies, who knows - its like Murder on the Orient Express in reverse, one good Mrs Hubbard surrounded by Ratchets!

    “There were over 20 cameras in the building, and strangely, they were all turned off.”

    You don't need state power to turn off a camera in a building.

    “Equally strange, so were the cameras monitoring the rear of the Casa Rosada on the same night.”

    Are you seriously suggesting she sneaked out the backdoor of her house to kill him herself?!

    Dec 27th, 2017 - 06:08 pm - Link - Report abuse -9
  • Don Alberto

    Some birdbrain writes: “You don't need state power to turn off a camera in a building.”

    Of course not, but that leaves 20 working cameras.
    Who turned them off and why?

    The same xxx writes “Are you seriously suggesting she sneaked out the backdoor of her house to kill him herself?!”

    Why do you suggest Cristinan did it herself and that she was alone in la Casa Rosada?

    Dec 27th, 2017 - 08:31 pm - Link - Report abuse +3
  • British_Kirchnerist

    All I'm suggesting is imoyaro has an overactive imagination. As for turning off even 20 cameras, is that seriously beyond the power of a criminal conspiracy? Or a foreign state, or rogue elements of the local one dissatisfied with being led by a left wing woman?

    Dec 27th, 2017 - 09:38 pm - Link - Report abuse -9
  • Chicureo

    In The Bubble, Diego Lagomarsino has been indicted for being a “necessary accessory” in Nisman's death. In my opinion, he's innocent and the Federal Police security detail are most likely guilty. The evidence that Nisman was going to present against Cristina's government was obviously conveniently watered down after his death. The murder was committed by an organized agency empowered to confiscate, alter, remove and plant evidence leading to a supposed suicide. My money is that the witch was definitely guilty. ¡Culpable! ¡Culpable! ¡Culpable!

    BK reminds me of the Nazis who still defend their National Socialist party's crimes...

    http://www.thebubble.com/lagomarsino-indicted-as-necessary-accesory-in-the-homicide-of-nisman/

    Dec 27th, 2017 - 10:01 pm - Link - Report abuse +3
  • British_Kirchnerist

    “The evidence that Nisman was going to present against Cristina's government was obviously conveniently watered down after his death”

    To, merely, “treason to the fatherland”. Yeah, right. And he was killed after filing the charges not before. So it may be “obvious” to you but only out of wishful thinking.

    “BK reminds me of the Nazis who still defend their National Socialist party's crimes”

    Remind me which of us likes Pinochet...

    Dec 28th, 2017 - 11:42 am - Link - Report abuse -6
  • imoyaro

    Brutish_Kriminalist

    Remind me who supports Videla's Nazi policy of invading and brutalizing the peaceful inhabitants of the Falkland Islands, you filthy Ultra-Peronist Populist Fascist pig... :)

    Dec 28th, 2017 - 02:49 pm - Link - Report abuse +2
  • ElaineB

    Argentine_Kirchnerist is talking bollocks as usual. All that wanking has made him blind to the reality of the criminals he supports.

    No one is suggesting CFK actually fired the gun. That she was complicit is not in doubt. As I have said from the beginning, when this first happened, it was the Iranian's who actually carried out the murder with the assistance of CFK's government. Always follow the money trail.

    Dec 28th, 2017 - 03:07 pm - Link - Report abuse +3
  • DemonTree

    @EB
    You seemed to have more than a few doubts about her complicity this time last year:

    “Personally, I do not think CFK had Nisman murdered. I stand by my assertion from the time of the murder that the Iranians did it - you just have to follow the money trail. But it may be that someone in CFK's administration gave the go ahead for it to happen. If so they should be brought to account. If it transpires that CFK knew about it then she is also culpable. But, I am not convinces she did know based on her reaction and actions immediately after the murder.”

    Dec 28th, 2017 - 03:41 pm - Link - Report abuse -7
  • Lightning

    DT,

    Obviously, over a period of a year, EB has had time to contemplate things more thoroughly, and revised her opinion.

    Again, I must say you are remarkably good good at delving quickly into the archives to pluck out the very plums that you seek.

    It is almost unmatched.

    Dec 28th, 2017 - 04:01 pm - Link - Report abuse +1
  • Think

    TWIMC....

    As I consistely have said during the last 35 months..., all REAL evidence points to the suicide (quite possibly induced by his Paymasters) of that totally corrupt chantapufi Nisman...

    As inconsistent Anglo Turnipette ElaineB tells us above...:
    “ALLWAYS FOLLOW THE MONEY TRAIL...”
    The money trail of them many million dollars Mr. Nisman got deposited in diverse USA accounts by “undisclosed” benefactors...
    “Undisclosed” because “curiously” the USA authorities haven't yet “disclosed” them...

    NO OTHER MONEY TRAIL EXISTS...!
    ... But if anybody in here has any REAL info on the contrary..., I would be glad to see it...

    Dec 28th, 2017 - 04:23 pm - Link - Report abuse -1
  • imoyaro

    Speaking of “Chantapufis,” as Gauchito Drink knows very well, that word has its root meaning in an Italian word for a “defaulter.” Kamerad/Komrade Rique, Gauchito Drink, and Brutish_Kriminalist have all advocated that Argentina should not repay the loans the country contracted, making them the true chantapufis here. ;)

    Dec 28th, 2017 - 04:29 pm - Link - Report abuse +1
  • DemonTree

    @Lightning
    That's possible. I thought it was refreshing at the time that she had her own theory with reasons and wasn't jumping on the bandwagon of saying CFK did it. You can see she has been consistent about the Iranians being the real murderers, anyway.

    “Again, I must say you are remarkably good good at delving quickly into the archives to pluck out the very plums that you seek.”

    Again, huh? Was this the first time you said it to me?

    “You have apparently mastered an ability to recall conversations and subjects from the MP archives, that would confound the casual user of this site.”

    Dec 28th, 2017 - 04:39 pm - Link - Report abuse -7
  • Chicureo

    British_Kirchnerist

    It has been said that “Nobody owns life, but anyone who can pick up a frying pan owns death.”

    So it leaves many suspects, with CFK ultimately controlling the State Police organization. She was the person to lose the most if Nisman had lived to present his case.

    As I remind you again, Cristina hopefully lives a long, very long life behind bars, but if she should overdose on Botox in the short term, we have the parade already choreographed: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=kPIdRJlzERo

    Dec 28th, 2017 - 05:14 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @DT

    I love that you store my words so carefully but your interpretation is a little off.

    Yes, a whole year has passed and a lot more information has been uncovered. My position on who murdered Nisman is unchanged because it is correct. That was my theory and it has not changed. I was the only person positing that truth.

    I never said she personally fired the gun or authorised it but there is now no doubt that her administration was closely involved, allowed it to happen, worked to cover it up as suicide and since the buck stops with her, she is complicit. I rather suspect the people around her have dropped her right in the shit.

    I know a lot more but will keep it to myself since you are recording my words so closely.

    Dec 28th, 2017 - 06:15 pm - Link - Report abuse +2
  • Conqueror

    I look forward to seeing BK and Twinky appearing in an argie court to present all their “evidence”. Since they both “know” so much they are clearly implicated. They couldn't “know” so much from thousands of miles away. Could they be “agents” of the Kirchner regime?

    Dec 28th, 2017 - 06:27 pm - Link - Report abuse +2
  • Think

    Mr. DemonTree...

    People asserting being “the only persons positing this or that truth”..., do not like to be shown the inconsistencies of said “truths”...

    Good for the REAL truth (and for the REAL truth loving among us) that she has decided to keep her truth to herself since you are recording her words so closely...;-)

    Goooooooood boy...

    Dec 28th, 2017 - 06:34 pm - Link - Report abuse +1
  • El capitano 1

    Justin Beaber done it.....

    Dec 28th, 2017 - 06:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • imoyaro

    @ElaineB

    Delirium Tremens has repeatedly demonstrated he is cyberstalking opponents of the NarcoKleptocracy, in conjunction with Gauchito Drink and Kamerad/Komrade Rique.
    Prudence is definitely advised...

    Dec 28th, 2017 - 06:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DemonTree

    @EB
    Seriously? You are posting on a public website, and you know that comments are permanently stored in the archive. What difference does it make if some random person remembers what you said or not?

    And I remembered your comment because I though it sounded reasonable at the time, and I think somewhere else you linked to an article on the Bubble which pointed out some flaws in the theory that CFK did it. Was I wrong to believe you knew what you were talking about?

    I would ask you what more has been uncovered, since I haven't seen very much in the news, but I suppose you now have a convenient excuse not to say.

    @Imoyaro
    You are the biggest cyberstalker around here, reporting on Enrique's life. Isn't there some saying about how cheaters think everyone cheats and liars think everyone lies? Seems that cyberstalkers think everyone cyberstalks, and it's turned out to be the sockpuppeteers who see sockpuppets everywhere.

    Dec 28th, 2017 - 07:17 pm - Link - Report abuse -8
  • imoyaro

    You're funny Delirium. I never even looked at Enrique's “life” until he came in here claiming everybody was in here cyberstalking him. Humorous since he had been posting his “real” name and had tried to get people to tell him theirs. He made the claim that people had looked up his real address and told him so. I never saw anyone post anything like that, but figured, if he's going to make the accusation I should at least look up his blog, which had been mentioned. What I found was amusing. I still don't know his address, that is none of my business, but I found he was running for office, and that he had done so before. I also found that on his blog he has a history of deleting hostile posts and banning the posters, which was no surprise. Some of his “neighbors” also referred to him as an extremist, something I had discovered from his posts in here. Finally, he had pictures of La Asesina posted, which I am sure helped him get the results he received in the election. Given that I had been warring with him verbally a couple of years before he came in here making the assertion, I could hardly be accused of cyberstalking him. As for his life, I don't believe the cover story, or even that he was born with that name. As far as your opinion goes, well, you are always trying to get people to reveal where and what they are. People can judge for themselves if what I am saying is true... :)

    Dec 28th, 2017 - 08:17 pm - Link - Report abuse +3
  • DemonTree

    @imoyaro
    I don't know whether to believe you, since you really do have an overactive imagination. How long ago did all this happen, roughly?

    I admit I get curious sometimes, but mostly about things that are relevant to what people say. I don't think I've ever asked anyone something that would reveal who they are, and the only people I've ever 'cyberstalked' were Enrique himself since you linked his website, and Patrick Edgar who used his real name and picture.

    Dec 28th, 2017 - 08:43 pm - Link - Report abuse -7
  • imoyaro

    If I recall aright, I only linked the county election results. Personally, I would never give his hack blog advertisement. Maybe you should check...

    Dec 28th, 2017 - 08:48 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @DT I STILL say I do not believe she actually pulled the trigger. I am consistent in my assertion of who was responsible and uncovering of evidence would indicate CFK is complicit. The person at the top ultimately has responsibility for her thugs actions. And only she could have ordered the cover-up after the murder. I think you are being deliberately obtuse to create a little drama. I will let you play with others as your style is boring.

    Dec 28th, 2017 - 09:23 pm - Link - Report abuse +1
  • Think

    Mr. DemonTree...

    I Think..., she is being deliberately obtuse to create a little drama... Let her play her little play with others as her style is boring..., don't you Think...?

    Dec 28th, 2017 - 09:35 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DemonTree

    @imoyaro
    You're right, you only linked to the election results and I found the link to his site there when I was looking to see what he was standing for. I remember wondering how you knew about it; were you following him on Facebook or something? Otherwise why would you randomly google his name after already knowing him for ages?

    @EB
    No one thinks she actually pulled the trigger, I'm sure even Imoyaro was joking. Your post surprised me as it's not what I remembered you saying before. What evidence was uncovered that made you go from thinking she probably wasn't complicit, to being sure that she was?

    Dec 28th, 2017 - 10:07 pm - Link - Report abuse -9
  • Chicureo

    The real damage to CFK is that many people suspect she was involved. The tragedy for her supporters is that the crime was not solved during her administration IF she was innocent.

    Anyway the whole thing reads like a bad detective novel...

    Dec 28th, 2017 - 10:21 pm - Link - Report abuse +6
  • RICO

    At the end of the day Iran was the major suspect in the bombing. The last thing that Iran wanted was for evidence linking them to an anti Semitic terrorist attack outside of the Middle East. It would ruin their victim hood narrative. In these cases you call on your friends to help out and the Iranian government had a friend in Venezuela. It had markers to call in in Argentina relating to its support for the Malvinas claim and Chavez had campaign finance debts to call in. Who was it in Argentina who owed Iran and Venezuela and could have prevented the investigation from continuing with a quick bullet?

    Dec 29th, 2017 - 05:04 am - Link - Report abuse +1
  • Enrique Massot

    Here we go again. Another chapter in the long suicide/murder saga and most MP commentators again become all excited at a story they don't know much about but makes them salivate with the prospect of seeing CFK locked up.

    It remains that, for anybody who has taken the time to read Nisman's much-celebrated “denunciation,” there is little doubt CFK was the last person interested in obliterating the former prosecutor from the scene.

    The 289-page document can still be found online. It's so inconsistent, full of innuendo and lacking any serious evidence of the claims it makes, it's hard to believe a jurist (Nisman) would sign it.

    A judge can, of course, start an investigation, impute people and say about anything. Another thing is to prove things in a trial. The only man they got, Lagomarsino, is covered by video recordings that confirm his comings and goings at the times he declared.

    There was no trace of external intervention in Nisman's apartment, so no leads--only wild speculation, such as Elisa Carrio and Clarin's never confirmed tale of a Cuban-trained Venezuelan-Iranian commando coming to Argentina to murder Nisman.

    Much ado about nothing.

    Dec 29th, 2017 - 06:29 am - Link - Report abuse -1
  • imoyaro

    Once again Kamerad/Komrade Rique says “much ado about nothing.” Quite a revealing statement. After all, he admires the Castros, and supports extrajudicial killings, disappearing political opponents, torture, and concentration camps. The state sponsored assassination of a public prosecutor is, of course, a mere bagatelle to him.The only “comings and goings” they had recorded of Lagomarsino was at the airport. Would you care to back up your lies with actual articles, outside of the usual K propaganda sources? I thought not... ;)

    http://rantburg.com/images/piefight05.jpg

    Dec 29th, 2017 - 10:08 am - Link - Report abuse +1
  • The Voice

    If Nissman was murdered the evidence was obviously falsified or covered up expertly. A straw poll of Argentines would reveal a gamut of diverse theories. The motive, to silence Nissman, was certainly there, the means and opportunity was there for any expert contract killer. Long after the event with no access to clues its all a matter of speculation. As for EBs so called insider knowledge...pffft!

    Dec 29th, 2017 - 11:00 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DemonTree

    @Chicureo
    That's very true. If she was innocent it would have been in her interest to find out exactly what happened, because it looks so suspicious for her. If she was guilty it would have been in her interest to frame someone rather than leaving it as suicide and allowing the speculation to continue.

    It is like a bad detective novel, or an even worse spy novel, and like TV says there is not much chance now of finding out what really happened.

    Dec 29th, 2017 - 11:20 am - Link - Report abuse -6
  • imoyaro

    This article and the recordings sum it up nicely. Note the conversation is between La Asesina and her spy chief, Oscar “El Verdugo” Parrilli AKA “Pelotudo.”...

    http://www.thebubble.com/cristina-implicated-in-leaked-audio-clips-bad-mouthing-massa-stolbizer/

    ” ‘Cristina’: What do you think was the most serious of all the cases that I’ve had (implicating me), to see if we agree?

    ‘Oscar’: The Nisman one.

    ‘Cristina’: Ah yes, we agree then.”

    Dec 29th, 2017 - 12:37 pm - Link - Report abuse +1
  • Chicureo

    Jorge Lanata is an Argentine national treasure.

    Dec 29th, 2017 - 05:41 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Enrique Massot

    @imoyaro

    “Would you care to back up your lies with actual articles...”

    Would you care to backup this statement of yours:

    “he...supports extrajudicial killings, disappearing political opponents, torture, and concentration camps.”

    These are serious allegations, so I expect you will come up with something.

    Also, please back up the following:

    “The state sponsored assassination of a public prosecutor is, of course, a mere bagatelle to him.”

    For the record, that I am against any form of violence, and very particularly state-sponsored violence such as extrajudicial killings, disappearing political opponents, torture, and concentration camps. I challenge imoyaro and/or anybody else to come up with any contrary evidence.

    And by the way, I noticed that not one MP reader has yet bothered to read Nisman's denunciation about CFK/Timmerman's “plot to take down Interpol's red alerts.”

    My opinion is that former prosecutor Alberto Nisman was not murdered and especially not by the CFK government. My opinion is based on evidence made public and track record of both Kirchners' governments.

    I do suspect Nisman was asked to travel back to Argentina from Spain where he was vacationing with his daughter in order to make his famous “denunciation,” and later was left alone (security agent Jaime Stiuso reportedly did not answer Nisman's numerous cell phone calls shortly before his body was discovered). Nisman was scheduled to face a parliamentary committee the next day.

    As the judge in charge progresses with the investigation, he should question two members of the current government, Patricia Bullrich and Laura Alonso, who called Nisman several times on the day prior to his death.

    All this evidence was made public, but a lot of it won't be found in MP or Clarin. You got to dig a bit deeper to find it.

    Come on, people, dare to go to the sources--here it is:

    https://www.scribd.com/document/362631487/253237258-La-denuncia-completa-de-Nisman-pdf

    Dec 29th, 2017 - 06:51 pm - Link - Report abuse -1
  • The Voice

    Trouble is Enrique we all know even if presented with a video of Kretina shooting Nisman you would still insist it was fake. You are like a stick of rock with bent socialism running through it.

    Dec 29th, 2017 - 07:19 pm - Link - Report abuse +1
  • Chicureo

    Enrique,

    You state “...My opinion is that former prosecutor Alberto Nisman was not murdered and especially not by the CFK government...”

    YOUR opinion you note is “based on evidence made public and track record of both Kirchners' governments.” THAT's exactly why the vast majority worldwide is certain that it was an execution to silence him from presenting his case the next day.

    The lack of evidence is so damning against the state police is because they eliminated it. Whether it was an Argentine state sponsored assassination or from Iranian sponsored assassins, the government has covered up the facts.

    I'VE read Nisman's purported “denunciation,” and I think parts were conveniently removed, which somewhat fits with Argentina's story of frustration and schizophrenia regarding justice.

    Dec 29th, 2017 - 07:54 pm - Link - Report abuse +1
  • imoyaro

    Sure KameradKomrade Rique, do you deny those things occurred under the Castro Regime? You have said you admire the Castros. You deny the Concentration camps for political prisoners, and more infamously for AIDS victims? You deny Che did extrajudicial killings? How about arresting the “White Ladies” who have been protesting the disappearance or murders of their spouses/relatives? You are a despicable piece of work. Your neighbors are right about you, you are truly an “Extremist.” Your attempt to distance yourself by lying about being some kind of pacifist will never jibe with your past statements...

    Dec 29th, 2017 - 08:27 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @ The Voice

    I never said I had insider knowledge you twat.

    @EM You have no credibility here. You really should become a penpal with BK. You could share wank dreams.

    Dec 29th, 2017 - 10:24 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Enrique Massot

    @imoyaro

    “Your attempt to distance yourself by lying about being some kind of pacifist will never jibe with your past statements...”

    Very well. Now, I will ask you again to show “past statements” of mine showing that I supported “extrajudicial killings, disappearing political opponents, torture, and concentration camps,” as you claimed in an earlier post.

    In case you don't know, I am informing you that these are serious allegations, so I expect you will come up with some evidence.

    You have also irresponsibly stated that “The state sponsored assassination of a public prosecutor is, of course, a mere bagatelle to (Enrique).”

    Please provide evidence that a public prosecutor (I understand you meant Alberto Nisman) has been assassinated in a state-sponsored action.

    I remind you that I have posted my opinion, and some facts on which I base such opinion about the real causes for former prosecutor Alberto Nisman's death. You are free to disagree as much as you can with my opinion. If you do, please state your arguments. Attempting to shoot the messenger does not change the reality.

    @Chicureo

    Oh come on Chicu! You can't be serious! Are you really suggesting that former prosecutor Alberto Nisman's 289-page denunciation of CFK, Hector Timerman in relation to the memorandum of understanding with Iran has been clipped and not one has found out two years after the change in government?

    I am disappointed on you. I don't have a problem with disagreements, but please come up with some credible argument. Next.

    @TV

    What about the arguments I advanced? No response to them?

    @EB

    “You have no credibility here. You really should become a penpal with BK. You could share wank dreams.”

    Sorry, Elaine, you are losing steam and your previous nastiness is gone. Have a better 2018.

    Dec 30th, 2017 - 04:24 am - Link - Report abuse -1
  • imoyaro

    If you support the Castros, you support all of the above. Of course you could denounce what they have done, and point out that such behavior was not only counter revolutionary, but Fascistic in nature. How about it, extremist? I won't hold my breath. You have zero credibility, and the people who know you best have cast their vote... :)

    Dec 30th, 2017 - 04:37 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Enrique Massot

    @imoyaro

    Don't try to wiggle out of this one. You have accused me of supporting extra judicial killings and several other reprehensible crimes and are obviously unable to come up with the slightest evidence to prove your serious allegations. Your Cuban thing is just laughable.

    What is surprising is your childish inability to cope with disagreement and your readiness to resort to insult in lieu of reasoning.

    Now, I want you to acknowledge you have stepped over the line. Come on, say it and all will be okay then.

    Dec 30th, 2017 - 06:52 am - Link - Report abuse -1
  • imoyaro

    No it isn't, you are desperate. I'm not trying to wiggle out of anything. As far as I am concerned you are a MONSTER. Denounce the Castros and what they did. I can hardly say anything, after all I challenged you. Can't do that? You prove what I have always observed. Not to mention your neighbors... :)

    Dec 30th, 2017 - 07:24 am - Link - Report abuse +2
  • DemonTree

    @imoyaro
    If you are so concerned about “extrajudicial killings, disappearing political opponents, torture, and concentration camps,” why do you never give Chicureo a hard time for supporting Pinochet, who did all those except, perhaps, the last?

    @EM
    I've never seen you support those things, but I remember you did praise Castro when he died. So what do you think of him, really?

    Dec 30th, 2017 - 11:29 am - Link - Report abuse -11
  • ElaineB

    Laughing at EM trying to assert authority over another poster. You are impotent, old fella, with no credibility. Until you return to Argentina your words will carry no weight whatsoever.

    Why not do a little crowd funding so you can return to your beloved Argentina and witness the reality of years of corruption and underfunding of the basics by the Kirchners. Listen to the majority who realise they were conned by them. Then witness the start of change for the country instigated by Macri.

    Dec 30th, 2017 - 01:25 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • chronic

    Reeeeeeeeeeeeeekie:

    If you're lips are flapping or you're on a keyboard - you're either lying or demonstrating your ignorance.

    Which is it?

    Dec 30th, 2017 - 02:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • The Voice

    Reekie, what arguments? Have you not noticed that your political creed is an abject failure all around the world. Get back to your home country, and contribute! Is it the lack of vote bribes and free Choripans that keeps you in Calgary?

    Dec 30th, 2017 - 03:13 pm - Link - Report abuse +2
  • DemonTree

    Why do you all hate Enrique so much? So he disagrees with you, but why not have a civilised discussion instead of jumping straight to the insults?

    Dec 30th, 2017 - 03:23 pm - Link - Report abuse -13
  • Enrique Massot

    @imoyaro

    I really don't care if you call me names, even in all upper case letters. After all, you've been casually doing that since I post here. However, you have accused me of supporting crimes and I will not let you stand unchallenged on that. So I am asking you again to demonstrate in any way you can that I support violence of any kind--which I don't.

    @DT

    Imoyaro, EB, The Voice, chronic et al are simply unable to refute real arguments and this makes them furious. They are utterly unable to respond to a fact-based opinion and their only way out for them is to shoot the messenger--which doesn't work either, at least in this setting.

    However, far from me to try and change their ideas or approach--I just want readers to know that equality and justice for all is a possibility and that there are some who happen to believe in it. I apologize for not answering your question about Fidel Castro at the moment, because I want to focus on the baseless accusations I have received in this thread.

    Dec 30th, 2017 - 05:02 pm - Link - Report abuse -1
  • The Voice

    Its not worth reading or responding to comments or arguments from someone who supports Castro, CFK and Maduro, you just know that person must be a first class dork, especially when they are safely ensconsed in a civilised place in the British Commonwealth. Socialisms only purpose is to moderate Capitalism, on its own its a recipe for disaster. Socialism and Capitalism produce a perfect storm... Does that make things clear?

    Dec 30th, 2017 - 07:19 pm - Link - Report abuse +1
  • Enrique Massot

    @TV

    You are trying to help but no, you don't make anything clear.

    The exchange I am having with imoyaro is about his baseless accusation that I support state crimes--which I don't. I have asked imoyaro to produce evidence, and he has so far been unable to do so.

    If you want to help imoyaro, please provide evidence of my support for violence. If you can't, then you are out of topic.

    Dec 30th, 2017 - 08:01 pm - Link - Report abuse -1
  • golfcronie

    @ Enrique.
    I was under the impression that the topic is Nisman was murdered. I understand that no residue from the gun was found on Nisman, surely that must point to someone killing him. It has taken 2 years I believe to come to that conclusion.Argentine justice just takes soooooo long.

    Dec 30th, 2017 - 08:11 pm - Link - Report abuse +1
  • imoyaro

    Poor Kamerad /Komrade Rique. Of course you support state crimes. You are supporting one of La Asesina's crimes right now ! :)

    Dec 30th, 2017 - 08:23 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • The Voice

    Oops! I misspoke! (Cue Voice) I meant Socialism and Catholicism make a perfect storm. Guaranteed to destroy wealth and retard progress IMO

    Dec 30th, 2017 - 08:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DemonTree

    @TV
    You were talking about Nisman's death, not socialism. What you are really saying is that because Enrique is a socialist he must be wrong about everything else too, and you can dismiss anything he says without bothering to read it. It should be obvious that this is wrong.

    The only one who has addressed anything Enrique said is Chicureo, and he hasn't said how the document Nisman submitted could have been altered. Was it published before or after the murder and who would have seen it?

    Dec 30th, 2017 - 09:05 pm - Link - Report abuse -11
  • British_Kirchnerist

    So you're an orange bigot too...

    Dec 30th, 2017 - 09:09 pm - Link - Report abuse -5
  • Chicureo

    DemonTree

    Let's have a brief review shall we?
    The night before Nisman was about to present his case, he leaves a note for his maid to do some grocery shopping for the next day. The people who knew him best noticed no unusual behavior prior to his death. Reportedly he was optimistic and was enthusiastic the week before.
    As Golfcronie mentions, Nisman is found dead with a borrowed pistol, but without powder residue. (If you watch detective movies, you'll understand the importance.) The witnesses of the crime scene report a complete disregard for collecting or protecting forensic evidence at the apartment. Nobody knows nothing...
    Curiously, none of the closed circuit cameras in the area are working that night.
    Finally, you ask me how I know that part of the sensational case against the president is missing... I ask you how do you know what may have been deleted?

    Dec 30th, 2017 - 09:39 pm - Link - Report abuse +2
  • DemonTree

    “The people who knew him best noticed no unusual behavior prior to his death.”

    Except for asking his assistant to lend him a gun because he feared for his life. And sending away the security who were supposed to protect him.

    “Finally, you ask me how I know that part of the sensational case against the president is missing... I ask you how do you know what may have been deleted?”

    I don't know so much about it. According to Wikipedia:

    “Nisman had already submitted his complaint and wiretap transcripts to Judge Ariel Lijo on 14 January.”

    So do you think Judge Lijo is involved in covering up and deleting parts of the accusation?

    Dec 30th, 2017 - 10:47 pm - Link - Report abuse -9
  • Enrique Massot

    imoyaro:

    You are not going away from this, not even with all your friends' help.

    I am asking you again to show evidence that I ever remotely expressed support for state violence including state torture and assassinations.

    I remind what you wrote in an earlier posting in this thread:

    ”After all, (Enrique) admires the Castros, and supports extrajudicial killings, disappearing political opponents, torture, and concentration camps. The state sponsored assassination of a public prosecutor is, of course, a mere bagatelle to (Enrique).

    I want you to acknowledge that your accusation was baseless and uncalled for, made in the midst of a discussion on whether the late prosecutor Alberto Nisman was murdered or not--which is the story above's topic.

    I want you to acknowledge that you made your baseless accusation because you did not know how to counteract some facts I put forth in support of my opinion.

    Again, I do know others may not agree with my opinions and that's fine. However, I do not appreciate being accused of supporting state crimes, especially when that sort of crimes were massively committed in my home country, Argentina, in the 1970s.

    Dec 30th, 2017 - 10:53 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    Chicureo..., my gullible hermanito Shileno...

    Let's have a brief review shall we...?

    You write...:
    “The night before Nisman was about to present his case, he leaves a note for his maid to do some grocery shopping for the next day. The people who knew him best noticed no unusual behavior prior to his death. Reportedly he was optimistic and was enthusiastic the week before.”
    I say...:
    Corrupt Chantapufi Nisman's house of cards began crumbling late Saturday morning..,when his Paymasters didn't provide him with the promised “smoking gun” evidence and wouldn't pick his phone calls even if he tried dozens of times during his last hours of life...(All them calls properly documented in the Official Case File)

    You also write...:
    ”As Golfcronie mentions, Nisman is found dead with a borrowed pistol, but without powder residue. (If you watch detective movies, you'll understand the importance.)”
    I say...:
    (And...,if you didn't watch sooo many Hollywood movies and read the Official Case File..., you would find about the two (out of five) forensic tests with the auld Argie Bersa Thunder and its auld ammunition that didn't leave any residue either...)

    You continue writing...:
    “The witnesses of the crime scene report a complete disregard for collecting or protecting forensic evidence at the apartment.”
    I say...:
    As reported by the Clarin newspaper..., ya mean...
    Why don't you try to read the Signed Depositions of the REAL witnesses properly filed in the Official Case File...?

    You end saying...:
    “Curiously, none of the closed circuit cameras in the area are working that night.”
    I say...:
    Yet another of your Red Heerings...
    Chantapufi Nisman own personal slave..., Mr. Lagomarsino (the lender of the killing gun) is free..., as we speak...,BECAUSE HE IS CAUGHT IN FOUR DIFFERENT SECURITY CAMERAS LEAVING THE SCENE OF THE SUICIDE MANY HOURS BEFORE THE CHANTAPUFIS DEATH...,
    as properly filed in the Official Case File...

    Dec 30th, 2017 - 10:57 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo

    THINK

    Well, touché with your counter points. I still feel it was not a suicide.

    Dec 30th, 2017 - 11:20 pm - Link - Report abuse +1
  • Think

    Ahhhh....
    Mens feelings...
    How very 2017'ish...

    Dec 30th, 2017 - 11:30 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • imoyaro

    No Kamerad/Komrade Rique, you support what the Castros did. You support what I described, since that is what they did. You do not denounce their actions, because you support them. Of course, to an individual like yourself, killing a state prosecutor would be just another body. I don't care if you aren't going away. You are just trying to draw attention away from the topic of this story, and in so doing, you underline what I say about the state prosecutor. As for your lying about just wanting peace and justice, here's a little reminder of what you really support...

    https://panampost.com/marcelo-duclos/2017/12/19/day-of-fury-in-buenos-aires/

    Dec 30th, 2017 - 11:35 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DemonTree

    @Think
    Are men not allowed feelings? How very 1950s.

    @EM
    You know he's never going to admit being wrong. I'd say imoyaro etc are the ones distracting from the original topic though.

    Dec 30th, 2017 - 11:50 pm - Link - Report abuse -11
  • The Voice

    “What you are really saying is that because Enrique is a socialist he must be wrong about everything else too” - No, thats a misunderstanding...or word twisting, take your pick.
    When someone has such an obvious continuing blind bias towards KFC & Co its a total waste of time listening to any assertions they may make.

    Dec 30th, 2017 - 11:54 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    AngloTurnip above obliterates his own argument by writing...:

    “When someone has such an obvious continuing blind bias towards KFC & Co its a total waste of time listening to any assertions they may make.”

    Don't ya Think...?

    Dec 31st, 2017 - 12:05 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Voice

    I think he meant blind bias in supporting KFC & Co....
    He aint good with English Mr. Think...
    I think you should learn him...;-))

    Dec 31st, 2017 - 12:12 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    ;-))

    Dec 31st, 2017 - 12:15 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • imoyaro

    Highly amusing that this article was posted on this site...

    http://en.mercopress.com/2015/06/02/argentine-police-video-on-nisman-s-death-shows-experts-working-without-latex-gloves

    Dec 31st, 2017 - 12:38 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DemonTree

    @TV
    You deny it and then confirm it in the next sentence. All people have biases but that does not mean they are always wrong.

    @Voice & Think
    I don't see anything wrong with what he said. I thought it was perfectly understandable.

    Dec 31st, 2017 - 01:40 am - Link - Report abuse -11
  • Voice

    DemonTree

    Are you for real?
                                “When someone has such an obvious continuing blind bias towards KFC & Co its a total waste of time listening to any assertions they may make.”

    He is also telling you that it is a waste of time...listening to any assertions HE (The Voice) makes...it is understandable....;-)

    Dec 31st, 2017 - 02:11 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Enrique Massot

    @Think

    Excellent update on so many facts contradicting the version that the Macri government is desperately trying to install of Nisman's death.

    Good for Chicureo for, at least, acknowledging you have valid points. While not questioning men's right to have feelings (we men negated ourselves this for too long) having a feeling on how something happened is very different from gathering all available facts, listening to all parties (as a judge does or should do) and arriving to a conclusion. Chicureo wants to believe a certain version of facts, therefore he feels things happened in a certain way. In any event, saying “I feel Nisman was murdered” is more honest than just affirming “Nisman was murdered.”

    In any event, from the way the investigation has evolved, it will be interesting to see how the judge in charge will be able to discover the potential suspect of pulling the trigger, since Lagomarsino has been charged only as an “accessory to murder,” therefore is not suspected of being the executor.

    Coming back to Nisman's denunciation, which Chicureo said he read and is convinced it was clipped, I would say it's not the alleged missing parts that are most interesting, but the pages that are there.

    Think of it. The main accusatory points Nisman is base include the supposed plot to cancel the 'red alerts' on Iranian suspects of the AMIA bombing and a 'plan' to exchange Argentine grains in exchange for Iranian oil. The two points were debunked even before the day Nisman was to testify in front of a parliamentary committee the Monday after his death.

    This is why you pointed out to the many calls Nisman made to intelligence czar Jaime Stiuso, on that Sunday. Nisman wanted to come up with some other credible argument in support of his denunciation.

    Good luck to the judge in charge, and let's hope he arrives to uncover the truth.

    Dec 31st, 2017 - 03:42 am - Link - Report abuse -1
  • Think

    Estimado Sr. Massot...

    Firstly..., I want to say..., please continue “matándolos con la sonrisa”..., it's allways a pleasure to read...

    Secondly..., it is obvious that none of your critics in here..., including Shilean milico Chicureo..., has read Chantapufi Nisman's denounciation...:
    https://www.scribd.com/document/362631487/253237258-La-denuncia-completa-de-Nisman-pdf

    By the way..., if Mr. Chicureo..., our fellow hermanito Shileno...,had watched more quality Engrish detective movies and less rubbish Yank ones..., he would have noticed that EACH AND EVERY of the..., DULY NUMERATED..., 145 sheets of legal stationery that compose the aforementioned denounciation..., were duly SIGNED AND STAMPED by the Chantapufi himself...

    if our fellow hermanito Shileno had watched more quality Engrish detective movies and less rubbish Yank detective ones..., he would know that falsifying such a document would be even more difficult than training that imaginary flying Circus of Argie-Cuban-Venezuelan-Iranian Super Ninja Turtle Assassins that can move unseen by men and technique.., jump 13 stories high..., go through walls and locked doors to dramatically shoot Nisman with an auld weapon he just lended hours ago..., instead of..., for example..., taking him “accidentally” out in the beaches of Cancun or the streets of Madrid..., where he was a completely unprotected targetduring the previous weeks and days...

    Or they could have tried poisoning the private parts of one or more of the many young Argie Call Girls he luuuuved to rent ad company during his maaaany leisure trips...,as the CIA once planned to do against Fidel...;-)

    Dec 31st, 2017 - 08:26 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • imoyaro

    Nice to see the 2 chantapufis dancing cheek to cheek as they celebrate a murder. It's so...romantic. “...BECAUSE HE IS CAUGHT IN FOUR DIFFERENT SECURITY CAMERAS LEAVING THE SCENE...” Nobody thinks Lagomarsino actually killed him. Far from being a red herring, this indicates that the cameras were in working order, and that the perpetrators had complete access to the building and disabled them prior to the murder. It also indicates that Nismans phone was being monitored, no doubt by a state agency,(Oscar “El Verdugo” Parilli's AFI?) and the perps knew the weapon had been delivered. “..., go through walls and locked doors to dramatically shoot Nisman with an auld weapon he just lended hours ago...” As Gauchito Drink knows very well, there was a service corridor between the apartments with an entrance that was literally a panel in the wall, and pictures of this were shown at the time. Nisman probably had no idea it existed. The perps drugged him, shot him, and locked the bathroom door on the way out.“State Security Secretary Sergio Berni, one of the first to arrive at the presumed crime scene, asks the prosecutor – sometime after she has arrived – if she can verify whether Nisman is dying.” From the video...very interesting, they stood around while he was still alive? Carry on girls, let's see what else you can throw out there...
    http://en.mercopress.com/2015/06/02/argentine-police-video-on-nisman-s-death-shows-experts-working-without-latex-gloves

    Dec 31st, 2017 - 09:29 am - Link - Report abuse +2
  • The Voice

    The Voice / Think pedant is totally confused by plain English wot is spoke in the Sarf, perhaps it needs to visit confused.com? Heh heh...

    I dont believe anyone will ever be convicted for Nissmans death, not enough concrete evidence. So unless someone fesses up it will remain a mystery and a stain on Kretina, her entourage and supporters.

    Dec 31st, 2017 - 11:53 am - Link - Report abuse +2
  • DemonTree

    ”Good for Chicureo for, at least, acknowledging you have valid points. While not questioning men's right to have feelings (we men negated ourselves this for too long) having a feeling on how something happened is very different from gathering all available facts, listening to all parties (as a judge does or should do) and arriving to a conclusion.“

    Hear hear.

    @imoyaro
    ”From the video...very interesting, they stood around while he was still alive?“

    That's weird, but the article also says:

    ”The four-hour video, according to the PPT journalists, shows how investigators arrived on the scene at 2 a.m. on Monday, January 19”

    According to the autopsy, Nisman died between 3pm and 4pm on Sunday, so he was long dead by then.

    @TV
    No, now I'm sober I see what they mean. 'Bias towards' could mean either 'bias in favour of' or 'bias about' someone. But regardless of semantics it works both ways. You and most people on this site are biased against CFK, but just because you are biased it doesn't mean you are always wrong.

    Dec 31st, 2017 - 12:48 pm - Link - Report abuse -11
  • The Voice

    Sober....? Oh! I have reached the stage when I dont get bladdered any more. Very bad for you.
    I dont approve of CFK simply because of her disgusting use of the Falkland Islanders as an Aunt Sally and focus for hate. IMO She is despicable. Having spent some time in Peronist Argieland its appalling that such a rich rescourced land is in such a shite state brought on by her and her leftist predecessors.
    Perhaps Voicey is permanently pissed. Wouldnt surprise me if he fitted the stereotype of the aggressive bar room pissed Scottish idiot.

    Dec 31st, 2017 - 01:51 pm - Link - Report abuse +1
  • DemonTree

    Oh, I wasn't that drunk. Probably more tired than anything. I have a new little niece born last night. :)

    “I dont approve of CFK simply because of her disgusting use of the Falkland Islanders as an Aunt Sally and focus for hate.”

    I agree with you about that. But it doesn't mean she ordered Nisman's murder. We don't know what happened and only have the facts to go on, such as they are.

    As for the state of Argentina, CFK's rightist predecessors also have a share of the responsibility, no?

    Dec 31st, 2017 - 02:22 pm - Link - Report abuse -10
  • The Voice

    Never said she ordered his murder. If it was murder the murderer could have been a supporter acting on own initiative.

    Argieland is rather like Spain. It had it all and then lost the lot mainly through Socialism and division. Its important that countries remain united to prosper, a problem for us presently.

    Dec 31st, 2017 - 02:30 pm - Link - Report abuse +1
  • DemonTree

    Well then, why not consider fairly what Enrique says? You know he's biased, fine, but that doesn't change the facts he brings up, or the ones Think mentioned.

    “Argieland is rather like Spain. It had it all and then lost the lot mainly through Socialism and division.”

    Do you know any history at all? At what point did Spain 'have it all', and how did it lose it due to socialism?

    As for Argentina, are you under the impression the right-wing military government was good for the country? They didn't need to distract their people by invading the Falklands because the booming economy had made them so popular...

    Dec 31st, 2017 - 02:57 pm - Link - Report abuse -11
  • The Voice

    I never said I approved of any aspect of fascism. Under colonialism Spain was at its peak. It all went backwards from then on. The lost the lot. The Spanish Civil War and the fascists was the final straw, that clinched it. Your long term history seems rather shaky? We lost an Empire, fought two draining wars, but still survived far better than Spain.

    Dec 31st, 2017 - 03:54 pm - Link - Report abuse +2
  • Voice

    Confused by plain English...?
    I find it hilarious that it takes an Argie to highlight the irony of the statement (in English) because of the ambiguity of the word “towards”...
    Fortunately Demontree expectedly got there in the end...
    Whilst The Voice is still confused...(no surprise there)...

    Dec 31st, 2017 - 04:31 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • golfcronie

    HaHa Tinkle, The Official Case File HaHa you are so gullable, everyone knows that lying is a national trait.It's in the Argentine DNA

    Dec 31st, 2017 - 05:49 pm - Link - Report abuse +3
  • Chicureo

    Well abandoning Chicuréo and I'm now established here in my pied-à-terre in crowded Viña del Mar set in for tonight's celebraciones. I left the discussion yesterday to pack and save my marital bliss... There were no feelings hurt because I used the word touché as a brief acknowledgement of Think's argument in discussion.

    Dear THINK: Yes, I casually read over what is online of Nisman's 145 page denounciation and I found nothing that would destroy CFK. That's why I think the document in question was changed. No, I have no proof and my sources of suspicion you will scoff at such as Clarin, but instead I find damning.

    Regarding the cameras and other irregularities for example: https://www.clarin.com/politica/caso-nisman-extranos-sucesos-rodearon-dia-muerte-fiscal_0_B1-f3tHXz.html

    As far as why not “flying Circus of Argie-Cuban-Venezuelan-Iranian Super Ninja Turtle Assassins” or call girls were not used for his assasination instead, I suggest YOU'VE been reading too many comic books...

    Bottom line is that the entire death/murder/assassination was a ridiculously botched forensic investigation from the very beginning and there were were several persons involved in the crime. Nisman did not commit suicide. I know, THINK states: ”...As I consistely have said during the last 35 months..., all REAL evidence points to the suicide (quite possibly induced by his Paymasters) of that totally corrupt chantapufi Nisman...”

    * * * * * * * * * * * *

    There are currently several chilled bottles of exquisite Sauvignon blancs along with a feast of seafood awaiting tonight's festivities. I wish ALL the very best wishes to EVERYONE here, especially good health and cheer.

    ¡Salud!

    Dec 31st, 2017 - 06:51 pm - Link - Report abuse +5
  • The Voice

    Doh! Scotch peasant. You can be biased against someone or biased towards someone. https://www.vocabulary.com/dictionary/bias a verb meaning “to show prejudice for or against” Learn to speak English!

    Dec 31st, 2017 - 08:15 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Voice

    Oh dear...he still doesn't get it...
    Can you believe it...?

    Dec 31st, 2017 - 08:56 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DemonTree

    Happy new year everyone! Hope you all have a great year and good health and happiness.

    Jan 01st, 2018 - 12:56 am - Link - Report abuse -8
  • imoyaro

    What is not in doubt is that the state, represented personally by Berni, totally destroyed the crime scene. For those claiming to know when Nisman died, note that there are now at least 3 autopsy reports to choose from.
    https://www.nbcnews.com/news/latino/new-investigation-argentina-says-prosecutor-alberto-nisman-was-murdered-n817886
    https ://i.pinimg.com/originals/31/db/38/31db38c5e0d44ed6f79db4ed86761a22.jpg

    Jan 01st, 2018 - 06:50 pm - Link - Report abuse +2
  • DemonTree

    @imoyaro
    The times given in that article don't seem to make sense when compared with the time his mother discovered his body.

    @TV
    I didn't say you approved of any aspect of fascism either. My point is that the right wing governments, elected and not, have also done a crap job at running Argentina and building up the economy.

    As for Spain, the immediate cause of of it losing its empire was Napoleon's invasion and occupation, and other reasons were a poor economy and enlightenment ideas that had already resulted in the American and French revolutions. Socialism had nothing to do with it.

    Jan 01st, 2018 - 07:34 pm - Link - Report abuse -11
  • Think

    Mr. DemonTree...

    You say to Turnip Imoyaro...
    “The times given in that article don't seem to make sense when compared with the time his mother discovered his body.”
    I say...:
    Unless..., sweet & frail Jewish Princess Sara Garfunkel..., is a member of the Flying Circus of Argie-Cuban-Venezuelan-Iranian Super Ninja Turtles Assassins that killed her son...

    Jan 01st, 2018 - 08:08 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • imoyaro

    None of the times make sense with the video, after all it was issued by the Argentine police during the Narcokleptocracy. What would you expect?

    Jan 01st, 2018 - 08:13 pm - Link - Report abuse +3
  • Chicureo

    It's interesting to note that the majority of Argentines do not accept the official versionS of Nisman's death.

    Question: did they, or did they not find Nisman's fingerprints on the pistol? Also, THINK points out that pistol was tested and showed it did not always leave powder residue. Is that confirmed? Finally, were the cameras working only to capture his ex secretary, but nothing else? So many details...

    Jan 01st, 2018 - 08:15 pm - Link - Report abuse +2
  • Think

    Not “So many details...”, me gullible hermanito Shileno...

    Just a lot of “disinformation” the gullible are more than willing to swallow for diverse reasons...

    Just look at Turnip Imoyaros “valuable” contribution above...

    A pity for him that the presence of Nisman's MOM in the svene of the suicide ruin his conspiration theory...

    Jan 01st, 2018 - 08:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • imoyaro

    You're a joke, Gauchito Drink. I remember the story very well. His mother came to see him, and there was no answer. She got a guard to let her in. When the police were called, Berni was the first person there.That doesn't change the fact that he and the rest of the Klowns destroyed the crime scene. You really are a payaso...

    http://en.mercopress.com/data/cache/noticias/60807/0x0/nisman-muerto.jpg

    Jan 02nd, 2018 - 03:56 am - Link - Report abuse +1
  • Chicureo

    There is an old expression, “a fish rots from the head down,” meaning that in any organization, leadership sets the tone. For better or for worse. Where does the Nisman death investigation rot begin?

    What a brutal photograph!

    Jan 02nd, 2018 - 04:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    Dear hermanito Shileno...

    You start saying...:
    “”There is an old expression, “a fish rots from the head down,” “”
    I say...:
    And there is an eternal fact of life...: Fish rots from the guts.. (Take it from a humble Patagonian angler;-)

    You end saying...:
    “What a brutal photograph!”
    I say...:
    Ain't that picture just showing what ALL milicos ALL over the World are trained to do to the other side...?

    Jan 02nd, 2018 - 05:03 pm - Link - Report abuse +1
  • Chicureo

    THINK
    Perhaps you're right, but the old saying still remains the same...
    Perhaps also, many of those who served in wartime are most appalled by the violence. For me the photograph was brutal
    During most of my career, I was issued a sidearm that was kept locked in my desk drawer. It was only used for practice, but it was always loaded.

    Jan 02nd, 2018 - 05:25 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Th­ink

    More sockpuppets, please!

    Jan 02nd, 2018 - 10:08 pm - Link - Report abuse -6
  • Enrique Massot

    It is clear that, for the Macri government, linking the former CFK government to an alleged murder of former prosecutor Alberto Nisman would mean scoring major political points.

    In an apparent pursuit of such goal, Judge Julián Ercolini has ruled that Nisman was murdered and that former secretary Diego Lagomarsino was an “accessory” to such murder.

    However, there is not a single hint of evidence, in Ercolini's 656-page ruling, of whose accomplice Lagomarsino may have been.

    Ercolini's ruling also does not contain evidence of any hint of external intervention in the crime scene. Neither the judge or prosecutor Eduardo Taiano show any element leading to the murder conclusion.

    If Lagomarsino was an “accessory” or accomplice, he then must have had contacts with the murderer or murderers. Ercolini's ruling does not show any hint of such contacts.

    Which shows Ercolini's ruling as an example of what friendly/obedient judges are currently doing in Argentina, that is, to open investigations and charge individuals with little to no chances of conviction.

    Even the much-publicized incarceration of former Kirchnerist officials prior to obtaining conviction are a flagrant denial of rights, while being useful as showing a Macri government intent on actively pursuing corruption. In the future, what is now known as the “Irurzun's doctrine” of throwing in jail simple suspects could reveal damaging to government officials currently involved in suspicious transactions involving public money.

    To be continued.

    Jan 03rd, 2018 - 07:56 pm - Link - Report abuse +2
  • Think

    Please continue...

    Jan 03rd, 2018 - 08:53 pm - Link - Report abuse +1
  • Enrique Massot

    @Think :)

    Here it is:

    Judge Julian Ercolini, in his 656-page ruling that former prosecutor Alberto Nisman did not commit suicide but was instead murdered, failed to point to evidence of why Diego Lagomarsino, former Nisman's secretary, would lend an old 22. caliber Beretta pistol to his boss as part of a murder plan.

    Indeed, the weapon was registered in Lagomarsino's name and would have implicated the secretary from the get go.

    The latest autopsia performed by Gendarmeria concluded that Nisman was seriously beaten and drugged before being murdered. However, there were no traces of fight in Nisman's apartment and no traces of injection in Nisman's body. In Ercolini's ruling there is no explanation as to how the two alleged assassins would have been able to exit the bathroom where the body was found without leaving bloody traces and positioning Nisman's head against the door's inside.

    According to Ercolini's ruling, a giant plot would have been etched to weaken the protection to the prosecutor. Coast guard men plus federal police members would have plotted to that effect. Ercolini mentions also a newspaper seller as suspicious of being in charge of watching the street--however, as soon as the suspicions were made public, the newspaper seller appeared spontaneously and justified his activities in front of Nisman's building.

    Clearly, the judge attempts to open an avenue to make Iranian or Venezuelan agents or the former CFK government responsible for the alleged assassination.

    Lagomarsino is accused of being an accomplice of persons on whose existence zero evidence is given.

    And so, in spite of his voluminous ruling, Ercolini was unable to show a single lead or new element on which the investigation could progress.

    He instead left the case at a dead end.

    Jan 04th, 2018 - 05:23 am - Link - Report abuse +2
  • Think

    I was just Thinking...

    “Judge Ercolini has indicted poor personal slave Mr. Lagomarsino as a necessary accessory and “key piece of the Nisman homicide and ordered he continue with the ankle electronic bracelet”..., says the article...

    Woooooooooooooooow....:

    A ”necessary accessory” and a “key piece” of the Flying Circus of Argie-Cuban-Venezuelan-Iranian Super Ninja Turtles Assassins...

    My questions are...:
    1) Will an ankle electronic bracelet impede the escape of a key piece of the Flying Circus of Argie-Cuban-Venezuelan-Iranian Super Ninja Turtle Assassins...

    2) Will an ankle electronic bracelet protect a key piece of the Flying Circus of Argie-Cuban-Venezuelan-Iranian Super Ninja Turtle Assassins from termination by his misterious former masters...?

    3) Will an ankle electronic bracelet protect a key piece of the Flying Circus of Argie-Cuban-Venezuelan-Iranian Super Ninja Turtles Assassins from termination by the competing Flying Circus of Israeli-Yank-CIA-Mossad Super Ninja Turtles Assassins...?

    Poor perejil Lagomarsino...
    Chantapufi Nisman really fkucked him...

    Jan 04th, 2018 - 11:46 am - Link - Report abuse +2
  • Enrique Massot

    What a posthumous favour return to Lagomarsino, who had “donated” half his wages back to Nisman for seven years...

    Jan 04th, 2018 - 05:53 pm - Link - Report abuse +1
  • DemonTree

    @EM
    Did you read all 656 pages? And did it say anything about Nisman's police protection which he had dismissed a few days earlier according to the press? Possibly he no longer trusted them.

    “Lagomarsino, who had “donated” half his wages back to Nisman for seven years”

    I remember reading that Nisman had been paying him an unusually high salary. Was it some kind of tax dodge if Lagomarsino was donating half of it back?

    Jan 04th, 2018 - 06:26 pm - Link - Report abuse +1
  • Think

    Mr.DemonTree...

    What “Press” would that be...?
    The Argie pendant of the Sun...?
    Or the Argie pendant to the Mirror...?

    Corrupt Chantapufi Nisman did NOT dismiss any of his state sponsored Bodyguards/Servants...
    It was them Bodyguards/Servants that called her mother to open the appartment that fatidic night...

    Corrupt Chantapufi Nisman did NOT pay his personal Slave..., Mr. Lagomarsino...
    It was the Argentinean State that paid his wages...
    Chantapufi Nisman just ordered his personal Slave to give him half of them wages...
    Personal Slave Mr. Lagomarsino had no other choice than obey...

    Jan 04th, 2018 - 07:50 pm - Link - Report abuse +1
  • DemonTree

    @Think
    Hmm, none of them actually, it was Wikipedia. Probably even less reliable. The BBC says something different, that Lagomarsino claimed Nisman didn't trust his bodyguards, and that “Police say the team broke with protocol by remaining out of contact with Mr Nisman for several hours on the day of his death and failing to report to their superiors.”

    Why does everything important that happens in Argentina have at least three different versions so it's impossible to work out the truth?

    Lagomarsino said in an interview that he reported to Nisman, not to the prosecutor's office, but I suppose that doesn't mean Nisman was paying him directly.

    Where did you find out he'd been donating half his salary back, and why do you think he didn't mention it in the interview?

    If the state was paying Lagomarsino's salary then it sounds like they were colluding to cheat the taxpayers directly rather than indirectly.

    Jan 04th, 2018 - 09:16 pm - Link - Report abuse +1
  • Think

    Mr. DemonTree...

    Where did I find out that Personal Slave Lagomarsino gavr Chantapufi Nisman half his salary...?

    ... From Lagomarsino's very own sign deposition given to the judge in 2015 and duly noted in the Official Case File..., that's where...
    https://www.google.it/amp/www.lanacion.com.ar/1777361-segun-lagomarsino-nisman-se-quedaba-con-la-mitad-de-su-sueldo/amp/1777361

    PS...:
    If you find it difficult to navigate the childish Proto-Machiavellian intrigues of a third world backwater..., what makes you Think you do understand anything about the important stuff going on in the so called first world...?

    Jan 04th, 2018 - 10:25 pm - Link - Report abuse +1
  • DemonTree

    Now that wasn't mentioned on Wikipedia, or in the interview with El País where they asked Lagomarsino about his unusually high salary.

    Why do you think Lagomarsino agreed to be Nisman's personal slave, and act as owner of a US bank account for him? Was even half that salary still more than he could have got elsewhere?

    “what makes you Think you do understand anything about the important stuff going on in the so called first world”

    I don't know that I do. For example, it's now clear that the 'WMDs' in Iraq were an invention to persuade parliament to vote for the war. But the death of David Kelly has never been conclusively resolved:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Kelly_(weapons_expert)

    Perhaps the problem is that I don't know which papers are trustworthy in Argentina. I could ask someone, but I suspect I'd get very different answers depending on who I asked.

    Jan 04th, 2018 - 11:14 pm - Link - Report abuse +1
  • Think

    Yeahh....

    David Kelly...

    One of those many, many “inconvenient” individuals induced to suicide in the first world...

    Though..., not murdered by the Flying Circus of Super Ninja Turtle Assassins like Kanuk Gerald Bull...


    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerald_Bull

    Jan 04th, 2018 - 11:57 pm - Link - Report abuse +1
  • DemonTree

    Wow, he had an interesting life. Trying to launch a satellite using a gun! You'd think the g-forces would damage it, that's why railguns are better because they can accelerate things more slowly over a long distance. And really it seems silly that he ended up working for Iraq, why didn't the Canadians or Americans give him a job when he clearly had talent? At least it's clear that he was murdered and the only mystery was exactly who did it.

    Who are the 'many, many' other individuals induced to suicide in the first world?

    Jan 05th, 2018 - 10:20 am - Link - Report abuse +1
  • Think

    DYOR..., boy..., DYOR...

    Maybe then you will start understanding that Argentina's petty political intigues and disinformation are to the First World ones what the East Midlands Regional Women's Football League is to the Premier League...

    Jan 05th, 2018 - 11:14 am - Link - Report abuse +1
  • DemonTree

    Hmmm, not sure how without getting loads of irrelevant hits or crazy conspiracy sites.

    This is another example, but it's something else I remember seeing in the news, and I don't know how I would find it otherwise:

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-24927078

    Jan 05th, 2018 - 12:17 pm - Link - Report abuse +1

Commenting for this story is now closed.
If you have a Facebook account, become a fan and comment on our Facebook Page!