MercoPress. South Atlantic News Agency
Fraga: “the worst defeat for Kirchnerism since 2003; three out of four votes went to the opposition”
Argentina’s Sunday primary was the worst election result for Kirchnerism since they first arrived to office in 2003, almost thirty percentage points below the 54% of Cristina Fernandez re-election in 2011 writes Rosendo Fraga, Argentine historian and political analyst. Read full article
Comments
Disclaimer & comment rulesTurkeys coming home to roost!!!
Aug 13th, 2013 - 03:22 am - Link - Report abuse 0Oh look, all that screeching on about the Falkland Islands hasn't done TMBOA any good.
Aug 13th, 2013 - 03:42 am - Link - Report abuse 0Looks like the people of Argentina care more about more pressing matters, like the economy, corruption, security and the infrastructure of Argentina.
All those missed opportunities to improve Argentina instead of improving the health of her bank balance with the Argentine people's money.
So the big question is: What will TMBOA do next?
a. Accept defeat graciously (odds 1,000,000/1)
b. Refuse to accept defeat and be forced out by the Senate (odds 100/1)
c. Accuse the evil British and/or USA of manipulating the results by funding the opposition (odds 4/1)
d. Persuade her new 'buddy' in charge of Argentina's military to take control in her name, for the 'sake' of the boliviarian 'cause' until the people of Argentina learn to vote CORRECTLY (odds 2/1)
e. A combination of b, c, and d. (odds on favourite).
Any takers?
I'm crying for you CFK.
Aug 13th, 2013 - 04:16 am - Link - Report abuse 0#1
Aug 13th, 2013 - 04:24 am - Link - Report abuse 0You beat me to it. Exact wording, too!
@2 LEP
Aug 13th, 2013 - 05:01 am - Link - Report abuse 0b, c and d but also amend the constitution to reflect how much she believes the electorate love her deep deep down, so that only offspring of the incumbent president can stand to be president.
I thought these were primaries!
Aug 13th, 2013 - 05:39 am - Link - Report abuse 0Why are they talking about these results as if it was an election? Don't primaries help to choose the candidate for a party?
No Anglotino, these where for the senate and the other house (can't remember the name for it in Argentina)
Aug 13th, 2013 - 05:56 am - Link - Report abuse 0“Likewise great surprises and defeats for the Victory Front were experienced in what until Sunday were considered ‘safe havens’ such as the provinces of Chubut, San Juan, La Rioja, Jujuy.”
Aug 13th, 2013 - 07:02 am - Link - Report abuse 0Hey Yapper, El Think Chubut, Patagonia, Argentina.
What's going on? Why has this come to pass?
When the taxi drivers start complaining, you know that everyone is starting to wake up. All she has left is the welfare class, and the mentally ill.
Aug 13th, 2013 - 07:09 am - Link - Report abuse 0All she has left is the welfare class, and the mentally ill
Aug 13th, 2013 - 07:25 am - Link - Report abuse 0That's a HUGE voting class in Argentina!
HUGE!
@10. the results illustrated by this article prove otherwise.
Aug 13th, 2013 - 07:48 am - Link - Report abuse 0having reading comprehension issues are we?
AN EXPECTABLE MISCHIEVOUS LECTURE.
Aug 13th, 2013 - 08:02 am - Link - Report abuse 0Rosendo fraga is a very prestigious and smart political analist, however the furious rejection that he feels for kirchnerism doesn't let him sometimes make serious political lectures.
It's important to indicate some very important detaills, while it is true that the government must take note of the result of this election, it's also true that fraga, and all the rest of political analists know that it's a very wrong idea to compare a presidential election, with a legislative one, espcially in a country like argentina, which is not a parlamentary democracy like the u. k., in fact, it's a presidential democracy.
On the other hand, every political analist know that people often change their votes in legislative elections.
Beside, it's not honest, to omit that the front for the victory was the most voted politic party around the country, while it is true that it lost in the province of buenos aires, for just 6 points ,in a place which represents the 38 of voters, it's also true that front for the victory was the most voted party around the country, in fact it got the 27,31% of votes, followed by massa's party which got the 13,54%of votes, the national results of all the rest of politic parties were insignifficant.
Not many parties around the world can enjoy the privilege of being the most voted party, after having been in office for 10 years, this is an aspects that we can't ignore.
On the other hand, what was also omitted in this report, is that if c. f. k's party repeats in october the same election than last sunday, it won't lose deputies, it just might lose a few senators, it means that she will continue rulling the country without signifficant parlamentary obstacles, which is what really matters.
I think these results display a very good start for real change in Argentina. People are people regardless of where they live and the number one concern will always be themselves, a job, food on the table and a roof over their heads. Kirchners where different when they made their appearance. Little did the Argentine's think that they were as corrupt as they are. The best thing that happened was Nasty Nestor dropping dead and leaving a criminally inept Christina in charge that ultimately proved her not only a brunette bimbo, but criminally incompetent as well. I hope for the Argentine's that these results carry over into October.....and ultimately they make Christina and her croonies and hunchmen pay for sacking the country and bringing it to ruins.
Aug 13th, 2013 - 08:05 am - Link - Report abuse 0The pendulum is swinging and about time
Aug 13th, 2013 - 08:08 am - Link - Report abuse 0@12 fair point. Parties in power ALWAYS get hammered at midterms (or in the UK, council elections). It's a chance for people to register their disquiet on any number of issues. From the people I speak to in Argentina, most of them will still vote Victory Front. The old, because they have excellent pesnions, the young (becuase the old tell them how much worse things have been in Argentina) and some middle aged with a social consience. Many people say that they will vote VF because there is no candidate for opposition and, as such, they do not know what they stand for apart from being anti-VF. We'll have to see but I am always quite sceptical regarding mid-term voting patterns.
Aug 13th, 2013 - 08:26 am - Link - Report abuse 0@6
Aug 13th, 2013 - 09:22 am - Link - Report abuse 0You're right....These were just primaries, however only one party UNEN had candidates up for election, all the other parties had already selected their candidates making this an exercise in futility!!!
@12
Good spin on the results, essentially this is CFK's version of the events but the fact remains that the FPV went from 54% down to 26% of the popular vote.....a huge defeat, even worse than Nestor's in 2009
Even though FPV are still the most popular single party in Arg., all it takes is for any of the other opposition parties to ally with Massa & your scenario of maintaining seats in Congress in October is doomed
Essentially Kirchnerismo's time is finished & after October CFK will be a lame duck president.....time for all those corrupt politicians to start jumping on the Massa bandwagon!!!
Your CommentArgentina is according to the National Constitution is a federal republic but, by the actions of peronist governments, this has been deformed.
Aug 13th, 2013 - 09:47 am - Link - Report abuse 0It is nowadays a republic in which the head of state concentrates almost all the power in her hands with the exception of the Judicial Power (CFK unsuccessfully tried to change months ago) and the indefinitely re-relection (it was in CFK plans).
As a result of this accumulation of power the head of state controls almost everything important to become a strong central power. CFK handles the budget as if it was her money. CFK controls and makes decisions on all subsidies not only to the poor, but also to large corporations that depend on state funds. CFK controls the Central Bank, its reserves and its monetary emission. CFK controls the money from retirement funds, takes the 2/3 of the money of agricultural exports, controls and decides how much money each province receives from the federal funds and, avoiding provincial governors and directly sends money to the mayors of “municipios” of each province to increase control over them.
So, it’s no hard to understand how is that her followers are, just adding all the votes, the most voted ones. But checking province by province her retreat is quite evident and showed a tendency.
The peronist party was created as a “populist movement” with no ideological boundaries so the fact that in the main province the peronist candidates got most of the votes doesn’t mean anything since Massa got 35%, CFK 25% and De Narvaez another 10% and they all have their own ambitions.
Anyway, the economical decisions made during the last two years were designed to improve the country situation until this election but they are unsustainable so, after the elections the situation will be even worse.
Summing up, this elections showed that the peronist party is still the strongest one but, also, that CFK light is this turning off.
@14
Aug 13th, 2013 - 09:58 am - Link - Report abuse 0Shame its not an axe!
The pendulum is swinging... but towards where?
Aug 13th, 2013 - 10:06 am - Link - Report abuse 0Who knows... but it's not swinging towards Argentina befriending the North again!
@19 Yes, yes, we know you don't have any friends and don't want anyone else to have any.
Aug 13th, 2013 - 10:52 am - Link - Report abuse 0With a different government, a positive attitude to trade and an understanding that no country can prosper alone, Argentines might yet start to reap the rewards of their abundant resources.
The end for CFK is not going to be pretty.
@6:
Aug 13th, 2013 - 11:00 am - Link - Report abuse 0Anglo, who is a pommie bastard, doesn't know what primaries are or their significance. This lack of knowledge doesn't stop him from commenting while pretending to being an Australian and giving Australia a bad name.
12 axel arg (#)
Aug 13th, 2013 - 11:12 am - Link - Report abuse 0Aug 13th, 2013 - 08:02 am
“... in fact it [FpV] got the 27,31% of votes, followed by massa's party which got the 13,54%of votes···”
Axel, CFK and her minions will crucify you for this comment, the FpV got 27,31% of the vote in all 23 districts whereas Massa only ran in the Province of Buenos Aires and beat the FpV by 6 percentage points!!!!!!!!!
Overall the FpV lost 72,61% of the vote in the 23 districts!!!!!!!!!
@19:
Aug 13th, 2013 - 11:31 am - Link - Report abuse 0To the right, or at least to the center where more opportunities will come. The peoples of SA are beginning to wake up and the Bolivarians will be left behind to lay on the carp they created.
#19 perhaps tinman and hahon should not have put their knee pads on talking to the US Senators? Do you really think they care are Argentina's crying concerns?
Aug 13th, 2013 - 12:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0#22 That's some impressive ass kicking Massa handed the FvP. Do you suppose they got waxed because:
A- they outlawed U$
B-they lost control of inflation
C-They are restricting imports
D-there are shortage of goods because of economic ineptitude
E-Crime is seriously increasing
F-they are pervasively corrupt
G-unemployment is growing
H-all the above
They even lost in tobias' Mendoza
24 Captain Poppy (#)
Aug 13th, 2013 - 12:30 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Aug 13th, 2013 - 12:26 pm
Without a doubt “H”, they really have fucked up, thank God!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Rosendo Fraga as Mariano Grondona, Andres Oppenheimer hate Peronism (Kirchnerismo). Your comment is totally biased. Understandably, working for clarin media monopoly and the nation and supported state terrorism in Argentina and CNN. Fraga is a right-wing analyst and Pro market (colonialist).
Aug 13th, 2013 - 12:31 pm - Link - Report abuse 0He's desperate and is predicting the end of Kircnerismo since 2003. Prophesies the end of the world and nothing ever happens.
12 axel arg
Excellent analysis.
The British forumers (lying on their most when they say they are British and Argentineans are actually hate their own country), underestimate the ability of Cristina and Argentine and Latin American village that accompanies it. She has given ample evidence of greatly strengthened into a temporary situation unfavorably and finally emerge victorious with clean and true arguments. The example is in the elections of 2009 and 2011.
The main error distinguer Rosendo Fraga is not different contexts and settings of a parliamentary election and a presidential election.
Unfortunately As Andres Oppenheimer and Mariano Grondona, Rosendo Fraga has much hate Peronism and makes you lose clarity and objectivity in their analysis. That's why we are very discredited journalists throughout Latin America to support the alignment end neoliberal economies that supported the doctrine of national security and state terrorsimo sequelae.
They are very criticized in their country because they support national corporations and Foreign mediatic.
Mail: face1354@hotmail.com
Can anyone translate the rubbish written by raul2?????????
Aug 13th, 2013 - 12:37 pm - Link - Report abuse 0It seems to be a diatribe against Rosendo Fraga, Andrés Oppenheimer, Mariano Grondona and CNN, which is quite funny when you take into accout that Fraga, Grondona and Oppenheimer are considered coservatives and CNN is considered progressive!!!!!!!!!!
Simon68....I know you're in Argentina.....as is my extended family. I really hope this gains momentum and starts the process of change for the best.
Aug 13th, 2013 - 12:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0buena suerte y mis mejores deseos
28 Captain Poppy (#)
Aug 13th, 2013 - 12:56 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Aug 13th, 2013 - 12:47 pm
Gracias, Captain, I think that the process, once started, will be unstoppable!!!!!!
I hope that is not just wishfull thinking!!!!!!!!
No matter how things are....good or bad, they can't take hope away.
Aug 13th, 2013 - 01:25 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I have listened lots of CK fans acusing other fellow countrymen of being “cipallos”, I have already been despised and acused of being that several times but I must admit that I have never read that ”The British forumers (lying on their most when they say they are British and are Argentineans that actually hate their own country)”.
Aug 13th, 2013 - 02:20 pm - Link - Report abuse 0This time a CFK fan surprised me for the very first time in my life.
@26
Aug 13th, 2013 - 04:24 pm - Link - Report abuse 0”The British forumers (lying on their most when they say they are British and Argentineans are actually hate their own country), underestimate the ability of Cristina and Argentine and Latin American village that accompanies ”
Raul 2
On the contrary, I do not estimate the power of CFK to assist in Argentina self degenerating, and welcome it.
And obviously bad mid term election results are common worldwide.
While it is unfair on the Argentines, at a time when the Falkland Islanders have a chance to develop their oil industry/associated infrastructure to serve them well in to the future, CFK is the WORST president Argentina could possibly have and will go down in history as the Argentine ,who by her bullying, most convinced the MLAs to get off their butts and challenge the inaccurate comments regularly distributed by Argentina, and subsequently placed the Falkland Islands ever further from Argentina's reach.
Menem and Di Tella underestimated the intelligence of the islanders by sending them 'Winnie the Pooh' books (not realising education is better in FI) but whilst their cooperation was never going to convince the islanders to be Argentine, they had a great opportunity to benefit commercially from the Islands, rather than the isolation CFK has now ensured-which has earned them-JACK SQUAT
At this crucial time in the islands history, CFK is helping them by making the Argentine armed forces ever more impotent, messing up the economy and most usefully, goading the Falkland Island politicians into correcting the erroneous history that Argentina has banded around for the last 50 years, and also the myth that the UN Charter does not apply to the Falkland Islands (misproved by many of the excellently researched comments on these posts).
It will be therefore pivotal assistance to the Falkland Islands gaining more financial and political independence if CFK does well at the election and hopefully gains a third term.
As regarding “32 Pete Bog” comment I must admit that having an enemy such as an Argentina ruled by CFK is not an issue at all. I always think about that. FI you are quite lucky..being against an Argentina in default, with no credit, lacking credibility, with 30 of inflation, without reserves, without defense forces, isolated from the World....quite a cheese to bite.
Aug 13th, 2013 - 06:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 0In addition, regarding the comment of “Axel” that “it's a very wrong idea to compare a presidential election, with a legislative one”. The fact is that from now until the end of his second (and TG her last term) there will be just one election, a parlamentary one. There won't be any future election with CFK trying to extend her mandate. The National Constitution bans her for doing that.
Finally, he wrote that “it won't lose deputies, it just might lose a few senators, it means that she will continue rulling the country without signifficant parlamentary obstacles”. I do agree, she w she started...ill keep most of her power, in fact she have been one of the Argentine presidents with more concentration of power...but she failed to control de inflaion, to control the crime rate, to make the country grow, to honour the country obligations, to make the reserves increase....a total failure
You can add zucchini to the list of stuff Rgs can't get any longer
Aug 14th, 2013 - 10:43 am - Link - Report abuse 0It's like they're living in a world before refrigeration...
Their future looks mighty bleak
SIMON68. RAUL2. PGERMAN.
Aug 14th, 2013 - 11:31 am - Link - Report abuse 0SIMON: I don't deny the relevancy of the province of buenos aires, which represents the 38% of voters, but i can't omit either that massa won for just 5,5% points, do you think that such an exigous victory leads to the so called end of cicle, like some idiots often repeat?.
On the other hand, the political lecture of this election can't exclude the results got in all the rest of the country, accept it or not, after 10 years of being in office, f. p. v. is still the most voted politic party in argentina, in fact, if you see the results of the all the rest of politic parties, you'll see they were pathetic.
Any serious political analist would never compare a parlamentary election, with a presidential one, due to people often change their vote in a legislative election, in contrary to what happens in a presidential one, where there is much more polarization, because argentina is a presidential democracy.
Anyway, the government must take note of this result, because if c. f. k's party repeats the same results than last sunday, she will be able to continue rulling the country, without signifficant parlamentary obstacles, however it's always better to increase the number of officialist deputies and senators.
PGERMAN: A total failure?, so, according to your opinion c. f. k. hasn't done anything right in these 6 years. This is evident that you have no more than the tipicall ignorant and too partial view, which is characteristic of empires, in relation to argentina, and to all the rest of latin america, this is the reason why debates are always so difficlut in this forum, especially when people like you, who don't have any intellectual honesty post their opinions.
RAUL: This is evident that although rosendo fraga is a smart political analist, he can't be a serious detractor of kirchnerism, because of the lack of intellectual honesty that he sometimes has.
Zucchini? OMG.......that stuff grows like rabbits prolificate. They are almost like a damn weed. And that stuff handles cool weather. Next they will run out of dirt.
Aug 14th, 2013 - 12:27 pm - Link - Report abuse 035 axel arg (#)
Aug 14th, 2013 - 01:02 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Aug 14th, 2013 - 11:31 am
I repeat, axel, the electorate voted in 73,7% AGAINST the government, in words of one syllable, a HUGE MAJORITY OF ARGENTINES voted AGAINST the government, capisce?????????????
He's working his ass off spinning. Amazing thing can be can with numbers. If one sliced a pie in 10 pieces and took a bite of 9 slices equaling to 5% of each slice, one can say they had 90% of the true. True, because they had a piece of 9 of 10 slices. However the reality remains that each bite was only 5% of the slice. The reality is they had 5% of 90% of a whole…..4.5%. It’s the same thing with elections and results……they try to spin to their advantage
Aug 14th, 2013 - 01:56 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Axel Arg,
Aug 14th, 2013 - 04:38 pm - Link - Report abuse 0It is more than evident that the Government of CFK is a total failure.
Just someone full of hate, anger and fanaticism can deny it. Argentine Governments are, generally, very poor ones and really a failure for their country. They have led Argentina, a country with plenty of resources, to be an international economic pariah.
We could discuss hours on the statistics that mark a new economic failure of Argentina but it would be very difficult to reach a conclusion because most of the country official statistics are distorted (inflation, unemployment, growth, central bank reserves, etc.). The Government has worked a lot to distort each statistic making impossible an cool analysis between two people who think differently.
The real indisputable facts are reflected in the last issuance of sovereign bonds (Cecin and Baade) of Argentina that have raised far less than 15 million when the Government stated a goal of U$D 4 billion. Uruguay issued bonds, almost the same time, with the aim of raising U$D 2 billion and achieved to U$D 3.4 billion. Uruguay is a country the size of an Argentine province but it’s ruled by credible, honest and capable people. Argentina, to the contrary, is a country governed by an oligarchy of corrupt incompetents.
Argentina last year received only 1.4% of foreign investment of Latam while smaller countries such as Chile, or Peru, received three/four times that percentage.
So, the failure of CFK as president is a fact. Don’t blame any Empire, CFK did it all on their own.
39. THe FDI figure is a bit misleading and even WORSE than what you posted since Int'l corps can't x-fer U$ out of the country. What they are FORCED to keep there is then counted towards FDI even though it is really not an investment.
Aug 14th, 2013 - 05:51 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The real FDI is probably negative.
As if driving foreigners out of one's country was actually BAD.
Aug 14th, 2013 - 07:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I hope you still think that when GM FORD and DOW pull out.
Aug 14th, 2013 - 08:07 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Mendoza has none of them what do I care.
Aug 14th, 2013 - 08:12 pm - Link - Report abuse 0#41 you're right tobias, it is a good thing driving foreigners out......unless of course you are not smart enough, wealthy enough or talented to drill for your own oil.....no? You prefer candles, fireplaces and horse and buggies?
Aug 14th, 2013 - 08:15 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The technology can stay, the foreigners can leave.
Aug 14th, 2013 - 08:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 045. Even if the equipment stayed Rgs are too dumb and lazy to figure out how to use it properly.
Aug 14th, 2013 - 08:54 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You could not even learn how to great people in Spanish living in-country multiple years, and you are calling others dumb.
Aug 14th, 2013 - 09:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Even parrots speak more words and gorillas understand more vocab in 5 years than you managed to process.
I speak to my maid in spanish all the time...
Aug 14th, 2013 - 09:20 pm - Link - Report abuse 0BTW a language degree is pretty worthless I pay U$1 page for translation
you better learn to clean pools
#45 tobi sucking your mommas tits again? Technology goes with the foreigners......at least you indirectly admit Argentina is too stupid, broke to drill for oil.
Aug 14th, 2013 - 09:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Yankee, they have many with language degrees here...and Liberal Arts, they are working at McD's....Wendy's
Yep, you can work in a hotel, show apts, McDonalds, nice restaurants. All serving foreigners.
Aug 14th, 2013 - 09:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 0All minimum wage or a 6 mos contract
Doomed I tells ya doomed
Did you see inflation is creeping up, I remember somebody said the last 1/4 of the year it will skyrocket and end up closer to 40% than 30%, wait was that me?
Yes, yes it was
I study languages on my own time, as I can teach myself entirely. I have never gone to any actual classes. It will be a very coveted future resource to my career, as people will always prefer to deal with those that speak their language and not ignorant monolinguals. Reason why no one in the world hires Americans any more.
Aug 14th, 2013 - 09:46 pm - Link - Report abuse 0How can you hope for Arg isolation and at the same time be dependant on Foreigners for your career?
Aug 14th, 2013 - 10:38 pm - Link - Report abuse 0BTW lots of people hire Americans not so many hire arrogant Rgs who can't do math nor understand economics.
Proficiency in languages are just about meaningless nowadays. Yeah its nice to speak to someone in your native tongue but in the end just about anyone who can buy or sell something of value or has a mediocre degree speaks English. I've traveled all over the world and never had a problem communicating.
Yeah, I'm going to follow your well-informed opinion.
Aug 14th, 2013 - 11:20 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I can hope for isolation but leave it up to individuals to decide what they want to do. I have never said I would forbid individuals from travelling or making business on their own, I just want the government to have no interaction with useless foreign governments.
My goal is not to communicate. If that's what you want, take your English and your little smart phone translator and you are set. Neither of those are of any use in what I will be doing.
such good lols
Aug 15th, 2013 - 02:12 am - Link - Report abuse 0AND analysis too!
yankeebee, I haven't seen anything mentioned about soy since articles saying there was the biggest crash in 30 years. What is ur take on thaylt?
Tobi you really are funny. Are you studying language to be the next great communicator? You make the most outrageous statements fr someone who has never been out of mendoza let alone argentina. It's a big amazing world out there. Unlatch and explore it.
Aug 15th, 2013 - 05:22 am - Link - Report abuse 0You are studying language but not to communicate.
Aug 15th, 2013 - 08:01 am - Link - Report abuse 0OK
I wish you all the best in your future endeavors.
Tobias, I forgot to congratulate you on having a de luxe candidate for national deputy.
Aug 15th, 2013 - 09:00 am - Link - Report abuse 0It is really good to see the revival of the UCR at the hands of such a deserving person.
Viva Julio Cobos!!!!!!!
SIMON68: This is evident that you don't understand anything about politic. If you are a fun of the so called end of cicle theory, i just can tell you that you are commiting the same stupid mistake that many detractors committed in 2009, when they predicted the end of kirchnerism, did you forget that year?, what happened in 2011 finally?.
Aug 16th, 2013 - 09:31 am - Link - Report abuse 0If you have no capacity to understand that any serious political analist would never compare the behaviour of people in a parlamentary election, and in a presidential one, then it's a waste of time to continue discussing with you. Beside, you don't need to be a fanatic kirchnerist in order to realise that it's a very mischievous lecture to argue about the so called end of cicle, just because c. f. k's party didn't win in the most important provinces of the country, don't forget that she has still two more years to continue rulling argentina. If you, and many other detractors of kichnerism keep on underestimating c. f. k., i just can tell you that you'll have to make a new critic of your own posture in the future.
PGERMAN: I don't pretend most people in this forum think like me, because this is evident that we have deep ideological differences, however contrary opinions shouldn't invalid all the achievements that workers could get in the last ten years thanks to the policies of kirchnerism, i understand that maybe for you and for many other people here, c. f. k's policies are just cheap populism, however, what you ignore, is that for many people those ahievements changed their lives. Anyway i don't deny that her government committed mistakes, beside there are also some negative aspects, and i am always disposed to discuss about them, however what is really misserable, is to invalid all what she has done in behalf of workers, just because you don't agree on her ideas, thats' why it's always so difficult to debate here.
Is axle grease a troll bot?
Aug 16th, 2013 - 05:15 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@58
Aug 19th, 2013 - 12:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Axel
I agree with you, CFK should win, or Timmerman, I don't care.
It's good for the Falkland Islanders future.
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