Malvinas are Argentine for ever and “we will never yield in our claim”
“The Malvinas are Argentine for ever” and this government “will never yield in our claim” promised President Cristina Fernandez de Kirchner during the main commemoration of the Malvinas war Fallen and Veterans Day in Rio Gallegos, Santa Cruz province.
“Argentina will continue to reaffirm its international law right to negotiate the Malvinas Islands sovereignty”, she insisted on Saturday which recalls 2 April 1982, when Argentine military forces invaded the Falkland Islands and occupied them for 74 days before being expelled by a British Task Force.
Standing next to national and provincial authorities, and Malvinas veterans in downtown Rio Gallegos, (the political turf of her late husband and former president Nestor Kichner), Cristina Fernandez said “we will continue to reaffirm in all international forums the full force of international law to solve conflicts in abidance with the United Nations mandate for Great Britain to comply with what was mandated by the UN and sits to negotiate with Argentina in the terms so established”.
But Cristina Fernandez also made a strong appeal to patriotism and national unity saying that “I know we are going to recover what belongs to us, the Islas Malvinas, but I also know that the best homage to our fallen is this: armed forces and peoples blended together under the flags of our parties and those which bring us all together”
“No country can consider itself a nation if it does not recognize those who made the ultimate sacrifice for the motherland, and it is indispensable that all Argentines learn and understand that the motherland and its rights are above all circumstances and what we have been through”.
“It’s in democracy where the fortitude of a country can be built to address the great gests”, underlined Mrs. Kirchner pinpointing the importance of “national unity” since “whenever our nation was divided it was defeated from outside and from inside”.
The Argentine president then criticized UK’s pontificating: “on occasions when I’ve heard some British authorities express concern (about a new attempt on the Falklands) it sounds likes a joke coming from a country that likes solving conflicts by bombing (Libya, Iraq, Afghanistan), and particularly with suggestions against us who only participate in peace missions, and we are an example to the world of non nuclear proliferation”.
“Putting the spotlight on us, doubting of our peace intentions and above all our abidance of the law and international law” speaks of outdated colonialism, insisted the Argentine president.
She also recalled that in 1991 her late husband then mayor of Rio Gallegos Nestor Kirchner inaugurated a monument to the fallen in Malvinas in the Santa Cruz capital.
“I believe it was the third monument in the whole of Argentina because at that time the policy was to hide and forget, a de-Malvinization process which begun the same day they brought our brave soldiers back virtually hidden”, said Mrs. Kirchner.
Further on she recalled the blackouts during the war period in 1982, when the military dictatorship rule and called to differentiate what then happened, “separate those who ruled at the time under non democratic forms from the very event which was an exercise of national sovereignty and rejection of colonialism which stills shames humanity”.
The square in downtown Rio Gallegos where the commemoration of the 2 April 29th anniversary took place is named after Cardinal Antonio Samoré, Pope John Paul II envoy who skilfully in 1978/79 managed a peace and friendship agreement between Argentina and Chile, finally signed in Montevideo, Uruguay.
At the time both countries were ruled by military regimes but in late December 1978 the Argentine Junta decided to take by force some islands in the extreme south of the continent under dispute with neighbouring Chile.
John Paul’s personal intervention and appeal stopped the tanks rolling just moments before the battle was scheduled to begin.
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about Falklands-- Argentina--UK relations ...!
I haven't read and heard them right before ! very very interesting !
As for your leader, for only if you believe that the blind can lead the blind, then the blind will actually lead the blind straight into hell .
@4 Rise and Rise again until Lambs become Lions !!!
we need another lion heart,
not this shower we have in charge,
Sorry!! Is he your dating English friend?
Hell now she planning of using a school teachers letter from 1982 to brainwash your children with even more hatred towards the islanders and UK, and educate them in the false claims argentina claim over the islands. The argentine government say they are peaceful yet all the rehtoric comeing from there mouths and economic aggression towards to the islands says otherwise.
blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/brendanoneill2/100082174/why-the-british-political-class-is-so-snooty-about-gibraltar/#
Wow....someone told you something once that you're not going to tell us....
it's one hell of a compelling argument yul, you impress me.
I think the description of the writers says it all really “Brendan O'Neill is the editor of spiked, an independent online phenomenon dedicated to raising the horizons of humanity by waging a culture war of words against misanthropy, priggishness, prejudice, luddism, illiberalism and irrationalism in all their ancient and modern forms.”
What a complete Prick he is.
www.lanacion.com.ar/1362078-la-historia-del-malvinense-que-se-enamoro-de-la-argentina
Greetings to the people of the islands. Also for Isolde, Red, Justin, Monty, Zethee, Roberts, Marcos, xbarilox, etc ,etc. I hope to see you all in a asado.
;)
Please !! have a look this link, It is for you but just for special real kelpers
www.lanacion.com.ar/1362078-la-historia-del-malvinense-que-se-enamoro-de-la-argentina
“There is one simple solution to Britain and Spain’s spat over Gibraltar, which has hit the headlines once again following Spanish Crown Prince Felipe’s subtle moan to Prince Charles about Britain’s continuing rule over the Rock. And that solution is to have a look at a map. Anyone who does that, and who exercises his BRAIN while doing so, will see that Gibraltar is quite clearly a part of Spain, just as surely as the Falkland Islands are a part of Argentina, and that it therefore should be governed by Spain.”
Brendan O'Neill
blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/brendanoneill2/100082174/why-the-british-political-class-is-so-snooty-about-gibraltar/#
Yankees. Do not talk in his films of the conquest of the American West, killing Indians. John Wayne, Robert Mitchum, out.
There are many unfair things in the world. We are still struggling.
First you start the Chagos island and then continue the discussion.
UK out of Georgias Del Sur
UK out of Sandwich Del Sur
UK... don't even think about Antártida Argentina
ARGENTINA... keep pressing, don't stop until ALL our sovereignty has been RECOVERED.
BRITISH... OUT OF SOUTH AMERICA!!!!!!!!
This sounds like the Argentine governments smoke screen to cover up the fact they can't solve Argentina's real problems.
Hopefully Argentina's people are not really this gullible.
If the problems in Argentina get bad enough, will there be another war to take people's minds off the real problems?
President Cristina Fernandez de Kirchner wants the Ilse Malvinas/ Falkland Islands back from Brittan. Maybe she will give Paraguay back the land Argentina took from Paraguay?
@34 Martino, Spanish, get out of South America.
So if they are Argentina's forever, then Argentina must therefore currently be exercising sovereignty over them...but wait on a second!...Why then do you need to perpetually claim something if it is currently yours forever????!!!???
But mind you when has the Argentine state ever approached this issue in a rationale logical manner, some sensible ideas and words were briefly said by Carlos Menem, but that was the highlight of what we called rationale logic in Argentine diplomacy :)
Also, would you be happy for Chile to claim ownership of Argentina because it looks close on a map?
Given the very real and immediate problems Argentina's President should be addressing, does it occur to anyone there that this may be successful diversionary tactics by CFK?
I don't know what you heard from your mates,
All America and All Africa continents countries are always dirty .
I came from a alien space planet which is called the World !
#16/
U are on panic , reason ?
#23/
They can't be told openly...also I promised to be tight mouth !
#40/
the -- dirty-- word is even short,
but i can't blame peoples, countries ..
just the handiworks of few immoral idiots ... very vicious !
You say:
“ There will be another war.”
I say:
Who are you going to attack?
“Who are you going to attack?”
Name it...
So which statement is correct - because, logically, they cannot both be so?
Or are both statements false?
Back to Think's #42
Come to think of it Argentina has never attacked another country, that is a distinction shared almost exclusively amongst “superpowers”. ;-)
Dan4, meet Geoff
“Argentina is increasingly becoming a branch of hell...”
I take it you're from the islands and all you know is what you read or watch on TV. It all boils down to one thing and one thing only, ignorance. You have no idea what Argentina is like or what we expect from our president.
I can sit here and say that the UK is shit. Now how the hell would I know that? I've never been there.
Conquest of the desert.
Falklands war.
War of the tripple alliance.
War of the confederation.
Asuncion.
Conquest of the desert.
Populating the desert can hardly be described as a war, it was the natives who attacked the European immigrants. Argentina's defense was not aimed at destroying the native people.
Malvinas war.
The name says it all, our land, not yours. We did in 1982 what we should have done in 1833, a little late, and badly planned.
War of the Triple Alliance
Several theories exist, no doubt you will pick the one that portrays Argentina as the bad guy. And of course the fact that Paraguay invaded both Corrientes (Argentina) and Rio Grande do Sul (Brazil) will be conveniently omitted.
War of the confederation.
I'm going to call complete bullshit on this one, sorry. This started first by Chile declaring war on Peru which started with a tariff disagreement. It was also Peru's plan to place a blockade over Buenos Aires with the help of the French navy. (go figure) Peru had it coming…
Asuncion. ?
Again you're referring to the War of the Triple Alliance
It was there land, you landed, killed them and took there land.
“Malvinas war.”
You stated that you have never attacked another country. Nomatter your reasons you still attacked us. I am simply proving the fact that you are chatting shite again.
“War of the Triple Alliance”
Was wrong about this one, you attacked in defence.
“War of the confederation.”
You declared war then attacked them in Peru.
“Asuncion. ?”
Belgrano attacked the city to try and bring it under Argentine rule and lost. He was finally beaten again at tacuari and is the reason for there independance.
You attacked Uruguay in the civil war.
Stating that your nation has never attacked another nation is complete crap, even from you.
Also, nuclear plants aren't easy to fix and the country is a mess. I hope they get it sorted and no more people die from this disaster.
My view of Argentina is that of someone who sees it from both the inside and the outside. Argentina's resources have been managed, post the Perón period, by a bunch of selfish, corrupt imbeciles. This caused the economy to stagnate and deteriorate rapidly. I believe we are just beginning to wake up from this, the right people are beginning to have the right influence. People like national delegate Mario Cafiero, who does not support the current presidency in all aspects, I dare say almost none. The national debt is a very complex issue, I don't claim to understand it, but it is said that this debt has been payed many times over. Interest on this debt is usually higher than the rate at which the economy grows, making this debt a chronic decease. People like Cavallo and Lavagna, who in 1982/1991 and 2004 respectively transferred debt from privately owned operations to the state represent what is called internally, the 'illegal debt'. I'm not sure how this is being looked into now, I would need to find out.
Continued...
I think CFK has the right intentions, the right attitude. Whether or not she is being truthful, and whether or not she can overcome these chronic deceases the country faces, is yet to be seen. But since Nestor Kirchner took office and even more so since CFK took office there have been more changes for the better than for the worst. I will give you two examples. 1. The national aircraft factory, FMA, had been sold to McDonald Douglas, it simply stopped functioning. It is now back in the hands of the government and there are numerous projects in the works. 2. Tandanor, the national military shipyard in Buenos Aires, which run for a consecutive period of 112 years, was somehow sold to a private firm and driven straight to bankruptcy. Like the FMA, Tandanor is once again an industrial complex of the state and it appears to be doing very well.
I think I've already made my opinion of CFK's attitude towards the sovereignty dispute more than obvious, she represents the sentiments of the Argentine people extremely well. What she needs from us Argentines, is a little faith and a little less cynicism.
I know a great deal about the debt issue and you should spend some time, if you feel inclined, to look into it as I think you will see where the current financial troubles originate.
There are three sides to every story in a dispute. Two points of view and the truth. Who was most culpable for the financial last crisis, the Argentine government or the IMF and the bond traders that brought a country to its' knees? The truth is all of them. (Personally I think the bond traders are a bunch of lying thieves but I am sure their mothers love them).
I sincerely hope Argentina reaches its' potential but it will need the collective will of the people to do so. Institutional corruption has to become unacceptable at every level for a start. I could say more but I am not here to insult. I try to look objectively at the countries I work in and embrace the differences between them.
I agree, and like I said I'm not an expert, let me know if you speak spanish I think this site would interest you. proyectonacional.wordpress.com/la-deuda-externa-es-imparable/ It's the one I'm trying to learn from, maybe you can tell me if the info is accurate or not.
58 Dan4,
I didn't say the UK was shit, I said that I don't know because I've never been there, you're the only one that didn't get what I said.
“Every time I think it has hit rock bottom, it sinks further.”
If you are what you say you are, you strike me as one of those Argentines that blame the country for all your misfortunes, regardless of what the state of the country may be. Nothing to do with you, right? It's all the country's fault.
For your information, many… MANY Argentines that left Argentina during the worst periods are returning home, precisely because conditions in those countries are actually… WORST.
www.infobae.com/notas/518419-Se-multiplico-la-cifra-de-argentinos-que-vuelven-de-Espana-por-la-crisis.html
www.losandes.com.ar/notas/2011/3/25/argentinos-vuelven-558225.asp
noticias.rastrealo.com.ar/cientificos/58-800-cientificos-argentinos-regresan-al-pais.html
www.argentina.ar/_es/ciencia-y-educacion/C3882-cada-vez-mas-cientificos-regresan-al-pais.php
You want to blame Argentina for all your misfortunes? Why don't you build a cross instead and nail yourself to it, you're probably a victim no matter what country you live in. Go to hell.
63, I have not lost my identity, never will, I would rather put a bullet in my head.
I don't think Dan could say the same thing. Could you Dan?
(grillos)
No response?
“My identity is defined by my choices...” Whatever, I'm Argentine, simple.
You're full of shit and you haven't told us where you live.
Dan, if you don't like Argentina so be it, just keep your comments to yourself and be happy. We already have ENOUGH opposition here !!! Thanks!!
Good point, a gringo-wannabe is even worst than a gringo.
Get lost
On Danny boy, you miss the point, we live in a free society with freedom of speech so regardless if I like your comments or not is part of the debate. martin lives in Utah (argentine mormon) and I live in the Republic of Texas just in case if you want to know ..... the ain't thing is american, right?
Dan.. another 'Frank' who won't say where he's from or where he lives.
Weirdos
What a load of tripe. If she thinks these islands belong to Argentina how come they are not living here. Oh I forgot they don't belong to you do they.
History proves that. When will you morans get it .
As for war again you could not beat our British forces when you had already established key positions on the islands in 1982. What makes you think it will be easier this time round.
Face it the Islands will never be Argentine and the quicker you get used to it the better.
Seems we might also be enjoying a new wealth from the recent black gold find. You could say we have ze oil you don't.
Pitty that your leaders are still brain washing your kids. Still you have to clutch at any straws because without your brain washing chances are most sensible Argentines would let us get on with our lives in our own Country.
Good news is that last time I checked we were still British and your still over there complaining.
Napoleon Bonaparte
Can't remember who said that but it makes sense.
haha
“ There will be another war.”
Isolde the letter ñ that you just learn how to type is to be used only as a letter of mass discussion not destruction!
Remember?
71 lsolde (#)
Apr 03rd, 2011 - 03:00 am
@68 Thank you Marcos, try that one, Think. ññññ-l've found a new toy.
The Falkland Islands will only be prised from our dead, cold fingers. And before you accept that offer again Marty. Think about it.
Can't remember who said that but it makes sense. ”
Some Argie historian no doubt.
You Martin_Fierro, you are the worst of all, hypocrite. ¿Cómo podés estar viviendo en Estados Unidos? ¿No se te cae la cara de vergüenza? Los otros tres no valen un cazzo, pero vos parecías al menos distinto de los otros que desde el primer día me di cuenta que eran una basura hipócrita. Pero así son todos ustedes, critican al imperio pero aman los verdes más que su propia madre. Sigan dándonos consejos sobre como votar a Cristina de Kirchner desde los Estados Unidos, Canadá y Europa. Qué lindo, ¿también van a Aspen a esquiar con Boudou? Viva la dolce vita! Hello USA!
Youl
because they do not talk to your boysfriends and ask him again the secret that told you !!!!!
No problem, I had friends in Argentina who moved here, it seemed logical... not anymore, haha.
89 Dan4 & 90 xbarilox
What the hell?
l have absolutely no doubt that Argentina is beautiful & rich in resources. So why are you so poor? Use your boundless energy to clean up & develop your own country & forget about longing & lusting for our land. A land that you do not own, never have & never will.
Yes, Think, there will be another war. l can sense it.
On the subject of the article, it is clear that CFK is ramping up the Falklands for the sake of the presidential campaign. Now, IF there are any Argentines with brains, you would realise that you are NEVER going to get them. Doesn't matter how long you witter on about it, the Falklands, South Georgia and the South Sandwich Islands are BRITISH. The day may come when they will be independent, but that is up to the Islanders. They will NEVER be Argentine. Not least because they NEVER have been!
1) Who’s countrymen are fighting?
XbariloX??? : He is Chilean………………..
Dan4??? : Too rich, too intelligent, too successful, too important and too modest to be Argentinean :~)
The rest is having quite a civilized dialogue……….
2)Argentina is like a beautiful and difficult woman. And she can multitask.
3) You say:
Yes, Think, there will be another war. l can sense it.
I say:
Then, it will be you starting it......
Our military is virtually nonexistent. We have done a good job the last 29 years. Even the biggest British Turnips know that.
And will continue being virtually nonexistent in the foreseeable future.
,,,,
the only real problem with Argentina, is the idiots that run it, it could be so much better, if only its leader didn’t distract its incompetence by using the Falklands as a convenient distraction, and the fools that think the sun shines,, why is such a great country held back by blind self deluding incompetent fools that live in the past, get with the future, leave the Falklands alone and get on with making Argentina great again, sadly this will not happen this 21st century,, that’s bad news for Argentina, and good news for the rest of us,
la la ?
The British do not want a base in the South Atlantic, prior to 1982 there was virtually no military presence there. The only reason there is one at all is because Argentina invaded.
The more often you spout the same hysterical hyperbole, the more irritating you are and you'll just be ignored.
”Dan4??? : Too rich, too intelligent, too successful, too important and too modest to be Argentinean :~)“
You forgot ”too good-looking“ and ”too irresistible”, but since I'm also magnanimous, humble and understanding, you're forgiven for the oversight.
Well......................................
I'm beginning to Think that it may be a crumb of Argentine DNA in you....... But you have to work much much harder on your self esteem.
You employ far too many qualifying adjectives.
Saying “Argentinean” should suffice…………………………..
“Oh for gods sake, give it a rest will you.
The British do not want a base in the South Atlantic”
Suuure.
www.clarin.com/politica/Mount-Pleasant-llego-ajuste-Cameron_0_455954478.html
“the Falklands are safe for the foreseeable future”
Dan4, not even GOD knows what you are. But I tell you right now, you're not Argentine no matter what your passport says.
You disgust me.
Compelling Marcos, a Clarin reporter says he saw soldiers in a military base and warships in a military port, obviously they can't be there to defend British territory, they must be there to take over the South Atlantic, interesting logic.....or more accurately, paranoia.
Can you detect and prove anything factually wrong with the statement “the Falklands are safe for the foreseeable future”? I bank on it being empirically sound, but if you want to challenge it with anything other than empty rhetoric, give it your best shot. I'm certain it'll be enjoyable.
Jupppppppp
Malvinas are safe for the foreseeable future…………………........................
But, if no oil is found………… they will also be stagnant, sleepy, sluggish, sagging, snoozing, slow-moving, somnolent, stooping, slothful, slacking, slumping, slouching and slumbering for the foreseeable future.
Just like Argentina “the Mother country”
“Yes, it would not be worth spending a single bullet in this piece of of asshole”
Not an exact translation but good enough. Whats funny though is the real reason it wouldn't be worth spending a single bullet is because they haven't got enough bullets to spend. And with their inflation at 25%, i doubt they will beable to afford any more bullets anytime soon either lol.
I know exactly what you mean. Cape Town is great, but I think the Western Cape gets even better as you get closer to the Indian Ocean. Franschhoek and Stellenbosch have the potential to match Napa, Bordeaux and Tuscany in the near future. I love it there also because it reminds me of the area where my grandfather was born, and where my cousins keep making award-winning barolo. Kleinmond and Hermanus provide a great complement, with whale watching and quiet beaches. Equally amazing are Knysna, Plettenburg Bay and Wilderness, where I spent a week in January. It's hard to think of a single spot in the Western Cape that is not scenic and beautiful. Nkosi sikelele iAfrica, indeed! I'll stop now, lest you think I'm collecting a salary from their tourism office.
the man with no friends always insults people , that’s as far as his education takes him, the poor degenerate fool, the coward who sits in anther country and slogs everybody off, , he know not what he says, brain dead people never understand the meaning of respect,
[its nice to insult others, but not nice when people insult you is it]
but then you don’t care, and neither do we, rrr don’t cry house martin, its only a comment, its only a comment, demag demark derango debark ?
“but then you don’t care, and neither do we, rrr..”
That's the 100th time you tell me you don't care.. lol
rrrrr...
sometimes you have to come 2nd, grrrrr
“That's the 100th time you tell me you don't care.. lol”
Thats because he really doesn't care, though you don't get the message so he has to keep repeating himself in order to get it through your thick skull. Basically he or, in fact most brits and islanders here, simply do not care what you say or think. Because we have the islands you don't, so why should we care what you think or say lol.
Theres only one way you will get the islands, and we both know you cannot do that, plus it didn't exactly workout well the first time you tried either - Did it now!
“are we deluded or are we fools”
You're all of the above, case closed... now stop talking to me weirdo.
like the Army says ....”assumptions are the mother of the fuck ups!!. You are too gay for my taste anyways and we can compare financial statements anytime, let's see how pays more taxes and contributes more to this economy. Anything else??
Clearly you don't have a clue, keep dreaming.
so now they say [don’t speak to us]
well that suits us fine,
we got the Falklands
we got the charisma
and we are British, and that lot have an uncontrolled CJD growing in their heads
A) If you live in Texas, then by definition you're a red-stater regardless of your alleged political orientation. Feel free to come back to the discussion board after you pass Logic 101.
B) When mentioning your allegiance to the Democratic Party in the US, the “D” in “Democrat” should be upper-case, not lower-case as you typed it. Once again, you're welcome back after you pass Grammar 101.
C) Calling me “too gay” is certainly a way to prove how progressive you are! I believe your thinly veiled homophobia indicates a stronger compatibility with the GOP. Ask Zel Miller to show you the way.
I'd suggest furthering your education as a way to avoid future embarrassment in public fora like this one. Then again, seeing where the state of Texas stands in the US literacy ranks, it's unlikely you'll be able to do that without relocating.
P.S. If the message above gets too complicated for you to comprehend, take a break halfway through so your lips don't become too tired as you read.
There's not too many Argentines do that.
Dana is doing insults - it's just that he is using different language. Calling somebody uneducated and socially unacceptible is pretty insulting
- and for an Argentinian to say this of a 'Citizen of the USofA' is the pinnacle of insult.
;-)
tell me artillero601, you say you have a college decree,
you have travelled from wherever to America, I presume when you talk about the military , you mean the American military, or another country, you already have self made skills that you learned in there,
most interesting, but [and I rarely do this] if its any interest,
when I went to my secondary school, [comprehensive] or state school,
believe it or not, I was suspended within the first year, for a time, and expelled by the time I was 14, no A levels no O levels, no gcse;s and no decrees, everything I write is self taught , as an adult I understand how important an education is, but as a teenager I couldn’t care less,
I learnt the hard way , truly, that’s why i don’t particular, like these who abuse others on their spelling, we all make mistakes, if my spell checkers messes up, then so do I,
my point it, I ignore others who think they are better, where poss,
im just me, an ordinary guy just me, I even get stick for being left handed, so I wouldn’t worry about other people education, its how you use it that counts, mmmmmmm
I cannot belive that you read such rubbish, the link is totaly wrong,
if you and others , like you belive what you have written, then you surley have no chance of ever beliving the truth ?
Typically (if there is such a thing) a younger person becomes unemployed and develops a group of unemployed friends, none of them stupid or uneducated, but they develop a vision of the world that is conditioned by their (group) outlook.
The books, articles, links, clips etc - largely involving conspiracy theories - are passed around within the group, further reinforcing the world-view.
Their bedroom/hostel-room walls are covered with anti-establishment posters and, if there is an external 'enemy', the process of group-demonization transfers an illogical and/or excessive hate to the 'enemy'.
The conditioning is akin to that in '1984', but it is largely anti-establishment.
Thus, whenever the 'enemy's' spokesperson makes an assertion, it must be countered - however warped the logic. It is a type of conditioned reflex (a bit like the need to RESPOND to every insult on these blogs ;-)
The 'hate' condition can occur naturally, though, in recent years, I have observed it most frequently in individuals between 16-28 who have developed a pot-habit using skunk [ THC has jumped from 6% to 30% and the protective antagonist, CBD, is virtually absent].
There is good research evidence that the induced paranoid tendencies and/or psychotic episode triggers this class of behaviours.
This is not just me speculating; my 'acquired daughter' (these things happen ;-) is a Clinical Psychologist, and it is a recurrent family conversation because of her profession.
Nor was anything mentioned about a “citizen of the USA”
He was responding to my post @101.
You must be thinking of another post.
Yeah, yeah....whatever. I(diot).
Speaking in wider terms, do you think another contributing factor to this anti-establishment rage is the lack of social mobility and opportunity in some societies?
- probably.
There is a high correlation in the UK between the type of secondary school you attended and the probability of employment/unemployment. but social mobility occurs when someone crosses from one stratum to a different one - and the biggest crossing is between full-time permanent employment and long-term unemployment. This is now more endemic in the UK than ever since the early 1990s.
But your question implies Upward mobility; glass ceilings, wrong school, wrong type of university - you know the 'privilage', the 'silver spoon'.
Yes, people who keep bashing their head against 'the barrier' get disaffected and more frequently fall into the behaviour-group mentioned.
Does it happen here in Bahia? - to a MUCH lesser extent.
Social mobility is not constrained by ethnicity or racial mix, but powerfully by Education. True, black genes predominate in the poor, but there is no lack of aspiration and there is no visible frustrated rage against the machine.
Different cultures, different systems, different expectations.
But the Balsa Familia in Brasil IS developing a dependency culture where the entitlement ethos is becoming fixed in the mentality.
Perhaps all cultures developing towards first world urban living go through it - or more likely, the Rage is an inherent feature of imbalances in (first world) urban living where you can see the riches but cannot reach them.
You see - I am no expert, but the virtue of blogs is that we can all express opinions and float ideas.
All Argentina has is nationalistic political rhetoric and systematic state sponsored political, economic & social persecution of the Falkland Islanders because they are belong to a minority ethnic group and are an easy political scapegoat.
Shame on Argentina.
My Island Home - Chagos Islands
www.youtube.com/watch?v=qFLhB_SkMIg&feature=fvwrel
“I can see that you are a complete ignorant Sir. Your writing and especially your English grammar suggest your lack of education. Your logic about organization is completely wrong we don’t do things like that you are a shame for our country Sir.”
The big white man with blue eyes behind the desk with his eyes injected with blood responds to him.
You.. are.. in.. Deutchland, Deutchland sir...
Ha ha
Another “little nail” in Great Britain's diplomatic coffin in the South-Atlantic.
www.infobae.com/notas/574112-La-Unasur-reclamo-ante-la-ONU-que-el-Reino-Unido-negocie-por-Malvinas.html
@153 Think, change the record(or CD), that one is boring.
Boring?
Get used to it!
This is only the beginning of the Argentinean diplomatic and economical counteroffensive...... .........................................................
We just managed to close one of the Islands most valued social and gastronomical assets.
Don't you believe me?
Pick up the phone, call 22233 and find out!
:-)))
“This is only the beginning of the Argentinean diplomatic and economical counteroffensive”
Counteroffensive, sorry think inorder to go on the counteroffensive the opposing side must have acted offensively towards you, which is something the falklands islands and the UK have not done. Though keep it up and we will start to get pissed with your country and teach it another lesson.
Don't you believe me?”
Nope.
Did you call!
Heard the message?
“Close til further notice” ;-)
No more fresh Pizza to Stanley.......
Back to canned Fray Bentos kidney pies; 30min. at 220C
Anyway would you care to enlighten me as to how you (Argentina that is) has contributed the downfall of this huge bastion of our economy, what policy of Argentina's brought about this mighty blow to the Falklands society...
I could tell you but.......................... then your computer would self-destruct after 10 seconds.
If Isolde tells me in which US state “Frank the Yank” was born......
I'll tell you if there is a 'Malvinas pizza delivery sabotage' department in the Argie government.
PS:
Nice of you to use the real (Scottish) name for the Islands.
I had not realised the dividing factor in Brazilian society was education rather than the overt racism I have witnessed in some SoAm countries. My mantra is that education is the answer. A bit simplistic but an undereducated work force will always impede the growth of a country.
I have interviewed disaffected people who rage against the establishment and, in some cases, I have had sympathy. They were born into a class-ridden society that would never allow them to move out of poverty. I would be pretty pi$$ed off too. Quite a few were clearly using drugs too but I am not sure which came first; The knowledge that no matter what they did in life they would die poor and turned to drugs or the other way around.
The Islands belonging to some bint called Malvina? Anyway that would be Malvina's Islands not Malvinas.
AFAIK the Scots call the Falkland Islands...the Falkland Islands.
Ban Ki-moon took a peek at the letter again and said, I know where Argentina is, But where are the Malvinas, when they told him they were the Falklands, he nearly fainted, when he gathered himself together he asked for a trash can where the letter landed. Then he went to dinner where he had a good dinner with real diplomats with real world problems.
He then put his hand in his jacket pocket to pay for the dinner and came out with a fist full of $, where has that lot come from he said, with raised eyebrows his aids said those dam Argentines they have done it again, we will give the money back tomorrow boss.
On day a new philosopher very proud of his new social status achievement while walking around Athens found this tiny guy bad dressed sitting in the floor looking very poor together with his dog eating beans.
The new philosopher lectured the poor man about how wrong was his attitude toward life and his luck of aspirations. He also remarked that if he would be willing to do like him he could progress and he will be enjoying the favours of the King and he could have everything he wants like he has done. So he wouldn’t have to eat beans in the floor anymore.
The poor man without much surprise and slowly put his head up while looking him and said...
Too bad for your that you don’t like beans else you wouldn’t have to work for the king I feel very sorry for you.
Yes education matters as you have said unfortunately the young philosopher lack of such skill.
@ 147 GeoffWard
People work hard, push others to make money and try to reach at any cost the top of the social pyramid.
When you ask them if all these stress and the pain really worth the reward, they say of course my dream is to be come rich to don’t have to do anything in the future. And to be the whole day in a beach in Brazil or in any other exotic place.
How rich must be the Brazilians that they are living other people’s dreams from the day they are born.
And how poor are all these people that have to pass through all these pain just to be in a Brazilian beach.
@#154 lsolde
If you read all post again and then my German joke you will understand.
Else doesn’t matter German humor is not very good trust me.
: )
“I reckon that all lost something in translation Nico....unless you meant it to be bollocks of course.” ?????
Now try it again with something meaningful, can you please?
: )
My Bollocks to english translator gave up after the first line of Nicotines rant
@163Think,don't know where Frank was born, but he grew up in..................¿?¿?¿? & speaks like ?¿?¿.!!!!!!!!!!therefore he must be????
“Now try it again with something meaningful, can you please?”
I will if you will.
I am not advocating wealth as the panacea to a fulfilling life. Education may or may not lead to a wealthier life but it definitely enriches life and creates opportunity. More opportunities = more choices.
From a wider view, if you keep the masses poorly educated it maintains a cheap work force to be exploited.
“People work hard, push others to make money and try to reach at any cost the top of the social pyramid.”
There are other motivations.
Some university professors chose their own degree courses to teach, chose their own research areas and travelled the world researching and giving papers at conferences.
Such people live a life of very different motivations and rewards.
And when retirement comes, they may not be the richest in terms of money, but, by God, they are rich in so many other ways.
And if they chose a beach - so what? Having seen most of the world - good, bad and indifferent - the choice of (metaphorical) beach is a way of chosing a closing chapter to the book of life.
For myself, powerfully influenced by Hemmingway's remeniscences of his old man 'fighting his last fight with the big fish' real and allegorical, the greatest riches come from the final distillation of memories that are the pictures in your mind as you approach your last fight.
Thanks Agent99
I did reach the very same conclusion some time ago…..
Definitively Appalachian Inbred!
You can tell Westi that,..................¿?¿No?¿? & Malvinas qué?¿?¿. Pizza!!!!!!!!!! sabotage '''Å?++ dos cervezas???? Claro Señor!
PS:(174)
How melodramatic.
Pull yourself together, young man……
You are just 62!
Hellu Monkies
In my story of the young philosopher, the poor man eating beans was “Diogenes of Sinope” or also called “Diogenes the Cynic” he was a master philosopher.
Diogenes was a fantastic character in ancient Greece he came from a wealthy and prominent family that for political reasons the king condemned them to live in exile and poverty.
He promoted the ideas of how should be a real free pure man, and he was against any material possession above basic needs.
So lads stop drinking so much beer and the football watching it is dangerous for your brain health.
But after reading your post I’m afraid you are terminal RIP : )
@ElaineB
What I try to say is that we “The Westerners” always try to classify people and cultures according with our indoctrinated standards. And if we are wrong?
Education is a relative thing depends on the environment How much useful would be a MBA in the middle of the Jungle or in a beach? And a Chaman Master in London?
When you ask people working hard for “social progress” about what are their aspirations the 80% answer to become rich to travel and to be under the sun in a beach, eat exotic meals, fun, sex, etc.
The Brazilians are so smarts that they are having all these things for free or by doing little.
So they are better educated than anyone to teach us on how to archive our beach dreams in case these are our aspirations.
We lack of fun Elaine nothing that we cannot get for few Quids and a couple of beers.
: )
@GeoffWard
“For myself, powerfully influenced by Hemmingway's remeniscences”
Mine influence it is a little bit more modest than your yank, I mean Michael Philip Jagger he is on his 68 and seems he is still getting a lot of fun. You were lucky to don’t chose Edgar Allan Poe I guess.
Anyway I recommend you “the man of the crow”
Ha ha
: )
If you live in a society where the path to mobility is through education then it should be available to all, equally. What a person choses to do with it is another matter entirely.
Sadly, of all the developed countries, social mobility is declining in the UK and is stagnant in the US. This is in no small measure due to disparity in the education available dependent on social class. This is obviously from a macro perspective, individuals can and do break through financial stratum.
“When you ask people working hard for “social progress” about what are their aspirations the 80% answer to become rich to travel and to be under the sun in a beach, eat exotic meals, fun, sex, etc.”
In a recent survey of disadvantage school children in the UK, they were asked about their aspirations. An alarming number wanted to be like Katie Price* aka Jordan, the former topless model who acquired a fortune in the region of £42m by displaying her comely udders to anyone willing to pay. In other words she expoited the expoiters. I admire her for her determined success but is it a realistic aspiration for the masses? What happened to wanting to be a teacher or firefighter?
It is true that the best things in life are free but a little filthy lucre certainly eases the way.
* I think Katie Price is knocking around Buenos Aires at the moment.
For those with masses, it is an option - feel for those without ;-)
True Nico, that's exactly the way you Argies look at us Falkland Islanders.
”So lads stop drinking so much beer and the football watching it is dangerous for your brain health.
But after reading your post I’m afraid you are terminal RIP : )”
...we always try to classify people and cultures according with our indoctrinated standards.....
Yup that fits.
;-)
“An alarming number wanted to be like Katie Price* aka Jordan”
That is quite alarming, though sadly not particularly surprising
“I admire her for her determined success but is it a realistic aspiration for the masses? ”
I personally can't stand the woman. It's nothing personal per se, she just embodies the banal cultural mediocrity that is so rampant at the moment., where the people with the least to say are given the most time to say it, 'celebrities' are made from reality t.v. (i.e. winning a competition) and then remain 'celebrities' for being stars of the 'news'.
I generally agree with your other points.
“If you live in a society where the path to mobility is through education then it should be available to all”
In Argentina education is available for all and free including university.
We have the higher rates in quantity of Doctors in medicine, Psychologist, etc in the world over 100.000.
And we are full of “Katie Price” we can export them and cheap.
What do you understand by mobility?
I know social mobility but what that means for you?
Because a lot of people believe that is money and shopping. Especially Yanks and they have exported this model to the world.
“What happened to wanting to be a teacher or firefighter”
Happen that the crappy media controlled by big groups had made a good job to portray Katie’s success as the easy way to get the “American Dream” buy, buy and if you can pay.
So the teacher and the fire fighter become a looser.
You have also say that you admire her, so can you imagine what’s the influence of the crappy media over a 15 years old girl?
The buy, buy model works having people unsatisfied old the time.
Would you like to be successful and have all these cute women you need a BMW! Call us 0800-spend what you don’ have. And close to the clip appears other ad saying...
Short of cash? Wanna buy you BMW don’t worry Bank Ruin you Life ltd. have the right loan for you.
Then even my mum will have to show her bubbies to pay back the draconian loan.
All is a big business and Katie Price for a good price found something to sale but like in economy to much offer means less $$$ then they will have to invent another new thing.
May be “be a teacher of Fire fighter man” and the ad saying Fire and teach Ltd. talk free 0800-pay first and later will see.
Life is like this, “models” change through generations. Look the Architects for example in ancient Egypt they were slaves today you have to become slave to pay them.
: )
@WestisBest
Ah! just you with “West Is Best” as nickname give me a break mate. : )
WE NEVER FORGET.
Go away, I, you're still boring.
I should qualify my thoughts on Ms Price by saying that I admire her for exploiting an industry that usually exploits women. She is a shrewd lady. But would I aspire to have her life? No.
I have visited some schools in Argentina and there is quite a contrast between the free and paid education. This is the same problem as the UK. It is not equal education opportunities. (And I say this having benefited from an expensive education).
For this discussion I am defining social mobility as breaking through group barriers effecting income and/or opportunities.
There is reasoned debate, and people strongly hold differing views on every subject, that is the point of this Comments section of MercoPress.
However, I think everyone has to agree that the Pork Hunt is completely off his trolley.
Nice “Poof” Isolde!
Let's hope some Responsible Person “Poofs” Sr. “AVargas”, aka “ I”, aka “Pirat-Hunter” for good.
PS: what's a rappist I(diot)?
a rapper who plays the piano perhaps?
But you help them out at the weekends dont you, you little minx Prat hunter
lt must be a terrible life for them. Do you think anybody would want to be one if they had the choice? ldiots like you only make life harder for them. They need your understanding, not your hatred. And before you start the accusations, no l am not one & have never experienced that type of life. You're an idiot, boy.
What is a “Pirat”? Or is it yet another spelling mistake of yours while trying to type “Pirate”? I can't say I'm surprised, as it matches your overall writing and reasoning abilities. Let's see:
“#58 you are not an Argentine stop the BS, by the way you talk you are either a british illegal alien in Malvinas Argentina wich should make you a proud pirat or Chilean, who are you trying to fool ??”
I'm not trying to fool anybody. I was born and raised in Cordoba, where most of my nuclear family still lives. The way I talk makes me a rational and educated human being, but it doesn't indicate my nationality.
“you are missing a unique gene in your DNA, that wich is esential to all Argentine, the gene resposible for praid,”
First, I believe you meant to type “pride”. Second, where was that “pride” in June of 1982? Surely, if Argentine pride is DNA-embedded they would have preferred death to surrender, right? Your assertion only proves your ignorance regarding genetics (pride is a cultural concept, not an inborn trait) and that you suffer the delusions of grandeur that most Argies use to mask their crippling inferiority complex. Sorry about that. Seek professional help.
[...] and who are all those clowns you mentioned, do you know who Che Guevara was ??“
So, John Locke is a ”clown“ but a guy who decides that 2 people can ride a motorcycle across a continent with no spare parts is a genius? I have to thank you for being so amusing, even though you're not doing it on purpose.
[...] about San Martin o Sarmiento [...]
San Martin was aligned with England. Why else would he leave a promising career in the Spanish Army to go fight against that very army? Sarmiento was a known anglophile as well, as his books clearly indicate. Both were great and both would be on my side in this debate.
”WE NEVER FORGET.”
You can only forget something that you knew. Since your post indicates you know nothing, there is nothing for you to forget. QED.
For all the good it did. How about focusing on results instead of on the merely symbolic?
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