MercoPress. South Atlantic News Agency
Falklands ‘under British sovereignty since 1765’, says Commissioner Drake
British sovereignty of the Falkland Islands dates to 1765 and although Britain did not establish a permanent presence until 1833, it formally protested at sporadic Argentine attempts to assert sovereignty, points out Howard Drake, British High Commissioner to Canada. Read full article
Comments
Disclaimer & comment rulesWhy are Spanish and Argentine claims to easily refuted?
Aug 20th, 2013 - 10:03 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Comment removed by the editor.
Aug 20th, 2013 - 10:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Great words from HC Drake! As a Canadian, I'm very happy to have a staunch defender of the Falklands on board as High Commissioner to Canada.
Aug 20th, 2013 - 10:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Sorry about the photo with just our Canadian Prime Minister Harper, taken by Prime Ministers Office. Here is link to HC Drake shaking hands with PM Harper at that photo opportunity:
http://wpmedia.o.canada.com/2013/06/harper_20130607_27236095.jpg
http://wpmedia.o.canada.com/2013/06/harper_20130607_27236095.jpg
Another ignorant. Otherwise, he call should him a liar.
Aug 20th, 2013 - 10:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@3 JohnN
Aug 20th, 2013 - 10:46 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I think that is the crux of Argentina's (and Spain's) problems; they don't have very effective spokespeople or representatives pushing their cause.
Argentine government officials and especially their president come across as slightly manic and ill-prepared whereas UK counterparts always seem to speak with more gravitas and authority.
@4 ICJ, Malvi, take it to the ICJ if your case is so good. Oh, yes. You won't. Because it's... not.
Aug 20th, 2013 - 10:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Britain has never been really confident over its claim to the islands. In 1829, the Duke of Wellington observed: “I have perused the papers respecting the Falkland Islands. It is not clear to me that we have ever possessed the sovereignty of all these islands.”
Aug 20th, 2013 - 11:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@7 ICJ, Marcos... Why not?
Aug 20th, 2013 - 11:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@ 7 Marcos Alejandro
Aug 20th, 2013 - 11:35 pm - Link - Report abuse 0For your information: 1829 was 4 years BEFORE 1833.
Beside, you have been shown time and again that what you quote is taken out of context and you and others have been shown the contex.
In a demonstration of 'viveza criolla' you repeat the same nonsense over and over again.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viveza_criolla
The Duke of Wellington observed: “I have perused the papers respecting the Falkland Islands. It is not clear to me that we have ever possessed the sovereignty of all these islands.”
Aug 20th, 2013 - 11:53 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Marcos Alejandro has been shown time and again that his quote is taken out of context; he has been shown the context, yet he continues with his lies.
Aug 21st, 2013 - 12:11 am - Link - Report abuse 0One is reminded of the socalled “La mano de Dios” where some Argentine “football”player scored using his hand.
1829!
Aug 21st, 2013 - 12:21 am - Link - Report abuse 0PMSL.
Means nothing. Still not Argentine 184 years later.
4 Malvinense 1833 (#)
Aug 21st, 2013 - 01:01 am - Link - Report abuse 0Aug 20th, 2013 - 10:44 pm
Report abuse
Another ignorant. Otherwise, he call should him a liar..........
“Erm....”he call should him a liar”......Ahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa...LMAO..!!
The past is the past, what matters is the present and the future. The question of sovereignty lies with the people who live there, be it Gibraltar or the Falklands. That doesn't mean they will always be safe, we should always be prepared for war.
Aug 21st, 2013 - 02:35 am - Link - Report abuse 0“in 1833, Britain asked a recently established Argentine garrison to leave, which it did without loss of life on either side. Britain has administered the Islands peacefully ever since, apart from the few months in 1982 when Argentina illegally occupied them”.
Aug 21st, 2013 - 02:54 am - Link - Report abuse 0Even that is overstating the Argentine case:
“in 1833, Britain asked a to leave, which it did without loss of life on either side. Britain has administered the Islands peacefully ever since, apart from the few months in 1982 when Argentina illegally occupied them”.
Thats better!
All of what happened prior to March 2013 is irrelevant, never mind the fact that most of the RG claim is based on unprovable myths and lies.
Aug 21st, 2013 - 03:15 am - Link - Report abuse 0At the end of last year the UN GA issued a resolution 67/134 which, in paragraph 7(c), re-iterated what similar, annually issued, resolutions had said for several years. That is that the populations of the NSGT's have a right to self-determination. The Islanders exercised that right earlier this year with an almost unanimous decision to maintain the status quo regarding their political situation.
RG trolls please note the word 'populations', many RG supporters contend that as irrelevant, non-mandatory UNGA resolution 2065 referred to 'populations' then the UN Charter did not apply to the Islanders as it (the Charter) referred to 'peoples'. UNGA 67/134, and its similar predecessors, dispels that myth. Just to add to the irony of the RG claims Argentina voted 'for' 67/134, as they did for its similar predecessors.
It would seem to be 'game, set and match' to the Islanders, with the support of Argentina, unless of course they (RGland) did not intend to vote 'for' the subject resolutions. Always possible I suppose.
Marcos
Aug 21st, 2013 - 04:34 am - Link - Report abuse 0Indeed. In 1829 it could certainly be argued that Britain had only historical sovereignty of West Falkland. I think the Duke of Wellington was correct.
So the question then arises, who if anyone had the sovereignty of East Falkland.
The answer to that, undeniably, would be Spain, based on their 60 year population ending in 1811.
All very clear and undeniable.
So, we need to answer the following questions:
1) Does Spain still have sovereignty over East Falkland?
2) Did Spains sovereignty pass to anyone?
3) Did the pirate usurpers from the UP respect British sovereignty to West Falkland when they were doing their murdering and raping in november 1832?
The answers, are straightforward;
1) Spains claim has long since lapsed, they have never tried to reassert sovereignty.
2) Spains sovereignty claim DID NOT pass to the United Provinces. The UP became independent by self-determination. There was nobody on the island in 1814 to self-determine anything. The islands were not a part of the UP that claimed independence as borne out by Jewitt trying to claim them in 1820. The nearest pat of the UP was 1000 miles away in 1814 so there can be no “territorial integrity” argument even applied historically. If island groups 1000 miles away from a newly independent country automatically cede, then the entire Carribean including Cuba should be part of the US.
3) The UP ignored the historic right of Britian to West Falkland when they set up their illegal usurping murdering, raping garrison in Nov 1832, they are hardly in any position to complain, that their 2 month claim to East falkland was ignored!
Ho hum...keep it coming!
@17 Monkeymagic
Aug 21st, 2013 - 05:47 am - Link - Report abuse 0To add to your post.
Spain officially renounced it's claim to the Falkland Islands in the 1840's, and OFFICIALLY recognised Britains claim by saluting the Union Flag that was flying over the territory.
Spain did NOT recognise Argentina as anything other than a rebellious colony until 1863.
So there is a period of 20 years between Spain dropping it's claim and them recognising Argentina as an actual independent country.
@ 10 At least Marcos got the noble Duke's quote correct, many trolls leave out the 'all''.
Aug 21st, 2013 - 06:13 am - Link - Report abuse 0However as has been pointed out the quote is normally taken out of context.
I am sure Marcos can tell us to whom the letter containing that quote was addressed,and what that person was at the time? Having answered that perhaps Marcos would care to post the response from the addressee to the noble Duke?
Not to mention, of course, that Argentina accepted British sovereignty over the Falkland Island in the Treaty of Arana-Southern. Signed by both parties in 1849 then ratified by the Argentine Congress in 1850.
Aug 21st, 2013 - 07:06 am - Link - Report abuse 0Argentina then forgot about its claim until 1888 then forgot it again until 1941 when Argentina thought that Britain was about to be defeated by the Germans.
Where are the trolls?
Aug 21st, 2013 - 07:21 am - Link - Report abuse 0Answer, dusting of their deckchairs for a nice weekend in deckchairs somewhere in Europe.... Except for Tobi/Nostrils who is halfway through his shift at MacDonalds in Peckham.
Think is following his Mrs around Waitrose (as is A-Void and Vest Itch) and Aussie Shoeshine is out on the beat as a traffic warden.
Hey ho...
@4 Indeed you are. How long have we been telling you that you don't know what you're talking about. And yet you continue to demonstrate that you don't have a brain. Lack of brain is pretty common in argieland. Are you well-off? With 24% inflation, major debts that you refuse to pay, lack of power, more debts through paying for fuel from abroad. How are the supermarket shelves? Empty again? Have you noticed how surrounding countries are edging away? How's the possibility of loans from the IMF or World Bank? Not good? And the Inter-American Development Bank doesn't seem to be on your side. How's the court case in New York? Perhaps argieland could resort to desperate measures. How about not lying, for a start?
Aug 21st, 2013 - 07:47 am - Link - Report abuse 0@7 Trotting that out again? Got anything else? How about 1770/1 when the Spanish king admitted he was out of order, returned everything to the British settlers and paid compensation. seems fairly clear who had sovereignty.
@14 In fact, according the internationally-recognised legal principal of “uti possidetis” at the end of an [armed] conflict, property and territory remains with the possessor. There have been a number of conflicts over Gibraltar, but it always remained in British possession. And for the Falkland Islands? 1982!
Isn't it strange how the argie trolls trot out their hackneyed tripe and then disappear when they are challenged. Just look. Perfunctory comments for about an hour and then nothing. Unable to argue or debate. Perhaps the argie propaganda ministry is paying less these days?
I think it is funny these desperate Rgs argue info from 200 yrs ago like it is relevant today.
Aug 21st, 2013 - 08:37 am - Link - Report abuse 0How is it possible they are really that stupid and delusional?
Nice to see we can still rely on our Commonwealth brethren and sons and daughters of the empire. Thank you Canada.
Aug 21st, 2013 - 08:39 am - Link - Report abuse 0JaJaJaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!!
Aug 21st, 2013 - 11:53 am - Link - Report abuse 0The Argentine Falklands under British sovereignty since 1765!
It is exactly the same as saying: “I shit on the story”, moron, stupid and idiotic!
Usual rubbish posted by Marv and others. Marv - Wellington authorized the 1829 protest to BA. Says it all .
Aug 21st, 2013 - 12:41 pm - Link - Report abuse 025
Aug 21st, 2013 - 12:45 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Sorry about “Falklands” the fucking electronic translator...
THE MALVINAS ARE ARGENTINE, and this is the list of Spanish and Argentine governors until piratical usurpation of 1833:
SPANISH
1767-1773 F. Ruiz Puente
1773-1774 D. Chauri
1774-1777 F. Gil y Lemos y Taboada
1777-1779 R. Carassa y Souza
1779-1781 S. de Medina y Juan
1781-1783 J. M. del Carmen Altolaguirre
1783-1784 F. D. Montemayor
1784-1785 A. de Figueroa
1785-1786 R. de Clairac y Villalonga
1786-1787 P. de Mesa y Castro
1787-1788 R. de Clairac y Villalonga
1788-1789 P. de Mesa y Castro
1789-1790 R. de Clairac y Villalonga
1790-1791 J. J. de Elizalde y Ustariz
1791-1792 P. P. Sanguineto
1792-1793 J. J. de Elizalde y Ustariz
1793-1794 P. P. Sanguineto
1794-1795 J. de Aldana y Ortega
1795-1796 P. P. Sanguineto
1796-1797 J. de Aldana y Ortega
1797-1798 L. de Medina y Torres
1798-1799 F. X. de Viana y Alzaibar
1799-1800 L. de Medina y Torres
1800-1801 F. X. de Viana y Alzaibar
1801-1802 R. Fernández de Villegas
1802-1803 B. de Bonavía
1803-1804 A. L. de Ibarra y Oxinando
1804-1805 B. de Bonavía
1805-1806 A. L. de Ibarra y Oxinando
1806-1808 B. de Bonavía
1809-1810 G. Bondas
1810-1811 P. G. Martínez
After the emancipation of America, by the principle uti possidetis juris, the emancipated countries inherit, of course, the limits that had its pre-emancipation, including the Malvinas Islands
ARGENTINES
1820-1821 D. Jewett
1821-1821 W. Mason
1824-1824 P. Areguatí
1829-1832 L. Vernet
1832-1832 J. F. Mestivier
1832-1833 J. M. Pinedo
During all these years (66) there was no complaint from any country.
THE MALVINAS ARE ARGENTINE FOREVER
Hey where the ferk is the one between 1824 and 1829? No volunteers, not has if they were required to live there, was it.
Aug 21st, 2013 - 01:35 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Never been the Malvinas, never will be, ever!
Any relationship to Francis Drake?? LOL
Aug 21st, 2013 - 01:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@27 Claim by Letterhead. Means nothing. If you think it doesn't, prove it, take it to the ICJ. Oh yes. You have no case, so your government won't since it would mean giving up the distraction.
Aug 21st, 2013 - 02:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Jose - hey Man! Here's a list of FISH with names beginning with A
Aug 21st, 2013 - 02:42 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Just about as relevant as your list!
African glass catfish
African lungfish
Aholehole
Airbreathing catfish
Airsac catfish
Alaska blackfish
Albacore
Alewife
Alfonsino
Algae eater
Alligatorfish
Alligator gar
Amago
American sole
Amur pike
Anchovy
Anemonefish
Angelfish
Angler
Angler catfish
Anglerfish
Antarctic cod
Antarctic icefish
Antenna codlet
Arapaima
Archerfish
Arctic char
Armored gurnard
Armored searobin
Armorhead
Armorhead catfish
Armoured catfish
Arowana
Arrowtooth eel
Aruana
Asian carps
Asiatic glassfish
Atka mackerel
Atlantic cod
Atlantic eel
Atlantic herring
Atlantic salmon
Atlantic saury
Atlantic silverside
Atlantic trout
Australasian salmon
Australian grayling
Australian herring
Australian lungfish
Australian prowfish
Ayu
Alooh
Faz
Aug 21st, 2013 - 03:50 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Your list is no where near as fishy as his list!
RC #32 At least my list is accurate, his list is a list of trespassing Spaniards and illegal okupas (in his parlance) of our Falkland Islands. As you say José Malvinero's list is very fishy indeed. I cant help feeling a bit sorry for him, he tries so hard with things like this. It is an improvement on his usual hurled insults at the start of some threads which are hilarious.At least he makes an effort in English with the help of a web based translator. Personally my Spanish is only about 5 words.
Aug 21st, 2013 - 04:17 pm - Link - Report abuse 0In March 1848, the delegates at the Lima Congress in Peru signed a number of agreements.
Aug 21st, 2013 - 05:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Article 7 stated – ” The confederated Republics declare that they have a perfect right to the conservation of their territories as they existed at the time of independence from Spain, those of the respective Viceroyalties, captaincies-general or presidencies into which Spanish America was divided.”
This is known as the Uti Possidetis Juris principle and Article 7 was signed by Ministers from Colombia, Chile, Bolivia, Ecuador, and Peru. The doctrine of Uti Possidetis Juris is therefore a useful tool to resolve sovereignty/border issues between the signatories.
Argentina did not sign. Britain did not sign. Uti Possidetis Juris does therefore not apply to the Falkland Islands.
@34
Aug 22nd, 2013 - 07:33 am - Link - Report abuse 0SELF DETERMINATION DOES THOUGH
@ 35
Aug 22nd, 2013 - 12:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Yes and RG landed voted for the Islanders to have it.
Read paragraph 7(c) of UN General Assembly resolution 67/134 and then check the voting record.
All available on the UN website.
@ 35. There is also the fact of British Territorial Integrity which bestows additional imprescriptible rights to Great Britain and fully includes the Falkland Islands and its prior dependencies
Aug 24th, 2013 - 09:35 am - Link - Report abuse 0On ratification of the U.N. Treaty, the members states agreed that Sovereignty over existing territorial entities were to remain inviolable
Great Britain listed with the U.N. the Falkland Islands and its dependencies as non-self-governing territories and is now the sole Administrating Country under U.N. Article 73 and as a result Great Britain maintains sole right to protect its own national unity and territorial integrity with respect to the self-determination of the peoples of these Non-Self-Governing Territories
Nothing shall authorize the United Nations or its member states to intervene in matters which are essentially within the domestic jurisdiction of Great Britain or shall require Great Britain to submit such matters to settlement under the present Charter
All Members of the U.N., including Argentina and other Latin-American States must refrain in their international relations from the threat or use of force against the territorial integrity or political independence of Great Britain, including its overseas territories, of which the Falkland Islands and its prior dependencies
Thus British Territorial Integrity is a also very strong argument in favor of British Sovereignty of the Falkland Islands and its prior dependencies
Like I've been saying... they've vacated the claim in every venue relevant to sovereignty. 2065? Walked away from it in February for the whole world to see. ICJ? Won't go near it they know they'll loose. Invasion? Failed in 82 to force their fascism down the Islanders necks will never have that option again.
Aug 24th, 2013 - 10:22 am - Link - Report abuse 0They take it everywhere else but no where where it matters. Claim. Vacated.
@37
Aug 25th, 2013 - 05:15 am - Link - Report abuse 0Domingo
“Thus British Territorial Integrity is a also very strong argument in favor of British Sovereignty of the Falkland Islands and its prior dependencies”
Good point. As it doesn't mention' geographical' integrity.
The UN principle and concept of Territorial Integrity & National Unity & disruption thereof applies the the borders of member states and overseas territories as extant on 24th October 1945 when the UN Treaty came into force; many of these member states possess overseas territories and the treaty applies equally to these in terms of sovereign territorial integrity
Aug 25th, 2013 - 06:38 am - Link - Report abuse 0Applying the principle of Territorial Integrity to the Question of the Falkland Islands, would refer to the succession of the Falklands Islands from British sovereignty & its effect on British territorial integrity and British national unity
The fact is Argentine has never possessed any right of territorial integrity and the pretensions of the Republic of Argentina regarding the British territories of Falkland Islands, South Sandwich Islands, South Georgia, the South Orkneys, South Shetlands, Graham Land and Coats Land
Argentina's encroachments and pretended acts of sovereignty in or relative to any of those territories are, under international law, illegal and invalid and always have been
The fact is the only country with territorial integrity and national unity rights regarding the Falkland Islands and its one-time dependencies is Great Britain
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