Friday, June 15th 2012 - 03:18 UTC

Summers invites Argentina to sit down and enter into a dialogue with the people of the Falklands

In his speech to the UN Decolonization Committee MLA Mike Summers recalled that Article 1 of the UN Charter sets out the importance of respect for the principle of equal rights and self-determination of all peoples, which Argentina ignores and the Commission, which tries to be neutral, does not express this in its resolutions.

MLA Summers addressing the C24 and inviting Argentine to a dialogue

In a quick oversight of the advance of the Falklands in the last decades, with self government, a working democracy and GDP per capita at Northern European standards, MLA Summers said all this has been achieved in spite of the by vindictive Argentine attempts to stifle our economy.

He emphasized that the Falklands had no native inhabitants and no civilian population was expelled. Likewise the UK established its first settlement in the Islands in 1766, a date which pre-dates the existence of Argentina.

Finally MLA Summers invited the Argentine government to sit down and listen to the views of the people of the Falkland Islands, and enter into a dialogue, designed to find ways to co-operate in matters of mutual interest to the benefit of future generations of Falkland Islanders and Argentines.
 

The official invitation to the Argentine government from the Falklands’ government, in the form of a letter, MLA Summers later admitted was never received by the Argentine side.

The full text follows:

Mr Chairman, Excellencies. I last addressed this Committee 8 years ago in 2004. I am now in my 14th year as an elected representative of the Falkland Islands Government, and am pleased to be able once again put the case for the Falkland Islands. But I am also disappointed that it should still be necessary to do so, when the people of the Falkland Islands are so clear about their wish to retain their current political arrangements.

Since 2004 the Falkland Islands have moved on very significantly, both politically and economically. We are a successful country. I intentionally use the word country, because Falkland Islanders have a distinct and clear identity, and consider the islands to be our country, our home. We are committed to the care and well being of our people and the development of our country for our children and grand-children, and their descendents.

Unfortunately some things have not moved on. The unwelcome and unsubstantiated claim on our country by Argentina remains, and is pursued with increasing vigour. The United Nations and this Committee has over the years carefully attempted to remain neutral over the sovereignty of the Falkland Islands. However, all resolutions from this Committee and those from the General Assembly must comply with the principles of the UN Charter. Article 1 of the UN Charter sets out the importance of respect for the principle of equal rights and self-determination of all peoples.

Argentina will I am sure argue that the United Nations has ruled out self-determination as applying to the Falkland Islanders. It has not, even though this Committee studiously ignores its responsibility to promote the rights to self determination of the Falklands people. In fact General Assembly resolution 1514 of 1960 explicitly sets out the right of all peoples to self-determination.

And Argentina will undoubtedly read a long list of regional and multilateral meetings that call on the UK and Argentina to negotiate our future above our heads. However I draw your attention to Article 103 of the UN Charter which makes it clear that obligations under the UN Charter prevail over any and all other international agreements. Member states obligation to respect the principle of self-determination under the UN Charter cannot be negotiated away or ignored at convenience, thus rendering all of Argentina’s regional declarations as irrelevant under international law.

Argentina has called many times for UN reform, to attempt to achieve its objectives. We agree that UN reform is needed, but such reform will not change the UN Charter, to which all UN reform would need to comply; nor would it remove the obligation on this Committee, and on all member states, to respect the principle of self-determination.

The Falkland Islands are a small country, about the size of Jamaica, with a population of 3,000. All the people of the Falkland Islands have arrived and live there of their own free will, from many parts of the world, including Europe, Latin America, and the Far East. We have developed our own culture based on a broad variety of influences. We are rightly proud of our achievements over the last 170 years.

Our economy is strong, based on fishing, tourism and agriculture, with hydrocarbons exploration bringing additional economic activity. GDP is over £130m per annum, and GDP per capita is at Northern European standards. We have no borrowings, and reserves of three times annual recurrent expenditure of £50m. However, we also have challenges. Due to our size per capita government expenditure is higher than other countries. Our relative isolation adds to these costs, and is increased by vindictive Argentine attempts to stifle our economy.

But despite these challenges, the Falklands have continued to thrive and to grow, and have been economically self sufficient for over 20 years, except for the cost of defence which is provided by the UK. That defence commitment is in place only because of the illegal invasion of our country in 1982 by Argentina, and Argentina’s continued aggressive tone towards the inhabitants, and is of a size that is only proportional to the perceived threat.

The Falkland Islands pay no taxes to the UK, and receive no income from them. We are responsible for the provision of all services, including education, health, police, fire and immigration services, internal transport infrastructure and regulatory services. We issue our own fishing licenses, and licenses for the exploration for hydrocarbons. All income which accrues from these licenses, or may accrue from them in the future, belongs to the Government and people of the Falkland Islands, not the UK. The Islands are well developed and well served, though still a lot of infrastructure works remain to be completed over the next few years.

We have a written Constitution which was last revised in 2009, which confirms our post-colonial status. A small legislature of 8 independent members from two constituencies makes up the Government, which is elected for a 4 year fixed term, and is fully responsible for all matters except defence and foreign affairs. There is clear separation of executive functions from justice, and from management of the civil service, as one would expect in a properly functioning democracy. The Constitution contains a full suite of protections of fundamental rights and freedoms which accord with the European Convention on Human Rights, including the right to self-determination; this right also mirrors the provisions of Chapter 1 of the UN Charter and its other provisions on self-determination.

Falkland Islanders are comfortable with our post-colonial relationship with the UK. We have the right to move away from that relationship if we so wish, though there is no current mood in the community towards independence, or association with any other country. The UK has very clearly stated that it will not discuss sovereignty of the Islands unless and until the Islanders so wish it, in accordance with the provisions of the UN Charter, a Charter which you as members of this Committee are responsible to uphold. There is specifically no current wish to associate with Argentina, though we would have the right do so if we so wished.

Argentina still claims the Falkland Islands despite their claim being based on spurious and dubious historical “facts” and interpretations. There were no native inhabitants of the Islands, and no civilian population was expelled. The UK established its first settlement in the Islands in 1766 (a date which pre-dates the existance of Argentina) and re-commenced permanent occupation of the Islands in 1833, and current Islands families have lived in the Falklands since 1843. Some Islanders are now 8th and 9th generation. With us today we have part of the new generation of young Islanders who have a keen interest in our future development, and who are 4th 5th and 6th generation Islanders. I too am a sixth generation Falkland Islander. Large swathes of Argentina and other Latin American populations cannot trace their own families’ history in the region back so far, yet they enjoy their right to self-determination. Perhaps the Argentine delegates could tell these young Islanders why they are part of an implanted population, yet people of similar age in Argentina are not, when our ancestors arrived by similar means to theirs, and ours in many cases before them. Why don’t we have the right to self-determination, but they do? Are we in any way less human; are we second class people with unequal rights, just because we are not Hispanic? Or are we insignificant because we are too few, free to be abused by a bigger bullying neighbour?

Of course we are not, and as much as Argentina might like to air-brush us out of existence, to satisfy its unjustified lust for our land, such behaviour belongs to another era and should not be tolerated in this modern world.

Argentina inserted a clause in its Constitution after the '82 war, pledging to “reclaim” the Islands. It rejects the concept of self determination for the Falkland Islanders, in contravention of the principles of the UN Charter and international law. It makes reference in its Constitution to respecting the “interests” of the Islanders, but not the “wishes” - “interests” no doubt to be determined by Argentina, and not by us. Is that not the epitome of colonialism, a country deciding what is in another distinct peoples “interests” rather than allowing them to decide for themselves. Argentina effectively seeks to re-colonise the Islands, after decades taken by several generations of our forefathers to develop our democracy, our land and our economy to what it is today.

Mr Chairman, Excellencies. What I have described to you in the Falklands is a small, progressive, internally self governing and well managed country, keen to develop and to get on with its neighbours, to preserve the environment for future generations, and to ensure that our success is based on sustainable use of natural resources. But that ambition is inhibited and impeded in every which way it can by a very much larger, aggressive and uncaring neighbour, who doesn't care if it breaks international laws or subverts the most basic of human rights of people, so long as it can get our land. The land that my father, my great-grandfathers, my great-great grandfathers, and their predecessors, made their homes and developed into a successful country.

Let me repeat, lest anybody should have missed or mis-understood. There were no native inhabitants of the Falkland Islands, and no civilian population was expelled, as the Argentines would have you believe. That is just a convenient lie to make you believe that they have just cause. They do not.

The Falkland Islands has been peacefully settled over a century and a half by my ancestors and their fellow pioneers, from many different parts of the world, who have been free to come and go, but have chosen to make the Falklands their home, and who have made it into a successful community. My generations and our children and grand-children, and these young Islanders here today, have no desire other than to be left in peace to continue that development, and to make a safe home for future generations of Falkland Islanders.

It is your duty to ensure we are allowed to do that, through adherence to the spirit and the letter of the UN Charter, and to discharge the responsibilities of this Committee, to support the right of all non-self governing territories, including the Falkland Islands, to self determination.

Mr Chairman, I invite all Members to recall and regret the un-timely death of over a thousand young men in the Falklands in 1982, and to condemn the use of military force to attack a small and peaceful neighbour. On this the 30th Anniversary of our liberation, I invite you to join me in celebrating freedom, justice, and the right to live in peace and harmony.

Mr Chairman, Excellencies. Argentina calls for negotiations. In fact in a letter only six days ago to the UK foreign Secretary, Ambassador Timmerman included a quotation from Winston Churchill which said “Courage is what it takes to stand up and speak; courage is also what it takes to sit down and listen” He then went on to write “We will always be willing to talk on what we believe is right, but we also have the same disposition to sit down and listen”.

Mr Chairman I have here a letter, from the Government of the Falkland Islands, which invites the Government of the Republic of Argentina to sit down and listen to the views of the people of the Falkland Islands, and enter into a dialogue, designed to find ways to co-operate in matters of mutual interest, and to preserve the environment of the South West Atlantic to the benefit of future generations of Falkland Islanders and Argentines, as we did before the on-set of sanctions by Argentina against our people. I invite the Argentine delegation to allow me to approach their table in order to hand over the letter.

 

174 comments Feed

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1 Marcos Alejandro (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 03:31 am Report abuse
Mike who?

CFK

“When I looked today at 10 Downing Street and saw them and what they were doing with the flag which they call the Falkland Islands flag, I felt shame from afar for them because wars are not to be celebrated nor are they to be commemorated. Do you know why? Because many people lost their lives.”

“They will not find us in Iraq or Afghanistan and if we are talking about referendums, let’s have a referendum in Iraq or Afghanistan and see what they think.”

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/southamerica/falklandislands/9333049/Cristina-Kirchner-attacks-UK-decision-to-fly-Falklands-flag-on-30th-anniversary-of-surrender.html
2 brit abroad (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 03:36 am Report abuse
Marcos

And your point is???
3 Simon68 (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 03:37 am Report abuse
1 Marcos Alejandro (#)

Just what was Kretina and Co doing on 02/04/12 in Ushuaia?

They just went for an asado perhaps???
4 Malvinero1 (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 03:38 am
Comment removed by the editor.
5 brit abroad (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 03:45 am Report abuse
Simian Malvinero1,

You hateful little squirt of a man.

You wouldnt have the balls to speak like that to a falklanders face!
6 Britninja (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 03:46 am Report abuse
@4 The silly cow even blatantly lied about events that have happened in the past few months, let alone the last 180 years lol. Either she's a compulsive liar or the botox has seeped into her brain. The fact that you're actually quoting her lies, while knowing without a doubt that they ARE lies, and knowing that we know, just makes you look ridiculous :)
7 brit abroad (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 03:49 am Report abuse
As far as I remember she was part of a commeration of the Conflict not so long ago!

Rg's voted in a Loony!
8 Marcos Alejandro (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 03:49 am Report abuse
3 Simon68 CFK on 02/04/12 in Ushuaia you said?

Did you learn Spanish Brit or I have to translate the whole article for you?

“On Friday sent a letter to the International Red Cross for the Argentine men and ENGLISHMEN who have not yet been identified as ”every sister, every widow, every parent is entitled to have his name on a plaque,“ adding: ”Every mother has the inalienable, as Antigone to bury their dead.“
”War should not commemorate wars bring only pain and hatred,“ he said. And said: ”We do not want helmets and drums of war the only helmets that we are the workers.”

web.clarin.com/politica/Cristina-encabezara-Ushuaia-central-Malvinas_0_674932658.html

Meanwhile she was saying that Mr Cameron was bombing Lybia I think, right after they sold weapons to Gaddaffi of course.
9 Britninja (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 03:50 am Report abuse
Oh, my last comment was aimed @1 not @4, but since you Malvinistas all share the one braincell anyway, I'm sure you got the message.
10 brit abroad (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 04:08 am Report abuse
@8

What relevance ???? You fail in every aspect of making an argument!

What has Libya got to do with you or your government or the article or the falklands issue......etc etc

WHAT IS YOUR POINT!!!!!!!! Explain please.....also I bet you cant do the following:

Show/illustrate with references, your arguemnet against those submitted by the falkland represenatives at the NY meeting!!!

Come on, if you are so damn clever, and know everything, show us all .....please please please
11 KFC de Pollo (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 04:20 am Report abuse
@8 There are no unidentified British soldiers on the islands....
12 Boovis (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 04:24 am Report abuse
@8: at what point have the FIG or even the UK government ever refused access to the dead Argentinian servicemen in the Falklands?
13 Britninja (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 04:24 am Report abuse
@8 By the way Marcos, yet anotherrr lie. There are *no* unidentified fallen British soldiers from the Falklands conflict. That's because we respect and honour the sacrifice they made and took the trouble to identify them. In contrast, your country just abandoned your dead (while spitting on the survivors) for us to deal with, so that they could be trotted out at a later date as a propaganda tool. Typically grubby Argie behaviour.
14 brit abroad (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 04:27 am Report abuse
priceless!!

No answer to my post at marcos.....MARCOS what did you quote before??

Marcos quoted KFC ””War should not commemorate wars bring only pain and hatred,“ he said.

Now here is my response:

Monday, April 2nd 2012 - 01:49 UTC
Cristina Fernandez leads main Malvinas war commemoration in Ushuaia
Argentine president Cristina Fernandez will lead on Monday the main ceremony commemorating the 30th anniversary of the beginning of the Malvinas war or South Atlantic conflict, when Argentine troops invaded the Falklands and held them for 74 days until ousted by a British Task Force.
“The Argentine president ATTENDED the CEREMONY at the impressive Malvinas Plaza in Ushuaia with Vice President Amado Boudou, Tierra del Fuego governor Fabiana Rios, members of her cabinet other local and military authorities, foreign delegations plus Malvinas war veterans and next of kin organizations.” Monday, April 2nd 2012 - 22:20 UTC
15 Marcos Alejandro (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 04:37 am Report abuse
April 2 2012 picture

“Cristina Fernández de Kirchner throws flowers into Ushuaia Bay in tribute to the Falklands war dead. Photograph: Reuters”

www.google.com/imgres?hl=en&sa=X&biw=1067&bih=507&tbm=isch&prmd=imvns&tbnid=ecJA6QeVwf7-QM:&imgrefurl=blogs.voanews.com/photos/2012/04/02/april-2-2012/&docid=XcA7scRvhBknBM&imgurl=http://blogs.voanews.com/photos/files/2012/04/Reuters_Argentina_Fernandez_Falklands_02apr12-878x490.jpg&w=878&h=490&ei=Q7vaT9-QMcmw2QXIufzOCA&zoom=1&iact=hc&vpx=83&vpy=225&dur=251&hovh=168&hovw=301&tx=163&ty=200&sig=104383133107997166195&page=1&tbnh=107&tbnw=191&start=0&ndsp=9&ved=1t:429,r:4,s:0,i:88
16 brit abroad (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 04:39 am Report abuse
Sorry re post but marcos didnt read/understand or even comment on my previous post

“Cristina Kirchner attacks UK decision to fly Falklands flag on 30th anniversary of surrender”

KFC said: “ I felt shame from afar for them because wars are not to be celebrated nor are they to be commemorated. Do you know why? Because many people lost their lives.”

HOWEVER……………………

Monday, April 2nd 2012 - 01:49 UTC
Cristina Fernandez leads main Malvinas war commemoration in Ushuaia
Argentine president Cristina Fernandez will lead on Monday the main ceremony commemorating the 30th anniversary of the beginning of the Malvinas war or South Atlantic conflict, when Argentine troops invaded the Falklands and held them for 74 days until ousted by a British Task Force.
“The Argentine president ATTENDED the CEREMONY at the impressive Malvinas Plaza in Ushuaia with Vice President Amado Boudou, Tierra del Fuego governor Fabiana Rios, members of her cabinet other local and military authorities, foreign delegations plus Malvinas war veterans and next of kin organizations.”

Sorry to all malvinists, but I think I just proved that your Queen is either a liar or a plain lunatic!!!!!

So suck that, and try telling me i am wrong!
17 Britninja (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 04:41 am Report abuse
Argies don't listen to facts. If they did their entire belief system would collapse, since it's all built on a foundation of bullshit tee hee.
18 Marcos Alejandro (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 04:48 am Report abuse
Sorry but the link didn't work well but the picture is clear 4/12/2012
“Cristina Fernández de Kirchner throws flowers into Ushuaia Bay in tribute to the Falklands war dead(Arg. and UK). Photograph: Reuters”

Yesterday Mr Cameron wave a sheep flag on top of his house like a child in tribute of his own arrogance.
19 Boovis (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 04:53 am Report abuse
Marcos, are you even listening to these posts?
20 Britninja (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 04:54 am Report abuse
Haha you can't admit that she's a liar can you. Pathetic.
21 Boovis (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 04:59 am Report abuse
I think CFK should realise that even Angela Merkel has attended events commemorating the end of the second world war. She really is either badly researched and informed, batshit looney, or all of the above.
22 Monkeymagic (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 05:17 am Report abuse
@21

Batshit looney, I think you will find.
23 Boovis (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 05:21 am Report abuse
@22: I like the way this is going, actually, she's making such a douche of herself at the UN that, when we do eventually just have enough, sink all her ships and destroy her economically (if she hasn't beaten us to it, that is) nobody at the UN will care.
24 DanyBerger (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 05:22 am Report abuse
I guess Summers have not a clue about what he is talking about.

1-“Likewise the UK established its first settlement in the Islands in 1766, a date which pre-dates the existence of Argentina.”

This argument is wrong because using the same logic the “United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland” didn’t exist either until December 1921when was signed the last act of union with NI.
There is not such nation recognised as UK.

So is he is talking about settlements he has to go back to 1536 in Argentina history when was the first settlement.

2- “Finally MLA Summers invited the Argentine government to sit down and listen to the views of the people of the Falkland Islands, and enter into a dialogue, designed to find ways to co-operate in matters of mutual interest to the benefit of future generations of Falkland Islanders and Argentines.”

Another mistake to be accepted as a representative of a nation to establish diplomatic relationship with a nation like Argentina or any other nation, first the Islands has to gain the status of independent nation.

Until now the only valid interlocutor who claims rights over the Islands is UKoGBaNI so he has to address any exhortation for dialogue to motherland AKA UKoGBaNI.

So the only one to whom Mr. Summers can aspires to have talks and informally is with ordinaries Argies may be in this forum perhaps?

So here I go to show my good will toward you Mr. Summers...

Hello Mike,
About what would you like to talk?

I’m the representative of Dany Berger Govt. appointed by her majestic myself of course and I would like to accept your generous invitation for formal talks.

I’m concern about Fishery and Oil at the moment but I don’t have a boat or bump.
If you have one we can go to fish in partnership.
If the fish understand English is yours otherwise in mine.
If we cannot determine what language the fish talk we can go to ICJ to resolve the dispute.
Now let me think a bit about the oil please...

Se you later.
25 Britninja (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 05:24 am Report abuse
Did you write her speech by any chance?
26 Boovis (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 05:27 am Report abuse
24: At least you're willing to go the ICJ, we've asked your mental government loads of times and they always turn us down.
27 Beef (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 05:57 am Report abuse
So the Falkland Islanders go to the committee to talk about their rights to determine their own future. CFK talks about the planting of vegetables and gets support from Syria who talk about the “rights of citizens”.

The Falklands remain British.
28 Faulconbridge (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 06:20 am Report abuse
It raises questions about the sincerity of Argentine claims to be 'peace-loving' that Kirchner celebrates on the anniversary of the beginning of a war, not the end.
29 DanyBerger (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 06:58 am Report abuse
@ Boovis

“At least you're willing to go the ICJ”

But just for the fish.

Capichi ragazzo?

@Faulconbridge

“It raises questions about the sincerity of Argentine claims to be 'peace-loving' that Kirchner celebrates on the anniversary of the beginning of a war, not the end.”

That has more logic because you have fireworks in the beginning.

By the way latest news UK ready to pump more money into banks for the already collapse of the Spanish financial sector.

Who next?
30 GreekYoghurt (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 07:53 am Report abuse
@28 Argentinians are incapable of telling the truth on any issue. It's that simple.
31 Redrabs (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 08:04 am Report abuse
The reason why the Argentians remain unidentified is the fault of its own Government which did not supply all of its troops, and especially the conscripts with Dog Tags and/or other identification.

The SS used tattoos so those should appeal to Madame President who probably has family members with these LOL!
32 GreekYoghurt (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 08:09 am Report abuse
@31 This is an example where she uses deception in order to try to push a vision of reality that is far from the truth.

I think most politicians would know she's full of sh!t, but uneducated latin americans wouldn't have the ability to know she's missing all the facts.

Your typical latin american is basically an uneducated poor person who can barely read the newspaper.
33 DanyBerger (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 08:48 am Report abuse
@GreekYoghurt

And that coming from a kebab eater that watch “go talent” and the better conversation he got is about Manchester United and the weather.

Ha ha you are very funny a little bit underclass but still funny.
34 Boovis (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 09:07 am Report abuse
@29:
1947: Britain first offers to take the sovereignty dispute over the Dependencies to the ICJ. Argentina does not accept.
1948: Britain again offers to take the sovereignty dispute over the Dependencies to the ICJ. Argentina declines.
1955: Britain unilaterally refers the sovereignty dispute over the Dependencies to the ICJ. Argentina indicates that it will not accept any judgement.

No mention of fish.
35 Pete Bog (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 09:22 am Report abuse
This shows the Argentines are scared of the Falkland Islanders, because the Argentines are not intelligent enough to do so. The only thing the Argentines uunderstand is aggression.
36 GreekYoghurt (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 09:43 am Report abuse
@33 Sorry Dany, I didn't get what you were trying to say. I'm not an uneducated poor person, I don't even speak spanish or watch plebball.

The fact is Argentinian schooling and education is just so dreadful that they won't figure out that this portrayal of history from a bitter author, a bitter traitor and a lady who cannot seem to string her thoughts together coherently ... isn't actually correct.

They'll just accept it as fact and their lives will continue on in a tragic fashion. This is typical of people in their 'latin america'. It's good that the Falklands are in Anglo-franco america then.
37 DanyBerger (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 10:40 am Report abuse
@GreekYoghurt

OK, but now can you write all this again in good and coherent English so everybody can understand what you were trying to say?

We are not asking you to learn Spanish or German or Italian I know that this is an impossible task for your little brain.

But come at least on read some book of English grammar time to time. Would you?

Am I asking too much?
38 GreekYoghurt (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 10:47 am Report abuse
@37 It's nothing about Italian or German. It's about the fact I don't need to talk to poor uneducated people, so I don't need to learn Spanish. I'm more than capable of second-language learning, I just have no motivation to learn what is essentially the language of the morally culpable. sorry.

The fact is your Neo-hitler President asked people listen and to sit down and have a dialogue, the FIG offered her the chance to listen and have a dialogue and she completely ignored their offer.

She's just a mindless hypocrite. We know it, you know it. Now get over it.
39 Idlehands (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 10:53 am Report abuse
“But come at least on read some book of English grammar time to time. Would you?”

Classic - where's my “I'm with stupid -->” T-Shirt?
40 Islander1 (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 11:13 am Report abuse
Marcos- if you ma staements- back them up with factual evidence - or stay quiet at all times.

Where is your evidence that there are unidentified British dead buried in the Islands?

A documented FACT for you though- After the Arg surrender in June 1982 and even after each battle - Argentine Officers REFUSED to work with the British to identify the Argentine dead on the battlefields.
Your Arg Officers and NCOs KNEW their names - but REFUSED to tell the British.

THAT is why so many are unidentified.

Furthermore the British Govt confirmed to the Falklands Govt the other day that NO such request has been recieved from the Int red Cross or your Govt.

Deal in facts - not fantasy like CFK
41 Conqueror (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 11:15 am Report abuse
@1 Stupid cow!
@8 Here's a couple of thoughts. For a start, they're already buried. What's Mama going to do? Dig them up and bury them again? There are no unidentified British troops, WE bothered to give all ours identity tags. Don't recall you giving the same rights to the people you dropped in the ocean.
@18 Nobody waved anything. It was on a flagpole, STUPID!
@24 Did you know that I have, unfortunately, trod in dog turds with more intelligence?
@28 It doesn't raise ANY questions about argie “sincerity”. WE ALL know what THEY are!
42 GreekYoghurt (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 11:15 am Report abuse
@40 You make a good point. The FIG deal in Objective Truths, the Arg.gov deal in Subjective Truths.

The Argentinians never back up anything they say with Facts, they just repeat opinions. All their quotes are opinions. They are never underpinned by current or historical facts.

They cannot even deal with the fact the Falklanders exist.
43 A Skiver (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 11:24 am Report abuse
#1

CFK is probably upset that Iraq and Afganistan now have democracies giving the people self-determination rights.
44 UKOwnsArgentina (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 11:55 am Report abuse
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45 Musky (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 12:32 pm Report abuse
I watched the proceedings on the UN webcast, from partly through MLA Edwards to most of CKF and I must say how well Edwards and Summers performed. They gave a good account of themselves and the falklands and the way it is and in no way played with the truth.
CKF resorted to claiming that the Falklands were theirs because she saw birds flying in from that direction and they could not make such a journey from the uk. She said 'how awful' to celebrate the end of wars.. downgrading the efforts of the britain, america and its allies in ending WW2 or any war. 'Are we bad people'?' she asked... because many britons live in argentina .. bet they all keep quiet about the falklands.
There was an ex-falklander of argentine descent casting dirt on the islanders, saying he'd effectively been run out of town. This one-sided story proves just one thing... he left the falklands.

Finally CFK finishes her presentation to a thunderous applause... from the entourage of 90 hand picked chums.

Exciting times ahead....
46 EnginnerAbroad (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 12:51 pm Report abuse
Funny isn't it. The british are evil for celbrating the end of a war yet in Argentina they celebrate the start of an illegal war by a government they tell us they had absoutly nothing to do with by giving everyone a day of work, and as she stated yesterday “How is this the fault of Argentine people”

Because you stood by and let them take power and hold that power and obly choose to overthrow them after they had lost the war. If Argentine was truelly anti war it would of overthrown the government when the announced the invasion. They didnt because they beleieved in the invasion which is exacly why the Junta and Galaterri did it. If it isnt Argentines fault then it certainly isnt the Falklands islanders fault.
47 GreekYoghurt (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 12:54 pm Report abuse
@46 Well... pretty much all the Argentines lined the streets and clapped when they found out the junta had started the war. When it comes to a sign of popular support that's pretty much the best one you can get.

Then she started talking about Maximo being in a war, which is nonsense because he's fat as f*ck and clearly couldn't go for 5 minutes without having a cream-bun.

The manically clapping entourage were quite magnificent though. They were very good at clapping at the right times.
48 briton (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 12:59 pm Report abuse
as these argies cannot prove anything they say,

why bother,

once a liar, always a liar
49 EnginnerAbroad (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 01:12 pm Report abuse
I actualy believe that statements to the UN should be made under oath and the law of perjurary should be incoporated so that there is a legal remedy for member states who are disadvnataged by others declaring statements which can be proven to be incorrect or false.
50 GreekYoghurt (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 01:18 pm Report abuse
@48.49 But it's interesting to see how far they will go to tell lies. Getting an argentine to say anything under oath is not going to happen, they avoid the ICJ like the plague for just that reason.
51 briton (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 01:34 pm Report abuse
m
yes but can you imagine a judge sitting at the hearings, whos job it is ,
is to refute any liars that have been told,

CFK the islands are our,
judge- no they are not,
CFK - they are being hgeld hostage
judge- no they are not .
CFK- they are stealing our resources,
judge - no they are not,
CFK- silence .
judge- next speaker please ,
????????????
interesting and very funny,
52 ElaineB (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 02:16 pm Report abuse
Argentines used the word 'celebration' for their festivities over the anniversary of the start of the Falklands War. I was in BsAs at the time and challenged some pro-government Argentines over the use of the word 'celebration', stating that it should be a commemoration. They were adamant that it should be a celebration as CFKC stated. So I asked them why they wanted to celebrate the start of a war they lost and would they go around shouting 'We are losers, we are losers' at their celebration. They went very quiet while that thought sunk in.
53 GreekYoghurt (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 02:21 pm Report abuse
@52 Curious that she thinks celebrating a war makes her feel shame for the victor and pride for the loser.

Makes me think her mind is unsettled and forgetful.
54 Idlehands (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 02:57 pm Report abuse
Someone else on here came up with the analogy - but I think it's worth repeating. The CFK government behaves like a pinball in play, bouncing around from rubber to flapper in a state of constant crisis.

The difference is a pinball knows it is an object of fun and not the one pressing the buttons.
55 ElaineB (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 03:06 pm Report abuse
@53 & 54

I think CFKC's mind is unsettled and forgetful, and probably reacts like a pinball machine. I noticed how she would ramble and make some random remark that seemed to surprise even her.
56 GreekYoghurt (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 03:21 pm Report abuse
Gibraltar guy is tearing Spain/C24 a new asshole.
57 axel arg (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 03:39 pm Report abuse
Unfortunatelly this is evident that neather summers, nor cameron, or some other integrant of the l. a from the islands realized about how hipocrite and rediculous they were going to seem before the public opinion when they accused argentina of colonialism, summers did the same in his statement. However at the same time, they want to continue under the protection of a colonial power which still has 10 of the 16 colonial enclaves.
On the other hand, summers, like all the rest of the integrants from the l. a. distort once and again the resolutions from the u. n. It has never asked the u. k to return the islands to arg., beside, it neather invoked the right to self determination for this cause, like it did for ohers colonial situations, nor said that the sovereignty must be discussed only if the islanders wish it. Beside, summers omits that the malvinas-falkland cause has always been considered like a particular-colonial situation.
If the u. k never asked the u. k to return the islands to arg., it means that the islanders will be able to remain under british government as much as they want, and we won't be able to change that, beyond what our constitution says about our claim. But it doesn't mean that we can't find a fair solution for all the parts, however this is evident that it's something that neather summers, nor all the rest of the l. a from the islands want, thats' why they say they are dispossed to discuss about different issues with arg., but not the sovereignty. On the other hand, c. f. k was very clear yesterday when she said that we are not asking the u. k, to recognize that the islands are argentine, we just ask it to dialogue with us about this conflict, this phrase destroy planty of the stupid and hipocrite conclussions that some people in this forum, and the lawmakers from the islands give when they argue about the posture of argentina. Anyway i have always thought too that our government should dilaogue with the islanders.
58 Marcos Alejandro (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 03:40 pm Report abuse
24 DanyBerger

Bravo!
59 GreekYoghurt (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 03:48 pm Report abuse
@57 Axel. You don't seem to understand that KFC directly stated that she wanted the proposal to lead to Falklands integration with an alien power, Argentina. This is completely against the remit of the C24 and the UN Charter.

KFC wasn't clear yesterday. She was the exact opposite of clear. She was babbling on about how these 'Malvinas' were Argentine because of migrating birds. They've altered the constitution to reflect that they want full sovereignty of the islands, that much is clear. This leaves nothing to discuss, because they've already said what they want and they'll only settle for that.

These Argentines don't even care about what the Falklanders say, or even that they exist. They just keep repeating that it's 'our latin america' and these people are anglo-french, implying it's not their land.

She's a shameless hypocrite leading a country full of pathetic rodents.
60 Truth_Telling_Troll (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 03:51 pm Report abuse
@59

Well, they don't exist, thus they should be left alone by Argentina. I will support your side up t that point.

But I will be the first in the street if Argentina in the future ever has any dealings with those people. No cooperation, ever again.
61 Leiard (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 03:56 pm Report abuse
You have two countries Argentina and Spain, both with using the UN.C24 to distract their own people from their internal problems.

They are now talking about Western Sahara.
Cuba, Venezuela,Ecuador, are now stating that the C24 should allow self determination, respect the rights of these people, accept the referendum from these people.
62 GreekYoghurt (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 03:58 pm Report abuse
@60 That's fine. You can cooperate with 'kelper' Alessandro Betts, he seems well suited to your Argentine moral and ethical code [or lack thereof]. Then the Falklanders can get along with making their nation something similar to Singapore, but a bit more snowy.

[Likelihood of this happening = 0; Argentines are imbeciles and will therefore invade again within 10 years forcing the major powers to ruin them into a cave dwelling existence]
63 Truth_Telling_Troll (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 04:00 pm Report abuse
These British are totally one crazy bunch.

Britain has no internal problems, apparently. Because they point fingers at all other nations on this planet on a daily based.

They are the most distracted and hoodwinked population of all.
64 Leiard (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 04:06 pm Report abuse
TTT
Yes we have our own internal problems and we are trying to sort these out

We are supporting the Falkland Islanders in their self determination.
65 GreekYoghurt (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 04:12 pm Report abuse
@63 You can read about our issues in our free press. It's typically about ethnic minorities in Bradford marrying their cousins, having 14 deformed kids [bankrupting the NHS] and then demanding a gold bullion 17 bedroom house from the council without looking for work, because western work is evil.

So that's why I pop in here every so often for a laugh.
66 Leiard (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 04:15 pm Report abuse
@65
sometimes your comments are worse than some of the others on these threads.
67 Truth_Telling_Troll (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 04:20 pm Report abuse
Your free press? You mean the one that was told to massage the Iraq war, the one who is involved in a massive corruption and human rights scandal, and the one that has always been the laughing stock of Europe for being overwhemingly sensatioanist and tabloid oriented?

Oh that one.
68 Conqueror (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 04:21 pm Report abuse
@51 Isn't that what the “Chair” is supposed to do?
@57 Explain how using a forum that is supposed to be about de-colonisation to press a “claim” for support in reference to a territory that belongs to someone else and is occupied by someone else so that you can colonise it is not hypocritical. Then go on to explain to explain how argieland could have sovereignty whilst leaving the people under their existing administrations. I'm going to put it to you that what you want is the resources. So you're proposing that argieland will leave the people alone whilst taking their resources. You must think we're as stupid as you are. But now I'm going to give you a little personal tip. If you watch the way that I, and others, use the English language, you might learn something.
@60 So you're planning to breach the UN Charter yet again!
@63 Your problem is that you can't get your head around our ability to think about more than one thing at a time. Obviously, you can't!
69 Leiard (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 04:22 pm Report abuse
TTT

You have obviously never read der spiegel - that great German newspaper.
70 Truth_Telling_Troll (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 04:24 pm Report abuse
I have, it is also garbage and underlined by nationalist haughtyness towards the rest of Europe.

So?
71 Leiard (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 04:31 pm Report abuse
TTT
Association of Publishers of Argentina, your own little group that support the government.

The point is that it was you who suggested that the UK press were all idiots.
72 Truth_Telling_Troll (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 04:35 pm Report abuse
“Suggested”? Even the Brits (not all of you here, since you obviously will deny it to save face), acknowledge the UK media has a laughable international reputation. Heck, its even a point of mention in travel books about your country.
73 deutscher (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 05:02 pm Report abuse
I Think Mike Summers is worried about his business in fisheries.
If the 'Falklands' became argentine, he will lost this large amount of money.
There is nothing worse than a poor and discriminated farmer who became rich from one day to another.
Mike, go home, you are not supposed to defend your business in UN.
74 Pete Bog (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 05:16 pm Report abuse
@57 I need your help. I cannot find any UN statement that definately rules out self determination for the Falkland Islanders. Please provide me a link to where the United Nations has explicitly stated that self-determination does not apply to the Falkland Islanders.

The Falkland Islands is no longer a colony of the UK, due to the devolvement of law making powers to the Falkland Islands, they are a self-governing overseas territory, (the clue is in the name).
Iam glad to see you support dialogue between the Argentine Government and the Falkland Islands Government because the Argentines will get nowhere fast if they don't.
Can anyone on this post especially the followers of Mrs Botox, enlighten me?
Do the Argentines now believe that migrating birds should be given control over countries ?
Ie, as swallows migrate from Africa to the UK, does this mean the Swallow's African country of origin holds sovereignity over the UK or is it the other way round? And if some Swallows stop over on the way, who owns the countries they stop over in???
75 Leiard (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 05:40 pm Report abuse
Another great broadcast

webtv.un.org/media/watch/h.e.-mr.-h%C3%A9ctor-marcos-timerman-foreign-minister-of-the-republic-of-argentina-media-stakeout/1690089823001
76 slattzzz (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 06:23 pm Report abuse
@75 what a load of bollocks he looks like a rabbit in headlights, if William Hague and Hilary Clinton ever lowered themselves to attend one of these meetings I bet all the nations present would come out and agree with them, whatever the subject, why? because they are a bunch of spineless bastards. But the point is once again he hasn't the decency or guts to mention the people of the Falkland Islandsand thier wishes. A complete and utter TIT or is that TTT
77 reality check (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 06:31 pm Report abuse
@75
So you agree it is Mikes home. Good, then keep your thieving hands to yourselfs and let him get on with his life as you seem so eager for him to do.
78 slattzzz (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 06:42 pm Report abuse
Argentinas delegate at UN C24 meeting 92 other countries about 5, Argentina. President, Foriegn secretary, top goverment officials, mayors, war vets, a british traitor, war widows, thier Mothers and a few aunties and the rest to carry CFK's shopping plus a cat and someone to carry BK's tissues in case of accident. Fookin idiots.
79 Truth_Telling_Troll (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 06:59 pm Report abuse
www.ironiascotidianas.com/2007/04/o-mar-da-alegria.html

The Falklander's Sea of Shit was not their originality. The Brazilians already claimed the Sea of Joy, and the Chileans a bit later the Sea of Concha'tu madre.
80 reality check (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 07:02 pm Report abuse
That last post should be for deutscher at 73.
@78Slattzzz
Same odds as 2nd April, 1982. Once a bully!
81 Truth_Telling_Troll (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 07:08 pm Report abuse
Once a bully...

Always a European country.
82 slattzzz (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 07:14 pm Report abuse
TTT wakey wakey as i said before you dont like the truth, change your name!!!! Unless your Guzz the ships cat in disguise
83 Truth_Telling_Troll (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 07:17 pm Report abuse
European countries will never be forgiven for what they did to millions of people in multiple continents, to hundreds of innocent species, and to the flora of their own continent.

We celebrate what is going on in Europe right now including the UK, the protests, the strikes, the cuts, the downgrades, the unemployment, the recession.

It is a divine send, that is obviousl
84 Britninja (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 07:27 pm Report abuse
@83 You're sounding increasingly twisted Tobias. Maybe you should step back from the computer before that little bulgy vein in your forehead explodes.
85 Truth_Telling_Troll (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 07:31 pm Report abuse
Not twisted. Simply put, seeing how you Europeans act in this and other forums has fostered a hatred in the heart of this young argentine. And like me millions of others. Why we are so amenable to the teachings of professors in our universities about Europe, which are far worse than anything I have said here (which is all fact). If people here think I don't like Europeans, you don't want to meet uni students taking Professorials on European Crimes against Humanity and Mother Earth (a course of study).
86 slattzzz (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 07:49 pm Report abuse
TTT its only fact according to you, young my arse. What strikes in the UK, think you'll find we are still AAA rated and the financial hub of the world, hows your economy going. Not good CFK's spending it in New York pensions and all. If you are young as you say I suggest you open your eyes to whats going on in your own country and let your voice be heard before it's to late and life passes you by, or you get thrown out of a C130 into the South Atlantic. PS Don't believe all your professors are telling you, remember they tell you what they want you to hear, just like Hitler did to his people. Anyway lighten up and salute the Falkland Island peoples right to self determination, have a drink and chill
87 Britninja (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 07:50 pm Report abuse
It sounds eerily similar to the throughly objective and factually-accurate propaganda-fest teaching that Argentine kids in school experience. Clearly your country's whole educational system is a factory for churning out angry bitter nationalists with a sense of entitlement.
88 Truth_Telling_Troll (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 07:56 pm Report abuse
Who says I believe what professors say? I think for myself. I haven't mentioned what they teach about what Europeans did to the planet, I don't believe all of it.

But, Europe destroyed its own environment, committed crimes against millions around the world, exterminated many species. Thos are all facts. If they make you Europeans uncomfortable, that is not the messenger's fault, it is the message.

If Argentina won't ever be forgiven about the Falklands as stated constantly here, you must all be dreaming if you believe Europe will be forgiven for what it did, which is the Falklands to the 10*10*10 power.
89 slattzzz (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 08:14 pm Report abuse
So your anti European for what reason, because we've left you behind? Dont talk about extermination South America's record is not great either. You contradict yourself again by saying you don't believe it all but constantly quote crimes against humanity, are you refering to the Germans in WW2 against the Jews, did you expect us to sit back and let it happen, same as do you expect us to sit back and let Syria happen, whilst you do nothing and then judge us, because Syria sides with you over human rights (LAUGHS OUTLOUD) towards the Falkland Islands. We are not UNCOMFORTABLE but we will fight and win for what we believe is right which includes the British Soveriegn territory of the Falkland Islands. What are your views on the middle east if you feel so strongly about UK/US intervention and the constant put down of free speech and democracy of those people, about Isreal being constantly harranged for just being what they are, a nation of free thinking people with the will to be recognised. RING ANY BELLS.
90 Truth_Telling_Troll (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 08:26 pm Report abuse
Your discursive harangue makes whatever you attempted to convey diffuse.

I'm anti-European simply for one reason: none of these nations ever showed CONTRITION.

If you did, and were humble for once in your lives, you would be shocked how powerful that could be... but won't ever happen, you simply are incapable.

What does Syria have to do with anything? The Middle East is a disaster created in great extent by the UK, France, USA, Italy (Lybia), etc, etc... Countries that made no sense ethnically, tribally, or religiously. Syria, Iraq, etc, are in significant measure your fault.

Israel is a different matter, I don't like how Israel was created, because it is exactly what all of you accuse Argentina of doing (of displacing natives). But it is what it is now, and Israel is a legimimate nation and Argentina was one of the first to support it back then.

Anyway... Humility. Europeans have no capability of it, which is why I'm anti.
91 reality check (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 08:44 pm Report abuse
Contrition, lovely word. First time I have ever heard it used in a secular context though.
92 slattzzz (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 08:46 pm Report abuse
TTT you are totally deluded and sorry to say stupid. You say what has Syria got to do with it but constantly harp on about Iraq, Libya etc etc when you are losing an arguement, try telling the people in those countries they make no sense ethically, tribally or otherwise I think you won't like the response. Isreal has a case whereas Argentina does not. We don't need to be humble we know we're right and can prove it instead of spinning lies and deciept and constant whinging to an organisation that is both fruitless and a waste of all countries involved tax payers money. Leave the Falkland Islanders alone to live thier lives, if it's not important to you that you get the Falklands stop posting SHIT
93 Truth_Telling_Troll (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 08:59 pm Report abuse
@91

Libya was an ITALIAN invention, an oppresed colony of theirs. Syria and Iraq British/French inventions, your oppresed colonies. And not even colonies, since they were people's INVADED by you Europeans.

You know, this sums up the European attitude: I go to a home and rape a 16 year old girl. She has the child, and then the child falls seriously ill. I come along saying I'll help the child with the medical bills... so I must be a good guy now!!!

LOL

You people are really disturbed.

Most of the ethnic turmoil in the Middle East and Africa is because European nations invented nations that do not exist. Like Argentina going to Europe and creating a county out of southern Ireland, England, and northern france; another nation out of southern Germany, Switzerland, and northern Italy; another out of Portugal, Spain, and southern France...

HOW LONG would you guys be at peace in such “countries”??

So now you claim to stand for these people's rights, when their suffering is partly your fault!

Insane.
94 slattzzz (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 09:18 pm Report abuse
so that would be like EUROPEAN SPAIN inventing rgenweener. Then rgenweener decides we'll kill all the indigenous people, thats ok, then decides we'll kill some of our own by throwing them into the south atlantic from a C130, then we''ll invade the Falkalnd Islands because they are only a few klicks from our coast and the Brits won't bother. You are wrong on so many issues. So we let all these countries go thier own way and they fooked it up so it's all Europeans fault FFS grow up. I take it all would be good if Hitler had won the war and everyone was German, sorry your arguement is flawed at best and derogitory at worst to all the countries that just want to be recogised as self determinating.............RING ANY BELLS
95 Truth_Telling_Troll (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 09:22 pm Report abuse
We woudn't be German, we were at peace with Germany. You, maybe.

Spain did not invent rgenweener. Argentina invented itself, and conquered our neighbor's territories and grew from the size of France to world's 7th largest landmass. The difference we did these things in our own territory, not in other continents.
96 Britninja (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 09:32 pm Report abuse
You didn't have your “own territory”, you stole it. You think you're somehow morally superior to present-day Europeans just because your *European* ancestors stayed put in one location and massacred the natives and attacked your neighbours rather then travelling a bit further afield? Jeebus that's twisted Argie logic at work. O.o
97 Truth_Telling_Troll (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 09:38 pm Report abuse
We went to war with Paraguay, the natives and won. We forced Bolivia and Chile to cede land to us. We encouraged Brazil to give us most if Iguazu Falls, and Uruguay to give us Martin Garcia Island.

They all agreed. Tough luck, right?

Right??
98 briton (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 09:48 pm Report abuse
Truth_Telling_Troll
European countries will never be forgiven
Including, Spain , Germany , Holland , Denmark , bell, Andorra , Italy , Greece , Switzerland , yep all bad, very bad,

Should have been British then ,

.
99 Britninja (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 09:50 pm Report abuse
I just find it a little incongruous how you can boast about Argentina's list of brutal territory-expanding endeavours while at the same time ranting about meanie Europe and all the nasty things we've done. I mean, are you not getting that you're a hypocrite? (To be fair it is a distinct Argie trait from Turkeyneck downwards).
100 Truth_Telling_Troll (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 09:58 pm Report abuse
@99

Young countries must take risks. Europe is not a young place, you had no further right to other territories, much less outside your own continent.
101 Britninja (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 10:08 pm Report abuse
Lol wow... It really does show that Argies can convince themselves of anything when it comes to their hypocritical, tissue-thin arguments. So butchering defenceless people is a “risk” for you but a black crime for everyone else. I only recently learned this term, which is apparently well-known in Latin America:

Viveza Criolla

Viveza criolla is a Spanish language phrase literally meaning “native cunning” describing a way of life in Argentina, originating in Buenos Aires, in which to achieve success in life, anything goes: lies, taking advantage of the weaknesses of others, etc. Viveza criolla has been called “the principal cause of a moral, cultural, economic, social and political crisis”. It is a philosophy of progress along the line of least resistance and ignoring rules, a sense of responsibility and consideration for others, and it extends to all social groups and throughout the whole country, although it predominates in Buenos Aires. It is a similar concept to jeitinho brasileiro in Brazil.

Viveza criolla includes:

1. Lack of respect for others and indifference to the common good in a framework of individual interests.
2. Political corruption, which extends in all institutions, in the form of perks, direct appropriation of public funds, favoritism, misallocation of state resources, etc.
3. Extreme individualism, with mistrust of others and little ability to partner and cooperate in community goals.
4. Anomie or weakening of the common morality, and social deviance as behavior that departs from generally accepted standards in society.
5. The habit of blaming problems on someone else, thereby encouraging paranoia and granting a permit to self-indulgence.

I think you've got a major dose of 5. with a sprinkling of 3. at the moment.
102 briton (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 10:10 pm Report abuse
So by your very own words,,,,,,,
The
USA Australia, NZ and Canada,
Can all attack Argentina?
As young countries must take risks,

Sounds very risky to me.
And suicidal .e
103 Truth_Telling_Troll (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 10:18 pm Report abuse
New Zealand, Australia woudn't dare really.

Canada could win, but then how would the keep an occupation force? They would lose there.

United States can, but it is no wonderous feat for a country of 300 million to take over one of 40 million.

@101

No it is you Brits who play that game. Blame Argentina for its improprieties, but whatever the UK did is totally forgivable because of what... you brought the befallen cricket and rugby?

That is the British logic.
104 Britninja (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 10:25 pm Report abuse
Well next time your “young Argentinian heart” is filled with burning hate for people based on the crimes of their long-dead ancestors, feel free to give yourself a quick smack round the face ;)
105 Truth_Telling_Troll (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 10:28 pm Report abuse
Killing in war is not a crime. Sorry.

We won fair and square, the Paraguayans, Chileans, Bolivians, Uruguayans, natives lost.
106 Britninja (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 10:45 pm Report abuse
Riiiiiight. So killing in war is not a crime. Except that I've read your remarks in other threads talking about how shameful Europe is for killing people in the World Wars... So bad when Europe does it, fine when you do it.

And an infinitely better-armed invading army massacring natives is “fair and square”... So when we colonised less-advanced countries we're despicable, but when you do it it's fine and dandy...

You might have a big vocabulary but frankly I think even you know your arguments are pretty meh. If this is the sort of rubbish that university lecturers feed their students in Argentina, I have an even lower opinion of your country than I did before.
107 Truth_Telling_Troll (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 10:53 pm Report abuse
There is a difference between a CRIME and a moral sin. I have said Europe should be unquestionably ashamed for their savagery in the world wars... you don't find it humiliating for your civilization, the barbarism it reached then, on both sides though particularly on the Axis side?

There is also a difference between subjugating loose tribes that were barely even hunter-gatherers, and conquering well established civilizations and peoples in India, North Africa, Middle East, Mesoamerica, Andean South America, etc. That demand serious preparation, and preparation affords you multiple opportunities for scruples to demur your plans. Yet European nations pursued them anyways.
108 Britninja (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 10:59 pm Report abuse
Just more semantics and self-delusion. We invaded and killed people. You invaded and killed people. Simple. End of. :)
109 WestisBest (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 10:59 pm Report abuse
@105

...and you lost in the Falklands, fair and square.
110 Truth_Telling_Troll (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 11:02 pm Report abuse
@108

Sorry, but you are not morally superior. Argies never say we are morally superior, it is the Europeans who claim it. I simply put you down back to where you all belong. Bottom shelf.

@109

I agree.
111 Britninja (#) Jun 15th, 2012 - 11:18 pm Report abuse
No Tobias, you simply made yourself look silly. Just like your president, everything you say is riddled with hypocrisy. If *we're* on the bottom shelf, you're down there with us. We can all be guilty together - yay.
112 Truth_Telling_Troll (#) Jun 16th, 2012 - 12:43 am Report abuse
But we are only 200 years. You had 1800 years prior to us to rectify.

Some would call that, dumbness.
113 Britninja (#) Jun 16th, 2012 - 12:57 am Report abuse
You could have learned from our mistakes and chosen to take a better path, but you didn't. Argentina is choosing to do things in 2012 that most civilised countries view as tawdry episodes of their distant past. What's worse? A person who commits a crime but learns from it and vows never to do it again, or a person who sees the initial crime and consequences and decides to gleefully copy it anyway? Frankly in that way I think we *are* morally superior to you. Oh, and we also don't poison the minds of our children and young people with government-sponsored bullshit either. Another morality point for us. You can stay on the bottom shelf by yourself :)
114 Truth_Telling_Troll (#) Jun 16th, 2012 - 01:01 am Report abuse
You only learn from the mistakes of those you may consider worthy of observation.

I don't consider amoebas, for example, worthy of study in regards to their morality.

Europe is the amoeba of morals. Not even worth a look. Sordid vacuum of any morality there.
115 Britninja (#) Jun 16th, 2012 - 01:07 am Report abuse
It's a shame because I used to think you were a bit more reasonable than the braindead Malvinista trash that infests these boards. But your obsessive sanctimonious hate for an entire contintent is just weird. Maybe you should try more typical studenty things like drinking, playing Call of Duty and getting laid - it might cheer you up.
116 Faulconbridge (#) Jun 16th, 2012 - 01:07 am Report abuse
'Young countries must take risks.'...and they shouldn't whine when the risks come out against them, TTT @ 99
117 Truth_Telling_Troll (#) Jun 16th, 2012 - 01:08 am Report abuse
@115

I hate arrogant twats. Simple as that.

If Europe and the USA are full of them, not my fault.
118 Faulconbridge (#) Jun 16th, 2012 - 01:22 am Report abuse
haveyou ever heard of the psychological condition known as projection, TTT?
119 Truth_Telling_Troll (#) Jun 16th, 2012 - 01:26 am Report abuse
No need to convolute things.

None of you have the guts to admit it here, but Europeans and Americans are known around the world for their (unmerited) belief of moral/racial superiority.

Call me a liar for saying that. Where have all racially poisoned regimes, groups, and ideologies come from? Which have been the most murderous nations in the 19th and 20th centuries?

That's right. Call me a liar... go ahead if you have the gall.
120 Faulconbridge (#) Jun 16th, 2012 - 01:49 am Report abuse
'
None of you have the guts to admit it here, but Europeans and Americans are known around the world for their (unmerited) belief of moral/racial superiority.'
Definitely, projection here:
None of you have the guts to admit it here, but Argentines are known around Latin America for their (unmerited) belief in their own moral/racial superiority.

'Which have been the most murderous nations in the 19th and 20th centuries?'
Numerically, China, in both centuries.
Proportionate to population, Paraguay and Cambodia in the nineteenth and twentieth centuries.
All self-inflicted.
121 Truth_Telling_Troll (#) Jun 16th, 2012 - 01:56 am Report abuse
@120

Ad homimens are the refuge of those replete of vacuous argument.
122 Faulconbridge (#) Jun 16th, 2012 - 02:03 am Report abuse
'Ad homimens are the refuge of those replete of vacuous argument'

Not when the homo concerned acknowledges their their opinions are inspired by nothing but hatred, TTT.

What'e ad hominem about this, anyway?
Argentines are known around Latin America for their (unmerited) belief in their own moral/racial superiority.

'Which have been the most murderous nations in the 19th and 20th centuries?'
Numerically, China, in both centuries.
Proportionate to population, Paraguay and Cambodia in the nineteenth and twentieth centuries.
All self-inflicted.
123 Truth_Telling_Troll (#) Jun 16th, 2012 - 02:10 am Report abuse
I called Europeans as self-believing in moral/racial superiority, you countered with the exact same accusation about Argentines, with the purpose of making my observation somehow invalid.

I just used the “tu qouque” clause to call out your ad hominem.

As per the 2nd part, you yourself said it: SELF-INFLICTED. Europe killed millions not of their own nationality.
124 Faulconbridge (#) Jun 16th, 2012 - 02:16 am Report abuse
'I called Europeans as self-believing in moral/racial superiority, you countered with the exact same accusation about Argentines, with the purpose of making my observation somehow invalid.'

As distinct from ad Europeanam, TTT? Actually, I was merely pointing out a widespread perception of Argentines in Latin America. The fact that it confirms my hypothesis about your own mental condition is a bonus.

'As per the 2nd part, you yourself said it: SELF-INFLICTED. Europe killed millions not of their own nationality.'
I see. It doesn't matter how many are murdered if they are of their own nationality. Definitely an exculpation of Argentine history.
125 Truth_Telling_Troll (#) Jun 16th, 2012 - 02:25 am Report abuse
I was merely pointing out a global perception of Europeans and Americans, why so defensive.

More people certainly died in one of England's many civil wars than in all dark epidodes of internal argentine history.

Though, admittedly, you usually took it out on the Irish.
126 Faulconbridge (#) Jun 16th, 2012 - 02:34 am Report abuse
'I was merely pointing out a global perception of Europeans and Americans'....and i was merely pointing out it was false.

'More people certainly died in one of England's many civil wars than in all dark epidodes of internal argentine history. '....which- even if true- ended before Argetina was invented.

'Though, admittedly, you usually took it out on the Irish.'..and Ireland is much closer to britain geographically than the Falklands are to Argentina and was granted to English kings on legally stronger grounds and so by your standards was perfectly justified.
127 Truth_Telling_Troll (#) Jun 16th, 2012 - 02:43 am Report abuse
You did point out it was false? Must have missed that, golly.

All I recall is you ad hominem'ing me about that remark. As hard as I try anamnesis, I can't bring back any rebuttal of yours regarding European/American arrogance. Sorry.

Since when does chronological positioning trump extent through time? It took you 800 years to get your internal act together, and you are judging us?

Justifying the deliberate starvation of the Irish, and the killing of thousands of them in relatiation of defiance of British oppression... Interesting mores.
128 Faulconbridge (#) Jun 16th, 2012 - 02:58 am Report abuse
'You did point out it was false? Must have missed that, golly.'
You're not a very observant chap.

'All I recall is you ad hominem'ing me about that remark. As hard as I try anamnesis, I can't bring back any rebuttal of yours regarding European/American arrogance. Sorry.'

...and your arguments- as you acknowleddge- are inspired by hatred, which makes your mental state a relevant aspect of the discussion.

'Since when does chronological positioning trump extent through time? It took you 800 years to get your internal act together, and you are judging us? '
Who are 'you' and who are 'us'? Even if your claim is true, it's going to be about six humdred years before Argentina gets internal act together, so the Falklanders have very good reason to want to keep away from it.

'Justifying the deliberate starvation of the Irish, and the killing of thousands of them in relatiation of defiance of British oppression... Interesting mores.'
Standard mores of the times, as Rosas and Sarmiento would acknowledge.
129 Truth_Telling_Troll (#) Jun 16th, 2012 - 03:10 am Report abuse
Be advised I'm merely toying with you Faulcon.

You did not present any evidence to confute my statament about how Europeans and American are perceived. To call into question my ocular capacity is yet another peripephal (to be grossly generous) diversion.

My statements are inspirted by hatred, but all of you insult Argentina out of brotherly love? What asinine claim.

Argentina already got its act together, it grew from the size of France to the world's 7th largest nation, it was at one point 5th richest, it is the only one that has not faced any secession movements in the New World, and yeah we have two world cups. I'd say we have our act together more than most.

Yet you lambast Rosas and Sarmiento, but excuse your diadem wearing monarchs. Basileiolatry up your alley?
130 Faulconbridge (#) Jun 16th, 2012 - 03:30 am Report abuse
'You did not present any evidence to confute my statament about how Europeans and American are perceived. To call into question my ocular capacity is yet another peripephal (to be grossly generous) diversion.'
Ah. You failed to specify which of your claims you meant.
I answered your question: 'Which have been the most murderous nations in the 19th and 20th centuries?' As you haven't actually produced any evidence for your claim about how Europeans and American are perceived there's no need to refute it.

'My statements are inspirted by hatred, but all of you insult Argentina out of brotherly love? What asinine claim.'
All of me? How have I insulted Argentina? I have been rude about Argentine politicians and Argentine voters, but nothing like as rude as other Argentine politicians and other Argentine voters.

'Argentina already got its act together, it grew from the size of France to the world's 7th largest nation, it was at one point 5th richest, it is the only one that has not faced any secession movements in the New World, and yeah we have two world cups. I'd say we have our act together more than most.'
...and yet it has a history of civil wars,dictatorships, caudillism, coups, hatred of its nrighbours and national delusions.

'
Yet you lambast Rosas and Sarmiento, but excuse your diadem wearing monarchs'
Where have I lambasted Rosas or Sarmiento? I pointed out that they- like nineteenth century British politicians (what do powerless diadem wearing monarchs have to do with it?)- reflected the attitudes of theur times.
Basileiolatry may be foolish but it is certainly much less dangerous or damaging than caudillism or kleptocrcay when the monarch is powerless and serves a symbolic role .
131 St.John (#) Jun 16th, 2012 - 06:32 am Report abuse
@57 Axel arg

When the Falkland Islanders want to stay British and under no circumstances want to become Argentinos, what is then “a fair solution for all the part[ie]s”?
132 DanyBerger (#) Jun 16th, 2012 - 07:56 am Report abuse
@St.John

Fair solution:
They stay British as long as they wish (self-D here) and Argentina will be responsible for foreign affairs and defence. UK goes home and everybody happy.

Pax romana
133 Leiard (#) Jun 16th, 2012 - 08:35 am Report abuse
@132
And if that is not what the Falkland Islanders want, is yours a fair solution?
134 DanyBerger (#) Jun 16th, 2012 - 09:38 am Report abuse
@Leiard

You say fair solution and not what the Islanders want.
What the Islanders want (to keep the status quo) will not be possible to keep in the time much longer.

So you have to get real and evaluate your better options while you can to negotiate a definitive long standing peaceful solution.

Or risk to have nothing in the future to negotiate and meanwhile deal with future Arg./ SA escalating measures like:

1-The ruining or the entire economy of the Islands. For example given free licences to fish indiscriminate.
2-By ruining entirely your little tourist industry.
3-By cutting air links to Rio Grande to Antarctica.
3-Pushing to put more restrictions on UK exports to MS that can be extended to the whole SA.
4- Military action.

Do you want more?
135 Self Determination (#) Jun 16th, 2012 - 10:48 am Report abuse
@134
4- Bring it on ,and we will kick your Argie butts again, next time we wont be so magnanimous in victory, we will waste the infrastructure of Argentina (some say we should have done it in 1982).
You should be thanking the UK for ridding you of Galtieri, You dont understand humility.
136 Faulconbridge (#) Jun 16th, 2012 - 12:06 pm Report abuse
'Fair solution:
They stay British as long as they wish (self-D here) and Argentina will be responsible for foreign affairs and defence. UK goes home and everybody happy.'

A similar situation to the Åland Islands and what was likelyto come about until the early 1970s. Unfortunately it has become clear that there is not an international agreement Argentine politicians won't abandon on a whim for short-term advantage and that their desire is not to administer the islands but to dominate them and humiliate their inhabitants. When- if- Argentine governments have shown that they can be trusted then such a situation may come about, but it looks like it'll be a very long wait.
137 Leiard (#) Jun 16th, 2012 - 12:18 pm Report abuse
@134. DanyBerger

Oh Dany Boy the typical response of a bully.
138 Martin Woodhead (#) Jun 16th, 2012 - 12:47 pm Report abuse
Dany boy you tried that in 1982 did not work out for you so well.
Nobody even in cfks deluded mind is going to try it again.
Going to war with the Uk was a mistake we have very long memories its now impossible for a uk goverment to negociate soverienty .
139 reality check (#) Jun 16th, 2012 - 12:53 pm Report abuse
I think they are going to have a very long wait if they think that they are ever going to gain sovereignty over the Falkland Islands. In fact I predict these people have a much better chance of success.
”The search for extraterrestrial intelligence (SETI) is the collective name for a number of activities people undertake to search for intelligent extraterrestrial life. Some of the most well known projects are run by Harvard University, the University of California, Berkeley and the SETI Institute. SETI projects use scientific methods to search for intelligent life on other planets. For example, electromagnetic radiation is monitored for signs of transmissions from civilizations on other worlds.”
They will be receiving a lovely message from ET, long before Argentina ever achieves sovereignty.
140 Britninja (#) Jun 16th, 2012 - 01:01 pm Report abuse
Let's just hope that the aliens don't arrive over Argentina, scan the brains of the locals and then decide to nuke the whole planet as a result.
141 Kipling (#) Jun 16th, 2012 - 01:13 pm Report abuse
Mr. Jobless, come back to NZ.
142 Conqueror (#) Jun 16th, 2012 - 02:32 pm Report abuse
@88 The only trouble is that most European nations have returned to their own countries. By contrast, argies and other latin americans, are still squatting on the land, blood and bones of those that were there originally. Argieland is probably the worst offender. Having set out, in its War of the Desert, to deliberately exterminate the native peoples. You want to talk about crimes and extermination, talk about your actions. As I have pointed out elsewhere and elsewhen, OUR ancestors stayed in Europe and fought to make things better. YOURS ran away, made the same mistakes and invented a few new ones. YOU have NOTHING of which to be proud. Don't you even commemorate your genocide on your money?
@95 Oh, you conquered your neighbours' territories, did you? You mean that after you attempted to exterminate the natives, you attempted to exterminate each other? What a pity that we “Anglos” kicked Germany shitless so Hitler couldn't give you the bits of the British Empire he promised you. Still trying though, aren't you?
@105 YOU won “fair and square”? Are you demented? How would you compare your breech-loading rfles with the natives' spears and bows and arrows?
@107 And your “justification” for the destruction of the Aztec and Inca civilisations and the attempted destruction of the Maya?
@110 You are most definitely at the bottom. In the cesspit.
@112 You took 1800 years with you. Or is the Atlantic Ocean supposed to be the River Lethe?
@117 Have you got a mirror?
@119 Why not who was the most murderous in the 15th to 19th centuries? Look in that mirror you daren't have.
@121 So stop using them. And it's “ad homiNem”.
@125 Current intelligent estimates of the pre-Columbian native population range between 50-100 million. What did you do with them?
@129 Argieland “grew” because the British built it. Every time you tried to do without US, you fell apart.
@134 Tell you what. I'll bet the Islanders keep what THEY want long enough for YOU to die!
@141 Cakes?
143 briton (#) Jun 16th, 2012 - 06:36 pm Report abuse
Some seem to think, that the islanders should have no say in who governs them, and should be forced to be argentine,
,,,,
Not their may be a grain of truth in that statement,
After all, we are only human, and slaves to our egos are we not.

But to be fair to this persons opinion, and without him sounding like a fool and a hypercrit,
Then one must follow ones example to the bitter end,
So thus,, if we can force the, islanders to be argentine,
Then we can also force argentine to be British, [is this not fair]
If they have no rights / argentines have no rights,
Amazing how one changes ones opinion, when it is fairly applied backwards,

Is it not lol.

.
144 shb (#) Jun 16th, 2012 - 06:49 pm Report abuse
@danny berger

On economic sanctions - coming from a country that is determined to upset its' major creditors, you make me laugh. We should beggar your country and can a lot to screw you in return if you want to go that way.

On war.

Go for it, if you have the gonads.

We saw you lot off last time, and we'd do it again.

I bet your not going to be in the first landing craft anyawy.
145 TipsyThink (#) Jun 16th, 2012 - 06:50 pm Report abuse
Argentina has no sitting down rest time ,its economy growing,growing...
146 Leiard (#) Jun 16th, 2012 - 06:57 pm Report abuse
@145
you should sit down and take more water with what ever it is that you are drinking.
147 TipsyThink (#) Jun 16th, 2012 - 07:33 pm Report abuse
146
iam drinking Vodka +Lemonade(produced from Argentine lemons concentrated)..............................saludos !
148 Pirat-Hunter (#) Jun 16th, 2012 - 09:33 pm Report abuse
Does USA or UK sits and talk to illegal aliens or do they dictate laws and deport them?? Why do English people have bias attitudes and dubble standards against the whole world??? No wonder people hate them.
149 reality check (#) Jun 16th, 2012 - 10:36 pm Report abuse
@148PH
By people I take it you mean Argentinians. That I can understand, no one likes to be shamed in the eyes of the world, but it has been 30 years or are you expressing the opinion for others as well, you seem to have a penchant for that. Personally, I would be pissed off if someone expessed an opinion on my behalf, without having the decency to consult me first.
150 DanyBerger (#) Jun 16th, 2012 - 11:39 pm Report abuse
@Self Determination

Another boy internet warrior in fantasyland playing war games on Xbox ah!

“waste the infrastructure of Argentina”

Have you any idea of what you are talking about?

This will imply you would have firepower able to destroy 15 times UK or the whole Western Europe.

Ah! I know you will start again with your Tomahawks Am I right?

Lets see a practical example Iraq:

240,000 Cluster bombs were dropped over Iraq + 20,000 guided and unguided bombs + 800 Tomahawks.

Operation on ground required 500.000 servicemen.

Poor close to none infrastructure there over a territory 7 times little than Argentina main land.

Now have you an idea how ridiculous you sound?

Not yet?

1 BGM109T= 5 conventional bombs power destruction.

But you are ruining out of BMGs since last years wasted on Libya operation.

“If this is correct, the Navy will have used up to 20 per cent of its 64 Tomahawks in the opening salvos of the war, leading to fears that it is “burning through” its armoury.
The situation could become an embarrassment for the Government if the submarine were the only vessel within range of a number of targets but could not fulfil the mission.”

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/africaandindianocean/libya/8400079/Libya-Navy-running-short-of-Tomahawk-missiles.html

So its more credible that Argentina is able to blow up the entire UK that you can do anything you say.
151 briton (#) Jun 16th, 2012 - 11:48 pm Report abuse
148
Please allow this poor British turnip to help you in your endeavour to understand things.
1, does USA or UK sits and talk to illegal aliens
[according to the most eminent scientist and experts, there has been no actual proof, that alien exist .
2, do they dictate laws and deport them
[as we cannot prove they exist, we cannot deport them .]
3, Why do English people have bias attitudes and dubble[double ] standards against the whole world,
[This is actually biased again English people is it not, and the British, up hold international law,]
4, No wonder people hate them,
[ in the latest nupee poll, 9-10 people said that they liked the British people ,
They are officially the 7th most popular in the world,]
[Argentina by the way, are 52nd .
.
152 Pete Bog (#) Jun 17th, 2012 - 12:02 am Report abuse
@150

Heard of Storm Shadow?
153 briton (#) Jun 17th, 2012 - 12:22 am Report abuse
The Royal Navy has revealed details of a new defence system able to intercept enemy missiles travelling at supersonic speeds.
Sea Ceptor missiles fired from Navy warships will reach speeds of up to Mach 3- more than 2,000mph - and can protect an area of around 500 square miles over land or sea.
They will initially be used on the Navy's Type 23 frigates, but in the future it could be adapted for use by the Army and RAF.
They will replace the Sea Wolf air defence system when it goes out of service.
The head of the Navy, Admiral Sir Mark Stanhope, said: ”This new weapon system will equip our frigates to deal with the type of sophisticated missile threat expected in the coming decades.
news.sky.com/home/uk-news/article/16159274
.
154 DanyBerger (#) Jun 17th, 2012 - 01:24 am Report abuse
@Pete Bog

“Heard of Storm Shadow?”

Yes is the copy past of the French/Italian “SCALP EG”

And? What are you trying to say?

@briton

Yeah! Briton like your Spy toy sat made with webcams bought in Oxford Street.

Ha ha stop consuming media propaganda please they can say that uk is ready for next Star Wars and you repeat it like a dummy.
155 WestisBest (#) Jun 17th, 2012 - 01:27 am Report abuse
@150

There is one crucial element you're missing in that post.

The Iraqis know how to fight. They're hard bastards, very hard. Argentinians on the other hand....
156 St.John (#) Jun 17th, 2012 - 01:56 am Report abuse
@ 134 DanyBerger

“1-The ruining or the entire economy of the Islands. For example given free licences to fish indiscriminate.”

Thus ruining Argentinas fishing industries as well?

“2-By ruining entirely your little tourist industry.”

The cruisers will more probably avoid Argentine ports.

“3-By cutting air links to Rio Grande to Antarctica.”

Following Colombia's linking their demand for a sea port this will make Chile much less interested in supporting Argentina and will have little influence on the flight from Punta Arenas - Chile only has to change the route to go through Estrecho de Magellanes. International pressure will probably force Argentina to abstain.

“3[4]-Pushing to put more restrictions on UK exports to MS that can be extended to the whole SA.”

Argentina has a trade surplus in much needed trade surplus in foreign currency with the UK. Also the EU is going to retaliate.
The other SA countries are very unlikely to risk their own trade surplus and preferential treatment.

“4[5]-Military action.”

You must be joking.
157 Self Determination (#) Jun 17th, 2012 - 09:17 am Report abuse
@150 Danny Burger
How many missiles does it take,to take out your power stations, oil refineries ,lng terminals,naval and air bases? 2 dozen?
Do you think H.M. Submarines dont have the coordinates of prime targets?
Do you think the SAS & SBS haven't practised for all scenarios? Who knows they might be“ sleeping” in BA now.
Im too old for playstation, more of a snooker man at the British Legion.
Bring it on .
Hows the pot banging going?
158 reality check (#) Jun 17th, 2012 - 10:14 am Report abuse
@154DB
Do you know what joint development means? Copy my ass, you are a pathetic nationalistic prick. Just because you choose to alter the truth, does not mean other half intelligent people can not look it up for themselfs. Same fucking missile different name given by the airforces deploying it.

”British Aerospace and Matra were competing with McDonnell Douglas, Texas Instruments/Short Brothers, Hughes/Smiths Industries, Daimler-Benz Aerospace/Bofors, GEC-Marconi and Rafael.[7] The BAe/Matra Storm Shadow was selected on 25 June 1996.[8] A development and production contract was signed on 11 February 1997, by which time Matra and BAe had completed the merger of their missile businesses to form Matra BAe Dynamics.[9] France ordered 500 SCALP missiles in January 1998.

Look up BAe prat. Give you a clue, got fuck all to do with Brazil!!!!!!
159 axel arg (#) Jun 17th, 2012 - 04:30 pm Report abuse
In the article that reffers to the rejection by argentina invitation to the dialague with the government from islands, i left a comment, it's 217, but i have a problem with my computer, i coudn't correct the mistakes i made when i typed, and it was suddenly published, in a few days, i'll publish comments again, just in order to clarify what i wanted to say in that comment.
160 ChrisR (#) Jun 17th, 2012 - 04:37 pm Report abuse
I don't think Mr. Summers will be extending the invite to yet another so called Argie 'sportsman':
“David Nalbaldian disqualified from Queen's final for injuring a linesman after kicking hoarding around him” resulting in a bloody injury to the linesman's left leg.

So, after the despicable 'Hand of God' incident, Argentina will now have “the foot of the stupid bastard” to add their illustious sports record.

Talk about a penchant for self-destruction. See the video on:

www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/tennis/atptour/9337032/David-Nalbaldian-disqualified-from-Queens-final-for-injuring-a-linesman-after-kicking-hoarding-around-him.html

You couldn't make this fiasco up!

I wonder how long it will take for the Stupid Malvanistas to blame the Brits! Ha, ha, ha. :o)
161 Conqueror (#) Jun 17th, 2012 - 04:51 pm Report abuse
@145 You mean its benefit system is growing, growing. How are you getting on with your energy sources? Oh, sorry. Economy. You mean 100% = 130%. That's called inflation. How are your dock strikes going? How are your farming strikes going?
@154 No, it's not a “copy”. It's a British/French/Italian manufactured missile. “Storm Shadow” is the British name in RAF service. In fact, if you want to be completely accurate, it's a British/French missile.
@148 The UK and USA DO sit down and talk to illegal aliens. The process is called “the immigration interview”. These are usually conducted in the “home” country under laws passed in the “home” country. The Falklanders are sitting in their “home” country. They are not trying to get into argieland. In fact, they are trying NOT to get into argieland. There may be some illegal aliens in the Falklands. But they'll probably be argies who came ashore in rubber boats in the middle of the night!
150 Have you considered 160 nuclear warheads delivered by Trident-D ICBMs launched from the English Channel? You ARE within range. The missiles could be with YOU in 30 minutes. What? Shock/horror from the rest of the world? WE say “We got tired of listening to them whine.” Everybody else says “Yeah, right. They were a pain.” And YOU? You say NOTHING. Do you understand? You need to be a little concerned about what WE COULD do. And here's another happy thought for you. Online British news sites. Things get reported about argie actions, accusations and whinges. People start calling for argieland to be nuked. WE are TIRED of YOU. No, you can't have what you want. Get out some old newsreels. Take a look at what WE did to Germany. And that was with the technology of 70 years ago! We are actually a pretty restrained people. But we KNOW and can PROVE that your cuntry is lying now and has been lying to the United Nations since 1964!
@159 Don't bother, it was gibberish anyway. And I've reported it for your ad hominem remarks!
162 briton (#) Jun 17th, 2012 - 08:49 pm Report abuse
Trouble is Danny,
The giant Argentina has already been beaten and humiliated by, this tiny island,]Britain ]
Without nuclear weapons,

And it can and will be done again, without unclear weapons,

We only need determination, guts, loyally , professionalism ,
And the will to win,something sadly vary much lacking in your military .
163 Pete Bog (#) Jun 17th, 2012 - 09:49 pm Report abuse
@154 If we don't have enough Tomahawks, we have enough Storm Shadows to strip the tarmac of every Argentine runway within range of the Falklands. (I am probably missing Brimstone here etc etc).

When KFC is so desperate that her rantings are not taken seriously the Super |Etendards will be launched against oil rigs (give peace a chance means only until we can't resist a military air strike) and then the problem of Argentina threatening the Falklands will be solved within a week when the SE's join the undersea Argentine air force museum and resultant threat denial measures are taken. If as a result KFC and her brownshirts are replaced with mature politicians who talk with the Falkland Islands on cooperative terms, and if they talk the right lingo (ie display proper diplomatic skills), then Southern Argentina's economy will thrive. Until then Southern Argentina remains a dump, rife with unemployment and the FI's deal with UK, and non-Argentine countries, and get richer at Argentina's expense.
164 physiwg (#) Jun 17th, 2012 - 10:02 pm Report abuse
Hypothetical: France takes over the Isle of Wight this month by force. Over the next 20, 30 or more years, the population, coming from France, becomes entirely French speraking with ties to France. The UK keeps pressing for the return of the island, but France regularly sends warships to protect their island (now names île du fromage). When the UK wants to negotiate with France over the island, France refuses and says talk to the French people on the island directly. So all you UK supporters in this comment section would agree that the UK should talk directly to the French people on the Isle of Wight and not with the government of France? And when France conducts a poll, 95% of the population wants to be allied with France, not the UK - is that poll relevant at all? You promise that in this hypothetical you would support negotiating directly with the French speaking population of the Isle of Wight, and you would drop all claims to the island should they vote to be with France (after all it's about their human rights). Not to mention the French people in forums mention that the UK economy sucks, so all the more reason that the UK should drop their silly demands for the return of the Isle of Wight. (and you agree with that point, as well as many other comments about the UK prime minister having had plastic surgery...)

The UK stole the Falklands/Malvinas, they won't give it back. Too much time has passed. Period. But please smirk with discretion, high five in private, but enough with the hypocritical self righteous indignation. Please.
165 briton (#) Jun 17th, 2012 - 10:39 pm Report abuse
Hypothetical
Cannot operate in reality,

Only in theory.

So does not matter a jot, in this case .
.
166 St.John (#) Jun 18th, 2012 - 12:46 am Report abuse
@ 164 physiwg

“The UK stole the Falklands/Malvinas,”

As has been pointed out time and again Argentina ceded any claim on the Falkland Islands in the peace treaty of 1850.

In president Bartolomé Mitre's message at the opening of the Argentine Congress on May 1st, 1865 he said (about Britain and France) “… no ha habido sino motivos para consolidar las relaciones amistosas que existen entre éste y aquellos gobiernos.”

As has been pointed out time and again Argentine vice president Marcos Paz “... perjuicios sufridos por súbditos ingleses en 1845. Aun no se ha resuelto esta cuestión que es la única que con aquella nación subsiste.”

As has been pointed out time and again Argentine president Domingo Faustino Sarmiento confirmed it “Nada nos reclaman las otras Naciónes: nada tenemos que pedir de ellas, sino es la continuación de las manifestaciones de simpatía con que de parte de pueblos y gobiernos ha sido favorecida la República por sus progresos y espíritu de justicia.”

In case you want to read the statements of the Argentine presidents and vice president yourself, here are the sources in Argentina:

Heraclio Mabragaña, Los Mensajes 1810-1910, Buenos Aires 1910, vol. III, pag. 227
Heraclio Mabragaña, Los Mensajes 1810-1910, Buenos Aires 1910, vol. III, pag. 238
Heraclio Mabragaña, Los Mensajes 1810-1910, Buenos Aires 1910, vol. III, pag. 286
167 DanyBerger (#) Jun 18th, 2012 - 10:53 am Report abuse
@ Self Determination

Lets see with my little example over a little Island of 12173 km² (FI) 228 times little than Argentina and without infrastructure at all with just only one relevant military base.

GeoTargeting coordinates
-51.82265142133176, -58.44598044907377 (Mount Pleasant runway)
-51.81976000827681, -58.46301784073637 (Mount Pleasant runway)
-51.81930903721946, -58.43821277176664 (Mount Pleasant runway)
-51.82124552807027, -58.468897242897015 (Mount Pleasant flying things)
-51.81994570092961, -58.47666492020414 (Mount Pleasant Heliports)
-51.826630126735346, -58.463361163490276 (Mount Pleasant)
-51.829361967617906, -58.460614581459026 (Mount Pleasant)
-51.83087369184139, -58.46185912644194 (Mount Pleasant)
-51.82355329202242, -58.465421100013714 (Mount Pleasant)

-51.68583597002855, -57.77731647049711 (Port Stanley airport runway)
-51.68583597002855, -57.7696775392227 (Port Stanley airport runway)
-51.68583597002855, -57.78692950760649 (Port Stanley airport just to be sure)

I just used 12 and I didn’t touch any power station, grid, port, oil refineries (ah! you don’t have any) etc. and only 1 military base.

Now you make your own calculation how many do you need.

Iraq 7 times little and with little infrastructure:
“240,000 Cluster bombs were dropped over Iraq + 20,000 guided and unguided bombs + 800 Tomahawks.” US report

And what happen when your sub reveals it's position after the T launching?

Oh! glu glu...

“Do you think the SAS & SBS haven't practised for all scenarios?”
They don’t’ know all scenarios.

Who knows they might be“ sleeping” in BA now.”
Cameron?

@ reality check
SCALP EG is based on MBDA Apache (French) development
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MBDA_Apache

And BAE is a multinational mostly owned by Americans international investment funds like BP.
US is now putting restriction on BAE to export US military technology.
So may be you don't get any plane after all. haha
168 ChrisR (#) Jun 18th, 2012 - 12:26 pm Report abuse
167 Dunni-Burger

I see you are back and spouting the usual bollocks.

I thought when you left you must have landed a proper job at last and didn't need to work for LaCamping-it-up queers of the FatBoy.

Got chucked out of the job did you. I told you so! Forgot what I advised you about learning before spouting: always the mark of the bullshitter like you and your nonsensical 'Blob' Technology'.

So why can't you go back to running a server farm? Managed to kill the servers last time then?

Never mind, carry on as you are doing, we can all do with a laugh.
169 reality check (#) Jun 18th, 2012 - 04:40 pm Report abuse
DB
Firs it was a copy of Scalp/EG.
Now it's a copy of Apache.
Make your mind up!
Does not matter anyway, cos you aint got fuckin either.
170 DanyBerger (#) Jun 19th, 2012 - 06:05 am Report abuse
@ChrisR

“bullshitter like you and your nonsensical 'Blob' Technology”

Really?

Prototype application based on blob tech using fiducial and multi-touch finger tracking on a multi-touch screen using taxonomic object oriented programmed interface.

Live performance at SubMixPro Studios Via Postunia Torino Italy, enjoy it.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mgy1S8qymx0

David Guetta testing one (tip DJ total Box)
www.youtube.com/watch?v=qKLqgpHmPR0

Still “nonsensical “ tech for you?

@ reality check
You need to check reality.
171 TreborDoyle (#) Jun 19th, 2012 - 11:46 am Report abuse
Argentina's democracy is barely the timespan of a decent length mortgage in the Western world. It is not far enough away from the actions of the military junta and therefore still demonstrates what appears to be its innate resorting to aggression and force. Argentina's people did too little to oppose the military when they were in power and what was done by the military was done in their name whether or not they accept this. Argentina's behaviour is infantile in the World of democracy like a child throwing its toys out of the pram when it does not get what it wants. Mature democracies will not give in to this blackmail.

Against this, the United Kingdom is a long-standing, never-conquered democracy, a powerful member of the United Nations, a permanent member of the security council, an EU member, a NATO member, a Commonwealth member and a respected member of the international community.

Despite many attacks on the UK by terrorists et al over the years, including the attempted assassination of the Prime Minister, the UK did not give in to terrorists and those using force to achieve their aims. We never give in and we never give up.

The Falkland Islands is an overseas territory of the UK, and this will remain so. Perhaps it is time to incorporate the Falklands into the United Kingdom itself (as an autonomous entity), and remove any doubt that Argentina may have as to our position, or that of our British Citizens in residence there.

One begins to experience serious fatigue listening to the 'macho-moaning' emanating from Queen Christina and Lapdog Timerman. It is only a matter of time before they fade into irrelevance with this broken record.

The wise thing to do (explains why they haven't done it!), would have been to woo the islanders ... but that would have required patience, something Argentina is short of, along with food, jobs, diplomacy, as well as foresight and hindsight.

Argentina is an aggressor. It knows no other way, and cannot demonstrate otherwise.
172 British_Kirchnerist (#) Jun 19th, 2012 - 02:13 pm Report abuse
So I now see Summers and Edwards (2 of only 8 Falklands MLAs!) both had their speeches reproduced in full here, but only a few edited highlights from La Presidenta. Bias anyone?

Also I must say marcos did a brilliant job on here in pointing out the difference between Cristina's graceful commemoration of the dead and Cameron's arrogant flag waving
173 ChrisR (#) Jun 19th, 2012 - 03:34 pm Report abuse
Dunni-Burger

Still dodging the questions I see, so I will put it as clearly as I can:

1) Did you get your new job you were bragging about months ago, developing blob techology for manufacture in Argentina?

2) Give me a link of something YOU have done, not a link to somebody who has been working on it from before 2009 AND knows what he is doing. In other words PROVE your claim with PHYSICAL EVIDENCE.

3) The link ably demonstrated what the commenters said: neither of these prats knew what they were doing when compared to the first link. I take it they had the table on loan as neither knew anything advanced about it?

BET YOU DON'T ANSER THESE QUESTIONS EITHER.
174 DanyBerger (#) Jun 20th, 2012 - 04:11 am Report abuse
@ChrisR

1- “ Did you get your new job you were bragging about months ago, developing blob techology for manufacture in Argentina? “

I never said that otherwise you were who say that.

The project is for myself to manufacture one for a new business project (company) that takes a lot of time.
The electronic and engineering part is fun and the easy part.

What takes so many time is the design of marketing strategies, software application to run business on/off line, market research and physical space where the business is going to operate (that I already own) all these kind of things that make part of your business plan you know?

2- “Give me a link of something YOU have done, not a link to somebody who has been working on it from before 2009 AND knows what he is doing. In other words PROVE your claim with PHYSICAL EVIDENCE.”

Simply I don’t see any need from me to provide you anything or to prove you anything what for?

Any qualify IT or Electronic engineer would figure out if I was talking bullshit as you say. You seems to have doubts. Ha ha

3- The other link was to prove you that this kind of tech (what you called nonsensical Technology) has commercial future. David Guetta (the guy with long hair in the video) that I guess you don’t know who is because you listen Elton John, immediately wanted one.

I will not tell you more about my future business ha ha.

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