Wednesday, November 14th 2012 - 07:11 UTC

Ghana port officials deny water supply until the Argentine frigate relocates

Ghana authorities have denied the supply of water to the Argentine Navy flagship ARA Libertad impounded and retained in the port of Tema since 2 October and which refuses relocation to a less active pier despite a court order.

Former Argentine minister Jaunarena called for rationality and compliance with the relocation of the frigate

“The crew asked on Monday for water and we told them that if they want water they will have to move to where they have been indicated”, said a spokesperson from Tema port authority which is demanding the frigate moves from a very much demanded docking area of an already congested terminal.

“We told them that if they want our port services they will have to move to pier 6. There are no services for them at pier 11 where they are currently docked”, added the spokesperson.

The Argentine navy flagship has generators for electricity but is short in water and Tema officials also warned that if the vessel requests fuel this will also be denied until it complies with the court order.

Last 5 November the Accra Superior Tribunal confirmed a ruling ordering the frigate to move from the current pier since it was impeding normal trade activities in Tema, the African country’s main sea port.

Argentina solicitors in Ghana later managed on appeal ‘a suspension order’ but time is over and from Buenos Aires the argument now is that with only 44 crewmembers and a captain, moving the vessel implies a great risk.

That is why last week when Tema officials moved on the vessel with tugs, a crane and ground crew ready for the operation, the Argentine crew reacted lifting the plank and showing their rifles.

The incident only complicated things and Argentina gave Ghana a deadline for the release of the vessel by Wednesday. If not Argentina will take the case to the UN Law of the Sea Tribunal in Hamburg of which the two countries are signatories.

ARA Libertad was impounded by a Ghana high court on request from a New York court acting for NML Capital, an investment fund holding defaulted Argentine sovereign bonds with face value and interests totalling 370 million dollars.

Argentina refuses to deal with the ‘holdouts’ which it describes as ‘vulture funds’, and likewise refused to deposit a 20 million dollars bail for the release, arguing that military vessels can’t be impounded.

Tema port authorities when asked on the Argentine deadline simply said that they were complying with an order from a competent Ghana court, and “we will have to wait and see what happens”.

The Ghana government has responded to all Argentine political contacts and requests saying that the Judiciary is independent and thus can’t interfere in the litigation.

The government of President Cristina Fernandez also accuses Ghana of ignoring the Vienna Convention for not guaranteeing the immunity of the war vessel, but the Ghana court argues that Argentina dropped its diplomatic sovereignty from the moment it issued sovereign bonds.

In Buenos Aires Defence ministry sources said the Navy was preparing to send a fresh crew to replace the 44 members currently on board.

Likewise a former Argentine Defence minister with three different presidents, Horacio Jaunarena called for ‘rationality’ and compliance with the Ghana court order to relocate the frigate.

“The essential thing is not lose rationality in this entire incident. The Ghana court has ordered the relocation and this does not justify an incident over something non important for the real issue. We have to accept the ruling and we can be sure things are going to run smoothly for Argentina in the international courts”, said Jaunarena.

“All vessels that access a port have local pilots on board. What is not sensible is to accept the court order and then resist, endangering the lives of the crew. The problem is the crew in obeying orders from Buenos Aires but if the high court of Ghana orders relocation, it must be done”, added the former minister and expert in military affairs.

“Showing weapons by Argentine crew members, as was reported is a very serious international incident plus the confrontation with Ghana. We accept the jurisdiction; we must accept its resolutions. Argentina is right: military vessels and not impoundable and precisely because the reason is on her side it must avoid incidents: if Ghana does not solve the issue, then we go to the Hamburg tribunal. I would recommend the President to order the vessel to be relocated and avoid silly incidents”, concluded Jaunarea.
 

206 comments Feed

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1 Idlehands (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 11:39 am Report abuse
Woohooooooo - we're off and running again.
Thirsty Argentine sailors need to avoid looking at the ocean that surrounds them if they can't remember primary school physics.
........or they could just move their boat.
2 pgerman (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 11:44 am Report abuse
Results of a poll conducted by the most important economic and trade journal in Argentina:

What to do with the “vulture funds” and the frigate ARA Libertad?

Pay and recover the frigate: 30.3%
Open a negotiation and pay the least possible 36.4%
Do not pay anything and seek international justice 27.6%
Breaking relations with Ghana and ignore the Frigate 6.1%
3 GeoffWard2 (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 11:52 am Report abuse
... or keep the external pot on the boil until the massed internal street 'concern' goes away.
(This means the Argentinian sailors in Ghana must be allowed to die of thirst, if necessary.)
4 Boovis (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 11:56 am Report abuse
If CFK was answering she would have chosen: Option E) Be a massive dick about it.
5 Foxtrot Indigo (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 12:03 pm Report abuse
Good on you Ghana! Stand firm and don't let the RG's pressure you into doing anything. The court is the voice of the law and no one stands above the law.
6 LEPRecon (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 12:09 pm Report abuse
Water, water everywhere,
And all the boards did shrink.
Water, water everywhere,
Nor any drop to drink.

The captain should have the courage to move the vessel.
7 Idlehands (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 12:09 pm Report abuse
Does anyone ever have problems posting here whereby the “Submit Comment” button is greyed out and doesn't work?

Post 1 was made from my mobile because my PC was having none of it but now it seems fine for no particular reason.
8 Frank (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 12:14 pm Report abuse
Ungreys when you start typing...
Looks like the site has been purged of trolls....
9 saphira (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 12:15 pm Report abuse
I thought all comments had been closed until I logged in
10 Idlehands (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 12:22 pm Report abuse
8 Frank

No it stays grey making it impossible to post even when I've written my most astute comments. Never seems a problem on my mobile. I think it may be related to the fact it is my work PC so I don't have total control over it.
11 saphira (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 12:24 pm Report abuse
Guzz seems to think he has got the comment section closed judging by his post on mercopress's facebook page
12 Zhivago (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 12:26 pm Report abuse
Not much debate when one side is banned!
13 Foxtrot Indigo (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 12:26 pm Report abuse
@6

I agree, he doesn't want his crew dying of thrist does he? There is loyalty then there is sheer stupidity.
14 Idlehands (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 12:41 pm Report abuse
Is Guzz Mr Gomez in disguise?
15 Condorito (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 12:42 pm Report abuse
Ha ha I'm back! I thought I had been tarred with the Argie brush!
16 wangito (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 12:48 pm Report abuse
@2...poll results:
Pay and recover the frigate: 30.3%
Open a negotiation and pay the least possible 36.4%
Do not pay anything and seek international justice 27.6%

One question was missing:
Reach any of the first three agreements, and then NOT pay...99%
ARG mentality. Nothing you can do about it.
17 Idlehands (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 12:48 pm Report abuse
Does anyone know what's actually happened here over the last 48 hours? I got no response to a query to the mods.
18 Anbar (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 12:51 pm Report abuse
One wonders how much freedom of action the Captain has anyway... orders-from-the-top are probably dictating his every move.

Poor sod.
19 Frank (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 12:54 pm Report abuse
@17 Night of the long knives.... troll purge... with a bit of luck.

@12 ..the trolls didn't contribute to the debate.
20 Idlehands (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 12:57 pm Report abuse
One would assume we've seen the last of Conqueror too then? He was as bad as the rest of them.

I assume the captain will move the ship only when they've completely run out of water - unless he sends out his crew to buy bottles of Evian. I hope when they do finally move that the port services are only restored when the frigate settles it's berthing debts to Ghana.

At least Jaunarena is displaying some common sense.
21 Foxtrot Indigo (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 01:00 pm Report abuse
@20

While reading your comment I had a vision of the crew going out to buy bottled water and while they are out the Ghana port authorites surround the ship and shift to pier 6.

Made me laugh :)
22 Idlehands (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 01:03 pm Report abuse
I'm amazed at the restraint shown by Ghana.

The ship would look like the Ecuadorian embassy in London had they tried this nonsense in a British port - with a few heavily armed marines thrown in too.
23 Anbar (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 01:06 pm Report abuse
@17 no idea, i did email DTU where Guzz is supposedly at university, asking them to look into the use of their facilities for his “Incitement” posts, but any connection to mercopress events i suspect is coincidental.
24 Condorito (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 01:06 pm Report abuse
Idlehands / Frank
“Night of the long knives” – I think that is about right. There seems to have been a troll purge based on those using multiple logins from a single IP. Long overdue, but unfortunately all too easy to work around for the committed.

@12 ..the trolls didn't contribute to the debate – quite right. When you ever ask them a straight question on a serious issue, they change subject or just don’t answer.
25 Anbar (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 01:15 pm Report abuse
“When you ever ask them a straight question on a serious issue, they change subject or just don’t answer.”

Well, that was their JOB, for a chunk of them at least. ¬_¬
26 Idlehands (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 01:20 pm Report abuse
I don't really believe that any of them were paid trolls as advocated by some on here. For a start they were pretty useless at it - surely if CFKs regime were that paranoid about internet forums they'd employ people capable of achieving their aims.
27 ElaineB (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 01:20 pm Report abuse
I did think for a moment that the moderator just lost patience and closed the comment section for good. I can understand it as some comments were way beyond acceptable.

“The essential thing is not lose rationality in this entire incident.' But that is impossible with an irrational president.
28 Anbar (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 01:28 pm Report abuse
“I don't really believe that any of them were paid trolls as advocated by some on here. For a start they were pretty useless at it - surely if CFKs regime were that paranoid about internet forums they'd employ people capable of achieving their aims.”

is not the answer to that already in the question? ;-0

-----

I feel rather sorry for the sailors onboard tbh, not form anything done by Ghana, but just for being put in such a horrible position by their government, solely through bad-debt.

It would be resignation time for most politicians of any morality.

(Oh, hang on....!)
29 Idlehands (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 01:33 pm Report abuse
I'd like to know what their rules of engagement were during the stand off. Was the Argentine government really expecting them to defend the Libertad with their lives? Were they really ordered to shoot had the Ghanians ignored them and carried on?

What would their response have been had the Ghanians whipped out some firearms too?

28 Anbar - are you saying that CFK & Co are so inept that they could only employ the inept and yet remain too inept to notice their ineptness?
30 ptolemy (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 01:34 pm Report abuse
Odd, I'd have thought the ship would have already tanked up on water,..before this mess. Something wrong there..
31 Frank (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 01:40 pm Report abuse
You would have thought so but with her full complement she would be making most of her water when she is at sea... so maybe not much tankage.
32 Lau-wai (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 01:44 pm Report abuse
Havn't you noticed? whilst all eyes are on the ARA Libertad, there's a lot of silence over the issue of the ARA Espora in Simonstown. Does anyone know anything about the legal issues (possibly leading to a sequestration order) surrounding the fate of this ship?
33 GeoffWard2 (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 01:47 pm Report abuse
Obviously some software modifications going on at Mercopress.
But not convinced that the rationale is to eliminate troll activities.
34 pgerman (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 02:00 pm Report abuse
@ 16 wangito excellent !!

Why don't you act with a bit of healthy pride and stop begging the usage of the Argentine airspace and sea?

“Two” rich and with very high wealthy countries as UK and FI with high per capita income would not have any issue to afford long trips to London to leave or enter the Island. In addition London is a lovely and wonderful city to visit.

By doing this you would get rid of the annoying and uncomfortable dependence on the Argentine cheaters.

And would demonstrate a bit of healthy pride and ability to be independent from the nasty Third world represented by Latin America.
35 Anbar (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 02:00 pm Report abuse
“” are you saying that CFK & Co are so inept that they could only employ the inept and yet remain too inept to notice their ineptness?“”

lol, yes, its all rather “Whoops Apocalypse” really isnt it? :-)
36 briton (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 02:03 pm Report abuse
Just what kind of a country are we turning into?
We think, to points of note here,
1, Cfk it seems is leaving her own people on this ship to suffer her humiliation.
2, we think she is hoping, something goes wrong and not only does she hope Ghana will get the blame, but the world will shift to give Argentina sympathy.
3, CFK is probably looking for a Victory to give her people.

In the meantime, the territory is Ghanaian, and the ship and its crew really must comply with the Ghanaians requests,
If they require the ship to be moved, either you do it, or they will,
And we think that CFK is trying to create a diplomatic incident in her favour.

CFK you are being humiliated, as is your country,
Just pay the money, then deal with the finer points of law, later, and after you get this crew safely back home, indeed if you cared, this would be done already.
Do you care, do your bloggers care .pay up. Please.

just an opinion.
37 HansNiesund (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 02:09 pm Report abuse
@34

> Why don't you act with a bit of healthy pride and stop begging the usage of the Argentine airspace and sea?

Who exactly has been begging Argentina for anything?
38 pgerman (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 02:09 pm Report abuse
Last results of a poll conducted by the most important economic and trade journal in Argentina:

What to do with the “vulture funds” and the frigate ARA Libertad?

Pay and recover the frigate: 38.5%

Open a negotiation and pay the least possible 35.7%

Do not pay anything and seek international justice 20.5%

Breaking relations with Ghana and ignore the Frigate 2.7%
39 briton (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 02:16 pm Report abuse
The point being,
They cannot stay on the ship indefinitely,

This will eventually cause all sorts of problems , health or other wise,

Loyalty only goes so far,
She is using these men to further her point,

Sooner or later something will happen,
But who will ultimately carry the can.

.
40 Idlehands (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 02:16 pm Report abuse
What's going on with pgerman? Seems to be quoting things that haven't been written and generally going around in circles. Rather odd.
41 Frank (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 02:20 pm Report abuse
@40 They have only nailed one of his feet down?

His post at 38 made sense.
42 Anbar (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 02:23 pm Report abuse
well, personally, I think that Argentina will “win” at the UN over the holding of a “warship” being against all sorts of treaties....

their biggest problem is the classification of the ship as a “warship” and, following on from that, they will then owe Ghana a chunk of money for mooring fees anyway...and already be in dispute with the Ghanese legal system anyway.

Its perfectly feasible for the Argentine Gov to come out looking like victors in this. (Key words “looking like” - at least for internal consumption)
43 pgerman (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 02:31 pm Report abuse
Hansniesund ... .yes you are right, I'm getting old and a bit obsessive about my ideas.

It just happens that based on lots of dismissive and disparaging comments towards my country, and its people, that I think it would be great that the islanders could stop taking any small advantage at the expensed of Argentina.

So they did in the past when they were poor and took deliveries of fuel Argentine governments, medical aid and scholarships. All this giveaway price.

For instance right now you could stop begging to get or have any collaboration that will benefit economically.

yes, I know, I know....it's a deal ... that it is null and only benefits a part ... but Argentina is bound to the end of time ..
44 ElaineB (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 02:32 pm Report abuse
It is significant they they changed the villain from the US based NML Capital to Ghana. They have not a leg to stand on regarding the repayment of the bonds -especially since the recent ruling - so they have to create a new enemy. Ghana is merely sticking to the letter of the law and do not deserve to be painted bad by the Argentine government.

The only badly behaved in this farce is the Argentine crew being ordered from Buenos Aires to point rifles at the unarmed Ghanaian port authority officials. For that there will be serious consequences.
45 yankeeboy (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 02:44 pm Report abuse
I read an article a couple of day ago written by an attorney in Ghana, basically it said since the Executive branch of the Gov't wasn't involved in the detention of the ship there is no basis to take it to The ITLOS. It is strictly a private matter between two entities. Ghana did say they would vigorously defend their position in the courts though to show what a stand up/legitimate country they have become.

I think CFK thought she would quickly win but like everything else she is losing and it is all spinning out of control.
46 Idlehands (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 02:56 pm Report abuse
CFK seems to use litigation to just kick things down the road a bit.

They're seeking a restart and whole new retrial in the case of Judge Griesa and his bondholder decision:

www.buenosairesherald.com/article/116833/argentina-seeks-us-appeals-court-retrial-on-debt-ruling

Argentina is complaining that future sovereign debt crisis would become impossible to negotiate. Doesn't seem to occur to her that prevention is better than cure and that lurching from one to the next is not good government and not good for lenders either.

Sovereign nations don't have a right to go bankrupt because they are sovereign.
47 mastershakejb (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 03:10 pm Report abuse
I have to agree with Briton; I think Cristina genuinely wanted a firefight to ensue, or at least some injuries/major headlines to make it look like Argentina is somehow a victim....but it didn't go as she had hoped, and things continue to deteriorate for her. But I'm sure she also sees it as somewhat of an upside in that it's a distraction from the economy.
In the end though, she probly honestly doesn't care that much, because she's kept in her rich bubble, with helicopter fueled ready to escape Argentina any minute if it should collapse.
48 pgerman (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 03:21 pm Report abuse
@46
The sad fact is that, even under the assumption that the Argentine government wanted to pay the bonds and the Paris Club debt, they cannot. Simply because Argentina do not have the dollars to do so right now.

Currently the actual federal reserves are very low and would not allow to make the payment of U$D 3000 million to the bondholders and the 8/9000 million to the Paris Club.

Argentina is really broke. I really do not know how things are legally fixed in these cases.
49 Conqueror (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 03:26 pm Report abuse
@20 Seems the mods don't agree. There have been any number of occasions when others have agreed with me. Perhaps some of them were before your time! Not everyone has to subscribe to YOUR views. I have a simple view. Neither I nor my country nor anyone we protect will be browbeaten by ANYONE! I refuse to be politically correct. And if anyone doesn't like me telling them what my country is capable of doing, tough! On the one hand, they shouldn't have said something that got me thinking that way, and on the other, if it makes them reconsider their words and attitudes, so much the better.

It seems you're as intolerant as anyone else. Or shall we go back and check the number of posts you've had removed?
@24 Why did you use the word “committed”?
@28 Really? Do you remember the “axel_arg”. The one that was supposedly a schoolteacher? And yet, also supposedly, had time to run around conducting a “survey”? I also wonder how many of the “malvinistas” were/are university “students. ”Paid” doesn't necessarily mean money. How about higher grades?
@32 I can't find anything substantive on the Espora later than 6 November. Possibilities might be that (a) Springer is waiting until it has been repaired or (b) the South Africans are being more “co-operative” with the argies. Anyone know what the South African judicial system is like these days?
@34 I'm not really sure of the purpose of your comment or the reference to “Argentine airspace and sea”. All around the world, airlines based in one country regularly fly through the airspaces of other countries. It's because aircraft provide the most direct means of transport. Argieland is notable because it restricts air travel in order to place pressure on the Falkland Islands. There is no other reason. The situation is similar in respect of the sea. Argieland restricts “right of innocent passage”.
@42 It shouldn't do. Argieland waived immunity. That destroys the Article 28(2) proposition.
50 Idlehands (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 03:35 pm Report abuse
49 Conqueror

I can save you the bother - I'm not aware of any post I've ever made on here being removed.
51 Gordo1 (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 03:44 pm Report abuse
It seems to me that this vessel is not a military vessel as it us not suited to modern warfare, It is a training ship for the Argentine and other Latin American navies and is used to instruct their cadets in basic seamanship. It also flies the flag for Argentina in its trips around the world.
52 Idlehands (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 03:50 pm Report abuse
Why am I amused that this site reports that ARA Libertad was last reported heading south to Tema at 11.7 knots on 1/10/2012

www.fleetmon.com/en/vessels/Ara_Libertad_36410
53 Raven (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 03:53 pm Report abuse
27 ElaineB
''I did think for a moment that the moderator just lost patience and closed the comment section for good. I can understand it as some comments were way beyond acceptable.''

So did I. Not a surprise after the Rememberence Sunday thread that had stacks of removed comments. The fact that the shop has re-opened without the usual suspects shows a rather big purge, well, almost all...

Back on topic, It seems they Argentine Gvt is doing the usual trick of making lots of noise in one direction, then when that fails, making loads of noise in another, despite knowing they are on a sticky wicket. That boat will move before too long and I expect CFK to crow about how it with her own twist to the story. Will it be ''CFK made the moral decision against the pirates and vulture funds' or 'Nasty Ghana attacks Argentine Soverign Territory'???
54 Idlehands (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 04:00 pm Report abuse
I'm not convinced CFK wanted a firefight either. I'd take a guess that the plan was to enrage the Ghanians enough that they would also bring weapons to bare and forcibly remove the Libertad to the other mooring. She would then have had all sorts of issues to rant about.

Does anyone understand the thrux of this story:

www.buenosairesherald.com/article/116885/lower-house-lawmakers-to-debate-per-saltum-bill

It sounds very dodgy but there isn't enough detail to comment. Since when do courts pass laws?
55 Troy Tempest (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 04:06 pm Report abuse
@34 pgerman

“And would demonstrate a bit of healthy pride and ability to be independent from the nasty Third world represented by Latin America.”

Is this how you believe the Brits, US, and Falklanders view South America, or just Argentina, or only the CFK government?
56 Conqueror (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 04:10 pm Report abuse
@50 I am! Seems my memory is better than yours.
@51 I'm afraid it doesn't follow. For example, the US Navy has 2 hospital ships, 4 salvage ships, 9 dry cargo ships, 4 fleet ocean tugs, 4 container ships and 16 other cargo ships. None of them would really be appropriate for warfare, would they?
57 Anbar (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 04:21 pm Report abuse
@34 pgerman

I (caps) dont regard Argentina or Argentines' as 3rd World, however, i DO (caps) regard Argentina's Government as Third World.

It is, for me at least, a pretty big and important distinction.
58 pgerman (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 04:25 pm Report abuse
Ahhh Conqueror...you always make me laugh .... so balanced, so rational. But finally we agree on something, you said “I have a simple view” ... it is quite clear that even a child or pet is more complex and elaborate thought you.

In my case if I disregard someone I always stay away from him. It's ever worse if this peron is violent and cheats .. but the islanders have always been taking every (small or large) advantage they could from Argentina whenever they could.

My friend “Hansniesund” always maintains that Argentina is forced by a treaty no matter that It has already been declared invalid.

But now you go beyond, based on your comments “everyone has the right to use the air and sea space of all” ... never in my whole life I have ever heard anything like this !!. Let's suppose then that the Argentine Air Force or Aerolineas Argentinas has the right to fly over Port Stanley, or over London, without asking for permission and no one can stop it !!!

Excellent ... simple reasoning with a simple conclusion ... unrealistic and nonexistent conclussion !!!
59 Idlehands (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 04:25 pm Report abuse
56 Conqueror

Go find this deleted post then - or are we all expected to rely on your superior memory?
60 Ayayay (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 04:33 pm Report abuse
Yeay!!!!! Cap'n Poppy, Elaine, Troy, funny Brits, Argentine Simon, and (some) others-missed you guys!!

Almost had to comment on FB ;)
61 Foxtrot Indigo (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 04:41 pm Report abuse
Steady on chaps, we're all on the same side right?
62 Anbar (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 04:49 pm Report abuse
@58 ” the islanders have always been taking every (small or large) advantage they could from Argentina whenever they could.”

Do you have any examples?
63 Raven (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 04:49 pm Report abuse
I do not wish for 'Conqueror' to be considered on my side.

His vacuous, hate filled post #70 in the linked thread was absolutely out of order and was even worse than anything the ''RG trolls'' ever posted. en.mercopress.com/2012/11/11/thanksgiving-service-at-the-liberation-monument-in-stanley#comments
64 LEPRecon (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 05:01 pm Report abuse
@56 - Conquerer

No but they are classed as military vessels who provide support to warships and thus would be classified as having the same protections under international law.

The sticking point here is that Argentina waived its sovereign immunity rights in order to secure loans. So yes the Libertad could be considered a warship, but Argentina voluntarily waived their sovereign immunity on all of their sovereign assets including military hardware.

The court in Ghana is only upholding the law.

@60 - We missed you too. I thought I was going to have to create a Facebook account!!!!! Shock horror! Then I'd no longer be an individual! LOL
65 Foxtrot Indigo (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 05:01 pm Report abuse
@63 Raven

Unfortunately every country has its share of 'fanatics' who think they know best. The only thing you can do is educate them or shoot them. I've always believed that educating people is more beneficial. Also, I don't have a gun ;)

I agree that 'Conqueror' has often made very rude posts on this site, on par or worse than the RG's trolls. That is wrong and maybe he/she should take a step back and think before posting. However, the UK has become so conjested with the PC nonsense its no wonder some people are taking extreme views. I'm not excusing his/her behaviour, just trying to understand it.
66 ElaineB (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 05:03 pm Report abuse
@53 I like hearing the other side of the debates. The problem was the NPD poster(s) - I believe it was one person - causing arguments without basis. Anything for attention. It was tiresome and generally lowered the tone of attempts at rational debate.

I am wondering what the Argentine government will do next in Ghana. They seem to have run out of road on this one.
67 Hook (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 05:04 pm Report abuse
I think “Conqueror” is OK.
68 pgerman (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 05:06 pm Report abuse
Dear Anbar.

Firstly I'd like to coment that I think the the islanders have lot of rights over the FI, I'm not a supid “malvinista-K”, and the Islanders are honest people the deserve my respect.

But, if you analyze the history (even in the decade before the war) the FI used everything the mainland sent (mainly Argentina).

Until the day of the invasion, Argentina suppñlied the FI with fuel and energy at bargain prices, sent planes with medical assistance when needed and had students in Argentine schools with scholarships.

The Royal Navy was supplied in Argentine ports and repairs were made in their ships when needed. All of this with the reception of friend of Argentina. None of them, niether the people of Uk nor the islanders considered argentine people as cheaters no mattehr that they want them far from the Islands....as far as possible.

Now that the islanders are rich, thanks to the UK favor, I believe it's time to act more ethically. Just this.

I have never wnated to offend the islanders at all.
69 Simon68 (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 05:16 pm Report abuse
68 pgerman (#)
Nov 14th, 2012 - 05:06 pm

It is true that we provided many services to the Islands during the 1970/80's, and a lot of them were as you say at bargain prices, but we did it for a reason, to win the Islanders' favour.
There is also the fact that the Islanders and the British government actually paid for those services, and the famous scholarships were only to state schools which were not used by the Islanders, those that took advantage of schooling in Argentina went to bilingual private schools such as St. Hildas, St. Andrews, St Georges, Northlands, St. Pauls, etc.
These services did cost the Argentine tax payer a bit, but the end game was to get sovereignty of the Islands, Galtieri managed ti f*ck that up for eternity!!!!!
70 Santa Fe (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 05:19 pm Report abuse
I dont think pooping in the islanders helped much either
71 Raven (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 05:25 pm Report abuse
Thank you for the replies Foxtrot and Elaine.

As the place has had a flush out, it would just be nice to debate, to ask questions and educate myself without the incessant trolling that reached a peak on the aforementioned thread. Hopefully this can be achieved. I have no fight with any Argentine, I'd just like to discuss ideas and concepts in a civil atmosphere. This is why I shake my head at Conqueror.

We had all best make use of this time, I can't imagine Guzz or any of the others being able to stay away for too long. :(
I read another forum that is based in the US, the trolls there regularly resurface under new guises before getting hit under yet another ban hammer.
72 LEPRecon (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 05:27 pm Report abuse
@68 - pgerman

But just what your comments have to do with Ghana cutting off the water supply until Argentina moves the Libertad?

Would you care to comment on this, as this thread has nothing to do with the Falklands?
73 Anbar (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 05:31 pm Report abuse
Cheers pgerman, it was an honestly asked question with no hidden agenda - thanks for the honest reply. :-)

I think that “back then” the Islands got more assistance “locally” than they did from London(?), its a shame that changed because I think the FI can now go ahead without any need of assistance from Argentina (& other than defence: the UK) and that that, in the long term, will be detrimental to Argentina if its position never changes.

Not in some grand apocalyptic fashion, just that Argentina and the FI working together makes a lot more sense than having them work against each other.

I'm pretty certain that the future of the Islands will, ultimately, if not for some time, result in their independence, so i regard the current (Argentine) government approach, and “we wont change” approach to Sovereignty .... perverse. It can only ever harm Argentina more than the UK or FI.

I honestly regard Ban Ki Moons recent comments as the Fat-Lady Singing with regards to any hope of the UN going against the Islanders fundamental, and irrevocable, rights to self-determination.

With that in mind I can only hope that Argentine politics change to reflect this.

In the mean time, please try to ignore the slathering idiots on here who hate everything Argentine, they are, most definitely, a minority...you can tell because of how loudly they have to shout & scream everything.
74 Santa Fe (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 05:35 pm Report abuse
70... Should of read islanders houses, not islanders ..that would be even worse
75 toooldtodieyoung (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 05:38 pm Report abuse
My Friends!!!!

It's good to be back with everything back up and running again. I was having the same struggle with myself that LEPRecon was having as well.

It just wasn't the same being on this website but not being able to comment on it. Now it's back again, it's business as usual I see.

Ghana port officials starting to play hard ball with the Argentinian's, we shall see how much stomach the Argentines have for this until they comply.
76 KFC de Pollo (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 05:41 pm Report abuse
@69, you are so right! I'd place money on the islands being associated in some way with Argentina if we had never invaded. now all we can do is try and stop this propaganda and try and move on as a country.
77 Think (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 05:52 pm Report abuse
TWIMC

I can read that there is much speculation about a ”Purge” going on…..

My experience tells me that ”Purges” and ”Censorship” only work ”One Way” in here, at MercoPress.

I personally wouldn’t miss deranged and insulting Argentinean psychopathic posters as ”Pirate Hunter” or ”Sussie” ….

Neither would I miss deranged and insulting Anglo psychopathic posters as ”Conqueror” or ”Captain Poppy”……

Servus
78 Joe Bloggs (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 05:54 pm Report abuse
69, 76

Definitely agree almost entirely with that but there was certainly some degree of underlying trust of the Argentine AND UK governments if I am honest.
79 agent999 (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 06:11 pm Report abuse
world.

You have a government claiming inflation to be below 10% while the truer figure according to your own independent people is nearer 25%, also claiming to have $ reserves in excess of $40 billion, and the list goes on.

CFK, at a meeting at Harvard University, suggests that the US inflation figures are wrong and the IMF do not know what they are talking about.

At every turn CFK plays the victim card, the courts are against us, the rating companies are against us, everyone in the world is against us.

At every opportunity the Argentine government attack the UK, the Falkland Islands and the rest of the world.

You have massive demonstrations against what is happening in your own country, CFK's answer “there is no credible opposition to us so we must be right, why are these people wasting their time demonstrating”.

They now attack the Ghanaian government for something that has been decided by the courts, quite rightly the Ghanaian's answer it is a problem must be dealt with through the court system – the Ghanaian government do not control the courts. They are now taking Ghana to the ITLOS - it’s nothing to do with Ghana – it is their “independent” court system. Unfortunately for the Argentinian population their own court system is easily controlled by the government.

The CFK run Argentinian government are as bad as any of the previous military junta’s, they want complete control, don’t care about their population.
They have this absurd view of themselves – they are always right and anybody who is critical of what they are doing is wrong and does not understand them.

I have nothing against the Argentinian people but the continuous rubbish that comes out of CFK and her cronies in government is just too much.

I really feel sorry for the majority of Argentinians you have potentially such a rich country in people and resources but continually cannot get anyone to run your country to your advantage.
80 Joe Bloggs (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 06:14 pm Report abuse
Bit of a faux pas in 78. Change trust to mistrust.
81 pgerman (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 06:20 pm Report abuse
Argentina supplied the FI with fuel and other services at the same prices that small towns were supplied in the Argentine territory. Basically because, legally FI were considered part of the country. The reasons why the country did this is another issue and it's part of your speculations but anyway it doesn't change anything.

Regarding this case, there is little doubt, as do the majority of Argentine people, the caountry must pay and honor debts. I would pay the U$D 20 million to bring the boat home.

I have seen this boat a couple of times in two different sea-side cities very closely and is really quite wonderful. It's a piece of jewelry. With surpluss that was entirely built at a shipyard in Argentina.

The last time was in Sydeny I wanted to visit the Discovery to be able to compare both boats but unfortunately it was on a tour.

It is unfortunate that a boat like, the ARA Libertad, is at risk of being lost.

I think it is clear that CFK wants to take advantage of this situation playing the role of the victim.

Anyway, as I mentioned before I do not think that the actual federal reserves of Argentina would allow to cancel the debt with the bondholders.
82 toooldtodieyoung (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 06:22 pm Report abuse
79 agent999

Exactly, Couldn't have put it better myself. Now that this seems to be free of La Campora trolls, screaming misinformation and twisting or distorting history / the truth. We can now talk about what has gone so wrong with Argentina.

It is not the general population who is at fault, it is the failure of the government, chosen by them, to run the country properly. I get the feeling that Argentina could be a real powerhouse of an ecomony, one of the strongest in South America, if only the Politicians would actually do a good job and not use being president as an excuse to line their own pockets.
83 MistyThink (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 06:28 pm Report abuse
You might write on your own article(s) instead of trying to make profundity of these matters under the different comments names writing.

I don't guess you are aware of these matters essentially.
84 pgerman (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 06:42 pm Report abuse
I'm Argentinina born no matter that I don't live in Argentina. I visit it regularly.

I also do agree with “agent999” and “toooldtodieyoung”.

It's quite evident that the Argentine political class is the problem of the country. CFK is lead the country to another bankrrupcy...its broke again !!!!
85 Raven (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 06:43 pm Report abuse
From post 81 pgerman

''Anyway, as I mentioned before I do not think that the actual federal reserves of Argentina would allow to cancel the debt with the bondholders.''

As can be seen from this article linked, Venezuala gave 3 Billion Dollars to Argentina to pay for IMF debts.
en.mercopress.com/2012/11/06/venezuelan-leader-establishes-similarities-between-the-governments-of-argentina-and-venezuela

Why would CFK accept Venezuala paying off Argentine debt? Is as pgerman surmised, the reserves are without enough funds?

CFK has crowed about $40 billion in reserves. Maybe that is as distorted as the apparent distortion of inflation figures by INDEC? That would make Argentina in big danger of another collapse.

If this is anywhere near true, the ARA Libertad is destined for new ownership soon, as Argentina really does not have the money to spend to recover the ship, or pay off Sovereign debt to the 7% that did not accept the debt restructure.
86 ElaineB (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 06:43 pm Report abuse
The ship is indeed beautiful and I think that, once again, CFKC misjudged the will of the majority wanting to keep the ship. She arrogantly stated that they could 'take the ship' but the majority of Argentine people declared it was not her's to give away. Quite right!

For someone declaring she is a lawyer CFKC seems to have little understanding of the law. Or maybe she thinks laws do not apply to her. (Nixon made that mistake). She has become a monster without the constraints of Nestor, and her over-indulged son just encourages her.

Argentina may not have the ability to pay but they should have, at least, negotiated a payment schedule.
87 Conqueror (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 06:53 pm
Comment removed by the editor.
88 Ayayay (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 06:59 pm Report abuse
@15 Glad you're back!!

I admire how peaceful the Ghanians are conducting themselves, they are just following their law, & they're resources are a courtesy. *grabs popcorn*
89 ProRG_American (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 07:02 pm Report abuse
I see that after a long day of rest from truth delivering comments by Malvinenses, this site is now open for comment again.
Sorry to pop your ballon, again, but the highly respected publication Ambito Financiero is reporting that the TemaNazi authorities have started supplying food and water to the Fragata Libertad.

www.ambito.com/noticia.asp?id=663106

I suppose that those sorry a-s corrupt Ghanan judges and politicians are beginning to sense that they have gone too far, there won't be a quick payout, and their country will be sued for damages.

Oh by the way, kore positive news
“ARGENTINA HAS THE FASTEST GROWING MIDDLE CLASS IN THE REGION OVER THE PAST DECADE“ WORLD BANK SAYS
”According to a report released today by the World Bank, Argentina has the highest percentage of growth of the middle class across the region
“The middle class in this period rose from 9.3 to 18.6 million people,” says the report.
“This increasing people represent 25 percent of the total population of Argentina”. “This is the largest percentage growth of the middle class across the region during the last decade, followed by Brazil with 22 percent and Uruguay with 20 percent,” the report said.
The figures are from the study entitled “Economic mobility and the growth of the middle class in Latin America” and define the members of the middle class to those with an income of between 10 and 50 dollars per day per capita.
World Bank President Jim Yong Kim said, “Recent experience in Latin America and the Caribbean shows the world that can bring prosperity to millions of people through policies that find a balance between economic growth and expansion opportunities for the most vulnerable. “

A GOOD REASON WHY THE INTERNTIONAL “FINANCIAL SAVIORS” ARE SO DAMN MAD AT ARGENTINA
90 toooldtodieyoung (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 07:04 pm Report abuse
86 ElaineB

You know what? I would not be surprised by what KFC / TMBOA / Ol' Turkey Neck / The Harpy declares herself as these days.

Her government is running around like headless chickens over this, trying to find someone to blame, trying to find something to blame, crying and wailing and saying “It's not fair” to anyone who will listen. Then you have laughing boy timerman saying they will pay, she says they won't.

Oh the circus goes on and one doesn't it?

But pgerman at 81 and you are quite right, the ARA Libertad is such a lovely ship, it would be such a shame to the Argentine people if it were lost.
91 ProRG_American (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 07:07 pm Report abuse
I say, the English in a state of denial.
92 ElaineB (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 07:11 pm Report abuse
@89. It is the middle-class that will lose the most when CFKC's 'model' drives the economy over the cliff. They may have grown in the past few years but inflation will eat away at their new-found disposable income and the pensions they paid for have been stolen.

If anyone is in denial it is you. You cannot seriously be denying the financial mess of the Argentine economy?
93 toooldtodieyoung (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 07:12 pm Report abuse
91 ProRG_American

When they got rid of the trolls, they missed you? Damn!!!

Look everyone!! ProRG_American has chosen this special time to humiliate himself in public!!!

GO then please ProRG_American, we are all waiting......................
94 pgerman (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 07:19 pm Report abuse
@ProRG_American

YES, yes, yes...the article of “Ambito Financiero” is so right that the country is exploding, hyperinflation is close, the international default continues, there are no dollars neither in the market nor in the Federal Reserve.

The mid class is so successful that nearly one million people came out to protest in every city of the country on 8N !!!!

As I once told me a friend of mine:

Arguing with a fan of CFK is like talking to the fridge and expect some reasonable answer. No matter what you tell him/her or for how long as any refrigerator he/she will keep doing the same noise.
95 briton (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 07:21 pm Report abuse
I was not here on Sunday,
But tried late that night, only to find the site closed,
I thought it was my computer or something,
So left it,

Today all back to normal,
I have just read some of the things said on Sunday, and the massive [deleted bloggs replies]

No wonder they closed it,
Perhaps some are just taking things to seriously,

May, I be permitted to say,
1, its only a blog
2, we must not go over the top
3, don’t take it too seriously,
4, nothing we do or say, will have any effect on our government’s decisions or policies
5, its Justa blog
6, I must confess I have got a bit led astray sometimes, as I think others would agree,
7, we must relax more often, drink a cuppa or coffee, and relax.
8, no idea. But at least they let us back in.lol.

89, it dont take much to do does it.
mmmm
96 toooldtodieyoung (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 07:26 pm Report abuse
95 briton

You missed a treat then! wow!!

I thought when I tried to log on yesterday that they had pulled the plug for good and that would have been a real shame. Glad to see that they didn't decide to close off the comments for good though.

94 pgerman

“Arguing with a fan of CFK is like talking to the fridge and expect some reasonable answer. No matter what you tell him/her or for how long as any refrigerator he/she will keep doing the same noise.”

LOL!!!!
97 Foxtrot Indigo (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 07:32 pm Report abuse
@91

And we were having such a pleasent conversation until you showed up..........

If the middle class in RGland only earn 10 - 50 dollars a day (appox 6 - 31 GBP a day) I'm not sure they can be considered 'middle class'. Besides, RGs don't get paid in dollars right? So 50 dollars is approx 239.170 RG peso....wow you really are rolling in it aren't you? My God I am so jealous right now (sarcasm)
98 MistyThink (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 07:35 pm Report abuse
84

Where are you from Argentina ?

Would you want to talk about Argentina on somethings with me before removing this web site together with other 962 sites from Argentina internet.
99 Joe Bloggs (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 07:39 pm Report abuse
I know it's only the first day but let's see how many tags are noticeably missing. No sign of:

TTT/ Tobias / (at least 6 ridiculous names I've forgotten)/ Nostrildamus.
Guzz (I reckon that was TTT but TTT strenuously denied it)
Pirate Hunter
Sussie plus at least 20 other names

What others?

I can't think of a pro-Falkland poster who has gone. I have to be honest and say I was not really aware of blatant multi-tag posters from our side.

They'll all be back under other tags as soon as they (all 3 of them) sort out new IP addresses but for now it's reasonably peaceful.
100 Think (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 07:45 pm Report abuse
TWIMC….:

ARA Libertad, Port of Tema, Ghana - 18:00 Zulu Time

Captain Salonio reports ”All Normal” on Ship……
Water, electricity and sewage services have been Re-Re-established…
Planification of alternative ”Return Routes” has begun ….
101 Joe Bloggs (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 07:46 pm Report abuse
100

Pleased to hear it. The crew shouldn't have to suffer.
102 toooldtodieyoung (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 07:46 pm Report abuse
89 ProRG_American

OK, not very at keeping up with current events are you? This “Story” was reported on this very webside on Tuesday, November 13th 2012 - 20:51 UTC “Latam rapidly turning into middle class continent, says World Bank”

Note the “Latam” in the headline and not “Argentina” so you are wrong ( again ).

I suppose that those sorry a-s corrupt Ghanan judges and politicians are beginning to sense that they have gone too far, there won't be a quick payout, and their country will be sued for damages.

Who said anything about a payout? to whom?
and what have they damaged?
and why does the Ghanian Judge have to be sorry a*ssed?
( Everything bottoms with you American's isn't it? ).

How can enforcing international law be “Going too far?”
103 briton (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 08:09 pm Report abuse
ghana 1--argentina -0
england -1 sweden -1
argy bloggers 3 missing, brits,all correct so far,
so is anyone missing,

its like escaping from a P O W camp, and making sure we are all safe and sound.loll
104 redpoll (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 08:12 pm Report abuse
My thanks moderator. Th eposts were getting very abusive and offensive and full of thinly diguised f words and references to sexual deviances. Your rules are quite plain I hope you will enforce them to the letter.
Of course some of us have very divergent views on the situation: thats what free debate is about but from now on ladies and gents, Queensberry rules?
105 Troy Tempest (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 08:14 pm Report abuse
@84 pgerman

Thank you for taking the opportunity during this lull in hostilities, to explain your position.

My understanding was that while you detested CFK and the Peronists, you were still an ardent Malvinista.

If that is not the case, I misunderstood you. I hope there can be some useful discussion between us.

For my part, I hope that Argentina can shake off these criminals ruining the country and Argentinians can realise their full potential as a mature and prosperous society.

BTW, I do realise the big difference between yourself, participating productively with Csnadian society, and that malevolent foul psychopath PH ALEX, in Toronto, who misrepresents Argentina and gives the culture and values of both our countries, an unforgivable disservice.
106 MistyThink (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 08:14 pm Report abuse
99

LEPRecon is from one of whose names ?
107 Troy Tempest (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 08:20 pm Report abuse
Is Poppy back ?
108 Joe Bloggs (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 08:29 pm Report abuse
106

I was never aware that LEPRecon was operating under multiple tags. Is that what you're suggesting?

Has he been on here today? Maybe not everyone realises it's back up yet.
109 MistyThink (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 08:34 pm Report abuse
108

ok ! then
let's wait how LEPRecon intimate talkings with interesting names will be.
110 Troy Tempest (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 08:35 pm Report abuse
Not sure if I have seen Yankeeboy, yet.

Not saying that he or Poppy are “multi-ID's ” or “bounced” either, just wondering...
111 Raven (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 08:35 pm Report abuse
LEPRecon has posted today #6 on this thread.

Poppy has not come back yet.
112 briton (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 08:38 pm Report abuse
The government formally reported Ghana today before the Tribunal for the Law of the Sea,
Foreign Minister Héctor Timerman announced the measure today
in order to push Ghana to inconditionally release the ARA Libertad ship,

Buenos Aires Herald
www.buenosairesherald.com/article/116889/govt-denounces-ghana-to-tribunal-over-libertad-
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

U.S. Judge Sends A Big Threat To Argentina If It Does Not Make Bond Payments It Owes Next Month
Reuters' Alison Frankel reports that District Judge Thomas Griesa basically threatened Argentina in federal court in Manhattan on Friday if the country does not make interest payments it owes to bondholders next

www.onenewspage.us/n/Business/74ritt2lj/Judge-Sends-Big-Threat-To.htm

Poor Argentina, nothing is going right for them.
113 MistyThink (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 08:42 pm Report abuse
110

Chris = Yankeeboy
----

111

I just talked with Captain Poppy at --Cuba embargo article--.
114 stick up your junta (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 08:42 pm Report abuse
JUST CHECKING IN :-)))
115 briton (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 08:45 pm Report abuse
Yankeeboy,
And poppy are both back,
Seen them on the other bloggs today.
But no sign of chrisR
.
116 Joe Bloggs (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 08:49 pm Report abuse
So it's looking like the multi-tag technique was pretty much Only used by the Malvinistas.
117 MistyThink (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 08:53 pm Report abuse
He is also very unkempt boy

He should cut his very longed curly hair.
118 briton (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 08:58 pm Report abuse
posted or missing in action....

José Malvinero===missing
Lord Ton===missing
HansNiesund===missing
stick up your junta===missing
Anbar===missing
v for victory===missing
Zethee==missing
Theman===missing
Clyde===missing
//////////////////////////////////
We got your Fragata===present.
Tompaine===present
Britworker===present
Pugol-H===present
Yuleno===present

did we miss any
119 MistyThink (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 09:00 pm Report abuse
118

you forgot MurkyThink who is my other name.
120 Raven (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 09:00 pm Report abuse
Guzz===missing, presumed KIA
gustbury===missing
121 Idlehands (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 09:02 pm Report abuse
Alternatively the downtime may have been totally unrelated to the forum comments. Maybe there was a Mercopress wedding and they all disappeared for a piss up?! We may never know. Interesting to see how the dynamics of speculation work
122 briton (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 09:03 pm Report abuse
119
sorry.
there are some others we have missed
123 Troy Tempest (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 09:04 pm Report abuse
I am fairly certain that Pirat - Alex is not Multi-ID,
and probably completely freelance. From his FB, a wannabe only.

Here's hoping he was thrown out with the other trash.
124 briton (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 09:06 pm Report abuse
susie has not appeared
125 Troy Tempest (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 09:08 pm Report abuse
There have been times that I suspected ProARG Am. was another ID for sussie
126 Raven (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 09:10 pm Report abuse
HansNiesund===present. Post 100 on the Ban Ki moon thread.

Pirate love===missing
beef===missing
falklandlad===missing
M_of_FI===missing
David Cameron===missing
Islas Malvinas===missing
Monty69 ===missing
scarfo===missing
nigelpwsmith===missing
127 MistyThink (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 09:11 pm Report abuse
Would you want to see the list -who is who- ?
128 briton (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 09:12 pm Report abuse
what about,, ISOIId,, is this correct,
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Notice no new articles,
Mercopress is keeping us rationed,

Tee hee,
It’s like the Great Escape, with Steve McQueen
129 Raven (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 09:17 pm Report abuse
war monkey===missing
Troy Tempest===missing
Gord01===missing
welsh wizard===missing
Steve-32-uk===missing

Right chaps, I call it your duty to report these missing posters when found. Offer support should they return from the cooler.
130 Joe Bloggs (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 09:18 pm Report abuse
126 Raven

A lot of the names you list there don't post on a daily basis. Stick up your junta has been on today.
131 briton (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 09:20 pm Report abuse
127 MistyThink (#)
Would you want to see the list -who is who- ?

Go on then
At least we will see who has been on the list[full]

129 Raven
Troy Tempest===missing
Is above you.

.
132 Raven (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 09:22 pm Report abuse
@ 130 Joe Bloggs.

True but many of them were posting right up until the cessation of hostilities came into effect (I wish they told me, I'd just written a long post with some cracking points in it, hits the submit comment button and BAM, ''sorry this is now closed for comment'')
133 MistyThink (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 09:23 pm Report abuse
I don't talk about missing or present used names

I do talk about the personifications --who is who ...
who uses which other names....

I do talk about who talking themself within their names.
134 Joe Bloggs (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 09:24 pm Report abuse
ChrisR and Westisbest are on the Ban Ki-moon thread right now.
135 Troy Tempest (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 09:26 pm Report abuse
I'm here, “X” “Armourer”, and “Procuror”!!

In Defense, “Isolde” posts very infrequently, anyway...
136 Stevie (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 09:28 pm Report abuse
I hope the threads will be clean of abuse and people at least tries to stick to the subject. Even though this is totally off-topic.
137 MistyThink (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 09:31 pm Report abuse
131

First,I should take the patent of this list before publishing here.

a clue :

Conqueror = CaptainPoppy= ? = ? = ? = ?......
138 briton (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 09:32 pm Report abuse
so_far is on there
and Raul
allarguing over the...
dotting the eyes, and crossing the t;s.
over Ban Ki-moon statment.
...................
139 Stevie (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 09:34 pm Report abuse
If they didn't ban conqueror, my guess is that nobody got banned
140 MistyThink (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 09:36 pm Report abuse
look at -- Cuba embargo article -- how he(Captain Conqueror) was thud !
141 Joe Bloggs (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 09:38 pm Report abuse
Conqueror and Captain Poppy have both been on here today.
142 briton (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 09:40 pm Report abuse
137 MistyThink
thanks.
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
it seems everybody has been polite today,
how long will it last.
143 Raven (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 09:43 pm Report abuse
@142

All except Conqueror, who is the first to get the 'Comment removed by the editor' on post #87
144 briton (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 09:45 pm Report abuse
143
i had not noticed that.
sad it had tobe a brit.
145 MistyThink (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 09:47 pm Report abuse
141

but GreekYoughurt is absent whereas this was one of Conqueror names.
146 Joe Bloggs (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 09:49 pm Report abuse
I haven't seen Greek on here for months.
147 Troy Tempest (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 09:50 pm Report abuse
@143

New Standards Practices
148 Raven (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 09:53 pm Report abuse
Well he did have to do his usual and start trolling.

And things have been so civil.

Nevermind, I'm sure normal service will be resumed when Guzz and the rest get bored of FB.
149 MistyThink (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 09:56 pm Report abuse
146
possible,he was tired of this name.
but we should be ready his new snap names like * PinkPuding*
150 Joe Bloggs (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 10:06 pm Report abuse
149

Perhaps he'll come back as a nice Tzatziki.
151 ProRG_American (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 10:10 pm Report abuse
I am so polular on thsin site. Did you all Royal Subjects miss me as your favorite dart board yesterday? Go ahead, throw all the darts you want?

Think, I wonder if the planning of the return route is due to sanity in Ghana finally sinking in (no punt intended). Let's make sure that planning considers fuel expenses on Ghanas ticket when the International Tribunal makes it's decision.
152 Pirate Love (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 10:11 pm Report abuse
@126 present and correct sir, dont get rid of me that easy plus my posts dont get removed, and im no troll with numerous accounts, i have only this. my views may upset some folk but id like to think they are not disgusting and darn right offensive enough to be deleted.
153 MistyThink (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 10:11 pm Report abuse
150

I am really Captain J.Cook admirer.

I said him Captain Cook was a Conqueror at --Cuba embargo article --wasn't he ?
154 Think (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 10:21 pm Report abuse
(151) ProRG_American

The planning of the return route is due to recent info from the Hamburg tribunal and two earlier North-American courts verdicts about the invalidity of the Argentinean Bonds “immunity waving” on Military vessels...

I'm beginning to think that it will not be necessary to scuttle her...
(A pity really)
155 surfer (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 10:28 pm Report abuse
I wonder if people realise how close we are to a 'game over' scenario for Argentina.

Not so much regarding the ARA Libertad but rather the bond situation in NY, we could be weeks away from default, the default risk is up 41%. This is a very worrying situation.
156 briton (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 10:29 pm Report abuse
miss me as your favorite dart board yesterday

most it seems were not here yesterday.

as for your boat,
it may well be there for another week at least.
157 MistyThink (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 10:29 pm Report abuse
142
por nada !
but you can list too if you are careful.
158 kelperabout (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 10:33 pm Report abuse
So it is not funny when another Country takes possession of something belonging to Argentina. CFK wiil do well to remember this fact when trying to take our Country from us. For the first time in it's History Argentina has been on the receiving end of the same principle they use on others and they do not like it at all.

Now is the time for the Argentinw government to start acting like real people and honor their debts . we all have to honer ours so why should the Argentines simply be given vast amounts to never pay back.
159 Joe Bloggs (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 10:36 pm Report abuse
So it seems that the majority of the most regular posters on the pro-Falklands side are already back on here whereas the majority of the pro-Malvinas side have gone walkabout at least until they rebadge themselves again.

Just sayin'
160 Think (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 10:37 pm Report abuse
(155) surfer

You say:
“I wonder if people realise how close we are to a 'game over' scenario for Argentina.............. We could be weeks away from default........ This is a very worrying situation.

I say:
Uhhhhhhhhhh......................... Mr Surfer is ”Very Worried“
Why?
According to the ”Maya Calendar, we will all be dead by December !

Ain't that so, Mr. “Doomsday Prepper” Surfer ;-)))
161 Nostrolldamus (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 10:38 pm Report abuse
There is no pro-Falklands side. Check this article, is this article about the Falklands????????

There is the “Malvinista” side, and there is the argentine people-hating side.
162 Joe Bloggs (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 10:40 pm Report abuse
Did you have to go far to get access to another IP address TTT?
163 Nostrolldamus (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 10:45 pm Report abuse
My demesne is not your desmene, as much as you essay,

to take it away, for I remain true to my realm and terrain,

exult of your riches, and superiority self-proclaimed,

you still a nothing-fiend amongst us you shall remain.
164 redpoll (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 10:48 pm Report abuse
Wat you really want Think? That the captain shoulddo a Hans Langsdorff wrapped in the Argentine ensign in a Ghana hotel room on the orders of that minister with the prominent proboscis? Probably just want Cristina wants so she can trumpet that he died for the Patria and make political dirty capital out of the demise of a man would seems to be honourable naval officer
As for the scuttling charges, I would think they are already in place just in case. It would be a normal precaution in the circumstances
165 MistyThink (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 10:49 pm Report abuse
There are neither Falkland nor Malvinas sides here.

as my other name MurkyThink had asked few questions on about these islands ,but got no reply...noone knows these islands except their map places.

-------

162

no need to access to TTT's IP address
you can capture and easily find it if you are careful.
166 Nostrolldamus (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 10:50 pm Report abuse
Scuttling charges????

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

What's next? Vultures going to court to prosecute and extradite argentines who evade taxes for taking “the vultures money”?

You people live in a parallel brain don't you? (not even a parallel universe).
167 briton (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 10:53 pm Report abuse
According to the ”Maya Calendar, we will all be dead by December

Wasn’t that just America
, not us,
They probably didn’t even know we existed,
Would it not be fair to say, the world as they saw it, was the Americas, or what ever they knew abt it.

Just predicting, like.
Hoping not us. Mmm
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Nostrolldamus
Don’t let Mercopress know you are back,
They are getting hot potatoes at the moment,

And ZIP ZAP anyone offending.
Just a thought.

p/s
back tomorrow to meet the hangman.lol.
168 Nostrolldamus (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 10:58 pm Report abuse
For a people who claim to be the standard-bearers of freedom,

the Angles seem to engage in all actions related to fiefdom,

and this now has reached the shores of the electronic kindgom,

how then can these people pretend to be the guardians of wisdom.
169 redpoll (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 11:05 pm Report abuse
@166 Thank you for your comment nostraldamus It shone with the brilliance of a hydrogen bomb burst. By the way which planet are you on? Maybe you are a denizen inhabitant of the incoming asteroid that is going to destroy us all in December?
170 surfer (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 11:08 pm Report abuse
The cost to insure Argentine debt (against non payment) has risen 41%, this is referred to as 'a sign of distress'. This is a fairly objective assessment.

Interesting times.....
171 Think (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 11:12 pm Report abuse
(164) redpoll

You are Uruguayan just in your papers...
Your profound Anglicanism betrays you...
The Captain of the ARA Libertad is a Catholic...
As President Cristina Fernandez de Kirchner is...
No honor in suicide for Catholics, matey...
On the contrary; it's a Mortal Sin.
Now you know.
172 Nostrolldamus (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 11:15 pm Report abuse
Whether tumbling ethereal rocks or divinely inspired messengers,

its up to lowly man to decide their descriptive nomenclatures,

but all this is of no consequence at all for the scriveners,

what they'll lay in stone is the end of your earthly scriptures.
173 surfer (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 11:25 pm Report abuse
Argentina's debt is currently the most expensive to insure against non payment in the world.

Maybe significant?
174 Xect (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 11:27 pm Report abuse
Bah I didn't get a mention although I don't post that much and I'm pretty easy going.

Xect
175 Stevie (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 11:31 pm Report abuse
Seems nobody got banned, maybe the mods just needed a break, or maybe some posters did
176 Anbar (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 11:39 pm Report abuse
“”“Arguing with a fan of CFK is like talking to the fridge and expect some reasonable answer. No matter what you tell him/her or for how long as any refrigerator he/she will keep doing the same noise.”“”

oh man that quote is SO SO seriously awesome.. i am stealing it for future use!

----------

“Did you have to go far to get access to another IP address TTT?”

as i said before: changed their proxy or got a new VPN.... it just took them longer than expected. ;-0
177 Chicureo (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 11:40 pm Report abuse
Think: you report that “Captain Salonio reports ”All Normal” on Ship……
Water, electricity and sewage services have been Re-Re-established…
Planification of alternative ”Return Routes” has begun ….”
Something is going on...
Scuttling the ship in a shallow port solves very little...
178 redpoll (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 11:41 pm Report abuse
Careful Think. Aspersions on religious persuasion I think could lead you into hot water with the moderator and its no concern of yours what religion I follow or mine of what yours is. By the way you catch anything? Your home tied Wooly Buggers flies certainly make the monsters rise on this site anyway!
179 Anbar (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 11:45 pm Report abuse
@# 118 Anbar===missing

really? I am? lol i couldve sworn ive been posting here since around #23

Crikey.. i DO hope you dont work for Military Intelligence...

actually... ¬_¬

----

i'm glad the Think-gestalt is back anyway ;-)
180 surfer (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 11:46 pm Report abuse
At least they do some moderation here, over on the Russian Government's 'news' site RT.com it's total BS.

All these totally deranged conspiracy theorists over there, kind of amusing as it's so mental!
181 Zhivago (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 11:51 pm Report abuse
Sorry guys, you can't ban all the poor argies and then not ban Conqueror or even me, I have had a number of posts deleted and gone far off the deep end in a Scotch induced bout of anti-latino metaphorism. Comments are great but a debate consists of a pro side and an anti side. I think we are all adults so if caution is avoided at times run past them and come up with something better. I love reading Conquerors comments, I love TTT's use of English and I really enjoy baiting Pirat and Sussie, and I only post under one name, always have.
So long live the Falklands but let's keep debating the RGs.
182 Stevie (#) Nov 14th, 2012 - 11:58 pm Report abuse
Kudos to you Zhivago, a comment full of sincerity. I wouldn't worry though, noone was banned.
183 Ayayay (#) Nov 15th, 2012 - 12:16 am Report abuse
@114 Ok, we're checking you in! Haha I really hope it's cleaner too this time, using up gallons of brain bleach.
184 Zhivago (#) Nov 15th, 2012 - 01:32 am Report abuse
182
I'm glad nobody was banned. Argentines and the Islanders have a symbiotic relationship, they affect each other whether they like it or not. These are only questions: Would the Falklands have enjoyed the same prosperity and benefits they now receive had the Rgs not invaded in '82? How would the Rgs have fared under thirty years of successive military governments? We can lament that a thousand people had to die to get where they are today but it happened and the situation is producing another generation of bitterness. Argentina has to accept that the Falklands are there to stay, independent, and the Falklanders need to become more a part of South America, one of many countries, nationalities and governments. That's enough of being on the soapbox for one day!
185 Pirat-Hunter (#) Nov 15th, 2012 - 01:33 am Report abuse
Hold on there boys CFK is looking out for everyone of you. Cheers!
Here is some news from the old mighty.
en.mercopress.com/2012/11/12/obituary-sir-rex-hunt-cmg
186 Troy Tempest (#) Nov 15th, 2012 - 01:46 am Report abuse
Dammit!!
That didn't take long.

Back to the same old cr@p :-(
187 Ayayay (#) Nov 15th, 2012 - 04:24 am Report abuse
Tangent but: look @ Americans complaining because prices aren't CHEAPER than last year: feeds.gawker.com/~r/gizmodo/full/~3/upWIfNHu4Bs/90-of-this-years-black-friday-ads-have-the-exact-same-items-and-prices-as-last-years-black-friday-ads
188 St.John (#) Nov 15th, 2012 - 08:21 am Report abuse
On the one hand: ”... making voluntary debt restructuring essentially impossible,” Argentina argued in the brief.

and on the other: President Cristina Fernández de Kirchner, repeated that she will continue to refuse to pay those who did not enter the debt restructuring process ...

I know the Argentine government is completely erratic and governed by emotions and not rationality, but this is even more contradictory than almost anything else, they have done and said.

1. Voluntary and 2. refuse to pay those who did not enter the debt restructuring ???

Source: www.buenosairesherald.com/article/116833/argentina-seeks-us-appeals-court-retrial-on-debt-ruling
189 Idlehands (#) Nov 15th, 2012 - 10:48 am Report abuse
180 surfer

I would encourage everyone to come over to Russia Today when it's a bit slow here. It really is a place where all the idiots of the world appear to congregate for the amusement of everyone else.

Note it is almost totally unmoderated so be prepared to roll your eyes or even allow them to pop out on stalks from time to time.
190 briton (#) Nov 15th, 2012 - 02:26 pm Report abuse
meenwhile back on blogg,
ghana still has the ship,
the argies are still screaming,
CFK is hiding,
we are all laughing.

and the marry go round, goes round and round.lol.
191 redpoll (#) Nov 15th, 2012 - 03:29 pm Report abuse
@185 That a threat Pirate? Well if it is we know who you work for. I was going to say you have already selected the paredon the wall against we should all be shot. No thats old technology A one way journey over the Rio de La Plata by a 130 is much more efficient. How are things in the old Escuela Mecanica? Still directed from his prison cell by the blonde angel Alfredo Astiz?
192 Ayayay (#) Nov 15th, 2012 - 06:10 pm Report abuse
Lol @ 189
193 TipsyThink (#) Nov 15th, 2012 - 06:41 pm Report abuse
190

Argentina is moré démocratic coúntry thán UK.
194 agent999 (#) Nov 15th, 2012 - 06:47 pm Report abuse
@183
another joker trying to better prate hunter
195 TipsyThink (#) Nov 15th, 2012 - 06:53 pm Report abuse
190

really ,i say the truth.

do you have objection ?
196 Think (#) Nov 15th, 2012 - 07:57 pm Report abuse
(178) redpoll

You say…:
”…..Aspersions on religious persuasion ….. could lead you into hot water with the moderator”
I say…:
I apologize thousand fold for having called you “Anglican”…………..
Church of Scotland it is ;-)

You say…:
“Your…Wooly Buggers … certainly make the monsters rise”……
I say…:
Wooly Buggers???.... Wooly Bloody Buggers !!!
Do I sound like a Wet Fly Fisherman???
;-)
197 briton (#) Nov 15th, 2012 - 09:28 pm Report abuse
190
why are you talking to your self.
198 redpoll (#) Nov 15th, 2012 - 09:38 pm Report abuse
Very drool Think. No you will have to guess again as I am not a member of the Kirk. Arent there a lot of Welsh chapels down your way? Wet fly fisherman? well maybe but I dont put a spinner on to bait the truth! Your reference to Icarus I got though Joe didnt. Down there in the frozen south no possibility of getting your wax wings melted thogh possibly you may fall into the ozone hole. Now joking apart, did you catch anything apart from a cold?
199 briton (#) Nov 15th, 2012 - 09:50 pm Report abuse
195 sorry.
im over worked.lol.
200 St.John (#) Nov 16th, 2012 - 12:25 am Report abuse
@ 12 Zhivago & @ 82 toooldtodieyoung

@ 12 Zhivago:

“Not much debate when one side is banned!”

It looks as if Guzz was almost all the trolls, as they disappeared together with him when he lost his third brain cell and wrote filth on the Remembrance Day page.

@ 82 toooldtodieyoung:

“It is not the general population who is at fault, it is the failure of the government, chosen by them, to run the country properly.”

Based on my experience with Argentinos you are both right and wrong at the same time.

The Argentine government is completely erratic and governed by emotions and not rationality, but that is to a large extent the fault of the population.

I lived in Argentina for about 4 years and have seen the Argentinos having a jolly good life in bars and cafés.

When I suggested to my friends, that they should join a political party - any party they favoured: left, right or center - spend a little less time in bars and a few hours a month on active politics, using their member vote to get rid of corrupt and worthless politicians, they just shrugged and said 'This is Argentina'.

Most are completely apathic about politics - not a problem per se, but if you don't take part in politics, when the system is rotten, you cannot expect good governance.
201 Doggy Rap (#) Nov 16th, 2012 - 12:47 am Report abuse
@ 69 Simon68

“It is true that we provided many services to the Islands during the 1970/80's, and a lot of them were as you say at bargain prices, but we did it for a reason, to win the Islanders' favour.”

True and that was a very sensible politic.

One must not forget, however, e.g. that high ranking officers sent their wives to the Falkland Islands for childbirth simply because that was safer than an Argentine hospital - both parties gained something from the other.

“ Galtieri managed ti f*ck that up for eternity”

Well, not necessarily. Look at the European nations view of Germans after WW2 - hate, contempt, hostility, ...

Already some 30-40 years later the view had changed considerably (but then, Germany did no longer claimed sovereignity over the rest of the world).

Now, 67 years after the war, most are positive and/or sympathetic towards the Germans - except, of course those who, like the Greeks borrowed money from them, wasted the money and now can't pay it back. Everybody hate their creditors when they have wasted what was borrowed.

The same can happen to the islanders' attitude towards Argentina, when (if) she has become a real democracy, using her resources wisely to become as affluent as the Falklanders and has achieved a genuine friendly and neighbourly attitude towards them.
202 Think (#) Nov 16th, 2012 - 07:26 pm Report abuse
(198) redpoll
You ask:
Now joking apart, did you catch anything.............. ?
I answer:
Many nice Fontinalis on nymps the past week...... biggest one, just under a clove!
Patagonia is the Fly Fishermans dream come true....

200 St.John
You say:
“It looks as if Guzz was almost all the trolls, as they disappeared together with him .......”
May I ask....?:
Besides “Guzz”.....; who has disappeared?

(201) Doggy Rap
You say:
“.... high ranking officers sent their wives to the Falkland Islands for childbirth simply because that was safer than an Argentine hospital...”
I say:
Where in Jehovas name do you trolls get your silly stories..???
Even toda, in 2012, the Kelpers, very sensibly, send their pregnant women to a clinic in Chile or Uruguay if complications are expected.
What a Turnip!
203 GeoffWard2 (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 12:16 pm Report abuse
#202, 198
No char, but a 10kg UK winter carp on worm last week. Trout season just started but will stick to the chavender on the rivers.
204 redpoll (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 05:46 pm Report abuse
No our think is a dry fly purist and uses nymphs. Perhaps his fly was drowned and thats whats happened to sussie?
205 Think (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 06:29 pm Report abuse
(204) redpoll

I have, ocasionally, used a little live wiggling worm on a medium sized streamer when in need of edible fish........
Darn effective method I must say;-)
206 redpoll (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 10:04 pm Report abuse
Quite agree Think. When needs must....

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