MercoPress. South Atlantic News Agency
Argentine navy short on spares and resources for training and maintenance
The Argentine navy is not going through one of its great moments, not only because of the impounded flagship ARA Libertad in Ghana and the ARA Espora stranded in South Africa waiting for spares. The rest of the fleet is suffering the consequences of years of lack of maintenance and training with corvettes, destroyers and even submarines involved in mechanical and conducting incidents. Read full article
Comments
Disclaimer & comment rulesMaybe they can sell one of Kretina's Louis Vuitton purses to pay for the repairs? Or maybe pimp her out for a few dollars? Any takers?
Nov 22nd, 2012 - 11:14 pm - Link - Report abuse 0This must be the devastating fighting force Danny keeps warning us about....
Nov 22nd, 2012 - 11:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Gosh these times must be frustrating for anyone in the Argentine Navy.
When I served in the British Navy around 2005 we had a influx of Argentine officers come and spend time aboard training with us. They were good quality individuals with reasonable training who some of which I still communicate with. It's a shame that we can't have cordial relations with Argentina anymore as they are decent folk.
Oh well, such is life I guess.
Finally the submarine crews which operate from Mar del Plata need at least 190 days of immersion practice and in the last year only spent 19 hours submerged. Submarines Salta, Santa Cruz and San Juan have maintenance difficulties and “only few remember that in August 2010, Defence minister Nilda Garré announced Argentina was planning to build a nuclear submarine”, concluded lawmaker Martinez.
Nov 22nd, 2012 - 11:24 pm - Link - Report abuse 0other than that everything in the armed forces is going great. lol
Kretina thinks that if she needs to use military force that her buddy “Dead Man Walking” Hugo Chavez will come to her rescue. Little does she know that no matter how much they all claim to be “united” in South America, these dictators are the biggest backstabbers that exist and when push comes to shove they will never support each other.......Chavez also knows if he fires as much as one bullet outside of that dump he calles Venezuela, that the US will turn his country into nothing more than an obliterated pumping station.......Kretina keeps proving how useless and spineless she and her cronies are!
Nov 22nd, 2012 - 11:32 pm - Link - Report abuse 0This now explains the British militarization to “defend” the islanders from the mighty argentine navy.
Nov 22nd, 2012 - 11:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@5 - The best suppression of a bully is through unquestionable ability to impose your will on theirs.
Nov 22nd, 2012 - 11:37 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Don't ever, ever show weakness to an aggressive bully i.e. Argentina because they will seek to exploit that very weakness at their first opportunity.
“The ARA Espora and the fellows on board would have avoided the bad moment they are going through in South Africa if the corvette Spiro, originally assigned for the Altasur naval exercise, had not suffered the accident of running into a sand bank when leaving Mar del Plata”, said Martinez. ARA Spiro has been on service since 1987 and was sent to the first Gulf War in 1990/91 by then president Carlos Menem.”
Nov 22nd, 2012 - 11:40 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Well that is interesting. Didn't some of the Argentine bloggers scoff when HMS Astute ran aground and don't they half scoff at the UK's involvement in 'illegal' wars of aggression?
Ah well. Glass houses and all that.
@7
Nov 22nd, 2012 - 11:53 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Convince the world Iraq was a defensive war to protect Britain from an invasion by Iraq.
As for the topic, the whole military should be disbanded. Use that money to develop a dissuasive shield against aircraft, missile, nuclear attacks, and a “last resort” weapon against a ground invasion of the country. Something (mustard, chemical, etc), that makes any invasion force suffer massive casualties (death), and dessist.
@8 Nostrolldamus The 2nd (#)
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 12:08 am - Link - Report abuse 0Nov 22nd, 2012 - 11:53 pm
I like it. So what's it going to be then? A force field maybe? Or a geo-orbital weapons platform? Or sharks with laser beams on their heads?
You've been reading way too much high Sci FI Tobes and nobody is going to invade you you daft shaft.
this is just embarrassing
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 12:08 am - Link - Report abuse 0@ 2 Xect
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 12:14 am - Link - Report abuse 0I share your sentiment.
I'd like to be laughing at this whole charade, amused that this has all come to light and that the Argentine Navy is no better than the guy in a pedalo that I posted in another thread.
Sadly I cannot.
The sea is a cruel mistress, that requires utmost training and dedication. The Naval forces of any nation perform more than just a military dictat but are a vital part of protecting and looking after the well being of merchant sailors too. I'm sure the ex RN here can post just what a military Navy does in it's everyday voyages.
MUCH worry goes to the submariners. The steel coffin deserves utmost respect and should require training of the utmost high standard. 19 days to fulfill that?! That is gross negligence of the most highest order and poses an outrageous risk to it's crews.
I can't find anything to crow about with this most harrowing of reports. The Argentine Navy should mutiny at such disgusting disregard for their safety.
nice try nostril anus but all British / US / Nato Armed Forces are trained in Nuclear, Biological and Chemical warfare and have the appropriate equipment to counter it. I've said all along that training is paramount to a good armed force, something rgenweener obviously hasn't grasped. RN ships train all the time doing COST and BOST regulary under the hospice of the best training organisation in the world Flag Officer Sea Training, it's that good that the rest of NATO send thier ships for training.
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 12:17 am - Link - Report abuse 0@2 I remeber having Argentinian Officers on York and they seemed polite and proffesional they must be very frustrated to see thier ships and crews being treated like shite.
its no co-incidence she has two vessels stuck in overseas ports, this is just part of her grand scheme to save a buck, offload as many navy vessels as possible to other countries so they have to feed,water and supply electricity for the crew under humanitarian rules,thus saving oooodles of pesos over the long term,...
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 12:18 am - Link - Report abuse 0....more realistically Crustina would rather build up her personal fortune
than build up her countries defence....well done Argentina youve elected yourself a right piece of work there, funny it was only the other day arg trolls were knocking the royal navy over the astutes sea trials and all i can say to them is........
...... your not laughing any more, your not laughing anymore...
Now I understand why they want the ARA Libertad back. It's probably the only vessel in the Argentine Navy that's fit for sea!
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 12:23 am - Link - Report abuse 0The sailors aboard the ARA Espora must be cursing CFK by now. The company supplying the parts to rebuild the generator has quite rightly refused to do any work until Argentina pays for the parts and the work in advance. They realise that Argentina is out of cash and they're not about to be stiffed for the bill.
It also explains why Argentina offered to train the officer cadets from other countries. It was the only way they could get enough money to pay for the fuel and supplies for the voyage.
However, as Kretina is refusing to pay the amount ordered by the court to satisfy NML's bond and occupying the valuable berthing space in Tema port, it won't be long before the Ghanaian court repossesses the ship to pay off the berthing fees and sends the Argentine sailors home in disgrace.
As for the submarines, that is indeed hilarious. The only effective warships in the entire fleet and they lack the spare parts (from Germany) to even get some sea time.
It's a wonder that the Chilean Government doesn't decide to take over it's next door neighbour and remove the threat they've faced for so long. Given the state of the Argentine armed forces, they could probably be defeated by the Vatican City!
I wish all militaries had this problem :3
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 12:26 am - Link - Report abuse 0To follow on NO Royal Navy ship is ALLOWED to deploy unless the ship and it's crew reach the necessary standard required in all departments, from the Chefs to Ops Room crews to ships firefighters and stewards, they are even marked on the cleanliness of the ship itself, if it's not clean enough they will undergo weeks more training until it is, we call it round again. Submariners undergo even more rigourous training with a need to know everyone elses job onboard the boat before they can get thier dolphins.
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 12:27 am - Link - Report abuse 0I think they should mark this day as November 22nd Red Face Day!!
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 12:47 am - Link - Report abuse 0@9, 12
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 01:09 am - Link - Report abuse 0I have no doubts any of your countries could try to invade us for no reason (again), and no matter what training you got... dump sufficient poison on a biological organism, it dies.
No orbital platforms, or gamma lasers. Just a good stock of bio, chemical, and high TNT bombs, and drop them on any invading force. I don't care what technology you have... enough gunpowder, enough poison, and enough germs finish off any invader since their supply lines coming from so far away would be nonexistent.
To keep a navy, army, and air force that can't ever hope of defeating larger countries is a waste of money. Disband them and send the officers to find other jobs.
@11 I can't find anything to crow about with this most harrowing of reports. The Argentine Navy should mutiny at such disgusting disregard for their safety.
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 01:13 am - Link - Report abuse 0I totally agree Raven I hated going on the Subs as Ships Manager when I was in Faslane, steel coffins is an accurate description, I hated even more having to meet them out in the Clyde and they were on the surface all the way in. 19 days is disgraceful, a work up for our lads is 8 weeks minimum thats after all the shore training. To risk even sending those lads out with nothing more than 19 days at sea in a year is disgusting and a total disregard for thier lives.
oh my! where, oh where are the trolls yet again???
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 01:17 am - Link - Report abuse 0they seem to have mysteriously......vanished!
along with the future of The great Argentine Navy.
I wonder if Crustina has her jet on standby yet..... its coming ??
@18 Nostrildoofus
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 01:17 am - Link - Report abuse 0“To keep a navy, army, and air force that can't ever hope of defeating larger countries is a waste of money. Disband them and send the officers to find other jobs.”
Gosh, Nozzy, you sound so much like Guzz, despising the military like that.
:- )
@21
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 01:21 am - Link - Report abuse 0Did I say I “dispise” the military? I said they can't fulfill the purpose they have been assigned in their current form, which is to dispel all threats.
Why pay for stupid ships, and boots that are not used 99.9999999% of the time and if they were to be used, they can't defeat larger countries?
Get rid of them, put machines and bombs and little viruses as our line of defense. Build so many batches and so many bombs that any invasion either fails or costs an intolerable amount of lives.
@18 rule one, control the skies, how are you going to “dump” when any aircraft has been reduced to ash long before any ground offensive, any artillery or munition stocks would soon follow, i see you have clearly thought your scenario through, good luck general.
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 01:26 am - Link - Report abuse 0stick to call of duty less chance of hurting yourself.
@ 18 our lads are equipt and trained to fight in a nuclear fall out zone mate, you don't get much more TNT as you put it than that, and how are you going to protect your own people? Launch some chemicals at the enemy and then suddenly the wind changes direction oops, millions of dead civilians who don't have the protective clothing, haven't gas masks or been innoculated against germ warfare as our lads have, suggest you read about the threat of chemical weapons in the Gulf war and how many innoculations our boys got to combat it. Vaccines given to coalition troops included, amongst others, anthrax, botulism and bubonic plague, all in all 12 different chemical agents were annoculated against this was backed up by full NBCD suits gas masks and antropin and NAPPs tablets. How are you going to provide all that to the civilians.
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 01:32 am - Link - Report abuse 0@23
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 01:34 am - Link - Report abuse 0With enough missiles (not expensive if you reduce the BILLIIONS in salaries and ships and the like from scrapping) a proper standing military, you woudn't be able to.
You would lose all your alloted aircraft before you could eliminate the threat.
If you dedicate 300 aircraft to a campain, and each of those can destroy on average 20 AAA's before getting hit, then have 7000 AAA's.
And even then you would not have to get to that point. Just make the attempt to control the skies so punitive that you woudn't continue. Look at Libya, they have almost no such weapons and yet you needed a almost a week to eliminate their threat.
Imagine if a country ditched their entire military and diverted that spending and other to just ammasing AAA's.
And that's before dealing with the germs on the ground.
hes going to need a lot of fullers earth and a sh*t load of charcoal lined suits ;)
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 01:35 am - Link - Report abuse 0@24
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 01:39 am - Link - Report abuse 0You don't get it do you. If a foreign country is invading us to take us over, the population does not matter much if they are going to be enslaved and subjugated by the invaders. You would try to minimize the risks, but if it is necessary, then that consideration is secondary in destroying the threat.
And please everyone knows that no matter how well equipped you are, you can't fight long with such equipment and then the detox process makes you vulnerable to further attack. Why do you think that to this day “crude” chemical and bio weapons like your mustard and anthrax are so FEARED by any military? If it was so easy as you fanciful internauts claim, they would not be so zealously planned for.
Nostro, I don't think.. you'ree talking to any 'Mericans right now. Most are too full to type words
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 01:39 am - Link - Report abuse 0@22 Nozzy
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 01:43 am - Link - Report abuse 0“Get rid of them, put machines and bombs and little viruses as our line of defense. Build so many batches and so many bombs that any invasion either fails or costs an intolerable amount of lives.”
Nozz, now you sound like “Comical Ali”! :- )
Funny, if it weren't so hateful.
@ 19 slattzzz
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 01:51 am - Link - Report abuse 0I Mistyped. It's not 19 days at sea, it's 19 HOURS submerged!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Holy F@£!$
That's not just outrageous, that is total disrespect.
I may never have been in the Navy, but it only takes watching Das Boot (the greatest and most truthful of submarine based films) and reading E. Young's ' One of our Submarines' and of course reading about the Thetis, Kursk etc to realise just how much you REALLY have to be on top of things when in a submarine.
19 hours submerged? Ridiculous in the most extreme and dangerous of circumstances. It's seems the thinking is just because you can do the theory, the practical is no different. Pehaps the Gvt needs a trip out in one past 500', with the casing creaking and snapping and with a simulated fire and compartment flooding combined with a lighting failure 300NMiles from the nearest help, maybe they would boost funding for training.
God help those that serve in Argentine subs, they need every prayer at this moment.
LOL! Did TTT get his military training from online fantasy gaming?
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 01:52 am - Link - Report abuse 0How are you going to train those little viruses to only infect foreigners? If you are happy for Argentines to die for the cause I hope you will be first in the line of martyrs. And viruses don't recognise borders, so where would it stop?
If, and I can't see any reason for it, such tactics were blurted out by your verbally incontinent President, no ground force would be necessary, her own people would turn on her to prevent such a ridiculous idea from ever happening.
Clearly, TTT, you have nothing to live for.
@27 Paranoid dellusionist. you remind me of that north korean puppet in team america kim jong.... whatever, talking how you would use chemical and biological warfare to defeat the evil west in your conquest to rule the world...MUFAAaaaaa,
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 01:53 am - Link - Report abuse 0and as i remember it didnt end to great for him.
and whats the range of your so called AAA's , most surface to air missiles have a ceiling of about 8000 ft, a laser guided weapon can wipe out a target from 20'000 feet mate, and the chances of AAA hitting an aircraft doing mach 1.5 are very very slim, and once the ammo dumps are laser bombed what then pea shooters? Even if we had no laser guided bombs we could accurately carpet bomb you from 30,000 feet well out of range of missles and AAA as you call it. Have you considered a job in defence?........no thought not
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 01:56 am - Link - Report abuse 0@25 by the way missiles are very expensive, the ones you are talking about are called fireworks.
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 02:00 am - Link - Report abuse 0@34 LOL :)
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 02:02 am - Link - Report abuse 0whats next? a counter attack using special forces armed with sparklers, ninjas throwing catherine wheels, catapulting bangers from stealth balloons....please, you havent the money or intelligence, i would stick to pots and pans its more fun.
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 02:14 am - Link - Report abuse 0TWIMC (to borrow 'Thinks' phrase)
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 02:19 am - Link - Report abuse 0Never mind trying to turn the argument, and saying the money could be better spent elsewhere with missiles etc.
Currently, you have people who are literally risking their souls out in the South Atlantic, in ships that are badly maintained. This as far as I am aware, goes against every seafarers code of conduct. If you want to disband your navy then fine. Just do not forget those that serve RIGHT NOW, and the fact they no more deserve to be given a piece of equipment that could kill them through neglect than you do at your place of work.
Keep them safe, they deserve no less.
if the argentine navy degrade any further i can see them recomissioning the belgrano as it is more sea worthy than the current vessels,
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 02:26 am - Link - Report abuse 0@37 well said Raven as an ex Royal Navy man I have the deepest respect for seafarers of ANY nation, but they have the right to be able to carry out whatever is asked of them in a safe enviroment, badly maintained ships and poorly trained personel make a dangerous job almost suicidal, sending a submarine to sea with only 19 hours submerged in a year is damn right disgracful, it is a disaster waiting to happen
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 02:27 am - Link - Report abuse 0My neighbors are trying to stuff me with paper plates of food so heavy they bend in the middle!......
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 03:20 am - Link - Report abuse 0Help me, Argentina!
maybe they could pay the brits to defend their sea from spanish/brazilian trawler-men.
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 03:50 am - Link - Report abuse 0payment in advance only though, no credit for argentina!
@7 'if the corvette Spiro, originally assigned for the Altasur naval exercise, had not suffered the accident of running into a sand bank when leaving Mar del Plata'.
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 05:41 am - Link - Report abuse 0Astute was a stuff-up.
The Spiro incident was just a minor slip-up in that part of their training where they have to stay in really shallow water where subs can't get at them.... :)
Morning all!!!
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 07:04 am - Link - Report abuse 0I was just passing, I heard that the circus was in town, but I can now see that I was right. so nice to see that some things don't change.
I can see that “Nostrolldamus The 2nd” Is, as always, the first to be spitting bile to mask his embarrassment at his own armed forces, yet again trying to change the subject by bringing up ( yes you guessed it!! ) The British involvement in Iraq.
Change the record son!!! and please, please, PLEASE take the time to read your posts before you press the “Submit Comment” button, it will stop you sounding like a rabid, wide-eyed, loony.
@27 - Tobias
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 07:19 am - Link - Report abuse 0So instead of having a properly equipped and trained military, you are going to opt for biological & chemical weapons, which will probably kill more of your own people than the 'enemy', as the enemy troops will have protective equipment but your own people won't?
So instead of defending Argentina you 'cunning' plan is to just make it easier for the 'enemy' to invade by killing all the locals?
Congratulations, you have now joined Pirat-hunter and Dany Berger, in the race to be the most incompetent 'backseat' strategist on here.
By the way, Tobias, the development of biological, chemical and radiological weapons is prohibited and against international law. The UNSC would certainly put an embargo on any substances or equipment that could be used to create your suicidal weapons, and even if you did manage to develop some weapons, your weapons facilities would be bombed into the stone age, again the curtesy of the UNSC.
Although to be honest I don't see Argentina getting that far. All the substance and equipment required would be held up at customs, waiting on you to export soy to the same amount. Plus, suppliers of these chemicals would want paying up front - no credit extended.
Face it, Tobias, your post was stupid, ill thought out, and well really stupid.
Your military of today are not the Junta. Most of the young men and women who serve today were not even born when the Junta was in power.
They volunteer to join up to protect Argentina and her citizens. It takes courage, loyalty and determination to do that (alien concepts to you Tobias, I know), and the very least they should expect is to be treated fairly and with respect by the government and people of Argentina.
The very least they should expect is to have sufficient funds to maintain their equipment, if new equipment can't be afforded.
The government of Argentina, and the President in particular, main purpose is to defend Argentina and her people. They seem to be sleeping on the job.
And people are surprised by this article, why?
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 08:11 am - Link - Report abuse 0Interesting thought, sumarines receiving 19 hours submerged training, I wonder? is that figure per boat, or is it for the entire fleet?
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 08:34 am - Link - Report abuse 0Slatzzz says it is a disgrace, me, I say it is Criminal!
Everyone in Argentina knows that the funding to the armed forces have been drastically cut since 2001, and even further under CFK. Nothing surprising with this article. The Argentine armed forces would struggle fight their way out of a wet paper bag, let along re invade the falklands or recapture and liberate the Libertadad as some of the more looney elements would like.
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 08:55 am - Link - Report abuse 0Well part of it is good news zero ability to try anything onthe falklands.
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 10:15 am - Link - Report abuse 0The rest not so good enforce fishery regulation in there part of the south atlantic impossibe and the poor sods at antartic bases cant imagine helicopters and planes maintence is brilliantbwith budgets that bad.
46 reality check
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 10:24 am - Link - Report abuse 0The 19 hours of submerged training was when the sub accidently sank in the harbour.
CFK !
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 10:33 am - Link - Report abuse 0take guard ..
Captain Conqueror plans to attack you with his internet crew using of puffing boats.
Well, I have been among those who parodied the AG military and claimed they only had nuclear powered rowing boats.
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 11:18 am - Link - Report abuse 0Seems I gave them more credit than they deserve.
But I must ask a question: where the fcuk were the high command in all this? Why were they not on the steps of Casa Rosada demanding (they are usually good at that) that either more money is found to safeguard the officers and men or they will all resign.
Ah! I see the weakness in my argument: that would require HONOUR and it is clear from this report of the Lower House that they do not have any, despite all the chicken shit on their epaulettes. To let their subordinates risk their lives in this manner is nothing short of criminal and they should be brought up on charges, the principle one being dereliction of duty.
They'd be better off drasticlly reducing the size of their navy to one where they can competently operate and maintain all their vessels.
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 11:26 am - Link - Report abuse 0They may as well abolish their navy and spend the cash on something else than waste it away like this.
@27
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 12:04 pm - Link - Report abuse 0What do you call this genius strategy of yours? 'Defense of mass destruction' maybe?
@5 Yeah, well, we only send ONE ship. What's the matter? Isn't 15:1 a big enough margin for you? I know it's close. Back in '82, we damaged a sub and sank a cruiser. So only 13 combat vessels ran for “home”.
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 12:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@8 You're the one that seems to have a problem about Iraq, not I. Iraq was simply a problem that should have been resolved first time around.
@18 Oh, goody. Argieland has ratified both the Biological Weapons Convention and the Chemical Weapons Convention. Still, argieland never pays any attention to anything it's signed, does it? Rogue state!
@22 Sorry, sonny. Do you not understand that British forces are equipped and trained to fight in a CBRN environment against the old Soviet Union? Surely you remember the pictures from Iraq that showed troops in full environmental kit in case Saddam tried that route. You don't have anything we couldn't beat if we wanted to. But why are you so nervous? The UK hasn't threatened you with any offensive military action. You just need to stay well away from anything that isn't yours. And quit trying to make other people's lives more difficult.
@25 Still trying to make yourself feel big? With our base on the Falklands, and tankers, and submarine-launched cruise missiles, you have NOTHING. Typhoons. Equipped with Beyond Visual Range weapons. So, an initial and continuing barrage of cruise missiles. Interspersed with manned aircraft to knock out tracking equipment with BVR weapons.
@27 Poor boy. You're in dreamland. But we'll bear in mind that your population “doesn't matter much”.
@42 Oh dear. The Astute incident was down to the commander trying to land crew members in shoal waters. Something that might be required of any submarine.
@46 Just remember that the Falklands are safe. Any argie vessel that tried to “put to sea” would probably founder within 10 miles. If they dared get so far out that they couldn't put their foot down and touch bottom!
@50 I have my own weapon to defeat you! I could fart! Should finish you.
Never underestimate your enemy,
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 12:21 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Even if they have nothing,
History tells us, the fools are the fools that get caught out and suffer the humiliation,
As long as she is in power, and friends with Hugo and being able to manipulate others, she can never be trusted,
Still,
Plenty of knives to go round,
Never turn ya back.
Just a thought.
.
@ Nostroll.
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 01:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You really need to get a grip. Your Pirat Hunter esque comments just make you look the baffoon. Your suggested defence strategy has more basis in fantasy than any reality.
The Argentine Navy does more than just fight on the ocean. They guard against illegal fishing, provide search and rescue facilities, defend against your 12 mile oceanic border becoming like Somalias', charts waters, provides accurate weather reports and dozens of other things that you'd never realise.
If you want to junk your navy, that's fine, but for Gods sake, let those who serve currently at least have a safe environment in which to work. It's not fair they should be risking their lives for CFK to save a few Pesos.
Err, should we send out Prince William and his Air-sea rescue helicopter just in case ?
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 02:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0[ 54
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 02:35 pm - Link - Report abuse 0dont trouble
i always use ventilator when reading Mercopress comments.
@57 - brucey-babe
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 03:01 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“should we send out Prince William and his Air-sea rescue helicopter just in case ?”
LOL! I'd imagine TMBOA would have a coronary, and immediatley tell the UNSC that they UK is planning to invade Argentina with an unarmed rescue helicoptor.
However, if the rest of their Armed Forces are as badly maintained as their Navy, then that might be all it'll take.
Let's set the scene.
A bright yellow Seaking helicopter heads towards the Argentine coast.
Tobias (TTT, Nostral or whatever he's calling himself today), upon hearing this, will be first into the fray with his snotty nose, spreading his biological weapon of the common cold, to anyone within reach...
Well, at least they haven't had the potential safety nightmare of a ship at sea losing power mid-harrasment-of-fishermen and the embarrasment of having to be towed back into port by a Falkland-flagged vessel (which they haven't really tried to blockade at all have they?)
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 03:38 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I'd imagine that would fix TMBoA's low blood pressure nicely...
Nostrolldamus The 2nd??? hello?? Nostrolldamus The 2nd!!! Mistythink!! Prorg-yank?? ( tumbleweed rolls past ) Anyone there???
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 05:11 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Shame on you lot!!!! you've scared them all away..........
lol.
Maybe it’s time for Argentina to abandon even the pretense of a “blue water navy”, decommission the big ships in favour of fewer, smaller vessels that at least could be maintained and used.
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 05:11 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Then at least they would be able to patrol their eez waters, if nothing else.
Could always keep at least one sub, to sneak ashore in S Georgia/S Sandwich islands and plant an Argy flag every once in a while.
At the moment it sound like even attempting that would be a high risk “life or death” mission for the sub crew, without any interference from the British.
Just a thought.
Maybe they can rename their navy puddle pirates or the brown water navy. I would be afraid in their subs that wonce they took on ballast they could never blow it.
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 05:36 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@62
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 06:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“Maybe it’s time for Argentina to abandon even the pretense of a “blue water navy”, decommission the big ships in favour of fewer, smaller vessels that at least could be maintained and used.”
Do you mean, reduce it to a small capable force of “Pa-Troll” boats?
Actually, weren't they ridiculing the Ghanaians for their small navy.
Seems that Ghana are the smart ones.
:-D
@56
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 06:36 pm - Link - Report abuse 0They can have a safe environment to work in. They can retire and find jobs in the private sector.
We can hire private contractors to patrol the waters.
To keep an actual armed forces is pointless.
And the rest of you are missing the point... the point I originally made was “what is the most likely to cause serious harm, damage, and ruin to a possible invader” (the whole point of having a modern army, since invading other countries with an army for little or reason for preemptive reasons is the realm of rogue, barbaric states with no sense of right or wrong)...
The answer is not keeping a useless army, navy, air force, where most of the budget goes into salaries and keeping useless material.
The best answer is to have a MASSIVE pile of anti-aircraft material, because that is the preffered method of supremacy in modern warfare (especially the biggest threat to Argentina, NATO).
Take that supremacy away, and their only solution is a ground invasion. And without air superiority you can dump all the TNT, germs, and mustard on any invading force.
OMFG, Nato the biggest threat to Argentina? pray explain, just how is Nato a danger to Argentina? are you planning to attack one of their member states?
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 06:45 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@65 Nozzy
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 07:02 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“We can hire private contractors to patrol the waters.”
Where are you going to get the money for mercenaries, if you don't have money for a 'real' navy?
As soon as they see a Chilean patrol boat, I bet they cut and run, rather than risk their boats and their asses for the likes of you.
Besides, you would have to pay them in advance, with your credit rating. Then what's to stop them buggering off at the first sign of trouble??
Even if you could hire a military contractor, they would not fulfill the many other maritime duties that a sovereign navy would carry out, regulation of fisheries, search and rescue, etc.
I suppose, as a gesture of goodwill, Prince William could visit the Falklands for a bit with his yellow helicopter.
Big morale boost for the Fslklanders and the professional British fighting forces there. If one of your boats making an incursion into Falkland waters, or harrassing a fishboat, should swamp or breakdown, he might help them out.
“We can hire private contractors to patrol the waters.” I guess going to war and/or invading say argentina would be a matter or paying off the “paid contractors” lolololololol
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 07:05 pm - Link - Report abuse 0As for for your massive anti aircraft.....maybe you are behind in the times........there is technology now called stealth......not 100 % full proof....but pretty damned good.
Idoit....I am not even going to momment on your last sentence other than you've been playing call to duty way too much........give it a break and choke your chicken for a while like a normal teen
@64 Troy Tempest
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 07:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0It looks like Ghana's navy might be getting with a new three masted training ship.
@68
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 07:11 pm - Link - Report abuse 0And there is anti-stealth missiles that seek even the most-minimum air-wake, not reflections of metal of traditional radar.
I don't care what the fuck stealth planes you have, they still glide through the air and displace it.
When you have anti-gravity planes that somehow do not disturb the atmosphere around it, then get back to me.
@Pugol-H
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 07:13 pm - Link - Report abuse 0LOL - wouldn't that be a blow to CFK !!
Let me see hum, now what would be the first requirement for a succesful air campaign? Hum! would that be neutralising the enemy Air Defence Radar and Missile systems?
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 07:18 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Get off the video games kid. You remind me of that other idiot and his “nuclear defense” for argentina. Both of you have not yet over come your first barriers for the technology.......GREENBACK MONEY!!!! You can't even keep your light on the the capital......but good practice for a NATO invcasion....lol.
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 07:29 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@73
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 07:32 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Maybe you have a point, but we don't need to really put more “greenback”, when it is imminent that you and NATO will be “trimmed” down to form by the tune of a trillion in military cuts coming in the USA, UK, Germany, France, Italy, Spain, and all the others.
Paymaster China simply won't allow you all to keep using papa's credit card to build shiny new toys that could be used against them. That's the immediate future.
@73 Nozzy
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 07:39 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“And there is anti-stealth missiles that seek even the most-minimum air-wake, not reflections of metal of traditional radar.”
And you could afford lots of those, right ??!!
You can't keep your planes flying either - all mirages grounded!
Where will you get money and parts??
Pukara's - only good against civilians and ground troops. Got any of those left??
Considering that it is most likely Brazil that will attack it's unstable neighbour, or Chile that hates you, NATO needn't bother.
Brazil certainly won't help you arm or repair your planes.
You obviously have a great sense of smell from thousands of miles away,
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 07:53 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Crap
is from losers, they always moan and change the subject,
As for brits,
I take it you mean that great British nation inhabited by and called the British people .lol.
Brazil and Chile would be taken out by a couple of nukes. We would only need two, if the attacked, and short range 1000km missiles which we already have built in the past (Condor program).
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 07:54 pm - Link - Report abuse 0If the wind is blowing south or east at the time, argentina would suffer radiation fall out and probably all die as well,
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 08:04 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Argentina cannot/will not afford or be allowed to have nukes, [sorry]
It would be like giving matches to a child.
@78
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 08:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Hate to break it to you, in my part of the world countries are bigger than a car trunk.
@77 Nozzy
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 08:12 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Nukes?? LOL, snort,guffaw!!!
So, you really are on a par with that genius, Pirat-ALEX VARGAS !!
What a laff !!
TTT, Nostril, etc, - surely the stupidest troll that ever mashed a keyboard!!
Woot!! Brits WIN!!
and poorer than a caveman......TTT....go back to Rosey Palmer and her 5 sisters, you get along better in that crowd........you all believe you all love one another, at least you act like it.
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 08:18 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You are insane. I didn't say we should get nukes, I put a hypothetical on how to avert Chile and Brazil invading us.
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 08:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I'm far more capable than you Troy Tempest. You are the typical anti-argie that always wants Argentina to lose, always arguing Argentina is on the wrong side of any argument, always hoping the rest of the countries screw us over for the fun of it.
It is you and your ilk who are the stupidest ever... you all claim to hail from democratic, multi-cultural “utopias” where diverging points of view are respected.
Which you all have proven here not to be the case, you are as intolerant, narrow-minded, and doctrinarial as the better apparatchiks of facist, socialist, or European/American parlamentary/republican government.
Nostrolldamus the 2nd - why are you and the other trolls totally lacking in a sense of humour? Can you not appreciate we are laughing at you but in the most sincere way? Are you unable to appreciate that your leaders are not leading?
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 08:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@79 - Tobias
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 08:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0And just how will you get these nukes that you are going to use to destroy your allies Brazil and Chile with?
You do realise that radiation can travel thousands of miles don't you? When Chernobyl blew the radiation affected most of Europe, thousands of miles from where the incident occurred.
You really are stupid if you believe that the fallout won't affect Argentina. It will, even your precious Mendoza.
Face it, you're talking bollocks.
You can afford the military that you have now. No one in the world is stupid enough to sell expensive stuff to Argentina unless the dollars are paid up front.
And when you have all that expensive hardware, who is going to fire it when the time comes? After all you've just disbanded your armed forces.
Oh wait, that'll be the mercenaries that you're going to hire. Problem is, that your friends Brazil and Chile have more money than you, and so will pay the mercenaries to fire your missiles at Argentinian targets.
I have decided that you have won the competition of most incompetent backseat strategist, easily outpacing both Dany Berger and Pirat-hunter.
By the way, which countries build these 'stealth' missiles? Certainly no country that could build such weapons would let just anyone buy them. They prefer to sell them to a certain type of country. Namely one that has money. JAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJA
Argentina is in economic meltdown. You won't pay maintain the defence of your own country.
Compare this to your good buddies Brazil (the one you're planning in nuking). Economy reasonably stable given the world economic conditions, inflation manageable.
They even have the confidence to buy brand new military hardware, and vessels for their navy.
Face it, Tobias, rampant corruption and incompetence has destroyed Argentina. Argentina could've been where Brazil is now, may have even been better, but the people of Argentina seem to be self destructive.
Argentina, the architect of your own downfall.
@NoHopetrollDemented the recurring.
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 08:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Ah I see! The old 'Nuke' word uttered.
Get a grip in reality will you. You know, the place where 7billion people exist, and not the fairyland your head seems to reside in.
Next you will be telling us INDEC forecasts are the most accurate measure of inflation ever devised.
Answer @82 applies to 83, 84 and 85.
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 08:32 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Happy reading, antis.
Hate to break it to you, in my part of the world countries are bigger than a car trunk.
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 08:46 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Perhaps you think nuclear weapons just blow up car trunks like a hand grenade
If I am correct, depending on the size of the war head,
It will kill and destroy everything within about 15/20 square miles,
Causing death and hurricane winds out to a distance of about 50 square miles,
And people will die of radiation for years afterwards,
That’s a bit bigger than a car trunk,
Can one suggest you go to google images and put in Nagasaki or Hiroshima,
And see the devastation your self.
.
@86 - Tobias
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 08:51 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Well I think Argentina can celebrate that you aren't running things.
So instead of investing in the training and equipment of your Armed Forces that could act as an 'actual' deterrent against your 'theoretical' invasion, your 'theoretical' defence of Argentina is to destroy Argentina and kill all it's people?
Yup, you really are stupid.
@86 Nozzy-Nukes
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 09:07 pm - Link - Report abuse 0So, you're bailing out now without defending your position?
Calling us names doesn't make you right.
You are incredibly naive, and stupid!
Are you the player on Halo - online, who was crying because other people were shooting at him??
Apart from Conq, and he had his own reasons, nobody here is “anti-Argie”, but the anti-Brit, anti-US, anti-EU, rhetoric you use to discredit us when you don't get your way, is not going to go unanswered. Your posts are built solely on lies and accusations.
Your forum opposition is anti-troll, anti-Malvinista, and anti-CFK.
You lot profit at the expense of others, namely us, and your Argentinian 'brothers'.
Reprehensible that you screw those who trusted you, and then you blame others.
Good luck to the Argentinians - may they get rid of your gang of crooks and reach their true potential.
Lets see. so far we have had, Nukes, Chemical Weapons and Star wars Shields.
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 09:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0What next me wonders? Phasers and Photon Torpedoes no doubt and it all started, cos they can not afford the upkeep of the hardware they already have. Love this site!!!
@89
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 09:13 pm - Link - Report abuse 0CFK till 2015.
Code of Governance Part A, Article 2, section 34, paragraph 7, sub-section I, line 1(b), 12.1 reference 1:
“As ordained by the immanent and indefeasible powers of the popular democratic process under which the public servants of the Republic swear to faithfully engage office, and hitherto implicitly sovereign to this Article, it is thus accorded, expected, and required under penalty of official and legal inquiry of percontation and interrogation by peers, that he/she elected by the procedures outlined and in sections 7-31 wherewith such authority is bestowed to the elected by the republican and provincial assemblies through the desires of the electee, that the holder of the office of President of the Republic of the Federal Argentine State of provinces fulfill a 4 year term, and so protecting the integrity of the republic by providing a seamless quilt of governance resistant to the whims of rapid social development, of the fomented mob, or anent pretensions engendered by political rivaly, competition, or animus.”
titter....titter...
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 09:14 pm - Link - Report abuse 081 Captain Poppy, 84 LEPRecon, 85 Raven, 87 briton, 89 Troy Tempest
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 09:18 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Just between you and me, I don't that Nostrolldamus The 2nd is here for the news or the debate, I think he just likes getting buttf**ked in public...... It would seem that he is coming out with more and more fanciful and outlandish points of view, only to be b*tch slapped until he squeals........ He has done it sssssooooo often now that I am thinking that he actually likes it......eeeeeeewwwwww!!!
Well, I'm thinking that it takes all sorts, and if being made to look a complete kn*b in public on a daily basis does it for you then I can't say anything can I?
I just hope La Campora pays well........... On second thoughts......
@91 Nozzynukes
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 09:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“CFK till 2015.”
Well, if you're not worried she'll get turfed before then, you can stop posting right now.
Then we would all be happy - no angry accusations and excuses from you - no replies from us exposing the holes in your arguments and slapping you sideways for being stupid.
LOL
“Which you all have proven here not to be the case, you are as intolerant, narrow-minded, and doctrinarial as the better apparatchiks of facist, socialist, or European/American parlamentary/republican government.”
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 09:25 pm - Link - Report abuse 02015......time will tell tobias....Suriname may decide to grew and invade Argentina....get your NBC defenses out along side your nukes and star wars......must be reading the Reagan years.
We are supppose to be tolerant to countries that take moeny and pay back pennies on the dollar and none at all to others??
Code of Governance Part A, Article 2, section 34, paragraph 7, sub-section I, line 1(b), 12.1 reference 1:
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 09:25 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“As ordained by the immanent and indefeasible powers of the popular democratic process under which the public servants of the Republic swear to faithfully engage office, and hitherto implicitly sovereign to this Article, it is thus accorded, expected, and required under penalty of official and legal inquiry of percontation and interrogation by peers, that he/she elected by the procedures outlined and in sections 7-31 wherewith such authority is bestowed to the elected by the republican and provincial assemblies through the desires of the electee, that the holder of the office of President of the Republic of the Federal Argentine State of provinces fulfill a 4 year term, and so protecting the integrity of the republic by providing a seamless quilt of governance resistant to the whims of RAPID SOCIAL DEVELOPMENT, OF THE FOMENTED MOB, or anent pretensions engendered by political rivalry, competition, or animus.”
talk about DAFT VADER lol.
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 09:30 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@96 Nozzynukes
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 09:32 pm - Link - Report abuse 0That 'Code of Governance' won't help when CFK is dragged out of Casa Rosada, past her impotent trolls, and she's strung up by her own support-hose.
Hmm, then you'll be out of a job, won't you?
Of course, you could likely get a job at a Mendoza shopping mall, serving empanadas or such. That's if they are still in business.
@98
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 09:39 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You people do realize that threats against a world leader are in fact investigated not only by the Argentina's Policia Federal, but also by the FBI (why I don't know).
I guess its winter up there so you are asking for some warm company.
@99Nozzynukes
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 09:45 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Put it down as 'wishful thinking' on our part, based on what we've seen of your protests and heard from English-speaking 'real' Argentines, it won't be long before CFK is removed by impeachment of forcibly.
@100
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 09:46 pm - Link - Report abuse 0They will all be shot dead as they should. As should have happened in 2001.
You think that the Security Forces that have just had their wages slashed by CFK are going to fire on their own people?
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 09:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Not when they see how the tables have turned, they'll join in!!
Of course, if the Judges resist being bribed, she could escape that by allowing impeachment, or she could flee the country forthwith, and allow Argentina to recover.
how many would be shot dead,
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 09:54 pm - Link - Report abuse 0and what happend in 2001,
@103briton
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 09:56 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I see a name change coming, methinks.
:-D
yep
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 09:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0he is getting rather confused ..
That's what happens when you back a rabid TiTmouse into a corner.
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 10:02 pm - Link - Report abuse 0perhaps he will now settle down with his airfix models,
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 10:12 pm - Link - Report abuse 0and give up on the plastic nuks.lol.
Shoot em dead, or protest peacefully. The constitution is first.
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 10:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 0but she keeps wanting to change it.
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 10:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 0still
if you shot everyone that disagreed with her views, their would be no one left to make the tea.lol.
@109
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 10:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“As ordained by the immanent and indefeasible powers of the popular democratic process under which the public servants of the Republic swear to faithfully engage office, and hitherto implicitly sovereign to this Article, it is thus accorded, expected, and required under penalty of official and legal inquiry of percontation and interrogation by peers, that he/she elected by the procedures outlined and in sections 7-31 wherewith such authority is bestowed to the elected by the republican and provincial assemblies through the desires of the electee, that the holder of the office of President of the Republic of the Federal Argentine State of provinces fulfill a 4 year term, and so protecting the integrity of the republic by providing a seamless quilt of governance resistant to the whims of rapid social development, of the fomented mob, or anent pretensions engendered by political rivalry, competition, or animus.”
@110 Nozzynukes
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 10:46 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Why do you keep posting that? The Constitution is inconvenient to CFK.
As to the people - well, desperate times, desperate measures!
BUT, I suppose this is the end of the thread. Nozzy has criticised the Navy, as opposed to the government's financing of the same.
Certainly, his alternative to a properly functioning navy is ridiculous and fanciful, no matter how much he insists on his video game models.
Now, he is not responding at all, since made a fool of himself, except to spam the Argentine Constitution.
LOL, next thread, please.
@111
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 11:00 pm - Link - Report abuse 0What I think is ridiculous is that you demand that money be wasted on a losing proposition, i.e, a navy that can defeat all possible enemies on this globe.
We don't have 200 million, 300 million, 1 billion people to do so, nor are we part of an alliance of 700 million, or have 1000 years of seafaring experience.
To ask to spend billions on a non-starter shows how little you care about Argentina. Then again, I never suggested any of you did, nor do I expect you to by any means. Not your country, fair enough.
A properly functioning navy defeats the threat. This navy can't, so save the cash for a dissuasive threat against imminent invasion, instead of spreading precious resources thin.
Nostril “Shoot em dead” well thats a solution. Your other name Alfredo Astiz? The blonde angel reincarnated? Hows the Escuela Mecanica? Does the new Plan Condor have any seviceable Hercules C130s to fly free one way trips over the Rio de la Plata?
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 11:20 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@112 Nozzynukes
Nov 23rd, 2012 - 11:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“What I think is ridiculous is that you demand that money be wasted on a losing proposition, i.e, a navy that can defeat all possible enemies on this globe.”
Nobody DEMANDED anything - especially that. This is your amateur attempt to belittle our comments after you proposed ridiculous alternatives.
”As for the topic, the whole military should be disbanded. Use that money to develop a dissuasive shield against aircraft, missile, nuclear attacks, and a “last resort” weapon against a ground invasion of the country. Something (mustard, chemical, etc), that makes any invasion force suffer massive casualties (death), and dessist.“
That and your ”nuke'em” response makes you look stupid.
Your Navy only looks ridiculous because of your bragging and military pretensions. After all the threats, and all the criticism of our military, we find out your fleet is ironically, tied up at the dock because you can't afford to sail it.
That makes CFK and the Trolls look stupid.
Downsizing the fleet and using small craft makes sense given your shortage of resources - meaning slashing of your budget because funds have been misappropriated.
Feel truly sorry for your naval personnel, for both their pride and their safety.
Small craft? lol
Nov 24th, 2012 - 12:25 am - Link - Report abuse 0For what?
To me the fact she has run the military down like this while spending generously on the people just goes to show what a good leader and good human being Cristina is =) But one quick question: does Argentina have the capacity for a lightning rescue of the Libertad, if other channels fail? If not, do any of its allies? Hopefully this won't be necessary, though if it happened it would certainly boost Cristina!
Nov 24th, 2012 - 02:18 am - Link - Report abuse 0BK
Nov 24th, 2012 - 06:30 am - Link - Report abuse 0Operation Entebee 2?
Nahh!!! Operation Eagle Claw 2, more like, I think!
@116 BK
Nov 24th, 2012 - 07:16 am - Link - Report abuse 0“one quick question: does Argentina have the capacity for a lightning rescue of the Libertad?”
- not likely with your “small craft”!
LOL !!
@116 - BK
Nov 24th, 2012 - 08:38 am - Link - Report abuse 0Argentina hasn't got the capacity to do steal the Libertad, if they did I'd bet they would've tried by now.
Why would Argentina's allies break international law to try and retrieve a ship that has nothing to do with them?
Argentina caused this mess by refusing to pay back the money that people loaned them in good faith. Argentina can solve this quite easily by paying the bond, twenty million should be chump change to a national government, but Argentina refuses to do that.
Now why would, for instance, Brazil risk it's very good standing in the world, by committing an illegal act?
Even if they somehow 'got' the Libertad, they'd never get it back to Argentina as they would be intercepted by the navy of Ghana, and probably from their allies too - the UK, Nigeria, South Africa.
So it is a silly, and impossible scenario you put forward.
Spending on the poor is laudable, but surely the 1st remit of ANY President is the security and safety of the nation and it's people?
She appears to be shirking her responsibilities in this area. If you can't afford a large military, you downsize, and have a small, but professional one in its place. If you can't afford a big navy, you should downsize, and only keep the craft that you can maintain.
Sending sailors to sea in unseaworthy vessels is negligence. If those sailors die as a consequence, then the President as chief executive, top dog, whatever you want to call them, is ultimately responsible for EVERYTHING that happens under their watch.
This utter contempt for the lives of those sailors tells us all what we need to know about CFK. Incompetent, inept, corrupt, uncaring, narcissistic... I could go on but I'm running out of characters.
Does Argentina need to havé Návy ?
Nov 24th, 2012 - 10:03 am - Link - Report abuse 0Kirchner knows that she neither needs nor can afford a large sea faring navy, any ability to retake the Falklands by force is long long gone, Argentinas armed forces are at least 50 yrs out of date.
Nov 24th, 2012 - 11:20 am - Link - Report abuse 0But what she does know is that her proud people like to think they have a large sea faring navy. So having numerous ships that do not work and cannot fulfill their role, but yet provide a visible presence, is better than scuttling what's left of them and having no visible rusting presence at all.
Am I right ??????
112 TTT
Nov 24th, 2012 - 12:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0If you claim ownership to the seas that surround you, one would think you should be able to defend it!
It all seems quite perverse to me, if you can't afford so many ships then reduce the number of ships and keep them in a good working state and exercise them heavily so that they are combat ready.
Nov 24th, 2012 - 12:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Sure you can't replicate real battle hardened militarizes but you can get close the skills/experience gap.
Remember last time when bombs weren't armed correctly, torpedo's were wired up backwards and soliders surrendered on mass when faced with a battle ready army? That is typical of an inexperienced and un-exercised military.
It's a nice thought a country doesn't need a military or Navy but to do so would render the country susceptible to an aggressive force unless protected by another country or group of countries (NATO/UN etc).
We all know the Falkland's would be in Argentine hands for instance if the British didn't constantly demonstrate their ability to impose their will on Argentina should Argentina use any military force against the islands.
Still I think if Argentina did disband what is left of its military its only danger would come from South American countries and Argentina is a member of the regional groups so maybe it is possible?
@62 What “big ships”? The largest argie “destroyer” (actually a frigate) is less than half the size of a Type 45.
Nov 24th, 2012 - 01:24 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@70 “anti-stealth missile”? Turn your inventive mind to the interception of a supersonic missile launched by an aircraft already travelling at Mach 2. Or you could consider a cruise missile travelling so low that nothing has time to track it.
@77 Thinking of buying from Iran? Hasn't CFK already self-imposed sanctions on you?
@89 Don't speak on my behalf. I am quite capable of speaking for myself. As I have posted elsewhen, I am anti-argie. But I differentiate between argies and Argentines. Argentines are honest, intelligent idividuals who are sensible, truthful, reasonable. There aren't many. For example, there is NO Argentine government. Then there are argies. They are belligerent, corrupt, cowardly, criminal, genocidal, mendacious, thieving war criminals. They'd like to steal the Falkland Islands. I hold them responsible for the deaths of 255 British servicemen and 3 Falkland Islanders. I hold them to be cowardly because they won't admit their guilt and instead proffer scapegoats.
@91 War Criminal No. 1.
@96 Yep. Can't go having REAL democracy.
@99 “World leader”? Don't be silly. She's a screechy, little, lying, stupid South American bitch with delusions of grandeur.
@108 Pity you don't comply with it!
@115 They're easier to sink!
@116 “spending generously on the people”. Lol. Nothing in S. Am. is capable of a “lightning recue”.
@123 No. There's no chance. The only “country” stupid enough is Venezuela. And I'm not sure that even Chavez is that stupid. It might be enough to make the U.S. “intervene”.
#116 BK if you really never been to argentina....take the trip......she spends NOTHING on the people
Nov 24th, 2012 - 02:15 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Lmao, Nostro truly sounds like your average dumb World Of Warcraft player.
Nov 24th, 2012 - 02:37 pm - Link - Report abuse 0BUILD BOMBZ WE'LL BLOW PPL UP!
Never mind the fact that Argentina has never actually built an ICBM nor has the money to even if they retired there forces.
Never mind the fact that even if they had the money, no-one would sell them such technology anyway, such weapons are state guarded secrets and rarely traded with other nations.
Never mind the fact that there ENTIRE defense would consist of a missile that would only be able to hit nations close to them, not any external threat.
Never mind the fact that because they retired there navy they have no ships to fire an ICBM.
Never mind the fact that there only weapon is easily shot down by any modern navy, especially when that navy knows there only weapon is a missile.
Never mind the fact that by building some WMD's they would turn into the next Iraq.
Never mind the fact that without an army, the SAS or any type of special forces unit could just walk into there country and disable there entire defense system without any problem.
Clearly, this idiot has really though this through.
@124 Conq
Nov 24th, 2012 - 03:39 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“@89 Don't speak on my behalf. I am quite capable of speaking for myself. As I have posted elsewhen, I am anti-argie.”
Apologies Conq, if you think I was speaking for you. I specifically mentioned in that post that you were not included in my statements. Perhaps I did not word it clearly.
@125 Bk has been nowhere near rgenweener, he lives in scotland and dreams (fantasises) of a life with CFK
Nov 24th, 2012 - 06:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@127 Accepted.
Nov 24th, 2012 - 06:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@128 Almost certain to be a Scottish Nationalist. 97% of them are 11 pence short of a shilling.
Or 10 pee caught short in a pound Scots for what its worth?
Nov 24th, 2012 - 06:50 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@129 no just a deluded idiot he's not clever enough to know what a scottish nationalist is
Nov 24th, 2012 - 07:18 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Then Again
Nov 24th, 2012 - 07:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0If CFK disbanded her Army, Navy, And her Air force,
Think of the advantages,
1, more money for her
2, more money for her government
3, pay her debts
4, being an [Iceland] she can claim being the victim everyday.
Just a thought.
.
#129
Nov 24th, 2012 - 09:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@128 “Almost certain to be a Scottish Nationalist. 97% of them are 11 pence short of a shilling.”
This would still make him 5 pence more valuable than the English National Party !
For what it is worth, he said in one of his posts that he was pro -union and against the SNP.
However, I have asked him repeatedly to give some details of his “Scottish credentials” but he has ignored this time and time again. I don't want his name, address or personal details.
His local MP, the school he went to, or the town where he lives.
Until he gives some info. he must be suspect as a troll in sheep's clothing - no reference to the Falklands implied !
Clyde are you talking about me, if so i live in dalgety bay have done since 1990 before that lived in rosyth married quarters and regulary drunk in the familys club and the gladyer, i am a totally against alex (william wallace) salmond, my son owns a flat above the central bar (now closed) in inverkeithing, my wife works in tescos and i drink tennants lager. Gordon Brown west fife MP,and Helen Eddie local mp or was last time i looked because personally i dont give a fook, happy or do you want my post code it starts KY11
Nov 24th, 2012 - 10:15 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Och Clyde an Slattzz. Away wi the pair o ye! Ye no ken that our wee body Bk is the keeper o the lighthoose on Muckle Flugga? But aye he has a wee problem. Yon beacon o the seas ha been automatic for many a year but he hasna twigged that yet so his wee address is nae tae be respected
Nov 24th, 2012 - 11:25 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You guys are lucky, try spellinhg Plaid Cymru.
Nov 24th, 2012 - 11:46 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@135 you must be from fife with that accent
Nov 24th, 2012 - 11:46 pm - Link - Report abuse 0How many times do I have to say that I'm a British patriotic Scot who opposes the breakup of the UK, I just have a more critical view of our relations with our BOTs, especially our refuasal to talk to the peaceful, anti-junta government now in Argentina, while taking the oil. Also I don't “fantasize” about a “life” with Cristina, I know that can never happen, I'm not a fool! But that doesn't mean I can't support her politics, or wind you up by praising her beauty =)
Nov 24th, 2012 - 11:50 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@138 well funny cheers BK“ especially our refuasal to talk to the peaceful, anti-junta government now in Argentina, while taking the oil. Also I don't “fantasize” about a “life” with Cristina, I know that can never happen,” classic you are a complte tool aren't you
Nov 24th, 2012 - 11:55 pm - Link - Report abuse 0British Patriotic Scot my lilly white welsh ass! Find it hard some how to picture you charging up Tumbledown, with the Jocks, taking the bayonet to the enemy.
Nov 25th, 2012 - 12:30 am - Link - Report abuse 0@138 you are a complete idiot aren't you?
Nov 25th, 2012 - 12:54 am - Link - Report abuse 0BK
Nov 25th, 2012 - 01:16 am - Link - Report abuse 0You know the difference between a Sottish soldier and one of your Argentine soldiers.
When an Argentine soldier runs out of ammunition, he runs away.
When a jock runs out of ammuniton, he fixes his bayonet and he attacks.
That's a fact!
She's single, how could that not happen?
Nov 25th, 2012 - 03:18 am - Link - Report abuse 0@ 5 Islas Malvinas
Nov 25th, 2012 - 03:19 am - Link - Report abuse 0“This now explains the British militarization to “defend” the islanders from the mighty argentine navy”
Can you provide us with reliable data (including reliable sources) abouth this alleged “British militarization”?
“Nostrolldamus The 2nd” is Dr. Mengele, or what?
Nov 25th, 2012 - 03:56 am - Link - Report abuse 0have you gone completely off your rocker?
If you had even the slightest knowledge of chemical and biological warfare, you wouldn't even think of using them in your own country.
A large proportion of the population would be dead, the rest only too happy to receive any conquering army to save the lives of their children, anyway the country would be clean again within half a year to be used by the conqueror.
Slaattz
Nov 25th, 2012 - 12:05 pm - Link - Report abuse 0It was NOT you to whom I was referring.
I was referring to Conq. post 129 replying to your post at 128.
I was requesting some info. on BK to “prove” he is Scottish.
I have given details about myself in the past which people can either take or dismiss. However BK never gives the slightest hint of his background or whereabouts which to quote the Scottish justice system makes his nationality not proven.
I have no problem with his political views - that is his business and he should be allowed to express them in this forum. I would take them more seriously IF I knew he was not a clever Argie Troll. At least he does not stoop to profanities like some other posters !
@138 - BK
Nov 25th, 2012 - 01:20 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Surely that should read a patriotic British citizen and a Scot. You sentence construct isn't correct for a native speaker.
What critcal view could a 'British patriotic Scot' have regarding British Overseas Territories? The British government have given them all the right to determine their own future, in line with the UN charter.
Yet, as a 'British patriotic Scot' you support a psuedo-dictatorship, whose only purpose is to take someone else's land and homes (by hook or by crook) and impose their own culture, language, laws and currency upon them. So in other words you support the colonial aspirations of Argentina, whilst condemning the democratic and lawful British actions of supporting those same people's right to determine their own future and allegiance.
That doesn't sound patriotic to me, well not patriotic to Britain anyway. I'm sure you're very patriotic to your real country Argentina.
Tell me, BK, if you really were Scottish, how would you feel if Britain just handed the Shetland Islands over to Denmark or Sweden, because 1000 years ago the Vikings once lived there? Obviously, the way you look at it, what the people of the Shetland Islands wanted would be completely irrelvant becasue they aren't actuall 'people'.
The only difference between that and the Falkland Islands is that Argentina has NEVER had ANY valid sovereignty claims or communities living on the Islands. And their sole argument seems to be 'because we want them', and 'it's not fair you're picking on us!'
In other words the arguments 5 year old use. Pathetic really.
However, despite how sorry I feel for the sailors of the Argentine navy who only want to serve their country, the news is increasingly good for the people of the Falkands. At least they know that there is no way Argentina could invade them now, and probably not for decades to come - assuming they actually get a competent government that can actually run a country properly.
I wouldn't hold my breath if I were you.
Bk is a leprechaun living in the twilight of Celtic myth. On second thoughts he isnt a fairy as he LOVES Cristina. She will shortly be confined to an ivory tower, so BK, her white night to the rescue!!On a bike made for two??
Nov 25th, 2012 - 03:27 pm - Link - Report abuse 0BK is not fooling anyone that he is a Scot. My in laws all speak english impeccibly and a lot of Argentine's do as well. I do commend the Argentine's on their language skills as many speak at the very least their own, English and other another. That being said, sentence construction can never be hidden and he constructs his sentence often enough as most English speaking Argentine's. And to boot he knows more intricacies of local politics and happening that is just not posted or in the internet news, often more than the typical Argentine. I think if I were from the UK I would want to put a hollow point through his cerebellum for using the word “Patriotic” . BK is an elder la campora....nothing more. As for his masterbatorial love and thoughts of cfk's beauty, he is either related of was steam rolled with the ugly truck. HE is one sick individual.
Nov 25th, 2012 - 07:24 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Apparently a welsh school boy was punished for speaking English in class,
Nov 25th, 2012 - 07:45 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Justa thought,
One opens a can,
And many many worms come out,
.
.
@145
Nov 26th, 2012 - 01:10 am - Link - Report abuse 0You obviously are not qualified to speak about anything Argentine, they size of the country, the population density and distribution, and most importantly the fierce loyalty to the concept of nation (which is why unlike all your countries, we don't have any threat whatsoever of break-up).
Next.
#151
Nov 26th, 2012 - 11:35 am - Link - Report abuse 0Probably correct just as you have no qualifications to speak about anything pertaining to the UK,population, history, peoples etc.
151 TTT
Nov 26th, 2012 - 12:07 pm - Link - Report abuse 0But is it apathy or patriotism?
@153
Nov 26th, 2012 - 02:46 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Do the test. google:
“independence of Quebec / Alberta”: tons of articles, news stories, political groups, and historical accounts on the separatism of these areas
“secession/independence of Texas / California / Cascadia / Alaksa / Republic of New England / New Confederate States of America”: tons of the same as above
“independencia do Rio Grande do Sul / Sul do Brasil / Sao Paulo”: lots of websites, articles, and news stories
“independencia de Santa Cruz”: plenty of info on the well known fracturization of Bolivia
”independencia de Mallaganes: articles, info, and even websites about the separatist drive in southern Chile (they've even held protest with gasp, argie flags!)
“independencia de Nuevo Leon”: plenty of calls by citizens online for that state to break away from Mexico
Then search “independencia de Buenos Aires / Mendoza / Cordoba / Patagonia” ...
LOL! All you get is the location of “city plazas/squares”.
That's the difference between Argentina and all othe 202 countries of the planet. We are not perfidious to the concept created in 1810, because it came about in special circumstances. Something you foreigners can never understand.
#154
Nov 26th, 2012 - 05:17 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Your country is not in the separatist camp, but instead you go the other way. Your country is trying to acquire land from someone else. The Falklands , South Georgia, South Sandwich Islands and Antarctica for example. Maybe St.Helena also. You probably have your thieving eyes on some parts of Chile if they let their guard down ! Uruguay and Paraguay would also make the demographic map a little neater from your perspective.
This is something we foreigners DO understand !!
@155
Nov 26th, 2012 - 05:36 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Chile, Paraguay, and Uruguay? don't be delusional, that is long gone as an era.
Falklands, South Georgia, and Sandwich? I don't support that policy, thus to be it is wrong.
Antarctica? Absolutely. It certainly at the very least isn't yours, no matter how much you cry about that fact.
@156
Nov 26th, 2012 - 06:05 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Argentina should look inwards instead of being colonialist - this is the 21st century. You had your colonial expansion in the 19th and 20th centuries - time to forget about the Islands. We live in different times, amigo. No llores sobre la leche derramada!
Your colonialists got their hands on Patagonia and took the land off the Malpuches and their mates, but you didn't try hard enough when you had the chance with the Falklands. There's no point crying now - nearly 200 years later, because no body really cares what your neo-colonial country think. No llores sobre la leche derramada!
@157
Nov 26th, 2012 - 06:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0What did I say in 156???
#157
Nov 26th, 2012 - 06:11 pm - Link - Report abuse 01) Is it? If you are allowed to be delusional then so am I.
The UK is continually being berated for being colonialists with no current proof, so I am permitted to suspect the motives of your country looking at their past history and extrapolate possible behaviour in the future
2) You don't support it but your government thinks and acts otherwise
Correct Antarctica is not ours NOR yours, no matter how much YOU cry about it
@159
Nov 26th, 2012 - 06:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Then why include it with the Falklands, Georgia, etc? Not the same in the slightest.
Funny you state you can extrapolate future actions of Argentina based on past action? What's the statute of limitations on that? 10 years? 30 years? 100 years?
I say this because every solitary Brit objurgates profusely the fact that I bring up Britain's past behavior... they claim it is irrelevant today.
Why is it ok for you, but not for me to use history as a touchstone of assessing the future?
@160
Nov 26th, 2012 - 09:40 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Britain's past behaviour is about as relevant as Argentina's.
”160 Nozzy
Nov 26th, 2012 - 11:20 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Correction then, your CURRENT behaviour and attitudes indicate what we can expect in the near future.
You seem to think that there is no statute of limitations on the behaviour of the “Anglos” as almost all your posts indicate.
Nov 26th, 2012 - 11:29 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Why then is it wrong for me to look at the history of the Argentinian colonial record and current behaviour and extrapolate future actions based on this.
I have not said that YOU cannot bring up the UK's history but equally I have the right to bring up your not so pristine past and speculate, that given half a chance, your country MIGHT have more colonial ambitions - the Falklands and sub Antarctic islands being the obvious.
Do you deny that your government had plans to invade Chile just prior to the Falklands invasion ? This could still be on the back - burner !
'Argentine Navy short of resources and spare parts'
Nov 27th, 2012 - 10:03 pm - Link - Report abuse 0http://www.45enord.ca/2012/11/la-marine-argentine-a-court-de-moyens-et-de-pieces-de-rechanges/
A member of the G20 I wondeer where all the money is going?? I mean theres only so much BOTOX one can buy
Nov 28th, 2012 - 01:25 am - Link - Report abuse 0ARGENTINA ALWAYS THE VICTIM.
“Finally the submarine crews which operate from Mar del Plata need at least 190 days of immersion practice and in the last year only spent 19 hours submerged” More like a cork than a submarine !! LOL
Nov 28th, 2012 - 10:18 am - Link - Report abuse 0“”“”“”“”“”But I must ask a question: where the fcuk were the high command in all this? “”“”“”“”“”“
Nov 28th, 2012 - 05:50 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Here: http://www.aljazeera.com/video/americas/2012/11/20121128152444376725.html
and here: http://www.aljazeera.com/video/americas/2012/11/20121128152444376725.html
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”“”“I say this because every solitary Brit objurgates profusely the fact that I bring up Britain's past behavior... they claim it is irrelevant today.”“”
I dont.
'What' you bring up is often (usually) irrelevant or a deliberate side-track; the fact that you do so doesnt bother me the slightest though... I certainly dont criticise it severely.
However the same applies for everybody else old chap: if you are going to claim Brits are colonials then everybody else can claim Argentines are trying to be so now with the Falklands... and they'd be right...just as they'd be right that Britain was the master of colonialism... entirely true.
Bothers me> Not at all... because we dont do that any more. Indeed NOW we support self-determination whilst other countries try to PRETEND not to acting in a colonial fashion.... whilst ignoring the fact that their own country is a colonised area where the COLONISERS are the ruling party and the indigenous are of little value or representation.
This “problem” has never been, nor ever will be, overcome by Argentine supporters of Falklands colonisation, because Argentina cannot come to terms with its own past..... WITHOUT having to back-slide on most of its claims visa a vis the Falklands.
Its a rather nasty catch-22.
@197Anbar PERFECT,could not have put it better
Nov 28th, 2012 - 06:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0ARGENTINA ALWAYS THE VICTIM.!!
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