MercoPress. South Atlantic News Agency
G77 plus China present Argentina with the Malvinas statement denied by the Americas Summit
Representatives from the Group of 77 plus China meeting in Doha, Qatar approved a statement calling on the UK to resume negotiations with Argentina regarding the sovereignty of the Malvinas question, according to a release from the Argentine Foreign Ministry. Read full article
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Disclaimer & comment rulesHardly an unqualified message of support, more of a general statement that the dispute should be settled peacefully by negotiation. And the final bit about abstaining from unilateral action sounds like a warning to Argentina!
Apr 22nd, 2012 - 11:20 pm - Link - Report abuse 0We'll only come back to negotiate if Nestor comes and apologizes for walking out of the last set of negotiations on resources around the Falklands.
Apr 22nd, 2012 - 11:30 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The process recommended by the general assembly is that these islands become an independent state, and not some weird lebensraum annexed territory. This whole statement seems a step backwards for the Argtards, and a warning telling them not to invade again.
Anyways, we're waiting for Nestor to apologize for unilaterally walking out of negotiations in 2005.
Nestor is dead.
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 12:50 am - Link - Report abuse 0Breaking news.
@3 He's saying that the chances of us negotiating with you are very unlikely. Unless Nestor does a Thriller of course.
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 01:07 am - Link - Report abuse 0Well, I don't care really since I don't have any personal interest on the Falkland's issue. Just wondering.
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 01:21 am - Link - Report abuse 0yeah talk about sharing the resources and managing the seas properly would be perfect.
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 02:50 am - Link - Report abuse 0talk about 3000 people giving up their rights for self determination will never happen.
I doubt there'll be a major rapprochement for at least another generation or two - hopefully enough time for Argentina to get a constructive non-deranged government and for the most rabid Malvinistas to die out. Saying that, they've been whinging for 180+ years already so who knows?
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 03:06 am - Link - Report abuse 0went straight over Tobias head.......bless him!
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 04:52 am - Link - Report abuse 0Probably big news in Argentina but, this story hasn't made any news paper in the UK.
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 06:04 am - Link - Report abuse 0So. Nothing new to see here then? A reiteration of UN policy and Malvinistas clutching at straws.
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 07:17 am - Link - Report abuse 0Move along.
Timmerman needs to undestand a simple fundamental - the attitude of the Arg Govt (both Kirchners) and its crazy and bellicose, bullying, arrogant policies of the last several years has only served to promote and consolidate - a further 30 years of distrust by Islanders towards Argentina and its political machinery (whatever the colour or persuasion). Never has so much been delivered by so few, to consolidate the Falkland Islanders cause of self determination. Priceless PR!
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 07:41 am - Link - Report abuse 0It's the same old story. Argentina want sovereignty, the islanders don't want Argentine sovereignty, you cannot talk about this with any kind of satisfactory outcome. Oh almighty Zarquon, these countries know that signing this declaration will have no effect on the UK. Having failed to get a statement out of the SummtOfAmericas', they get one from the G77 and where has it got them? Nowhere. Next it'll be a statement from the Sudanese All Ladies Badminton League.
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 07:53 am - Link - Report abuse 0When the islanders decide that the UK is not for them (plenty of places have done that) then maybe they'll join up with Argentina but hey, they might plump for full independence though somehow this is unlikely as Argentina is so untrustworthy.
Quick question, they keep trumpeting their “amazing support” but have the Argentines actually tried to negotiate in the last couple of years?
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 08:34 am - Link - Report abuse 0Well its official, the majority of humanity (or at least their governments!) in support of my Queen =)
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 09:26 am - Link - Report abuse 0@12 Musky (#) Apr 23rd, 2012 - 07:53 am
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 09:36 am - Link - Report abuse 0My money is on full independence. Maybe not yet. Maybe not for a century or two but that is where I think this HAS to go.
@13 Calaras (#) Apr 23rd, 2012 - 08:34 am
In short no. They have walked away from all negotiations and bilateral agreements because the FIG/UKG will not put any issue of sovereignty on the table.
There are a number of reasons for this, the two key ones being that
1) First and foremost, the FI do not want to be Argentinian. They are and always have been British and they wish to remain so. This is also the cornerstone of UKG policy with regard to FI and it is also fundamental in the Charter of the United Nations. Simply put this is the Right to Self Determination for all people.
2) The Argentinian government have rather unwisely written it into their constitution that sovereignty of the islands that they call Las Malvinas is non negotiable. So if the British were to walk into a conference room with a view to talking about sovereignty of the FI, all Argentina will be prepared to talk about is when they will get the key to the door. So it isn't a matter of negotiation for Argentina at all. They have no intention of negotiating anything other than the timing of some mythical future handover of the islands into Argentinian governance.
And further to the issue of the Right of Self Determination for all peoples, the Argentinians, rather chillingly, do not recognise the people of the FI as people and argue therefore that they have no rights at all.
@14 It's also official that no-one's listening. Not the Falkland Islanders and not Britain. And no-one else counts. Certainly not argieland.
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 09:57 am - Link - Report abuse 0@15
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 10:28 am - Link - Report abuse 0Thanks that's a very clear and well phrased explanation. I still fail to understand however why the Argentine government aren't encouraging an actual debate with the islanders. If they want the islands so badly then surely the easiest way would be to convince the islanders it'd be a good idea and give assurances that the island way of life would be preserved.Hostility is not the way to go
17 Calaras (#)
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 11:29 am - Link - Report abuse 0Apr 23rd, 2012 - 10:28 am
See my last paragraph in post 15. If the Argentinians agreed to speak to the islanders they would have to recognise the islander right to exist.
Christ almighty!!!
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 12:01 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Doesn't this circus ever stop? If the Islands wanted to negotiate with Argentina, then we would be sitting round the table with them right now!!
Because the Islanders DON'T want to then we are not. How simple can you explain it?
End Of.............
Move on, for f*ck's sake...........
Fair enough. Well hopefully the next government of Argentina (when this lot run off with the cash) will be more rational and accept that the islanders want to remain British.
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 12:05 pm - Link - Report abuse 0It is not easy to move on when the big nasty fecker next door keeps putting your windows through and shitting in your back garden because they think your house is in fact their house and they are determined to drive you out of it.
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 12:05 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Really, the world seems to be supporting Argentina.
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 12:54 pm - Link - Report abuse 0A statement from the Sudanese All Ladies Badminton League carries a lot of weight with the Argentine populace. KFC will probably declare a day of national celebration and this show of solidarity will probably cause the British to come to their senses and return to the negotiation table.
Meanwhile, this just in, the Bolivian travel council of Sucre has just named Aerolíneas Argentinas as the best airline in the world. It received top honors in efficiency, customer service, on time arrival and profitability. Perhaps the Falkland Islanders need to re-consider Cristina's offer of direct BA flights to Mount Pleasant...
#17 “I still fail to understand however why the Argentine government aren't encouraging an actual debate with the islanders. If they want the islands so badly then surely the easiest way would be to convince the islanders it'd be a good idea and give assurances that the island way of life would be preserved.”
I'm overwhelmed: You know in today's harsh and brutal world, it's refreshing to know there are innocent individuals like yourself that still believe in the tooth fairy and the Easter Bunny. Maybe Tinker-bell can sprinkle some fairy dust over CFK's hair and turn her into another Christine Lagarde...
They've tried the seduction technique in the past - but with changes of government they never have the patience to stick with it. They seem to believe that a couple of years of “playing nice” should be enough and when it hasn't resulted in tangible gains they've resorted to the old drum beating for domestic purposes.
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 01:07 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Argentina had economically beneficial agreements with the FI in relation to both fishing and hydrocarbons - and yet chose to throw it all away so they could begin complaining about “unilateral actions” by the Falklanders/British.
The problem is that there is no continuity of political aims from one government to the next, even when the government is the same as it's predecessor. All Argentine politicians think in terms of 4 years, never in the long term good of the people.
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 01:48 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Doesn't it all come back to their constitution which makes it illegal to negotiate over sovereignty, not that, that would ever be on the table anyway. They would have to change their constitution, which by the way they conduct politics, is as easy as changing your socks!
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 01:50 pm - Link - Report abuse 022 Chicureo (#)
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 01:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Apr 23rd, 2012 - 12:54 pm
Two problems I can see straight away with that otherwise perfectly reasonable idea.
Argentinians want things to happen quickly. They can be nice for a few years but if they don't see any return after at, at most, a decade, they will flounce and pout in an unholy huff crying things like 'it's soooo unfair' and 'pirates!' and 'squatters!' and 'be strong my queen' and other such shite. You tell them it old take hundreds of years of being nice and even then they may just opt for independence and it is easier for a Malvinista to just pretend the islanders aren't really human and can be ignored.
There was another problem. Can't remember what it was now.
Oh yes. I remember.
Experience shows that Argentinas assurances assure nothing.
@17
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 01:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Yes its blindly obvious from a practical point of view. Be nice, treat the FI people with respect, build relations and links- business and emotional - and within a relatively short time The Falkland Islanders would feel connected with Argentina.
However this is mostly about nationalist politics which has become a deeply ingrained well established cause after 60 years of systematic brainwashing.
IF Argentina ever did get the Islands it would be a result but its not really what this is about. Argentines would be ecstatic for a while - like winning the world cup - and the government would milk every last political drop out of it.... The dictator of the day can then bathe in glory and have a 10 storey high mural of his/herself painted on the side of a building in Avenida 9 de Julio and have every other street, school, hospital, park, bridge, the football league etc named after him/her.
But as always the fantasy is better than reality, the yearning more powerful than the having, and in short time people would carry on with their lives - like they do after winning a world cup. The nationalist government would then find another enemy or cause (and it would) to keep the populace angsty and united.
#27 Perhaps if the Argentines operated their government over the next 50 years with stable good governance and treated the islanders with respect and build relations with “links- business and emotional” perhaps in 3 or 4 generations the Falkland Islanders would feel more connected with Argentina.
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 02:30 pm - Link - Report abuse 0#26 My only proposed thoughts were:
1. Perhaps world opinion was indeed on the side of Argentina since they now have the Sudanese All Ladies Badminton League and the Bolivian travel council of Sucre solidly on their side and this may cause the British to come to their senses and return to the negotiation table.
2. Maybe Tinker-bell can sprinkle some fairy dust over CFK's hair and turn her into another Christine Lagarde.
Seems reasonable, how could you find “problems” with my thoughts? By the way, your last line is so true... and so sad.
“The problem is that there is no continuity of political aims from one government to the next, ...” Simon68 (#24)
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 03:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 0This key point is the main reason why no agreement can be entertained and why the status quo must prevail.
If you can NEVER be sure that any 'All Time' agreement will last beyond the length of a government term, then the only logic is to never create an agreement.
If an international treaty can be torn up by the turn of an election vote, then the legs are kick out from under ANY agreement or contract with that country.
On so many fronts, Argentina is saying to the world “we will not play by your rules, take it or leave it”.
I know its tough on the Argentinians, but the time has come to blackball the nation.
This club we call the world just doesn't want to deal with a country that, so wholeheartedly, rejects the rules by which the world operates.
Ok i admit it sounds a bit naive wondering if the argies would play nice seeing as they never have in the past. But what i meant was that surely someone, some Argentine somewhere, must realise that aggression is counter-productive? Surely someone in power in Argentina must be looking at what's happening and shaking their head in dismay?
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 03:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I think watching a bald geriatric in blue glasses shouting on about the wanting the falklands before soiling himself and then receiving an injection of blood into his fail-stream is quite a sad thing.
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 03:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Personally I have to cry for timmerman, he's such a sad man.
@28 Chicureo
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 03:12 pm - Link - Report abuse 0It goes without saying that Britain has to send out its best diplomatic team immediately to beg to the Sudanese All ladies Badminton League and the Bolivian travel council of Sucre to perhaps.. maybe.. reconsider .
Personally I've seen the Bolivian travel council of Sucre. And the Bolivian travel council of Sucre are not to be messed with.
As for the Sudanese All ladies Badminton league. Well, if its anything like the Arunachal Pradesh Cub Scout Association, then the FI really are f*%$ed.
@24 “The long term good of the people”! That's a laugh. Just like nazi Germany, “the people” are the excuse, not the reason. That's 'populism' for you.
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 03:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@26 & 27. Regrettably, what argieland requires, at every level, is the removal of every argie politician and apparatchik and a wholesale re-education of the population. It will not set matters right in a year or ten years or, obviously, 30 years. On the evidence available, it may take 100 years or more. First indications - the removal of the disgraceful first article of the 'Temporary Provisions' of the argie constitution. The worldwide public apology to the Falkland Islanders by the argie head of state for every negative act and every claim since 1833. The clear, unequivocal and irreversible recognition that the Falkland Islands have never been argie territory, have the right of self-determination and will never be argentine. The clear, unequivocal and irreversible statement that argieland recognises the autonomy of the Islands under the legitimate protection of the United Kingdom. When the use of the term 'Malvinas' becomes, in argieland, a criminal offence.
@28 See above.
@30 You're expecting someone in argieland to display intelligence. Think Kirchner, Timerman, Puricelli, Randazzo, Georgi. See any signs of intelligence? They can't even come up with accusations that hold water! Bit like the ARA Belgrano. That can't hold water either.
@31 “Timerman”, “man”. Wherever did you get the idea that those two words go together? May I suggest that “Timerman” and “sad, stupid, slimy, mendacious git” would go together better!
30 Calaras (#)
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 03:29 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Apr 23rd, 2012 - 03:09 pm
As a thinking Argentine, I don't think that you sound naive, only sensible. Unfortunately in the present political climate in Argentina if anyone got up on his hind legs and said “lets treat the Islanders like people and take notice of their human rights.” That person would be crucified like the intelectuals who made a similar statement a few weeks ago.
I seriously believe that somewhere an Argentine politician is thinking “this cannot go on forever, we must stop this madness and get back into the real world before we go totally bankrupt.”
Please God that it should be soon.
@30 There was an open letter from 17 leading thinkers/historians (or something) but I don't recall them saying 'Hey listen amigos, it's not ours, those clever Brits were right all along, let's be friends'. They simply said ”argentina's approach is going nowhere..win their minds instead'... which is exactly the government crime on their populace, alas almost all of them are they're brainwashed.
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 03:32 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Every time I see an image of Timmerman I get Barry Manilows greatest hits playing in my head. But sometimes I get the very slow sad plinky plonky piano music like in a Disney films when mom etc has to tell little Mikey etc that his faithful dog etc has died heroically whilst saving a basket of kittens etc from...
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 03:41 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@34
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 03:42 pm - Link - Report abuse 0As a resident of Eire i can sympathise with you on the government being corrupt and inept. I sincerely hope some sensible Argentine like yourself manage to get things back on track.
@37
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 03:53 pm - Link - Report abuse 0My hope to. The last 30 years have been wasted. If this acrries on, the next 30 years will go the same way. It's a shame, a real bloody shame.
The G77 scraping the barrel at bit are we not RG's. Is it similar to when a petition comes round it ''sign this please'' look at all the signatures we have.
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 06:11 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Didnt the botox queens husband walk out of and tear up the previous agreements / negotiations with the UK??? Doesnt the RG constitution say the Islands are RG property!!! so how can we progress. The Rg's seem to choose which rules to play by, which to break as defaulted loans , stealing oil companies from your mother country, illegal blockades, and victimisation of 3000 citizens on the Falklands. Fight your own battles, stop your constant moaning. Fix your broken economy and develop your own resources which are large.
| 34 |
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 06:18 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Where do you live in Argentina ?
I cant ask you any questions if you say living in far flung areas like Chubut,Patagonia,Missiones,Salta,La Riola....
#22 & 28 Why would my beautiful radical Queen want to turn into that IMF hag Legarde?!
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 06:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@40 Max. Why do need to know where Simon68 lives, to ask him a question?
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 06:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0| 42 |
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 07:05 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Let's say that just my sportive mentality.........!
@43
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 07:14 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Well, lets just say he keeps his annonimity then. That sporting enough.
41 Scottie_Kirchnerist
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 08:05 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The only Queen you should be interested as to her health is HM Queen Elizabeth II. Not some rubber plant with pretentions of life.
BTW if the Argies had the support (post 14) that the English have of getting rid of the Scots in a referendum then all you dole claimers will be out begging Salmon-Face with your gruel bowls. That will be the measure of his 'support'.
The Doha mob recommendation is in open violation of Article 2 of the UN Charter! It's about time the injusticialist malvinazis understood that first and foremost the Falkland Islanders' self-determination must be respected! Everything else is blah+blah+blah.
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 08:53 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Philippe
I think that the “Malvinas Question” has now changed at all these summits to - why the hell are Artgentina still going on about it? We do not give rats ass... There will be no negotiation as the Argentine Constitution only allows for one recognised outcome. Some negotiation - Argentina - grow up and sort out your own problems... not distract your people with ignore the right hand and watch the left hand politics - CFK must have had lessons frpm Penn & Teller!!!!
Apr 23rd, 2012 - 10:39 pm - Link - Report abuse 040@
Apr 24th, 2012 - 12:49 am - Link - Report abuse 0I live in darkest Patagonia, does that help?
36 Tobers
Apr 24th, 2012 - 12:17 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Every time I see Timmerman, I want to grab a can of Mr Sheen and polish his head to a high mirrored shine. His face could do with an iron as well, just to get all those creases out of it.
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