MercoPress. South Atlantic News Agency
Argentina planning a “nuclear powered” submarine with conventional weapons
Argentina is considering the development of “nuclear propulsion” for its diesel-engine submarines, according to Defence minister Arturo Puricelli. The initiative follows a request from President Cristina Fernandez and is closely linked to Brazil’s construction of a first nuclear powered submersible with French technology. Read full article
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Disclaimer & comment rulesjajajajaja, this is another dream of our “Botox Queen” and her lunatic followers. Former President Menem announced a plane able to flight from Buenos Aires to Australia in a few hours. Former President Kirchner announced in 2006 the high-speed railway.
Aug 01st, 2011 - 07:48 am - Link - Report abuse 0Our presidents, when having big problems like now, use to make this kinds of announces.
“ ..Still partly in crates in the Domecq García shipyard, the ARA Santa Fé apparently has been 75% assembled after spending over two decades “resting” in dozens of containers...”
Aug 01st, 2011 - 08:05 am - Link - Report abuse 02 decades! That's not a bad siesta :-)
It isn't practical to put a nuclear reactor in the hull of a sub that small. Basic physics.
Aug 01st, 2011 - 08:41 am - Link - Report abuse 0Red, we were busy working in the “nuclear powered” submarine.
Aug 01st, 2011 - 08:43 am - Link - Report abuse 0' He added that Argentina has the “capacity to develop nuclear propulsion for submarines”.
Aug 01st, 2011 - 08:45 am - Link - Report abuse 0“This means that when the submarine ARA Santa Fe, which has been waiting for some years leaves the shipyard she will not do it with its original propulsion but with nuclear propulsion developed in Argentina”, '
Well... she won't be going to sea anytime soon will she....
Apparently they've worked out 'dive', but 'surface' is proving difficult to get right :-)
Aug 01st, 2011 - 09:40 am - Link - Report abuse 0Old news, last year Garre said that the reactor will be ready by 2013 and by 2015 the sub will be operational.
Aug 01st, 2011 - 10:27 am - Link - Report abuse 0@3: That's why they are developing a nuclear reactor and you are writing bulls**t on a website. 8^)
There is a fundamental reason why nuclear submarines are larger than conventional submarines, there are fundamental limitations to small nuclear reactors. Basic physics but of course they don't apply to politicians.
Aug 01st, 2011 - 11:30 am - Link - Report abuse 0Nice photo... but isn't that the Santa Fe the diegos left behind in South Georgia???
Aug 01st, 2011 - 11:39 am - Link - Report abuse 0@3 & 8 Shouldn't be so hasty. The Santa Fe is a TR-1700 class submarine. It is a little on the small side but the first U.S. nuclear submarine wasn't that much bigger. The main thing is that Argentina hasn't built one yet! A light-water version is apparently being built near Atucha l Nuclear Power Plant and another is planned for Formosa Province. However, both are a little different from the PWR needed for a submarine.
Aug 01st, 2011 - 12:02 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@9 Yes. I checked it out. The ARA Santa Fe picured is the one captured by us British in 1982. It was subsequently towed out to deep water and scuttled in 1985.
Typhoon, the TR-1700 isn't just a little on the small side, it's about twenty five feet shorter than any SSN produced by anyone at any time (the Rubis class).
Aug 01st, 2011 - 12:17 pm - Link - Report abuse 0If I were a submariner, on the crew of the first nuclear submarine produced by my country, which had spent the last twenty years in bits in a dock, I'd be making sure that I took plenty of iodine before I got on board and wouldn't be planning on fathering any more children.
Can someone indicate how many nuclear propulsion systems have been retrofitted to conventionally designed subs?
Aug 01st, 2011 - 12:34 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Hmmm, is there an election later this?
#12
Aug 01st, 2011 - 12:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Answer: 0
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TR-1700_class_submarine
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TR-1700_class_submarine
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TR-1700_class_submarine
A 1000 tonnes makes a lot of difference. Although derived from the Tang class, the Nautilus was a lot bigger. It was a specific design, rather than an add on.
Cheers Justin, although I already knew the answer. Does this sort of crap actually matter to the Argie electorate and are they thick enough to swallow such rubbish.
Aug 01st, 2011 - 12:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Argentina has neither the technical capabilities or the cash to pull this off. It's another one of their pipe dreams the gov't puts out that never come to fruition.
Aug 01st, 2011 - 01:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0When I was living there they announced plans to build the“ South American World Trade Center ” it was supposed to be the tallest building in the hemisphere on reclaimed land in the Rio de la Plata. That was 5 years ago and they have not started yet nor will they.
The funny thing is they don't even realize how stupid they sound and look.
If real INDEC numbers were released it would show their economy in a shambles, they need 20B next year to meet financing needs. Guess what they don't have it and can't get it from anyone.
with 0.9 % of GDP for Defense , what in the hell is he talking about ???????????????
Aug 01st, 2011 - 01:48 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I believe that they have the technical capabilities, but they definitely do not have the money. This is just another pipe dream of the K government.
Aug 01st, 2011 - 01:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@17 Not only we have the resources and technology since the 60's but in reality they have no intentions to have Armed Forces so why don't they close the whole thing down and save some money and have “the Campora” defend the country like the K's want to ?
Aug 01st, 2011 - 01:53 pm - Link - Report abuse 0They cannot shut it down because if the money flow completely shuts down, so does their skimming!
Aug 01st, 2011 - 02:03 pm - Link - Report abuse 0All of their decent scientists moved away long ago for better pay and to countries that respect patent law. That is why they are not capable, they may think they can do but it will never happen.
Aug 01st, 2011 - 02:08 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The 60s were a long long time ago now Argentina is much poorer and much less educated.
HMS not so Astute
Aug 01st, 2011 - 03:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Let's see what the Americans think about British subs:
http://wonkette.com/427479/dumb-british-submarine-stuck-in-mud
http://wonkette.com/427479/dumb-british-submarine-stuck-in-mud
At least they have submarines and we don't
Aug 01st, 2011 - 03:37 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Thank God! What a waste of tax payer money.
Aug 01st, 2011 - 03:42 pm - Link - Report abuse 0you think so ? so you and Think will patrol ... how many square kilometers?
Aug 01st, 2011 - 03:50 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The idea of modernizing the fleet makes sense. However, CFK should let the ones who know make the decision about reburshing submarines. Argentina has the technology. However, they might consider talking to the Germans or French about making one from the scratch. And for CFK...get your paws off the pie!
Aug 01st, 2011 - 07:02 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Pipe dream, anyone who knows anything about submarine technology would be looking at AIP for a conventional sub not the nuclear option. A submarine reactor is a tricky proposition and I very much doubt Argentina is two years away from technology suitable for a sub in the 2000 tonne class.
Aug 01st, 2011 - 07:16 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Reactor technology is not the only key technology to master, its making the boat quiet that is really the key. But hey it is an election year.
but there is NO intention to modernize anything
Aug 01st, 2011 - 07:17 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Argentina Armed Forces are in a terrible shape, the situation is so bad that most of the “defense” budget (80%) is used to pay salaries. I believe that the size of Argentina requires better armed forces, and to achieve this money should be put in other projects. I think this is a waste of money, energy, resources and time. There are many other important ways to help rebuild our forces. This is just silly and stupid. But again, we never had many clever governments.
Aug 01st, 2011 - 07:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0LMSA!!
Had Fernandez said what she meant by conventional weapons? Sling or bowmen, perhaps? I love her PA's. She's an expert in all arts, you know?. She said once on the wireless and TV she perfectly knew that water was H two zero!
Aug 01st, 2011 - 07:55 pm - Link - Report abuse 0– one of the three that were purchased by Argentina in the eighties from Germany’s Thyssen.
Aug 01st, 2011 - 10:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Still partly in crates in the Domecq Garcia shipyard the “ARA Santa Fe” apparently has been 75% assembled after spending over two decades “resting” in dozens of containers
http://navaltoday.com/2011/08/01/argentina-submarines-to-get-nuclear-propulsion/
by the time they get a decent sub,
the world would have moved on by thirty years at least lol.
24 Artillero601 How many bullets did Ghandi need to defeat the mighty British Empire?
Aug 01st, 2011 - 11:50 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Considering the USA is being bankrupted by its insanely greedy Millitary Industrial Complex, with the Spentagon the most incompetent, corrupt, and wasteful government bureaucracy on the planet, its preferable for Argentina to underspend. Don't want to end up with a massive debt like the Yanks with their Pork Fighters (F-22).
Aug 02nd, 2011 - 01:54 am - Link - Report abuse 0Marcos - but Ghandi was a man of great intellect and astuteness who's primary goal was focused on Indian independence. What you want is the forced removal of a population and the trnasfer of sovereign territory from one nation to another. Your strategy is failing and all you have is a “guesture of support” from your neighbours.
Aug 02nd, 2011 - 06:32 am - Link - Report abuse 0You are clutching at straws now!
if Argentina cannot afford to put a conventional sub to sea, let alone most of their navy, airforce etc then I suggest this is a story to give the army a good laugh, how can they possibly afford to convert these subs to nuclear hahahahahahaha
Aug 02nd, 2011 - 07:25 am - Link - Report abuse 0It's not just the army laughing FFred. We all are!
Aug 02nd, 2011 - 08:15 am - Link - Report abuse 0Be nice.... they just need to bog up the diesel engine mounts so the turbines fit.... stick the reactor in the stokers mess..... bit of plumbing... job done...
Aug 02nd, 2011 - 09:21 am - Link - Report abuse 0Probably take up less room than the diesels and batteries so they can fit a pool table..
mind you... with no battery bank it will probably float upside down....
Artillero,
Aug 02nd, 2011 - 09:50 am - Link - Report abuse 0How did it ever come to this?
ln 1900 Argentina had one of the highest living standards in the world.
You've got plenty of resources & farmland, Why?
Bloody hell I thought the Argentine Navy had sets of rowing oars on both sides of her subs, they had the oars to save money as they could not afford engines, know they are saying they are going to be powerd nuclear, hells bells and buckest of blood whats going on.
Aug 02nd, 2011 - 11:56 am - Link - Report abuse 0@37
Aug 02nd, 2011 - 12:41 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I, ask Peron that question :-))
Americans laughing about HMS Astute, the most powerful British sub :-)))))))
Aug 02nd, 2011 - 02:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“Our former colonial masters, the British, used to be renowned for their terrifying navy, which would obliterate rival fleets and bombard barbarian cities from the sea in order to pave the way for colonial conquest. Unfortunately, the Brits are stone cold broke now, having spent all their Pounds Sterling on booze, and so their navy sucks. CASE IN POINT: the HMS Astute, a fancy new submarine that is supposed to be invisible to sonar because of fancy British technology, not-so-astutely got itself stuck in the mud off the coast of Scotland. Is there video? Oh, you bet there’s video. Was this video shot by someone who works for some kind of otter rescue group? BELIEVE IT”
40 Marcos Alejandro ,,,,boy we are getting desperate,
Aug 02nd, 2011 - 07:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0the astute sub is having teething problems, and she will have many more,
she is testing and using advance sustems and [xx] equipment, that is still unknown in 99% of the worlds navys,, so yes show your delinquency,
but even so, she is having problems, she can still destroy any target in argentina from over 3,000 miles away, so think of what she can do at 100% fitness ??
@40 ... get all your news and views from Wonkette do you Narco?
Aug 02nd, 2011 - 08:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You are a foolish child.
The stranding of 'Astute' was human error.... it happens in the very best of navies.
A nation that buys a sub and then leaves it in bits for over 20 years is on the far side of incompetent.....
Oh well.... “The Argentine project.... was actually launched a year ago” .... they have managed to launch something....
ARA San Luis was a Type 209 that the Argentines cut in half, with the intention of fitting a nuclear reactor, then it was AIP. And having ruined a perfectly good sub they paid it off in 1997.
Aug 02nd, 2011 - 09:27 pm - Link - Report abuse 0If it has been in bits for 20 years its useless. 20 years ago they were using 286 processors, none of the electronics will work anymore.
Pipe dream at best, deliberate electrioneering more likely.
41 briton
Aug 02nd, 2011 - 10:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0HMS “not so”Astute, which has been plagued by major incidents since it was launched by the Duchess of Corn in 2007, shooting, murder stuck in the Scotland coast and more, not just minor problems.
Waste of money.
Hola, permítanme mi opinión:
Aug 03rd, 2011 - 01:31 am - Link - Report abuse 0Lo importante de esta nota, para los argentinos, es que durante muchos años la industria nacional estuvo detenida gracias a distintas gestiones de gobiernos. Desde hace unos pocos años se está intentando cambiar eso y, a pesar de ser muy lento ese cambio, algo se está logrando. Entonces a mí, como argentino no me interesa si este submarino (el ARA Santa Fe) no es tan moderno o tiene las mismas prestaciones que un super submarino de alguna otra nación. Lo que me importa es que después de mucho tiempo, esos contenedores se abrieron, se están ensamblando y encima se modificarán con tecnología argentina, hecha por profesionales y estudiantes que más allá de obtener un submarino a propulsión nuclear como resultado, están ganando experiencia.
Experiencia que brindará, posiblemente si se mantiene esta política de estado, otros submarinos o buques o lo que fuese y ahí si podría ser ya una nave que pueda competir a nivel tecnológico con las que otras naciones pueda fabricar (o comprar).
Así que, más allá de lo poco novedoso que este submarino le resulte al resto del mundo, a mí me pone feliz la noticia de que en lugar de ser comprado, es fabricado aquí, en mi país.
Muchas gracias!
Google translation:
Hello, allow me my opinion:
The point of this note, for the Argentines is that for many years the national industry was detained due to various efforts of governments. In the last few years is trying to change that, and despite being very slow this change, something is being achieved. So to me, as Argentina does not interest me if this submarine (the ARA Santa Fe) is not as modern or has the same features as a super sub in any other nation. What matters to me is that after a long time, these containers are opened, are being assembled and will change with technology over Argentina, made by professionals and students beyond obtaining a nuclear powered submarine as a result are gaining experience.
Experience will provide possibly if it remains the poli
From the guys who would have to man and operate it
Aug 03rd, 2011 - 10:58 am - Link - Report abuse 0”However there have been warnings from undisclosed Argentine naval sources which consider the project ‘pharaonic and disproportionate’ given current budget resources for Defence plus the fact that the TR hull is “unviable in space and density to lodge a nuclear reactor”.
nuclear weapons or in this case a nuclear sub is the only way to end the illegal occupation of Malvinas Argentinas, UN is just a tool to keep a led on anyone who is not a voting member in other words UN is a trap to keep slaves duped with honey and mirrors, while they theft the gold and silver. brits fear us not for we are far greater people then you'll ever be, lets never forget that u-boats from germany where leathal to everyone at sea, and we just have to get it right once for british pirats to end up at the bottom of the sea, I say you all go home now while there is still time.
Aug 03rd, 2011 - 12:37 pm - Link - Report abuse 044 Marcos Alejandro [shooting, murder stuck in the Scotland coast and more, not just minor problems.]]
Aug 03rd, 2011 - 01:11 pm - Link - Report abuse 0boy this is seriouse, its time for sherlock holms,
all these murders in scotland commited by a submarine,
mmmmmmmmmmmmm
I missed a comma but I think you got the idea Watson.
Aug 03rd, 2011 - 04:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0your lucky its just a commer,
Aug 03rd, 2011 - 06:03 pm - Link - Report abuse 0my spell checkers gone to argentina for repairs,
but i can cope , till i get it back,
holms .
@44
Aug 03rd, 2011 - 11:02 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“HMS “not so”Astute, which has been plagued by major incidents...... shooting, murder stuck in the Scotland coast and more, not just minor problems.”
Tell us more about these major incidents Narco.... lets see... ran aground in silt.... Captain sacked..... a nutter shot two other crew.... don't think either one of those was the boat's fault.....
Oh... here we go.... a minor problem with the steam plant.....
Got any others for us ?
51 Frank
Aug 04th, 2011 - 05:11 am - Link - Report abuse 0One said: “There have been problems with Astute. Every time engineers think they have solved one problem, another crops up”
http://www.g84.org/g84news/hms-astute-trials-plagued-by-technical-faults.html
Problems in design using 3D CAD
Fortythree months behind schedule, and the Astute class were £900 million over budget
Running aground and collision with tug, October 2010.
2011 shooting incident
“Astute: Relic or Revolution for the Royal Navy”
http://www.g84.org/g84news/hms-astute-trials-plagued-by-technical-faults.html
Now Frankie for a person who got screwed so easily by a Ezeiza taxi driver ('you only gave me a ten) it might difficult to understand.
they will come right in the end,
Aug 04th, 2011 - 02:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 0with 7 to be built ,
pluse they will use most of this technolagy for the new nuclear subs yet to be built,
besides why does argentina want subs anyway,
you cant find your way on the surfice,
you will get totaly lost under the water lol.
All new projects like this have problems when they are under trials, that is the point of the trials. The sub is now however reportedly doing well in trials. Compaired to most highly advanced projects like this it's done very well and in a year or two when it's ready will be an amazing sub.
Aug 04th, 2011 - 03:42 pm - Link - Report abuse 0At least I knew when I had been screwed by the cab driver.... Narco doesn't even know that he is being shafted on a daily basis by the botox queen.....
Aug 04th, 2011 - 09:38 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Nothing new from Narco re the Astute I see.... Astute is 'first of class' so delays and problems would be expected. 'Cost overruns'? Is there such a thing as a 'cost under-run??'.... maybe in Argentina where projects simply cease to run.
Tell me... how are they getting on with EVA PERON and her three sisters down at the Rio Santiago yard? Welding started in about 2006.... still no sign of a launch date for any of them I suppose... and those are simple steel boxes with pointy ends.....
soon the new carrier will get to see the light of day,
Aug 04th, 2011 - 10:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0and the argies will see their claim slowly fade to nothing lol.
55Frank, “At least I knew when I had been screwed by the cab driver”
Aug 05th, 2011 - 12:47 am - Link - Report abuse 0That's even worse.
“Tell me... how are they getting on with EVA PERON and her three sisters down at the Rio Santiago yard?”
What's the rush? You are sinking without any help, did you check the market today?
I think the Brits should change the name of the HMS Astute to HMS Frank the Yank, that name will suit the vessel better.
how about HMS Argentina,
Aug 06th, 2011 - 11:46 am - Link - Report abuse 0you could always pretend it yours lol.
Hey that's a good idea! We need some scrap metal :-)
Aug 06th, 2011 - 03:53 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Use the Santa Fe.
Aug 06th, 2011 - 05:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0its rusted to far lol.
Aug 06th, 2011 - 09:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Wow the Brits are really protesting so much.Of course they never developed anything themselves they just latched on to the North american technology.The facts are that ?Argentine industry is growing at phenomenal rates.Car production will reach 850,000 this year ,agri machinery is booming and huge strides are not only being made with the nuclear power sub but the air force will soon see Argentine built planes.
Aug 07th, 2011 - 12:37 am - Link - Report abuse 0These guys cant hack it amigos but the WASPS days of dominace has ended
Ogara,
Aug 07th, 2011 - 07:18 am - Link - Report abuse 0can you make some of those cars right hand drive for us for when we take over Patagonia? well a lot of them actually because that is one of the first things that we are going to change!
Isolde, Hurry up to take over Patagonia before those young British burn England.
Aug 07th, 2011 - 04:11 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“Violent riots over Tottenham”
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newsvideo/8686954/Violent-riots-over-Tottenham-shooting.html
another ex irish barbie doll.
Aug 07th, 2011 - 08:15 pm - Link - Report abuse 0what do they call them now,
oh i know [pretenders]
by backing argentina , that makes him [smart]
mmmmvery smart indeed ?
ASTUTE nice name for a sub I would say that with sad economic collapse of western Europe and North America the Brits would be ASTUTE to forget about military waste and concentrate on placateing their impoverished population.Tottenham and now Enfield both in London are like war zones.The embers of empire ehh
Aug 07th, 2011 - 08:40 pm - Link - Report abuse 0CLEVER
Aug 07th, 2011 - 09:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The ARK was built by amatures
The TITANIC was built by professionals
interesting .
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