MercoPress. South Atlantic News Agency
The Times poll shows slim majority support UK exit from the European Union
Britain’s future in the European Union would rest on a knife-edge if a referendum was held immediately, according to a research poll carried out for The Times: 40% of voters back an UK exit while 37% want to keep ties with Brussels and 23% do not know. Read full article
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Disclaimer & comment rulesAnother bunch of dead-headed reporters who think they can guess the outcome of an EU In/Out referendum.
Jan 28th, 2013 - 10:47 am - Link - Report abuse 023% don't know! Or won't say, or are waiting for a campaign to help them decide, or - any one of thousands of reasons why people do not disclose to anyone what their voting intentions are.
NONE of my friends in the UK will vote to remain in the EU, NONE. So on my 'poll' it will be 100% vote to chuck the porkers out of our trough.
Just as 'scientific', just as valid. Just as rediculous.
The people of the UK voted to join and remain in a trading organisation. Since then we have seen more and more sovereign powers devolve from Westminster to Brussels. That will be crux of this referendum, if the vote is to leave, then the EU only has it's own Federal ambitions to blame.
Jan 28th, 2013 - 11:40 am - Link - Report abuse 0@1 ChrisR
Jan 28th, 2013 - 12:29 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Exactly. I know that I am undecided. If being in the EU is so beneficial to the UK then the politicians should explain why.
If they can't do that, then obviously being in the EU isn't beneficial to the UK and we should get out.
I personally think the whole EU system needs revamping, and unelected beaurocrats shouldn't be allowed to make and dictate policies that affect all the people of the EU. The need to be held accountable, and the European Parliament needs to become a proper parliament, with proper rules, regulations and powers.
Until that is done, the EU will be prone to corruption and the haemorrhaging of the tax payers money into stupid inane things that mean nothing, while important things are left to slide.
@3 For years I have been asking the same simple question of those “in favour” of remaining in the EU: Please list 10 reasons, understandable to and beneficial for, the ordinary British man and woman for Britain to be in the EU. Surely, at £53 million a day, that's not too much to ask. Can you answer it? Because no-one else ever has. The right to move and settle freely? Because that's what's going to let all those Bulgarians and Romanians in. And how many Brits actually WANT to go and live elsewhere? Travel maybe, but live? I hear a lot of those that “chose” Spain now want to “choose” Britain! What else is there? Free health care and welfare benefits wherever you are? No. That's why so many head for Britain. How about trade? The lifeblood of Britain. And I know how the stats are compiled. They are a EU-slanted lie. Ever heard of the Antwerp-Rotterdam Effect? British exports intended for, say, China may go through Antwerp or Rotterdam container ports. Where they are counted as exports to the EU! And British exports OUTSIDE the EU already account for more of our trade. Take account of “the EFFECT” and British exports to the EU are more like 25-30%. And if we sold them nothing, there are still 179 other countries to trade with. How about your food and energy bills? Food bills are inflated because of the CAP, for inefficient French farmers, and energy bills are inflated because EU rules made it easier for EU companies to buy our suppliers. And now our money goes to their shareholders! Immigration? There are EU policies. And an EU deal with India could see another 200,000 Indian migrants to the UK. And when you read the europhiles saying that Churchill supported a United States of Europe, he didn't. The furthest he got was the Council of Europe. “We have our own dream and our own task. We are with Europe, but not of it. We are linked but not combined. We are interested and associated but not absorbed.” Now, why are you undecided?
Jan 28th, 2013 - 01:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 04 Conqueror
Jan 28th, 2013 - 01:25 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Do you know what a paragraph is?
Can not see how anyone can make an educated Yes or No at the moment until all the facts of the bennefits of being in or out are shown to us,ofcourse there are the people who will vote no whatever.
Jan 28th, 2013 - 02:24 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@6 andy65
Jan 28th, 2013 - 02:32 pm - Link - Report abuse 0True, just like there are people who will vote yes, even if it was proved that the EU was the worst thing to happen since reality TV.
Some people never learn.
However, when the original referendum was put forwards in the 1970's the government sold it to the population that the removal of trade barriers would mean cheaper food. I think we're still waiting for this cheaper food to appear.
But never once in the '70's campaign did they mention a European Union, or the handing over of sovereign rights to a group of unelected beaureacrats.
No did they mention the cost membership would cost the UK, with only a pittance in return.
Now I'm not saying that being in the EU is completely detrimental to the UK, but the politicians appear to have gone completely out of their way not to explain WHY being in the EU is beneficial.
Therefore, the general public only see the bad things.
A referendum would at least make the politicians put the facts on the table, and give people the choice that they didn't give them in the 1970's.
Face it, the EU itself needs to change, and stop being a means of the UK apparently supporting the economies of other countries, because Germany and France were so keen on a common currency that they let idealism override common sense.
@3 LEPRecon (#)
Jan 28th, 2013 - 02:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Jan 28th, 2013 - 12:29 pm
The only thing they ever come up with that is difficult to argue with but by no means impossible is “it has bought peaceable and stability”.
Well I think not. NATO brought peace and there is nothing stable about the EU and it certainly hasn't brought prosperity. Not to the UK at any rate. So by “brought peace”, I think they mean it is a shabby protection racket. So long as you tow the line you won't get duffed up.
Less than half of our trade goes to Europe and we we have a £190bn deficit with the EU. We have a £21bn surplus with the rest of the world and it would be more if we were not bound by EU trade laws and were able to make our own FTAs.
Also, there is nothing to stop us co-operating on joint ventures such as ESA, NATO etc from outside the EU. It has worked up to now and it will continue to work.
Here. Have a butchers. This is as good a place as any to start:
http://www.betteroffout.net/
Like them on Facebook and you will get all of thier news feeds.
My mind was made up years ago but all I hear from Europhiles is insults and threats which only stiffens my resolve quite frankly.
Have you noticed contrys like Poland who now put down The UK as being alone and out of touch with the rest of The EU .Poland also voted for a RISE in The EU budget simply because it receives so much more than it puts in The Whole EU project needs looking at and changing,I for one will be voting YES only if certain reforms are made.
Jan 28th, 2013 - 05:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@5 What's it matter to you? If you've a problem following it, you can run your finger along under each line. Take it slow, so you don't lose your place. That'll be a use for one of your hands. Could your “brain” cope with paragraphs?
Jan 28th, 2013 - 06:24 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@7 If you can remember the campaign in the 70s, you might remember that a big “selling” point was the “bogeyman ploy”. The number of countries that would “stand together” against a Soviet armoured invasion across the north German plain. And who had anything with which to “stand together”. The same people. The British, the Americans, possibly the French. The Canadians. What could “the EU” have done? Nothing. Remember the recent Libyan conflict? Remember how Van Rompuy leapt to his feet to trumpet the “contribution” of the EU? And quietly got told to shut up and sit down. Because the EU did nothing. We shouldn't take all the credit. NATO did most. The British, the Americans, the Canadians, the Swedes, the French. What did Italy do? It whinged, it kept threatening to withdraw use of its airbases, it made the “refugee” situation worse. There is NOTHING good about the EU. It's a shyster trick. Notice how much the “eurocrats” get out of it? MEPs are paid over £83,000 pa plus expenses. British MPs are paid £65,738 pa plus expenses. British MPs aren't my favourite people but why would an MEP get an extra £18,000? What do they DO?
@8 Obviously a “eurosceptic”. Or as I like to call us “normal people”. Where was “the EU” between 1945 and 1975? “Peace” was bought by British and American troops, and certain British-related others. The French “withdrew” in 1966. Fat lot of good they are anyway. Why can't people see beyond their holiday “on the Continent”?
@9 Remember all the Poles in the UK? Imagine the effect on Poland if they all had to go “home”. Wasn't it a couple of years ago that the Romanian prime minister praised his people for going to the UK? Relieving pressure on his economy. Sending money, including benefit payments, to Romania?
Angela Merkel
Jan 28th, 2013 - 07:39 pm - Link - Report abuse 0leave him alone,
we are comming out, and no amount of crying on his shoulders will alter this fact,
get losty
Out out out, get us out of that mess, why the hellfire we have to wait 5 f-ing years!
Jan 29th, 2013 - 12:10 am - Link - Report abuse 0The problem is, voters won't educate themselves so they learn from the likes of the pro-EU BBC. If they bothered to learn the facts, they'd vote out, too. Things like:
Jan 29th, 2013 - 01:20 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Myth: We can renegotiate the terms of membership
Fact: No we can't. Illegal under EU treaties including Lisbon. Would require treaty change and agreement by other 26 members. Won't happen, will it?
Myth: Millions of jobs lost if we leave
Fact: Based on research in 2000 - EU membership created 3m jobs, mostly in trade. The same researchers debunked Clegg by saying that UK has a £39bn a year trade deficit with EU (we buy more than we sell!) so trade wouldn't be affected, therefore, neither would jobs. Would Germany stop selling us BMW's? Of course not!
Myth: We need membership to have access to the single market
Fact: Free trade agreements with China means they have the same access we do, but it doesn't cost them £53m a day! Many more countries have a similar agreement
Myth: If we're not in it, we have no say on laws it makes part 1
Fact: If we're not in it, the laws won't apply to us anyway! Apply laws for single market only on products/services going there, nothing more. Same as China, for example.
Myth: If we're not in it, we have no say on laws it makes part 2
Fact: Norway has more say than UK on EU law and they're not in the EU. They help shape IMF, WTO, UN, and a load more organisations laws where they have a vote, that in turn shape EU laws. EU has one vote in these fora, which means UK has 1/27th of a vote! We have less influence on the world stage within than we would without!
Myth: UK Government is cleaning up energy supply with wind turbines
Fact: EU law is forcing the government into using wind turbines which are only on at most 25% of the time. Big scam involving continental turbine manufacturers (Spain, mostly). It adds £300 to our annual energy bills, for absolutely no gain.
There are far more lies and scare stories like these that are easily disproved. Have a look on Google.
Ha ha ha
Jan 29th, 2013 - 07:12 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Seems Britons will be out of EU faster than Greece and without EU bailout.
sounds good to me,
Jan 29th, 2013 - 07:48 pm - Link - Report abuse 0greece always was a slippery customer.
#14 Danyberger - why you laughing? Most Brits want to be out of the EU.
Jan 29th, 2013 - 11:01 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Surely, if you don't like the UK, you should be wanting us to stay IN the EU. Believe me, it's far worse!
Besides, the EU won't let Greece leave... Greece cooked its books to get into the Euro and the EU let them. If they left, the EU would be shown to be wrong - if the current crisis hasn't done that already!
Sure, sure When are you departing?
Jan 30th, 2013 - 02:13 am - Link - Report abuse 0Commenting for this story is now closed.
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