MercoPress. South Atlantic News Agency
Falklands: The years that count and those that don't
By John Fowler - This is the sixth of a series of extended political articles written exclusively for the Penguin News web site by Deputy Editor John Fowler. John is a former Superintendent of Education and a former Manager of the Falkland Islands Tourist Board. Read full article
Comments
Disclaimer & comment rulesand in addition the Argentines will celebrate the commencement of hostilities on the 2nd April. Most honourable and civil people will celebrate the end of hostilities and the commencement of peace.
Jan 23rd, 2012 - 05:04 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Not Argentina it appears.
@beef
Jan 23rd, 2012 - 05:13 pm - Link - Report abuse 0the only things they regret about the war are that
a) they lost
b) they did not “dissapear” the islanders
c) they did not kill more british soldiers
otherwise, it is to them as CFK said a “heroic adventure”, and despite their shrieking protestations of being “peaceful” and “democratic”, the moment they think they can get away with it, they will attack again
What is the problem?/ uk did the same Against a peaceful population in 1833..
Jan 23rd, 2012 - 05:51 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Just buzz off! I hate the brits imperialist..
You do not like what Argentina did?/
Too bad uk started all!
The original use of the force is all uk fault!
Just go back to your island in the north Atlantic,pirates brits!
“..his country clearly has no need now to feel culpable for the nearly 1,000 deaths of military and civilians which then ensued, nor to apologise for the trauma to which the population was submitted.”
Jan 23rd, 2012 - 05:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Let´s put things right and clear Mr Fowler:
Of the 1000 deaths, 650 were Argentine troops, 255 British and only 3 civilians. In that sense it is also important to mention that the 3 civilian deaths were caused by British fire and yourself was present at the place and had a great responsibility by not promoting the evacuation of those women which caused the tragedy as you yourself acknowledged in a television interview in 2010.
It is also imporant to highlight YOUR irresponsibility in 1982, which en the middle of the conflict you were walking with the swetest little girl in the middle of the “wild” Argentine troops ??? How that is possible ??
a) or you exaggerating about the alleged “brutality” Argentina .
b) or you are not very sane to walk with that little girl down the streets.
minute 8:53
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=720lj4O_5lw
With regard to events in paticular year 1833 which is very important because it is the historical root of this problem between the two countries and it is also interesting to analyze YOUR attitude and YOUR responsibility past, present and future in relation to YOUR main task and duty as Superintendent of Education.
It's really amazing how much ignorance that has most of the islanders on the events of 1833 ..... I wonder why this methodology institutionalized in hiding the truth and promote lies?
If you want a future there must first be justice, can not build a society or community based on a historical mistake and damage a young nation.
Never be developed, will be an eternal bastard race until acted with dignity, honor, truth and justice.
Not only Argentina or international community is calling ... is required by common sense and proves that in 179 years have not accomplished anything until FIG act civilized.
so far - those three civilians would be alive if your cowardly forces were not firing artillery from designated civilian areas!
Jan 23rd, 2012 - 06:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Other Argentine actions from 1982:
Painting every building which housed soldiers and ammunition with a red cross.
Booby trapping civilian homes with grenades
Using a child's playground slide as a mount for a rocket launcher
Flying a white flag and then shooting dead the soldiers coming to accept the surrender.
Using a school house as an ammo dump.
Booby trapping your surrendered ammunition, resulting in the death of an Argentine soldier taked to clear it.
I guess the Geneva Convention means nothing to a bunch of cowards like you? No chivalry, no honour, no spine, no significance. All we need to know about you is clear to all, and you are toongutless to attempt it all again and no balls for a legal fight.
Well I have no wish to dwell on the past,
Jan 23rd, 2012 - 06:07 pm - Link - Report abuse 0But the future, this year will be the year of celebrations, not only in the UK but around the world, and in the Falklands,
And should be enjoyed by all that see it, or are watching it on TV ,
That a royal coming to the Falklands for a couple of weeks on deployment,
Can only be a good thing for the islanders, and should be enjoyed,
Yes, I can see a very nice 2012 for the British, and the world to watch, and see how it is done,
.
read the article!! Uk had landed well before that date (before Argentina existed) FACT. Argentina has no claim, or take it to legal UN court...which I doubt you will do because the facts would support the UK. If you have never owned a country you can 180 years later claim it!!! So keep on making fraudulent claims and making up history, the fact are for all to see.
Jan 23rd, 2012 - 06:12 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I guess the Geneva Convention means nothing to a bunch of cowards like you? No chivalry, no honour, no spine, no significance. All we need to know about you is clear to all, and you are toongutless to attempt it all again and no balls for a legal fight.
Jan 23rd, 2012 - 06:31 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Look who is calling Argentina...The pinnacle of criminals...Or you forget the horrendous brits crimes....
uk Landed...The Spaniards landed well before that.In 1530 they claimed for Spain..Argentina is THE SUCCESSOR of Spain...
As far as the celebration in MAlvinas..Who cares...3000 people and beef and britton...
Flying a white flag and then shooting dead the soldiers coming to accept the surrender.
It was proven that was a mistake...the brits killed innocent soldiers...How many crimes were committed by the Argentines...NONE.
Just read brits source...the killing on the school by the brits... Even the brits soldier said some of them should be court martial ed for killing surrendered soldiers..
You are a crook beef..LIAR to the core!
Malviner - why did every building housing Argentine soldiers or equipment have a red cross on it. You didn't need that many hospitals.
Jan 23rd, 2012 - 06:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You may call me a liar but the history of 1982 clearly demonstrates the cowardice of Argentina.
You lost and are still losing :-)
Drill bitch drill!
Look pal,just read the british soldier recount,the brits journalist...none of them they complained the treatment by Argentine soldiers.Cowardice?/
Jan 23rd, 2012 - 07:08 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Read the brits journalist and the soldiers recount.
Did you know that the brits were unloading military equipment from the Uganda,wich bears the red cross on it? The air force men saw them,unloading military equipment and did not bombed..
The accident in Darwin,even from brits journalist,recognized,that some guys,did not know about the surrender.There was fog,and they did not know anbout the surrender.But after the brit military obliterated a school, to get even.And this is in the brits books.There were several accusations agains the brits crimes.NOne to my knowledeg against the Argentine soldiers.You did not know that the brits soldiers raped Argentine soldiers after 2 days the battle was over?/ Or you do not read british book about the war??Tell me one complain against the treatment of the Argentine soldiers?The April recuperation was a very clean,profesional action that did not produce a single brit casualty.
BTW the way the Geneva convention prohibited the cluster bomb.The brits suspended them after Argentina denounce it.
Now,it is fanny a brits calling colonialist, murderers against another nation. Like I said: I do not mind having differences of opinion ,but lies....and false accusation I will never tolerate that...
@9
Jan 23rd, 2012 - 07:18 pm - Link - Report abuse 0notice he also whines that the “soldiers” who showed such sickening cowardice in abusing the white flag to illegally murder (as defined in international law) British soldiers, were in fact the “victims” as their deception meant that their “real” surrender was viewed with fully justified suspicion.
also he whines about British historical crimes
- which were in pretty much every case enormously less severe and damaging compared to just about every other nation, and also balanced with an even more extensive list of beneficent inventions, innovations, accomplishments and contributions
while utterly ignoring argentina's historical crimes
- several counts of wholesale genocide and permanent land theft balanced by zero beneficent inventions, achievements or innovations
in a textbook demonstration of argentine lack of intelligence, and their need to be “victims”, as well as their immediate retreat to shrieking propaganda the moment their delusions are challenged
Malviner - even Think admitted that Argentine actions in 1982 where in contravention of a number of Geneva Convention protocols. At least you lot could have fought with honor. You even armed you hospital ship up to the eye balls and used it to fire on British special forces.
Jan 23rd, 2012 - 07:21 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Not only do you display disregard for the rules of war you also lost. Pretty useless aren't you. Firing from civilian positions, painting every building with a red cross, booby trapping civilian properties, sabotaging the mains water pump in Stanley after the surrender. Despicable and cowardly bunch you lot arn't you. Post Offies are for posting mail, not pooing on the floor!
Get back to what you are good at like burning flags and complaining. A bit useless arn't you.
@11
Jan 23rd, 2012 - 07:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0you keep mentioning this supposed “brit journalist” yet you have zero evidence of him existing.
and yes, the argentine occupation of the Falklands was steeped in argentine cowardice, from
-the Junta subjugating defenseless islands
-to the officers on the ground like Pat Dowling who threatened children with death for his own gratification
- to the spineless conscripts who broke every rule of law to save their own skins, and took out their impotent rage on the islander's property, for fear of retribution if they did so to the islanders
once again you whine out a load of endlessly disproved propaganda because you cant find any actual facts.
unlike the cowards you sent to the islands, Britain had no interest and nothing to gain from destroying islander property, or in breaking Geneva convention rules, as unlike you we never needed the white flag, or had buildings to paint a red cross on.
And just about all of the accusations of british “crimes” has gone nowhere, as they were universally the product of your own propaganda. hell they are so full of shit your own government does not use them.
hell the one thing that does shine through when reading the accounts is just how much the argentines appreciated the kind treatment britain gave them compared to their officers.
and the only reason your illegal invasion failed to kill anyone is because when you sprayed the marine's barracks with bullets and grenades, they were already out.
now either give evidence to ANY supposed British “crime” during the war, of disprove ANY argentine crime, or stop whining and crawl away.
I think Malviner is himself evidence of the indoctrination commonplace in Argentina. His country is officially classified as a flawed democracy and by what he is saying is becoming more like North Korea every day.
Jan 23rd, 2012 - 07:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I bet he imagines himself as a conscript defeating the Brits on his own in 1982. The reality would be he would be yet another crying coward waving a white flag and running into the nearest building with a red cross on.
Tonight Malviner will be Errol Flynn!
@8
Jan 23rd, 2012 - 08:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Malvinero You quote the Geneva convention and yet argentine troops planted land mines and did not log all of the fields where they were placed!!!
How LOW is that!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Long Live the Falklands.
lies have short legs.. http://cilley.net/thecilleypages/cilley-en-o/p242.htm
Jan 23rd, 2012 - 09:01 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@16
Jan 23rd, 2012 - 09:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Don't piss on My back and tell Me that its raining!!!
@16
Jan 23rd, 2012 - 09:57 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Argie with hole in pocket,feel cocky all day
#10
Jan 23rd, 2012 - 10:04 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Bullshit in every respect.
There was no military equipment on Uganda, Uganda never landed in the Falklands till after hostilities ended. Aboard Uganda were IRC observers who monitored the use of the hospital ship.
On the other hand ARA Almirante Irizar whilst supposedly designated a hospital didn't carry IRC observers, transported the improvised Exocet launcher and engaged in offensive action whilst in Stanley.
The Geneva Convention did not preclude the use of cluster weapons in 1982, they remained in common use in the Gulf War in 1991.
And in addition to the incident at Goose Green, at San Carlos during the landing Argentine troops machine gunned the crew of a Gazelle helicopter they shot down whilst they struggled to survive in the water.
You claim the Argentine troops behaved like a bunch of choirboys on a Sunday School outing. Bullshit. There were numerous instances of blatant breaches of the Geneva Convention - such as imprisoning the entire population of Goose Green, mock executions and booby trapping children's bikes. But I suppose by Argentine standards this was relatively benign as they didn't shove people alive out of the back of aircraft.
But hey typical that he'll the worst kind of bullshit, whilsts ignoring what Argentine forces are documented.
@19 Justin Kuntz
Jan 23rd, 2012 - 10:12 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You forget, argentina demands praise and thanks for not mass raping and murdering the population, and for barely sticking to some rules of war. In fact it is this fact that most argentines use to legitimize the subjugation and suppression of the islanders.
Malviner is just misguided. On my annual visit to Seoul, I occasionally meet a North Korean who has made it South. They really struggle to come to terms with the fact that their nation of birth started the Korean war.
Jan 23rd, 2012 - 10:23 pm - Link - Report abuse 0He has had to put up with indoctrination since he went to school. When Peron came in the school children had their books taken off them and were told to buy new ones. When a military gvt grabbed power these books were taken and new one had to be bought. Such is Argentina and it is the only strategy subsequent leaderships know.
Don't blame him, he is blind to the truth.
“21 Mr Beef,
Jan 23rd, 2012 - 10:40 pm - Link - Report abuse 0What a interesting reflection you made ”Dr”...
I was thinking that probably Mr Peron spend a lot of money in printing enormous amount of those books.....because countries of UNASUR, complete Latin-America also believe that version ....... and you know what ? Also in the United States, China, Russia and even serious journalists, media and academic people in the United Kingdom studied those books too !!......... did not know the relevance that was Peron.
Honestly i didn´t like him so much.....but considering your point of view.....i´ll start to respect him a bit.
That life is unfair ...... 2000 descendant of pirates living illegally in the Malvinas have the truth and nobody believes them.......thats injustice !!
:)
Malvinero1
Jan 23rd, 2012 - 11:17 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I think you very much need help,
Perhaps you supervisor could give you a couple of days of, im sure their are indocronoughts waiting out side,
But you seriously need help, you had better see a doctor straight away,
[ps] Just don’t admit nothing, and look out for the straight jacket behind the door,
Good luck .
I served on and Ambulance Ship during the war in 1982, we never went alongside in the Islands. Uganda was carrying members of The International Red Cross who visited us. Uganda did not go alongside anywhere in the Islands, she was too big. We did not have any contact with any warships or other ships of the Task Force.
Jan 23rd, 2012 - 11:41 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Why did Argentine Troops imprison 114 islanders in the Community Hall?
What do you mean Argentina is the SUCCESSOR of Spain? I am sure Spain will be interested to hear that claim.
Do you still believe that HMS Invincible was sunk?
I find it very sad that you believe you can win with your current attitude, if you had carried on the negotiations from the 1990's you may now have trade agreements in place with the Islands and both Argentina and the Islands would have mutually benefited. With your current attitude I would be very surprised if if the Islanders ever consider trusting you.
He has had to put up with indoctrination since he went to school. When Peron came in the school children had their books taken off them and were told to buy new ones. When a military gvt grabbed power these books were taken and new one had to be bought. Such is Argentina and it is the only strategy subsequent leaderships know
Jan 24th, 2012 - 02:32 am - Link - Report abuse 0Sure guys...Just read:The battle of the falklands, MAx hastings...He describe the accident of the para Jones,that he believes the Arentine guys did not know(Were not aware of the surrender).Also describe the obliteration of the school,killing all of them inside,just to get even.....No brits crimes..And the brits used hospital ships to unload military gear...
Sorry guys,I have a mind of my own..Did any of you lived in Argentina?/I bet not..Nooo body indoctrinet us.......And the brits crimes are huge...India,South Africa...the boers war,the Zulus....It is well documented and many brits agree of the “bad things” done by the brits...Sure the Australian natives and the Amori etc...never happened...Of course, guys....Nooo Body believe the brits lies..
At least have the courage to accept what you are.....
The genocidal practices perpetrated against Australian Aborigines were the outcome of policies adopted and implemented by all Australian governments from British settlement in 1788 until the present. A people who had virtually no contact with the outside world, were suddenly confronted with a hostile and alien force. Aborigines were forced out of their traditional homes, hunted like wild animals, poisoned or shot, and confined to the harshest and most desolate climes. The effect of British settlement upon these people led to near extinction within 120 years.
The Australian Institute of Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Studies has published a report detailing this history. Entitled Genocide in Australia, it was written by Professor Colin Tatz, director of the Centre for Comparative Genocide Studies at Sydney's Macquarie University.
http://www.ws
There is no evidence of this allegation.
Jan 24th, 2012 - 05:32 am - Link - Report abuse 0Argentina spuriously claims that Marv01 has a mind, even suggesting that they implanted it first in 1832, but that late in the evening, and after a spanish lunch, there is little chance of real success!
More recent evidence suggests that Marv01 is, in fact, the only living example of a completely brainless person. Malvinistas have been trying for decades to achieve this through selective breeding (left hand only), although few of them can really grasp what happened the day before yesterday, so cannot remember why!
The result speaks for itself - if rather too often!
There is no evidence of this allegation.
Jan 24th, 2012 - 08:09 am - Link - Report abuse 0Argentina spuriously claims that Marv01 has a mind, even suggesting that they implanted it first in 1832, but that late in the evening, and after a spanish lunch, there is little chance of real success!
More recent evidence suggests that Marv01 is, in fact, the only living example of a completely brainless person. Malvinistas have been trying for decades to achieve this through selective breeding (left hand only), although
As usual,you are a LIAR!!
Just count the days that uk will sit a negotiate a condominium with Argentina....It is over the stupid brit non sense in the SA....Not even uncle Sam(with all the Latino votes in USA) they wil support uk this time.....It is over and the sooner you recognize it,will be the less painful...Remember Ridley in the '80??/The nonsense is over....
No negotiations unless the Islanders wish it ......... EVER !
Jan 24th, 2012 - 12:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0http://cupe.ca/budget/budget-2010-aboriginal-peoples
Jan 24th, 2012 - 02:12 pm - Link - Report abuse 0This budget includes a total of $908 million to assist Aboriginal Peoples:
$30 million to support K-12 education for students to receive comparable education whether the classroom is located on or off reserve.
$330 million funding extension for safe drinking water on reserves.
$10 million over two years to address violence against women and the disturbingly high number of missing and murdered Aboriginal women. This funding is acceptable, but does not deal with the approximately 500 Aboriginal women have gone missing in the last two decades.
$53 million to further progress on developing partnerships with First Nation organizations, provincial and territorial governments on the delivery of child and family services.
$199 million to implement Indian Residential Schools Settlement was anticipated, as about 150,000 Aboriginal Peoples were forced to attend government schools over the last century.
$285 million to improve Aboriginal health outcomes by renewing investments in the Aboriginal Diabetes Initiative, Youth Suicide Prevention Strategy, maternal and child health programs, Aboriginal Health Human Resource Initiative; and the Aboriginal Health Transition Fund.
What does it mean for Aboriginal Peoples?
Dying from hunger in food-exporting Argentina
http://cupe.ca/budget/budget-2010-aboriginal-peoples
Almost 30,000 people live in this region of north-west Argentina, making up around 200 communities. The tribe we visited is known for its reticence. Its members are wary of contact with outsiders.
The areas where they live are a picture of desperate poverty. The houses are mostly wooden shacks, with blankets as makeshift walls, where there are any at all.
We found hardly any access to clean water or sewage systems in the communities we visited.
“When children who lack proper nutrients also face these sorts of sanitary hazards then the risk of disease increases,” said Enrique Heredia, director of social med
19 JustinKuntz
Jan 24th, 2012 - 04:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Bullshit in every respect.
“You claim the Argentine troops behaved like a bunch of choirboys on a Sunday School outing. Bullshit. There were numerous instances of blatant breaches of the Geneva Convention - such as imprisoning the entire population of Goose Green, mock executions and booby trapping children's bikes”
Hard times at “Goose Green”
” -In there they kept us, the bastards“, Allie spits defiantly. We are standing outside a tin roofed timber building that has a bell tower on it which might allow it to be used as a church in case somebody wanted to pray for redemption, but was considered so unlikely it was turned into a bar and social club for the majority who were pretty much certain they were in Hell anyway.
-How long were you in there Allie? I ask.
-Over two months, he replies.
-Terrible...terrible, I sympathise.
-Oh, it wasn't so bad, he sniffs.
-How do you mean?
-Food was good - all Argy stuff and they gave us plenty of Beer and fags.
-Oh, right, I answer then ask. ”But they wouldn't let you out would they and you couldn't get washed or
use proper toilets and things“?
-Who told you that?
-It was in the newspapers.
-Load of bollocks, he sneers. ”They kept us in there at night because of the bloody English sending planes over to bomb the airfield but in the daytime we went back to our houses”.
-I thought your homes had been taken over by the Argentinians?
Some of them had. I had a couple of officers in my house but I liked them. Real polite they were and they gave me all sorts of stuff……………….,”
http://www.wix.com/cusak1951/fantazum
@30
Jan 24th, 2012 - 05:05 pm - Link - Report abuse 0What a load of RUBBISH did you make that up yourself or get your mother to write it for You!!!!
Long Live the Falklands.
Down with argentine Colonialism.
Marcos, where did you get that story from? I have talked to people who were imprisoned in Goose Green and they were not allowed out of the Hall.
Jan 24th, 2012 - 06:02 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“Eileen Jaffray, 61, says: ”It was like a refugee camp but everyone pulled together and helped each other out.
“The children seemed to sense danger — they were ever so good. Sometimes you would see a child crying and you would ask what the matter was and they would say, 'I'm hungry' but there were no tantrums.
”We lived on one meal a day of a cracker, one spoon of beans or spaghetti and a tiny slice of ham. To this day some of the people cannot eat beans because of it.“
With just two toilets, one wash basin and no bedding, living conditions quickly became squalid.
Meanwhile, the islanders' homes were overrun by soldiers, who used every room as a toilet and terrorised their captives daily. ”
Why did Argentinian Soldiers Defecate in every room in every house they went into? Don't you use toilets in Argentina?
Long Live the Falklands.
Jan 24th, 2012 - 06:04 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Down with argentine Colonialism.
Down with brits LIES and Crimes!
VIVA SUD AMERICA!! OUT THE BRITS IMPERIALIST!!
Ahaah Did you get any support from SA,conquered???
Just take care of the 3 million poor brittons and teh 9 trillion pound foreign debt......The rest is OVER!!
@33
Jan 24th, 2012 - 08:00 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Poor Malvine still cannot get Your Facts straight!
Its 1 Trillion pounds Not 9!!
And by the Way You will NEVER get the Falklands!!!!
Long Live the Falklands.
Down with argentine Colonialism.
Down with argentine Lies.
Stop argentine Imperialism.
End argentine Corruption.
Malvinero1
Jan 24th, 2012 - 08:42 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I think you very much need help,
Perhaps you supervisor could give you a couple of days of, im sure their are indocronoughts waiting out side,
But you seriously need help, you had better see a doctor straight away,
[ps] Just don’t admit nothing, and look out for the straight jacket behind the door,
Good luck .
you should go to the ONU and present all your proofs, you seem to have them all.
Jan 25th, 2012 - 12:17 pm - Link - Report abuse 0the ONU is calling you.
british implanters for more than 170 years in south america, go home.
Argentines what does this countdown that you constantly refer to look like? Is it something like this... ∞
Jan 25th, 2012 - 02:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You have been boasting about this countdown since the start of the oil exploration and I have seen little in getting Britain (note: not England) to negotiate something that is not theirs. Negotiations will simply not happen, accept that.
We will all be here in 20 years and you Argentines will still be spouting the same thing. You all claim is has been 179 years since you started protesting and 179 years of pure and unadulterated failure, what actually makes you think now that you are so close? Idiocy I think is the answer.
@36 Malen
Jan 25th, 2012 - 04:54 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Too many Years of indoctrination have Warped Your brain, the Falkland Islanders are here to stay in Peace and Prosperity!!
Long Live the Falklands.
Malen...your and your fellow Argentines constant statements telling the islanders to go home is absurd. We are home. We are part of South America. You need to open your mind and accept our self-determination. We are not going anywhere. It must be embarrassing for a country of 40,000,000 that cannot subdue an island community of 3,000, because you need to get used to it. You are in for a lot of years of frustration and disappointment. 179 years and counting.
Jan 25th, 2012 - 06:20 pm - Link - Report abuse 0And as you have a nasty habit of none payments of debts,
Jan 25th, 2012 - 07:24 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You are thus, only tenants your selves, are you not.
And not very good one’s at that .
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