Sunday, November 4th 2012 - 06:40 UTC

Argentina private sector increasingly isolated from foreign money markets

Earlier in the week Standard & Poor’s ratings services lowered to ‘B-’ from ‘B’ its unsolicited long-term sovereign credit rating on Argentina and on Friday the ratings agency said it is taking a similar rating actions on four Argentine banks and 16 Argentine corporations.

All financial institutions operating in Argentina could face indirect effects of a sovereign downgrade”, says S&P

Standard & Poor’s lowered to ‘B-’ from ‘B’ its global scale issuer credit ratings on Banco Hipotecario SA, Banco Patagonia SA, Banco de Galicia y Buenos Aires SA, and Banco de la Provincia de Buenos Aires. The outlook on the ratings also remains negative.

S&P also announced on Friday that it is lowering the global scale ratings on the provinces of Buenos Aires, Córdoba, and Mendoza, and the City of Buenos Aires to ‘B-’ from ‘B’. (They are among the richest provinces of the country).

On the situation of the banks S&P said “we rarely rate financial institutions above the foreign currency ratings on the countries where they operate because we consider it unlikely that these institutions would remain unaffected by developments in their domestic economy.”

S&P said the downgrade “on the Republic of Argentina is based on the increasing risks the government will face on its debt management following the Second Circuit Court of Appeals of the United States’ ruling ratifying the judgment of the New York district court granting summary judgment to plaintiffs on their claims for breach of the Equal Treatment Provision”.

It added that “this rule could potentially increase the liabilities of Argentina and the debt service of the government over the near term. In addition, recent negative events, such as the payment in local currency of a province liability denominated in US dollars issued under Argentinean Law and the blocking of a Navy ship in Ghana by litigants from the 2001 sovereign default, highlight the increasing risks the government of Argentina will continue to face to define its economic policy management and financial program over the near term”.

More specifically on the situation of the banks S&P said “also, all the financial institutions operating in Argentina could face indirect effects of a sovereign downgrade.”

The report said that “this is because we believe a sovereign downgrade is normally associated with, or could lead to, a weaker operating environment for financial institutions, which would very likely affect their creditworthiness. These trends could harm the credit fundamentals of these four banks. We will continue to monitor their financial condition closely”.

According to S&P “the negative outlook indicates at least a one-in-three chance of a downgrade over the next 12 months.” S&P also said it downgraded the provinces of Buenos Aires, Córdoba, and Mendoza, and the City of Buenos Aires to ‘B-’ from ‘B’.

“The negative outlook on these entities reflects the outlook on the sovereign and the risk of further deterioration of economic and financial conditions in Argentina,” the ratings agency said.

S&P also downgraded the outlook of 16 Argentine companies. (BAH).-
 

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1 surfer (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 07:53 am Report abuse
Not long now, Default II ahoy.
2 Joe Bloggs (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 09:01 am Report abuse
Why is everyone giving Argentina such a hard time? They're only doing this to keep the glorious nation down.
3 We got your Fragata (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 09:43 am Report abuse
I can't wait to see how Crisitna ends.......I envision her either laying in a coffin surrounded by La Campora flags, or in the women's prison en Ezeiza with her hair braded by the other inmates!
4 jkw (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 10:22 am Report abuse
This action of S&P tells me that Argentina's actions with regard to Repsol were spot on. But know this: the US Courts no more represent America than do its current crop of politicians who are bought and paid for by the 1% which control Washington. Argentina has thrown off that yoke. And it is being punished for that. Any emerging nation in the world which tells global banking IMF and WB that it wants to go its own way, e.g., Iran in 2008 avoided the financial meltdown, will be and is being punished. And that is sad. Because there is a role for international banking to lend a helping hand instead of being a parasite sucking the lifesblood from small and emerging nations. But that will not change until the international banking community is no longer allowed access to world governmentsf.
5 yankeeboy (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 10:53 am Report abuse
This just compounds on their U$ problem and their ever decreasing foreign reserves.
If their economy wasn't already in full stop and probably into negative territory I would think they would have already entered into hyperinflation. Luckily they are in recession and only have 30%!
hahaha
Which Province will be the 1st to pay salaries or expenses with Patacones?
Patacones or 10/1 peso which comes first? chicken egg chicken egg

I doubt anyone will notice a Peso note with another zero...I'm sure they won't
Austal again anyone?
6 The Chilean perspective (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 10:54 am Report abuse
4 jkw
I think you're over analyzing the issue. It's much simpler than what you think.
Argentina is in the firing line simply because they refuse to pay their debts. Other parties are having to prosecute them in foreign courts so they can get paid, that's all. If they sat down with them and worked out a payment plan everything would be OK.
As for Iran, well they are a terrorist state and are working on a nuclear capability. The west or their enemies if you want to say it truthfully are very worried about this and are presently conducting a covert economic war on this Islamic regime. Luckily for us it seems to be working. Their economy is grinding to a halt and it now seems a preemptive attack won't be necessary.
7 Guzz (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 11:07 am Report abuse
The hypocrite west has only themselves to be worried about. While Iran is said to be producing WMD (something they deny and Iraq also was accused for) and threatens to take action against invasive nations, the west HAS WMD's and not only threatens but does indeed invade sovereign nations. Can't see the wood for the trees?
8 Joe Bloggs (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 11:17 am Report abuse
7 Guzz

Last time I checked Argentina were part of the West. Are you suggesting otherwise?
9 Guzz (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 11:20 am Report abuse
In a globe, west is pretty much relative...
10 Joe Bloggs (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 12:58 pm Report abuse
Some of the deadbeats here make me LMAO. They complain about the terrible white people or the terrible people from the West? HELLO!! Anyone would think they were predominately a black indigenous population.
11 Britninja (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 01:20 pm Report abuse
Hypocrite Guzz bitching about the “hypocrite West” while sat in a country of the West getting West-level training and education at the taxpayer's expense. Just out of curiosity Guzz, when you are actually heading back to South America to improve the lives of your countrymen?
12 CJvR (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 01:32 pm Report abuse
Things rarely turn out well when the regime wages economic warfare on it's own population and businesses.
13 Guzz (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 02:31 pm Report abuse
Hahaha!!
So, because of me being in the west, the western nations don't habe WMD's all of the sudden? I love your logic, where's that Mensa-guy?
Hahaha!!!
14 Joe Bloggs (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 03:15 pm Report abuse
... and they blame the West that they are a part of for everything that's wrong in the world as if they are NOT included in the West. FFS!

Anyway Guzzy Guzzler. You say you're not interested in the Falklands and that's all I'm on here for so you and your puzzling little views are all fine by me. I couldn't give a fuck whether Argentina prospered or went down the drain just as long as they leave us alone like they currently are.
15 Guzz (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 03:16 pm Report abuse
Great, the we agree, you stick to your experiment, I'll stick to mine ;)
16 ElaineB (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 03:29 pm Report abuse
“I'll stick to mine”?

What possible influence could you - one man in no position of power - have on Argentine politics when you claim to be Uruguayan and living abroad?
17 yankeeboy (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 03:30 pm Report abuse
He thinks his posts are power.

Being brought up delusional has that effect on you....
18 Guzz (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 03:32 pm Report abuse
Elaine
Check how many Tupamaros are ministers in Uruguay today, that's all you get out of me ;)
19 Conqueror (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 04:01 pm Report abuse
@4 What a funny comment. Want to try for reality? Argieland is “unfortunate” because it tries to manage an economy by ideology instead of economics. Argieland tried to support itself by using the facilities of the world's economy. When it came time to repay, it couldn't. So it has tried to persuade the world that it has its own “economic model”. And it does. It's called “theft”. Brought down to the bottom line, you can't continue with a policy of “borrow 100, pay back 30”. Eventually, lenders say “it's borrow 100, pay back 120. Or don't borrow”. And that's where argieland is. Iran is much the same. Although they are no doubt asking Allah whether they've got his economic model wrong. Here's the real reality. This is a planet with an economy worked out over thousands of years. It's really the only game in town. If you want to “experiment”, you do it when you have more money than you know what to do with. Not when you are up to your ears in debt. The world doesn't owe you a living!
@7 Only following your example. Or are you suggesting that, by the standards of the day, Spain didn't have WMDs? Or that it didn't invade sovereign countries? Or that it didn't commit theft, rape, murder, genocide? Or that argieland hasn't done the same?
@9 Ever heard of longitude? Or the Prime Meridian? We can understand your attitude. If you're in Denmark, you are, technically, in the east. Does that make you feel better? But if you ever give up the privilege of existing in a free, democratic country and go home, you will be going to the west!
@13 Were you not reading? You're in the east. Of course we have WMDs. We have to protect ourselves from the sub-humans. We don't deny it or hide them. When did we start to learn that the sub-humans like corruption, criminality, genocide, mendacity, theft, violence, war? 1982! Fortunately, we were just ready enough. We're much readier now. Here's our current day logic. The proper response to a threat is to eliminate it. Permanently!
20 Guzz (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 04:17 pm Report abuse
conq
Got 1 word that will solve most of your issues. Myotonic.
21 Pirat-Hunter (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 04:26 pm Report abuse
Its about time Argentina started to use pesos to move the economy rather then U$ dollars, didn't they know that the dollar goes back to USA to provide them with jobs and our raw materials? The pesos will fill in the gap left by US dollars and this time it will be the peso earning people who will have the privilege of earning the cash not uncle sam, the peso together with an import tax of 50%charged from every nation giving help and refuge to vulture funds can completely replace the Argentine tax revenue lost to international theft.
But I much rather have the Argentine government expropriate the land and bank accounts of foreign polluters withing Argentina then lose this opportunity chasing ghosts while they theft from us, let the expropriation war begin.
www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/energy/oilandgas/9646826/Argentina-told-to-seize-up-to-19.2bn-of-assets-from-Chevron.html
“Ecuador has asked Argentina to seize up to $19.2bn of assets from Chevron in the latest twist in a long-running lawsuit over pollution in the Amazon rainforest.

The oil giant will also have its bank accounts in Argentina seized and gas sales frozen, a judge has ruled.

The 2011 ruling, one of the biggest of its kind in history, stated that 30,000 residents of Ecuador's Lago Agrio region had been harmed by the operations of Texaco, which Chevron bought in 2001.”
22 British_Kirchnerist (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 04:36 pm Report abuse
#3 Well hopefully you'll be waiting a long time. I can see her being re-elected in 2015 and maybe for someterms after that, ageing slowly and gracefully like the best, classiest divas do, and eventually retiring to become a wise roving campaigner like Lula or indeed Fidel currently are, in the meantime Argentina moving further and further to the left (in part in response to hostile moves like the one in the article). If the world also waes up and moves left, I can see her playing more and more of a global role too

#4 Great post =)

#18 I hope one day you join them =)
23 Vader (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 04:36 pm Report abuse
#6 “If they sat down with them and worked out a payment plan everything would be OK”

Not to defend Argentina's deadbeat flauting, but the Vulture funds by nature do not have any desire to negotiate, they simply take advantage of desperate sellers of distressed bonds and then take advantage of the distressed debtor.

They are not the duped victims many in this website portray them to be. They made money from both the small investors that got hosed by Argentina's default, and now are trying to make money from Argentina itself. Simple as that.

Elliot Management will never negotiate in good faith. Kinda like Argentina, i guess!
24 ElaineB (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 04:40 pm Report abuse
@23 Except that Elliot Management have the law on their side.

@18 So you have absolutely no power or influence. That explains the tone of your posts.
25 Guzz (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 04:43 pm Report abuse
BK
I hate the fact that you are in the crossfire of generalisation. Know I have no problems with British people. British with capital B, not the fascist ones. I can't imagine how hard it must be for you taking crap from both sides though... Wish you and your proper countrymen all the best and more, and I'm truly sorry if I ever offended your flag or country in my misfire.
26 Vader (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 04:45 pm Report abuse
@24

So did slave owners have the law on their side, if you want to go that route.

I didn't say they were not correct to pursue. I just rightly mentioned they are not out to protect the bonholders, they hosed the original bondholders by buying these bonds at token price. Now they want the full price for them.

They are not representing any of the prior buyers, those sold at basement prices. Whatever money the fund gets, they keep, they are not going to give it to the pensioners or 401k people that were hurt.
27 Anbar (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 04:49 pm Report abuse
“””#3 Well hopefully you'll be waiting a long time. I can see her being re-elected in 2015 and maybe for someterms after that, ageing slowly and gracefully like the best, classiest divas do, and eventually retiring to become a wise roving campaigner like Lula or indeed Fidel currently are, in the meantime Argentina moving further and further to the left (in part in response to hostile moves like the one in the article). If the world also waes up and moves left, I can see her playing more and more of a global role too“””

oh man, go get shares in Kleenex (or specsavers!)... SO, so funny. Best post in the thread. :-0
28 British_Kirchnerist (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 04:51 pm Report abuse
#26 “So did slave owners have the law on their side, if you want to go that route”

Exactly, the law can be an ass, as that great British wordsmith Charles Dickens pointed out

#25 Thanks mate I apreciate that =)
29 ElaineB (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 04:54 pm Report abuse
@26 I am not supporting the practises of firms like Elliot Management, just pointing out the difference. Argentina is making no effort to settle the loan and by paying bondholders that accepted the 'haircut' whilst not paying the bondholders wanting full repayment, they are breaking the law.

CFKC's oligarchy government is no victim in this battle.
30 Vader (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 04:57 pm Report abuse
@28

Yes, but I'm afraid the original bondolders should be protected and Argentina be forced to repay them, if not the full amount most of it (or to whomever they designate as beneficiaries of their accounts).

I believe an overhaul of the world's financial system is needed. To prevent countries like Argentina taking advantage of it and to end this hedge and vulture fund casino. Both sides are responsible along with investment banking for the instability of the world's economy, and it is always the small investor that loses.

As it is right now, I almost feel as if both sides profit somehow from all this: the countries borrow money, then get into a crisis, and then come the funds waiting in the wings to snap a bargain. Then they make a profit, have more money to lend, and the process begins anew.

The middle man in that, the retail saver, is left with the bag.
31 Guzz (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 05:03 pm Report abuse
Vader
I agree and thank you for a sane input. What is your thoughts on the plan Brady, the original contract Argentina was forced to sign in order to avoid this happening to them in the late 90's?
32 toooldtodieyoung (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 05:06 pm Report abuse
13 Guzz

Yeah Guzz, a nice Western education you have there, which allows you to Criticize the west.

You are a laugh you know Guzz? there you sit, in the lap of luxury and hark back to the land of your origin.........

If the west is that bad, then why don't you go home? If you are truely offended by everything that “The West” has done, then why are you not off back to your country to find your roots? improve the lives of your own countrymen?

Oh, 'cos you're not THAT offended..... just enough to hate everyone in your posts but not enough that you want to move home......... mmmm I see now, Guzz you are a weapons grade idiot ha,ha, HA!! the biggest joker on this forum.......
33 Guzz (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 05:08 pm Report abuse
Toool
Not all European are fascists mate...
Matter of fact, I've never met such a big concentration of them as in these threads...
34 British_Kirchnerist (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 05:10 pm Report abuse
#30 Thats a good nuanced analysis, but if its reform of the world financial system you want (as do I), I think you'll find qualitively different responses from Singer and Cristina...
35 ElaineB (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 05:15 pm Report abuse
@30 Have you read 'And the Money Kept Rolling In (and Out): Wall Street, the IMF and the Bankrupting of Argentina'? It gives a fair and balanced account of the events leading up to the default and the consequences for ordinary Argentines. Of all the books I have read on the subject it examines faults on all sides.

What is concerning is how very little CFKC's government has learnt from the previous situation and seems determined to drive the country into a second default. The first default COULD have been avoided if Argentina put aside some of that outstanding belligerence and worked with the IMF. The government of the time just did not believe that the IMF would pull the rug, no matter what they did. They behaved like a naughty child with an over-indulgent parent believing that there would be no consequences.

I read 'Argentine' posters on here believing they can operate outside of the world market but they cannot. They should play the system rather than fight it because they are not powerful enough to win.
36 yankeeboy (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 05:31 pm Report abuse
The government of the time just did not believe that the IMF would pull the rug, no matter what they did. They behaved like a naughty child with an over-indulgent parent believing that there would be no consequences. SPOT ON!

Nothing has changed since then and this time there will be no support from the USA. I think Argentina is going to be used as an example of what happens when you don't play by the rules.
37 Pirat-Hunter (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 05:34 pm Report abuse
#35 IMF? How stupid do you think Latin Americans are?. Get educated or STFU. I think CFK is the best president Argentina had in 40 years but I am sure you love menem, dualde, videla or galtiery better than the K's, but we will like to know why? Good luck with that pea brain.

www.google.com/webhp?client=ms-android-acer&source=android-home#hl=en&safe=off&client=ms-android-acer&tbo=d&site=webhp&spell=1&q=four+steps+to+damnation+argentina+gregory+palast&sa=X&ei=F6WWUMbrNaXsyQG7voD4Cw&ved=0CC8QBSgA&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_cp.&fp=763c3cc1e26523b6&bpcl=37189454&biw=1280&bih=800

No we don't want to operate outside the world market we want the market to make justice.
www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/energy/oilandgas/9646826/Argentina-told-to-seize-up-to-19.2bn-of-assets-from-Chevron.html
Ecuador has asked Argentina to seize up to $19.2bn of assets from Chevron in the latest twist in a long-running lawsuit over pollution in the Amazon rainforest.

The oil giant will also have its bank accounts in Argentina seized and gas sales frozen, a judge has ruled.

The 2011 ruling, one of the biggest of its kind in history, stated that 30,000 residents of Ecuador's Lago Agrio region had been harmed by the operations of Texaco, which Chevron bought in 2001.
38 ptolemy (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 05:49 pm Report abuse
@37
Please copy and paste something new.
39 Ayayay (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 06:14 pm Report abuse
@Jkw are you joking? The IMF, Christine Lagarde, handed Greece a 2,000 person list of Swiss bank accounts held by the Greek financial elite.
It “lost” it.
Then attempted to prosecute the journalist that didn't.

Do you think Christina Kirchner would welcome the secret Swiss bank accounts of the Argentine financial elite being published?
40 ElaineB (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 06:25 pm Report abuse
@36 To be fair, the over-indulgent parent must take some blame for not being tougher from the start. I don't think they quite understood that they were dealing with a child that needed a firmer hand all along. The Argentine finance minister at the time believed he could walk on water.

And Argentina was being touted at THE poster-child for SoAm investment when they really didn't deserve the credit. Money was made out of pimping Argentina and the subsequent haircuts. It was not by any means only the US that profited and Argentina seemed to welcome every snake-oil salesman with open arms. And let us not forget that the Argentine government greedily grabbed at any money they could lay their hands on and spent it like a lottery winner let loose in Vegas. What they failed to do was meet any of the terms and conditions of the loans.

@37 How does it feel to know I have spent far more time in Argentina than you ever have?

Until you stand by your convictions and go back to Argentina your words have no validity at all.
41 briton (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 07:48 pm Report abuse
True, good , false , bad ,
There is only one person to intimately carry the blame for ones countries successes of failure,
And that’s the leader, [CFK ]
And her government,

No one can blame any other nation for what has happened,

Argentines problems are from argentines policies, headed by the argentine government headed by CFK,
Full stop.

If you disagree then we strongly suggest you write or email CFK and tell her,

Still,
If you do complain, make sure you either bolt ya doors at night, of immigrate first.

Justa thoughta .

.
42 Pirate Love (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 08:02 pm Report abuse
music to ones ears, did someone mention “DEFAULT” hehehehhee :))

GO IMF! Bring on that RED CARD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
43 yankeeboy (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 08:49 pm Report abuse
40. The problem the IMF made was keeping the tap open after they lied and didn't do what the loan terms required.
At that time though the USA was backing Argentina with the belief that a stable Argentina was needed in South America. Boy have time changed! The USA has Chile, Peru ( !) Colombia(!) and Brazil as stable functioning countries (dare I say aligned) so they can let ARG slide into oblivion without it hurting anyone but themselves.
I think the USA wants the world to watch a spectacular failure as a lesson to play by the rules.
We will see shortly...
44 Guzz (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 08:56 pm Report abuse
To hell with your rules, as YOU will see ;)
45 yankeeboy (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 08:59 pm Report abuse
I'm sure there are a lot of people living on the streets and out of garbage cans that have the same attitude as you Guzz.
46 Guzz (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 09:03 pm Report abuse
Oh, but you are unique in your disgrace...
47 ElaineB (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 09:03 pm Report abuse
@44 See what? How would you know as you don't live there?

My friends there are acutely aware of the daily increasing difficulties there. One - who used to be a strong CFKC supporter - emailed me last week saying people felt afraid and the feeling was spreading.
48 Pirat-Hunter (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 09:07 pm Report abuse
#38 truth is constant, if I Taylor the truth I might have to sacrifice facts and end up losing credibility, Like some people with the WMD, you wouldn't want Latin America to become that stupid, would you?
49 Guzz (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 09:08 pm Report abuse
You lot should really focus more on the oincreasing difficulties in your own country, instead of filling your days helping Singer fill his own pockets, pointing at Argentina. That wont make your unemployment lower, nor will it make your gov able to pay the people their pensions...

Why IS it you are so busy helping Singer out???
50 Pirate Love (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 09:29 pm Report abuse
@49 because its fun, same reason why you slate other countries, its give and take, how do you take it?
51 Guzz (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 09:32 pm Report abuse
Great :)
I'm Uruguayan, curently we have the IMF, WB, US, EU and even you lot fighting for a spot up our arses. Win-win, I'd say...
52 Pirate Love (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 09:43 pm Report abuse
I ask you “how do you take it” and you come back with a sentence about arses, take what you like from that.

“I'm Uruguayan, curently we have the IMF, WB, US, EU and even you lot fighting for a spot up our arses”, yet you still remain argentinas bitch, why??
grow a pair and stand up for yourselves against argentina just like The Falklands has.....
53 Guzz (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 09:58 pm Report abuse
Arg is not our enemy, you are ;)

Now do as your masters say and come use some pounds sterlings.
54 Ayayay (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 10:36 pm Report abuse
this newspaper needs to measure Argentina's progress in happiness and health, not money.

I love how well my part of the world is doing in all of them :)
55 Pirat-Hunter (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 11:29 pm Report abuse
#40 it only shows me that no mater what race, gender or creed there is some sort of germ everywhere? Everything else feels the same.
I don't think you truly understand freedom and freedom of expression as well as you think you do. Before dictating to me what your expectations of My country is I think you would benefit from reading the international human rights charter and maybe then we could have a balanced discussion over What is good for Argentina, but before I lecture you over what's right and wrong, I admit that you have the right to speak for yourself thats all.
#41 ask any Argentine pensioners if it was the IMF or the bankers who came to help back in 2001? And when you find the name that sorted all out you will understand most Argentines until then you'll keep running into a brick wall. I“all make it simple for you. Duhalde, menem, galtiery and videla, get the picture?
#43 the word you are looking for is accountability, and the results from IMF conditions couldn't be more predictable. As is the case in Spain, Greece and was it Greenland that also went broke over night?
www.washdiplomat.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=8228:icelands-busted-economy-slowly-puts-back-the-pieces&catid=1484:march-2012&Itemid=497
The ambassador added that ”in reality, they never closed. Now the government owns Landsbanki, and the two others are owned by the debtors. We also borrowed money from our Nordic friends because there was a lack of foreign currency. They backed us up in a friendly and efficient manner.”

Yet other neighbors didn't exactly react in a friendly manner — namely the British and Dutch, whose governments demanded that Iceland repay the roughly $5.8 billion that their depositors lost when Landsbanki went under.

The Icelandic government initially agreed, but when the issue was put to a referendum, taxpayers refused to foot the bill for foreign creditors — which would've entailed relinquishing an amount roughly equal to half the country's GDP.

The v
56 Ayayay (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 11:35 pm Report abuse
The Icelandic issue was about PRIVATE banks, their GOV was in good shape. And Icelanders got very mad when the gov consensually nationalized parts of a hansdful of banks-they hope to sell this year.
57 Guzz (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 11:56 pm Report abuse
I too read that the icelandic nationalization of their banks saved their economy, but I'm wondering, the last piece of news about the icelanders being upset with the decision, was that for brit ears only? ;)
58 surfer (#) Nov 04th, 2012 - 11:58 pm Report abuse
Any investment in Argentina = vulture grade.
59 Pete Bog (#) Nov 05th, 2012 - 12:13 am Report abuse
@21
“import tax of 50%charged from every nation giving help and refuge to vulture fund”

I do hope that these countries are the ones supplying your armed forces with kit and spares.

In that case go ahead-put 100% import tax on them then.
60 Britworker (#) Nov 05th, 2012 - 12:20 am Report abuse
I can't remember the last time I heard an Argentine good news story on Mercopress, maybe there isn't any good news, or maybe the Uruguayan based Mercopress particularly dislike Argentina.
What do you think Guzz?
61 yankeeboy (#) Nov 05th, 2012 - 12:24 am Report abuse
According to THINK having the pride of the RG navy seized was a good news story. He is glad it is gone for a variety of reasons.
62 Troy Tempest (#) Nov 05th, 2012 - 12:25 am Report abuse
@11 britninja

“Hypocrite Guzz bitching about the “hypocrite West” while sat in a country of the West getting West-level training and education at the taxpayer's expense. Just out of curiosity Guzz, when you are actually heading back to South America to improve the lives of your countrymen?”

Britninja,
GUZZ now says, “Hypocrite Guzz bitching about the “hypocrite West” while sat in a country of the West getting West-level training and education at the taxpayer's expense. Just out of curiosity Guzz, when you are actually heading back to South America to improve the lives of your countrymen?

“Ones that leave SA because they are not allowed to feed off others” are called ”Gusanos”.

Now, he says he was EXILED to Europe, Denmark, Sweden, (not his fault), for fighting as a Socialist in Operation Condor.
Magically, he has now “returned” to South America !!

Sounds like one of Sussie's fantasies of being a Vegas Showgirl LOL !!

Anyway, so much for his claims of living in Europe and being a privileged but impartial observer, from outside South America ,

LOL LOL LOL
63 briton (#) Nov 05th, 2012 - 12:42 am Report abuse
argies aways change the subject,

and most aint even argies,

but if the boot was on the other foot,
????????
64 British_Kirchnerist (#) Nov 05th, 2012 - 12:49 am Report abuse
#39 “Do you think Christina Kirchner would welcome the secret Swiss bank accounts of the Argentine financial elite being published?”

Yes, for two reasons - they are her enemies, and it would also show that the rumours she had one are false =)
65 The Chilean perspective (#) Nov 05th, 2012 - 01:15 am Report abuse
23 Vader
I do believe that if the CFK admin sat down with the bond holders they could come up with a solution. It wouldn't be a few cents in the Dollar but a rather more a substantial ammount. The likes of Elliot management have not made money as you claim, they first have to cash in the bonds to make a profit and that has not happened yet. CFK claims that they have some US$45 billion in reserves. It is therefore morally as well as ethicaly and proper to pay up, what sort of a country do they want to have? A serious one or a global laughing stock?
66 Ayayay (#) Nov 05th, 2012 - 03:24 am Report abuse
The point is-the icelanders were majority AGAINST bailouts and nationalization, and prosecuted their Prime Minister for doing it.
67 Guzz (#) Nov 05th, 2012 - 06:10 am Report abuse
Now the icelanders prosecuted their PM for nationalizing the banks... What is this thread, a place for alternative reality???

According to the rest of the world, he was prosecuted for negligence...
68 surfer (#) Nov 05th, 2012 - 06:49 am Report abuse
Back on topic.

The only class of investors who will be interested in Argentine investments will be vulture funds.

YPF is an example of how commercial investments will be respected, Govt. bonds tell their own story. The story was, and is, about Default.
69 Troy Tempest (#) Nov 05th, 2012 - 07:24 am Report abuse
How are your ships and your airline ?
70 TipsyThink (#) Nov 05th, 2012 - 09:55 am Report abuse
67

Well done sedulous Guzz...

keep on writing away.

06:10(GMT)....05:10(Copenhagen Time)
71 Troy Tempest (#) Nov 05th, 2012 - 03:08 pm Report abuse
@70 Tipsy

“sedulous”

I think the word you are looking for is,

“seditious”
72 British_Kirchnerist (#) Nov 05th, 2012 - 03:18 pm Report abuse
#66 Rubbish, he was removed for supporting the corrupt banks andits his successors, brought to power by the people, who have broken from the neoliberal consensus
73 ChrisR (#) Nov 05th, 2012 - 05:25 pm Report abuse
But for all your comments, did anyone have any of their OWN money in Landsbanki?

My wife and I did, but fortunately below the rescue amount, AND we got our interest as well.

All's well, that ends well! :o)
74 toooldtodieyoung (#) Nov 05th, 2012 - 06:57 pm Report abuse
61 yankeeboy

“According to THINK having the pride of the RG navy seized was a good news story. He is glad it is gone for a variety of reasons.”

Yes he was, he seemed to think that it was a waste of money and a drain on the countries budget...... Pity he didn't stop to THINK that Ol' Turkey Neck / KFC / TMBOA / The Harpy was an even bigger one and by having her impounded, they could have saved Argentina from financial ruin.......... Oh well, when THINK is the best you've got.........
75 Troy Tempest (#) Nov 05th, 2012 - 10:00 pm Report abuse
@74 too old for TV21

What is happening on NOV 8th ??

Is it going to be in every city with an Argentine Consulate ??

Will it be violent?

Should they be scared ?

Big pots, or little pots ???

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