MercoPress. South Atlantic News Agency
Falklands’ population 2.563 of which 75%, live in Stanley, according to April census
The normal resident population of the Falkland Islands on Census Day (15 April 2012) was 2,841 according to the first results from the census published by the Falkland Islands Government and released on Monday. Read full article
Comments
Disclaimer & comment rulesFor some reason loads of argies seem convinced that the population figures stated from time to time actually include the military personnel as well, as it states above “as non-residents, military personnel are not included in the census.” so I hope they can now stfu.
Sep 11th, 2012 - 07:11 am - Link - Report abuse 0Oh!
Sep 11th, 2012 - 08:25 am - Link - Report abuse 0This must be a joke a census just to count 3k?
Oh! They got electricity and Heating such an achievement.
And they do have toilettes also wow!.
Someone has noted that in the photo the houses look like these cheap “pre-fabricada” that people use in Argentina shantytowns and for low income people under the poverty line American style?
http://www.viviendaselombu.com.ar/images/cabana/33.jpg
http://www.viviendaselombu.com.ar/images/cabana/33.jpg
http://www.viviendaselombu.com.ar/images/cabana/33.jpg
Cost start from $29.000 pesos or $6250 US dollars.
http://www.viviendaselombu.com.ar/images/cabana/33.jpg
And this is suppose to be rich in F@ckland?
Amazing!
You're a bit deranged really aren't you Dany.
Sep 11th, 2012 - 08:32 am - Link - Report abuse 0There are no “shanty towns” in the Falklands - unlike those you admit exist in Argentina.
@2.
Sep 11th, 2012 - 08:41 am - Link - Report abuse 0Yes the Falkland Islanders have toilets which were unused during the illegal occupation by `Argentine`s finest warriors`. They defecated everywhere and anywhere but in the toilet, so next time you come out with your smart-arse comments, check `em out first !
Maybe they weren't old enough to have been trained in the use of toilets at the time. After all they were only teenagers.
Sep 11th, 2012 - 08:51 am - Link - Report abuse 0@5.
Sep 11th, 2012 - 09:00 am - Link - Report abuse 0True, I do recall they were wearing their potties on their heads.
@2 A census is about much more than just counting heads.
Sep 11th, 2012 - 09:24 am - Link - Report abuse 0“... statistics collected through the Census are vitally important in understanding peoples needs and in establishing what services need to be provided for people - from education, health, community care, housing and many more. ”
I assume your government doesn't care enough about the “needs” of the population to ask these questions.
@2
Sep 11th, 2012 - 09:46 am - Link - Report abuse 0Many of the newer houses in Stanley are indeed timber framed prefabricated kits. They are not, however, the flimsy, cheap units you would see in South America, these are quality kits of European manufacture. They might not be to everyones taste aesthetically but they are solid, double lined houses that deal with our harsh climate just fine. I've seen timber frame housing being built in South America (shockingly poor both in quality of components and build quality) so I can understand why you are scornful of such building techniques when your experience is of houses built to that standard.
I suppose it's part of the Argentine ethos though, if you're going to do something then do it badly.
@ Idlehands & brucey-babe
Sep 11th, 2012 - 09:46 am - Link - Report abuse 0Absolutely no need to become angry mates.
Stanley would be a Shantytown in Buenos Aires mate.
Could be some part in la Matanza, Gonzales Catan, La Ferrer or even worse because they have shopping malls, cinemas and all service.
Do you know these places from the news of ClarinMiente like Gonzales Catan that is full of poor and Conqueror like so much.
Gonzales Catan shopping http://cpmcines.com/cpm/index.php?option=com_zoo&view=frontpage&Itemid=123
Is my fault that your houses are the same that the very poor people who lives in what is known as a shantytown use in Argentina?
I found here a opportunity for you a used Pre-fabricada for $9.000 pesos just USD 1939,65
In Villa Luzuriaga La Matanza.
http://cpmcines.com/cpm/index.php?option=com_zoo&view=frontpage&Itemid=123
The dog is not included because I guess cost more than the house.
As you can see the guy is building a 2 floors house in solid concrete behind thanks to a good job he probably got now thanks to Cristina policies.
BTW how much cost a real house of 2 floors made in concrete in F@ckland?
Ah! too expensive and you have to sell 10 houses to build just the basement.
And that is what you consider to be rich?
So based on these results I presume only 29% will vote to be British in the referendum the other 71% are clearly either held hostage by those big bad usurping pirates or Chilean. Argentina must be delighted LOL
Sep 11th, 2012 - 09:59 am - Link - Report abuse 0Who would become angry at your entertaining but pointless ramblings?
Sep 11th, 2012 - 10:06 am - Link - Report abuse 0The Falklands are 1st world and Argentina is 3rd world - mainly due to the catastophic political climate in Argentina.
Taking a look at a picture of a house and then rabbiting on about pesos and prefabs is hilarious. Maybe you should pop back once a month and revise your peso figures so we can see the escalating price of cheap prefabs in Argentina month on month.
DanyBerger, mate.
Sep 11th, 2012 - 10:23 am - Link - Report abuse 0lf the houses & amenities(shopping malls etc) are not up to your exacting standards, why do you want the land so much?
Land that l might add is not yours.
2 DanyBerger
Sep 11th, 2012 - 10:44 am - Link - Report abuse 0I looked at your picture; it's a log cabin garden office.
We considered getting one of these to put out by the river as a fishing cabin. Unfortunately, it wouldn't be suitable for the weather, even as a holiday cabin.
You really haven't got a clue.
Looks like a well balanced population of well balanced people. Falkland Islanders first and British second, nothing wrong with that.
Sep 11th, 2012 - 10:45 am - Link - Report abuse 0Falkland Isalnders will choose in the referendum who they wish to maintain a political relationship with. Those who are nice to us and support the rule of law have a significant advantage over those who bully, bluster and ignore international law at their convenience.
Time to wake up and smell the coffee Argentina.
These are one company that are used in the Falklands since you are so obsessed with our houses, the one pictured is similar to some.
Sep 11th, 2012 - 11:04 am - Link - Report abuse 0http://www.scotframe.co.uk/web/site/SelfBuild/HomesPortfolio/134Storey/Maple.asp
what's going on in Fi(for you),there are not women or women are ugly..!!Many years occupying our land and population grows!!!THAT PEOPLE SO BORING!!!!!!!
Sep 11th, 2012 - 11:39 am - Link - Report abuse 02 DanyBerger (#)
Sep 11th, 2012 - 11:41 am - Link - Report abuse 0It is the uneducated just like you that are the ones who do all the crap comments on mercopress. No wonder your Country are still barbarians because you appear from your lack of knowledge to be still living in the caveman days.
OR is it because all of you are so bloody jealous of just what we have in our Country. We are actually living in the present century with every bit of modern technology available to us. There are almost two cars per person. Everyone pretty much has mobile phones as well as access to the internet. We do not have unemp. We are rated as one of the top Countries in the world to visit , Argentina does not even come close to that . We don't trash each others homes as Argentines did when they so call came to liberate us in 1982. But above all we have a first class education system which is something Argentina has not otherwise we would not be seeing these deranged people putting such comments on any of the topics on Mercopress.
To sum it up That is why we are where we are today. Argentina is so backward it is trying to drag us down with it. Time now to start growing up and move forward with the succesfull ones Argentina. If your people spent as much effort in putting your own house in order as you do slagging the Islanders Argentina would be today a great Country. But untill you start changing you will stay the same. Stuck in your lost world.
16 gustbury
Sep 11th, 2012 - 11:43 am - Link - Report abuse 0Thankyou for that useful coherent contribution. If you could just write it out again in English so everyone could understand the point it would be much appreciated.
@ Idlehands
Sep 11th, 2012 - 12:01 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“Taking a look at a picture of a house and then rabbiting on about pesos and prefabs is hilarious. Maybe you should pop back once a month and revise your peso figures so we can see the escalating price of cheap prefabs in Argentina month on month.”
How much do you want to bet that is a upload this pic to a site and put a donate button saying help poor people living in shantytowns in Africa I will get even donation from Villa 31 and Fuerte Apache?
Now serious you are kidding us right?
This is a shantytown in Stanley.
Now can we see the houses of the rich ones please?
@Benson
The houses you have showed me are called industrialised house or pre made. Like this http://img1.mlstatic.com/construccion-de-viviendas-industrializadas_MLA-O-2980667800_082012.jpg
Cost starts from 15.000 pesos to 66.000 pesos.
Durlock inside cement superboard outside, roof in tin anti corrosion and in 2 plants cost 45k pesos.
A house in a middle class area made on concrete in Great Buenos Aires of 220m2 cost 240k.
Among other things,Argentina is a leader in nuclear energy, where is the delay? SOON WE'LL TAKE ARGENTINE BEAUTIFUL WOMEN TO HELP GROW THE POPULATION
Sep 11th, 2012 - 12:07 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@20 twatbury
Sep 11th, 2012 - 12:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“we are a leader in nuclear energy”
Ha, ha, ha to the power google.
Idiota (so you can understand that).
@20 twatbury
Sep 11th, 2012 - 12:29 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“we are a leader in nuclear energy”
You are an idiota chris.
Let see:INTRODUCTION
The Australian Nuclear Science and Technology
Organisation (ANSTO) has contracted a new
high performance Research Reactor – the RRR.
The reactor is being designed and built by
INVAP (Argentina) at the Lucas Heights
Research Laboratories (Sydney) site.
BTW it replaced the aging brit nuke
SORRY EXCEPT LISA WATSON,she's so nice!!!!!!!!
Sep 11th, 2012 - 12:35 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Someone (islander) in this site told us, that there were a “demographic boom” on the islands. Where is this boom? Even having an economic boom since 1982, they could not reach 3200 inhabitants.
Sep 11th, 2012 - 12:57 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@22
Sep 11th, 2012 - 01:01 pm - Link - Report abuse 0http://www.cosmosmagazine.com/news/2217/opal-reactor-leaking-water-safe-says-ansto
http://www.cosmosmagazine.com/news/2217/opal-reactor-leaking-water-safe-says-ansto
“SYDNEY: Australia's OPAL nuclear reactor is facing new criticism that a fault allowing water to seep into the reactor vessel renders it unsafe. The problem follows a fuel issue that already forced the new reactor to close down for ten months.”
Jajajaja. Typical high-quality Argie technology.
chrisR I think you dont know nothing about us,our technologies,I think we'd must know us more.And is not necesary insult!!!
Sep 11th, 2012 - 01:02 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The lunatics have overrun the asylum.
Sep 11th, 2012 - 01:02 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Dany - let's hear more about the fabulous prefabs and concrete buildings in Argentina. Don't forget the pesos.
@kelperabout
Sep 11th, 2012 - 01:03 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I would like to make precision plastic extrusion and injection in FI, oh! It is not possible.
I would like to make high precision CNC matrix in FI, oh! It is not possible.
High volume metal stamping? Neither.
Water cutting metal? Oops no sir
Laser cutting metal? nope
Import ceramic floor made in FI? Nope
Cars made in FI? Nope
The lasted piece of software made in FI? None
Buy a ticket from FI airline? No
I can made a long list of nope do you understand now what is living like a “caveman” as you said.
You need 100 years to go and invest a lot of money and a lot to learn until you can reach any development grade comparable even with Bolivia.
Seems your education is not working mate since you are still living from farming, fishing and tourism.
Oh! Wait a minute but that is what a poor country in Africa does.
Doesn’t it?
Now can you send me a link of the houses of the rich please?
There are “people” who talk without knowing! Shame
Sep 11th, 2012 - 01:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 028 DanyBerger
Sep 11th, 2012 - 01:12 pm - Link - Report abuse 0That post is so stupid it's not actually worth responding to.
@ 28 Lol - thanks for making us laugh at your Argie 'logic'. I'm sure the Falklanders cry themselves to sleep at not having their own space program too. Simple fact:
Sep 11th, 2012 - 01:21 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Falklands GDP - $35400 per capita
Argentina GDP - $10650 per capita
So Argentines can buy some crappy home built station wagon and Falklanders can all swank around in Mercs and Japanese 4x4s.
Sep 11th, 2012 - 01:31 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Total population: 2.563
Sep 11th, 2012 - 01:35 pm - Link - Report abuse 059% of residents consider their national identity to be ‘Falkland Islander’.
Falkland Islanders: 1512
To “defend” the right of “self-determination” of a population of 1512 fishermen the UK maintains the bigest military base in South America and their standard of living...
This is a VIP population.
28 DanyBerger
Sep 11th, 2012 - 01:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You're not all there, are you, you poor thing.
You can't do any of those things in Bermuda or the Channel Islands either.
There are some very rich people in the Falkland Islands. Their houses look pretty much the same as any one else's. That's just the kind of place this is, and if you don't like it you can just.....
Amazing how much interest the Falklands, draw in Argentina,
Sep 11th, 2012 - 01:56 pm - Link - Report abuse 0They are either jealous
Envious or just plain upset,
Still,
What the Argies don’t have,
Her supporters on here will ,have..
[nothing] lol
If Mount Pleasant is ”the bigest (sic) military base in South America” it says more about the feebleness of South America than the might of Mount Pleasant.
Sep 11th, 2012 - 02:03 pm - Link - Report abuse 0NB The UK makes no payments to the Falkland Islands - their standard of living comes from their own resources. Even if we did you would not find many Brits opposed to it. When we're hassled by tin pot little countries we tend to have a unity that compels us to poke them in the eye.
@33
Sep 11th, 2012 - 02:20 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“the UK maintains the bigest military base in South America ”
An airbase with a total of about 10 aircraft is the biggest in South America?
Your South American airbases got 5 aircraft each then?
Hi DanyBerger
Sep 11th, 2012 - 02:23 pm - Link - Report abuse 0check out this article on Argentinian shanty towns.
http://www.meattradenewsdaily.co.uk/news/210410/argentina___two_million_in_buenos_aires_shanty_towns_.aspx
@Monty69, Idlehands & co
Sep 11th, 2012 - 03:34 pm - Link - Report abuse 0We are talking about country development level, buying an expensive car or whatever doesn’t mean you are archiving any grade of development.
And the cars you have in the islands are not the expensive ones and the rich are not so rich.
This is an expensive car “Pagni Zonda” parked in the Street of Buenos Aires, cost half million Euros
http://i60.servimg.com/u/f60/13/20/97/65/user2816.jpg
Here a more expensive one cost 1.2millions Euros plus tax Pagani Huayra
http://i60.servimg.com/u/f60/13/20/97/65/user2816.jpg
Ferrary f430 riding in Buenos Aires USD 335.000
http://i60.servimg.com/u/f60/13/20/97/65/user2816.jpg
Ferrari 458 parking in Buenos Aires
http://i60.servimg.com/u/f60/13/20/97/65/user2816.jpg
Ferrari and Porsche riding in BA
http://i60.servimg.com/u/f60/13/20/97/65/user2816.jpg
Audi R8 v10
http://i60.servimg.com/u/f60/13/20/97/65/user2816.jpg
Do you want more Ferraris, Porsches, or expensive cars in Argentina?
Bermuda and CI and this is your idea of development?
Give me a brake please
@agent999
I showed you that in these places like Gonzales Catan, la ferrer, la matanza, etc. cited in your article have houses like yours the very poor also there are better houses than yours and they have 4x4, internet, cable, Mobile phones an more infrastructure than the whole FI. So you only are making a fool of your self by thinking that so rich.
Here their shopping centre with 3d cinema and 6 room exhibition
http://i60.servimg.com/u/f60/13/20/97/65/user2816.jpg
Show me yours now in FI.
And the houses of the rich people? I'm still waiting...
BTW I found by chance wonderful houses from super rich America in Baltimore
http://i60.servimg.com/u/f60/13/20/97/65/user2816.jpg
Is that your parameter of comparison that make you think you are rich?
just wonder...
So basically you are saying we don't have such a massive discrepency between the haves and the have nots in the Falklands. The rich in the Falklands aren't as rich as the privillaged few in Argentina but the poorest in the Falklands probably earn above the Argentine average wage.
Sep 11th, 2012 - 03:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 039 DanyBerger
Sep 11th, 2012 - 03:51 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You have the mentality of a 5 year old. Can't believe you bothered with all those links.
One question. How many of those cars are manufactured in Argentina?
33 Islas Malvinas (#)
Sep 11th, 2012 - 03:57 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Sep 11th, 2012 - 01:35 pm
Just one military base in Argentina has more military personal than Mount Pleasant, and that is Puerto Belgrano with 1.796 naval personel.
Our little town in Patagonia has a population of 10.000 and an army base with over 800 military personel.
I imagine that the air bases in Santa Cruz are fairly well manned also, so to say that Mount Pleasant is the biggest military base in South America is, to say the least of it, an enormouse exageration, not to say a total lie!!!!!
22 Malvinero1 from now on also known as The Chief Twat
Sep 11th, 2012 - 04:05 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“we are a leader in nuclear energy”
No you are NOT. INVAP is very experienced in medical isotopes and conning people who should know better:
Quote from ANSTO Media release 6th June 2000:
“will deliver high performance for both neutron beam facilities and irradiation facilities......Australians will be able to benefit from reactor operations in areas such as nuclear medicine, the environment, industry, science, education and government.”
Abstract from specification: “The reactor thermal power is 20MW and its compact core is designed to achieve high performance in the production of neutrons.”
It’s a baby TWENTY MEGAWATT thermal power, neutron research reactor you morons.
NOTHING AT ALL TO DO WITH NUCLEAR ENERGY. The clue is in the word ENERGY.
AND, being over a year late in attaining FRP (2006 instead of 2005), within 12 months (Oct 2007) the thing developed a serious fault in the fuel assemblies DUE TO FAULTY MANUFACTURE and resulted in the reactor being shut down for TEN months!
AND now there is a serious water leak.
Brilliant work by the AG manufacturers!
AND don't think that other laughable nuclear power project that is the conversion to the Thyssen TR1700s makes you lot less of a laughing stock.
I have covered that fiasco in past posts and I am not going to waste any more time with this hollow crowing by AG and accusing me of not knowing anything about nuclear physics.
@39 What a sad, childish drip you are. Just how long do you think one of those “super” cars would last on the Falklands? A month?
Sep 11th, 2012 - 04:53 pm - Link - Report abuse 028... Amazing theory that a small island with a population of a English village doesn't make anything like cars and software is backward and undeveloped. With the investment from oil companies facilities can soon be built not a problem it may take RGs 100 years to develop industries or high tech support facilities but the oil industry do this all the time, it's part of the industry. Try again columbo
Sep 11th, 2012 - 04:56 pm - Link - Report abuse 033 Islas Malvinas
Sep 11th, 2012 - 04:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Surely you mean the biggest military base per capita in South America. Don't you?
@39 The Falkland Islanders are still better off than the average Argentine and will be a lot better off when that oil starts to gush and the peso is devalued (again).
Sep 11th, 2012 - 06:11 pm - Link - Report abuse 0islands Envy isn't life rubbish for Rgs devalued currency, rampant inflation, low GDP, and the thing they want to steal the most they can't because Gret Britain will give them another beating.
Sep 11th, 2012 - 06:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 0jejejeeeeeeeeeeejajajaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaajoooooooooooooooh
Sep 11th, 2012 - 06:36 pm - Link - Report abuse 0poor Falkloosers!
189 years......and only 3,000 retards!
jeejeeeeeeeeeeeejajajaaaaaaaaaaaajoooooooooooooooh
not enough “drip, drip, drip”
jajaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaajaaaaaaaaaaaajaaaaaaaaaa
@DannyBerger
Sep 11th, 2012 - 06:36 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Yet the Islanders already enjoy a much better standard of living than the average Argy, and theirs is about to go up, a lot, whereas Argentina’s is about to;
Go up a lot more!
Surely that will only increase the migration of people from the Islands to the shanty towns of Argentina.
No money No class Keep the islands in your arse!
Sep 11th, 2012 - 07:30 pm - Link - Report abuse 028 DanyBerger (#)
Sep 11th, 2012 - 07:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The only differance between you and me sunshine is thaT I am happy and living on the Falkland Islands can afford to travel the world as and when I want and never have to worry where my next meal is coming from. And you are so jealous of that and the only reason you and your cronies are making such loud noises.
The one thing you would do to remember Money cannot by happiness but it sur lets you have a heck of a good time when there is a lot about and boy do we have a lot of it to spend.
What´s the problem with the decreasing population?
Sep 11th, 2012 - 08:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0No sex? No fuckland?
@52
Sep 11th, 2012 - 08:25 pm - Link - Report abuse 0In Las Vegas, NV, USA with UK Prince Harry?
Tell me about it...what is the best restaurant you like outside the islands?
I like the Station Casinos and Bally....how about you?
Intersting discussion and census on life in the Falklands. May I ask some questions?
Sep 11th, 2012 - 09:30 pm - Link - Report abuse 01. Given the amount of wind on the Islands, and the cost of importing fuels wouldn't wind generated electricity coupled to heat pumps be cheaper than kerosene for heating?
2. And demand for electric cars - especially since a 50mph range is probably OK for Stanley and I guess fuel is expensive.
3. I assume kit houses are popular - and probably from Germany or Scandinavia? Excellent insulation for -30C winters.
4. If oil and gas services take off, will the Islands population have to double or treble? Lots of opportunity, but you might have to lock your cars. How do the Kelpers feel about that prospect?
5. I can't find online how many trees the Falklands has. Any?
@55 Nice to have some genuine interest in the Islands instead of the endless petty arguing!
Sep 11th, 2012 - 10:50 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Not sure if anyone has installed ground source heating in the islands yet, but certainly seems to be a good idea (I know a few people in UK using it). The wind farm near Stanley can provide around 50% of the power for the whole of Stanley on a nice windy day, and overall has cut the powerstation fuel bill by about 30% (I think), but electricity is still relatively expensive ( I think it is about 12p/ kWh but not sure). Diesel fuel is about 73p/litre, about half the cost of fuel in UK, as there is no tax or import duty on it. Kit houses are popular, as you say, but mostly from UK. And we don't have -30C winters!! doesn't often get much below -5C at worst, and a normal winter day doesn't often go below freezing. Views on oil and gas taking off are mixed, but most seem to think the pros will outweigh the cons.
As for trees - only where they have been planted, none naturally. A lot around Stanley, the “forest” at Hill Cove (a few acres of mature trees planted late 1800s, I think) and a lot of recent plantations of shelter belt trees thsat are doing quite well at places like Port Howard and Shallow Harbour and other places (I think quite a few patches of about 20,000 trees each in various places).
They are developed because they come from a developed country, they study there since 15, they buy pigs cars trees butter from there, etc. that makes them more developed. :)
Sep 11th, 2012 - 11:08 pm - Link - Report abuse 057 malen
Sep 11th, 2012 - 11:41 pm - Link - Report abuse 0OMG Malen, you have found a new theory of economics. All of those countries of the world that are trying to develop- all they need to do is buy their pigs and butter from a developed countryand they too will become more developed. I think you should spread the good news.
I think you should start with your own government. Closing your economy to imports doesn't seem to be the route to development.
If the Falklands had the same percentage of its population living below the poverty line as Argentina does, there would be about 500 Falklanders living in hovels with malnourished children. I believe there is nobody in the Falklands living below the poverty line.
Sep 12th, 2012 - 01:47 am - Link - Report abuse 0Danyberger = bitter and jealous
Sep 12th, 2012 - 02:14 am - Link - Report abuse 0argentinians are not jealous of the rubbish bloody english people.
Sep 12th, 2012 - 02:19 am - Link - Report abuse 0I want all brits out of my country, the sooner... the better!
UK Embassy=rubbish bloody english people!
UK Embassy=closed!
Ah!!!! my new little monkey 2012!!
Sep 12th, 2012 - 04:23 am - Link - Report abuse 0It seems you enjoy making an arse of yourself! Good work, keep it up :-)
@56 - thanks for the answer. The pictures of the Falklands always show windswept lands and nothing of Hill Cove.
Sep 12th, 2012 - 07:15 am - Link - Report abuse 0I know the Falklands never gets as cold as Germany but the same insulation is useful because the wind chill is a major factor. Given the lack of extreme cold, but the low average temperatures, air source heat pumps might be fine.
Your diesel is expensive given the lack of tax - but needs to be shipped in relatively small quantities.
The Falklands would be a great place to do a “zero carbon” experiment (as Iceland is trying to do). Wind electricity has got to be cheaper than using imported fuel, and plug-in hybrids or battery vehicles can get to Darwin and back on one charge. Agriculture is tricky because there are no electric tractors or off-road vehicles in production.
2,500 people will need about 5MW including heating and electricty for vehicles. The military basse might need similar. At a 40% production rate the Islands would need about 25MW of wind capacity which is about 8 large turbines.
Expensive, but would mean no fuel imports (backup could be done burning bio mass - or converting kelp into bio-diesel?), and create a new industry.
Of course, if oil services come in, the tempation is just to switch everything to oil - as most of the Gulf does - and waste it. (subsidising petrol and chilling swimming pools etc).
@61: There are plenty of Argentine rugby players playing professional rugby for English clubs. They're a credit to Argentina and are welcome to stay. As for the Argentinian politicians and posters, shouldn't they be focusing their energy on making Argentina a better place to live?
I'm not sure if electric carswould be robust enough for the Falklands, they'd be fine just as get arounds for around Stanley and the odd trip to Darwin wouldn't do them too much harm so they'd be fine foar a lot of people. I think the majority would still want something more robust though, even without going offroad the roads to outlying farms are pretty rough
Sep 12th, 2012 - 08:18 am - Link - Report abuse 0Six large turbines feeding Stanley. I think nowadays pretty much all of the farms have small turbines and their backup generators rarely need to be used.
@2012 (SussyUS)
I think the idea of a sock puppet is to try and change your writing style slightly, or did your Sussy US account get banned?
@64 In principle electric motors are much, much more robust than a diesel. But to date electric vehicles have been aimed at town users - not off roaders. Things will change though:
Sep 12th, 2012 - 09:23 am - Link - Report abuse 0http://www.nextgreencar.com/news-item.php?Land-Rover-tests-plugin-hybrid.
With wind power, big is better. On the other hand, is there an electricity grid in camp? So large turbines might be good for Stanley only.
I think the advent of Internet and cheap high bandwidth communications must have transformed the Falklands. Not sure how the Kelpers survived before all that.
Good internet, but NOT cheap.......... We pay over £100 per month for 3.3Gb of up/down load, and about 10p per Mb if you go over that. (There is a free period between midnight and 6am though, which is very useful for big updates etc.) The problem is it all comes in and out by satellite, no cheap sub-sea cable connection, and unlikely to be in the near future (unless the oil industry decide they can't do without it.......)
Sep 12th, 2012 - 10:56 am - Link - Report abuse 0@Benson
Sep 12th, 2012 - 10:58 am - Link - Report abuse 0No, what I’m saying is that the “poor” in Argentina have more infrastructure available to them than you guys.
They have public hospitals that cost 50m dollars.
Hopistal en Florencio Varela
http://hospitalmipueblo.org/
Can you see?
And that your rich people seem to be pretty poor compared with rich argies.
@Idlehands
“One question. How many of those cars are manufactured in Argentina?”
And how many of your cars are manufactured in FI?
Horacio Pagani is Argentine idiot from Santa Fe and owner of the factory in Modena “Automobili Pagani S.p.A”
http://hospitalmipueblo.org/
Do you want to buy one?
http://hospitalmipueblo.org/
http://hospitalmipueblo.org/
http://hospitalmipueblo.org/
@ Conqueror
They need to make proper roads first like in any civilised place I guess. Is what we call lack of infrastructure.
@Santa Fe
You are wrong because you will not be even equal to Nigeria they have oil industry also and big but the “add value” goes elsewhere.
@ Brit Bob & Pugol-H
No they are not
10% Rich total assets ranging from U$s 10m to 8bn assets
17% middle upper class ranging from U$s 1m to 10m assets
30% middle class ranging from U$s 100k 1m to assets
32% low middle class ranging from 50k to 100k
11% poor class Someone with a “prefabricada” house and 4x4 in the garage ha ha
@ kelperabout
I’ve been 1 time in Africa, 2 times in Monaco, 3 times in France, Brazil, Uruguay, Paraguay, 3 times in Switzerland, I lived in Germany, Italy, Spain and UK and jumping around other countries.
Rosario in Santa fe counts?
Idiot.
“Horacio Pagani is Argentine idiot from Santa Fe ”
Sep 12th, 2012 - 11:06 am - Link - Report abuse 0You read it here first courtesy of Dany. You've gotta laugh :-)
Dany, what you truly fail to understand is that Argentina is a country of 41.2m people, with GDP of $435.2 billion and an area of 1,073,518 sq mi. Of course your infrastructure is better, it has to be to support the population of 40m+ and covering an area of 1,073,518 sq mi. To compare territories like Argentina and the Falkland Islands, is comparing apples and oranges, due to the size of each. And don't forget Argentina has the benefit of being on mainland South America and not an island.
Sep 12th, 2012 - 11:23 am - Link - Report abuse 0So, in order to allow for a fair comparison, economists and generally knowledgeable people use the GDP per capita, as a good indicator to compare countries standard of life, and the Falklands GDP per capita is amongst the highest in the world, despite Argentina's best attempts to destroy the Falklands economy.
Why would the Falklands Government build a large $50m hospital when the need for such a large hospital simply isn’t required? Why would people in the Falklands buy sports cars when they would not suit the Falklands in the slightest?
You ask these questions in an attempt to mask Argentina's declining economy. You ask these questions to belittle the Falklands accomplishments. You see a thriving small community facing a belligerent neighbour who is failing to destroy an economy supported by a mere 3,000, and you are embarrassed by your Government's incompetence.
This highlights how developed Argentina is:
Sep 12th, 2012 - 11:44 am - Link - Report abuse 0http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/southamerica/argentina/3866797/Real-life-Mowgli-kept-alive-by-cats.html
I am amazed at those from Argentina who think that the Falkland Islands are deprived through not having high rise hotels , impersonal concrete buildings and sports cars thinking these are a signatory of wealth.
Sep 12th, 2012 - 11:46 am - Link - Report abuse 0What surely matters is the people are happy with their government, life and whose average income per person is more than that of many Argentines.
Being happy is something that some Argentines seem to think only possible if they have won the world cup or have invaded the Falkland Islands, hence the constant whining. Or having a sportscar. They don't seem to be content with the country they have, the Malvanistas seem to want, want, want, winge ,winge, winge about what isn't theirs.
There is one thing about the Falkland Islanders that means they are not as primitive as the Malvanistas on here proclaim.
They have manged to persuade the UK government to have available aircraft, submarines and ships to defend the islands that are anything but of basic standard in comparison to what these 'advanced' superior' Argentines can muster.
@65 Enviroc
Sep 12th, 2012 - 12:39 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The plan is to keep increasing green energy in the Falklands. If I remember the goal is to get to around the 80% mark from wind turbines so, although there is a large outlay, eventually the cost of electricity should come down so the could make something like the Range_e quite viable.
I suppose you could say there is an electricity grid on the settlements so something like a large turbine half way between Goose Green and North Arm might be viable. Wouldn't work with the outlying farms, you're talking ten miles or so between individual houses.
67 DanyBerger (#)
Sep 12th, 2012 - 12:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Sep 12th, 2012 - 10:58 am
“They have public hospitals that cost 50m dollars.”
Right, Danny, and now the médicos are on strike because they haven't got the wherewithal to attend their pacients!!!!!
Vaya infraestructura!!!!!!
Oil is one thing but if natural gas is exploited then this could need storage and liquification plants on the Falkland Islands. Something like that would need the population to go to something like 10,000.
Sep 12th, 2012 - 01:12 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Where developments have taken place in remote areas of Australia, salaries rocket - e.g. £60,000 for a truck driver - but the style of life changes. Perhaps West Falkland will become the new remote area.
How would the Islanders react? Would you prefer the processing to be done all offshore - straight to tankers. This would mean very few jobs for Islanders but less impact. Or do you want a new Aberdeen? (hopefully with better food).
One more thought - now that we've stopped buying Argentinian wine, where can we buy Falklands lamb?
@Simon68
Sep 12th, 2012 - 01:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0What do you get by telling lies all the time mate?
You are only proving to us that you are a complete fool.
I just rang to the hospital and the girl in the commuter told me that they are working as usual. No doctors on Strike and she was surprised by my question.
Ring them here you have the phone numbers.
4255-7809/10 4255-4769
So next time you post more BS at least try to be at least 10% precise.
Am I asking too much?
Simon, it must hurt when DanyBerger tells you to stop posting BS!
Sep 12th, 2012 - 04:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Dany, it is good to see you have ignored my comment (69)? It is based in reality too much for you to resond?
@M_of_FI
Sep 12th, 2012 - 06:40 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Oh! Sorry Moffi I didn’t ignore you it is that I didn't see it.
My apologies mate.
Well let see the size on territory and population:
Argentina has low population in relation with its large territory and when you have large territory its harder and costly to develop infrastructure. So this in not and advantage over a small territory.
You have the example of Africa is large territory with 1billon inhabitants, so following your logic Africa should have more infrastructure that US or Europe.
So a large territory and a big population will not provide per se infrastructure.
Your problem is political what isolates you from your best source of funds to create infrastructure.
“So, in order to allow for a fair comparison, economists and generally knowledgeable people use the GDP per capita, as a good indicator to compare countries standard of life”
GDP per capita does not indicates standards of living this is a lie otherwise some sort or productivity.
So if someone in an Island have a factory with 2000 employees and the factory has a turnover of 120m that will give a GDP per capita of $60.000 each, but the owner earns 50 million at year while the employees 12k and the rest go to suppliers abroad...
what is the real standard of living of the poor 2000 employees?
Or are you telling me that you pay to your workers 5000 dollars at month while you earn the same?
Are you communist?
Come on mate, do I look so stupid?
Faaa!!, 2563 inhabitants! 763 guys more than 1982 in 30 years. Neither the illegal exploitation of the wealth of the ARGENTINE SEA fisheries get populate our islands.
Sep 13th, 2012 - 12:26 am - Link - Report abuse 0True we may be growing at a slow pace but it is a honest one and we are not trying to overpopulate or over exploit our land as the Argentines are so keen to do.
Sep 13th, 2012 - 01:11 am - Link - Report abuse 0It is so nice to have so much open space where nature is still in charge nothing like the over crowded city of BA which you almost choke to death from the thick fumes.
Unlike Argentines who seem to be breeding like rabbits so that they can go and try to settle other people land.
Our small population has most likely put more back into our Countries care than any argentine has ever put back in their unlawfully acquired country.
79 kelperabout:
Sep 13th, 2012 - 03:06 am - Link - Report abuse 0What comment so stupid!. In 30 countries of America, Argentina is ranked 25 with 9 inhabitants per km2! Wish we be breeding as God intended, but the reality is that we do not reproduce “like rabbits” in your hideous and contemptuous of our way to show yourself Argentine people. Besides the usurpers, not growing at a slow pace, because if they have fewer inhabitants than six years ago, the usurpers are declining.
“Country of illicit origin”. Why do you not go to ........................................... ............... and to another galaxy too!!!!!
@kelperabout
Sep 13th, 2012 - 09:41 am - Link - Report abuse 0How you like to post BS all the time mate,
“True we may be growing at a slow pace but it is a honest one and we are not trying to overpopulate or over exploit our land as the Argentines are so keen to do.
It is so nice to have so much open space where nature is still in charge nothing like the over crowded city of BA which you almost choke to death from the thick fumes.”
Overpopulate? What? Are you joking?
Qatar has 11,500 km2 (little than Malvinas) and has 2 million inhabitants.
And you with 12,200 km2 are scary to overpopulate the Islands?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Doha_Palace.jpg
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Doha_Palace.jpg
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Doha_Palace.jpg
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Doha_Palace.jpg
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Doha_Palace.jpg
I don’t see any overpopulated place there.
Are you suffering from any kind of countryside disease perhaps?
81 - Your arguement is obsurd
Sep 13th, 2012 - 11:40 am - Link - Report abuse 0Your killer point is that the Falklands has a small population and no posh houses!!! and your comparing it to a land mass with the same area in the middle east owned by one of the world richest oil dynastys good luck with your amazing thesis.
Its a small island in a baron environment, which still manages to produce average wages that the RG's would dream of, and thats before the black gold starts pumping jajajaja
The islanders keeps saying that they earns lots of monies and travel overseas, but no one has mention is they spend their monies in Europe, Asia or Africa, where they buy their fur/leather clothes, what restaurants they like or what type foreign food!
Sep 13th, 2012 - 04:35 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Prince Harry likes to play polo in Buenos Aires and have wild parties in Las Vegas,,,,more yet, he is planning to reside in the USA around the year 2014 when he receives the inheritance from his mother.
Good boy!
@83
Sep 13th, 2012 - 05:38 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You are right! I believe some of the islanders never had the opportunity to fly or ride in a train!
Those islands are not for me. Just looking at the internet, everything looks very cheap!
83...prince Harry Vegas, George Galloway, pirates..change the record jajajajajaja
Sep 13th, 2012 - 05:50 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@85
Sep 13th, 2012 - 06:04 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Who are you? you don't make any sense.
signed:
La Rioja
As a professional engineer with quite a lot of real life experience with battery electric vehicles and some with hybrids I have read some of the comments regarding going green with electric cars in the Falklands (there are STILL no Malvinas) with some amusement.
Sep 13th, 2012 - 07:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Firstly the verdict on most electric cars is still out. The Prius is an ecological disaster if you look at whole life costs and getting rid of the batteries without poisoning the planet. Why is it that Toyota consistently stonewalls questions about this? Changing a battery at present costs about the same as replacing the whole diesel engine for a Land Rover, including its ancillaries! The car is also a fragile thing to even think of putting into an environment like the islands.
The statement that “In principle electric motors are much, much more robust than a diesel” overlooks one very important consideration. The present infrastructure must be able to deal with diesel engine service; repair and overhaul without too much bother.
Try effective diagnosis and repair of high power thyristors and inverter systems for 2,500 people. The cost of the parts is prohibitive, even if you could get them.
Range is also a problem with battery electric cars and it collapses in the winter due to cold conditions (batteries of ALL types just love the cold, never mind freezing) and the need to use heaters, wipers and headlights.
Even with 62 Million people in the UK and thousands of pounds per vehicle of 'support' by the government, electric vehicles have so far been a complete commercial flop.
They are however brilliant to drive: bags of torque of course and silent running and reasonable ride quality, especially on motorways and if you don't try cornering quickly.
You must have plenty of corners / bends on the Falklands, but not many motorways? :o)
79 kelperabout “ True we may be growing at a slow pace”
Sep 14th, 2012 - 04:53 am - Link - Report abuse 0Slow pace or not growing at all?
28% works for the colonial government...lovely.
“Falklands Census: no growth, population aging”
“It also shows that the population over 65 has grown by 14 percent, while the number of children has remained the same, frustrating islanders who want their community to grow large enough to be self-sustaining”
http://news.yahoo.com/falklands-census-no-growth-population-aging-184054766.html
88... Wait for all the oil workers and specialist moving to the Falklands with families. UKs over 65 population is out growing the young, your grasping at straws with this one iam afraid. The islands will grow in population with the ramping up of oil production mmmm black gold.
Sep 14th, 2012 - 11:31 am - Link - Report abuse 0@87ChrisR
Sep 14th, 2012 - 02:21 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Add to this the re-charge time, probably the biggest limiting factor on electric cars.
If this could be significantly reduced then they become more viable in more applications, the rest of the support services would follow.
Still a long way from taking over, but it would be a start.
I believe a group of American scientists announced they had found a way to reduce hours to minutes in re-charging Lithium batteries.
A lot of lithium in Bolivia apparently, but their (I think)President said in an interview that “the days when S. America exported just raw materials were over, they would not just make the batteries in Bolivia, but the cars as well”.
Also “all the profit would stay in Bolivia”.
I believe the Lithium is still in the salt flats, another case of flogging a dead cow.
@88 Marcos Alejandro
Don’t worry all those statistics, are about to start changing rapidly.
No doubt the Islanders have a plan to manage the changes to come.
A plan you can be sure does not involve Argentina, so your concern is quite touching, but quite unnecessary.
@90
Sep 14th, 2012 - 03:36 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Yes, you are correct but I would very much like to see the effect of super-fast recharging on the present generation of lithium batteries of whatever configuration. Drastic reduction in life for a start, nevermind fire and explosion!
No doubt that 'one-day' alternative fuel vehicles will be necessary if our lifestyle of independence from public transport is to be maintained, but they are a long way away from that point at the moment.
Even the Prius has had the engine size increased from 1.5 to 1.8 in an attempt to reduce the engine speed to gain better mileage.
The early Prius was a real dog to drive and a big disappointment in real life 'mileage' with the engine having to rev it's knackers off to drag the overweight tank up to speed.
I have driven a 3rd generation Prius and it is a much more sophisticated vehicle altogether, and it needs to be for the asking price.
If only the price was more realistic it might make the Prius a serious motor car at last.
@ 89 ..... Santa Fe.... pay attention ....
Sep 14th, 2012 - 06:03 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Harbour Park apartments looks better compared to the poor design of the houses shown in the internet!
Signed: Bariloche
I bét thàt Lisà Wàtson does not livè àt thèse islañds.
Sep 14th, 2012 - 07:05 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I hope I'm mistaken, but is the political situation in Argentina not somewhat like that in 1982? Falklanders and HM forces, keep alert.
Sep 14th, 2012 - 10:37 pm - Link - Report abuse 0http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/southamerica/falklandislands/9540493/Falkland-Islands-census-delivers-blow-to-Argentina.html
Sep 15th, 2012 - 10:53 am - Link - Report abuse 0http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/southamerica/falklandislands/9540493/Falkland-Islands-census-delivers-blow-to-Argentina.html
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/southamerica/falklandislands/9540493/Falkland-Islands-census-delivers-blow-to-Argentina.html
@Steve-32-uk
Sep 15th, 2012 - 01:17 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Just British poor rubbish propaganda none cares about it.
Sorry
94 ynsere
Sep 15th, 2012 - 02:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Disney channel is on, go watch it.
97 Marcos Alejandro
Sep 15th, 2012 - 04:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“Disney channel is on, go watch it.”
Thanks! I didn't know TMBOA was on the telly again, she is always SO funny with all that hiarious make-up on, she reminds me of the clowns at the circus.
But, there again, I suspect the Casa Rosada is much the same as a circus.
LOL
Reviews in London for the tour of YPF for funds
Sep 15th, 2012 - 09:15 pm - Link - Report abuse 0http://www.ieco.clarin.com/empresas/Criticas-Londres-YPF-busca-fondos_0_774522670.html
99 Steve-32-uk
Sep 16th, 2012 - 11:23 am - Link - Report abuse 0Did you read the comments to the article! I haven't read one that supports TMBOA yet. This, one of several, seems to see the real picture:
“But had not reached an agreement with Chevron?
But it seems that the agreement was to say: You get the money, we'll see what we do.”
I think the wheels are coming of the cart.
@100
Sep 16th, 2012 - 01:38 pm - Link - Report abuse 0It appears YPF are so desperate they are coming to the UK to get investment.
The cart's going to run on skids soon.
Chevron already has an investment in Argentina and are the fourth largest producer of oil there.
Sep 16th, 2012 - 02:38 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Argentina has agreed a memorandum of understanding with Chevron to work together, Chevron are not going to say anything else for fear of having Chevron going the same ways as YPF
”The population in Camp (areas outside of Stanley) has declined by 3.3% to 351 people”
Sep 16th, 2012 - 08:01 pm - Link - Report abuse 0So when people talk about self determination for the Falklands, what they really mean is for Stanley, as the rest of the Islands are effectively empty! Why not have a compromise where Stanley stays British and Argentina gets the under(almost un)populated Camp to develop. Without harming the 351 people who do live there of course, but 351 people in an area the size of Wales surely don't have the natural right to say “no foreigners pleae, we're full up!”!!!
A few more interesting FI articles ... First one extremely bias
Sep 16th, 2012 - 08:41 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Falklands: British MPs foiled a maneuver in hemispheric forum
http://www.lavoz901.com.ar/despachos.asp?cod_des=154404&ID_Seccion=5
FALKLANDS MLAs REPORT SUCCESSFUL LATIN AMERICAN TRIP
http://www.lavoz901.com.ar/despachos.asp?cod_des=154404&ID_Seccion=5
The Falklands: An underutilised paradise?
http://www.lavoz901.com.ar/despachos.asp?cod_des=154404&ID_Seccion=5
“The Falklands: An underutilised paradise?”
Sep 16th, 2012 - 09:18 pm - Link - Report abuse 0They're certainly underutilised, Cristina coul definately utilise the camp, the size of Wales with 351 people in it, better...
@105B_K,
Sep 16th, 2012 - 09:34 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Don't think anyone is going to consider your generous offer, BK. LOL.
How about you hand the Highlands of Scotland over to the Democratic Republic of the Congo?
They are under-utilised.
l'm sure the Congolese could utilise them.
98 ChrisR Do you watch Disney channel in Uruguay at your age?
Sep 17th, 2012 - 03:14 am - Link - Report abuse 0Don't get scare of Mickey.
107 Marcos Alejandro
Sep 17th, 2012 - 11:15 am - Link - Report abuse 0Well yes I do.
You see I was watching AG TV but I found Mickey speaks more sense than The Mad Bitch Of Argentina!
LOL
9 DanyBerger (#)
Sep 18th, 2012 - 12:37 am - Link - Report abuse 0Are you being serious. Argentine construction is a joke. say what you will but the British can build like it or not. Argentines...can't. We used to be like you but we moved up in the world. Accept it and move up as well.
@forgetit87
Sep 18th, 2012 - 07:18 am - Link - Report abuse 0British can build what Mr. Forgetit87?
I don’t get it...
Whatever it is, Dany, apparently we can build it & you cannot. lol
Sep 18th, 2012 - 09:33 am - Link - Report abuse 0And, thats right, you don't, cant & won't get it..............the Falklands that is.
Nevermind Dany, be happy.
They can build things that only a select few can build. British engineering is sought after all over the world. A disproportionate amount of the largest and most complicated structures in the world were either built by British company's or had British engineers and designers in charge.
Sep 18th, 2012 - 01:45 pm - Link - Report abuse 0To compare an Argentine home with a British one is like comparing a Brick to Cheese. Our Argentine cousins need to wake up. You still live like you did 200 years ago in some places. Look at us, we started out the same but we are now a world power. Why not Argentina as well?
@f0rgetit87
Sep 19th, 2012 - 03:16 am - Link - Report abuse 0“To compare an Argentine home with a British one is like comparing a Brick to Cheese”
Do you have more jokes like this please?
Yes I do.
Sep 19th, 2012 - 11:27 am - Link - Report abuse 0DanyBerger goes into a Gay bar. Gay asks him if he has the time. DanyBerger say “Sure do do for you Big Boy, Just be gentle”
Fuck you! Argentine House is 20 times better than English house. At least they don't smell of curry after the last family moved out.
Sep 19th, 2012 - 12:05 pm - Link - Report abuse 0http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IrR2YSACFDI
Sep 19th, 2012 - 01:13 pm - Link - Report abuse 0http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IrR2YSACFDI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IrR2YSACFDI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IrR2YSACFDI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IrR2YSACFDI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IrR2YSACFDI
There is not inflation in UK
A house in 1974 cost 10k Pounds
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IrR2YSACFDI
Now a cheaper house would cost to close to 250/260k pounds
2500% /38 years 65,79% inflation over housing market alone per year.
And the stupid laugh about Arg inflation.
@115
Sep 19th, 2012 - 06:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Yes but you don't know what toilets are for as Argentine soldiers proved in 1982 when they shit in bedrooms, and not the toilet.
I prefer Arbour Park with a jacuzzi and swimming pool !
Sep 19th, 2012 - 07:53 pm - Link - Report abuse 0118 2012
Sep 19th, 2012 - 09:40 pm - Link - Report abuse 0But have you noticed how everyone else gets out when you get in?
@119 ChrisR= Zhivago
Sep 19th, 2012 - 09:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Too late.
I am on my way to Las Vegas.
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