MercoPress. South Atlantic News Agency
London launches paper warning on defence income lost and costs for an independent Scotland
A Scotland analysis paper on Defense, published on Tuesday, highlights the extent to which an independent Scotland would no longer benefit from the £34 billion annual UK defense budget, one of the largest in the world. Read full article
Comments
Disclaimer & comment rules“that an independent Scotland would have real difficulties trying to replicate a similar but smaller force from scratch.”
Oct 08th, 2013 - 05:53 pm - Link - Report abuse 0What is London saying here? That it's really an English Navy/Army/Airforce?
Scotland will have to start from scratch?
What about all the Scots in the “British Forces”....do they get the sack...
Would they want to join a Scottish Force with no capabilities....no kit....no Ships etc....not part of NATO ...not part of the EU.....
How will it work without the 14 thousand International treaties Britain has with the rest of the world...
The English are now going to tell it as it is......Game on!
..... tumbleweed ....
Oct 08th, 2013 - 06:00 pm - Link - Report abuse 0¬_¬
@1
Oct 08th, 2013 - 06:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 0It is their choice is it not? I think that Alex Salmond just wants to make a name for himself just like CFK. He wants to run Scotland just so that in history he was the one that if successful was the man to emulate Robert The Bruce. A bit like CFK wants to emulate Nestor.
3
Oct 08th, 2013 - 06:34 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Yes you are probably right.....but I'm highlighting some of the questions that have not been asked.
The General public in Scotland have no idea at all how this is going to work.
The White paper from Salmond is not even out till November and the issues have not even been discussed between the SNP and Westminster....so how will they even know what to put in it.
It's a huge joke and London haven't even begun to list the negatives to the Scottish electorate....
@4
Oct 08th, 2013 - 06:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I expect this to be a none event ( Scottish Independance) but they have the right to self determination as do the FALKLANDERS. Why do you think that Alex Salmond wants the 16year olds to have a vote? Would that happen in Argentina?
@5 It already has. 16 and 17 year olds can vote but it is voluntary. 18 + it is compulsory with the threat of a fine for not doing so. Though a friend in Buenos Aires said she knew many people that did not vote in the last election and nothing happened to them.
Oct 08th, 2013 - 06:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I believe it was compulsory voting in Chile but will not be for the election next month. It will be interesting to see the difference in turnout, especially between the parties.
Korea went to war==to preserve the union.
Oct 08th, 2013 - 07:01 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Vietnam went to war = to preserve the union.
The United States went to war = to preserve the union,
Britain’s politicians sit on there bum and say nothing, do nothing,
But spread rumours,
And mr salmon tries to swim back up the river of no return..
The point it,
Go she will==stay she will,
September will let us all know, so relax,
Read a paper , have a cuppa , lol
.
What a complete waste of government time and effort. Everyone knows that a big majority of Scots want nothing to do with independence. They just dont want a government of remote Tories running things, just like the majority of us in the South dont want to be run by labour MPs from Scotland and the north of England.
Oct 08th, 2013 - 07:04 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Whats the answer - regional parliaments and a national parliament to take care of national things like defence and the majority of taxation.
Salmon is a one man party. Without him it would all collapse and everyone knows it.
Scotland will stay,
Oct 08th, 2013 - 07:15 pm - Link - Report abuse 0september will prove one way or another,
interestingly, we dont all get who we voted for, sometimes we have to live with the majority vote, like it, or lump it,
for those who feel, if we dont vote for you, then we deserve the man we voted for,
then Britain alone and as an example in the modern world, would today, have no fewer than say at least 500 goverments,
and we have just solved the unemployment problem,
like it or lump it, we have who we//they voted for..lol
@1 No, it's not an “English Navy/Army/Airforce”. They are three UK Forces. And what would Scotland expect? That the UK would continue to defend it? But there are already six documents on the implications of independence for Scotland. By comparison, I doubt if Salmond has produced as many as six pieces of paper setting out his woolly ideas.
Oct 08th, 2013 - 07:46 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@8 No, it's not “a complete waste of government time and effort”. For the time being, Scotland is part of the UK. The UK government has a responsibility for the people that live there. It has a responsibility to inform them so that they can arrive at their best judgement. This contrasts with Salmond. He has no particular interest in the people of Scotland. As mentioned, the UK government has now published six documents. https://www.gov.uk/government/organisations/scotland-office/series/scotland-analysis
Where's Salmond's? He's set out on his “crusade” supported by his flights of fancy. Things that he's come out with. Scotland will waltz into the EU on its own terms and with all the UK opt-outs. International law AND the EU say it won't. Scotland will have a currency union with the UK. Only if it doesn't want to be “independent”. Scotland will be part of NATO. NATO includes reliance on a nuclear capability. How is a non-nuclear state like Scotland going to manage that? Salmond wants to continue “free movement” between Scotland and the UK. Not possible. The UK, for the time being, is an EU member. But it's not a member of the Schengen Agreement. Border controls against non-EU states. Scotland would be required to join Schengen. Border controls against Schengen states. And Scotland wouldn't be able to be a member of the Common Travel Area, the agreement that permits people from all parts of the British Isles to travel freely.
@8
Oct 08th, 2013 - 08:01 pm - Link - Report abuse 0People want less political snouts in the trough - not more.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/3984387.stm
I'm a bit bemused by the comments that this analysis is a waste if time. If I was to go from being part of the sixth largest economy in the world with the fourth most powerful military, to an economy the size of Latvia, I would certainly like to know how my country was going to defend itself.
Oct 08th, 2013 - 08:39 pm - Link - Report abuse 0What is the problem here?
Oct 08th, 2013 - 10:32 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Scotland votes for independence, they leave the Union.
Scotland votes against independence, they stay in the Union.
WTF has it gotto do with the Argentinian poster son here.
One would have thought they would remember their last contact with the Scots!
13
Oct 08th, 2013 - 10:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0In that case WTF has any news about SA got to do with you.?
In fact what has the Scottish vote got do with you being neither English or Scot?
The world has become smaller and being an inhabitant of the World then it's as much my business as anyones....
Besides there are huge implications for the rest of the UK.....who loses the oil revenue, where are they going to put Trident.....where will the Nuclear Subs go...
Oh now let's see, could it be because I live it on the same Island and not in South America!!!!!!
Oct 08th, 2013 - 11:08 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Call yourself educated?
15
Oct 08th, 2013 - 11:15 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Are you going to get a vote on it?.....that's right FA to do with you.....
So you agree you shouldn't comment about South America....Doh!
Let me me put it in simple language and in CAPITALS, so you can not miss understand it.
Oct 08th, 2013 - 11:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0WHAT EVER THE SCOTS VOTE FOR, IS FOR THE SCOTS.
Nothing to do with the people from South America.
Nothing to do with you!
Nothing to do with me!
Is that simple enough, or do you want me draw you pictures!
Oh yeah, duh!
Wrong again... it is not for just the “SCOTS”
Oct 08th, 2013 - 11:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The vote is for the “people” of Scotland ...not the Scottish people.....
You are making a lot of assumptions...how the Fcuk would you know whether it has to do with me....all you do know is .....it has nothing to do with you.....
Is that CLEAR enough for you or do I have to draw a picture?.....Doh!
Did I just read this?
Oct 09th, 2013 - 12:09 am - Link - Report abuse 0There is a difference between the Scots and the Scottish people!
Please explain, wow! this going to be good.
Are you drunk.....can't you grasp the difference between the residents and inhabitants of Scotland and those that are Scottish?
Oct 09th, 2013 - 12:17 am - Link - Report abuse 0Do you not realise almost 1 in 10 are English along with lots of other nationalities...
Scottish people residing in England do not get to vote.....only PEOPLE residing in Scotland...whatever nationality get to vote....
Are we getting this or do I have to keep repeating myself until it finally sinks in?
Like I said....nothing to do with you.....but you have no idea whether it has to do with me!
If the Scots vote for indepenence, they will leave the Union.
Oct 09th, 2013 - 12:49 am - Link - Report abuse 0If the Scots vote against independence, they will stay in the Union.
Say what you like.
That is how it is, only two outcomes!
20thinkVoice
Oct 09th, 2013 - 04:22 am - Link - Report abuse 0“Like I said....nothing to do with you.....but you have no idea whether it has to do with me!”
You're invited to come out and make a definite statement that you are a “concerned Scot”.
If you continue to steadfastly and deliberately hide your national identity, we are perfectly at liberty to assume that you are nothing more than a malicious shit-disturber.
Philip Hammond is Defence Secretary, not 'defense' Secretary
Oct 09th, 2013 - 09:07 am - Link - Report abuse 0@14, 16 “WTF”? That's easy. South America threatens a British territory and its inhabitants. And I do mean threatens. And what would any South American state do with the Falkland Islands that it cannot do in its own territory? It's just imperialism, colonialism and GREED. It won't succeed.
Oct 09th, 2013 - 01:51 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“... they just don't want a government of remote Tories running things, ...”
Oct 09th, 2013 - 04:15 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Faz #8
Well, they (the Scottish socialist 'mafia') had 13 years of opportunity running the Labour party when in government over the whole of Britain.
They sure had enough practice with how to destroy Great Britain;
they should find it much easier to finish off little old Scotland.
GUARDIA CIVIL BOARDS FISHING BOAT OFF CATALAN BAY
Oct 09th, 2013 - 06:12 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Another day – another incident – another protest – another ignoring laughing Spanish government.
http://www.chronicle.gi/headlines_details.php?id=31130
Queen Elizabeth Class Aircraft Carriers (in Action)
http://www.chronicle.gi/headlines_details.php?id=31130
Royal Navy 2013
http://www.chronicle.gi/headlines_details.php?id=31130
Britain is currently building one of the worlds best Aircraft carriers actually, The Queen Elizabeth class. Not to mention we have the most technologically advanced destroyers in the world and some of the best subs and nuclear subs
[if only we had a government with a real backbone, ]
Nuclear submarine documentary narrated by Andy Sweet
http://www.chronicle.gi/headlines_details.php?id=31130
One day = those who take the piss out of us,
Will be severely pissed on and deservedly Drowned..
Reporting from the fleet.
Fiery Dragon as destroyer’s Lynx tests its decoy flares in stunning fashion
http://www.chronicle.gi/headlines_details.php?id=31130
.
Sooo -The English are starting to manipulate the Scottish referendum. I did not expect anything less.Its got nothing to do with the Defense capabilities. And Scotland will be welcomed in the EU. No its all about North Sea Oil - like Malvinas Oil. Ironic isnt it. Falklands and Gibraltar have the right to self-determination but the Scots are threatened with Defence budgets. Typical English Hipocracy. They have been bleeding Scottish assets for decades. Some would say centuries.Without the North Sea oil Britain wont have money for a proper defense budget and the Scots will be wealthy.Typical of the parasites. Making money off everyone whilst they project themselves as the protectors of democracy and all that is good in the world. Gods representatives on Earth. Spying and lying.
Oct 09th, 2013 - 07:51 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Ask Irak, Afganistan, Syria,Egypt, Libia,In fact the whole of the Middle East,Israel,India, half of Africa, etc.etc.etc - ad nauseum.
Get rid of them Scotland - you might never get another chance.
@27
Oct 09th, 2013 - 10:34 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“Falklands and Gibraltar have the right to self-determination”
The Scottish have got a referendum- that's an example of self determination. The cons have been pointed out here, but the pro Scottish independence supporters have not been prevented from putting their own case forward.
You seem to be unaware that the UK government gives a lot of money to Scotland from British taxpayers which roughly balances out the oil money. If the Scots gain the oil money, they will also lose a huge wad from the UK government.
“The English are starting to manipulate the Scottish referendum”
But if the Scottish disagree with what Hammond is saying, they will vote for Independence, so the manipulation will be ineffective.
27
Oct 10th, 2013 - 09:07 am - Link - Report abuse 0Once again some brainwashed at reading, what they call gospel, blames the English
The English are to blame for everything this planet has had to endure,
And yet the rest of the world lives in total innocent,
Nice to know then, that without the nasty English, the rest of the world would live in peace and total paradise,
Personally
Living in the real world, I know a very different story ??
Pedro, show what you know m8, feck all..............
Oct 10th, 2013 - 11:11 am - Link - Report abuse 0The oil from the North Sea equates to around £9 Billion per year. Scotland receives an extra £1500.00 per person per year from the UK, now multiply that figure, with the current population of scotland (around 6 million), now tell me what the answer is. It's a pretty simple calculation.
Scotland will have to apply for EU membership, and NATO membership, If Salmond wants to go it alone, he must accept the responsibilities that come with it. So Defense will be an issue, not just for Scotland, but for the whole of the UK. Your lack of knowledge rates on par with Marcos.
Ohh, yeah forgot to mention. Scotland will vote NO!, so please crawl under the pebble you came out from.
poor pedro, he knows not,
Oct 10th, 2013 - 06:04 pm - Link - Report abuse 0but tries all...lol
Which country in the world would bomb Scotland? None. Which country in the world would bomb England? Many. Which country really needs one of the largest defense budgets in the world? England. There is always a problem with these people, the oil and the gas of Scotland, they wonder if the Scottish oil and the Scottish gas are really Scottish. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-20042070
Oct 11th, 2013 - 12:20 am - Link - Report abuse 0'Which country in the world would bomb Scotland?' #32
Oct 11th, 2013 - 06:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 0any country that thought Faslane presented a threat.
any country concerned with breaking through the Iceland Gap.
any 'group' that realised that the British Army has a disproportionate number of Scottish in it.
any 'group' that realised that the Edinburgh Festival would be a suitable place at which its members might blow themselves up.
anybody sufficiently upset with George Galloway.
Shall I go on?
Well scotland did insist on the subs at faslane,
Oct 11th, 2013 - 06:36 pm - Link - Report abuse 0and would it not be fair to say, that anything that was invested ,
by the UK goverment, should be shared by all,
rather than kept by the place that the minerals /wealth was found,
share and share alike..
Well, I guess Mr Salmond will be picking up the bill for these researches and for the referendum.
Oct 11th, 2013 - 06:48 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Or is this a UK initiative where democracy has a centralised cost?
win or lose, he will send the bill to westminster we bet lol
Oct 11th, 2013 - 06:55 pm - Link - Report abuse 0what about RBS ( Royal Bank of Scotland ) ??
Oct 11th, 2013 - 06:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0RBS? .... so the bill will be paid mostly by the non-Scots, then.
Oct 12th, 2013 - 10:24 am - Link - Report abuse 0Tis better to remain in the family...lol
Oct 12th, 2013 - 06:03 pm - Link - Report abuse 0^Nonsense above.
Oct 13th, 2013 - 04:18 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Thats what salmon said ,
Oct 13th, 2013 - 05:56 pm - Link - Report abuse 0and still lost..lol
How has he lost if it hasn't even happened yet?
Oct 13th, 2013 - 08:55 pm - Link - Report abuse 0time will tell,
Oct 14th, 2013 - 06:21 pm - Link - Report abuse 02014.
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