Ghana port officials deny water supply until the Argentine frigate relocates
Ghana authorities have denied the supply of water to the Argentine Navy flagship ARA Libertad impounded and retained in the port of Tema since 2 October and which refuses relocation to a less active pier despite a court order.
“The crew asked on Monday for water and we told them that if they want water they will have to move to where they have been indicated”, said a spokesperson from Tema port authority which is demanding the frigate moves from a very much demanded docking area of an already congested terminal.
“We told them that if they want our port services they will have to move to pier 6. There are no services for them at pier 11 where they are currently docked”, added the spokesperson.
The Argentine navy flagship has generators for electricity but is short in water and Tema officials also warned that if the vessel requests fuel this will also be denied until it complies with the court order.
Last 5 November the Accra Superior Tribunal confirmed a ruling ordering the frigate to move from the current pier since it was impeding normal trade activities in Tema, the African country’s main sea port.
Argentina solicitors in Ghana later managed on appeal ‘a suspension order’ but time is over and from Buenos Aires the argument now is that with only 44 crewmembers and a captain, moving the vessel implies a great risk.
That is why last week when Tema officials moved on the vessel with tugs, a crane and ground crew ready for the operation, the Argentine crew reacted lifting the plank and showing their rifles.
The incident only complicated things and Argentina gave Ghana a deadline for the release of the vessel by Wednesday. If not Argentina will take the case to the UN Law of the Sea Tribunal in Hamburg of which the two countries are signatories.
ARA Libertad was impounded by a Ghana high court on request from a New York court acting for NML Capital, an investment fund holding defaulted Argentine sovereign bonds with face value and interests totalling 370 million dollars.
Argentina refuses to deal with the ‘holdouts’ which it describes as ‘vulture funds’, and likewise refused to deposit a 20 million dollars bail for the release, arguing that military vessels can’t be impounded.
Tema port authorities when asked on the Argentine deadline simply said that they were complying with an order from a competent Ghana court, and “we will have to wait and see what happens”.
The Ghana government has responded to all Argentine political contacts and requests saying that the Judiciary is independent and thus can’t interfere in the litigation.
The government of President Cristina Fernandez also accuses Ghana of ignoring the Vienna Convention for not guaranteeing the immunity of the war vessel, but the Ghana court argues that Argentina dropped its diplomatic sovereignty from the moment it issued sovereign bonds.
In Buenos Aires Defence ministry sources said the Navy was preparing to send a fresh crew to replace the 44 members currently on board.
Likewise a former Argentine Defence minister with three different presidents, Horacio Jaunarena called for ‘rationality’ and compliance with the Ghana court order to relocate the frigate.
“The essential thing is not lose rationality in this entire incident. The Ghana court has ordered the relocation and this does not justify an incident over something non important for the real issue. We have to accept the ruling and we can be sure things are going to run smoothly for Argentina in the international courts”, said Jaunarena.
“All vessels that access a port have local pilots on board. What is not sensible is to accept the court order and then resist, endangering the lives of the crew. The problem is the crew in obeying orders from Buenos Aires but if the high court of Ghana orders relocation, it must be done”, added the former minister and expert in military affairs.
“Showing weapons by Argentine crew members, as was reported is a very serious international incident plus the confrontation with Ghana. We accept the jurisdiction; we must accept its resolutions. Argentina is right: military vessels and not impoundable and precisely because the reason is on her side it must avoid incidents: if Ghana does not solve the issue, then we go to the Hamburg tribunal. I would recommend the President to order the vessel to be relocated and avoid silly incidents”, concluded Jaunarea.
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206 comments Feed
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Thirsty Argentine sailors need to avoid looking at the ocean that surrounds them if they can't remember primary school physics.
........or they could just move their boat.
What to do with the “vulture funds” and the frigate ARA Libertad?
Pay and recover the frigate: 30.3%
Open a negotiation and pay the least possible 36.4%
Do not pay anything and seek international justice 27.6%
Breaking relations with Ghana and ignore the Frigate 6.1%
(This means the Argentinian sailors in Ghana must be allowed to die of thirst, if necessary.)
And all the boards did shrink.
Water, water everywhere,
Nor any drop to drink.
The captain should have the courage to move the vessel.
Post 1 was made from my mobile because my PC was having none of it but now it seems fine for no particular reason.
Looks like the site has been purged of trolls....
No it stays grey making it impossible to post even when I've written my most astute comments. Never seems a problem on my mobile. I think it may be related to the fact it is my work PC so I don't have total control over it.
I agree, he doesn't want his crew dying of thrist does he? There is loyalty then there is sheer stupidity.
Pay and recover the frigate: 30.3%
Open a negotiation and pay the least possible 36.4%
Do not pay anything and seek international justice 27.6%
One question was missing:
Reach any of the first three agreements, and then NOT pay...99%
ARG mentality. Nothing you can do about it.
Poor sod.
@12 ..the trolls didn't contribute to the debate.
I assume the captain will move the ship only when they've completely run out of water - unless he sends out his crew to buy bottles of Evian. I hope when they do finally move that the port services are only restored when the frigate settles it's berthing debts to Ghana.
At least Jaunarena is displaying some common sense.
While reading your comment I had a vision of the crew going out to buy bottled water and while they are out the Ghana port authorites surround the ship and shift to pier 6.
Made me laugh :)
The ship would look like the Ecuadorian embassy in London had they tried this nonsense in a British port - with a few heavily armed marines thrown in too.
“Night of the long knives” – I think that is about right. There seems to have been a troll purge based on those using multiple logins from a single IP. Long overdue, but unfortunately all too easy to work around for the committed.
@12 ..the trolls didn't contribute to the debate – quite right. When you ever ask them a straight question on a serious issue, they change subject or just don’t answer.
Well, that was their JOB, for a chunk of them at least. ¬_¬
“The essential thing is not lose rationality in this entire incident.' But that is impossible with an irrational president.
is not the answer to that already in the question? ;-0
-----
I feel rather sorry for the sailors onboard tbh, not form anything done by Ghana, but just for being put in such a horrible position by their government, solely through bad-debt.
It would be resignation time for most politicians of any morality.
(Oh, hang on....!)
What would their response have been had the Ghanians whipped out some firearms too?
28 Anbar - are you saying that CFK & Co are so inept that they could only employ the inept and yet remain too inept to notice their ineptness?
But not convinced that the rationale is to eliminate troll activities.
Why don't you act with a bit of healthy pride and stop begging the usage of the Argentine airspace and sea?
“Two” rich and with very high wealthy countries as UK and FI with high per capita income would not have any issue to afford long trips to London to leave or enter the Island. In addition London is a lovely and wonderful city to visit.
By doing this you would get rid of the annoying and uncomfortable dependence on the Argentine cheaters.
And would demonstrate a bit of healthy pride and ability to be independent from the nasty Third world represented by Latin America.
lol, yes, its all rather “Whoops Apocalypse” really isnt it? :-)
We think, to points of note here,
1, Cfk it seems is leaving her own people on this ship to suffer her humiliation.
2, we think she is hoping, something goes wrong and not only does she hope Ghana will get the blame, but the world will shift to give Argentina sympathy.
3, CFK is probably looking for a Victory to give her people.
In the meantime, the territory is Ghanaian, and the ship and its crew really must comply with the Ghanaians requests,
If they require the ship to be moved, either you do it, or they will,
And we think that CFK is trying to create a diplomatic incident in her favour.
CFK you are being humiliated, as is your country,
Just pay the money, then deal with the finer points of law, later, and after you get this crew safely back home, indeed if you cared, this would be done already.
Do you care, do your bloggers care .pay up. Please.
just an opinion.
> Why don't you act with a bit of healthy pride and stop begging the usage of the Argentine airspace and sea?
Who exactly has been begging Argentina for anything?
What to do with the “vulture funds” and the frigate ARA Libertad?
Pay and recover the frigate: 38.5%
Open a negotiation and pay the least possible 35.7%
Do not pay anything and seek international justice 20.5%
Breaking relations with Ghana and ignore the Frigate 2.7%
They cannot stay on the ship indefinitely,
This will eventually cause all sorts of problems , health or other wise,
Loyalty only goes so far,
She is using these men to further her point,
Sooner or later something will happen,
But who will ultimately carry the can.
.
His post at 38 made sense.
their biggest problem is the classification of the ship as a “warship” and, following on from that, they will then owe Ghana a chunk of money for mooring fees anyway...and already be in dispute with the Ghanese legal system anyway.
Its perfectly feasible for the Argentine Gov to come out looking like victors in this. (Key words “looking like” - at least for internal consumption)
It just happens that based on lots of dismissive and disparaging comments towards my country, and its people, that I think it would be great that the islanders could stop taking any small advantage at the expensed of Argentina.
So they did in the past when they were poor and took deliveries of fuel Argentine governments, medical aid and scholarships. All this giveaway price.
For instance right now you could stop begging to get or have any collaboration that will benefit economically.
yes, I know, I know....it's a deal ... that it is null and only benefits a part ... but Argentina is bound to the end of time ..
The only badly behaved in this farce is the Argentine crew being ordered from Buenos Aires to point rifles at the unarmed Ghanaian port authority officials. For that there will be serious consequences.
I think CFK thought she would quickly win but like everything else she is losing and it is all spinning out of control.
They're seeking a restart and whole new retrial in the case of Judge Griesa and his bondholder decision:
www.buenosairesherald.com/article/116833/argentina-seeks-us-appeals-court-retrial-on-debt-ruling
Argentina is complaining that future sovereign debt crisis would become impossible to negotiate. Doesn't seem to occur to her that prevention is better than cure and that lurching from one to the next is not good government and not good for lenders either.
Sovereign nations don't have a right to go bankrupt because they are sovereign.
In the end though, she probly honestly doesn't care that much, because she's kept in her rich bubble, with helicopter fueled ready to escape Argentina any minute if it should collapse.
The sad fact is that, even under the assumption that the Argentine government wanted to pay the bonds and the Paris Club debt, they cannot. Simply because Argentina do not have the dollars to do so right now.
Currently the actual federal reserves are very low and would not allow to make the payment of U$D 3000 million to the bondholders and the 8/9000 million to the Paris Club.
Argentina is really broke. I really do not know how things are legally fixed in these cases.
It seems you're as intolerant as anyone else. Or shall we go back and check the number of posts you've had removed?
@24 Why did you use the word “committed”?
@28 Really? Do you remember the “axel_arg”. The one that was supposedly a schoolteacher? And yet, also supposedly, had time to run around conducting a “survey”? I also wonder how many of the “malvinistas” were/are university “students. ”Paid” doesn't necessarily mean money. How about higher grades?
@32 I can't find anything substantive on the Espora later than 6 November. Possibilities might be that (a) Springer is waiting until it has been repaired or (b) the South Africans are being more “co-operative” with the argies. Anyone know what the South African judicial system is like these days?
@34 I'm not really sure of the purpose of your comment or the reference to “Argentine airspace and sea”. All around the world, airlines based in one country regularly fly through the airspaces of other countries. It's because aircraft provide the most direct means of transport. Argieland is notable because it restricts air travel in order to place pressure on the Falkland Islands. There is no other reason. The situation is similar in respect of the sea. Argieland restricts “right of innocent passage”.
@42 It shouldn't do. Argieland waived immunity. That destroys the Article 28(2) proposition.
I can save you the bother - I'm not aware of any post I've ever made on here being removed.
www.fleetmon.com/en/vessels/Ara_Libertad_36410
''I did think for a moment that the moderator just lost patience and closed the comment section for good. I can understand it as some comments were way beyond acceptable.''
So did I. Not a surprise after the Rememberence Sunday thread that had stacks of removed comments. The fact that the shop has re-opened without the usual suspects shows a rather big purge, well, almost all...
Back on topic, It seems they Argentine Gvt is doing the usual trick of making lots of noise in one direction, then when that fails, making loads of noise in another, despite knowing they are on a sticky wicket. That boat will move before too long and I expect CFK to crow about how it with her own twist to the story. Will it be ''CFK made the moral decision against the pirates and vulture funds' or 'Nasty Ghana attacks Argentine Soverign Territory'???
Does anyone understand the thrux of this story:
www.buenosairesherald.com/article/116885/lower-house-lawmakers-to-debate-per-saltum-bill
It sounds very dodgy but there isn't enough detail to comment. Since when do courts pass laws?
“And would demonstrate a bit of healthy pride and ability to be independent from the nasty Third world represented by Latin America.”
Is this how you believe the Brits, US, and Falklanders view South America, or just Argentina, or only the CFK government?
@51 I'm afraid it doesn't follow. For example, the US Navy has 2 hospital ships, 4 salvage ships, 9 dry cargo ships, 4 fleet ocean tugs, 4 container ships and 16 other cargo ships. None of them would really be appropriate for warfare, would they?
I (caps) dont regard Argentina or Argentines' as 3rd World, however, i DO (caps) regard Argentina's Government as Third World.
It is, for me at least, a pretty big and important distinction.
In my case if I disregard someone I always stay away from him. It's ever worse if this peron is violent and cheats .. but the islanders have always been taking every (small or large) advantage they could from Argentina whenever they could.
My friend “Hansniesund” always maintains that Argentina is forced by a treaty no matter that It has already been declared invalid.
But now you go beyond, based on your comments “everyone has the right to use the air and sea space of all” ... never in my whole life I have ever heard anything like this !!. Let's suppose then that the Argentine Air Force or Aerolineas Argentinas has the right to fly over Port Stanley, or over London, without asking for permission and no one can stop it !!!
Excellent ... simple reasoning with a simple conclusion ... unrealistic and nonexistent conclussion !!!
Go find this deleted post then - or are we all expected to rely on your superior memory?
Almost had to comment on FB ;)
Do you have any examples?
His vacuous, hate filled post #70 in the linked thread was absolutely out of order and was even worse than anything the ''RG trolls'' ever posted. en.mercopress.com/2012/11/11/thanksgiving-service-at-the-liberation-monument-in-stanley#comments
No but they are classed as military vessels who provide support to warships and thus would be classified as having the same protections under international law.
The sticking point here is that Argentina waived its sovereign immunity rights in order to secure loans. So yes the Libertad could be considered a warship, but Argentina voluntarily waived their sovereign immunity on all of their sovereign assets including military hardware.
The court in Ghana is only upholding the law.
@60 - We missed you too. I thought I was going to have to create a Facebook account!!!!! Shock horror! Then I'd no longer be an individual! LOL
Unfortunately every country has its share of 'fanatics' who think they know best. The only thing you can do is educate them or shoot them. I've always believed that educating people is more beneficial. Also, I don't have a gun ;)
I agree that 'Conqueror' has often made very rude posts on this site, on par or worse than the RG's trolls. That is wrong and maybe he/she should take a step back and think before posting. However, the UK has become so conjested with the PC nonsense its no wonder some people are taking extreme views. I'm not excusing his/her behaviour, just trying to understand it.
I am wondering what the Argentine government will do next in Ghana. They seem to have run out of road on this one.
Firstly I'd like to coment that I think the the islanders have lot of rights over the FI, I'm not a supid “malvinista-K”, and the Islanders are honest people the deserve my respect.
But, if you analyze the history (even in the decade before the war) the FI used everything the mainland sent (mainly Argentina).
Until the day of the invasion, Argentina suppñlied the FI with fuel and energy at bargain prices, sent planes with medical assistance when needed and had students in Argentine schools with scholarships.
The Royal Navy was supplied in Argentine ports and repairs were made in their ships when needed. All of this with the reception of friend of Argentina. None of them, niether the people of Uk nor the islanders considered argentine people as cheaters no mattehr that they want them far from the Islands....as far as possible.
Now that the islanders are rich, thanks to the UK favor, I believe it's time to act more ethically. Just this.
I have never wnated to offend the islanders at all.
Nov 14th, 2012 - 05:06 pm
It is true that we provided many services to the Islands during the 1970/80's, and a lot of them were as you say at bargain prices, but we did it for a reason, to win the Islanders' favour.
There is also the fact that the Islanders and the British government actually paid for those services, and the famous scholarships were only to state schools which were not used by the Islanders, those that took advantage of schooling in Argentina went to bilingual private schools such as St. Hildas, St. Andrews, St Georges, Northlands, St. Pauls, etc.
These services did cost the Argentine tax payer a bit, but the end game was to get sovereignty of the Islands, Galtieri managed ti f*ck that up for eternity!!!!!
As the place has had a flush out, it would just be nice to debate, to ask questions and educate myself without the incessant trolling that reached a peak on the aforementioned thread. Hopefully this can be achieved. I have no fight with any Argentine, I'd just like to discuss ideas and concepts in a civil atmosphere. This is why I shake my head at Conqueror.
We had all best make use of this time, I can't imagine Guzz or any of the others being able to stay away for too long. :(
I read another forum that is based in the US, the trolls there regularly resurface under new guises before getting hit under yet another ban hammer.
But just what your comments have to do with Ghana cutting off the water supply until Argentina moves the Libertad?
Would you care to comment on this, as this thread has nothing to do with the Falklands?
I think that “back then” the Islands got more assistance “locally” than they did from London(?), its a shame that changed because I think the FI can now go ahead without any need of assistance from Argentina (& other than defence: the UK) and that that, in the long term, will be detrimental to Argentina if its position never changes.
Not in some grand apocalyptic fashion, just that Argentina and the FI working together makes a lot more sense than having them work against each other.
I'm pretty certain that the future of the Islands will, ultimately, if not for some time, result in their independence, so i regard the current (Argentine) government approach, and “we wont change” approach to Sovereignty .... perverse. It can only ever harm Argentina more than the UK or FI.
I honestly regard Ban Ki Moons recent comments as the Fat-Lady Singing with regards to any hope of the UN going against the Islanders fundamental, and irrevocable, rights to self-determination.
With that in mind I can only hope that Argentine politics change to reflect this.
In the mean time, please try to ignore the slathering idiots on here who hate everything Argentine, they are, most definitely, a minority...you can tell because of how loudly they have to shout & scream everything.
It's good to be back with everything back up and running again. I was having the same struggle with myself that LEPRecon was having as well.
It just wasn't the same being on this website but not being able to comment on it. Now it's back again, it's business as usual I see.
Ghana port officials starting to play hard ball with the Argentinian's, we shall see how much stomach the Argentines have for this until they comply.
I can read that there is much speculation about a ”Purge” going on…..
My experience tells me that ”Purges” and ”Censorship” only work ”One Way” in here, at MercoPress.
I personally wouldn’t miss deranged and insulting Argentinean psychopathic posters as ”Pirate Hunter” or ”Sussie” ….
Neither would I miss deranged and insulting Anglo psychopathic posters as ”Conqueror” or ”Captain Poppy”……
Servus
Definitely agree almost entirely with that but there was certainly some degree of underlying trust of the Argentine AND UK governments if I am honest.
You have a government claiming inflation to be below 10% while the truer figure according to your own independent people is nearer 25%, also claiming to have $ reserves in excess of $40 billion, and the list goes on.
CFK, at a meeting at Harvard University, suggests that the US inflation figures are wrong and the IMF do not know what they are talking about.
At every turn CFK plays the victim card, the courts are against us, the rating companies are against us, everyone in the world is against us.
At every opportunity the Argentine government attack the UK, the Falkland Islands and the rest of the world.
You have massive demonstrations against what is happening in your own country, CFK's answer “there is no credible opposition to us so we must be right, why are these people wasting their time demonstrating”.
They now attack the Ghanaian government for something that has been decided by the courts, quite rightly the Ghanaian's answer it is a problem must be dealt with through the court system – the Ghanaian government do not control the courts. They are now taking Ghana to the ITLOS - it’s nothing to do with Ghana – it is their “independent” court system. Unfortunately for the Argentinian population their own court system is easily controlled by the government.
The CFK run Argentinian government are as bad as any of the previous military junta’s, they want complete control, don’t care about their population.
They have this absurd view of themselves – they are always right and anybody who is critical of what they are doing is wrong and does not understand them.
I have nothing against the Argentinian people but the continuous rubbish that comes out of CFK and her cronies in government is just too much.
I really feel sorry for the majority of Argentinians you have potentially such a rich country in people and resources but continually cannot get anyone to run your country to your advantage.
Regarding this case, there is little doubt, as do the majority of Argentine people, the caountry must pay and honor debts. I would pay the U$D 20 million to bring the boat home.
I have seen this boat a couple of times in two different sea-side cities very closely and is really quite wonderful. It's a piece of jewelry. With surpluss that was entirely built at a shipyard in Argentina.
The last time was in Sydeny I wanted to visit the Discovery to be able to compare both boats but unfortunately it was on a tour.
It is unfortunate that a boat like, the ARA Libertad, is at risk of being lost.
I think it is clear that CFK wants to take advantage of this situation playing the role of the victim.
Anyway, as I mentioned before I do not think that the actual federal reserves of Argentina would allow to cancel the debt with the bondholders.
Exactly, Couldn't have put it better myself. Now that this seems to be free of La Campora trolls, screaming misinformation and twisting or distorting history / the truth. We can now talk about what has gone so wrong with Argentina.
It is not the general population who is at fault, it is the failure of the government, chosen by them, to run the country properly. I get the feeling that Argentina could be a real powerhouse of an ecomony, one of the strongest in South America, if only the Politicians would actually do a good job and not use being president as an excuse to line their own pockets.
I don't guess you are aware of these matters essentially.
I also do agree with “agent999” and “toooldtodieyoung”.
It's quite evident that the Argentine political class is the problem of the country. CFK is lead the country to another bankrrupcy...its broke again !!!!
''Anyway, as I mentioned before I do not think that the actual federal reserves of Argentina would allow to cancel the debt with the bondholders.''
As can be seen from this article linked, Venezuala gave 3 Billion Dollars to Argentina to pay for IMF debts.
en.mercopress.com/2012/11/06/venezuelan-leader-establishes-similarities-between-the-governments-of-argentina-and-venezuela
Why would CFK accept Venezuala paying off Argentine debt? Is as pgerman surmised, the reserves are without enough funds?
CFK has crowed about $40 billion in reserves. Maybe that is as distorted as the apparent distortion of inflation figures by INDEC? That would make Argentina in big danger of another collapse.
If this is anywhere near true, the ARA Libertad is destined for new ownership soon, as Argentina really does not have the money to spend to recover the ship, or pay off Sovereign debt to the 7% that did not accept the debt restructure.
For someone declaring she is a lawyer CFKC seems to have little understanding of the law. Or maybe she thinks laws do not apply to her. (Nixon made that mistake). She has become a monster without the constraints of Nestor, and her over-indulged son just encourages her.
Argentina may not have the ability to pay but they should have, at least, negotiated a payment schedule.
I admire how peaceful the Ghanians are conducting themselves, they are just following their law, & they're resources are a courtesy. *grabs popcorn*
Sorry to pop your ballon, again, but the highly respected publication Ambito Financiero is reporting that the TemaNazi authorities have started supplying food and water to the Fragata Libertad.
www.ambito.com/noticia.asp?id=663106
I suppose that those sorry a-s corrupt Ghanan judges and politicians are beginning to sense that they have gone too far, there won't be a quick payout, and their country will be sued for damages.
Oh by the way, kore positive news
“ARGENTINA HAS THE FASTEST GROWING MIDDLE CLASS IN THE REGION OVER THE PAST DECADE“ WORLD BANK SAYS
”According to a report released today by the World Bank, Argentina has the highest percentage of growth of the middle class across the region
“The middle class in this period rose from 9.3 to 18.6 million people,” says the report.
“This increasing people represent 25 percent of the total population of Argentina”. “This is the largest percentage growth of the middle class across the region during the last decade, followed by Brazil with 22 percent and Uruguay with 20 percent,” the report said.
The figures are from the study entitled “Economic mobility and the growth of the middle class in Latin America” and define the members of the middle class to those with an income of between 10 and 50 dollars per day per capita.
World Bank President Jim Yong Kim said, “Recent experience in Latin America and the Caribbean shows the world that can bring prosperity to millions of people through policies that find a balance between economic growth and expansion opportunities for the most vulnerable. “
A GOOD REASON WHY THE INTERNTIONAL “FINANCIAL SAVIORS” ARE SO DAMN MAD AT ARGENTINA
You know what? I would not be surprised by what KFC / TMBOA / Ol' Turkey Neck / The Harpy declares herself as these days.
Her government is running around like headless chickens over this, trying to find someone to blame, trying to find something to blame, crying and wailing and saying “It's not fair” to anyone who will listen. Then you have laughing boy timerman saying they will pay, she says they won't.
Oh the circus goes on and one doesn't it?
But pgerman at 81 and you are quite right, the ARA Libertad is such a lovely ship, it would be such a shame to the Argentine people if it were lost.
If anyone is in denial it is you. You cannot seriously be denying the financial mess of the Argentine economy?
When they got rid of the trolls, they missed you? Damn!!!
Look everyone!! ProRG_American has chosen this special time to humiliate himself in public!!!
GO then please ProRG_American, we are all waiting......................
YES, yes, yes...the article of “Ambito Financiero” is so right that the country is exploding, hyperinflation is close, the international default continues, there are no dollars neither in the market nor in the Federal Reserve.
The mid class is so successful that nearly one million people came out to protest in every city of the country on 8N !!!!
As I once told me a friend of mine:
Arguing with a fan of CFK is like talking to the fridge and expect some reasonable answer. No matter what you tell him/her or for how long as any refrigerator he/she will keep doing the same noise.
But tried late that night, only to find the site closed,
I thought it was my computer or something,
So left it,
Today all back to normal,
I have just read some of the things said on Sunday, and the massive [deleted bloggs replies]
No wonder they closed it,
Perhaps some are just taking things to seriously,
May, I be permitted to say,
1, its only a blog
2, we must not go over the top
3, don’t take it too seriously,
4, nothing we do or say, will have any effect on our government’s decisions or policies
5, its Justa blog
6, I must confess I have got a bit led astray sometimes, as I think others would agree,
7, we must relax more often, drink a cuppa or coffee, and relax.
8, no idea. But at least they let us back in.lol.
89, it dont take much to do does it.
mmmm
You missed a treat then! wow!!
I thought when I tried to log on yesterday that they had pulled the plug for good and that would have been a real shame. Glad to see that they didn't decide to close off the comments for good though.
94 pgerman
“Arguing with a fan of CFK is like talking to the fridge and expect some reasonable answer. No matter what you tell him/her or for how long as any refrigerator he/she will keep doing the same noise.”
LOL!!!!
And we were having such a pleasent conversation until you showed up..........
If the middle class in RGland only earn 10 - 50 dollars a day (appox 6 - 31 GBP a day) I'm not sure they can be considered 'middle class'. Besides, RGs don't get paid in dollars right? So 50 dollars is approx 239.170 RG peso....wow you really are rolling in it aren't you? My God I am so jealous right now (sarcasm)
Where are you from Argentina ?
Would you want to talk about Argentina on somethings with me before removing this web site together with other 962 sites from Argentina internet.
TTT/ Tobias / (at least 6 ridiculous names I've forgotten)/ Nostrildamus.
Guzz (I reckon that was TTT but TTT strenuously denied it)
Pirate Hunter
Sussie plus at least 20 other names
What others?
I can't think of a pro-Falkland poster who has gone. I have to be honest and say I was not really aware of blatant multi-tag posters from our side.
They'll all be back under other tags as soon as they (all 3 of them) sort out new IP addresses but for now it's reasonably peaceful.
ARA Libertad, Port of Tema, Ghana - 18:00 Zulu Time
Captain Salonio reports ”All Normal” on Ship……
Water, electricity and sewage services have been Re-Re-established…
Planification of alternative ”Return Routes” has begun ….
Pleased to hear it. The crew shouldn't have to suffer.
OK, not very at keeping up with current events are you? This “Story” was reported on this very webside on Tuesday, November 13th 2012 - 20:51 UTC “Latam rapidly turning into middle class continent, says World Bank”
Note the “Latam” in the headline and not “Argentina” so you are wrong ( again ).
I suppose that those sorry a-s corrupt Ghanan judges and politicians are beginning to sense that they have gone too far, there won't be a quick payout, and their country will be sued for damages.
Who said anything about a payout? to whom?
and what have they damaged?
and why does the Ghanian Judge have to be sorry a*ssed?
( Everything bottoms with you American's isn't it? ).
How can enforcing international law be “Going too far?”
england -1 sweden -1
argy bloggers 3 missing, brits,all correct so far,
so is anyone missing,
its like escaping from a P O W camp, and making sure we are all safe and sound.loll
Of course some of us have very divergent views on the situation: thats what free debate is about but from now on ladies and gents, Queensberry rules?
Thank you for taking the opportunity during this lull in hostilities, to explain your position.
My understanding was that while you detested CFK and the Peronists, you were still an ardent Malvinista.
If that is not the case, I misunderstood you. I hope there can be some useful discussion between us.
For my part, I hope that Argentina can shake off these criminals ruining the country and Argentinians can realise their full potential as a mature and prosperous society.
BTW, I do realise the big difference between yourself, participating productively with Csnadian society, and that malevolent foul psychopath PH ALEX, in Toronto, who misrepresents Argentina and gives the culture and values of both our countries, an unforgivable disservice.
LEPRecon is from one of whose names ?
I was never aware that LEPRecon was operating under multiple tags. Is that what you're suggesting?
Has he been on here today? Maybe not everyone realises it's back up yet.
ok ! then
let's wait how LEPRecon intimate talkings with interesting names will be.
Not saying that he or Poppy are “multi-ID's ” or “bounced” either, just wondering...
Poppy has not come back yet.
Foreign Minister Héctor Timerman announced the measure today
in order to push Ghana to inconditionally release the ARA Libertad ship,
Buenos Aires Herald
www.buenosairesherald.com/article/116889/govt-denounces-ghana-to-tribunal-over-libertad-
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
U.S. Judge Sends A Big Threat To Argentina If It Does Not Make Bond Payments It Owes Next Month
Reuters' Alison Frankel reports that District Judge Thomas Griesa basically threatened Argentina in federal court in Manhattan on Friday if the country does not make interest payments it owes to bondholders next
www.onenewspage.us/n/Business/74ritt2lj/Judge-Sends-Big-Threat-To.htm
Poor Argentina, nothing is going right for them.
Chris = Yankeeboy
----
111
I just talked with Captain Poppy at --Cuba embargo article--.
And poppy are both back,
Seen them on the other bloggs today.
But no sign of chrisR
.
He should cut his very longed curly hair.
José Malvinero===missing
Lord Ton===missing
HansNiesund===missing
stick up your junta===missing
Anbar===missing
v for victory===missing
Zethee==missing
Theman===missing
Clyde===missing
//////////////////////////////////
We got your Fragata===present.
Tompaine===present
Britworker===present
Pugol-H===present
Yuleno===present
did we miss any
you forgot MurkyThink who is my other name.
gustbury===missing
sorry.
there are some others we have missed
and probably completely freelance. From his FB, a wannabe only.
Here's hoping he was thrown out with the other trash.
Pirate love===missing
beef===missing
falklandlad===missing
M_of_FI===missing
David Cameron===missing
Islas Malvinas===missing
Monty69 ===missing
scarfo===missing
nigelpwsmith===missing
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Notice no new articles,
Mercopress is keeping us rationed,
Tee hee,
It’s like the Great Escape, with Steve McQueen
Troy Tempest===missing
Gord01===missing
welsh wizard===missing
Steve-32-uk===missing
Right chaps, I call it your duty to report these missing posters when found. Offer support should they return from the cooler.
A lot of the names you list there don't post on a daily basis. Stick up your junta has been on today.
Would you want to see the list -who is who- ?
Go on then
At least we will see who has been on the list[full]
129 Raven
Troy Tempest===missing
Is above you.
.
True but many of them were posting right up until the cessation of hostilities came into effect (I wish they told me, I'd just written a long post with some cracking points in it, hits the submit comment button and BAM, ''sorry this is now closed for comment'')
I do talk about the personifications --who is who ...
who uses which other names....
I do talk about who talking themself within their names.
In Defense, “Isolde” posts very infrequently, anyway...
First,I should take the patent of this list before publishing here.
a clue :
Conqueror = CaptainPoppy= ? = ? = ? = ?......
and Raul
allarguing over the...
dotting the eyes, and crossing the t;s.
over Ban Ki-moon statment.
...................
thanks.
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
it seems everybody has been polite today,
how long will it last.
All except Conqueror, who is the first to get the 'Comment removed by the editor' on post #87
i had not noticed that.
sad it had tobe a brit.
but GreekYoughurt is absent whereas this was one of Conqueror names.
New Standards Practices
And things have been so civil.
Nevermind, I'm sure normal service will be resumed when Guzz and the rest get bored of FB.
possible,he was tired of this name.
but we should be ready his new snap names like * PinkPuding*
Perhaps he'll come back as a nice Tzatziki.
Think, I wonder if the planning of the return route is due to sanity in Ghana finally sinking in (no punt intended). Let's make sure that planning considers fuel expenses on Ghanas ticket when the International Tribunal makes it's decision.
I am really Captain J.Cook admirer.
I said him Captain Cook was a Conqueror at --Cuba embargo article --wasn't he ?
The planning of the return route is due to recent info from the Hamburg tribunal and two earlier North-American courts verdicts about the invalidity of the Argentinean Bonds “immunity waving” on Military vessels...
I'm beginning to think that it will not be necessary to scuttle her...
(A pity really)
Not so much regarding the ARA Libertad but rather the bond situation in NY, we could be weeks away from default, the default risk is up 41%. This is a very worrying situation.
most it seems were not here yesterday.
as for your boat,
it may well be there for another week at least.
por nada !
but you can list too if you are careful.
Now is the time for the Argentinw government to start acting like real people and honor their debts . we all have to honer ours so why should the Argentines simply be given vast amounts to never pay back.
Just sayin'
You say:
“I wonder if people realise how close we are to a 'game over' scenario for Argentina.............. We could be weeks away from default........ This is a very worrying situation.
I say:
Uhhhhhhhhhh......................... Mr Surfer is ”Very Worried“
Why?
According to the ”Maya Calendar, we will all be dead by December !
Ain't that so, Mr. “Doomsday Prepper” Surfer ;-)))
There is the “Malvinista” side, and there is the argentine people-hating side.
to take it away, for I remain true to my realm and terrain,
exult of your riches, and superiority self-proclaimed,
you still a nothing-fiend amongst us you shall remain.
As for the scuttling charges, I would think they are already in place just in case. It would be a normal precaution in the circumstances
as my other name MurkyThink had asked few questions on about these islands ,but got no reply...noone knows these islands except their map places.
-------
162
no need to access to TTT's IP address
you can capture and easily find it if you are careful.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.
What's next? Vultures going to court to prosecute and extradite argentines who evade taxes for taking “the vultures money”?
You people live in a parallel brain don't you? (not even a parallel universe).
Wasn’t that just America
, not us,
They probably didn’t even know we existed,
Would it not be fair to say, the world as they saw it, was the Americas, or what ever they knew abt it.
Just predicting, like.
Hoping not us. Mmm
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Nostrolldamus
Don’t let Mercopress know you are back,
They are getting hot potatoes at the moment,
And ZIP ZAP anyone offending.
Just a thought.
p/s
back tomorrow to meet the hangman.lol.
the Angles seem to engage in all actions related to fiefdom,
and this now has reached the shores of the electronic kindgom,
how then can these people pretend to be the guardians of wisdom.
Interesting times.....
You are Uruguayan just in your papers...
Your profound Anglicanism betrays you...
The Captain of the ARA Libertad is a Catholic...
As President Cristina Fernandez de Kirchner is...
No honor in suicide for Catholics, matey...
On the contrary; it's a Mortal Sin.
Now you know.
its up to lowly man to decide their descriptive nomenclatures,
but all this is of no consequence at all for the scriveners,
what they'll lay in stone is the end of your earthly scriptures.
Maybe significant?
Xect
oh man that quote is SO SO seriously awesome.. i am stealing it for future use!
----------
“Did you have to go far to get access to another IP address TTT?”
as i said before: changed their proxy or got a new VPN.... it just took them longer than expected. ;-0
Water, electricity and sewage services have been Re-Re-established…
Planification of alternative ”Return Routes” has begun ….”
Something is going on...
Scuttling the ship in a shallow port solves very little...
really? I am? lol i couldve sworn ive been posting here since around #23
Crikey.. i DO hope you dont work for Military Intelligence...
actually... ¬_¬
----
i'm glad the Think-gestalt is back anyway ;-)
All these totally deranged conspiracy theorists over there, kind of amusing as it's so mental!
So long live the Falklands but let's keep debating the RGs.
I'm glad nobody was banned. Argentines and the Islanders have a symbiotic relationship, they affect each other whether they like it or not. These are only questions: Would the Falklands have enjoyed the same prosperity and benefits they now receive had the Rgs not invaded in '82? How would the Rgs have fared under thirty years of successive military governments? We can lament that a thousand people had to die to get where they are today but it happened and the situation is producing another generation of bitterness. Argentina has to accept that the Falklands are there to stay, independent, and the Falklanders need to become more a part of South America, one of many countries, nationalities and governments. That's enough of being on the soapbox for one day!
Here is some news from the old mighty.
en.mercopress.com/2012/11/12/obituary-sir-rex-hunt-cmg
That didn't take long.
Back to the same old cr@p :-(
and on the other: President Cristina Fernández de Kirchner, repeated that she will continue to refuse to pay those who did not enter the debt restructuring process ...
I know the Argentine government is completely erratic and governed by emotions and not rationality, but this is even more contradictory than almost anything else, they have done and said.
1. Voluntary and 2. refuse to pay those who did not enter the debt restructuring ???
Source: www.buenosairesherald.com/article/116833/argentina-seeks-us-appeals-court-retrial-on-debt-ruling
I would encourage everyone to come over to Russia Today when it's a bit slow here. It really is a place where all the idiots of the world appear to congregate for the amusement of everyone else.
Note it is almost totally unmoderated so be prepared to roll your eyes or even allow them to pop out on stalks from time to time.
ghana still has the ship,
the argies are still screaming,
CFK is hiding,
we are all laughing.
and the marry go round, goes round and round.lol.
Argentina is moré démocratic coúntry thán UK.
another joker trying to better prate hunter
really ,i say the truth.
do you have objection ?
You say…:
”…..Aspersions on religious persuasion ….. could lead you into hot water with the moderator”
I say…:
I apologize thousand fold for having called you “Anglican”…………..
Church of Scotland it is ;-)
You say…:
“Your…Wooly Buggers … certainly make the monsters rise”……
I say…:
Wooly Buggers???.... Wooly Bloody Buggers !!!
Do I sound like a Wet Fly Fisherman???
;-)
why are you talking to your self.
im over worked.lol.
@ 12 Zhivago:
“Not much debate when one side is banned!”
It looks as if Guzz was almost all the trolls, as they disappeared together with him when he lost his third brain cell and wrote filth on the Remembrance Day page.
@ 82 toooldtodieyoung:
“It is not the general population who is at fault, it is the failure of the government, chosen by them, to run the country properly.”
Based on my experience with Argentinos you are both right and wrong at the same time.
The Argentine government is completely erratic and governed by emotions and not rationality, but that is to a large extent the fault of the population.
I lived in Argentina for about 4 years and have seen the Argentinos having a jolly good life in bars and cafés.
When I suggested to my friends, that they should join a political party - any party they favoured: left, right or center - spend a little less time in bars and a few hours a month on active politics, using their member vote to get rid of corrupt and worthless politicians, they just shrugged and said 'This is Argentina'.
Most are completely apathic about politics - not a problem per se, but if you don't take part in politics, when the system is rotten, you cannot expect good governance.
“It is true that we provided many services to the Islands during the 1970/80's, and a lot of them were as you say at bargain prices, but we did it for a reason, to win the Islanders' favour.”
True and that was a very sensible politic.
One must not forget, however, e.g. that high ranking officers sent their wives to the Falkland Islands for childbirth simply because that was safer than an Argentine hospital - both parties gained something from the other.
“ Galtieri managed ti f*ck that up for eternity”
Well, not necessarily. Look at the European nations view of Germans after WW2 - hate, contempt, hostility, ...
Already some 30-40 years later the view had changed considerably (but then, Germany did no longer claimed sovereignity over the rest of the world).
Now, 67 years after the war, most are positive and/or sympathetic towards the Germans - except, of course those who, like the Greeks borrowed money from them, wasted the money and now can't pay it back. Everybody hate their creditors when they have wasted what was borrowed.
The same can happen to the islanders' attitude towards Argentina, when (if) she has become a real democracy, using her resources wisely to become as affluent as the Falklanders and has achieved a genuine friendly and neighbourly attitude towards them.
You ask:
Now joking apart, did you catch anything.............. ?
I answer:
Many nice Fontinalis on nymps the past week...... biggest one, just under a clove!
Patagonia is the Fly Fishermans dream come true....
200 St.John
You say:
“It looks as if Guzz was almost all the trolls, as they disappeared together with him .......”
May I ask....?:
Besides “Guzz”.....; who has disappeared?
(201) Doggy Rap
You say:
“.... high ranking officers sent their wives to the Falkland Islands for childbirth simply because that was safer than an Argentine hospital...”
I say:
Where in Jehovas name do you trolls get your silly stories..???
Even toda, in 2012, the Kelpers, very sensibly, send their pregnant women to a clinic in Chile or Uruguay if complications are expected.
What a Turnip!
No char, but a 10kg UK winter carp on worm last week. Trout season just started but will stick to the chavender on the rivers.
I have, ocasionally, used a little live wiggling worm on a medium sized streamer when in need of edible fish........
Darn effective method I must say;-)
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