Audacity and tolerance: Who can imagine Hague publicly lobbying the Falklands’ case in Buenos Aires?
An Argentine columnist has found two great virtues: audacity and tolerance in Foreign Minister Hector Timerman current incursion in London to lobby and argue in favour of the most intransigent of Argentina’s position on the Falklands’ dispute.
“We must acknowledge Timerman audacity to travel to London and display in public the most hard-line position of Argentina in the Malvinas dispute”, writes Martin Rodriguez Yebra in La Nacion.
But he also admits and has praise for British tolerance.
“Can anybody imagine what would happen if PM David Cameron or any of his Secretaries (Foreign Secretary William Hague) came to Buenos Aires to argue publicly in favour of some of his ‘sabre-rattling’ statements on the need to fill the South Atlantic with arms?”, asks the Argentine columnist.
In the column under the heading of “A game in which only Britain wins”, Rodriguez Yebra argues that Timerman returns to Argentina with not much of a diplomatic advance in the Falkland Islands dispute, but yes for the government of President Cristina Fernandez facing non-sweet moments and for which playing the Malvinas nationalistic chord is a common resource for deteriorating regimes.
Telling UK in London that within 20 years the Falklands will be flying the Argentine flag, calling them ‘colonialists’, arguing that “not one country” supports UK’s position and that the country is going through a deep economic crisis and is isolating itself from the world, is only but a further step to ensure that negotiating the disputed Islands sovereignty becomes impossible.
And in the exchange of intransigent speeches and statements, Britain always wins, since the objective of London is for all to remain unchanged, says Rodriguez Yabra.
According to the columnist Timerman mission had two main objectives: display in rival territory the strong international support for the Argentine position in the dispute.
The other more relevant to weaken the effect of the ‘curious’ referendum scheduled for March when the ‘British inhabitants from Malvinas will vote…if they want to continue to be British”
But so far Argentina, leaving aside ‘lip-service’, has not managed to increase diplomatic support for the Malvinas cause, maybe except in Latinamerica and some emerging countries. The US remains “neutral” (but with a tacit support of Britain’s position) and Europe never questioned (and even supported with EC legislation and aid) UK sovereignty over the Islands.
Furthermore the recent turn in Argentine diplomacy reaching an understanding with Iran on the investigation into a 1994 attack of a Jewish organization in Buenos Aires comes as a surprise: it is a regime sanctioned by the main developed countries, and this can hardly help to make friends on the Malvinas issue.
However Casa Rosada is satisfied with the display the UK media has given to Timerman trip and interview-space to criticize UK policy. The impact was greater because he took the discussion to Parliament even when he denied self determination and insisted Argentina will continue to ignore the people of the Falklands and the March referendum, which also generated reaction among MPs.
To ease tensions after calling MPs ‘colonialists’, Timerman thanked Britain for its sacrifice during World War II and tried to force the idea that sovereignty dialogue “is possible and necessary’. And on leaving Westminster he made it a point of displaying to photographers the V for victory with his fingers.
But it is a game of two and the British government downplayed the Timerman mission by saying that when Foreign Secretary William Hague meets him, when addressing Falklands’ issues political representatives from the Islands should be present.
Argentina could never accept such a condition. With the exception of Menem and Di Tella’s years any negotiations on Malvinas can only be bilateral. So dialogue with the UK Government was impossible.
Finally even if the Malvinas issue returns empty handed, there are more imminent and palpable results: this will help President Cristina to revive again the Malvinas nationalistic reflex, a tactic that has always fascinated Argentine governments in moments of bad news and distress.
So given the imminence of the Falklands referendum that has Cristina Fernandez government nervous, “more incidents and episodes of this kind can be expected in the coming weeks”, forecasts Rodriguez Yabra.
For PM Cameron, even when the conflict has less impact in his domestic agenda, he can nevertheless enjoy the effects of the efficient propaganda machinery that represents reaffirming the diplomatic, political and military defence of the Falklands.
Thus the need to acknowledge Timerman’s audacity to display in London the least negotiable case of Argentina’s Malvinas claims. But at the same time British tolerance: can anybody imagine PM Cameron or cabinet members publicly displaying UK’s Falklands’ case in Buenos Aries?
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140 comments Feed
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I've yet to find any member of the Commonwealth of Nations who don't support the UK's position. That's another 53 countries right there. Add that to the EU and that's 79 countries. 40% of the UN and didn't even involve running around the world holding press conferences to announce.
”For PM Cameron, even when the conflict has less impact in his domestic agenda, he can nevertheless enjoy the effects of the efficient propaganda machinery that represents reaffirming the diplomatic, political and military defence of the Falklands.”
Hmmm propaganda. Really? If the truth is propaganda then yes. Much more effective than Argentina propaganda that's for sure.
The article is right though, this trip was quite an own-goal by Argentina. But they really are running out of options to placate the masses.
Britain would never do that for the simple reason that Britain has already reiterated its position and there is no need to travel to Argentina to emphasise it.
I am sure Hague would be willing to go to Argentina at any time but the agenda would have to be agreed beforehand so that when they actually sit down then will be no untoward interruptions such as those caused by Timerman in London.
You have to wonder if this wasn't the real objective. Or are they really this clueless?
This is why the UK sits in a very powerful position in all global affairs and Argentina languishes in the gutter.
Nothing ever changes eh? No matter how many promises the Argentinian government spuriously makes.
Timermans mission could be summerised -
Fizzzzz...........................phut
Another damp squib.
Now that's a bit rich, coming from the Foreign Minister of a country that was happily profiteering through most of the war, and only deciding to join in once the US and British Armies were over the Rhine in the West, and the Red Army was over the Oder in the East.
It must be a demonstration of the paramount martial skill of Argentina that within 40 days of them declaring war, the Soviets were flying the hammer and sickle over the Reichstag.
Declining discussions was a mistake by Timmerman.
Stating that the Islanders do not exist and do not have the same rights as the other peoples of the UN, was, well frankly, a mistake of monumental proportions.
how long can Argentinas nazi reich appease its long suffering people, with its Falkland distraction tactic from matters that really do cause daily hardship??
how much is the peso to the dollar today?
how much is the daily food basket per person :) ?
what is argentinas REAL inflation?
daily power cuts, strikes, protests.
Argentines will be fooled once again!
Heres to The Falklands first democratic free and fair referendum under their UN right of SELF-DETERMINATION!
Yesterday - England 42 Argentina 0
Anticipated result in Falklands Referendum UK Falklands 2800 Argentina 14
Freedom and SELF DETERMINATION for everyone
Grow up Argentina
Would be interesting to see a bar/bun fight between them and a bunch of demented malvinistas. One look from Haskell or Lawes would have them crying for their mummys.
“excuse me sir is this my cocaine that i have just planted in your pocket?”
or a la campora all night party outside their hotel all night every night.
its argentina would you rule out anything?
Otherwise good luck guys, enjoy the tour.
Here they talked of revolution
Here it was they lit the flame
Here they sang about tomorrow
And tomorrow never came.
Watching it was a lot of fun, and I'll miss it when the roadshow has left.
I think you may be being a bit optimistic for the no vote. I think I can predict with reasonable certainty that there will be more inadvertently spoilt ballots than there will be no votes from all of those Falkland Islanders who don't exist...
In the same way as they supported the Nazis
www.consortiumnews.com/1999/c010699a.html
www.greyfalcon.us/The Real Odessa.htm
but of course our world famous historian Herr Gott my not agree !
I think that depends on what his former KGB (and probably now FSB) handlers tell him to think.
@Simon
Slighty off topic but I was reading about the Dirty War recently. Can I ask what you think the true figure is for the number of -the disappeared-?
Your premise is pathetic. The UK needs to do nothing because there is simply nothing it needs to as you are satisfied with the current arrangement.
A better example would be the trade dispute. The rest of the world feverishly trying, at the G2o (Cameron's rant), at the WTO (all the bogus cases brought against Argentina), through the IMF (with Germany, Italy, Spain, and the USA lobbying behind the scenes), in Mercosur summits (the other Mercosur nations), at EU-Mercosur or summit of the Americas meetings, USA, Canada, Europe, UK, etc trying to get freer trade with Mercosur....
And in ALL fronts Argentina has not even lifted a finger.
Why? We have what we want: no trade with any of you, no IMF oversight, no bowing to the rules you northern nations try to impose on us, and you've lost in every front (Ghana ship, IMF, debt-holdouts, etc).
The rest of the world cries and pouts, Argentina quietly demonstrates far superior skills in keeping the status quo in the debt, trade, and currency.
12 years almost now, and nothing has changed not matter what the rest of you nations do.
@7
Simple, not our war. Why should we have cared for you whatsoever? Would you have don the same for us? Really, lol.
Yeah they really handled it well. Timerman was clearly outclassed, His goal here was obviously to stir up a storm over here and he was barely noticed apart from making himself look yet again like an idiot.
And the way Hague did it made it look just like an afterthought.
The rest of the world warns, and warns, and warns, yes. But sooner or later the rest of the world will stop warning. And then bad things will happen.
Argentina might have lots of natural resources, but if you either don't have or can't maintain the equipment to actually process them then they're as much use as a fleet of destroyers that you don't dare exert too much because you can't get spare engine parts for.
Except spending 10s of Millions U$ losing every case at ICSID, various Courts, world wide CFK hiding from the bailiffs so not to have anything repossessed.
Screeching and Screeching about Lemons and Beef bans in the USA
Twittering away on how unfair the world is to Argentina.
It is too bad you don't realize the tide has turned;
Price Controls that won't work
Bare Shelves
Depreciating Peso
30% inflation ( if you are lucky) but probably more
Huge Wage Protests
Multiple Navy ships that can't make it back to port
Soy and Corn paying for fuel
Everything is converging quite nicely
I know they have nothing on the shelves in the supermarkets.
So I guess you believe in self-determination, except for Argentine people. They have not such self-determination, they have to follow the demands of the entire world. Thank you for your honesty, better than most of the others here.
@28
And none of those, if true, are your problem aren't you?
@28
““ .... but a further step to ensure that negotiating the disputed Islands sovereignty becomes impossible”
You have to wonder if this wasn't the real objective. Or are they really this clueless?”
From what I've seen and from the Ttoll posts, I'd agree with you - it looks like they want to insult and provoke the UK into withdrawing diplomatic relations with Argentina, and perhaps elicit an angry rebuke to Argentina as well.
They could play that up on the world stage.
You don't live in Argentina though; you abandoned it because it's a right sh!t hole full of shanty towns. This doesn't stop you idealising the life you abandoned there, because like most emigrants from argentina you feel guilty about the people you left behind who are currently having a pretty sh!t time under an authoritarian fascist government.
What were you saying again?
It is all coming to a head now as it takes a long time for the wheels of justice to work.
The tide has turned
I'm sure that is why you and CFK are hysterical
BTW I see there was another mud slide with hundreds of cars trapped on either side of the pass. Whatever happened to the new tunnel being built? I think Nestor announced it like a decade ago. Then it was a new rail tunnel announced by CFK 5 yrs ago.. yet no tunnels and lots of missing $ par for the course
Kinda hard to export when the pass is closed.
Is it the 1800s again?
SUPPORT GROUPS OF 18 EUROPEAN POSITION TO ARGENTINA concerning sovereignty Malvinas islands
Intellectuals, academics, political and social leaders, journalists and artists met in London with Foreign Minister Héctor Timerman. They signed a document criticizing the militarization of the South Atlantic.
See the following link:
www.pagina12.com.ar/diario/elpais/1-213418-2013-02-07.html
”The whole Timerman road show to London was a pretty cool diplomatic move from CFK's point of view. She (or Timerman) realize that the referendum in March will be the end of any possibility of getting the Falklands, so the game plan has to be changed, populist governments need the “Malvinas lie” to blow smoke in the eyes of the Argentine people so having made sure that the Brits are “the bad guys” in the eyes of the plebs with the London show, now CFK knows there is NO WAY that Argentina can get the Islands and therefore she has them as a smoke screen for ever more!!!!!!”
Yes, CFK can blame the Brits or an 'inept' Timerman(again).
The Man of Timmer did ask the group in his own tongue, 'what groups doth though represent?' and the response was mute. They did not represent any group, but simply was representative of themselves. 'We are all from your city, Sir', said one with red hair.
That doth not do said the Man of Timmer, and did beggeth them to pretend to be from all the nations of the world, saying profanities of many a kind.”
A clip from upcoming book 'Please don't turn the lights on' by Kristina Kouldron Kirchner (1982)
Feb 07th, 2013 - 01:08 pm
The truth is that nobody knows, the Human Rights organizations put it at about 30.000, the Junta put it at about 7.000, so I would say that it is probably around 10.000. But I must insist that this is only an educated guess.
24 Conqueror (#)
Feb 07th, 2013 - 01:31 pm
You must understand that the “international aspect” doesn't come into populist thinking, they only play to the local audience, and of that audience, the plebs!
I think your numbers are actually a bit skewed, I would put it at about 36% plebs who go along with the “government”, the ither 64% are distributed between the various contending opposition parties, and those that refuse to vote for any of the crooks who put themselves up as candidates!!!!!
“Intellectuals, academics, political and social leaders, journalists and artists met in London with Foreign Minister Héctor Timerman”
Should read:
“Argentine intellectuals, academics, political and social leaders, journalists and artists, pretending to represent other countries, met in London with Foreign Minister Héctor Timerman”
Effectively a false flag situation, and worthy of looking at under the various Security Acts in this country.
nobody that matters
They remind me of the crazy homeless people that scream, cry and beg on the street corners as all sane people cross the street to avoid them.
www.penguin-news.com/index.php?option=com_flexicontent&view=items&id=499:a-scam-conference-that-almost-worked-by-peter-pepper
Based on what Ive read from various sources Id say 30 000 was much too high but it seems to be the widely accepted figure...
Feb 07th, 2013 - 04:31 pm
It is the figure accepted by our poor excuse for a government, and it's fanatical supporters, but I think that somewhere around 10.000 is more likely.
The other number that is unknown is the deaths caused by the terrorists prior to the March 24th 1976 coup. I've heard of about 750 to over a 1.000 but I really have no idea, because the military junta never gave out the number of personel killed in these actions.
The ignorance of some of the Turnips in here is flabbergasting…..
Take for example Poster Nr. (2); Mr. Anglotino…..
He says….:
”I've yet to find any member of the Commonwealth of Nations who don't support the UK's position.”
I say….:
Well………….. what about the clear, official Pro-Argentinean stand of those Commonwealth Countries that happen to be members of the Community of Latin American and Caribbean States (CELAC) like….:
Antigua and Barbuda…..
Bahamas…..
Barbados….
Belize…
Dominica…
Grenada…
Guyana…
Jamaica…
Saint Kitts and Nevis…
Saint Lucia…
Saint Vincent and the Grenadines…
Trinidad and Tobago…
Or the clear, official Pro-Argentinean stand of those Commonwealth Countries that happen to be members of the UN C24 Committee like….:
India…
Papua New Guinea…
Sierra Leone…
Tanzania…
Or the clear Pro-Argentinean stand of those Commonwealth Countries that happen to openly disagree with the UK’s colonial ambitions in the South Atlantic like….:
Bangladesh…
Botswana…
Mozambique…
Namibia…
South Africa…
Zambia…
Must take a lot of intelligence to be such a.......Turnip.
I would say you are overly optimistic in your characterization of the support Argentina has from ANYONE OUTSIDE OF THE BOLIVARIAN SOCIALIST countries which is somelike having the combined support of North Korea, Iran and Syria. Whoopty do.
retard
How many of this are in favour of anything more than “dialogue” and “peaceful resolution” . ( I mean of course in the dictionary meaning of those terms rather than the Argentinian fantasy meaning)
Unless you can provide links to the official statements made by these countries supporting Argentina your claims have about as much worth as the Argentine Peso.
And I do mean statements made by THESE countries. Not some shite spouted by Timerman, Fernandez or Chavez claiming support.
So come on you pathetic cock knocker. Put up or shut up you!
Sierra Leone…
Tanzania…
UK better watch out with clout like this behind Argentina!!
Do NOT chech CELAC's homepage......
Do NOT chech the UN c24's homepage......
Reality could hit you hard!
UK happens to be extremely friendly with Sierra Leone, might have something to do with us helping them put an end to a god awful civil war, forces on them by federal gangs.
Who cares, certainly not the FALKLAND ISLANDERS for Gods sake get a life. YOU CAN'T HAVE THE FALKLANDS end of
Wow..........two worthless organisations. What about the offical statements from the countries you mentioned. Can't do it can you? Dick!
I forgot Fiji on that list…..
Sorry Fiji….. ;-)
There is no doubt that some countries do indeed favour Argentina's position. Let's consider a few examples in the form of a simple, turnip-friendly, easy to understand quiz.
1) CHINA supports Argentina's position with regard to the non-applicability of the principle of self-determination to contested territories because :
a) They find it terribly unfair that Argentina's thieves, rapists, murderers, and pirates were booted off somebody else's islands 200 years ago.
b) Tibet
2) RUSSIA supports Argentina's position with regard to the non-applicability of the principle of self-determination to contested territories because :
a) They find it terribly unfair that Argentina's thieves, rapists, murderers, and pirates were booted off somebody else's islands 200 years ago.
b) Chechnya
3) INDIA supports Argentina's position with regard to the non-applicability of the principle of self-determination to contested territories because :
a) They find it terribly unfair that Argentina's thieves, rapists, murderers, and pirates were booted off somebody else's islands 200 years ago.
b) Kashmir
etc, etc, etc.
You can't even cheat properly, your so transparent the entire world press got to see straight through you.
My post Nr.: (46) was in response to Ozzie Turnip Nr.: (2), Mr. Anglotino....
Time is about 06:00 AM in Sydney right now.....
You other Anglo Turnips will have to wait nicely in line.
That poor little sausage must be given a chance to wake up and answer.
Chuckle chuckle©
Peso is back to 7.81/U$1 in case they aren't covering it in your local newspapers.
LOL. Dipshit! Fiji supports the right of self determination, NOT the Argentine claim to the Falklands.
en.mercopress.com/2012/06/07/fiji-anticipates-support-for-the-c24-resolution-on-falklands-malvinas
Most of the 'support' you claim for Argentina is nothing but a fantasy. The support is for the islanders right to choose their own destiny.
As several posters have said before, once the islanders make their choice it will allow these countries to come down off the fence and finally pick a side. I guarantee it won't be the Argentina side. It won't even be the UK. It will be the islanders! And that is why Argentina is terrifed about the referendum.
Watch your blood pressure, Freddy....
You should really eat less sugar....
Gained a couple of stones....
Haven't you...?
Diplomats often play a game of LIP SERVICE which means telling someone something they wish to hear.Now your dear lady leader Kirchner as been prostituting herself around South America and the world for god knows how long begging for support,I use thec word begging because she is the one who always brings the subject up so most leaders say they support her just to shut her up its called LIP SERVICE do you really belive most of these countrys could give a rats ass about The Falkland Islands and your dear ladys dream of securing them one day??? ofcourse they don't, ask yourself to which countrys is Argentina inportant to??? what seats do they occupy at the top table in any major organisations??? you have very limited influance due to lack of co operation within South America,beyond that continent NOTHING.
Just get use to it NOTHING will be changing this whole stupid exercise as cost the Argentine tax payer dearly money that could have been spent on the 25% of Argentines that have to live on less than $7 per day-and if you think I am wrong take a look on many Spanish Forums where people are less than supportive op there own governmant.
But it does not help by letting a deluded poodle run loose snapping at ones ankles does it.
.
Looks like you rattled -Think- (aka The Fake Argentine)
guffaw guffaw
hi sussie timerman - go to bed
What is fuelling this latest Argentinian interest in the Falklands is plans announced by four British companies to search for oil around the Falklands. (Photo: rpsgroup.com)
By Sir Ronald Sanders
BRIDGETOWN, Barbados, Thursday February 9, 2012 - The national and regional interests of Commonwealth Caribbean countries would hardly be served by backing Argentina in its long-running dispute with Britain over the Falkland Islands.
An Associated Press (AP) report of a meeting of some Latin American and Caribbean leaders, under the umbrella of ALBA, cites Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez as confirming the support of all the ALBA countries for Argentina.
ALBA is a grouping initiated by the Venezuelan President and comprising eight nations – the larger Spanish-speaking states Venezuela, Bolivia, Ecuador, Nicaragua, Cuba, and the three small Caribbean islands St Vincent and the Grenadines, Antigua and Barbuda, and Dominica.
According to reports by AP and other international news agencies, on February 4, the eight ALBA member governments are reported to have approved an agreement barring any boats flying Falkland Islands flags from docking in their ports.
“Caribbean countries should not be used to advance Argentina’s ambitions.” --Sir Ronald SandersUp to the time of writing this commentary, only one government has denied being party to such an agreement. In a statement on February 8, the Antigua and Barbuda government said that it “has never supported any call for the banning of flagships from any country in the region and therefore disassociates itself from any statement regarding the banning of ships carrying the flag of the Falklands (Malvinas) from entering our ports.”
It has to be assumed that the two other Caribbean governments of St Vincent and the Grenadines and Dominica will adopt a similar position to the now public Antigua and Barbuda government stance. All three states
Fundamentally the Falklands needs only one country supporting it, and that's the UK. The rest are better to just keep out of the argument.
and /or either way , any monytary support they recieve from the british goverment, should be stopped.
Argentina’s tax agency will start a campaign to check if farmers are hoarding soybeans and force them to sell their harvest, newspaper Cronista Comercial reported, citing government officials that it didn’t name.
Will we see outright confiscation for THE GOOD OF THE PEOPLE shortly?
One would think so
The Chilean marines are singing about killing Argentines and the police cadets from Mendoza are singing ' “Chilenito beware, because your throat cut.”
Lovely.
CELAC’s SPECIAL COMMUNIQUÉ ON THE MALVINAS ISLANDS (2011)
1. The Heads of State and Government of Latin America and the Caribbean, gathered in Caracas, Bolivarian Republic of Venezuela, on 3rd December 2011, within the framework of the Summit of the Community of Latin American and Caribbean States (CELAC), reiterate their strongest support for the legitimate rights of the Republic of Argentine in the sovereignty dispute over the Malvinas, South Georgia and South Sandwich Islands………
www.sela.org/attach/258/default/Special_communique_on_the_Malvinas_Islands.pdf
CELAC’s SPECIAL COMMUNIQUÉ ON THE MALVINAS ISLANDS (2013)
The Heads of State and Government of Latin American and the Caribbean, gathered in Santiago, Chile, on 28 January 2013, in the framework of the Summit of the Community of Latin American and Caribbean States (CELAC), reiterate their strongest support to the legitimate rights of the Argentine Republic in the sovereignty dispute over the Malvinas, South Georgias and South Sandwich Islands and the surrounding maritime areas….
www.gob.cl/media/2013/01/Malvinas.pdf
”The Community of Latin American and Caribbean States (CELAC), reiterate their strongest support for the legitimate rights of the Republic of Argentine in the sovereignty dispute over the Malvinas, South Georgia and South Sandwich Islands…“
”Their strongest support for the legitimate rights of the Republic of Argentine in the sovereignty dispute over the Malvinas, South Georgia and South Sandwich Islands…“
”Their strongest support for the legitimate rights of the Republic of Argentine...”
Does any of you Turnips understand English?
Chuckle Chuckle©
I think that may be the key phrase
One would think since Argentina has no “legitimate rights” to The Falklands the statement is meaningless and everyone who “agreed” to it knows it.
It's easy to sign up for something completely meaningless
There are many good reasons why Commonwealth Caribbean countries should not support Argentina in this dispute with Britain. First, the inhabitants of the Falklands have determined that they are British and wish to remain so. They have rejected the notion of being Argentinian. The right of self-determination, enshrined in the Charter of the United Nations, is one that Commonwealth Caribbean countries have long upheld, and, indeed, is the basis on which each of them achieved their own political independence.
When Foreign Ministers of the 15-member countries of CARICOM and the Dominican Republic met Ministers of the British Government in January this year at the biennial UK-Caribbean Forum in Grenada, they collectively and rightly agreed: “To support the principle and the right to self-determination for all peoples, including the Falkland Islanders, recognising the historical importance of self-determination in the political development of the Caribbean, and its core status as an internationally agreed principle under the United Nations Charter”.
A second good reason not to support Argentina is that the facts of British settlement and sovereignty over the Falklands are well established. It is important to appreciate that an existing UN resolution on the Falklands does no more than call for negotiations to find a peaceful settlement to the dispute over sovereignty. Where the problem arises is: if both countries claim sovereignty why would either of them want to negotiate over what they consider to be their legitimate right? In any event, Britain has exercised sovereignty over the Falklands since 1765 and, properly, if Argentina disputes such sovereignty, it should take the matter to the International Court of Justice for arbitration. Argentina has declined to do so, while Britain has indicated its willingness on several occasions.
Those are reasons of principle and law why Caribbean countries ought not to support Argentina in its
Those are reasons of principle and law why Caribbean countries ought not to support Argentina in its claim for the Falklands. By themselves they are solid and overriding reasons.
But, if economic self-interest were also to play a part in national decision-making on this issue the following points are worth bearing in mind: Commonwealth Caribbean countries earn far more from exports to Britain than they do to Argentina; Britain is a far bigger aid donor to the Caribbean than is Argentina, and British assistance is not only direct, it is also provided through the European Union, the Commonwealth and the Caribbean Development Bank; Caribbean tourism is far more reliant on British travellers than it is on Argentinians; a large number of Caribbean nationals live and work in Britain, few of them do so in Argentina; Caribbean students study, particularly for post-graduate work, in Britain, few if any study in Argentina; and the Commonwealth Caribbean countries share a history, culture, legal system and language with Britain that is of immense importance and benefit to them.
What is fuelling this latest Argentinian interest in the Falklands is plans announced by four British companies to search for oil around the Falklands. The explorers say they are targeting 8.3 billion barrels in the waters this year. But, Caribbean countries should not be used to advance Argentina’s ambitions.
Argentina is a neighbouring country, and, as good neighbours, the Caribbean should urge it to take its case to the International Court of Justice if it believes it has a genuine argument for sovereignty over the Falklands, and, therefore the right to any oil that is found in the territorial waters of the islands. It’s what the Caribbean would have to do in similar circumstances
CELAC’s SPECIAL COMMUNIQUÉ ON THE MALVINAS ISLANDS (2013):
The Heads of State and Government of Latin American and the Caribbean, gathered in Santiago, Chile, on 28 January 2013, in the framework of the Summit of the Community of Latin American and Caribbean States (CELAC), reiterate their strongest support to the legitimate rights of the Argentine Republic in the sovereignty dispute over the Malvinas, South Georgias and South Sandwich Islands and the surrounding maritime areas….
www.gob.cl/media/2013/01/Malvinas.pdf
One could even be a pedant and suggest that the Malvinas don't exist.
@75 I don't see the issue with Chilean Forces using songs about the ruination of Argentina to train to, surely Argentina and Peru are their biggest threat historically so why wouldn't they? Bolivia gets left out in the cold again?
What have I told you about LIP SERVICE????
Meantime a video was released of Argentine police cadets in Mendoza singing similar songs about death to Chileans. I remember when I was in Mendoza I was assured that all the crime there is the responsibility of Chileans creeping over the border.
@84 He's clearly just gone away to figure out that most people support bolivia's legitimate rights to parts of Chile (they have no legitimate rights to parts of chile). All this quite frankly needs a legal judgement, which seems to be the issue causing the argentines the most pain.
Then they just swim in the ambiguity.
So Timerman returns to Buenos Aires having utterly, utterly FAILED...... and if there is any justice, that will be the end of his career as well.
As predicted, he is cursed as some kind of modern day King Midus, everything he touches turns to s**t. His lies and his foaming-at-the-mouth speechs have had exactly NO effect and NO ONE has paid the slightest bit of attention to him.
Also, as predicted, we have Mssrs Think and Tito The Clown Troll on this forum, falling over themselves to be the first to get it all wrong and to try to defend his joke attempt at deplomacy.
I loving it, come on everyone!!! all together now!!!
“The more things change, the more they stay the same........!”
Falklands, its fishing, wildlife, oil, gas belongs to the islanders who can buy products from certain UK supermarkets in their largest shop. Imposters won't know.
You Rgs can whinge and produce all these stupid statements you like, it doesn't make any difference. Gollum is already history...
You say:
”I think if she (Sra. Cristina Fernandez de Kirchner) had continued with the agreement of hydrocarbons and without a policy so offensive to Malvinas/falklands, the position of the United Kingdom would be increasingly flexible in this topic.“
I say:
I ”Think” you are wrong.....
That was the policy of the Argentinean administration of the 90's......
What did it bring?
Argentina getting cheated, shortchanged and disrespected on both the Fisheries and the Hidrocarbons agreements.....
That if you set up a group, call it a fancy name,
And all agree that the world belongs to Argentina,
Then I suppose it does,
But in fact, the group has no jurisdiction, no power ,
And no interest other than supporting there mates to steal what is not there’s to steal,
Simple.
1, it has no legitimate claims, and never did.
2, it’s really about the fact Argentina is in a desperate mess
3, they only want the riches under the sea
4, as Britain is the good soppy obedient appeasing 21st century country
5, it’s only a matter of time before we wear them down, by convincing the world
That its in Britain’s interest to give them to us .
6, our people are conned into thinking the world owes us something.
7, the brits can’t even prevent Spanish navy ships from entering giblatarian waters.
8, if we can persuade the UN its in there interest to support us,
If not we will carry on moaning and yapping, until they get so fed up, they just give them to us,
9, after all, we can do what we want, we can send out diplomats right into the mother of all parliaments, and insult them,
And they do nothing.
10, its all British bull shit,
And only Argies seem to tread in it, and lap it all up.
fooooools.
We disagree of course....... but thanks anyhow for your polite answer....
tee hee
Chuckle chuckle (in a haughty tone).
I know that many of you Bored British Kelpers go to sleep right after supper (at about 18:30 :-).
That's not the case in lovely Argentina as you well know.....
Ah, Joe!!! I must say, your typing ain't too bad for someone who does not exist!!!! I take it that the regulars down at the “Upland Goose” don't exist either!! ( barely stifled, uncontrollable laughter )
Just watched Laughing boy Timerman's “press conference” on forces news, what a silly t-wat!!
There is no strong support just cheap, very cheap words. Its called politics and diplomacy. CFK's admin spends half their time and tax payers money on promoting - the Malvinas issue- at every opportunity. Timmerman went to Europe and after so much effort only found a handful of insignificant, attention seeking people to support the claim. He came back with nothing. Nothing.
What a deadbeat.
Chuckle chuckle.
They are too far down the slippery slope to be helped now. Argentina will be kicked out of international organisations, funds will dry up and everyone will stand back and wait for them to reach rock bottom. When CFKC and her bunch of morons leave office there will be help for them to build back up but not before she is out of there.
Ahhh...... That was a poetical reference to Post-Britpop Coldplay.......
Ask your children what it means, old young man ;-)
So much brewing right now!!
Where will it end
I am pretty sure I know
Hello too old. Always nice to hear from you. I have to say that Mrs Bloggs finds my typing pretty funny to watch. She learnt it properly way back at school you see. Back in the days of typewriters. Remember those? LOL!
Sad to say so but I'm afraid the Upland Goose hasn't been around for quite a few years. I never could work it out. The Malvina House hotel has had about 4 major extensions in the last 15 or so years and goes from strength to strength. At the same time FIC just let the poor old Goose perish more and more. It eventually stopped trading about (I'm guessing here) 5 years ago and they turned it into several flats. Quite nice looking and they did a pretty good job but so far they don't seem to be a huge success. Mrs Bloggs and I looked at them with an investment in mind but we felt they were a little pricey.
Thanks for the heads up. I must put BFBS on.
Gonna come in handy very very soon.
Quite true but Think isn't stuck over there with them. Like most of the deadbeats on here he is sitting cozy elsewhere with fond and distant memories of his once great nation.
You say....:
“ I take it that the regulars down at the “Upland Goose” don't exist either!!”
I say......:
Ermmm....... No, they don't.
Chuckle Chuckle©
There are no realtors or estate agents as such. Your first challenge would be to get permission to own land. We don't allow non residents to simply purchase it. Remember my shower mixer tap that got the deadbeats so excited? Well you'd have to get through that first. Land comes up for sale from time to time in the Penguin News. Or alternatively you could advertise for land in the Penguin News.
Good luck.
Of course. The aim of this ritual is not to obtain sovereignty over the Falklands but to distract the attention of Argentines from other more immediate matters.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=00w96wVev9U
Anyway so glad you seem to have taken a personal interest in taking me down a peg – my arrogance seems to know no bounds – I’ve noticed your pointed replies here and there.
So let’s take a quick glance at some of the countries you list (relevant paragraph in brackets):
Fiji (4) = tinyurl.com/anglotino001
PNG (72) = tinyurl.com/anglotino002
Saint Lucia (26) = tinyurl.com/anglotino003
Saint Vincent and the Grenadines (last) = tinyurl.com/anglotino004
Bahamas (14) = tinyurl.com/anglotino005
All quite blatant and open about the rights of self-determination.
As for CELAC, C24 and every other group that Argentina lobbies, I notice that none of them have actually renounced self-determination. Indeed I notice from your quotes that the groups you mention support the “legitimate rights of the Argentine Republic”.
”Their strongest support for the legitimate rights of the Republic of Argentine...”
So do I.
Removal of self-determination is not legitimate. Colonisation against the wishes of the inhabitants is not legitimate. Invasion is not legitimate. Lying about historical fact is not legitimate.
Legitimate… L E G I T I M A T E… I understand English better than you it would seem.
If Argentina’s rights are so LEGITIMATE then it should perhaps look to using a different forum to voice them and claim them such as the ICJ perhaps… probably more effective than CELAC.
PS: I have no problem being a turnip!
PPS: I’m an Aussie not an Ozzie. I think Ozzie bit the head off a bat once-you may remember?
PPPS: Melbourne not Sydney.
PPPPS: My manners preclude me from chuckling at any person with any form of retardation, so I will continue to refrain.
2, it’s really about the fact Argentina is in a desperate mess
3, they only want the riches under the sea
4, as Britain is the good soppy obedient appeasing 21st century country
5, it’s only a matter of time before we wear them down, by convincing the world
That its in Britain’s interest to give them to us .
6, our people are conned into thinking the world owes us something.
7, the brits can’t even prevent Spanish navy ships from entering giblatarian waters.
8, if we can persuade the UN its in there interest to support us,
If not we will carry on moaning and yapping, until they get so fed up, they just give them to us,
LIAR as usual,chimp briton.
uk ENTERED into negotiation WITH Argentina,BECAUSE they know their tittles are weak..
uk is FINISHED
PG Tip adverts they use to have years ago.
Dad, do you know the piano's on my foot?
You him it son, I'll play it.
Code! Mr Shifter!
Ah, happy days!!
Your lots are so dumbass really...
“First, the inhabitants of the Falklands have determined that they are British and wish to remain so”
By saying this you are not more than to provide a perfect legal support for Argentina who says that the Islanders are British and as so cannot have S-D on a territory on dispute.
Really you are so stupid, imagine that 1000 argies invade Dover and stay there claiming to Argies and that piece of land is part of Argentina and not enough with that they say that England is the colonialist party.
Who the f@ck is going to give them the reason?
Malvinas is legally a lost cause for British and if that doesn’t work always argies have the Gun resource they also can invade the Islands and if they are able to keep it they can make all referendum they like and proclaim they selves part of Argentina.
I like the last one like in the old days...
As usual you spout rubbish. The difference is obvious to all intelligent people.
The Falklands have been sovereign British territory since 1690.
The Falkland Islands community pre-dates Argentina's existance by more than 20 years.
Argentina never has had a valid claim, which is why you won't take it to the International Court of Justice.
Your government are thieves, liars and gansters. They rob you, and blind you with the 'Malvinas' Myth. But this myth isn't going to help feed Argentine people. It isn't going to create jobs. It isn't going to allow you to exploit your own natural resources, that if your government wasn't so corrupt and inept, would make Argentina one of the richest countries in the world.
This constant blabbing on about the Falklands by your government, instead of dealing with the REAL problems of Argentina is angering the sensible Argentine people (I don't count you Malvinitas and La Campora trolls among them), who want the government to do the job that they were elected to do.
Time is running out for CFK and her clownish government. The more hysterical they get over the Falklands, the worse things are in Argentina. Everyone in the world knows this, even you Malvinistas (you just refuse to admit it aloud).
Tick, tock, default number 2 on the way, and this time the victims won't be 'foreigners' it will be the people of Argentina, who have had their pensions stolen, and their future destroyed.
Well done, CFK, for destroying Argentina.
I like the last one like in the old days...
What, when you got well and truly stuffed.....bring it on !!
I guess they could use the fishing fleet to get their forces to the islands.
Some Argies might read but refuse to see. Could go on about horse to water etc but have just had a Tesco lasagne.
SPECIAL COMMITTEE ON DECOLONIZATION ADOPTS DRAFT ON FALKLAND ISLANDS.
EAN-BAPTISTE AMANGOUA (C ôte d’Ivoire) Côte d’Ivoire called for the peaceful settlement of the question of the Falkland Islands . Self-determination was a precondition for the enjoyment of peoples’ fundamental rights, and therefore, any solution must allow for the exercise of that right in the Falkland Islands. Côte d’Ivoire maintained excellent relations with both the United Kingdom and Argentina, two friendly nations, and hoped that the two Governments would return to the negotiating table in order to achieve a lasting, peaceful solution to the issue as soon as possible.
RASIE KARGBO (Sierra Leone) said the principle of self-determination was a prime factor in any consideration of the question of the Falkland Islands (Malvinas). The basic principles outlined in resolution 1514 (XV) (1960) formed the basis of the Special Committee’s work. Citing General Assembly resolution 637 (VII), she said the Special Committee was obliged, not only to uphold the principle of self-determination, but to recognize it as a prerequisite for realising fundamental human rights. Any attempt to resolve the issue without taking into full account the wishes of the islanders would be inconsistent with the United Nations Charter and relevant Assembly resolutions.
Oy, oy, oy Ozzie......
That's the way to do it , boy....
Educate yourself before comenting.....
What a difference from your turnipy post (2) where you said.....:
“ I've yet to find any member of the Commonwealth of Nations who don't support the UK's position.”
You found many, I can see...... Almost without any help..... Good boy......
Any guess?
THINK she'll start confiscating private stocks of SOY and CORN for THE GOOD OF THE PEOPLE?
I think the only personal property rights that will be respected are hers and MaxiK. Until they're confiscated by the next regime that is...
Also I heard CFK's cronies were out with bags of U$ trying to bring up the peso yesterday. I wonder how long they can keep doing that...
not long I would guess
can't fight the market
although CFK tries and tries
They whole country is filled with bi-polar delusional nutjobs. Any sane people would have got rid of these bunch of criminally insane thugs a decade ago.
www.facebook.com/HonourRestored
Please support our other page - Falkland Islands Desire The Right - dedicated to Falkland Islands current affairs -
www.facebook.com/truthfk
Where do you get the idea that the FALKLAND ISLANDERS have said they want to remain BRITISH ( nonesense )
The Referendum being put to the FALKLAND ISLANDERS is the following
DO you wish the FALKLAND ISLANDS to retain their current political status as an overseas territory of the United Kingdom YES/NO they have a choice and the UK will abide by their decision.
IT IS CALLED SELF DETERMINATION
Ok, this is a little embarrassing (for you).
“Oy, oy, oy Ozzie......
That's the way to do it , boy....
Educate yourself before comenting.....”
Umm here’s some education. It’s Aussie Aussie Aussie Oi Oi Oi!
youtu.be/uTjT3RXBO6I
THAT’S the way YOU do it BOY!
Wow I gave you a chance to correct yourself and you just couldn’t resist trying to point score…. Well it’s 3/4 time and you’re only kicking behinds while I kick goals. Keep trying.
In Australia, Ozzie is an ostrich.
“What a difference from your turnipy post (2) where you said.....:
“I've yet to find any member of the Commonwealth of Nations who don't support the UK's position.”
Yerp! Still trying to find where I changed my point of view. You seem to believe that just because some Commonwealth countries are members of CELAC or sit on the C24 Committee or just because some Commonwealth countries are pro-Argentinean that this mean they do not support the UK.
Please show some links to clear and definitive statements by the governments of countries you listed that say they do not support self-determination for the Falkland Islanders.
I’m all for someone’s legitimate claims but Argentina doesn’t have legitimate claims and even most Argentineans know this. Deep down even you know this I think because you don’t argue using any of the Argentinean government’s lies, you just obfuscate.
The UK’s position is that the Islanders can choose their own form of government. The UK position is self-determination. If the Islanders chose to join Argentina, then the UK would support that.
“Good boy......”
I am indeed. Thank you!
PS: I see you chuckle at me less now, which is a real shame because now I am unable to not-so-subtly call you a retard. You just take all the fun out of replying, but none of my arrogance.
if that doesn’t work always argies have the Gun resource they also can invade the Islands”
And get a battering again, only this time you'll lose some air bases but as your navy is sinking itself we don't need to bother with that.
Do you really think the decimation of what is left of Argentina's forces is a good idea?
What would then prevent other South American countries from invading you?
Because you know they will.
you wish..
the falklands will be british long after every single argie alive today, is long gone to fairy land.
chimp,
what an insult to chimps,
still,
better a honest chimp,
than an argies liar..
Cameron and Hague are hugely competent public speakers, they've made their thoughts know on this matter unambiguously, job done.
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