The New Falklands War
By Jaime Daremblum from the Hudson Institute (*) - In 1982, Argentina's right wing military junta launched a sudden invasion of the Falkland Islands, the South Atlantic archipelago that has been a British possession since 1833. The invasion was motivated by a desire to distract attention from the country's severe economic woes, including hyperinflation and massive capital flight.
We all know what happened next: Margaret Thatcher dispatched troops to retake the islands by force; the subsequent British victory boosted her popularity at home while further weakening the Argentina junta; and by the end of 1983, constitutional democracy had been restored in Buenos Aires.
Ever since then, however, democratically elected Argentina governments have periodically played the Falklands card to drum up domestic support and enhance their diplomatic standing in Latin America. This year marks the 30th anniversary of the war, and, not surprisingly, President Cristina Kirchner is once again bullying the islanders, with the help of neighboring countries. In December, the Hugo Chávez-inspired Community of Latin American and Caribbean States (CELAC) voted unanimously to endorse “Argentina's legitimate rights in the sovereignty dispute over the Falklands/Malvinas”.
A few weeks after the CELAC summit Mercosur trade group-which consists of Argentina, Brazil, Paraguay, and Uruguay-formally agreed to embrace “all measures that can be put in place to impede the entry to its ports of ships that fly the illegal flag of the Malvinas Islands.”
As if Buenos Aires needed more encouragement to rattle sabres, the President Obama administration provided it on January 20, when a State Department official was asked about the Falklands dispute. “This is a bilateral issue that needs to be worked out directly between the governments of Argentina and the United Kingdom,” the official said. “We encourage both parties to resolve their differences through dialogue in normal diplomatic channels. We recognize de facto United Kingdom administration of the islands but take no position regarding sovereignty.”
From a British perspective, these comments were deeply disappointing, but not altogether surprising, given Obama's history on the issue. From an Argentine perspective, the comments represented a major diplomatic triumph.
“The fact that the United States government does not recognize the British allegation of sovereignty on the islands show[s] that it is necessary that the United Kingdom should sit at the negotiation table with our country, to open a bilateral dialogue,” declared Foreign Minister Héctor Timerman. “We are sure that all Latin America views with satisfaction the stand taken by the United States on Malvinas.”
(Timerman, incidentally, is the same man who accused the United States of operating torture schools, who helped provoke a crisis in U.S.-Argentine relations over a routine military-training exercise, and who reportedly offered to suspend the investigations of two Iranian-backed terrorist bombings in return for economic concessions from Tehran.)
London is clearly alarmed by the recent escalation of Argentine rhetoric, and also by Timerman's successful diplomatic offensive across the Western Hemisphere. (The Argentine foreign minister recently travelled to Central America, and subsequently reported that “the support of the Central American countries [on the Falklands] was outstanding.”)
The British government has bolstered its military presence in the Falklands, and Prime Minister David Cameron has rebuked Buenos Aires for its provocations while rebuffing charges that British policy amounts to colonialism. “What the Argentines have been saying recently, I would argue, is far more like colonialism because these people”-the Falklanders-“want to remain British and the Argentines want them to do something else”.
Make no mistake: Just as the Galtieri regime did in 1982, the Kirchner government is deliberately stoking a conflict with Britain in order to divert public attention from domestic concerns. Argentina's inflation rate is not nearly as high today as it was 30 years ago, but it's still among the highest in the world. Buenos Aires has been doctoring inflation statistics and other economic figures, hoping to conceal the extent of the problem, but foreign investors haven't been fooled.
Back in September, the government went a step beyond fudging the numbers: Judge Alejandro Catania subpoenaed several Argentine newspapers, demanding that they hand over the contact information of journalists who had written or edited articles about the economy. Judge Catania also went after private consultants who had given legitimate economic data to institutions such as the IMF. His actions prompted Council on Foreign Relations scholar Walter Russell Mead to write that “stockholders should be able to sue the management of any company which puts money into Argentina. It is hard to think of measures which send a more unmistakable warning of dishonesty and impending crisis. Nothing and no one can be safe in a country where such things are done.”
Kirchner's persecution of unfriendly economic journalists has been part of a larger campaign to intimidate all Argentine journalists from criticizing her administration. A newly enacted media law will expand her control over the press, and a newly enacted “terrorism” law could potentially “allow the state to imprison people for up to 15 years for activities as diverse as marching in protests or pulling money out of banks,” according to Reuters. Justice Eugenio Zaffaroni of the Argentine Supreme Court has warned that it may eventually be used “against social protest and against the unions,” adding that “the country does not need this anti-terrorism law.”
Rather than address well-grounded fears about the media and terrorism laws, the Kirchner government has chosen to whip up a nationalist frenzy over the Falklands. We should note one other key motivation for its behaviour: The British have increased their oil-exploration activities around the archipelago, and “Falklands’ oil industry sources” recently told MercoPress that the initial exploration “was hugely successful.” Needless to say, major oil discoveries would raise the stakes in the Falklands dispute.
As that dispute continues, Britain should recognize Argentina's sabre-rattling for what it is: A transparent political ploy by an increasingly autocratic government whose domestic policies have reduced freedom, unleashed high inflation, sparked enormous capital flight, and created the conditions for an economic crisis.
(*) Ambassador Jaime Daremblum is a Hudson Institute Senior Fellow and directs the Center for Latin American Studies. This article was published by Weekly Standard Online and reprinted with permission.
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86 comments Feed
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I have to ask if anyone is at all surprised by this?
Recently I was asked by an Argentine if the British army was 'very small now' and 'not capable of war over the Falklands'. I didn't want to get into the whole debate so I just dropped in that it is more than numbers of men, like superior weaponry that has to be considered when assessing an army's capability. He also excitedly asserted that 'Cameron is in a lot of trouble because he is so unpopular'. I am not sure where he is getting his information.
It is true that the unions are ramping up the stakes in Argentina. Blockading the airport and threatening more action.
unfortunately in the real world it often leads to third world nations being painfully humiliated.
A poll taken yesterday in Argentina suggested the issue is a popular one, so it is not going out of the news anytime soon, sandwiched between bulletins on the endless strikes/protests, complains about inflation and ever increasing crime.
What a crazy thing for the Argentine to ask you about.
In any event;
Argentina - professional army 73,100 + 31240 paramilitaries (IISS 2010)
United Kingdom - professional army 197,780 + 212,400 reservists (IISS 2010)
So even in numbers we out number them 4:1 on the ground, let alone the better weapons in our hands.
How can they think that the 4th most powerful country in the World is unable to defend a territory that uses only £70 Million of our £45 Billion annual military budget? Somebody must be planning something stupid, again.
Well It is an opinion.Certainly the state department thinks differently.
As oil prospects goes,well the re is nothing there,so obviously he did not talked with the industry.Off shore is terrible expensive aand they need a lot of infraestructure from the continent.
Obviosuly daremblum knows nothing about history or international law.
Strange he mention the military,when some importants USA banks,like the citibank,were saved by Argentina and others SA countries,by pushing their loans.
Strange he does not mention that the conservative wanted to get rid of the MAlvinas in '80s.
Strange he does not mention the 1990 policies.Of course wall street Journal and Financial Times,were all too happy with them...
Strange that the people are much better off nowthan the “glorious 1990”
Either way i for one would shoot first and ask questions later ;-)))
”Bettter you sout yourself mateboy.Because there is nothing you can do about the oil...
MALVINAS ARGENTINAS!
Thanks,but I prefer the kirchner than the uk dictatorships...
Seem that they are getting nervous,that in Argentina are going to nationalize the oil industry.
BTW I live half of my life away from Argentina.
NOOOO body brainwashed me....
I feel sorry for your brainwashing.....Still think to “free” Libia,and Iran?
Just come and see for yourself...There is Full democracy and the people know exactly what they have to do.....
The political party in the uSA brainwashed them..They bankrupt USA and the conservative banrupt uk....
BTW: I talked with a friend of mine,lived for 25 years in France.He returned with his Argentine family set up a plasctic industry..and HE likes the kirchner.
Poor deluded brainwashed brits.....
COme and visit Argentina..dictatorship?/ In your dreams
Thats because she is his best customer:-))))))
Long Live the Falklands.
At Hudson, Daremblum frequently writes critical commentaries about leaders in Latin America, especially in countries that have pursued left-of-center political projects. Among his favorite topics are relations between Iran and countries like Bolivia and Venezuela, which he describes in a menacing light.
rightweb.irc-online.org/profile/daremblum_jaime
BESIDES, don't miss the recent and renewed support given by Costa Rica to Argentina in www.rree.go.cr/?sec=servicios%20al%20publico&cat=servicios%20de%20informacion&cont=593¬icia=898
Thats because she is his best customer:-))))))
really?/ I do not think so.Why don't you come and experience the “kirchner” oppression???
Strange in the internet era,somebody can brainwash you.
BTW,the people are rebelling agains some of kirchner free market policies.
Like the big minnings corp....
Sounds like Malvinero1 plans to be on a fishing boat and will be armed, best we ignore their white flags (history shows they are a dishonourable people and shoot people under a white flag), and spray these fishing terrorists with as much lead as possible, and then when everything is silently smouldering we then ask them to surrender
really,wireless?/ Why do not talk with bramley about the mkilling and raping of Argentine prisioners????
You are crazy wireless!
Nothing....................
I say :
The culture of greed and impunity we are witnessing on many TV screens scretches right up into corporate boardrooms and the Governments cabinets.It embraces the internal security powers and large part of media. It is not just its demaged youth ,but Britain itself (plus maybe Argentina) that needs a moral reformation....!.............
Unfortunately the double standart from Governments are symptomatic of widespread double standarts at the very top of our societies.It should be stressed that most people continue to believe in honesty,decency,hard work and putting back into society at least as much as they take out......!..........................
Besides i would love to know where CFK intends to get the billions of USD needed to compensate the international companies for nationalising their operations in argentina, consider the fact argentina has no money spare.
Nothing or talk about worthless things............
I say :
Political will for State managing is also sort supply nowadays.That's hardly surprising given that countries expected to help ruling the nations are the same ones that until recently were accused of neoimperialism.Remember 2002 Sierra Leoneans wellcome the British Peacekeeping forces with open arms and even wax nostalgic all about the old days of British Rule.But they revolted against the British Colonialism in the 1950s not so long ago,they condemned it as the root
cause all their problems.Should we be surprised that the British are ,at best ambivalent about their role ?
Colonial Powers formed a dozen of new States as they conquered vast swaths of territory ,tinkering with old political and leadership structures and eventualy replaced them with new countries and governments.The greater the difference between the precolonial political entities and what the colonial powers tried to impose ,the higher rate of failures......!....................
The lesson by now should be clear..no country is so insignificant that it can never become important.So, by all means let's focus our efforts only on strategically important countries ,as long as we can predict which ones they are...............!........................................
This article makes the worst of the BBC,Voa and Radio Moscow look like honest reporting
Bolivia has done,against giant petrobras and they doing fine.....
Anyway that is OUR decision.
CFK dictatoship...
By you people don't come and experience yourself the“ dictatorship”
Came any time.There is a Direct fligth in BA,LOndon -Buenos Aires
Outbound - Thursday 2 Feb, 2012 £ 1,246.83
Email price quote Currency calculator
Change flights
21:40
2 Feb 08:20
3 Feb Heathrow (London) Buenos Aires (Pistarini) BA0245
British Airways World Traveller
Inbound - Friday 17 Feb, 2012
14:40
17 Feb 06:50
18 Feb Buenos Aires (Pistarini) Heathrow (London) BA0244
British Airways World Traveller
Price breakdown
Passenger Fare Taxes, fees, charges and surcharges per person Total price*
1 Adult £ 883.00 £ 363.83 £ 1,246.83
1200 pounds..Check it out!
Rubbish talkers
Why not Aerolineas Argentinas? A bit too embarrassing?
Why not Aerolineas Argentinas? A bit too embarrassing?
No just I do not want you get “indoctrination” from kirchner.
The reason AA has no direct fligth,is cheaper but you have to connect Rome or Madrid.
Depart:
09:55
Arrive:
13:20
February, Tuesday 14
London Gatwick Airport , GB (LGW)
February, Tuesday 14
Madrid , ES (MAD)
Air Europa
Non Stop / UX 1014
Cabin: Economy / Embraer Jet E90
flight info
Connecting Flight
Depart:
20:05
Arrive:
04:55
February, Tuesday 14
Madrid , ES (MAD)
February, Wednesday 15
Buenos Aires-Pistarini , BA , AR (EZE)
Aerolineas Argentinas
Non Stop / AR 1133
Cabin: Economy / Airbus A340
flight info
Inbound
Depart:
22:55
Arrive:
16:05
February, Wednesday 29
Buenos Aires-Pistarini , BA , AR (EZE)
March, Thursday 01
Rome-Fiumicino , IT (FCO)
Aerolineas Argentinas
Non Stop / AR 1140
Cabin: Economy / Airbus A340-300
flight info
Connecting Flight
Depart:
19:55
Arrive:
21:45
March, Thursday 01
Rome-Fiumicino , IT (FCO)
March, Thursday 01
London Heathrow , GB (LHR)
Alitalia
Non Stop / AZ 206
Cabin: Economy / Airbus A318/319/320/321
flight info
TOTAL
Base Fare:
€622.00 EUR
Taxes :
461.25 EUR
Taxes and fee:
461.25 EUR
Total:
€1083.25 EUR
Thanks for that. Also, get this; Aerolineas Argentinas, the Argentine flag carrier and 99.4% owned by the Argentine Government offers fares on its website from Londres a Buenos Aires (I got Think to translate because nobody from non-Spanish speaking countries can read of write Spanish) for FKP908.
Malvi, do you know what FKPs are? Let me tell you. Falkland Islands Pounds! It doesn't even have / Malvinas Pounds written after it. So that's right, the English version of the website calls London Londres but offers prices in FKP!
What better time, than when the hosts are busy doing other tasks,
But then that’s what A surprise is all about, when your back is turned
Is it not .
.
Good for you!
You know what? That is an international currency calculator..
BTW,the only fligth is from LAN.Does NOT HAVE THE flk pounds.
Of course who want to go to the Malvinas dictatorship.
And for the astronomic cost of 850 USD,from Pta Arenas....
BTW: AA or LAN DOES NOT
www.lan.com/cgi-bin/compra/paso3.cgi?just_refresh=1;session_id=xy44691328131265_K03X7BRBS3
COme and visit Argentina..dictatorship?/ In your dreams
I here and I see exactly what Argentina is. Almost a dictatorship. What is it that you see? from what i read of your post you are not discribing Argentina but some other country,
There is no where i read this fact in Argentina. If he were in Argentina writing this he would be arrested givern accident.
I thought Merco Press was Argentine?
First,the Explosion on the AMIA(A jewish institution),was proven,the explosion CAME from THE INSIDE!I know the civil engineers,who determined the explosion(incidentally,one of them is a Full time Proffessor in a university in Argentina,M.Sc, from Princeton U,PhD from Imperial College,London.
The Israeli embassy in Argentina,does not further the investigation,because apparently this explosion was an accident.The Iran connection has not been proven.So the Israelis are playing down the incident,and they do not want to talk.
And there are journalist that criticized this.Noo body has arrested anybody from this charges.
ere and I see exactly what Argentina is. Almost a dictatorship. What is it that you see? from what i read of your post you are not discribing Argentina but some other country”Really?
So cristina kirchner was put without elections....If the people are unhappy,we already kicked out dictators,civil governments,the brrtisi,who wanted to impose their imperial policies in Argentina....
So tell me what is democracy then???
Your stupidity are amazing...
it follows quite straightforwardly that Argentina is a failing democracy, no matter how much of a rightwing nutcase Darenblum happens to be.
Cut the crap jordao....
The powerful normally control the press.Now in the internet times..is difficult.
daremblum,he does not knows what he is taking about...
Just be serious...guys....Kirchner wons with 54% of the votes in an open election....and many people voted for her,and many are happy...May be there are imperfections in the democracy..but the people can kick them out anytime..
There is no conspiracy happen in Argentina. Accidents but no conspiracy.
There is no conspiracy happen in Argentina. Accidents but no conspiracy.
Who says conspiracy......
nd who reportedly offered to suspend the investigations of two Iranian-backed terrorist bombings in return for economic concessions from Tehran.)
He says about the Iranian bombing.... refereed to the AMIA.....
Poor fillippo....So that is democracy..If the people do not like them,just kick them out like De la Rua....
I have pointed,The Timmerman
that dispute continues, Britain should recognize Argentina's sabre-rattling for what it is: A transparent political ploy by an increasingly autocratic government whose domestic policies have reduced freedom, unleashed high inflation, sparked enormous capital flight, and created the conditions for an economic crisis.
Reduced freedom..In which way????Are journalist beign put in jail?
I feel extremely free in Argentina.I do not see the people demostrating for democracy..Are the people protesting for inflation???The people I have talked,voted for cristina...so because they consider,they are better off now than comapres with menem.....Do you want more democracy like that?
I think what he state is crap....Opinionated stuff..
He said sbre rattling?/ Strange for a country that has asked,very civilized to an imperial one-uk-for talks,since 1833,and 6 ivitation for arbitration....
He IS GARBAGE!
ok jordao..An NOO BODY brainwash me.....
It is all BS...No substance...
Asking the islanders what they want sounds straightforward but is disengenuous; if you invade someone's land, evict the inhabitants, install your people and then ask your people what they want they are bound to say they want you!
Simple logic for most but this place is mostly frequented by idiots
MAybe also an UNGA resolutions...It seems they have no argument and everybody will laugh at them......Still 10 UNGA res that uk is not complying
Next it will be the LAN fligth cancellation....
And I think daremblum, Argentina should sue him and trow him in jail...for LIAR!!
indigenous peoples in Argentina, unlike what your post would lead us to believe, were NOT evicted! They were mistreated? Yes, but not evicted unlike what the English did with Malvinas in 1833.
Get your facts straight and then come back and join us.
For a couple of centuries, virtually the entire “West” has at various times vilified iniquitous dictators they contemned and despised, using fustian bromides of standing up for the values of democracy in order to encourage their downfall. Yet simultaneously they mollycoddled and placated those that did their bidding! And in many cases the differences between dictator A and dictator B were exiguous: they both hailed from the same region (perhaps even have been abutting neighbors), they both were coeval in their rise to power, etc. Yet A was bad, B was good. Steadfast defenders of democracy?
“If a principle is true, you have to accept all of its consequences, not just the ones you find convenient. This is such a basic law of logic that those who cannot abide by it are rightly considered mentally impaired.”
Right?
But I would just label it criminal hypocrisy, which precludes them from any higher moral ground—in any discussion.
Or we can agree that the moral of the story is countries are not cynosures of probity, and will desert their principles on a dime when it is convenient.
Please let's stop either holding Argentina to a higher standard, or claiming other countries possess a higher standard. History is perspicuously clear, and a lot of the problems in today's world stem from this very fact.
Like you said, it's only an international currency converter...
...hang on. Did you say INTERNATIONAL currency converter? That offers Falkland Islands Pounds? Interesting.
He seems far more human! ♥
Argentina's intentions towards the Falkland Islands are a type of colonialism. You want to take over a peaceful country that has nothing cuturally or racially in common with you, and doesn't share a language with you, completely against the will of its inhabitants.
In fact you want to impose alien subjugation and domination on us and deprive us of our chosen government, which is against the constitution of the UN.
And your reason? Because Britain expelled a small garrison of soldiers nearly 200 years ago, who probably shouldn't have been here anyway.
And then you say you will respect our interests but not our wishes, because you think you are a better judge of our interests than we are. What a shockingly colonialist attitude that is.
It also completely ignores the fact that Falkland Islanders would never willingly submit to Argentine rule. So what would you do to us? And how would it look for you when we kept turning up at the UN demanding our independence? Actually, we wouldn't have to keep turning up, because we would be granted independence by the UK before it ever came to that.
You really haven't thought it through, have you?
You talk of 'taking a territory that has nothing culturally or racially in common with you, and doesn't share a language with you, completely against he will of it inhabitants'. Gee, that sounds and awfully similar to what occurred in 1833.
You say 'that Argentina wants to impose domination on the colonists'. Well, if you know your history, you'd know that Argentina's claim to the islands is certainly strong. The treaty of Utrecht recognised Spanish sovereignty and this led to 40 years of Spanish occupation of the islands, which was reasserted in 1823 by Buenos Aires after its independence from Spain. Ten years later the islands were seized by force by Britain, and settlers sent out in a crude act of imperial aggression.
In fact, Argentina has continuously and uninterruptedly protested its right to the islands then and since, regularly registering it with the UN's decolonisation committee, supported by other post-imperial states in south and north America.
You say that 'that you'd be granted independence by the UK'. Is that the same UK that at the very time of the Malvinas war, was transferring Hong Kong to China on similar grounds of expediency, and her favourite minister, Nicholas Ridley, was seeking a negotiated compromise on the Malvians with Argentina at the UN? This was for a transfer of sovereignty over the islands to Buenos Aires with entrenched leaseback to Britain to administer them on behalf of the 1,800 islanders, who would retain their right to remain British.
As you can see, I have thought it through and there is plenty out there to back Argentina's legal claim on the islands.
Self determination you say? Well, Britain never gave the Hong Kong islanders a say in whether they would be handed over to Beijing. The fate of Gibraltar cannot be delegated entirely to the Gibraltarians . There is nothing special about the Falklands.
jordao; Your logic does not work....Did all the europeans evicted them???I think they are amongs them.They receive the same education has everybody else,they can elect their government...hardly an eviction.Anyway in international law,if somebody kick out from your home,and you do not complin for a long period it become yours.The brits try to pull that card,it is called prescription,unfortunately for them,does not apply,because of tthe continuous protest....
26 Malvi
Like you said, it's only an international currency converter...
...hang on. Did you say INTERNATIONAL currency converter? That offers Falkland Islands Pounds? Interesting.
Really? Here you have another link
www.xe.com/ucc/
Anyway try to exchange the flk in Uruguay or Argentina..Even LAN does not list them has a currency....
HArdly anybody cares..foMalvinas
Argentina's intentions towards the Falkland Islands are a type of colonialism. You want to take over a peaceful country that has nothing cuturally or racially in common with you, and doesn't share a language with you, completely against the will of its inhabitants.
monty: Why do not ask your brits friend to call the UN security council....So if Argentina is harassing you...just call the Mercosur,UN etc..
You know why they will not call or take any legal action agains Argentina? Because they know since 1910 that Malvinass does not belong to them....
That is the reason always the brits avoid to go to court..6 invitation to arbitration......never wantet uk.
Treaty of Utrecht does not recognise Spanish sovereignty.
Spain never exercised its rights beyond the penal colony of Puerto Soledad, it certainly never exercised control as your own archives show that the French, British and Americans used the islands at will without interference.
And any Spanish rights were not transferred to Argentina.
Nor has Argentina continuously protested. In 1850, it signed the Convention of Settlement, settling its differences with the UK and was silent for 35 yrs. It wasn't raised in the Argentine Congress from 1850 till 1941 - 91 years. The current claim was revived in the 1930s.
And of course, the claim that the British expelled the “Argentine” settlement established by Vernet are, being polite as I can, bollocks. Vernet's settlement was established with permission from the British consulate - it was in fact Vernet who urged the British to send a permanent garrison.
And the usual red herring about Hong Kong. Hong Kong was leased, under an agreement we would return it after 99 years and we did. In addition, the FCO machinations were done on the basis they cared more about trade with Argentina than the interests of the islanders and as far as they were concerned trading “worthless” islands for improved relations was a good trade. This was nothing to do with recognition of Argentina's claim.
It was the British who suggest the ICJ as a route to have the legal basis of respective claims judged, its Argentina that doesn't have the balls to do so. Says everything really.
As above, ditto etc.
It appears to escaped your notice that this isn't 1833.
Nothing that happened then excuses the human rights violation you wish to visit on us. Do you really think that a settled population of several thousand islanders, many of the 9th generation, in the 21st century, is of lesser importance that a few long dead Argentine soldiers in 1833? What kind of weird fantasy world are you living in?
You are still completely lacking any practical solution as to how you practically subjugate an unwilling population of British citizens who are used to running their own country and making their own legislation and deciding for themslves what is in their interests. What's your plan?
And we would be granted independence by the UK any time we asked for it, for the simple reason that this is what the UK has promised us. What they promised the Hong Kong residents is that they would be handed back to China after 99 years. And that is what happened.
We can be strong again, with all our might and all our passion directed at Las Malvinas and ignore all our problem at home, we can again be strong.
Never give in to English colonials because our blood is thicker than water and the blood of Las Malvinas I believe is black gold for which many of us with right connections can get very rich from.....
We are not in an Argentine territory and we will not be under Argentine rule. I know you think you have the right to offer us either subjugation or ethnic cleansing, but you are not the administering power and are actually nothing to us but a noisy neighbour with delusions of their own importance.
“smallpox blankets” = a lie. no one issued “smallpox blankets” to the Argentines or any Amerindians ever. There is NO, that is ZERO evidence for this. It is a lie.
You may just as well say, Argentina conspired to arm Neapolitan, it's over 200 years ago but then all claims to anything for Argentina goes back before their country even existed. There may be no evidence for it but, what the hell! It helps us paint them as the villains! Irrespective of its relevance 200 years later!
This is the mindset of a typical Argentine, having spent 6 miserable years living in Argentina and dealing with Argentine males, who make the average 6 year old in the UK seem mature, this is the what I've come to accept.
Their attitute to their resent history of genocide of their own youth, is either 1. don't talk about it or 2. they deserved it - they were terrorists. Nice, so it's ok to rape people and chuck their bodies out of the back of Argentine Air Force planes into the Atlantic Ocean, their families never to know the truth? Apparently, for the average Argentine, the truth is something they are incapable of dealing with. Making up reality is something they used to, it helps them deal with their mediocre lives.
The Falkland islanders have rights. They have the right to determine their own sovereignty. They know what Argentine democracy looks like. Every day that goes by, reinforces that view. killing them all may seem like a good idea to the average Argentine but realistically, in the court of world opinion it wouldn't work. The reality is no amount of force - short of genocide - can change that, therefore all the threats, all the name calling, all the jumping up and down in the world does nothing for the cause of Argentina other than make it look like some small child that has just thrown its dummy out of the pram.
Jo
Thanks for your reply. First, if you do amdit to holding Argentina to a higher standard than others have held other nations, and Argentina falls short, then perhaps it is not entirely that country's fault. Maybe your standards were unrealistic and should re-examine them :)
Second, let's play Devil's advocate. I personally support the rights of the Falklanders to self-determination. Let's say Dilma comes out tomorrow and changes course and supports this as well. Let's say Piñera did so as well. The Falklanders would be incredibly grateful, no doubt; the UK copacetic about it also. And then:
“as it appears that you are incapable of realising that what is sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander.”
The day after tomorrow.... a confederation of Amazon Tribes stretching from western Matto Grosso into Amazonas and Acre demand the right to self-determination. What position would the denizens of the Falklands take on the matter? And what does Dilma do?
British people should know that self-determination rights are only for natives, which “falklandres” are crearly not.
Really? Is that the history they tell you in Malvina's monty?
HK was NOT ON A LEASE!The surrounding N Territories was a lease.HK Island and Kowloon were ceded on perpetuity.
Date Treaty Result
20 January 1841 Convention of Chuenpee Preliminary cession of Hong Kong Island to the United Kingdom
29 August 1842 Treaty of Nanjing Cession of Hong Kong Island, founded as a crown colony of the United Kingdom
18 October 1860 Convention of Beijing Cession of Kowloon (south of Boundary Street)
1 July 1898 Second Convention of Beijing Lease of the New Territories (including New Kowloon)
ANd the HK DID NOT WANTED TO GO TO CHINA,like 3 millions..
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Hong_Kong
Get history straight..
Lol malviner you never cease to amaze me with how stupid and dumb you are, ”1 July 1898 Second Convention of Beijing Lease of the New Territories (including New Kowloon)” that kind of says it all really and confirms that yes the UK leased Hong Kong and New Kowloon from china. I suggest you read the wiki on the convetion i stated above as it makes it clear why it was unfeasible to return only the new kowloon land and not the whole of hong kong as it would have meant splitting the city in two.
Also you competely ignored the Sino-British Joint Declaration of 1985 - which basically explains all there is to know about the matter.
Referring to hong kong issue and using that to better your course over the falklands is illogical and originally hong kong was part of chine, yet the falklands were and have never been part of argentina so its a compeltely different situation.
perhaps argentina can prove they climbe out of the tree first, and thuse have first pick on the falklands,
[you never know the ICJ may even agree with you]
I doubt it, but hey stranger things have happend .lol.
Mhr
This is absolute bollocks. The UN has never said anything of the kind. The UN would never say anything so ridiculous because several of the territories that are or were on the UN's NSGT list do not have native populations. Some never had native populations because they were uninhabited when discovered by Europeans.
They will say anything to get their own way, no matter whether it is the truth or not.
No, Argentina, no, you cannot have our land.
You donot own it & never did.
Feel free to:-
1) rant
2) rave
3) whine
4) scream like a child
5) cry(crocodile tears)
6) snivel
7) etc etc etc ad nauseum
BUT:-
There will be NO NEGOTIATIONS on Sovereignty.
Got it? Gooooooood.
There will be NO NEGOTIATIONS on Sovereignty.
Got it? Gooooooood.
Really???
You will loose the battle...already a bankrupt country,will not put more money to “defend” you....remember Ridley in the '80???
Referring to hong kong issue and using that to better your course over the falklands is illogical and originally hong kong was part of chine, yet the falklands were and have never been part of argentina so its a compeltely different situation.
You a re a LIAR!!
MAlvinas was part of Argentina...
1/the Brits gave blankets to native Americans
2/the blankets carried smallpox
3/native americans were decimated by smallpox
4/the Brits did little to address the situation
I will pause there,because at the same time that this was occurring,the Brits did little to improve the Irish situation,and were also very active in the slave trade.
Returning to the matter of smallpox.
5/the Brits did not manifest any concern about the native Americans as they were having a lack of success in subjugating the native population.
And I am lying you say.tell me where the lies are.
Argentina will always talk history but never the future. Stop thinking about the PAST and look to the FUTURE.
Inflation in Argentina is poor, corruption is widespread and murder rate is high (when compared to more developed countries). You would rather let your country fall into the abyss whilst trying to claim the Falkland Islands than actually sort out the real problems! It is just pathetic that your focus on this is stronger than anything else. It is this type of mentality that is shown by the Taliban. It must be terrible that you can be compared to people as backward as them! You must be deeply embarrassed.
please can you prove this statement,
please provide the evidence
please show me a document that states the british did this,
i want proof,
////////////
show me proof, and you tell truth,,
no proof and you lie .
It makes me laugh! They still run on about their 'silly Falkland Islands claim' but will not comment on their inflation, corruption and crime problems. It just shows a total lack of morals and understanding!
l think that you are mixing up what l said with someone else but that doesn't matter as l agree with them anyway.
The Falklands have NEVER been a part of Argentina, are NOT part now & NEVER will be.
So, no, l am not lying.
Get used to it, signor.♥
Yet another wasted opportunity for our “Price Turnips” Mr. Briton and Mr. BenC30 to keep quiet and avoid embarrassing themselves once again…………….
www.nativeweb.org/pages/legal/amherst/lord_jeff.html
You say…
to keep quiet and avoid embarrassing themselves once again.
Briton say’s..
On the same page, it reads= people have doubted these stories; other people, believing the stories, nevertheless assert that the infected blankets were not intentionally distributed to the Indians
Yuleno says .
Native Americans were decimated by smallpox
[Eye] say..
Yuleno goes way over the top, it did not decimate all native Americans,
Only these at the fort, and this is north and not south, so strictly not correct,
But never let it be said, that [eye] Briton cannot apologise if deemed wrong,
And if I am wrong, then of course eye, apologise,
Another great British turnip, who knows how to be a gentleman,
In front of overwhelming odds, …lol.
.
but as now they have to wait a hundred years,
perhaps the plastic airfix company could help out .
Given the choice between being diplomacy and child like spats of anger and lies, they choose child like spats of anger and lies.
Argentina has never recovered from being a wannabe be Axis power in the 1930's. Argentina's version of fascism (like that of Spain's) remained undefeated by WW2 Allied powers. It hadn't even had to fight a real civil war to maintain power, just murder 50,000-100,000 of its own unarmed political activists and we all know how easy that was for their brave and heroic military men, like their hero Commander Astiz.
It took the Falklands War to shake the Argentines into some semblance of reality. Remove their military government and see the Americans as something other than a benevolent uncle, rather more like a the uncle you kept your children away from, you know the one in the old mack who always had his hands in his pockets and a grimace on his lips.
But within a few short years a girl came alone, a wannabe Eva Peron and took them all the way back to year zero! And the Argentine people gave up their collective memory and switched back to servile child.
In the West it's very difficult to understand how the average Argentine thinks. We have to imagine how our own per-adolescent children think and we can then get into their mindset. Give them a box of toy soldiers & some flags to play with and they are as happy as pie, tell them that they can't own Tracey Island though and they will cry their eyes out.
At school, the teachers would always tell them “Tracey Island” was their's. Even though the reality was, it wasn't..
The indocrinators may object to you,
But you are doing just fine,
You are entitled to say you piece .
.
I dont deny that we have serious problems, but mr darenblum is telling just the half of the question, he should review hes thought, and analyse if a woman who was reelected with the 54% of the votes, would need to use this cause, in order to distract people's mind, specially if we have an economy which expanded 9% in 2011, and it's forecasted to expand betwen 5 and 6% this year, despite the global crisis.
On the other hand, the anti terrorist law, had some corrections, and the social wont be repressed, respecting the inflation indexs, i wont put my hands on the fire nor for the indec, nor for any private analist, some of them showed very poor methods which are used to measure the inflation level, but beyond the controvery of the indexs, no one can deny that there are much more job oportunities than 10 or 20 years ago, beside, if we want to find the true reason of the inflation, we should talk about the oligopolic concentration that we have in the most important sectors of the economy, so it's not wrong if the state controls and sanctions them, on the other hand, i dont deny neather that the government has negative aspects too, but it's not as terrible as what is showed in the media.
Respecting the project that declares of public interest, the fabrication of paper, it will give the oportunity to all the newpapers, to have an equal acces to the prize of the paper, i dont know what kind of restriction to the freedom of press is that, like the oligopolic mediatic groups argue all the time. Like i said in planty of oportunities, dont buy so easily the partial information that you read in the newspapers.
make ya mind up .
It make me laugh when us Europeans argue that there is no proof! where is the proof? the documents? etc.. when by now i'm sure we all know that us Europeans have continuosly fabricated the world history, over history to justify our (us Europeans) actions and make ourselves( each of our individuals countries) appear in a better light. Africans had been saing for hundreds of years that we all came from Africa origionally. But it wasn't until it was undoubtedly proven by scientists a few decades ago that us westerners admitted this, as the scientific proof had become too big to hide this fact. We have constantly lied about slavery. Being a younger subject and going through education more recently, it is becoming quickly more apparent to todays youth that these facts are known worldwide. Education in history lessons is drastically changing in England at least to admit these things, so to me these statements as I mentioned above seem, very stupid. And if you went back into a history class in a modern school in England you would understand what I mean. Just had to get that out of my mind thats all. Am not trying to argue with anyone, am just stating the facts.
I already said that i dont deny that we have problems, in fact, i mention them all the time, but the situation is not as terrible as what is signalized in the newspapers, that's why i will always say that we can't buy so easily the so partial information that is published in the media, no matter if most you agree or not with the government, there are not many newspares which analyse deeply the diferent questions.
That is what “loyalists newspapers” inform.
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