Argentina blasts the credit-risk agencies and warns of global “anarchy-capitalism”
Members from the Argentine government defended the “Kirchner inclusive development model” and blasted the credit-risk rating agencies while warning of the existence of a financial “anarchy-capitalism” which is suffocating the economies of the world.
During a special session of the Council of the Americas in Buenos Aires, Industry minister Debora Giorgi said that “while industry in the leading economies of the world are showing a timid recovery which is below the pre-crisis levels or in some cases another dip, the economies of South America, with active government policies are rapidly recovering”.
“Argentina in particular is showing a manufacturing activity which is 10% above the pre-crisis level” said the minister.
Cabinet chief Juan Manuel Abal Medina mentioned that the world economies are threatened by a kind of “anarchy-capitalism” which is unregulated, takes advantages of capitalism’s loopholes and has no respect but for their interests and profits”, which helped to push the world to the current situation.
Economy minister Hernan Lorenzino targeted the credit risk raging agencies and called on the business community to look at the records and forecasts they have anticipated for example, for Argentina.
“For the last five years they have been rating us as a country in crisis and forecasting the country could blow up at any moment, but it doesn’t blow up”, said Lorenzino who then invited the audience “to abandon this perverse mechanism created by the risk-rating agencies”.
He recalled that according to those agencies’ reports Argentina was better off in 2001, when the country faced one of its most severe crises of the last hundred years, than now, “please gentlemen let’s be objective”.
The meeting which convened several hundred entrepreneurs and was organized by the Argentine Chamber of Commerce also included the president of the Council of the Americas, Susan Segal; the CEO of Chevron for Africa and Latinamerica Ali Moshiri and YPF CEO Miguel Galuccio, who pledged that soon “Argentina will again become a net exporter of oil”.
The meeting was organized basically to attract investors and people interested in making business with Argentina, and despite the encouraging messages from the local ministers official and private data is beginning to show that the country is facing a deceleration of the economy and a drop in the volume of exports.
Last July the Argentine government admitted the slowing down of the economy hit by the global crisis, a severe drought in agriculture which forced to lower significantly harvest estimates and the lesser growth in Brazil. However the central bank anticipated that in the second half the economy will pick up and end positively, not like in 2011, but with a strong performance.
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I mean, because of the 'Dear Leaders' glorious economic model, Argentina has no money, and we desperately need to borrow even more vast quantities of money that we can default on our loans at a later date. But at least the 'Dear Leaders' glorious economic model can continue.
We may even be able to invest in YPF and buy new equipment to drill for oil, unless of course the 'Dear Leaders' son requires more cream cakes and hotels.
The international community is just so unfair to Argentina. Pirates, bullies.” WAH, WAH, WAH.
What does this mean exactly? Ministers saying that everything is fine and that hard facts should be ignored...
“Everything is going swimmingly folks, the economy is booming”
“Things will be even better when we steal, er l mean borrow more money”.
Everything is fine................
Yes LEPRecon summed it up perfectly.
Did you not read it all,or did you read and interpret it in one reading?
Are thes people actually educated in basic sense?
Once again, proving the utter hypocrisy and lack of decency of the “other side” here. How many times have I heard “stay on topic” when the issue is Argentina?
Well, here the issue is the statement ”Argentina blasts the credit-risk agencies and warns of global “anarchy-capitalism”, and Lepicron and yankeeboy are not men enough to admit it is true, the world right now is being run by anarchy-capitalism.
Which is why the USA now officially is no longer a middle-class majority nation, an why the UK, France, Spain, Italy and most of the rest of the EU are in their 10th recession in 5 years or so, and both sides of the Atlantic with ABSOLUTELY NO HOPE of things improving, thus a desperate population at this point.
Yeah, your system is working out marvelously.
Argentines should love the idea of state-level anarcho capitalism. It allows you to effectively commit grand larceny then play the victim when the consequences come calling. Sounds like an RG wet dream...(or 2002 all over again lol)
If we had endless amount of planets at our disposal, the capitalist system, which builds upon endless growth, would work just fine. Even if it would leave a trail of dead planets behind...
Secondly, economies based on free market system do not create models at the government level.
And, for all you SA economic neophetes; if one had to define the economy it would be called a mixed economy: primarily market based with regulatory controls.
Tell your overseers at La Casa Rosada not to take a segment of an economy and try to make a discussion of it as being the basis of the GDP.
Guzz you jealousy is so unflattering as a man.
@12 Far better than yours. Can you do simple arithmetic? Divide 2,308,503 billion by 710.7 billion and tell me what the answer is. I can wait.
@13 Actually, the capitalist system is built on creation and value.
I did read it, apparently you didn't, or maybe you were just wearing rose tinted glasses at the time.
@10 - Tobias
What on earth are you talking about? Stay on topic? Well the topic was about Argentina 'blasting' the credit-risk agencies. Try re-reading the article.
This is typical Argentine hysteria, meant solely for domestic consumption, to divert the gullible people away from the fact that Argentina's economy is in the sh!t, and because it is in the sh!t it must be someone else's fault, probably the evil British Pirates or the evil Imperialistic USA.
Oh and Tobias before you start linking to every article under the sun, yes the UK is in recession, blah, blah, blah.
But this recession is nothing compared to the recession in the late 70's and early 80's where Britain teetered on the edge of bankruptcy.
In fact, in all honesty, I'm hardly feeling this one at all. I'm sure others do feel the credit crunch, but not me, I suppose I've been lucky.
Like all recessions they come and go. That's the way the economy goes. Only in Argentina you tend to have economic meltdown every few years, wheras the rest of the world try to keep it at least 20 years or more apart.
1 - Anarchy -Capitalism
2- what you define as American Middle Class?
The second might bite you in the ass as it is yet to have a pin point definitive in AMerican political lexicon. So please help us define American middle class?
Your posts warm me Guzz......hows the catina at La Casa Rosado....they open on all shifts?
The system is anarchy. It is not planned, maintained or owned by anyone. It is a jungle out there and we all have to fight our corner with what we have. The current problem for much of the West are derived from their decadence, overspending, short working days etc. I am certain some will take the medicine and bounce back.
The global economy continues to grow, so on balance there are more of us going forwards than those going back.
@13 Guzz
It is well established that private enterprise makes more efficient use of resources than state control. Cars, planes, trains, computers, light bulbs...all technology is gets more efficient, the only thing making that happen is private enterprise (and some regulations driving that).
“He recalled that according to those agencies’ reports Argentina was better off in 2001, when the country faced one of its most severe crises of the last hundred years, than now, “please gentlemen let’s be objective”.
'Be objective' from an Argie Minister, what a joke.
And the CEO of YPF:
”YPF CEO Miguel Galuccio, who pledged that soon “Argentina will again become a net exporter of oil”.”
And how do you get that when your own people laughed at your plan and walked out? 250 development wells with no way to buy tools and pay wages, etc.
And the Industry Minister 'Gorgeous Giorgi' (have you seen the photos - she makes TMBOA look attractive):
““Argentina in particular is showing a manufacturing activity which is 10% above the pre-crisis level” said the minister.”
BUT, there's always one, isn't there? These are INDEC figures, WTF believes these? Not the “several hundred entrepreneurs” evidently.
This smacks of desperation.
Your advocate in chief of responsible management of the economy has become fabulously wealthy utterly through capitalistic means. If everyone was as driven as her to amass wealth Argentina would collapse in no time. One rule for her and the cult and another for the masses.
Guzz do you really believe that your work is somehow separated from the evil capitalistic system? Wishful thinking.
This is typical Argentine hysteria, meant solely for domestic consumption, to divert the gullible people away from the fact that Argentina's economy is in the sh!t,
That's what you wrote,our own English language expert.
The article reports a meeting with potential investors into the Argentina economy.Foreign investors.It wasn't a political meeting for home consumption,it was a report,like the media does,of some of things that were said.
Is that a rosy enough comment?
Our poppy
Before the fall of the USSR,when Yugoslavia had a different economic model,the USA,just like the monetarists frowned on state intervention, so since when did the USA become a good old fashioned mixed economy like the old UK socialist economy
In 1937 we creaed the social security system, we oversee water treatment and so on and so on.
Bring on the insults. You do know that an insult is the BEST subsitute for the lack of a substantiated counter point....si?
Still got those rose tinted glasses on, eh?
Just keep telling yourself that Argentina is getting all the investment it needs. The audience was made up of Argentine entrepreneurs as well as some invited guests from other countries.
None of them appeared to believe or 'trust' the Argentine governments reassurances.
Then they did the usual Argentine modus operandi of blaming someone else for people not investing in Argentina (in this case the credit ratings agencies) and lying to persuade people to invest in Argentina.
Of course it was for home consumption. Every time an Argentine official opens their mouth it's for domestic consumption. Why else do your politicians constantly embarrass themselves on the world stage?
The UK is militarising the South Atlantic.
The UK is sending an unarmed helicopter pilot to the Falklands.
The UK is sending the Death Star to the Falklands.
The UK is spying on Argentina from the Falklands.
They said all this to an incredulous and unbelieving UN, but it was all for domestic consumption. ”Look how powerful your government is, talking to the UN and taking other the evil British pirates.
Oh, and let's not forget the embarrassing spectacle of your Ambassador to the UK, Castro humiliating Argentina in front of the worlds media. And thanks to her efforts every diplomat based in the UK slammed their doors in her face.
If it wasn't so pathetic it would be laughable.
You obviously have NO clue huh. 125 billion industry of a 15 trillion dollar GDP. The same can be said of the banking sector's weight in the nominal GDP of any country.
That's where you are totally clueless.
Let me give you a literal analogy: the jugular vein is only 0.01% of your body, but if I sever it, you are dead in seconds.
The banking system's leverage on any “semi-modern” ecoonomy is tens of times is actual GDP contribution. Plus, they hold a significant portion of the savings of a country. When they missbehave, you all pay. That is why financial-led recessions are so much worse than others, they cut the circulation of the entire system and it all collapses. A manufacturing or agricultural led recession usually is not as fatal.
That's the difference, and your banks are leading you to this, now you are a country where the middle class is a minority. Congratulations.
Next.
Just what bridge do you live under?
I think TTT has a new person working the blog, we should all introduce ourselves.
The world already knows what this corrupt thieves and liars want why even bother to write anything about them.
Of course, in proper countries with responsible governments, there is a reasonable certainty that repayments on borrowed money will be made. This is reflected in the fact that most of these countries have “AAA” or “AA” credit ratings while Argentina's is more like “ROFL”.
Also how are things in Florida this week.
en.mercopress.com/2012/08/23/argentine-government-economists-agree-the-peso-in-over-valued-and-hurts-non-primary-exports
Is the reason that it took so long that there was state credibility at stake or that the strength of the state ensured that it wouldn't be covered up?
Argentina has more international trade disputes running than any other country;
is the World's number one protectionist county;
is described as a pariah state by international money lenders.
Look out for the peso to be devalued soon because the dollars have run out and international loans will be too expensive.
Viva Cristina! Viva!!
US Postal team sponsors, as in advertising. US Teams lose sporting events all the time and win even more. Our government, unlike the other countries do not get involved in sports like you suggest. For God woman, get a better theory than that and read more about the USPS.
You really digressed here and if I did not anwser, in your troll wing would have assumed you scored a hit. Sports versus argentine inflation......good grief Charlie Brown.
And BTW......it was the USADA that would not let the issue die after the International agency dropped.
41# poppy are you paranoid.Is someone after you
And what does this mean-
US Postal team sponsors, as in advertising. US Teams lose sporting events all the time and win even more.
yulena, do me a favor so I can understand your thought process, connect the dots how you read my post and concluded paranoia? I can re type it in larger fonts of have my south american gardner translate it. What is easier for yulena?
If you don't like the Armstrong bit,forget it,but don't get all out of yourself about it.Perhaps you would like to explain how your remark
Evo evo is an indian, he gets a free pass for now, he doesn;t know anything....just follows the lead
Would you get the gardner to translate this.Ive used google translate but you know what-it doesn't make sense.
A pattern emerges. There are lots of losers in this system but one clear winner: the Western banks and US Treasury, making the big bucks off this crazy new international capital churn. Stiglitz told me about his unhappy meeting, early in his World Bank tenure, with Ethopia's new president in the nation's first democratic election. The World Bank and IMF had ordered Ethiopia to divert aid money to its reserve account at the US Treasury, which pays a pitiful 4% return, while the nation borrowed US dollars at 12% to feed its population. The new president begged Stiglitz to let him use the aid money to rebuild the nation. But no, the loot went straight off to the US Treasury's vault in Washington.
Now we arrive at Step Four of what the IMF and World Bank call their “poverty reduction strategy”: Free Trade. This is free trade by the rules of the World Trade Organization and World Bank, Stiglitz the insider likens free trade WTO-style to the Opium Wars. “That too was about opening markets,” he said. As in the 19th century, Europeans and Americans today are kicking down the barriers to sales in Asia, Latin American and Africa, while barricading our own markets against Third World agriculture.
www.gregpalast.com/the-globalizer-who-came-in-from-the-cold/
www.imf.org/external/np/fin/tad/extrans1.aspx?memberKey1=290&endDate=2012-08-26&finposition_flag=YES
The things about borrowing money, if you do not intend to pay it back, like argentina, do not borrow. No one holds a gun to your head and forces you to borrow. Money costs money. People that do not have money do not and cannot understand the time value of money and the purpuse of lending it to make money. Higher risk higher rates.
187 million in loans to Ethiopia since 2009 and less than 300,000 in interest payments
I think SA would do the world a favor and keep all trade in their own borders and start by no longer selling to Europe, Asia and North America. That will make all you trolls happy. But that means that all businesses for those countries will be packing and moving out as well. They can sell all residual assets to SA governments. Cash in dollars only please.
Stop poking the dumb animals.
Both need to play the current global economic game, show initiative, show political stability, develop a solid financial growth plan, grow big, strong and fat, and then they can start changing the order of the world’s economic model! At present neither can illustrate a better working model so until then, South America (possibly with the exception of Chile and Brazil) and Africa will have to tow the line, and in the case of the majority of Africa (which is more about politicians greed) get your countries resource raped at the same time!
At present i believe that South America is rattling the cage a little too early! They will have their moment, just as China is having hers!
China has built a superb ants nest for business growth and shown an internal solidarity towards a long term vision, and stuck to it quietly! Now China can start manipulating because its deserved its place!
South America – you are not there yet !!!!
I would agree with you if what we wanted was to live like you lot.
We want to keep our resources, use them with care and not hurt the environment, not grow big and fat at the expenses of others.
As for how to achieve this, you lot don't have a single clue. For the simple reason that you've never tried it before either...
@Guzz
where do you live and how are you paid?!
You are using the evil gringo system to your advantage rather than staying at 'home' and improving things from grass roots level. Are you living by example or just spouting all these right on solidarity comments?
Do you HAVE to live and work in Europe (and enjoy the benefits that gives you). Its most likely a choice.
And Guzz, you don't have to live like “us” to get a free market to work for you. China still lives like they always have and uses the free market system when it comes to world trade matters.
I don't work in Europe, other than the work required to get my sailing license
Poppy
I don't believe in a free market, just look around you, free market brings nothing but misery with its law of the jungle...
So this week you dont live there. But at least you admit to being in Europe to get something for your personal gain.
the evil Europeans and their wicked ways... and dont even get me started on sailing licences issued in Europe.
#49 some homosexuals don't just stop at stupid and you are not the exception.
#52 you are right Argentina needs to forget USA and EU and start dealing with China, Pakistan and India where people need to eat and are willing to pay without crying so much.
#53 trying to talk to Europeans is like talking to a wall. Quit wasting your time with the turds.
#54 unfortunately for you white trash can't tell anyone where they can live anymore, about you people start heading back to europe???
#55 shove your free market up your anal cavity, and quit bothering with Argentine matters, there's nothing worst then someone sticking their nose in our affairs.
#57 you talk as if trading was exclusive to free markets but freedom is everywhere, we feel sad your country makes you feel constricted. Maybe you should move and quit crying to Argentine's. Trust me if Argentina wanted to trade the US dollar would be easier to get, not the case is it?? Get your facts straight before opening your cock trap.
Free market is not a free market at all.For a system of exploitation to continue to grow it must seek to exploit new areas continually.So when an attempt is made to opt-out of this system,fear engulfs the exploiters and the population of the exploiting countries will have to bear greater exploitation than they are familiar with.You knew that PH of course,but I had to write it myself as well
Apparently by his response to #54 he is an indian and not of European decent. Anal lips, I mean cfk is a descendant of Spain, is she the white trash that needs to leave the jungle of SA as well?
And while trading is not exclusive to free market, why be a hypocrite and trade with them or cry about lemons?
The only ones allowed dollars is anal lips and her supporting cast of despots.
Whats worst then someone sticking their nose in others affairs as you say (btw thats called freedom of speech.....you know it?) Is a pirate hunter that's never caught a pirate, or a pirate hunter obsessed with human anatomy.......lol. You seem to revert to your latent( or overt) homosexual tendencies. Most of your menial drivel is based in insults, emotion and gut, knee jerk reactions. You should change your ID because I suspect most of the people here that type a deliberated response are tired responding to your emotional, inane and hastily typed conjectures.
Go back to whatever tribe you came from.........the jungle awaits you. you are not ready for the civilized world.
So you mean that in order to trade at all, it must on a free market basis?
No Sir, that's deciding the rules before we've decided what to play...
58
Who said Europe was evil?
Don't blaim Europe for your flaws, I don't.
Please so me where I stated you must be a free market to trade?
“the UK, France, Spain, Italy and most of the rest of the EU are in their 10th recession in 5 years or so”
Really? The UK has had 10 recessions since 2007? Does anyone else ( who is not deluded ) remember these 10 recessions?
Have you got the data to back up that claim? or are you just using the Argentine Ministry for Disinformations' own figures?
“you are right Argentina needs to forget USA and EU and start dealing with China, Pakistan and India where people need to eat and are willing to pay without crying so much”
What????? you clearly dont understand what i was saying, and based on your comment above an idiot!
Perhaps you should stay studying for you maritime documents, or sailing licence as you call it.
www.thegreatplanet.com/argentinas-economic-collapse-documentary/
You are on your final path on here,to post on that matter.
Are you a captain,captain of what?
Am I after my sailing license?
Where is the criticism of Argentina chasing more investment to maintain and improve growth in this global downturn and the hard work expended to avoid 25% unemployment for its young people.
As I said you are losing your control.Spend some time to regain it.
The american middle class is defined the same as any other middle class because middle class is not a matter of country or nationality irrespective of how anyone defines it using those categories.Can you move on now or are up still hung up on the issue?
as Minister Lorenzino says, “please gentlemen, let’s be objective”
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