Saturday, November 17th 2012 - 05:53 UTC

“Technical issues” delaying Argentine Navy vessel departure from South Africa

The Argentine Navy said that repair works in the corvette ARA Espora, which has been stranded in South Africa for over five weeks “are 65% completed” and denied there were any debts pending with the German company that is responsible for the maintenance of the MEKO class corvettes as was reported earlier in the Buenos Aires press.

The 1.400 tons ARA Espora in Simons Town with “65% of repairs completed”

“Advance in the repair works of the vessel to this day are close to 65% completed and the Navy has no arrears with the German company MTU since payments are being made effective as agreed when the service was contracted”, said a release from the Argentine Navy.

Earlier in the day the Buenos Aires media had reported that the corvette was delayed because it was waiting for spares and technicians from MTU to repair malfunctioning power generators, but the company was demanding full payment of arrears and an advance to address the current job, a total sum in the range of 1.5 million dollars.

“Until the bill is not fully paid, the Germans won’t move a finger. They also want advance payment for the job” a Navy source confided to La Nacion. The pending debt is not quite clear but for this job “they are demanding an advance payment of 450.000 dollars”.

However the official release said that the “vessel was not retained but involved in planned sailing preparations duties” adding that “the original timetable for preparing the vessel has been adjusting to technical issues”

ARA Espora has been docked at South Africa’s main naval base of Simons Town since last 10 October when the vessel was forced to abandon the joint exercise ‘Altasur IX’ in the South Atlantic with the navies from Brazil, South Africa and Uruguay, following the malfunctioning of three generators.

The 1.400 tons displacement ARA Espora with a crew of 110 was launched in 1985 and is one of the six built at the Rio Santiago ship yard with blueprints and technology from Germany’s Blohm and Voss. She’s a MEKO 140 Class, and is made up of several modules which facilitate upgrading and repairs according to Argentine naval sources.

Following the announcement last month that the corvette was stranded in South Africa there were strong concerns that she might face a similar situation to that of the Argentine Navy’s flagship ARA Libertad impounded and retained in Ghana since early October on request from the investment fund NML Capital acting through a New York court favourable ruling.

In early November South African Foreign Minister Maite Nkoana-Mashabane admitted after meeting with her Argentine peer Hector Timerman in Pretoria that “the South African government was aware of the issue. The Ministry of Defence has been informed and instructed”.

Consulted the South African embassy in Buenos Aires about such a possibility, a spokesperson said that until Thursday there had been no formal presentation before a South African Justice court demanding such an action by any investment fund.

89 comments Feed

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1 coldo (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 07:02 am Report abuse
If a countries debt, inflation and past history are anything to go on the this company is quite right to ask for the money. Sorry Argentina but you got yourself into this position when it comes to debt etc. deal with it, pay he fees and get your ship fixed....... And watch out for court orders impounding it...!
2 reality check (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 07:25 am Report abuse
MA. Fake Aussie.
Wot, no Argentine Enginners available? LMFHO.
3 DanyBerger (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 07:58 am Report abuse
This is not true I'm moving my fingers faster thane ever....
4 Joe Bloggs (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 08:44 am Report abuse
When is someone from the Argentine government going to blast the German company for holding Argentina to ransom by asking for money up front? Who the HELL do they think they are? Nobody pushes Argetina around like that.

What sort of a basket case is the Argetine economy that this even makes the news?
5 agent999 (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 09:07 am Report abuse
You should check those hairs growing fast on your on your palms
6 Raven (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 09:12 am Report abuse
I do wonder just how badly maintained the ship is if 3 generators failed. 1 would be unlucky, 2 would be questionable but 3?!

I also wonder why the Navy engineers couldn't fix the problems. Yes ships are more sophisticated these days but the engineers should have the ability to fix them. Imagine if the ship was at war? ''Sorry Captain, we are a dead duck as we can't fix it''.

This sounds all too much like missed maintenance to save money, leading to serious failure further down the line, especially with 3 generators going offline on the same cruise.
7 LightThink (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 09:48 am Report abuse
For all we see the mixed “” Dany,Conqueror,Chris“” trio came here from South Africa before Argentine Navy vessel departure .
8 British_Kirchnerist (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 10:18 am Report abuse
Clearly Argentina is in no hurry to get the ship out of South Africa, and it seems their quiet confidence is justified - no attempts to impound for the vultures by the heirs of Mandela yet....
9 slattzzz (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 10:33 am Report abuse
Looks like Christmas and new year in South Africa for the crew
10 Joe Bloggs (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 10:37 am Report abuse
9 Slatzzz

Every cloud has a silver lining.
11 Xect (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 10:44 am Report abuse
Raven, I would suspect rather than losing 3 generators all at once they sailed with maybe 1 or 2 of them not in a serviceable state betting the 3rd would survive the trip.

I would also hazard a guess funding for the Argentine Navy has got so bad when things go wrong they are left that way until something catastrophic like this happens.
12 Raven (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 10:52 am Report abuse
If the captain left port in such a state, he is just damned irresponsible and should be facing a court martial for endangering the lives of his crew. Putting to see without a 100% working ship is negligent.

However, if he was ordered to put to see and he had already stated to his superiors of the faults, then they should be the ones in the dock.
13 ChrisR (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 11:14 am Report abuse
Xect has nailed it on the head.

The Captain was in a quandry, either he misses the pantomime in the South Atlantic or he sails as his masters commanded, or he does the honourable thing and resigns.

This is the result of systematic lack of maintenance brought about by AG having USD 46 Bn in reserves. :o)

Does anyone really believe the USD 46 Bn?

Ha, ha, ha.

With a bit of luck Singer will request an injunction just before this wreck is due to sail: no good having a useless ship on hand is there?

Should be a good new year!
14 slattzzz (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 12:12 pm Report abuse
time for HMS Edinburgh to visit Simonstown for a port visit, now that would be funny
15 reality check (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 12:26 pm Report abuse
Cocktails in the wardroom and a Christmas football match. Now that would be the civilised thing to do.
They could exchange presents, wonder if they still make Meccano Sets, wonderful present for their skipper!
16 JIB (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 12:34 pm Report abuse
Once the Libertad is freed the Espora will have all engines repaired and ready to leave :)
17 yankeeboy (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 12:47 pm Report abuse
Do you think Singer asked the Germans NOT to ship the parts until after he owns it?

That would be funny..
18 slattzzz (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 01:07 pm Report abuse
@15 LOL
19 Frank (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 01:40 pm Report abuse
Maybe its that old you just can't buy bits for it anymore.....

What a Joke Navy
20 slattzzz (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 01:45 pm Report abuse
@15 raise the gin pennant and when the rg's turn up say sorry it's for commonwealth countries only :)
21 reality check (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 02:09 pm Report abuse
You could make an exception if they are still there next 21st of October, now that really would be something to see, I would even spend some of my pension to see it, be nice if an SSB paid a visit for the celebration. Let them see what a real navy looks like. Should not take the piss really, takes some courage to go to sea in a vessel you can not be sure will get you home again!!!
22 Conqueror (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 02:20 pm Report abuse
@3 You've been told before that it's not right to shove your fingers up there. No matter how gooood it feels!
@6 A vessel designed in the late 70s and “in service” since 1985. It's old! It probably needs parts that will have to be made specially.
@8 Yet.
@16 Sometime in late 2013?
23 Pirate Love (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 02:42 pm Report abuse
mmm... could this not be a ploy to snatch back argentinas tall ship, lets face it who would stop them cruising on up and escorting their vessel home, assuming there is nothing wrong with their destroyer of course? just a thought.
24 LEPRecon (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 02:46 pm Report abuse
Technical issues being they haven't got the parts and won't have until they cough up the money upfront.

No one in their right minds would trust Argentina enough to give them credit.

@6 - Raven

As an aside, during the Falklands War on of Invincibles engines failed. Rolls Royce built and flew a brand new one (the engine was the size of a 3 storey building) from the UK and the crew fitted it upon route. No easy task given the circumstances. The whole thing was so secret that not even the Prime Minister and the Chief of Defence Staff knew about it until after the war had ended.

Yet the Argentine Navy can't even repair their vessel in a friendly port during peacetime because of the ineptness of the Argentine government.

Although, to be fair, Rolls Royce were happy to extend the RN credit because they knew they'd get paid.
25 slattzzz (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 02:56 pm Report abuse
RN Ships change engines all over the world they are designed to be removed and replaced within 48 hours via a soft patch in the ships decks, this can be done in the most exceptional cases at sea. The RN being proffesional as they are have a Forward support unit on standby 24/7 365 days a year that fly out at an hours notice. They train for three years and know rolls royce and other engines inside out
26 reality check (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 02:59 pm Report abuse
Rolls probably gave the RN a customer loyalty discount.
27 LightThink (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 03:00 pm Report abuse
Their South Africa history has been a bitter one dominated by colonialism,racism,apartheid,sexism and repressive labour policies .The result is that poverty and degradation exist side by side with modern cities and a developed mining ,industrial and commercial infrastructure.
Their income distribution is racially distorted and rank as one of the most unequal societies inthe world....Lavish wealth and abject poverty characterise their society.

South Africa is a roller coaster to disaster..

The apartheid Government came to power in 1948,the same year that the State of Israel was created in Palestine.Having lived and witnessed the legacy of Zionism..wondering sometimes if this shared birth year was not accidental prophecy...

So,kept to the shadows,it was shielded behind the secret aggreements and disinformation that dressed up military cooperations as mining deals.
But when the spotlight occasionally flickered over one of the most intimate and enduring alliances of the postwar years.Israel quickly underplay its deep military ties with apartheid South Africa as nothing more than a neccesity of survival without a flicker of ideology affinity.
28 slattzzz (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 03:03 pm Report abuse
all the rolls royce and tyne engines off the decommisioned type 42's and type 22's will be refitted / upgraded and put in storage for such an event
29 LightThink (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 03:09 pm Report abuse
The apartheid unleashed a vicious wave of violance,
Thousands and thousands of people have been brutally killed forced from their homes.
They are close to creating a culture of violance in which no person can feel any sense of security in their person and property.
The spectre of poverty and violance haunts millions of their people.
30 slattzzz (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 03:15 pm Report abuse
lightthink your point being what in relation to an rg corvette being knackered?
31 Captain Poppy (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 03:35 pm Report abuse
#30 lightthink is a classic example of the problem with the argentine government. They cannot seem to fix problems because they cannot seem to stay focused long enough to identify the problem. ADD....
Do you trolls out there really continue to believe you government? I have some great get rich investments to sell you.
32 LightThink (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 03:36 pm Report abuse

I write them addressing to South African commentators.
33 Raven (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 04:02 pm Report abuse
@ 29 LightThink

''Thousands and thousands of people have been brutally killed forced from their homes.
They are close to creating a culture of violance in which no person can feel any sense of security in their person and property.

Just who posts on Mercopress that is from South Africa? Or is it just to bump your own post count up to earn more money from your queen cfk?
The spectre of poverty and violance haunts millions of their people.''

Considering history, this could easily be about Argentina.

@ 24 LEPRecon
I still can't understand how a ship like that could be allowed to set sail IF she was in a bad state of repair before she left port, which considering the 3 generator failures seems likely. A responsible captain wouldn't do that except in extreme circumstance. So either HE is inept or he was ORDERED to sail despite the incomplete repairs.
If it had been a Royal Navy ship, somebody would have been getting the sack. Who the hell is responsible in the Argentine navy for this mess? If the Argentine government has not been providing the funding to it's navy, why havent the top brass been saying and doing something about it and refusing to let their sailors leave port in a knackered ship?
34 Pugol-H (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 04:09 pm Report abuse
Why don’t you try asking S. African commentators about all that, instead of trying to tell people who live there, and lived through it, about it?

From Chebuts, in Argentina, you seem to be able to see a f*ck of a long way, from the foot hills of the Andes to Table mountain!!!!

“poverty and degradation exist side by side with modern cities and a developed mining ,industrial and commercial infrastructure”. Brazil anyone, or India, China or many other places, and possibly Argentina soon.
35 yankeeboy (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 04:29 pm Report abuse
27. Their income distribution is racially distorted and rank as one of the most unequal societies in the world....Lavish wealth and abject poverty characterise their society. blah blah

Have you been to Retiro or Horqueta in San could say the same about Argenitina
36 txiki (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 04:38 pm Report abuse
I heard that Timmerman threatened to take MTU to the UN Security Council, and they backed down and agreed to fix the corvette. :-)
37 toooldtodieyoung (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 04:45 pm Report abuse
On a par....I like this story better.

Never mind having your flag ship impounded. This is MUCH better. An Argentine ship “Impounding” itself because it's crew / engineers are a bunch of knuckle draggers and don't know how to repair it? Ha, ha and ha!!!

What did Slattzzz at 25 say? 48 hours?? to replace an entire engine? that's professional for you. That's a proper navy!!!

Over five weeks??? “65% completed” ?????? WTF???

33 Raven

“A responsible captain wouldn't do that” continuing that logic then, because the Captain DID leave port, that makes him.................?
38 slattzzz (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 05:44 pm Report abuse
the title of the article sums it up really, technical issue are delaying the repairs, those technical reasons being NO FOOKIN MONEY to pay for it
39 LightThink (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 06:14 pm Report abuse
-- 33

yea ... seems that this web site is on about South Atlantic but majority comments are from South Africa who names are (Welsh origin)Conqueror,Danny,Chris,and their some nano names....

Maybe they need to comment under the sniffing and breathing of SouthAmerica fresh winds to be relax inside of distress society South Africa.
40 Joe Bloggs (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 06:18 pm Report abuse
38 slatzzz

LOL! And how dare the German company, wanting money up front! Don't they trust the Argetine Government to pay. What sort of a navy doesn't have accounts for such repairs??? LOL!
41 LightThink (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 06:57 pm Report abuse
Phoenix is an Indian township of Durban once M.Gandhi residence place.
42 Teaboy2 (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 06:58 pm Report abuse
@39 - Really LightThink, what evidence do you have other than your deluded Drug induced assumptions that the people you referred to are in south africa and are posting from there. Those posters where posting on this site for at least 2 years prior to argentinas disputes with ghana and the mechnical breakdown of their ship now in a south african port. When brazil starts trade import restrictions against argentine goods will you be saying where all posting from inside brazil.

Muppet - P.s. i have reported you as a trol too, so don't be surprised if your banned by tuesday like guzz was banned!
43 LightThink (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 07:19 pm Report abuse
-- 42

Haven't you read the confession at other article on about living and posting from South Africa.

You are Teaboy2.......who is Teaboy ?
44 Anbar (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 08:10 pm Report abuse
“”“Looks like Christmas and new year in South Africa for the crew”“”

yeah, lucky SOBs.. i'd swap with them.. the longer they are stuck the better (expect for those with families i guess)

still, cant be bad place to be stuck.


lightthink - erm - yeah - you kinda missing the plot atm.... conqueror appears to be a genuine british-based rabid attack dog (sadly) ... not a SAFer

still, when did facts ever stop the malvinistas from claiming something entirely fallacious? /em ducks
45 briton (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 09:57 pm Report abuse
which one of the tiny little ships is the argie one..
46 reality check (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 10:03 pm Report abuse
The one with the lights, tinsel and the baubles in the rigging and the christmas tree on the bow!
47 Teaboy2 (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 10:30 pm Report abuse
@43 - How the hell should i know who the person that uses the username Teaboy is? Your just trolling Lightthink and making up assuptions nothing more.

Now as i said before i have reported you to Mercopress for trolling so don't be surprised if your banned just like i got Guzz banned!
48 briton (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 10:33 pm Report abuse
46 thank you.

we hope they have all the presents
49 surfer (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 10:57 pm Report abuse
At the risk of repeating myself.....They could easily lose this one too;

To the extent the Republic [of Argentina] or any of its revenues, assets or properties shall be entitled … to any immunity from suit, … from attachment prior to judgment, … from execution of a judgment or from any other legal or judicial process or remedy, … the Republic has irrevocably agreed not to claim and has irrevocably waived such immunity to the fullest extent permitted by the laws of such jurisdiction…
50 Raven (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 11:29 pm Report abuse
A cleverly worded clause, but one that rests upon a court to interpret.

It all depends on this phrase ''to the fullest extent permitted by the laws of such jurisdiction''

Just which jurisdiction would be the one that could definitively rule on this?

It all looks a bit of a grey area to me rereading. No wonder CFK is screeching as much as she can, she is hoping to influence a court decision, for that will inevitably be the one that sets the precedent on all other court rulings. If it goes against her in the final judgement, there wont be anything appearing from outside Argentine territory for quite a long time!
51 War Monkey (#) Nov 17th, 2012 - 11:50 pm Report abuse
“Consulted the South African embassy in Buenos Aires about such a possibility, a spokesperson said that until Thursday there had been no formal presentation before a South African Justice court demanding such an action by any investment fund. ”

Singer will wait for the repairs to be carried out first. He will want a fully functioning vessel not a floating wreck. It'd just be a liability to him.
52 reality check (#) Nov 18th, 2012 - 07:54 am Report abuse
I do not think he will go after it, this one is most definately a ship of war and to be honest, it is probably my sense of sportsmanship, it does not seem right to go after something that is there because it got into distress, even if it was through their own negligence. Besides a a tall ship has a much more saleable value, more so that a 30 year old Corvette.
53 LightThink (#) Nov 18th, 2012 - 10:38 am Report abuse
-- 47

I am only a revealer here

You should report somebody elses who talk themself not me..
54 yankeeboy (#) Nov 18th, 2012 - 11:21 am Report abuse
52. The only reason to take it is to further embarrass Argentina and CFK in particular.
The corvette may not have a lot of cash value but what is their pride worth?
December should be fun to watch...
55 Zethee (#) Nov 18th, 2012 - 01:47 pm Report abuse
Lmao, what a total embarrassment of a navy.

The funny part is, if one of these ships is taken from them. There is total squat they can do about it.

This kind of thing just couldn't happen to a real navy. If one of ours or say the american's ships got into a situation like this, we would simply take our ship back.
56 Captain Poppy (#) Nov 18th, 2012 - 02:24 pm Report abuse
Their Naval engineers must be the tops.
57 yankeeboy (#) Nov 18th, 2012 - 02:58 pm Report abuse
Do they even stamp “Made in Argentina” on anything?
They're not really known for their quality products...
58 Teaboy2 (#) Nov 18th, 2012 - 05:37 pm Report abuse
53 - LightThink, your not a revealer at all. Your just a paranoid conspiracy theories, whom did like what he saw posted by Me, Danyberger, Chris and Conquerer. So decided to tell everyone we were all the same and then later in the debate, tried telling everyone that i and the person that uses the teaboy username, which is not a username i use but someone elses, where the same person too. Thats like me saying LightThink and Think are the same, just because they have same word in username, but different number of letters of digits.

Reason i go by the username Teaboy2 is because TEA are the first 3 letters in my surname, Boy because am a Male, and 2 because am the second son of my parents!
59 Isoooooolde is Skare (#) Nov 18th, 2012 - 08:24 pm Report abuse
@ 57
what are you talking yankee nobody?
60 Captain Poppy (#) Nov 18th, 2012 - 10:24 pm Report abuse
They certainly do not manufacture anything relevant of of quality, but not being able to fix your own naval war ship....thats bad.
61 ProRG_American (#) Nov 19th, 2012 - 06:24 am Report abuse
More nonsense being reported by the Merco-Clarin press alliance. As announced by MOD, the ARA-MTU team is making progress daily. Work is coming along just nicely.
For all you ignoramuses out there, the MEKO 140 frigates were built in Argentina using German technology. The engines on this class of ships were built by MTU Argentina using German technology as well. The plant closed along with others around the world as part of the company’s restructuring in the 1990’s. MTU left an administrative and engineering support office to service its naval and commercial customer’s. This is the organization that is spearheading the repairs with support from Germany. Just as it does on all repairs performed in Argentina on this ship and its sister vessels.
MTU and other German suppliers will not walk aw
62 DanyBerger (#) Nov 19th, 2012 - 07:06 am Report abuse
@Captain Poppy

Ha ha you are a very funny guy. Especially coming from the country (USA) that makes military critical hardware for air defence, missile guide system, etc. using Chines-made Actel/Microsemi ProASIC3 A3P250 also provided with back doors that can be sniffed remotely for Chinese intelligence anytime.

I will recommend you to use XBoX and Nintendo PlayStation MC you could be surprised what can you archive with that and also are cheap and available in any electronics store for faster replacement.

And Chinese spy free.
63 Santa Fe (#) Nov 19th, 2012 - 08:03 am Report abuse
62....At least they manufacture something of merit, asking the Germans to fix your broken navy, they then refuse because you dont have dollar. Didnt think RGs were that broke
64 TipsyThink (#) Nov 19th, 2012 - 10:39 am Report abuse
Captain Yankeeconqueror.
65 DanyBerger (#) Nov 19th, 2012 - 10:56 am Report abuse
@Santa Fe

Read the post of ProRG_American the news from La Nación AKA “La Destrucción” was a lie.
The MoD and the Armada also say that.

”La Armada Argentina informa que los avances en los trabajos de reparación del buque al día de la fecha son cercanos al 65 por ciento de la obra y que la institución no mantiene ninguna deuda con la empresa alemana MTU

The Navy informed that the work had progressed to 65% and that the institution has not debts with the German company (MTU).

Now do you have also chips and boards also made in China or Nintendo Super Mario bros type?
66 Captain Poppy (#) Nov 19th, 2012 - 12:47 pm Report abuse
I say the technical issue is that, technically speaking, Argentina is techincally broke.
67 ChrisR (#) Nov 19th, 2012 - 01:17 pm Report abuse
61 ProRG_argie
”MTU left an administrative and engineering support office to service its naval and commercial customer’s. This is the organization that is spearheading the repairs with support from Germany. Just as it does on all repairs performed in Argentina on this ship and its sister vessels.
MTU and other German suppliers will not walk aw(ay?)”

Oh, you must be joking.

You are bragging about a bunch of Argies who work in a far outreach office of MTU ‘spearheading’ the repairs. And then you have the brass neck to claim these very same wannabe marine fitters (for they are most certainly NOT engineers given this fiasco) do all the repairs on each of these MEKOs. I imagine that Tognum AG who own what is left of MTU shipbuilding would just love to get shot of a bunch of deadbeat, rusting hulks that AG calls its navy.

OR was it TMBOA who would not spend the money when it should have been spent and now she’s having a blood red rave!

I have only one thing to say: it’s no wonder they are fcuked then.

Ha, ha, ha, ha.
68 scarfo (#) Nov 19th, 2012 - 01:23 pm Report abuse

wikipedia is quick now days!

I didnt relise that ARA Spiro was sent as a replacement for the joint military exercise and that also broke down as well! oops
69 Pete Bog (#) Nov 19th, 2012 - 03:15 pm Report abuse
If Argentina had any sense instead of complaining about 'British Militarising' the South Atlantic, it would have joint exercises with the Royal Navy so that when RG ships break down they would have something that works to tow them back to port (that might work out cheaper than getting MTU out).
70 Lau-wai (#) Nov 19th, 2012 - 03:36 pm Report abuse
The ara espora was fitted out with 2 SEMT Pielstick engines for its main propulsion. The ship was also fitted out with 4 generating sets delivered by MTU. 3 generator sets together with the electrical control panels and cabling is ruined. MTU had a maintenance contract with the argentine navy which was eventually cancelled because of poor payment morale. Since the debt restructuring of the corvette and frigate project by the german government in 1985, nobody really knows who owes whom how much, especially since the original builder Blohm & Voss as well as MTU changed owners / were restructured and many debts were written off. MTU however, is a major supplier to Stewart and Stevenson who is very active in Argentina, and the argentine navy still owes money to MTU marine for the repairs or replacement of engines on the icebreaker almirante irizar.
71 Captain Poppy (#) Nov 19th, 2012 - 04:33 pm Report abuse
Looks like somemore seamen will be fying home Air France from South Africa.
72 brits are pavos (#) Nov 19th, 2012 - 04:59 pm Report abuse
Isolde Yensere-ly Skare is busy touching her toes
73 Captain Poppy (#) Nov 19th, 2012 - 06:22 pm Report abuse
I wonder if Air France ever got paid......maybe they will not be flying home anytime soon.
74 Xect (#) Nov 19th, 2012 - 07:00 pm Report abuse
Haha they sent the ARA Spiro to replace Espora and Spiro also broke down on the way.

More failures than in the Argentine economy!
75 Captain Poppy (#) Nov 19th, 2012 - 07:19 pm Report abuse
Is that true or an urban legend? I can not find any reports.

Captain: Whe need more power Scottie!!!!

Scottie: Captain I am giving all she has, we have “technical problems”

Captain: Muttering to himself...“those fucks in BsAs, another country they screwed out of paying their bills”
76 Troy Tempest (#) Nov 20th, 2012 - 04:05 am Report abuse
@61 ProRG

“More nonsense being reported by the Merco-Clarin press alliance. As announced by MOD, the ARA-MTU team is making progress daily. Work is coming along just nicely.”

ProARG - please provide a link. Nowhere does it say that on the Internet, or Navy rumours.

Do you have 'special' information ?
77 ChrisR (#) Nov 20th, 2012 - 10:30 am Report abuse
76 Troy Tempest
“Do you have 'special' information ?”

Yes, it's the little voice in his head, you know, the one that tells him he is American but in reality he is an argie troll.

You would not mind if they could come up with something that was half-way intelligent and sought to 'almost' fit the facts, at least that would be a challenge.
78 Martin Woodhead (#) Nov 20th, 2012 - 11:27 am Report abuse
bit like all the unimogs that were Brought looted from the falklands the urban legend was when the MOD tried to buy spares mercedes threw a fit as they hadnt been paid.
the swiss had been for there AA guns and offered a really really good deal on refurbishing them :)
79 scarfo (#) Nov 20th, 2012 - 06:41 pm Report abuse

this is the best/funniest link that i can find to show naval/engineering incompetance.

i mean the torps were trying to run in reverse lol
80 ChrisR (#) Nov 20th, 2012 - 09:53 pm Report abuse
79 scarfo

No, the torpedoes were NOT trying to run in reverse. I covered this about a year ago.

It was the torpedoes gyroscopes that were in reverse (reversed DC polarity) and, of course, as soon as they were uncaged (the restraints were removed) as the torpedo launched the gyro would invert on its' gimbals.

All the settings so carefully entered to ensure a hit were the diametric opposite in reality.

And this from the so called AG Navy at war.
81 St.John (#) Nov 20th, 2012 - 11:50 pm Report abuse
@ 9 slattzzz
“Looks like Christmas and new year in South Africa for the crew”

Easter in South Africa is a great event :)
82 ProRG_American (#) Nov 21st, 2012 - 06:10 pm Report abuse
More hog wash being reported by the Merco-Clarin-Press alliance. As announced by MOD, the ARA-MTU team is making progress daily with work coming along just nicely.
For all you ignoramuses out there, the MEKO 140 frigates were built in Argentina using German technology. The engines on this class of ships were built by MTU Argentina using German technology as well. The MTU plant (which I have seen was located next to Hi 7) closed along with others around the world as part of the company’s restructuring in the 1990’s. MTU left an administrative and engineering support office in Argentina manned by Argentine personnel to service its naval and commercial customer’s. This is the organization that is spearheading the repairs with support from Germany, just as it does on all repairs performed in Argentina on this ship and its sister MEKO 140 aa well as MEKO 360 vessels.
MTU nor any German Naval supplier will walk away from ARA or any other South American client, especially with complete modernization of the modular MEKO 140’s and MEKO 360’s to be negotiated by the MOD and Germany in 2013. MTUs and its local team are key contributors along with Israeli ELTA in the TAM tank modernization program currently under way.
Progress, progress, and more progress!
83 txiki (#) Nov 21st, 2012 - 07:04 pm Report abuse

The only hog wash is what you are writing. If Argentina doesn't pay its bills - sooner or later suppliers will stop supplying and servicing.
84 LEPRecon (#) Nov 21st, 2012 - 08:53 pm Report abuse
@82 - ProRG Yank

The Argentine Navy can only be 'upgraded' if Argentina has the money to do it.

Argentina can't even cough up US$20 million to get their little sailing ship back, so how on earth do you think they will find the billions of dollars to upgrade their fleet (I use that term loosely of course)?

Since the Argentine government has shown the world that it won't pay it's debts, what's the chances of the Germans giving Argentina credit? None is the answer.

Face it, this rusting fleet will still be rusting in 10 years time, unless of course, Argentina gets a decent government who will work for Argentina instead of lining their own pockets with dollars.
85 ChrisR (#) Nov 21st, 2012 - 10:15 pm Report abuse
82 ProRG_Argie

You have posted this delusional nonsense before about the fabled 30 YO (and counting) MEKOs being modernised. I think Putridjelli (soon to be chucked out) actually went toi Germany quite recently.

I bet they all had a laugh at how stupid the man is when he thinks this junk (modular as it is) is capable of being brought up to date in any meaningful sense.

The electronics alone for a modern ship, coupled to fire control radar / sonar, missile launch and remote oversight would cost more than AG want to pay to do the entire laughingly called ‘fleet’.

And the TAM tank!! Oh what a circus, oh what a show! 1979 to 1983 (stopped due to no money – doesn’t this sound familiar) and then finished sometime after 1994 to close out 200 tanks. And now Israel and Germany are having a Giraffe at the expense of AG to ‘modernise’ them! Hope they get their money up front before ordering a screw!

Keep posting this crap and give us all a laugh: progress 1 step, backward 50 steps. Can’t you bunch of idiots buy something worth having? Oh no, you can’t!

Ha, ha, ha.
86 Captain Poppy (#) Nov 21st, 2012 - 10:29 pm Report abuse
#82 ProRG_American........always proving the RG you are with each and every word you type.
87 Britworker (#) Nov 22nd, 2012 - 12:15 am Report abuse
I can't see Argentina being invited to anymore military exercises, its kind of like being invited to a Champagne party and they bring along a bottle of Lambrusco.
88 Captain Poppy (#) Nov 22nd, 2012 - 01:15 am Report abuse
Well that's the RGs for you champagne taste and a beer budget. They can't even be the officials in a field maneuver exercise. During WWII, ships would go out on patrols for months and needed to be self sufficient. These naval engineers are a product of what peronists have done to their military.
89 Lau-wai (#) Nov 22nd, 2012 - 02:58 am Report abuse
@82. Rabies and spongy brain disease perhaps? Unqualified statements and fiction lead to derision. I can only suggest that a little bit of research and engineering knowledge would help your credibility.
The ara espora IS fitted with 2 x SEMT Pielstick diesel engines in 2 banks of 16 cylinders each, as delivered to the argentine naval shipyard by Blohm&Voss. Combined, both engines produce 16.624KW power. The ship is also installed with 4 x generating sets made by MTU with each generator producing 470KW. Under normal conditions, 3 generators are used, with the 4th on emergency standby. The reason why espora is stranded in Simonstown is because the electrical system was so well maintained by the argentine navy that 3 generators burnt out, together with the control panels and cabling. To change 3 generators is a job of 2 days. To change all the wiring, replace the specially configured electrical panels and, as well as change the generators is a job which can take months to accomplish, and thid does not include contract /financial, preliminary engineering, or procurement time.
MTU has no direct representation in Argentina since 1995.
Use a translation tool and inform yourself about the MEKO concept, history and politics of your country as well as the corruption, and complicity of others.
Do the same with this link:
If you have direct contacts at the Simonstown naval dockyard and MTU South Africa, MTU Friedrichshafen on lake Constance, you might be able to find out more specific details to inform yourself on...but that applies to everything you post on here anyway.

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