MercoPress. South Atlantic News Agency
“I think I did the right thing for Britain”, says PM Cameron
British PM David Cameron has defended his decision to block an EU-wide treaty change to tackle the Euro zone crisis, despite warnings it will leave the UK isolated. Read full article
Comments
Disclaimer & comment rulesCameron - hero or fool?
Dec 10th, 2011 - 06:32 am - Link - Report abuse 0I'm going for hero, becuase I've long thought that we should get out of the EU.
But time will tell. Has the Eurozone done enough to stave off the crisis - somehow I doubt it :-)
he's a hero and the rest in the UK who refuse to see the real scammers are a bunch of fools while Cameron is l.h.a.o. (laughing his ass off) for being seen as a hero because he did what he suppose to do; show the british people how tough he is on the so called euro project which is failing (what the Germans know though they act mixed, sometimes tough somethines sceptic and sometimes as if their is nothing wrong what make other leaders nervous). Even if he would do his best, he would lose the battle because Europe is runned through the (ECB) by Germany. For Merkel, cameron is a smuck. nothing more. He's also a hero for his bankster friends (because he bails them out while the british people are and will pay for it for years) though they, his bankster friends, know he isolated the UK from the rest of the gang who the UK needs. But since they don't care, it doesn't matter at all. the Banksters do not care than about themself. B.O.E. (a private bank) keeps printing and keeps interest rates close to zero what is gain for the speculators (the banksters) and a pain for the people.
Dec 10th, 2011 - 07:33 am - Link - Report abuse 0Fido (that's a dogs name isn't it?) - you talk through your rear end. The evidence already is that the agreements that France and Germany are pushing will not be enough to head off the looming crisis. Their mess, their problem.
Dec 10th, 2011 - 08:53 am - Link - Report abuse 0We'll get on with ours !
@2 Err Fido it was labour that bailed out the banks not the conservertives or cameron. Not only that, we do not need europe as much as it needs us. The Uk finicial sector is equal to 50% of the EU financial sector and its is not controlled by the ECB either. Though if we had signed the treaty it likely would have been. We have the rest of the world to do trade with, the EU is not the whole wide world you know. Just look at our increased exports to china in october narrowing our trade deficit by a record amount since records began. The EU needs imports from the UK, but do we need imprts from EU when we can get them from other non EU nations. If we had signed the new treaty billions of more UK money would have been paid to the EU annually, hence why france and germany refused the concessions, but their gamble at calling camerons bluff back fired on them when he wielded the Veto and now they are sulking and blaming him as a result of them not being able to get their hands on the UK financial sector, UK economy and UK taxation to use as a milk cow to support their precious Euro currency, that was doomed to fail from the start as stated in the begining by the very man that came up with the idea of the single currency.
Dec 10th, 2011 - 08:59 am - Link - Report abuse 0Going by Merkels comments of “Those that are not yet part or have not yet joined the Euro” one can only assume she has a deluded view that all EU nations will look at joining the Euro Currency in future. Sorry, but thats simply not going to happen. The treaty it self is not gauranteed to save the Euro either. French banks rating downgraded, German exports dive and is a sign of germany's resillience to the crisis is actually deminishing and they are heading the same way as spain, italy, portugal and france.
And Germany have been printing deutschmarks, just in case.
Dec 10th, 2011 - 09:46 am - Link - Report abuse 0The UK is still part of the EU trading market with a vote and a voice. What the UK would not (could not) agree to was changes to the EU treaty thus giving more power and the income from our biggest market to prop up the Euro. The Euro is not our currency, so not being at the table to discuss it is not that much of a inconvenience. But Cameron could not have agreed to major changes to the treaty with the EU without a referendum. And the danger of that is that overwhelmingly the voting public is anti-Europe. (I am not anti-Europe but the UK is an island nation with that frame of mind and I live in a democracy).
As I have said before, the Euro is still in crisis and for all the meetings and manipulations nothing has been resolved. The choice for the UK was to jump into the burning building with no safety equipment and no way out, or to stay out and deal with the resultant damage.
This is only the beginning of a long journey.
The UK people were lied to by Ted Heath about the benefits of joining and most of us have regretted since. Thatcher managed a small respite for us from subsidizing the lazy Mediterranean countries (S. Italy especially - and I worked there for 3 years).
Dec 10th, 2011 - 10:58 am - Link - Report abuse 0'New' Labour sunk the UK and gave away most of our sovereignty that was left.
All that Merkel and Sarkozy wanted from us was our money. Well done to Cameron to veto the 'agreement'.
Getting out of the EU would save billions and although the path ahead may be difficult the UK will get through it and without the drag of the UK hangers-on presently in Brussels. They will need to retire on their obscene EU pensions because they are unemployable anywhere else.
Can't wait to get rid of the EU Gravy Train.
It is true that the biggest complainers are the politicians with jobs in Brussels.
Dec 10th, 2011 - 12:07 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I was listening to the response to events from German voters and their views ranged from, 'They were sensible for not joining the Euro' to 'They have to do what they think is best for their own country' and 'We would have liked to have the British with us but they have a right to make their own choice'.
I think he made a mistake. In the XIX entury Britain could afford to have an isolationistic policy towards Europe because the country had a large market (its empire) to trade with. But now, most of the trade is done with Europe. It is early to know yet, but perhaps being out of this “new” union might affect Britain growth and commerce. The problem here is that London still believes it is the capital city of the British Empire.
Dec 10th, 2011 - 02:29 pm - Link - Report abuse 0#8 JB
Dec 10th, 2011 - 03:27 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Could you please point to the evidence to support the statement 'most of the trade is done with Europe' because it seems to be 48% EU & 52% ROTW (ind. site NOT HMG) but I could have overlooked an important site.
In any event the thing that really matters is 'the net worth' of dealing with the EU when all our payments to the lazy French and S. Italians (I worked there for 3 years on & off), nevermind the Greeks are deducted from our 'profits' (if any).
I do have some concerns regarding the automotive sector which is Japanese (Toyota & Honda), French (Renault/Nissan) and German (Mini) all of whom have said in the past that the GBP was hurting when the Euro was down. If I am correct, over the mid-term, the GBP will start to gain value and this may lead to flight of the four companies AND put pressure on UK based parts suppliers which is a considerable part of what's left of our 'manufacturing'.
The commerce thing may be a problem once the unelected, detested Brussels-crats realise they might be able to ban EU banks dealing with The City by demanding they do so on EU terms - but we will see.
However I am far more optomistic about the UK's chances of moving forward than anything I have seen from the skewed Argentinean figures.
Do you remember the doomsayers when the UK left the ERM? In this case we haven't even left the Euro because we were never in it. Merkozy are annoyed because the money from the UK would have taken some of the weight of holding up the Euro off the shoulders of Germany.
Dec 10th, 2011 - 05:24 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The UK are still part if the single market of the EU. We can and will still trade there. Once the dust has settled and Sarkozi stops flouncing around trade will go on. He is going soon anyway.
I had to laugh because one of the unsubstantiated rumours is that Sarkozi and Cameron almost came to fistycuffs during the 11 hours of talks. Can you picture it? Cameron holding one hand on Sarkozi's head whilst the diminutive man tries unsuccessfully to punch Cameron standing out of his reach? I am waiting for the cartoon.
We all know about the future isolation of UK, what about reparations?
Dec 10th, 2011 - 05:45 pm - Link - Report abuse 0People of the World, It's Time to get Paid...
http://www.britishreparations.org/commercial.php
@9 there is no reason to be upset. I just wanted to point out that perhaps cameron desition might not be beneficial in the future.
Dec 10th, 2011 - 06:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0If EU is destionation of 48% of UK exports, then the EU is your largest trade partner, by far. But, as you said, the important are the net benefits.
Yawn, Marcos you do tend to go off on a tangent.
Dec 10th, 2011 - 06:32 pm - Link - Report abuse 010 ElaineB (#)
Dec 10th, 2011 - 06:32 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Yes I do ElaineB. I was driving back from South West Water, having just got my first management consultancy contract for my new business.
I started back from Exeter and the interest rate went up and up, etc. By the time I got to the midlands I knew my new start in life was toast: I couldn't fund everything I needed and still pay the mortgage.
Then we pulled out of the ERM: what a relief!
Another lifetime.
@11 You're quite right. Reparations are in order. Starting with £510 million in response to 255 British servicemen killed. Plus £775 million for British servicemen wounded. Plus £3,140 million in compensation to Islanders.
Dec 10th, 2011 - 06:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Don't you worry, People of the World. We'll rip those reparations out of Argentina whatever it takes.
One way or another, we will take £4,425 million from these gutless gangsters. How? Well 1 Argentine life equals £1. Britain MAY consider itself repaid when there is no single Argentine left alive anywhere in the world. And the territory that used to be called “Argentina” is owned by the Falklands. Although much may be radioactive. No Argentine animal should survive. Who could deny the call to “Kill at least one Argentine a day”. Strip them. Emasculate them (they won't notice). Shaft them (They like it.) Let them watch their children have legs, arms and heads cut off. Argentina is sh*te. Obliterate it!
Time will tell but I think the UK staying as far out of the Eu as possible is a good thing. The EU is a mess, over regulated, over taxed and I don't see how they wind their way out of that mess anytime soon. The EU is the Progressives/Keynesian's last stand and they are holding on for dear life. Germany has wanted to rule the EU for a long time and they are getting their wish.
Dec 10th, 2011 - 06:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0This is the quiet anschluss they wanted in 1938.
Deutschland, Deutschland über alles, Über alles in der Welt....
perhaps when the british are out, and more powerfull, the argies wont be laughing so much,
Dec 10th, 2011 - 11:17 pm - Link - Report abuse 0you only want us to stay so we keep away from you,
but it will never happen, besides argentina is frantickly searching for a group / any group to signe up to,
@12 There is a problem with the concept that EU is the destination of 48% of UK exports. It isn't true. The important thing is not where you look for statistics but knowing how the statistics are compiled. There are a couple of features that need to be taken into account. They are called the Antwerp Effect and the Rotterdam Effect. Rotterdam and Antwerp, in that order, are the two largest seaports in Europe and they are hubs for container freight. In rather typical EU fashion, UK export goods in containers going through either of those two ports are counted as trade with the EU irrespective of their final destination. As a result, UK export figures are skewed in favour of the EU. Once you remove these two Effects it turns out that UK exports to the EU are only 20-25%. This places a different complexion on things, doesn't it?
Dec 11th, 2011 - 12:50 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Its also worht pointing out the the UK imports less goods from the EU than what it Exports to the EU. So technically speaking the EU needs the UK, but the UK does not need or rely on the EU.
Dec 11th, 2011 - 03:04 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@18 i did not know that, now I understand the true nature of that 48%. I want to said that it is not my desire to see Britain in crisis. If this desition taken by Cameron protects british interests then it was the right thing for him to do. However, from my point of view, I would like to see Britain inside the EU. I have read in some newspapers from UK that the next step will be to get out from the EU. I dont want this to happen. If it does Europe will become more protectionist, global growth cant afford this from big player like the EU.
Dec 11th, 2011 - 06:25 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Britain practically invented free trade
Dec 11th, 2011 - 08:41 pm - Link - Report abuse 0If [just if] the Europeans started to boycott and or started to tax British goods, the exact same would apply in return,
Thus the out come would mean that both suffered, but with a big difference,
It is the EU that would end up isolated, and Britain would again trade with the free world,, most of this is either ANTI-BRITISH, or BLACLMAIL from Germany and France,
Not personal, but united corruption,, every week [directives] come down from the EU,
Do this, do that, enforce this,, enforce that, illegal to do this, [this is not what we joined]
We joined a free common market, not a united states of Europe,
This last 26, will ALL be forced to join the euro, give their taxes to Europe, the budgets and more sovereignty over to Europe,
Thank god we said no,, and now we want out,
And as for the Argies,, like I said, anti British, and that’s all it is,
Cameron didn't “make a stand” as he's trying to make it seem, he made a blind, foolish and idiotic gesture by stubbornly not signing. The only reason for this is because he told the House of Commons he'd try and get the best deal.
Dec 11th, 2011 - 11:04 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Yet again, like all of his other decisions, he has failed with spectacular vigor.
Pygmy pirates? :-)
Dec 12th, 2011 - 01:22 am - Link - Report abuse 0“Britain faces being reduced to the status of a “pygmy” nation after David Cameron’s decision to veto a new EU treaty, Nick Clegg has warned”
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/nick-clegg/8949920/Nick-Clegg-attacks-Camerons-EU-treaty-veto-as-bad-for-jobs-and-families.html
Cameron isn't stupid he knows the legal basis for the new intergovernmental treaty proposed by France & Germany is not valid without his signature. It will be very legally complex for the new group of 26 to use EU legal structure to enforce the new treaty without the consent of the UK & a massive stretch to use the existing EU institutions for this new treaty. As such, the negotiations are far from over at some point Europe will have to return to negotiate with Britain or its Treaty will be unenforceable & Euro members will have an escape route should they wish to exit & since euro zone leaders need integration the UK's signature must be secured at some point.
Dec 12th, 2011 - 02:30 am - Link - Report abuse 0The English bulldog turned into a chihuahua.
Dec 12th, 2011 - 04:42 am - Link - Report abuse 0The Deputy Prime Minister says Britain now risks being a “the lonely man of Europe” and “a pygmy in the world”.
PM Cameron always does ”the right thing for Britain”, is this also good for most of the british people? Of course not, he is not representing democracy very much lately (I never expected him to do so anyway).
Dec 12th, 2011 - 06:23 am - Link - Report abuse 0I hope that in SouthAmerica we remember this crisis “solutions” as examples of worker's standard of life destruction. We also need to watch a lot at other continents to take the good experiences. Europe has so many good things to implement in here, but this lack of fraternity between neighbors is not one of them, making workers pay the crisis is also not one of them, institutions not being transparent and democratic is also not one of them.
All the workers around the world will live better if the economy (and the financial system) around the globe starts having more and more regulations. If not, bankers will go on doing the same: getting as much as they can for a period of some years and then cause a crisis to make their richness grow automatically in an exponential amount.
It is a pity that those who were not told the truth about economy and how their own future was gonna be, like the greek people and the spanish people, are now called “lazy” and told to be the only responsible ones for the crisis they didn't create.
Some small groups of world leaders in just a few rich societies have created the industrialized world where we live nowadays, a world made at their image, they gave it the shapes that suited them better. It is a world where just a few can enter to the room of success, only a few because they built a door that only they can pass through, of course, because humans are different between each other in many ways.
Democracy is the solution... It will make the door larger, so that the room of richness gives a little shelter to the 99% of the humans in the storm outside.
All the Argies should understand one thing about the coalition government of Britain.
Dec 12th, 2011 - 09:42 am - Link - Report abuse 0It's a bastardised amalgam of Conservatives (eurosceptics mainly) who needed the Liberal Democrats (europhiles) to form a goverment.
The Deputy PM is the leader of the LibDem, a former BrusselsCrat and a rabid europhile. It is believed Cameron made the decision without consulting him because he knew what the answer would be.
His comment about pigmy really fits him nicely. In contrast Cameron is a giant.
Hopefully Cameron will push it to an immediate election and the people, who are mainly eurosceptic, will vote him back without this cretin, Clegg.
the main picture says it all
Dec 14th, 2011 - 05:48 pm - Link - Report abuse 0[the bloody brits have done it again, arrrrg]
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