MercoPress. South Atlantic News Agency
Gibraltar takes border queues dispute to Brussels: Spanish government 'furious'
The Spanish Government is “furious” at Gibraltar’s high profile with EU decision makers, the Rock’s Liberal Democrat MEP, Sir Graham Watson, said on Monday. The lawmaker was speaking on the eve of a three-day visit to Brussels by a delegation from the Gibraltar Government led by Chief Minister Fabian Picardo. Read full article
Comments
Disclaimer & comment rulesNo matter how you some people try to belittle the fact, the truth is that Gibraltar is part of the EU.
Feb 12th, 2014 - 01:24 am - Link - Report abuse 0What did Spain think Gibraltar might do if they continued?
“The queues at the frontier are the subject of an ongoing European Commission investigation.”
Feb 12th, 2014 - 01:47 am - Link - Report abuse 0“Gibraltar border row: no evidence of Spain breaking EU law, say inspectors”
“The government has expressed disappointment after the European commission found that Spain had broken no EU rules by stepping up checks on the border crossing into Gibraltar.”
Is there any chance Brussels' response will be to favor the group that is non “white”?
Feb 12th, 2014 - 01:51 am - Link - Report abuse 0Or, if favoring the non-white group would be too obvious, then deliver a response that is neutral (so long as it doesn't help the UK side)?
I mean, it is totally obvious the border checks are punitive and the last time Brussels was addressed on this, it seemed for sure they'd tell Spain to cut it out. But they just delivered a neutral response, as if Spain was acting perfectly legitimately.
The EU is kind of bureaucratic and corrupt, isn't it? Like that UN Colony Committee? They are “in-your-face, we-don't care” biased. Maybe Brussels will be like that.
Madrid is Furious!
Feb 12th, 2014 - 03:02 am - Link - Report abuse 0HAHAHA! Excellent news. Madrid has attempted playground bully tactics and now has been reprted to teacher, maybe even the HeadTeacher.
Hahaha!
Spain needs to grow up, and Shut Up!
Cueta anyone? ooh, don't bring that to Teacher's attention either! That's why they are upset.
a) because they are sulking over Gib because they know they can never have it
b) if they start demanding it through legal means (which they can't) questions will be raised over Ceuta and Melilla
So Madrid is furious! haha! So what? Stop it with the silly 19th Century Border Harrasment and try being a serious country or get out of the EU (and spending UK & German taxes to stay afloat!).
Geeez.....
Spsin is angry? Spain is irrelevant
Feb 12th, 2014 - 06:12 am - Link - Report abuse 0@2 Paulcedron: please explain, if the searches of cars at the border are to stop cigarette smuggling coming out of Gibraltar, why the searches are of cars going IN to Gibraltar. Are they guilty if they have empty car boots, because that shows the intention to fill the car up?!
Feb 12th, 2014 - 06:16 am - Link - Report abuse 0My issue with this story is that it's reporting as fact that Spain is furious when actually is just seems to be this MEP's opinion. He's in danger of sounding like HT and his endless claims that every government in the world support Argentina over this and that.
Feb 12th, 2014 - 07:35 am - Link - Report abuse 0That said, hopefully Spain is sulking over the fact they can't force other nations to ignore the people of Gib!
@2
Feb 12th, 2014 - 08:28 am - Link - Report abuse 0The Commission report only said the Spanish border checks were not illegal, not that they were justified.
It also recommended various measures to be put in place to reduce queuing time and the length of the queues.
Or in other words, in the most diplomatic manner possible, it pulls the rug out from under Spain.
Good job, I'd say.
Fraternal greetings Gibraltarians. Stand up to bullys, it is the only way.
Feb 12th, 2014 - 10:07 am - Link - Report abuse 0@2 Congratulations. Your copy and paste abilities are second to none. But there are other factors and features. For instance, the fact that the EC is continuing to investigate. It hasn't just “dropped it”. The fact that Spain is currently putting forward, to the EC, its proposals for altering the frontier. The fact that the EC is committed to a “free-flowing” frontier. And it's a curious thing. Spain is damaging itself. Around 10,000 Spaniards cross the frontier twice a day in order to work. How long will it be before Gibraltar decides it can do without “workers” that are constantly late and constantly too tired to work. At its worst, the queues could last for 8 hours. Go figure. Inbound queue - 8 hours. Work - 8 hours. Outbound queue - 8 hours. Where's the time for sleep? But Gibraltar has other options. It's opening up its contacts with Morocco. Will Spanish workers be replaced by Gibraltar Government-sponsored Moroccan workers? That's 10,000 more Spaniards on Spanish welfare benefits. Clever Spain...NOT!
Feb 12th, 2014 - 12:36 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@7 Perhaps MercoPress is taking note of other articles on Gibraltar press websites?
http://www.chronicle.gi/
http://www.chronicle.gi/
http://www.chronicle.gi/
http://www.chronicle.gi/
Why go to Brussels when there has already been a ruling by the EU on the border dispute? The Gibraltan government is acting like a spoilt brat who has not accepted the EU ruling.While on the Spanish side the government should stop their childish attitude of moving in with their guardia civil vessels in Gib waters and respect what was agreed on in the Cordoba agreements.Honestly what childish behaviour between these two.
Feb 12th, 2014 - 01:32 pm - Link - Report abuse 0All the Unmighty EU is doing,
Feb 12th, 2014 - 02:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0is pushing us towards the door,
and eye say, good riddens to the gravy train,
sooner the better.
Sooner, rather than later, the EU will realise that the Brits, including Gib are getting a bit pissed off and nothing Camoron says about we are better in than out will count for anything, if indeed it counts for anything presently.
Feb 12th, 2014 - 03:13 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Then we will see the panic that will arise in the EU when they think we are really going to leave and take our money with us. Will Spain be happy then when their subsidies drop, because unlike Britain who CONTRIBUTES TO THE EU, they take out more money than they put in
# 10
Feb 12th, 2014 - 03:17 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Around 10,000 Spaniards cross the frontier twice a day in order to work. How long will it be before Gibraltar decides it can do without “workers”
Conqueror, I grace you with my presence by reading one of your posts, for a change.
I give my congratulations, your post did not feature fantasy military engagements or Apaches stored in mountain tops. Nor threats of hitmen or overly descriptive .... acts. Well done you.
Anyway, “Around 10,000 Spaniards cross the frontier twice a day in order to work. How long will it be before Gibraltar decides it can do without “workers” ... ”
Some time I'd imagine, workers are being imported from across the border for a reason, inadequate domestic supply.
As for importing Moroccan workers, where might these 10,000 Moroccans live in the new - now 33% Moroccan - Gibraltar.
Sort of a co-dependent relationship between LaLinea and Gibraltar.
Gibraltar needs LaLineas workers due to Gibs small limited population and small geographic size allowing only the tiniest population growth.
LaLinea needs Gibraltar due to lack of employment elsewhere
....... for now.
@11 Total rubbish!
Feb 12th, 2014 - 04:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@13 Have you not noticed some Hungarian twat called Andor whittering on about something of which he has no knowledge? Swiftly followed by a Luxembourg prat-twat. How wonderful it is that these European areseholes are persuading more and more British people that the European Union is a totalitarian dictatorship. Imagine telling the most over-populated country in the North that it's “lucky”. “Lucky” how? By being forced by those same Europeans to allow the dregs of the world into OUR country? Even within the EU, we have to take the dregs of Poland, Lithuania, Latvia, Estonia, Romania, Bulgaria, Hungary, Slovakia and Slovenia. Then there's the Reding prat-twat who can't. Read or even spell it. Telling Britons that they aren't intelligent enough to decide whether they want to belong to a useless organisation that costs them £53 million EVERY DAY.
@14 Still an ignorant prat, I see. I don't feel “graced” by your “presence”. Actually, I feel “soiled”. In case you don't get it, it's how you feel when faced with an example of mixed diarrohea, vomit and shit. But I'll give you a break. Not the break, I hasten to add, that I'd like to give you. I wonder if you have the education/intelligence to research the length of time it takes to cross the Mediterranean from Gibraltar to Morocco? Either by aircraft or ferry.
*15 Another detailed,analytical,interpretive,diagrammatic response from a nonsensical post.Dear me!
Feb 12th, 2014 - 04:34 pm - Link - Report abuse 0To be fair, people always quotes the, What if syndrome,
Feb 12th, 2014 - 07:08 pm - Link - Report abuse 0But the point is, Gibraltar like every other place, will have to cope,
They will find other ways to get the work done,
For simply to just rely on Spain for its existence, would totally defeat the object of being separated,
So they say.
just a thought .
15 - looks like about 1.5hrs before port customs.
Feb 12th, 2014 - 07:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Not a great timetable and to make a return journey 5 days a week would pretty much equal an unskilled workers wage.
Now just to find 10,000 cleared, well suited, English speaking workers and issue permits.
Oh and they'll be passing through Spanish waters....
Surely in this day and age,
Feb 12th, 2014 - 07:30 pm - Link - Report abuse 0There is a way of building a barrier between Gibraltar waters and Spain,
.
@ 19 Briton
Feb 12th, 2014 - 08:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Of course there is my boy.
THE ROYAL NAVY!
Well if Gibraltar cannot rely on 10,000 guest workers then I would assume the following would happen:
Feb 12th, 2014 - 08:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Some businesses close
Some restructure and with productivity gains need less workers
The economy reallocates recently unemployed to fill some gaps
There will probably be a recession while the restructuring occurs.
Eventually the economy will find a new equilibrium and Gibraltar will operate quite efficiently without 10,000 poor Spaniards making thir way across the border every day.
The Gibraltar economy will regain its former size eventually and be even wealthier as it doesn't send the salaries of 10,000 workers across the border every day.
The good thing is that with 10,000 less workers queuing and crossing every day, the border delays reduce and Spain's attempt at frustration have less and less effect.
End result?
Spain gains nothing but destroys the livelihood of 10,000 Spaniards.
Gibraltar continues onwards and is still British.
Or buy Ex-cruise liners, convert them into worker accommodation and anchor them in the bay ...some have a capacity for 3,000 to 5,000....
Feb 12th, 2014 - 08:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0spain is furious? .....so!
Feb 12th, 2014 - 11:53 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Its spains shit pie, now its time for them to chow down! Bon petit!
21 - Such a restructure would take a very long time. And would kill a huge percentage of businesses, mortgages defaulted, unemployment for some, cause for residents to leave.
Feb 13th, 2014 - 03:31 am - Link - Report abuse 0Reallocation - Ok Mr Baker, you're now a dock worker. Mr Butcher you're now a welder, IT tech, finance professional etc etc all of a sudden, just skip the years of re-training, guys in their 40's/50's adapt easily.
Fact is Gib is reliant on Spanish labor.
And Spanish customers. (Local. And export ~22.5%.)
And tourists coming through Spains border.
And imports coming through Spains border.
22 - Effectively making these thousands of guest workers permanent residents. How often are staff to be turned over and trained.
Hope a days manual work will cover the cost of a cabin.
Or maybe its specialists living on what better be a pretty expensive luxury boat. (coming from the public coffers)
Maybe just a lil squeeze on public services too. Police, medics, pharma, electricity supply, fuel storage, food storage, water system, social security and tax offices, adsl networks, maybe a bus route.
Maybe a few school places (whoops) if your new permanent workers are from Blighty.
And if they're not from GB .... Gibs British culture is now diluted.
House prices altered, views blocked, permanent facilities to be built etc etc etc.
So thats a nope then.
Gib doesn't function without its Spanish workers.
Spains economy will recover in time.
Alternative employment will be available at some point. No ? Never ?
Be careful.
All it takes is a well timed border fee.
@ 3 bushpilot: “The EU is kind of bureaucratic and corrupt, isn't it?”
Feb 13th, 2014 - 09:06 am - Link - Report abuse 0Corruption across EU 'breathtaking' - EU Commissionhttp://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-26014387
Yes Vestige.
Feb 13th, 2014 - 09:47 am - Link - Report abuse 0It would take time. It would lead to economic dislocation. It would lead to unemployment and some residents would leave.
But it would still be British.
And that would not be permanent.
Spain once tried to close the border and Gibraltar survived. It will again.
And considering Gibraltar suffers a labour shortage, it won't be as bad as you assume.
Here's a great quote I read this week which I will paraphrase:
”The changing mix of industries is actually a primary cause of our greater affluence. Countries that try to prevent their industry structure changing are the ones that stop getting richer.”
Nothing Spain has done in the past 300 years has gained it Gibraltar.
And nothing it has done has hindered Gibraltar in 2014 having a much higher standard of living than Spain.
Spain is welcome to keep frustrating. It gains nothing.
If one wishes to be free,
Feb 13th, 2014 - 10:37 am - Link - Report abuse 0then one has to put up with some hard decisions..
24
Feb 13th, 2014 - 11:14 am - Link - Report abuse 0Why would they need to be a permanent resident...Work permit...
Since when does accommodation cost the same as employment pay ...
What would an EX-cruise liner bought specifically to be converted in to worker accommodation got to do with public coffers..?
Sounds like a great private enterprise...
What strain on public services...the public services could expand somewhat as the wages from the extra residents would no longer be disappearing into Spain.
I reckon there would be no shortage of UK residents queuing up to get a job....
I think it's a solution that would work...
*12 I believe that your dippy and irrational cogitation on the EU is rather immature.Who do you think is going to pay for the reconstruction cost on the flooding all over the UK? The EU with its EU solidarity funds. No UK citizen will have to pay a pound......
Feb 13th, 2014 - 01:23 pm - Link - Report abuse 026 - you mean Spain DID close the border, and Gib survived...miserably.
Feb 13th, 2014 - 01:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I think in those politically extreme times most of us could survive an occasional day at sea followed by meeting (certain) relatives.
But nobody wants a return to that.
Gib doesn't just suffer a labor shortage, it intrinsically has a labor shortage, its economy is intrinsically dependent on Spains workers.
Now should Gibs people want another reef, or monkeys or what not they know the consequences of unilateral decisions that Spain doesn't like.
Snr. Picardo helped them remember recently, he wont be re-elected.
Gib is dependent on Spain in so many ways.
That level of political and economic influence gives Spain great informal power over the place.
Gibs inhabitants, living on the land from which Spaniards, ordinary people just like them, were forcefully removed should recognize the historic context and negotiate to appease Spain by formalizing that power in some token way.
Address an historic wrong, heal UK/Spain relations and make their own lives easier.
28 - you kind of need to be permanently resident if you want to be permanently employed there. Functioning economies generally requiring permanent workers.
Call them what you will they'd be resident...on a permanent basis.
It would need to be public owned if its to be reliably fixed, so an annual loss or company failure wont mean a pull out/sell off leaving thousands of homeless.
If private obviously that money no longer going to Spain is going to the ship operators in rent and maintenance, not Gib, which still must build the infrastructure long in advance using present day residents taxes.
Also theres the loss of previous incoming money associated with the daily Spanish worker to counter the new money no longer leaving Gib.
Might not want to have this new economy targeting exports at the Spanish market either.
29 ross
Feb 13th, 2014 - 07:15 pm - Link - Report abuse 0There are thousands of people, including my son in tiverton, that would call you a lie, for that immature remark,
The unmighty EU is corrupt, always was, and always will be, all you Euro lovers live in a totally different dream world, the ordinary people will lose out, and the rich will again win,
,,,,
Most people in the United Kingdom, including, most MPs regard their country as a sovereign nation,
Unfortunately, that is not the case.
This is made clear in the Final Act of the Intergovernmental Conference on the Lisbon Treaty:
As an old fashioned believer in democracy and the inalienable right to self determination, I cannot accept that.
The British people have never had a say on the Lisbon treaty.
In 2005 they elected a political party which had promised in it's manifesto to hold a referendum on the Lisbon treaty:
http://image.guardian.co.uk/sys-files/Politics/documents/2005/04/13/labourmanifesto.pdf
That party then refused to hold a referendum, signed the Lisbon treaty and ratified it without the consent of the people.
That is not democratic legitimacy.
Arms control treaties do not give foreign bodies the right to rule over the British people without their consent and in violation of their right to self determination.
There is NO benefit to the United Kingdom from membership of the European Union.
It has destroyed the historic freedoms,culture,traditions and institutions and economy of this country.
It is highly likely that membership of the European Union would be rejected if the people were ever given a vote on the matter.
Which is why the Europeanist political class refused to allow them a referendum.
GrandLogistics.
The EU will destroy this country,
of course you are entitled to your opinion,
and me, mine..
.
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