MercoPress. South Atlantic News Agency
Argentine government re-activates national committee of Malvinas combatants
The Argentine government reactivated the National Committee of former Malvinas combatants which will support legal actions against crimes committed by Argentine officers during the 1982 conflict and demand DNA tests to identify the 123 remains buried in the Darwin cemetery in the Falklands. Read full article
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Disclaimer & comment rulesits the falklands.
May 10th, 2012 - 04:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Your not getting them unless the islanders change their mind.
Which is going to be a cold day in hell or a warm sunny day in the falklands ( whichever comes first :) )
Demand! DNA tests. Who the feck are they to demand anything. Request would have been a more appropriate word! and it should be addressed correctly, to FIG. One sniff, the slightest sniff! of politicing from KFC on this issue and it should be treated with the contempt it deserves. The should be left in no doubt whatsoever on that score. We all saw the last “creative” example of the Argentines visit to the Islands.
May 10th, 2012 - 04:42 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@1 Dont you know Argenweener has DEMANDED, thus shall be written in stone,
May 10th, 2012 - 04:46 pm - Link - Report abuse 0best response to their continual demands is no response
The FIG have never refused access to these bodies, they tried to return them and the Argie government refused them, claiming they were already on Argie soil, so now their arrogance bites them on the arse. They could ask the FIG directly, but they won't talk to them and prefer to ask the UK instead, who have nothing to do with it, as well Kirchner knows. SHe's a dick and trying to say it's the UK stopping this process whereas it's purely her own bloodymindedness.
May 10th, 2012 - 04:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Simple answer, excavate the bodies for DNA and then ship back to Arg NOT for negotiation.
May 10th, 2012 - 04:55 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Or let them rest in peace.
I wouldn't let them within 250 miles of the Islands. If it's going to be done, let it be done by a neutral, the Swiss perhaps. Easy enough to achieve, any competent forensic team could obtain the samples and forward them on. No, absolutely no, autopsies.
May 10th, 2012 - 04:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Exhume the bodies no problem with me then return them back to Argentina where they can carry out whatever DNA tests you want. The sad thing is if they had cared at all about those young men they would have ensured that all of them carried working ID tags. I am not aware of any British corpse found that was not identified with the exception of those resting in the maritime graves but that is the sailors way. The very fact that this report is tied into abuses of private soldiers by their own officers is grim reading and yet another example of why we want nothing to do with them.
May 10th, 2012 - 05:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I have an awful feeling that this is the opening of Pandoras Box, and the people who are going to suffer will be the present day Falklanders.
May 10th, 2012 - 05:11 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Very difficult to handle this without The Mad Bitch milking it for all she can.
I would be very inclined to ignore whatever the 'Malvinas Combatants' demand.
@7
May 10th, 2012 - 05:14 pm - Link - Report abuse 0So the UK has no monument to the Unknown Soldier. Interesting. I will double-check now to confirm.
@9
May 10th, 2012 - 05:23 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Try looking in the middle of Westminster Abbey. SG is talking about the Falklands War. All our dead were identified.
tobias you are a twit, there are no unkown dead UK soldiers.
May 10th, 2012 - 05:25 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@10 and 11
May 10th, 2012 - 05:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You guys have some facts to clear up. When you do (does the UK have any unideed soldiers or not), get back to me.
Not from the Falklands war.
May 10th, 2012 - 05:32 pm - Link - Report abuse 0What SG is refering to is the recovering of bodies from sunk ships “resting in the maritime graves but that is the sailors way”
Bodies from sunken ships are not usually recoverable.
This is going to be funny. Argie conscripts trying to get their officers banged up for doing whatever it was they did during an illegal, unprovoked invasion where the UN told them to quit and go home. Regarding the argie “war dead”, I've said it before and I'll say it again, in agreement with Ken Ridge. Dig 'em up. Forensic examination by British/Falkland Islands specialists to the highest standards with photographs and the very latest in x-rays, cat scans and so forth. Into body bags with copy documents taped to the outside. Can't have much in the way of coffins. Not enough trees on the Falklands. Load the lot into a container. Completely seal the container. Load it aboard a suitable vessel flying the Falklands flag. Sail for argieland. At the edge of argie territorial waters, inform the argie authorities of the cargo and the intention to land it in a suitable argie port. In the event that permission to dock and offload is refused, jettison the container over the side inside legally-recognised argie waters. Return to the Falkland Islands. Arrange for argie war cemetary to be excised and the land returned to legitimate Falklander use. No more “argie land” on the Falklands. No more “argie family visits”. Problems solved!
May 10th, 2012 - 05:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@9 I assume that you are aluding to a tomb of the unknown soldier? As it happens the UK does have such a tomb/monument, it dates back to the first world war as is called the tomb of the unknown warrior.
May 10th, 2012 - 05:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0It's hardly comparable however, given the relatives scales of the Falklands and First World Wars.
It should be a relatively simple matter to get a neutral third party to excavate the graves of the Argentine fallen and extract the appropriate samples. I suspect more extensive forensics (e.g. autopsy) would require repatriation, which I'm sure could be arranged. One wonders why this is taking so long, could it be that the Argentine government has dragged its feet for 30 years and now expects the UK/FIG to act as if an arm of the Argentine administration. This is not a pressing a concern to the UK/FIG, and I suspect won't receive prime attention whilst Argentina continues to play these silly games (incl. not addressing the FIG directly!).
@13
May 10th, 2012 - 05:34 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Uknown Tombs are never about maritime sailors.
Tobias.
May 10th, 2012 - 05:37 pm - Link - Report abuse 0No, the UK does not have any unknown dead. Following their deaths in action, all UK soldiers were taken to the field hospital at San Carlos. In most cases, they were accopanied by a comrade. Surgeon Commander Rick Jolly, supervised their identification through their ID tags and certified the cause of death. Those who died at sea, with no known grave, were classified missing believed killed in action. Following the war, a coroners court held hearings into the circumstances and cause of the allmens death. In the case where no bodies were recovered, evidence was taken from witnesses to their deaths. Verdicts were recorded for all the men. There are no missing and no unkown dead.
12 tobias
May 10th, 2012 - 05:40 pm - Link - Report abuse 0WTF is an 'unideed soldier'.
You wouldn't by any chance be talking about those unidentified dead fromm WW1, too mangled by artillery fire ever to be recognised?
Perhaps we should 'demand' that the French dig them all up for us.
Idiot.
@16
May 10th, 2012 - 05:41 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Quite correct, but you appear to be alluding to a tomb which harks back to the first and second world wars. In the modern era, it is very rare (nee unheard of since the advent of DNA profiling) for there to be any unidentified fallen. As has been stated, there were no unidentified British fallen (outside of maritime dead) for the Falklands war. The scale of the conflict and the relatively cheap and simple measure of providing British soldiers with ID tags virtually assured that this would not be possible. Also, the fact that British fallen were repatriated to British soil meant that DNA profiling was possible (whether such a resort was neccissary, I don't know).
@16 I said none from the Falklands war, read 15.
May 10th, 2012 - 05:42 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Are you trying to justify your un-named war dead? Well send your troops without relivant ID or with leaders that couldn't be bothered naming them, then that's what you get.
At least we had the decency to treat your dead with respect named or not.
The statements made were “there are no unknown UK war dead”.
May 10th, 2012 - 05:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0That sounds like a statement not just including the Falklands, but all wars in the 20th century.
Now that it has been clarified, then I have no further objections.
I am all for giving these men their identities back, for the sake of their loved ones if nothing else. What I am against is any form of politicing whatsoever, over this issue. As previous posters have stated, this could have all been resolved years age, if it was not for F....ing politics.
May 10th, 2012 - 05:50 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@ 21 toby the twit.
May 10th, 2012 - 05:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The conversation is regarding the unidentified Falkland war veterans, twist things as you please it only makes you look a fool.
@14 Couldn't agree more.
@23
May 10th, 2012 - 05:54 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Name calling makes one look a fool. Now, I'll leave all to keep talking about the topic at hand.
I seem to remember that Kretina promised to do the DNA testing through the International Red Cross, please don't tell me she LIED, I can't believe it. It must be a mistake BK's Queen cant lie.
May 10th, 2012 - 05:55 pm - Link - Report abuse 0This is all nonsense. All they have to do is ask the Falkland Islands Government, and ask nicely. It's surprising what a little politeness can achieve.
May 10th, 2012 - 05:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@25 Simon68
May 10th, 2012 - 06:04 pm - Link - Report abuse 0She can promise all she likes, without the consent of the FIG not even the ICRC will have access to these men, she knows that, the obscene cow is just using this immotive issue to stir up her supporters and to distract the rest of the population from the realities of her presidency.
“Name calling makes one look a fool.”
May 10th, 2012 - 06:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Taking things out of context when it's clear to anyone that this discussion was about the Falklands war does indeed make you look quite the fool.
It rather looks like you was sceptical that in the Falklands war the UK did not have any unidentified war dead and after looking the subject up realized that it is indeed true, instead trying to use his words in the literal sense which could mean anything back to the founding of the UK where indeed we would have unidentified war dead due to the technology at the time.
The context of this thread was very clear.
a comment from telegraph by robbyb
May 10th, 2012 - 06:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0A few years ago, a remote peat bog gave up the remains of an Argentinian Air Force Lear Jet shot down by a RN ship during the war because it was spotting for bombers trying to attack the fleet. Inside the wreck were the remains of the 4 crew.
The Argentinian government refused to allow the remains to be repatriated for political reasons, but worse than that, they also failed to notify the relatives that human remains had been found. The bodies were buried in a fenced graveyard at the crash site by the UK military and a nice memorial was erected by the Gurkhas who happened to be the resident infantry company at the time.
Some months later, the local settlement manager at Pebble Island received a letter from Argentina from a berieved relative saying that they had heard rumours about the discovery of human remains and, in the absence of any official Argentinian information, could he shed any light on the matter. To cut a long story short, the relatives eventually visited the Islands and were flown by RAF Chinook to the lonely crash site where a service was held for them by military padre.
Some of the remarks here implying British intransigence are ill informed. The UK does everything possible to ensure that the matter of Argentinian war dead is treated as sensitively as possible.
Dispicable, truely dispicable, failing to inform the relatives. What in the name of all humanity can you achieve by keeping the discovery of four dead airmen a secret.
May 10th, 2012 - 06:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0OK bastards you want the DNA do you well you can have them, in fact you can have them tomorrow. However, bastards you will first have to drop this ridicules’ demand that the Falkland's belong to you. Now Bitch sign here------------------------------------.
May 10th, 2012 - 06:38 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The Argentine Military Cemetery, Spanish: Cementerio de Darwin (Darwin Cemetery), is a military cemetery on East Falkland that holds the remains of 237 Argentine combatants killed during the 1982 Falklands War (Spanish: Guerra de las Malvinas). It is located west of the Darwin Settlement close to the location of the Battle of Goose Green.
May 10th, 2012 - 06:46 pm - Link - Report abuse 0http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argentine_Military_Cemetery
After the conflict the United Kingdom offered to send the bodies back to Argentina, but Argentina refused, knowing that the remains would ensure a continuing Argentine presence on the islands.
Why not just the DNA samples, bypass the obscene cow and send them to Mr Alonso. He can cross match them with relatives, send the details back to the FIG. The gravestones could then be marked, end of. No press, no cameras and no KFC and her “creative” Argentinian advertising man. Never happen though, can you imagine the mischief she would get up to if she got her hands on the DNA.
May 10th, 2012 - 06:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0First of, Argentina should settle on what exactly what it wants to do, and achieve,
May 10th, 2012 - 06:57 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Then they may approach the red cross or the UN,
Who then in turn can approach the islanders, to arrange agreements to do, or not to do, what is required,
if they agree, then the organisations, concerned can then arrange specialist to visit and set up, facilities to retrieve the DNA or other info,
Then return the graves to the same state, in which they were found, and then they may leave, after the islanders and the organisation concerned are agreeable that all the work has been done,
Then they go away, and we can all get on with life,
It can be reported if required,,
This way, the argentine government has no reason to get involved at all, as it would in fact be a civilian operation, and carried out by professional people .
Sound about right .
yes / no
.
Most of the relatives in Argentina know that their sons were sent on the ill fated occupation of the Falkland Islands. They know that their kin lost their lives, this is just as sad as those from the UK who also lost kin.
May 10th, 2012 - 07:05 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Let us please all not use these fallen from both sides for political gain - CFK/Argentina especially.
Yes, no Government involvement.
May 10th, 2012 - 07:08 pm - Link - Report abuse 0CFK's idea to “re-activate” this organization, so it will likely toe her party line to harass the Falkland Islands pretty closely.
May 10th, 2012 - 07:31 pm - Link - Report abuse 0So far as I can tell, Ernesto Alonso's organization is called La Comisión Nacional de Ex Combatientes de Malvinas (http://www.cecim.org.ar/) and one of CECIM's principles that is a most obviously related to the Falklands is to “Defend the sovereign rights in the South Atlantic, Falklands, Georgias and South Sandwich from any colonialist and imperialist dominion” (Defender los derechos soberanos en el Atlántico Sur, Malvinas, Georgias y Sándwich del Sur de todo dominio colonialista e imperialista: http://www.cecim.org.ar/)
But since CECIM must figure it needs some measure of cooperation from Britain and Falkland Islanders, CECIM doesn't actually name Britain as being that nasty colonialist and imperialist power.
However, in recent Página 12 story on Ernesto Alonso, he proposes a new “paradigm” to try grab the Falklands without the militarist jingoism, chauvinism and violence associated with the past. With connexion to cFK, seems to emerge from the depths of the Casa Rosada itself.
(http://www.cecim.org.ar/)
The term “new paradigm” seems weird in this context, but I heard it in a recent videotape of that old soldier-war criminal and politician Aldo Rico, as he admitted that the British have developed a “new paradigm” of understanding the Falklands as enjoying “self-determination”, which Rico figured trumped the anti-colonialist or anti-imperialist pronouncements coming out of the current Argentine establishment.
So is it an internal Argentine battle of paradigms by war vets just wanting better pensions and sending more of their war-criminal officers off to jail, or is CECIM something actually firming-up as a new CKF strategy that needs to be shot-down now (pardon the pun) before it reaches the Falklands?
The British “Grave of the Unknown Soldier” is a memorial for all soldiers, sailors and airmen for whom there is no known grave, be they at sea or buried in foreign countries. It represents all dead. Not since the Second World War has there been a conflict or action during which the British have been unable to name their dead.
May 10th, 2012 - 08:18 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The graves of the dead RG soldiers at Darwin are there because the RG government refused to repatriate them. The most polite thing to at the time was to bury them with all the ceremony any fighting man deserves. They weren't taken out to sea and thrown over the side, or anything nasty like that.
My personal view is just this: Many families have come over and have identified themselves with a particular grave; if it transpires, and this is very likely, that said family finds that their son or father is not buried at Darwin at all, they will have no place to identify with any more. I think this would be particularly wrong.
I believe that the graves should be exhumed and the remains returned to Argentina. That will never happen as long common-sense does not prevail in RGland.
@38
May 10th, 2012 - 08:38 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The sad part of all this is that it is all politics to help Argentina make their claim on the Falkland Islands.
They have had 30 years to ask for DNA samples or the repatriation of the bodies of their fallen - it is only down to the Falkland Islanders and the UK that there is any memorial at all for these unfortunate men.
“The Argentine governments recently requested the International Red Cross to act as an intermediate before the UK government to allow forensic teams into the Falklands to identify the remains in the Darwin cemetery.”
This statement suggests that this has been an ongoing dispute about allowing Argentina being allowed to identify the bodies and this is not true.
The ICRC knows that full well but will still allow Argentina to use its humanitarian offices for propoganda purposes.
May 10th, 2012 - 08:42 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Surely they're 'demanding' the ICRC to act as an intermediate before the UK government who they then 'demand' to act as an intermediate before the FIG. It's curious that they demand to the wrong people, with two lots of people in the middle as intermediates.
May 10th, 2012 - 09:03 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Not sure what the ICRC or the British Government actually have to do with it, but this is yet another example of utter failure in their ability to understand diplomacy.
As a side note, it's withing the FIGs rights to say 'no, sorry... unless you want the bodies back' then the ball is back in the Argtard's court...
It really is unfortunate that the identification of war dead is made into a political football by the RG govt. Unbelievable that a block would be put on their repatriation if the family's wanted it to be so.
May 10th, 2012 - 09:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You just dont trust this RG Govt but all of the soldiers deserve to be identified and taken home.
RIP.
@42 I agree. It's time they go home and spend time with their families.
May 10th, 2012 - 09:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Up until 1982 all British serviceman killed in action were buried and commemorated as close to the place of death as possible.
May 10th, 2012 - 10:20 pm - Link - Report abuse 0After the Falklands War, one family requested the repatriation of their fallen son's body, and following this, other families requested the same; as a result, this offer was extended to all relatives. On the 16th November 1982 64 of the dead, (52 soldiers, 11 Royal Marines, and a Chinese laundryman) were returned to Britain.
The families of sixteen of the dead kept with tradition and preferred their sons' remains should stay in the islands. Fourteen are buried at Port San Carlos with two more at isolated single grave sites at Goose Green and Port Howard.
@44
May 10th, 2012 - 10:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Hasnt an island in the Falklands recently been named after one of the lads who died? If so - fitting. God Rest his Soul.
In many years the people will remember what they did for the freedom of the islands through paying the ultimate
May 10th, 2012 - 10:31 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@45 Yes it has. Craig Island out on Hope Cottage land, just up the road from Estancia. And a very beautiful place it is too.
May 11th, 2012 - 12:05 am - Link - Report abuse 0“Hero's island: Falklands outpost renamed in honour of last British soldier killed in war”:
May 11th, 2012 - 01:06 am - Link - Report abuse 0http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/heros-island-falklands-outpost-renamed-750390
Craig's Island on Google Maps: http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/heros-island-falklands-outpost-renamed-750390
Wonderful gesture, by a wonderful Falkland Islander. RIP Craig with th rest of the lads.
May 11th, 2012 - 05:01 am - Link - Report abuse 0The Big Lie
May 11th, 2012 - 06:06 am - Link - Report abuse 0http://falklandsnews.wordpress.com/2012/05/11/argentinas-big-lie/
@50 the big lie is just a big lie.
May 11th, 2012 - 08:13 am - Link - Report abuse 0@26
May 11th, 2012 - 10:40 am - Link - Report abuse 0That would be the way to achieve what they want to but there's no way she'd do that. By asking the FIG she'd be aknowledging our government of the Falklands....and that's the ONLY way to achieve what they want.
A very nice catch 22 situation.
@52 They're basically just one big anachronism. The FIG is democratically elected, represents the feelings, intents and wishes of the peoples of the Falkland islands, and as a self-governing BOT the UK people have developed a mature and lasting relationship with the people of the Falkands, based on mutual values and beliefs.
May 11th, 2012 - 11:10 am - Link - Report abuse 0Having some Argtards then want to negotiate with the UK, is just very very 1980s. The world has progressed since then, but Argtardia hasn't. They're just stuck in the past. They cannot even come to terms with the fact that to get things done they need to speak to the FIG.gov, not UK.gov.
In addition that silly orange head ambassador-fool seems to have got it into her head that she represents all of Latin America, and as such the Falklands is somehow 'leased' to them and full of argtards, and we should return it to them like with HK. She's clearly an imbecile because there are very very few similarities between the two situations.
Argtards gonna tard.
sadly this deluded indocrinated ancrinim of humanity knows only how to minipulate men, and to get her own way,
May 11th, 2012 - 11:36 am - Link - Report abuse 0the way to deal with this little barbie doll is to totaly ignore her,
we all see what happend not so long ago when her so called best and greatest supporters, just ignored her, she run home crying in tears,
mummy mummy that laugh at me ,
mmmm
Great move by my Queen to keep up the progress on human rights and hold the junta and their henchmen to account
May 11th, 2012 - 11:59 am - Link - Report abuse 0@55 Junta -v- Nazi Comical Politburo
May 11th, 2012 - 12:50 pm - Link - Report abuse 0WHAT'S THE DIFFERENCE?
@56 You could black box it and just look at the outputs for a comparison. Either way, same types of policies coming out of both, generally harassing the neighbours.
May 11th, 2012 - 01:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Islanders: I've been doing business with Argentines for many years, and here's what I've learned: most Argentine individuals are honest and will keep their word. However, when it comes to the government, best keep your distance, and remember that much of the Argentine gov't brass is corrupt and so are many of the lower-echelon employees.
May 12th, 2012 - 11:45 am - Link - Report abuse 0@34 You've put your finger right on “the problem”. You are suggesting that some argie organisation organises some specialists, presumably including gravediggers, and that FIG then allows this bunch to land on the Falklands, “set up facilities” and do what? Prepare two sets of reports, one for the FIG and one for the argies? No, no, no. The remains must be exhumed by Falkland Islands/British specialists, subjected to full forensic examination and then repatriated to argieland with copies of the reports, etc. Research how long it can take to do a full-scale forensic examination of 30-year old remains. Argies could be on the Islands doing whatever they want (no-one would expect them to work 24/7) for weeks or months. Quite unacceptable, and FIG would be daft to agree to it.
May 12th, 2012 - 06:25 pm - Link - Report abuse 0For the sake of any Falklanders reading this, I can tell you that I had dealings with the Forensic Science Service in London on a number of cases over the course of years. In NO case was it possible to get a result, even for as little as identification of a substance, in less than four weeks.
I don't see why Argentines should get the DNA. If they haven't the manners to ask FIG, then a neutral party from the Red Cross should take the samples. But the best solution is clearlyto repatriate the bodies to Argentina so they will be nearer to their relations. But even if the Argentines use this for propaganda purposes, which they will, once they have finished, they can't milk the same issue again.
May 19th, 2012 - 02:32 am - Link - Report abuse 0Commenting for this story is now closed.
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