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South America as a region to discuss measures to counter global financial crisis

Saturday, July 30th 2011 - 22:43 UTC
Full article 22 comments

South America’s top economic and monetary authorities will be meeting in Lima and later in Buenos Aires to agree on “joint and specific actions” to address the flush of global liquidity distorting regional currencies and of unsold manufactured goods threatening jobs and industry. Read full article

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  • briton

    and you lot was laughing at the west,
    as i said before, if we go under [the west]
    the shock waves will go all round the world,
    including argentina,
    so please dont laugh, you should be worried,
    will the Americans default or not, ??

    Jul 30th, 2011 - 11:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    TWIMC

    Article says:
    “With the massive inflow of dollars, South America’s currencies have appreciated sustainedly making imports cheaper and manufactured exports dearer, threatening jobs and creating asset bubbles.”

    I say:
    Not in Argentina, thanks to our heterodox economical policies.....
    An example many of our partners in South America are taking a good look at...

    Jul 31st, 2011 - 02:26 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Redhoyt

    It's called protectionism, and if we all play that game there'll be a new worldwide depression!

    Argentina's small minded politics will backfire in such circumstances.

    How's your inflation rate doing by the way?

    Jul 31st, 2011 - 04:35 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Forgetit87

    I expected something better from you, RH.

    Argentina has had a recent currency crisis in the late 90s and early 2000s that had been caused by an overvalued currency. It's only natural that it would be wary of letting its currency appreciate, or running trade deficits, specially if one considers that the Argentine government's ability to borrow from the foreign market is limited. Moreover, keeping the currency at competitive levels isn't 'small minded politics' - it is a development strategy. The external sector was of great importance to Japan in its path to becoming a 1st World country - more so than in the development of the US or Western Europe. And the sector was estimulated to some degree by currency manipulation. Japan has set the example and many countries in East and Southeast Asia are following suit. Japan is perhaps the only nation who has managed to become a 1st World country without becoming indebted to foreign banks, and maintaining trade surpluses of enormous importance in achieving that.

    Jul 31st, 2011 - 05:07 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Redhoyt

    Are you saying that protectionist measures are not a bad thing? Argentina's protectionism is already a worry to her neighbours, if the rest of the world goes for the same approach then we're going to be introuble. Rather more trouble than we are already in !

    http://www.nytimes.com/2011/06/08/opinion/08wed2.html?_r=1&ref=protectionismtrade

    http://www.nytimes.com/2011/06/08/opinion/08wed2.html?_r=1&ref=protectionismtrade

    And I'm not sure that Japan has done as well as you suggest!

    http://www.nytimes.com/2011/06/08/opinion/08wed2.html?_r=1&ref=protectionismtrade

    http://www.nytimes.com/2011/06/08/opinion/08wed2.html?_r=1&ref=protectionismtrade

    http://www.nytimes.com/2011/06/08/opinion/08wed2.html?_r=1&ref=protectionismtrade

    Not much they could do about the earthquake mind!

    Jul 31st, 2011 - 06:05 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Forgetit87

    Bad for itself Argentina's policies certainly are not.

    As for Japan, the articles you're posting are recent stuff. Everyone knows that in the 90s the Japanese economy experienced a downturn from which it has never quite recovered. But I was talking about Japanese policies during its path to becoming a 1st World nation. (Japan is one of the last countries to have emerged from underdevelopment; in the 60s there were even articles comparing Japan to the likes of Turkey!) From the 60s till the 80s Japan maintained good growth levels - more than any other developed nation. And much of Japan's growth had to do with export-promotion policies such as currency-manipulation.

    Jul 31st, 2011 - 06:52 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    TWIMC
    Argentina is not using “protectionistic” policies.

    Argentina is currently enjoying a big trade surplus due to a sound, intelligent and successful monetary policy that keeps the Dollar/Peso value correlation at an adequate/competitive level.

    Argentina is currently enjoying a big fiscal surplus due to a sound, intelligent and successful taxation policy, adequately targeting the richest sectors of our society that were grossly under-taxed in the past…….

    Argentina is currently enjoying a big social surplus due to a sound, intelligent and successful investment policy where the capitals and funds invested in Argentina are Productive Capitals, that generate physical jobs and goods; not Speculative Capitals creating big bubbles of nothingness…...

    Jul 31st, 2011 - 07:13 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Redhoyt

    Well, that's one way of Thinking about it :-)

    http://en.mercopress.com/2011/04/15/argentina-s-protectionism-the-great-obstacle-for-eu-mercosur-trade-talks

    http://en.mercopress.com/2011/04/15/argentina-s-protectionism-the-great-obstacle-for-eu-mercosur-trade-talks

    http://en.mercopress.com/2011/04/15/argentina-s-protectionism-the-great-obstacle-for-eu-mercosur-trade-talks

    http://en.mercopress.com/2011/04/15/argentina-s-protectionism-the-great-obstacle-for-eu-mercosur-trade-talks

    2nd after Russia - Wow! Well done :-)

    Jul 31st, 2011 - 07:31 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    (8) Hoyt

    As usual you choose inconsequential small personal blog sites or totally biased sources for your links…........................

    Anyhow….. Let’s analyzse one of your own neo-liberal links: http://investba.com/tag/argentina-protectionist-policies/ …..It says:

    ”Sao Paulo-based Vicunha Textil S.A. business in Argentina was squeezed in recent years by import tariffs imposed by the current administration. But rather than stimulating the local textile sector and boosting competitiveness, the measures will lead to Brazil now controlling 75% of Argentina’s denim business.
    O Globo reports Vicunha will invest up to US$40 million to acquire three plants in San Juan Province. The deal comes on the heels of recent acquisitions by Alpargatas Sao Paulo and Tavex-Santista meant to increase market share and circumvent the trade barriers implemented by Argentina. ”
    Well……
    That’s exactly what we want….
    Nothing wrong about Brazilians owing factories in Argentina....
    Instead of importing stuff from them and paying in dollars, we have them:
    1) Investing in Argentina,
    2) Producing in Argentina using Argentinean raw materials.
    3) Generating working places and tax revenues in Argentina.

    At the current Peso/Real rate, it is very possible that we will soon export Denim to Brazil….

    Where is the problem?

    Jul 31st, 2011 - 08:19 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Forgetit87

    -> http://en.mercopress.com/2011/04/15/argentina-s-protectionism-the-great-obstacle-for-eu-mercosur-trade-talks

    That's a bit cynical, isn't it? For as long as I can remember, Mercopress has been running pieces about government officials and farmers lobby in many EU countries - Spain, France, Ireland, UK, Germany, Poland - opposing a trade agreement with Mercosur. And now you point the finger at Argentina just because a EU official blamed her for that? Whom would you expect him to blame? Germany? protectionism freak France?

    Jul 31st, 2011 - 09:39 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • geo

    [] - 6 Forget

    no...no..no !
    Japan hasn't never been a export oriented country !

    Japan and Turkey are not comparable economies !

    Japan /high tech +permanently current account surplus+high saving
    Turkey/ ordinary tech+current account deficit +normal saving rates.
    -------------
    [] - 9

    where is the problem ?

    the problem is both country ( Argentina & Brasil) try to produce
    and export the same goods..also themselves !

    you can not realize a Regional Market Organization by these
    kind of economies.....
    they understood nothing from EU experiences !

    Jul 31st, 2011 - 09:57 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Forgetit87

    Dear geo,

    You're clearly wrong. Google “japan export development” and then we'll talk. You can even find stories from the 70s where the word 'Japan' is linked to exports of cheap goods flooding the world market - pretty much like 'China' is nowadays. Btw, many of China's economic policies, including the currency manipulation and acquisition (sometimes illegal) of foreign technology to boost domestic production, have been modeled after pre-85 Japan.

    Jul 31st, 2011 - 10:09 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • geo

    [] - 12 Forget

    Japan(2010) ;

    Export = 15,9 % GDP
    Import = 14,6 % GDP

    since 1990 this accounts have been growing yearly 1-2 % !

    Domestic Consumption = 65 % GDP

    Value Added Economic Activities = 27,2 % GDP

    Jul 31st, 2011 - 11:00 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Forgetit87

    @geo

    As I was saying to Redhoyt, I was talking about pre-90s Japan. I'm aware that, partly in response to international pressure, the Japanese economy passed through reforms during the 70s and 80s to become less export-dependent and more reliant on the domestic economy. That included currency evaluation, something that expectedly decreased exports, increased imports, and boosted consumption. The Chinese believe this process was in part to blame for the Japanese stagflation in subsequent years - that's why they fear currency appreciation. At any event, Japan is perhaps the only country* that joined the 1st World without having to resort to foreign loans. Instead they increased their domestic savings rate to finance development - but to do so, they needed to export a lot to enlarge their financial resources.

    * I don't know much about much South Korea and Singapore, but Taiwan did followed the same path as Japan, and so does China.

    Jul 31st, 2011 - 11:20 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Redhoyt

    Think - all I did was type “ Argentina Protectionism News” into Google and then picked the most recent stories. What can I say :-)

    Jul 31st, 2011 - 11:27 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Rob the argentine

    To Think (#7). Are you living in Argentina? NO one company can import, does not matter what, if they don't export for the same amount. That was ordered by Moreno a few months ago. If that is not protectionism, how you call it?

    You said: “intelligent and successful taxation policy, adequately targeting the richest sectors of our society that were grossly under-taxed in the past.”
    Sorry, the biggest surplus comes from “withholding” (retenciones) to exports (basically soy). The richest sectors every day pay less and, every month, more people have higher deductions from their salary.

    You also said: “intelligent and successful investment policy where the capitals and funds invested in Argentina are Productive Capitals, that generate physical jobs and goods; not Speculative Capitals creating big bubbles of nothingness.”
    Please, let me know which Productive Capitals were invested in Argentina during the last 3 years. Inflation is about 30% and unemployment increase 1.5 or 2% every single month.

    Aug 01st, 2011 - 07:31 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • jerry

    #16 - At last someone who sees conditions as they really are!

    Aug 01st, 2011 - 01:57 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    (16) Rob……

    No, that is not protectionism…..
    The importers are free to import more or less what they want but….. they are asked to contribute positively to the Argentinean economy by doing some export business.
    Many importers are making good money with this rule; some not……

    The export taxes on soy and cereals are targeting precisely those rich sectors of society that were heavily under-taxed before.

    Your economical data is quite wrong…..
    The list of new productive investments is just to long to mention here.
    Do your own research..................................
    Depending of the way you calculate it, last 12 months inflation oscilated between 18-24%
    And, you saying that unemployment is raising 1.5 to 2% monthly during the last years just shows how misinformed you are.

    To finish: Argentina's governamental policies are far from perfect but..............
    Compared with 10 years ago they are excellent.
    Compared with 30 years ago they are paradise.
    Where were you ten years ago?
    Where were yoy thirty years ago?

    Aug 01st, 2011 - 03:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Fido Dido

    and you lot was laughing at the west,
    as i said before, if we go under [the west]
    the shock waves will go all round the world,
    including argentina,

    First of all, describe the west in your view.
    you mean the so called developed (higly in debt) west?
    Shockwaves will go around the world, but it's not the end for more diversed export economies (US and Europe are not the entire world). And if we go under? Briton, Europe and the US are already in that phase of going under. That's reality and so long people can't or don't want to face that, they can't and won't solve the problem of keep going under and deeper in the hole of debt.

    so please dont laugh, you should be worried,
    will the Americans default or not, ??

    I only laugh of the incompetence of the politicians who cause this problem and now claim to have to solution. I also laugh at the people who still vote for them. Will the US default? Eventually yes, they just kicked the can down the road and soon they'll hit the wall. Is this the first time the US default? no, technically they did that when they went of the gold standard (just like UK and Germany).

    Is the Fiat money system broke? Yes, so we might go back to the gold standard, but the banksters don't want that to happen.

    Aug 01st, 2011 - 08:45 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Forgetit87

    Agreed, Fido.

    Aug 02nd, 2011 - 02:37 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • geo

    if you have more than -- 5 trillions $ -- then you are
    problematic /produce problems for the World Economy !

    the present Global Economic System is not convenient
    for the Economies which have more than -- 5 trillions $ -- !

    Aug 03rd, 2011 - 09:48 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Malvinero1

    Your economical data is quite wrong…..
    The list of new productive investments is just to long to mention here.
    Do your own research..................................
    Depending of the way you calculate it, last 12 months inflation oscilated between 18-24%
    And, you saying that unemployment is raising 1.5 to 2% monthly during the last years just shows how misinformed you are
    I agree fully witht El think!
    I have pointed before to Rob,where does he get the info!
    He says,in another post,the unemployement rate is 40%?????
    Really? Because in Tucuman,my native land,employment is booming!
    Soybean,Sugar Cane,Ethanol,Mechanical industry,Lemmons,Juice,extract,Tourism...
    I also agree with Fido!!
    Hasta luego!!

    Aug 06th, 2011 - 08:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0

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