MercoPress. South Atlantic News Agency
Gibraltar in C24 challenges Spain to take disputed waters case to the International Court
Spain is scared to test its “feeble claims” in Court, whether in respect of Gibraltar’s undisputable right to self determination or its undisputable waters. That was the charge made by Gibraltar Chief Minister Fabian Picardo on Friday before the United Nations Committee of 24 as he challenged Madrid to take these issues to the appropriate international courts. Read full article
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Disclaimer & comment rulesIt will be interesting to see if the chair makes any statement following the completed discussions.
Jun 18th, 2012 - 08:18 am - Link - Report abuse 0Although historically different, the argument is boiling down to the same issue - Sovereignty / Territorial Integrity over the basic human right of Self-Determination as in the Falklands.
There can be NO sovereignty dispute - El Peñon is British according to the wishes of the Monarch of Spain who ceded the sovereignty of Gibraltar in PERPETUITY in exchange for the Islas Baleares by way of the Treaty of Utrecht. In order to regain Gibraltar the Treaty of Utrecht would have to be renegotiated.
Jun 18th, 2012 - 09:26 am - Link - Report abuse 0I watched Fabian Picardo give his presentation to the committee and it was f*cking hilarious. He was basically tearing them a new assh*le and pointing out that no one listens to their referenda, and telling them exactly what Spain were going to say next. He then started saying how any discussions on sovereignty should go through the ICJ and why didn't Spain want to go to the ICJ. Then some weak minded guy from spain got up and said exactly what Mr Picardo said he was going to say, word for word. It was awesome, and the C24 just looked utterly useless.
Jun 18th, 2012 - 10:39 am - Link - Report abuse 0@3. “and the C24 just looked utterly useless.” Nothing new there then.
Jun 18th, 2012 - 12:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Saw a comment on another report that summed up perfectly. C24 = Re-Colonisation committee. How true is that.
@4 The more you watch it, the more you realise it's not interested in decolonising.
Jun 18th, 2012 - 01:02 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Oh god, they mentioned the unspeakable ICJ word. The c24 will probably decide to permanently ban Gibraltar from ever attending again now for reminding them of the court's existance.
Jun 18th, 2012 - 01:55 pm - Link - Report abuse 0It was originally about decolonising. Now it is simply a freebie talking shop and an opportunity for third world nations to air their grievances about the first world.
Jun 18th, 2012 - 02:08 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Spain needs to ask its self how it can win over the support of the Gibraltarians. Any change to Gibraltar's status without the support of its people would be unthinkable.
Jun 18th, 2012 - 03:02 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@8 They clearly showed in the C24 that they have no interest in listening to the Gibraltans. They pretty much laid that out flat, and then basically became argentina ranting on about nonsense.
Jun 18th, 2012 - 03:11 pm - Link - Report abuse 0What was interesting is that he said Spain have some militant group called the something of seville who continuously try to lead spanish fishing and shipping into Gibraltan territory and it's happened lots and lots in the past year.
It's only a matter of time before the Gibraltans/British sink something just to make sure the Spanish get the point that it's not their land, they signed it away.
There seems to be an issue with being true to your word, and speaking the spanish language. They don't seem compatible.
@9. Point taken, I agree with most of what you say.
Jun 18th, 2012 - 03:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0My point was that without the support of the Gibraltarians, Spain is wasting its time. But there is some common ground, and if Spain could strike a deal with Gibraltar, then the UK would happily go along with it.
The elephant in the room is independence, or at least a form of independence. The former Chief Minister flirted with an 'Andorra solution', where both Britain and Spain would have a constitutional role in an independent Gibraltar. An opinion poll in Spain indicated that 60% of Spaniards would support some form of independence for Gibraltar.
The same issue as the FI, TI vs SD, but I bet the C24 has a different view.
Jun 18th, 2012 - 04:08 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@10 The Spanish won't be happy until Portugal and Gibraltar are back under their wing, and the time machine they're inventing has taken life back to when they were a world power, rather than economically bankrupt and begging the Argentinians for crumbs.
Jun 18th, 2012 - 04:35 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Gibraltar may yet become independent, but they need to defend themselves against poorville living next door. This is an issue, and also the Treaty of Utrecht states that it's not allowed independence, as sovereignty returns to Spain.
If I remember my history.
The history and situation of Gibraltar from 1704 appears to be as follows:
Jun 18th, 2012 - 07:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0In 1704, an Anglo-Dutch force captured Gibraltar from the Spanish. The Spanish contend that the Spanish population were expelled. In fact, being Spanish, the population fled. Under the terms of the 1713 Treaty of Utrecht, Gibraltar was ceded to Britain in perpetuity. The cession was confirmed in the Treaty of Seville in 1729 and a subsequent treaty signed in Paris. In my view, along the way, Spain abrogated any rights it “might” have had under the Treaty of Utrecht by laying siege to Gibraltar in 1727 and again between 1779-83. Ludicrously, Spain claims that Gibraltar has no territorial waters because they aren't mentioned in the Treaty of Utrecht. Curiously, the same treaty doesn't mention Spanish territorial waters either. Even more curiously, the concept of “territorial waters” off a country's coastline didn't start to gain acceptance until the late 18th century. Generally, the idea was that a country's territorial waters were limited to where the country had a gun that could fire out to sea.
But then nothing from Spain until the 50s and 60s. And a dictator called Franco. And now the Spanish want to carry that on. Denying British Gibraltar Territorial Waters. Illegal incursions. Illegal fishing. Illegal invasions by Spanish paramilitary terrorists.
Does this remind anyone of another bunch of cowardly, dishonest, lying, sneaky, underhand Hispanics?
Like father like son,
Jun 18th, 2012 - 09:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Spain and Argentina,
Two rotten apples in the same corrupt barrel .
.
Watching Spain dry-hump Argentina's leg all the time makes me nauseous. At least the world has Gibraltar nearby where people make sense.
Jun 18th, 2012 - 10:11 pm - Link - Report abuse 0true .
Jun 18th, 2012 - 10:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Keep on dreaming....Mr Picardo.
Jun 18th, 2012 - 10:56 pm - Link - Report abuse 0#13
Jun 19th, 2012 - 10:51 am - Link - Report abuse 0You could add that Spain signed up to the 1958 convention on the territorial sea and the 1988 law of the sea convention, under both of which Gibraltar is entitled to territorial waters. And that the so called Spanish “reservation” from the 1988 convention is of no effect, as the convention specifically states that no such reservations can modifdy the convention's provisions.
But perhaps the most telling point is one that Picardo stressed: the Spanish foreign ministry has on many occasions received advice from its own advisers, particularly a now retired ambassador and professor of international law, to the effect that the argument that Gibraltar has no territorial waters is completely wrong.
@17 Keep on dry-humping, aussie. You are such a wanker. But then that's all most aussie-claimers can do.
Jun 19th, 2012 - 07:50 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Fabian Picardo for UK Prime Minister I say!
Jun 19th, 2012 - 08:34 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Got more balls than the two prats we have presently got.
When you go around putting colonies around the world...Don´t get upset when these countries want you out of their countries.
Jun 19th, 2012 - 11:00 pm - Link - Report abuse 020 I don´t think he has balls the only thing he has is a big ego and Spain
will just continue pounding and making it difficult for these individuals until they come to their senses...Spain wants its land back!!!
its not spannish land .
Jun 19th, 2012 - 11:08 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Treaty of Utrecht
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_of_Utrecht
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Disputed status of Gibraltar
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_of_Utrecht
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UNITED NATIONS: PICARDO CHALLENGES SPAIN TO TAKE SELF-DETERMINATION AND WATERS ISSUES TO INTERNATIONAL COURTS
Spain is scared to test its “feeble claims” in Court, whether in respect of Gibraltar’s undisputable right to self determination or its undisputable waters. That was the charge made by Chief Minister Fabian Picardo yesterday before the United Nations Committee of 24 as he challenged Madrid to take these issues to the appropriate international courts.
Gibraltar, he made clear, is confident of success. He was equally confident in his assertion that “Gibraltar will never be Spanish
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_of_Utrecht
read it,
@22 briton,
Jun 25th, 2012 - 06:52 am - Link - Report abuse 0Can argentine sunshine actually read English?
l would think that he just copies what his Argentine secret service controller puts in front of him/her/it.
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