MercoPress. South Atlantic News Agency
Foreign Office will continue to raise Falklands' sovereignty issue with the US
The UK will continue to raise the issue of sovereignty of the Falkland Islands and the right of self determination of the Islanders with the United States administration at very senior levels, according to the UK government response to the House of Commons Foreign Affairs Committee. Read full article
Comments
Disclaimer & comment rulesOpen US government support wouldn't do anything to change the status quo or improve the UK government's position.
Jun 07th, 2014 - 04:14 am - Link - Report abuse 0Just as the US government's current position does nothing to bolster Argentina's claim or position.
Perhaps the US should be invited to leave DG until they have an improved attitude regarding BOTs, and also democratic freedoms more generally. They should also be reminded that in the event they ever lose access to the Panama Canal the Falklands might suddenly become very important to them. They can't be neutral until the day they have that need and then suddenly act like they are the Falkland Islanders new best buddies. It doesn't work that way.
Jun 07th, 2014 - 04:54 am - Link - Report abuse 0The crying English babies always trying to get daddy's attention.
Jun 07th, 2014 - 05:31 am - Link - Report abuse 0And we have it Morecrap - whereas - you don't :-)
Jun 07th, 2014 - 06:22 am - Link - Report abuse 0@3
Jun 07th, 2014 - 07:45 am - Link - Report abuse 0It's called diplomacy, something sadly lacking in LATAM.
He knows what democracy is, he chooses to live in one, it's called Britian.
Jun 07th, 2014 - 07:50 am - Link - Report abuse 0Hypocrite!
Oh! poor Britons they still think that are the belly button of the world. Ha and haha.
Jun 07th, 2014 - 08:25 am - Link - Report abuse 0USAMEX doesn’t care a shit about UK because Amexican only look for their interest so today is more important Mexico than Ukistan.
They will never upset Argentina because they know that will be very dangerous for their interest in the region.
So keep the balance right and be practical Ukistan is for USAMEX what Spain is for Argentina or Portugal is for Brazil.
Lets say just a convenient useful tool when its is needed in Europe that’s all boys and babies.
#7
Jun 07th, 2014 - 08:31 am - Link - Report abuse 0Crap.
LOL if that is the case then let them go ask Argentina and the rest of the Americas for aid next time they want to go to war :-)
Jun 07th, 2014 - 08:52 am - Link - Report abuse 0@Clyde15
Jun 07th, 2014 - 09:30 am - Link - Report abuse 0Oh! poor boy you cannot see the reality of the world because you have been indoctrinated so many years by poor British's crap propaganda...
Amexican have no idea about Ukistan and in fact they hardly can point the little Islands on a world map.
That is the sad truth...
What can we do?
One woman with a placard and she obviously can't spell Falkland Islands correctly!
Jun 07th, 2014 - 10:33 am - Link - Report abuse 0And, as for the special relationship, the truth will outwith - new oil and gas discoveries will assure that.
Macros @ no:3 - That's hilarious considering the size of Argentina's begging bowl and the fact you can't go to another country without begging for support.. Fool.
Jun 07th, 2014 - 11:10 am - Link - Report abuse 0DanyBerger @ No: 7 & 10 - You talk out of your backside. If the USA has no interest in the UK it would not be trying to stick it's nose in, in regards to Scottish independence and the UK possibly withdrawing from the EU. As for geography, don't insult everybody else's intelligence just because your geography is so piss poor. That is the sad truth? Don't make me laugh, more like another one of your wet dreams more like.
Oh, and indoctrinated? Lol, the UK isn't Argentina, we're not as silly or stupid as you guys. How funny that an argie would even try and level that accusation at anybody!
The sad truth is you're a nutter, Dany. And a very boring one at that.
Latest FI related stories...
Jun 07th, 2014 - 11:18 am - Link - Report abuse 0'OIL COLUMN – Argos Resources on the rise as investors hope for drilling - Argos Resources (LON:ARG) shares were on the advance this week, as a cohort of oil and gas firms signed a contract for a semi-submersible drilling rig for a new drill campaign in the Falklands...'
http://www.proactiveinvestors.co.uk/companies/market_reports/69230/oil-column-argos-resources-on-the-rise-as-investors-hope-for-drilling-0000.html
'OIL COLUMN – Argentina warns Falkland oil explorers - Argentina has warned that a fresh phase of oil drilling in the waters surrounding the Falklands (Malvinas) could escalate the dispute over the islands’ sovereignty.
Argentina views the exploration activity as illegal and unauthorised.
The comments come within days of Premier Oil and a cohort of explorers announced a rig deal which could see as many as 21 new wells drilled in the South Atlantic, starting next year...'
http://www.proactiveinvestors.co.uk/companies/market_reports/69230/oil-column-argos-resources-on-the-rise-as-investors-hope-for-drilling-0000.html
“The UK is increasingly isolated from the world in his complaint” - Were the words of Secretary Relative to the Falkland Islands Affairs, Daniel Filmus. “The fact that the support has gone by acclamation and unanimously by all countries showing support for Argentina,” said the official...'
http://www.proactiveinvestors.co.uk/companies/market_reports/69230/oil-column-argos-resources-on-the-rise-as-investors-hope-for-drilling-0000.html
'A museum for the Falklands - It will operate within the premises of the former ESMA. “There will be war museum, but travel throughout the life and history of the islands,” he said its director, Jorge Giles. “We propose that Malvinas is also a cause of human rights,” he said...'
http://www.proactiveinvestors.co.uk/companies/market_reports/69230/oil-column-argos-resources-on-the-rise-as-investors-hope-for-drilling-0000.html
@1 Disagree. Open US government support, including a commitment to support Britain and the Falkland Islands, would tell the latams to lay off. I reckon you could watch latam support for argieland dropping off on a daily basis.
Jun 07th, 2014 - 11:23 am - Link - Report abuse 0@2 Perhaps the US should be TOLD to leave Diego Garcia AND Ascension Island. Both BRITISH territories. Might be an idea to accustom the US to argie methods. Agreements, contracts, treaties? Don't suit us anymore. All ended.
@3 Not “daddy”. Cousins. Maybe even brothers!
@7 Thank you for that “insight”. ALL countries look to their own interests. How's your history? In 1917, Britain showed the United States the Zimmerman telegram showing the intention to bring Mexico into the war to attack the United States. A month later the US declared war on Germany. Argieland constantly “attacks” the US. Look back 32 years. Who did the US support? To whom did it supply weapons? Argieland is just dead and diseased meat.
@10 Perhaps you don't understand that being comrades in war generates a special relationship. How many times has the United States “gone in” alongside the British? How many times have the British “gone in” alongside the United States? How many times has argieland “assisted” either? The answer is quite simple. Neither Britain nor the United States hanker for war. They understand that some of their people may die. Argieland doesn't give a toss until years later when it's politically expedient.
Here's the real truth. Argieland can be destroyed in a matter of days. And when it's been destroyed, Britain and the US can do whatever they like with anything that remains. And who in latam will care?
Don't worry DannyBoy - we all understand the balances of geo-politics, even if it makes one spit a bit at times. Just as we know what side countries like the US will always come down on when the chips fall down - the side of freedom and democracy.
Jun 07th, 2014 - 11:26 am - Link - Report abuse 0Silly, silly Dany.
Jun 07th, 2014 - 11:34 am - Link - Report abuse 0Absolutely no idea about the South Atlantic, have you Dany?
Or about oil politics,
What will we do with you, Dany?
You say that we are just a useful tool, maybe.
But you are just a tool, for sure.
And not the sharpest tool in the shed.
Marquitos Alejandrito
Jun 07th, 2014 - 11:43 am - Link - Report abuse 0Are you capable of adding anything mature to the conversation? Your comments are juvenile!
Well the lease on Diego is due for renewal, the current lease expires in 2016 and comes up for renewal in 2014 :-) I wonder if the Americans might like to withdraw from the Island :-)
Jun 07th, 2014 - 12:15 pm - Link - Report abuse 0#10
Jun 07th, 2014 - 12:21 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Amexican ? What would a Mexican know about an non-existent place called ukistan ~They may as well look for the mythical Malvinas.
How is it that this tiny little insignificant island scares the crap out of the world power of Argentina and the rest of the mighty Latam ?
An even tinier little group of islands 300 miles east in the S.Atlantic does the same.
Is it because it reminds you of what a bunch of useless whining twats you are. All you can do is post your drivel on this site---please world, help us, we are only a nation of 45 million and we are being terrified by 3000 people ! What a bunch of mealy mouthed cowards of which you are a prime example.
“What can we do? ”
Here is a suggestion !
You could stick your head up your arse and blow your brains out.
Sorry, there is nothing in there to blow out. You are on a regular verbal enema so that's that emptied. The cranial capacity is also void so you would come to no harm. No other valid suggestion available except that you could curl up and fester.
“As set out in our written evidence, we are actively considering how the changing nature of the United States, in particular the demographic shift, is altering the degree to which our historical and cultural ties resonate in parts of the United States.”
Jun 07th, 2014 - 12:31 pm - Link - Report abuse 0In other words the Yanks of the 40’s are no longer the Yanks we have to deal with today. You could say that about the UK also: every destitute nation in the EU now has its citizens “working” in enclaves within Britain, never mind the Packies and all the other seeds of destruction for the future.
The real problem lies with TMBOA as shown above with rings on her talon like fingers: the fact that the US said nothing must mean they support The Dark Country!
The lamentable actions over SCOTUS on the part of Obuma is just reinforcing this delusion.
The Falklands however will just carry on carrying on and no amount of LatAm tossers will alter that.
@7
Jun 07th, 2014 - 12:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The thing is, the UK position on the Falklands doesn't depend on third party support, whereas just about the only argument Argentina is able to proffer, is the one that “all our mates agree with us”.
And then the same group of supposed mates turns up again and again at different events with different funny hats on, and we're supposed to believe that there's a vast army of them clamouring in support.
Only the Malvinsta element of the Argentine domestic population is fooled by this. Otherwise nobody outside Argentina really gives a rat's ass that your murderers, mutineers, and rapists chickened out of a minor colonial skirmish some two centuries ago. Indeed, they're probably perfectly happy that Argentina is continually distracted by a neurotic obsession that focusses its aggression and criminality elsewhere.
Fags. Hang in alone. They filled the mouth of the 1982 war but is proven that without the logistical and material support of U.S. dad It would have been a catastrophe. And on top have the nerve to say that dad U.S. not supported by its colonialist adventures.
Jun 07th, 2014 - 01:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0They are so infamous that put the example of Diego Garcia, the expulsion of its authentic inhabitants (EXPULSION: Does they believe God) while talking about the ridiculous “referendum” in the Falkland Islands Argentinas. Can you be so cynical?
And on top, making a veiled reference to a supposed “demographic change” in the U.S. Do they refer to a “degradation” of the Anglo-Saxon race due to immigration?
Christ you guys don't get it. SELF DETERMINATION who in their right minds can condemn that. We will not be saying to the Yanks leave Diego Garcia or any such thing. We are diolomatic, what does it matter what USA thinks or does it will not change the status quo, the FALKLAND ISLANDERS have spoken via a referendum, end of. No-one is going to go against the sanctity of SELF DETERMINATION.
Jun 07th, 2014 - 01:41 pm - Link - Report abuse 022. Jose good effort I'm glad to see you don't let reality get in the way of your response. Lets see if we can quantify the US contribution to the British Victory. Hmmm? The US contribution must have been decisive to the British victory if we only discount the fact that all the forces that were employed were British, the ships were British, the missiles on the ships were British, the aircraft on the ships were British, The submarines were British, the torpedoes on the submarines were British, the long range bombers and the tanker aircraft were British and so were the Atlantic islands they flew from. On the ground the soldiers were armed with artillery which was British, with anti-aircraft missiles which were British, with light tanks which were British and with anti-tank missiles were British. I could continue but I think you get the idea and when I say they were British I not only mean they were owned by the British I also mean they were British built by British companies. Too be fair we did get support from the US in the form of intelligence and they did help us release NATO stocks of SideWinder but hey I guess being a founder member of NATO we were due that anyway. More interestingly the relationship between the UK and the US DOD was a lot stronger than the formal relationship between the the Foreign Office and the State Department. Caspar Weinberger was actually drawing up plans to give us a Carrier if we ever lost one of ours. We didn't need that help then because we were more than capable of teaching Argentina their true place in the world without outside assistance.
Jun 07th, 2014 - 01:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0By the time 2082 gets here, their history books will be saying they lost a war against American led NATO/WARSAW Pact Forces, supported by Klingon Birds of Prey.
Jun 07th, 2014 - 02:31 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@25
Jun 07th, 2014 - 02:40 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You forgot the most important adversary ( NRP. Nuclear Rockhopper Penquins ) and the FALKLAND SQUID combatitive unit
This is where the british colonialist stance goes. To ask the US that the Malvinas islands are strategically for US interests, and that they use other british bots as military bases to get a US support on the british position.
Jun 07th, 2014 - 02:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The same when they claim the US should support britain over the dispute becouse they helped them in wars and not becouse they believe the islanders deserve self determination.
So it is like : “i washed your hands, now you wash mine”. Pathetic.
Um in the same way that Argentina claims that the Islands are a threat to the entire American continent LOL in the way they claim that it is not simply a Argentinian issue but it concerns all of the Americas (But only they the great and all powerful Argentina can claim ownership of not just the Islands but that entire portion of the globe) LOL This is the Argentinian wanabee Colonialist stand LOL
Jun 07th, 2014 - 03:41 pm - Link - Report abuse 022
Jun 07th, 2014 - 04:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Cursed translator: I said, “Malvinas Argentinas Islands”
#29 Bahahahaha. Jupjupjup
Jun 07th, 2014 - 05:14 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The Falklands will always be British not Argentinian.
Jun 07th, 2014 - 05:25 pm - Link - Report abuse 0... and Patagonia belongs to Wales too. :-)
http://www.bbc.co.uk/wales/history/sites/themes/society/migration_patagonia.shtml
Cymru am Byth!
USA
Jun 07th, 2014 - 06:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Should support the UK out of respect , friendship , loyalty , and the fact that we are legally in the right, and CFK is totally mad,
CFK
Should be committed, as she is basically sacrificed her own country for her illegal and none existent claims, and her people are suffering,
Great Britain,
Are in the right, and we will regardless of the rest, defend the Falklands until hell freezes over,
The Falklands
Have a right to self determination, and a right to live in peace without harassment from an escaped loony,
Interestingly it is a historical fact, that Argentina is the most anti American country on the planet,
Yet Obama still refuses to do anything that may hurt US/South American/Argentine relations.
Just my opinion.
.
Mr Obama is keeping as low a profile as he can...Doesn't a want to remind people of how much the US assisted the UK during the Falklands War...Netherlands did, too... Oh yes, and...
Jun 07th, 2014 - 07:24 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The FO is wasting its time (at least with the present US administration), these people are so wrapped up in their political ideology that most of what they do is against the interests of the US. They don't care a damn what would be in the interest of the UK.
Jun 07th, 2014 - 07:40 pm - Link - Report abuse 07 DanyBerger
Jun 07th, 2014 - 10:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You forget your history. We swayed public opinion during the Falklands war back in 1982. Are you choosing to forget that? the Raygun administration was pro-argentine at the time, their south american foreign policy being run by Jeanne Fitzpatrick who was herself very sympathetic to the Argentine cause but we STILL got the US on our side AND to give us some material support as well
What chance does argentina have in the face of British diplomacy? I think it is somewhere between “none” and “Sweet f**k all”
Here is an example of Argentina's idea of diplomacy:-
The British were deliberately moving fast - and leaving as little room for manoeuvre as possible. The resolution must be voted on as drafted, Parsons said. It would not be modified. Take it or leave it.
At this delicate stage, Costa Mendez arrived at the UN and tilted the balance firmly against Argentina. On 3rd of Arpil he addressed the non aligned group, and instead of seeking to persuade them to his side, he delivered a lecture on how they should vote. The Falklands question was a colonial one, he said, and they should automatically vote on an anti-colonial ticket. This was not considered a helpful attitude to take, and his peremptory tone irritated the meeting.
So you see, with an attitude like that, British diplomacy WILL win the day, hands down.
Sooner or later the Anericans will have to support the international legal position 'that the right to self-determination is applicable to ALL NSGTS' as confirmed by 5 ICJ Advisory Opinions and 1 ICJ judgment from Namibia in 1971 through to Kosovo in 2010. I would expect that eventually one SA country will break ranks and the others will follow until Argentina is isolated.
Jun 07th, 2014 - 10:39 pm - Link - Report abuse 0#27
Jun 07th, 2014 - 10:56 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Incorrect...again
The uk has previously asked the us to respect the falkland referendum on the very grounds of self determination.
The us because of its position on Israel doesn't want to commit itself publicly to this dispute.
Do you think that Argentina is not playing this card time and time again stating it is a nuclear armed NATO base in South Atlantic? Even though it has no proof of nuclear weapons being there?
What I find amusing is the latam position, terrified of a non Hispanic territory that itself cannot corrupt therefore finding it a threat.
Since 1982 how many times has the supposed nuclear armed, penguin filled NATO base been used to threaten or invade the mainland of South America?
In response to “your fought our wars we expect the same”... Yes that's called allies, friends even family... Not some distorted temporal belief you gave on how countries should work together, but then again this is Argentina and they are schizophrenic at best.
In the great global politics of today or yesterday why haven't Russia or China sent real arms or aid to defend this great continent? Why have they just repeated the same old schtik of yesteryear ? Why did the Soviet Union abstain from the unsc resolution asking argentine troops to be removed from the falklands?
They are after all your buddies......
@37
Jun 07th, 2014 - 11:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 0No they are not our friends. You aren't either.
You lecturing us on “working together”, what a pathetic joke.
#38
Jun 07th, 2014 - 11:53 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Not particularly bothered who you perceive as your friends or not.
But in a global democracy such as the un it might help to sing what's on the hymn sheet (even if you mime in places). After all we are all signatories to the un charter.
In truth the us and uk position does work together but it more importantly it works for both countries. It may be strained at times but like a family we get on when it really needs.
We wouldn't say for example take each other to the ICJ for example over pulp mills... Territorial integrity, or inhibit free trade across our adjacent border.
Now that really is a pathetic joke.
I'm not particularly bothered on how you perceive our relations cross-borders.
Jun 08th, 2014 - 12:09 am - Link - Report abuse 0#40
Jun 08th, 2014 - 12:19 am - Link - Report abuse 0Is that the best a troll really has to say?
Now you really are a pathetic joke.
Do one.
Ha Ha The old hag wetting herself over her Falklands Fetish.
Jun 08th, 2014 - 12:30 am - Link - Report abuse 0@41
Jun 08th, 2014 - 12:50 am - Link - Report abuse 0I'm just underwhelmed with you foreigners. Delude yourself of another reason if you wish. Argentina is not interested in “international community relations”.
The US will not be casting a vote in support of British sovereignty over the Malivinas simply because it is aware that the UK will be returning the territory within the next 25 years and we do not back losers.
Jun 08th, 2014 - 01:22 am - Link - Report abuse 0I suspect that this is not about a OAS vote but an attempt to get the US to reverse various policies that are collateral to the Pivot to Asia which are terminal for British imperial fantasies in general and for their occupation of the Malvinas in particular.
The British threats WRT Diego Garcia and Ascension Island are bizarre. The British Government must know that the US will use any 'BOT' in any manner we care to and at any time we deem it appropriate for our National Interest. It is the responsibility of the British to facilitate the US in this regard.
5
Jun 08th, 2014 - 01:55 am - Link - Report abuse 0“It's called diplomacy, something sadly lacking in LATAM.”
it´s called bootlicking, something sadly very common in the uk
Hepatia
Jun 08th, 2014 - 02:22 am - Link - Report abuse 0Here’s a stroll down memory lane of some of your posts:
Apr 25th, 2012 - 11:00 pm
“In about 25 years time Brazil will tell the Brits to get lost. And they will. The Malvinas will then be taken over by Argentina.”
Aug 31st, 2012 - 03:02 am
“My prediction is that the administration of Las Malvinas will revert back to Argentina within the coming 25 years.”
Feb 16th, 2013 - 01:09 pm
“Specifically I'm talking about the return of Las Malvinas to Argentina within the next 25 years so that you people in the UK will not be surprised when it happens.”
Mar 07th, 2013 - 11:54 pm
“Given that the UK will be returning the islands within the next 25 years the incentives to act as you have suggested are no present.”
Mar 20th, 2013 - 11:27 pm
“…the UK will be returning las Malvinas to Argentina within the next 25 years. With that in mind I think the UK should save itself the future expense and humiliation and return the islands now.”
Jun 03rd, 2013 - 02:18 am
“As a continuation of that policy the UK will be returning the Malvinas to Argentina within the next 25 years.”
Oct 09th, 2013 - 03:13 am
“It is for this reason that the UK will be returning the Malvinas to Argentina and America within the next 25 years.”
Jun 08th, 2014 - 01:22 am
“…the UK will be returning the territory within the next 25 years and we do not back losers.”
Well if the US doesn't back losers, then I guess it ain’t backing you.
Nothing shouts loser more than someone saying the exact same thing for more than 2 years without even taking account of those 2 years.
Shouldn’t it be 23 years now?
Because your prediction has now blown out from 2037 to 2039.
25 years
25 years
aaaarccc
Polly want a cracker
'Argentina players hold up banner saying 'The Falklands are Argentine' before Slovenia friendly - Prior to Argentina's friendly against Slovenia in La Plata, the Argentine team posed on the pitch with a banner bearing the slogan 'Las Malvinas son Argentinas' ('The Malvinas are Argentinian')...'
Jun 08th, 2014 - 06:08 am - Link - Report abuse 0http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/worldcup2014/article-2651800/Argentina-players-hold-banner-saying-The-Falklands-Argentine-Slovenia-friendly.html
Yeah yeah Steve.
Jun 08th, 2014 - 06:32 am - Link - Report abuse 0They ramped up the rhetoric before the Olympics as well and two years later still nothing has changed.
In two years time there will still be no change. The poor plebs fall for stunts like this and prove that Argentina doesn't need anything to change to keep the circuses going.... now if only the bread doesn't run out.
#48 Remember (as far as I can tell) Steve-34-uk just posts stories about the Falkland Islands without necessarily agreeing with any of the actions.
Jun 08th, 2014 - 07:38 am - Link - Report abuse 0I honestly hope Argentina do something similar during a world cup game - it demonstrates to the rest of the world what children they are. If FIFA don't kick them out of the competition it's just another nail in the coffin of that organisation.
@47
Jun 08th, 2014 - 07:41 am - Link - Report abuse 0Great idea Argentina. Poison the only thing left that Argentina is well-regarded for. Tell me though, does that flag defeat self-determination?
@44 Hepatia. I have a press cutting quoting the Argentinean Foreign Minister stating that 'he expected the British to return the Falklands soon' dated 1947. Same old, same old rhetoric. When politicians start to spout propaganda and lies all they can do is continue. It's rather sad and pathetic especially for the people who believe in it. Lol.
Jun 08th, 2014 - 07:59 am - Link - Report abuse 0Can't see the Falkland Islands will ever just be handed over just because Argentina wants them. Self determination is an important principle and Nations ignore this at their peril.
Jun 08th, 2014 - 08:02 am - Link - Report abuse 0Quiet diplomacy and more polite interaction would have been better and ultimately much more effective.
It's a shame because it would be good for both the UK and Argentina to be friends and allies.
As for talks... its difficult to see in the current climate what they would achieve. More likely they would only serve to further inflame matters.
As far as the US is concerned once Obama has gone relations will improve.
#43
Jun 08th, 2014 - 08:13 am - Link - Report abuse 0Well then why are they appealing to all international forums and everyone and anyone who would hear their pseudo-wounded plight like some nutter screaming on the bus to all and sundry?
Like I said large glass of schizophrenic with a nice slice paranoid delusion .
Pathetic joke rings a bell......
Que? CFK stinks dis way going get our island agen. José Malvinero my hero. What England banner say?
Jun 08th, 2014 - 08:49 am - Link - Report abuse 025 years...that's a hell of a crystal ball prediction; a quarter of a century when the Argentine government, presently extant, won't be anymore... neither will these daft foresights..
Jun 08th, 2014 - 09:11 am - Link - Report abuse 0Disgraceful.
Jun 08th, 2014 - 09:18 am - Link - Report abuse 0Disgusting,
Insulting,
Intimidating,
Shameful, and bloody arrogant,
Should be kicked of the world cut immediately,
[--but they wont be --]
What if England meets them?
This is provocation at the very least,
https://twitter.com/SkyAnton/status/475391020948258817/photo/1
.
23 years from now, let's not forget, 2 years have already passed by since that famous prediction from that world renown statesman.
Jun 08th, 2014 - 12:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The Falklands will be a vibrant, thriving, happy community, whilst Argentina will still be wallowing in a pit of self inflicted misery!
And why not, self-determination for Puerto Rico?
Jun 08th, 2014 - 12:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Philippe
@ 46 Anglotino
Jun 08th, 2014 - 12:56 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Love the Polly comment: it's so appropriate for “her” or whatever it is (BOT?).
:o)
Philippe.
Jun 08th, 2014 - 01:05 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Surely the point is that, that is a matter for the Puerto Ricons.
.
Jun 08th, 2014 - 04:23 pm - Link - Report abuse 0At the end of the day.... The world doesn't give a f*ck about the Falkland Islands except some delusional ill-educated propaganda prone idiots in Argentina, the Islanders, and the Brits. The Brits aren't going to budge, the Islanders won't budge and the Argies can cry into their Malbec until the their steaks come home..... Nobody else matters. The UN is clear that the right to self determination takes precedence. No claim at the ICJ.......get the F*ck over it....
Jun 08th, 2014 - 07:20 pm - Link - Report abuse 0For: 62 Halcyon23 (#)
Jun 09th, 2014 - 11:24 am - Link - Report abuse 0Re:
“At the end of the day.... The world doesn't give a f*ck about the Falkland Islands except some delusional ill-educated propaganda prone idiots in Argentina, the Islanders, and the Brits”, et cetera…
You’re SO right.
I can only add this:
NEVER listen to what politicians SAY but DO observe their ACTIONS. Also very interested in the future of the Falklands (for the hydrocarbons, of course) are the Transnational Big Business Bosses. And they’re the people who REALLY rule the world, not their feckless ‘political lapdogs’!
Cheers!
Jim, in Madrid, Spain.
@22
Jun 09th, 2014 - 12:54 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Short memory eh?
Argentina 1982
Airforce Boeing 707s=supplied by USA
Bell Huey helicopters=supplied by USA
Skyhawk attack aircraft=supplied by USA
General Belgrano=supplied by USA
Amtracs=supplied by USA
Chinook Helicopters=supplied by USA
Turbomentor aircraft=supplied by USA
Learjet aircraft=supplied by USA
Grumman Tracker aircraft=supplied by USA
Uncle Sam helped you more than it helped the UK and you still lost.
I find it incredibly laughable and perplexing that Argentines are commenting on Britain raising this issue with America. Trying to categorise it in a way that we are trying to convince some kind of superior or trying to elevate Britain's own status. You should really consider that these discussions are happening directly at a “high-level” with the American administration and not played out in the media, football matches, newspaper adverts and made-up associations with your friends.
Jun 09th, 2014 - 01:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 0It is strange for Argentines to think their PR tactics and stunts are lauded but Britain’s diplomatic attempts behind the scenes are derided. This only symbolises the immature nature of Argentina and its people.
Agree..
Jun 09th, 2014 - 06:42 pm - Link - Report abuse 0For: 66 Briton.
Jun 09th, 2014 - 09:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Re:
“Agree.”
Yes. Mate. But with whom?
Recently, in this thread, there have been a number of other posts which appear to be replies to messages from “persons unknown”
Cheers!
Jim, in Madrid.
#65, We dont think the US is superior. They think they are, but they are not. What is laughable and perplexing is you british trying to convince them to support your cause telling them they should recognise self determination rights to islanders becouse britain helped them in wars, or becouse the islands are also strategic for US interests.
Jun 09th, 2014 - 11:11 pm - Link - Report abuse 0...or Britain fulfills agreements and keeps commitments.
Jun 09th, 2014 - 11:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0UK has demonstrated it's continued integrity with US.
Argentina?
which way is the wind blowing?
There are a number of puzzling elements within this article. First, there is probably a demographic change which will result in the present plurality of German ethnicity being supplanted by a Latino plurality - or, at least, no definite plurality at all. This has been causing all sorts of anxiety from tea baggers and Birchers within the US. But why the British believe that this will change the view of the US towards the UK is not clear. The British do not seem to have much understanding of the US at all.
Jun 10th, 2014 - 01:33 am - Link - Report abuse 0The policy of the US has been set. This is the significance of the trips down to Brazil by various members of the Pentagon and the OSD, including Panetta, in 2012. So, if not even the unbelievable bungling by the Europeans WRT the Ukraine can change this policy, why do the British believe that their pleading will do so? Could it be that they have just now woken up to what is going on?
Last, the British are acting like jilted lovers - dependent and clingy. Don't they understand that this behavior embarrasses Americans and causes them to shun the British even more?
and you act jealous, like tea cakes that have been nibbled for their icing, and then passed over.
Jun 10th, 2014 - 07:08 am - Link - Report abuse 0Ha ha, used and spurned
:-)
@70 Hepatia,
Jun 10th, 2014 - 08:23 am - Link - Report abuse 0Firstly l must congratulate you for not including your obligatory “return to Argentina within 25 years”
Maybe at long last, you realise that this is not going to happen?
And of course perhaps you have also, at last, realised that to “return”something, it had to belong to the other party originally.
The truth is of course, that Argentina has never owned the Falklands & is never likely to.
Secondly my American relations & friends would strongly disagree with your analysis of America's view of the UK.
We all know that the Latino population is increasing faster, in proportion to other lingual/racial(?) groups & if Argentina got into the Latinos ear then maybe your predictions could happen.
l seem to doubt it though as l have heard, too often of the hostility of the Latinos of Arizona to newly arrived Mexicans, for example.
Then of course, we must not forget the latent Argentine arrogant attitude that surely will put most American Latinos offside.
So all is not lost for us, or a foregone conclusion, even IF America has a Latino majority.
One can only hope that the Argentines abroad do NOT change! lol lol
Hepatia seems to argue that US Latinos will favour any other Latinos and break with their nation over racial lines to ally with hermanos in other countries.
Jun 10th, 2014 - 01:01 pm - Link - Report abuse 0At the same time, he is arguing that the English speaking majority, with a shared history, culture, values, and trade, are only too happy to drop their UK and Commonwealth friends and allies.
Hepatia has no concept of US patriotism and the “cultural melting pot” model of assimilation into American society.
He also accepts fundamental racism and prejudice as a dominant binding force in the Latin culture.
Hepatia is an ignorant unsavoury fool.
Well, put it this way,
Jun 10th, 2014 - 06:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 0if the US agreed with Argentina,
and demanded the UK give back the Falkland's,
would that in fact destroy democracy,
And how many other countries would now jump on the band wagon,
we might even see Spain re-claim parts of the USA ,
And even Mexico,
The Falkland's are British, by consent of the free inhabitants, full stop.
@65
Jun 10th, 2014 - 09:38 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Agree. Very well put comments.
I doubt they will ever get it, being as they (Argies) seem stuck in some wierd time warp/isolationist/ victim mentality.
Isolde
Jun 11th, 2014 - 04:24 am - Link - Report abuse 0“Then of course, we must not forget the latent Argentine arrogant attitude that surely will put most American Latinos offside.”
100% correct.
Most US latinos don't give a damn about Argentina and those who know a thing or two about them don't like them. They probably prefer WASPS.
The average north american is far less racist and xenophobic than the average argentine.
The US Latinos (legit, I mean) are happy to be who and where, they are. US first - they don't want the crap they ran from, following them.
Jun 11th, 2014 - 04:50 am - Link - Report abuse 0Sorry racist Hepatia
Troy,
Jun 11th, 2014 - 09:22 am - Link - Report abuse 0l seem to remember Hepatia saying that she is a she, not a he.
l could be wrong, its a while ago & it doesn't matter anyway.
I think you will find that most Argentinians and south Americans don't care one way or another abt the Falkland's,
Jun 11th, 2014 - 09:38 am - Link - Report abuse 0all they want is a decent country to live in,
but as in a lot of 3rd world places the government thugs always rile up the people in a crowd to look impressive,
we thinks the only real support CFK has, are her dim witted advisors whom she pay to tell her she is great..lol
78 Isolde
Jun 11th, 2014 - 02:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“He” “she”... We'll never know. That's the price of Hepatia's anonymity.
Too bad.
:-)
Hepatitis needs to remember that in 25 years , the Falklands will be a major oil and gas producer .
Jun 11th, 2014 - 02:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0All the sensible money backs an independent Falklands because it is a small , honest and transparent nation .
The way things are going , Argentina could cease to exist as one country .
Politically trapped in Peronismo , Argentina will simply carry on its spiral of decline .
There is a strong school of thought that thinks that agrarian “ reforms ” are on the cards , with Zimbabwe style land seizures just around the corner .
If that happens , there will be a civil war , and sooner than in 25 years .
25 years , the Falklands will be a major oil and gas producer .
Jun 11th, 2014 - 05:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 0[- Argentina will be a 6th world state dependant on islands hand outs -]
@68
Jun 11th, 2014 - 09:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“We dont think the US is superior.”
Of course you don't-any Navy who's ships don't sink in port are inferior as far as you are concerned.
How stupid does she look holing up a card with her drawing on it,
Jun 12th, 2014 - 05:55 pm - Link - Report abuse 0and she didn't even get 3rd prize...lol
http://en.mercopress.com/2014/06/07/foreign-office-will-continue-to-raise-falklands-sovereignty-issue-with-the-us#comment331450: Ha ha. I think the idea of a British person lecturing an American on what constitutes US patriotism is a joke in which we can all share.
Jun 13th, 2014 - 01:23 am - Link - Report abuse 0Had you read the article and my comment you would have seen that I'm not arguing that US Latinos will favor or any country over the US, but the opposite. But further, I am arguing that it does not matter whether the ethnicity of the plurality is German, Latino or Pink and Green floaters from the Planet Meh is irrelevant in so far as the UK is concerned. The British delusion that such a plan is relevant shows that they have no understanding of the US at all.
The fact is that that a pliant UK has been useful to US interests during WWII and the Cold War but is now surplus to our requirements. It is for this reason, and no other, that the US is in the process of dumping the UK. And the fact that the first time we have let Europe out without its training wheels on has resulted in the transfer of Crimea to the Russian Federation does not help the UK.
English speaking majority? Shared history? The British Commonwealth? Are you nuts! The US has no official language and a number have been spoken over our history. Currently the two main languages are English and Spanish.
We don't have a shared history. And I first heard about the British Commonwealth in the early 1970s. At that time I considered it was some sort of club where old Empirists could sing “Rule Britannia” one more time. I had forgotten about it completely and was only reminded of it by the British wing nuts that frequent this site. I certainly have never had a conversation in the US to the effect that 'we must support the British Commonwealth'. In fact most Americans have never heard of it.
To sum up, no amount “demographic shift” monitoring or British Commonwealth nostalgia will stop the UK from returning the Malvinas within the next 25 years.
Get real.
Jun 13th, 2014 - 05:32 am - Link - Report abuse 0Regardless of your own personal prejudices, lack of education, or stunted mentality, the US will continue to prefer doing business with developed partners that pull their own weight, uphold their agreements and bargain in good faith, rather than third world crackpots and fascist narco-states, constantly defaulting on loans and publicly denouncing and demonising America and it's interests.
When did you last see a US Court conduct proceedings in German French or Spanish?
#85
Jun 13th, 2014 - 09:22 am - Link - Report abuse 0Hilary Clinton was interviewed at length on the BBC last night.
Amazingly her views seem to be at complete variance with yours.
Now, who should we believe. An educated women with Presidential aspirations OR a nobody with a giant chip on her shoulder...like you.
Still peddling the 25 years I see...very comforting to see you are at least consistently wrong.
You are a real peanut brain, Hepatia.
Jun 13th, 2014 - 09:30 am - Link - Report abuse 0l don't know what circles you move in, in the US.
Of course America will do what is right for America first.
Any nation would.
But l do think that the US regards the UK as a more stable, reliable nation to do business with that the Argentine train-wreck.
No-one is asking you to support the British Commonwealth in anything.
We would like you to remain neutral but fair.
l have travelled extensively in your country & l could quite believe that a lot of people have never heard of the British Commonwealth.
A lot of people in the US have never heard of a lot of things because your education system focuses ON the US & not much anywhere else.
l have been asked where l learned to speak English by some Americans & when told they were amazed that English is the language of Australia, New Zealand, etc etc.
And you have not much idea of your own history to say that we don't have a shared history! Go read some history books, Hepatia.
Naturally the British element in your society became diluted when you received massive emigration from non-British sources.
But the British were still emigrating to the USA even after the Revolution of 1776.
As l pointed out, l myself have blood relations there & in Canada.
No, Hepatia, you maybe right in your small circle & of course we all know that Obama doesn't like us(& we don't care about that either), but the Falklands will NEVER fall into Argentine hands, so you had better do your crying elsewhere.
@85
Jun 13th, 2014 - 10:02 am - Link - Report abuse 0“ will stop the UK from returning the Malvinas within the next 25 years.”
From 2014? Or 25 years from:
2015?
2016?
2020?
”2030?
2050?
2150?
2433?
It's a perpetually l recurring' in 25 years time'.
When the sun has finally destroyed the Earth and the Falkland Islanders have joined the rest of the world in escaping its death throes, all of Argentina will be whooping with joy as they land on a deserted Falklands, the suns deadly heat setting off all the mines Argentina planted in 1982, setting all the camp on fire, and as they look up to the sky and see the rest of the world's population bid a sad adieu to the world, the Argentines will be dancing for joy at Port Louis getting pissed on Malbec waiting for the sun to blow them up.
QEClass Carriers
Jun 13th, 2014 - 10:33 am - Link - Report abuse 0We've got 21 days to go
https://twitter.com/QEClassCarriers/status/477369472752558080/photo/1
looks great.
not with this abt to be finished,
Argentina will be lucky to hang on to what it has .
88 Isolde
Jun 13th, 2014 - 12:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“But the British were still emigrating to the USA even after the Revolution of 1776.”
Let's not forget the huge numbers of well-educated British professionals who moved to the US during the big “brain drain ” of the 50's and 60's.
These were very capable, intelligent, and influential people, well-placed in industry and society, not the “huddled masses” uneducated labouring refugees that stereotypically flooded to the US from other countries.
@91 Troy Tempest,
Jun 13th, 2014 - 09:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 0There has been a steady British emigration to the USA ever since it was founded.
l recently watched a documentary on their Civil War 1861-1865 & it mentioned that there were British born boys in the armies of both sides.
Hepatia could come from some ethnic group who haven't been in the Americas that long.
They seem to be the ones that scream the most.
e.g. Timmerman & Filmus & of course not lets forget our wriggly, devious,lying resident snake. Think.
All first generation Argentines.
And think that they have the God given right to dictate to the Falklanders who can trace their ancestry back 7 or 8 generations.
They've got plenty of cheek, l'll give them that.
But they are completely unbelievable.
I knew the Brits did not have a good understanding of the US. But looking at the comments here I realize that I did not understand how profound that lack of knowledge is. It does explain a lot.
Jun 14th, 2014 - 04:57 am - Link - Report abuse 0One thing that you Brits may not understand is that the US, as required by the Constitution, holds a census every ten years. As a result Census Bureau tracks three orthogonal demographic variables: race, ethnicity and ancestry. So these demographic data are not a matter of speculation or guess work. And these data are well known in the US because it is not infrequently publishing in the media to illustrate some point or other - usually why the GOP should not support immigration reform.
From memory the five top ancestry categories are German at about 25%, Irish, American, African and Latino or Hispanic. You can check this data at the US Census Bureau. A projected increase in that last category causes the GOP - and, it seems, the British - great angst. I do not remember what the proportion of the population has British ancestry but I think it would be about 8%.
So, lets get back to the original question. I can understand that some schmuck picked at random off some British street might might hold the clichéd view of the US that has been exhibited here. But why is it that the British Government would think that a US with a Latino plurality would any different to a US with the current German plurality. Is it because they hold the same misconceptions about the US as the average schmuck?
The UK needs to understand that the US will adopt policies that it considers to be in its national interest. And it is the policy of the US to “Pivot to Asia”. Collateral to this policy the US has adopted a number of policies towards other areas of the world.
So no amount of demographic tracking of the US by the British will result in them not returning the Malvinas within the next 25 years.
So you have nothing but gut feeling and wishful thinking that the UK will be alienated from the US by growing Latino influence.
Jun 14th, 2014 - 05:28 am - Link - Report abuse 0Einstein, you ain't.
http://en.mercopress.com/2014/06/07/foreign-office-will-continue-to-raise-falklands-sovereignty-issue-with-the-us#comment332088: No. It is the UK government that believes that the demographic shift is a problem, not I. This is evidenced by their attention to it in the report.
Jun 14th, 2014 - 05:51 am - Link - Report abuse 0Do you comprehend English in any meaningful way?
Troy
Jun 14th, 2014 - 07:16 am - Link - Report abuse 0I seriously doubt that Hepatia is American.
#93
Jun 14th, 2014 - 07:38 am - Link - Report abuse 0The US pivot to Asia was based more of a supposed threat from china as it fears a new kid on the block. But again this is reassurance to South Korea, Taiwan and Japan. All of this was done prior to crimea.
Given the stability of NATO and the toning down of Russia. That decision was probably right. But you have to bear in mind that the US and NATO doesn't have a dog in this fight in regards to Ukraine , only to reassure NATO allies that were all in this together. Which has worked because Russia has stopped the overt operation and now moved to a position where it turns a blind eye to its borders.
So the training wheels are off and the eu are peddling...with a few wobbles...
Your belief that the uk is now a busted flush in regards to its relationship with the us is just absurd. The secret services of both countries are deeply intertwined. Relationships are forged from common interests or threats.
There is a saying in regards to this marriage; the us has money the uk has brains.... And it works well.
Also the uk is the bridge or buffer for us influence in Europe. That is why Obama has come off the fence in regards to the uk pulling out of the eu. As for the uk being pliable, I think Syria put that to bed, which is unfortunate because I feel that was more of an issue than a 12 year us lead wild goose chase across Afghanistan.
So yes the relationship is changing but i think that isn't down to usefulness of the uk but the restriction of the economical power the us has and by result the narrowing of its focus.
But you still don't really explain how the us has influenced the uk position in defending the falkanders or not. Like I said earlier, the us doesn't have a dog in this fight. But the uk does. What the uk have said in the report is stating economic and military benefits on respective positions..
If anything the is position would be to keep the status quo. I.e the uk keeps the upkeep of it and if the shit hits the fan can we crash their for a few days?
Well whatever, Hepatia, thats not what l'm hearing in the US.
Jun 14th, 2014 - 09:28 am - Link - Report abuse 0Anyway, we don't really care what you, personally, think or say.
Your 25 year prediction is just a load of old garbage.
lts what you would LIKE to happen, but l don't think it will.
How do you see the end play?
1) do you think that the US will arm Argentina in order for them to mount a successful invasion?
2) do you think that the US will invade us themselves & then give the lslands to Argentina?
3) do you think the US will put pressure on the UK to force them to deliver us to the tender mercies of Argentina?
l think if the US tried #s 2 & 3, then we would be looking for Allies elsewhere.
lf we are going to go down in a screaming heap, then you are going to be hurt too.
And the American public would never accept the US going to war, only to award the spoils to a third party(a 3rd rate, untrustworthy, ,devious, lying, wannerbe, colonial empire with no morals or scruples whatsoever!)
lf the US arms Argentina, then Argentina may take us, but they'll pay dearly for it.
So no, Hepatia, l don't see it happening.
The only sure way that Argentina could get their thieving paws on these lslands, is if we want them too.
And thats not likely to happen.
Don't cry for Argentina, Hepatia.
lf you hit a wrong note, they're just as likely to throw you out of a helicopter.
snigger.
For: Isolde et al.
Jun 14th, 2014 - 10:39 am - Link - Report abuse 0Re: What the US may or may not do (its foreign policy toward Latin America)
Why is it generally assumed that in 25 or 25 years time, the US will still have enough financial and military clout, let alone the desire, to deeply influence events in the Southern Cone? I wonder what role the emergent powers such as China may soon be playing in that part of the world’s affairs.
Cheers!
Jim, in Madrid.
@93 Hepatia
Jun 14th, 2014 - 01:31 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Former US Secretary of State Hillary Clinton told the BBC’s Newsnight programme:-
“The Special Relationship between Britain and the United States was worth everything to me and our country”. She added: “I do think we see the world very similarly”
“From memory the five top ancestry categories are German at about 25%, Irish, American, African and Latino or Hispanic.”
Jun 14th, 2014 - 03:00 pm - Link - Report abuse 0So even without British in the top 5 there has been a special relationship.
Hmmmm it must be based on something more than the racial makeup of the US.
Who would have thought the relationship between countries could be so complex?
96, 100 Leiard
Jun 14th, 2014 - 03:02 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Thanks, Leiard.
I am sure that Hepatia is not a US citizen and he does not live there.
It's just part of his invented persona - useful for posting disinformation and expressing supposed condescension towards the Brits.
He is not like any US American that I have encountered, and I spend a good deal of time down there. Sure, the average man in the street may not know much about the Commonwealth, but they know the UK are good allies.
They know less about South America, even less about about Argentina, and couldn't give a rat's ass about them.
Hepatia is a polished propagandist along though, along the lines of, “ if you keep repeating something over and over again, eventually people will begin to believe its true”
As monotonous as it is, we need to counter each of those statements with the truth, and assert the real documented history of events, and particularly, the Falklands.
It's good to see that the UK and the FIG are actively doing just that.
I thought that a few months ago Hepatia was purporting to be Brazilian? I certainly can't be bothered to investigate, but that was my impression. I would happily make a wager that she isn't American.
Jun 14th, 2014 - 06:29 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Anyway. Good see the Foreign Office publicly voicing support for the Falkland Islands.
surely in retrospect it matters not what we think, but what the American president thinks at the time,
Jun 14th, 2014 - 06:31 pm - Link - Report abuse 0quiet frankly if the American think that they can and do, drop the British, and find a new reliable ally who will stand by them day and night, then that's surely up to the American president and his advisers at the time,
And no doubt 95 Hepatia would like this very much, I very much doubt if that scenario would ever happen,
but what if 95 Hepatia is right and correct, and his powerful friends and influences persuaded the Americans to dump us,
just who does 95 Hepatia think would replace us, perhaps the mighty empress CFK would fill the gap, or as most likely 95 Hepatia is still living in dreamland, and we have nothing to worry abt,
so he says....lol
justa 95 Hepatia thought...lol
103 ilsen
Jun 14th, 2014 - 06:53 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“I thought that a few months ago Hepatia was purporting to be Brazilian? ”
“Brazzo” is the fake Brazillian, now.
“Hepatia” is only a fabrication anyway, no substance - a tool for posting propaganda, nothing more.
@105 Troy Tempest,
Jun 14th, 2014 - 09:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Someone on these pages, can't remember who, said that Hepatia was Dutch.
Don't really know,
Don't really care,
Another raving malvinista, who probably works for the Argentine Ministry for Disinformation.
No one really cares for Hepatia. No wonder she keeps changing personalities. Desperate for attention I guess!
Jun 15th, 2014 - 12:47 am - Link - Report abuse 0Don't even accept that “he” is a “she” - it's a total invention.
Jun 15th, 2014 - 03:05 am - Link - Report abuse 0Do you think the “Hepatia” operators would have any courtesy for us???
Why is this even being considered ? - they're “intelligence”/propaganda operatives - not humans.
http://en.mercopress.com/2014/06/07/foreign-office-will-continue-to-raise-falklands-sovereignty-issue-with-the-us#comment332099: In answer to your questions:
Jun 15th, 2014 - 03:15 am - Link - Report abuse 01) No to arming and no to invasion
2) No
3) No
The UK will return the Malvinas within 25 years and it will do so peacefully. Further the policy of the US up to the time of the return will remain as it is now - that it takes no position on the sovereignty of the islands.
I will ask you two questions which are relevant. In the late 19th and early 20th centuries the US removed from the UK its ability to project power into the Western Atlantic and Caribbean. So:
1) How did the US do this?
2) Why did the US do this?
Did they?
Jun 15th, 2014 - 03:31 am - Link - Report abuse 0You tell us.
Interested to hear your theories.
http://en.mercopress.com/2014/06/07/foreign-office-will-continue-to-raise-falklands-sovereignty-issue-with-the-us#comment332096: The Pivot to Asia is not a “was”. It is occurring and will continue into the future. The policies that impact most on the return of the Malvinas within the next 25 years where commenced in the summer of 2012. This was widely reported at the time, although not in Mercopress - which must make you wonder. Try reading FA, FP the NYT, WP, HP and others.
Jun 15th, 2014 - 04:01 am - Link - Report abuse 0So this intelligence service connection that you speak of - given the incredible European bungling in the Ukraine did the UK inform the US of the possibility that the Crimea would be likely to be incorporated within the RF? And why did the UK not perform the necessary diplomatic and military operations necessary to prevent this incorporating? Moving on to Iraq, did the UK inform the US of the impending Salafi take over of the country? And why did the UK not perform the diplomatic and military operations necessary to prevent this take over? Given the apparent failure of the UK intelligence services in these and other areas what value do you think that this connection is to the US?
The only value that I have seen in the connection is that it has allowed certain agencies of the US government to evade their 4th amendment requirements to US citizens. Do you think that this is positive for the US?
109 Hepatia
Jun 15th, 2014 - 07:11 am - Link - Report abuse 0”I will ask you two questions which are relevant. In the late 19th and early 20th centuries the US removed from the UK its ability to project power into the Western Atlantic and Caribbean. So:
1) How did the US do this?
2) Why did the US do this?”
Again,
Did they??
Please explain. How about Bermuda, Bahamas, Turks & Caicos, Jamaica, etc.
@111 Hepatia
Intelligence agencies, being secret by nature, we don't know what information passed between them.
We have no idea of what successful diplomatic or anti- espionage actions have been implemented, and what other situations have been averted. We never will, either.
Your notion that the UK intelligence services are alone responsible for the security and policing of European rogue states and illegal actions, is at best naive and simple-minded.
Your insights are quite laughable, a child's view of the world.
Please tell us more. Links would be useful to support your thesis.
#111
Jun 15th, 2014 - 07:19 am - Link - Report abuse 0The pivot stated as a was because we are discussing a policy that came out in 2010' a policy in the past. Which policies in 2012 are you babbling on about and if they are so detrimental why haven't they been discussed either on here, or in the national press of either Argentina or the uk?
Their was no bungling of Ukraine, the eu was put into a position by a puppet dictator who then got removed. Russia saw an opening and attempted to exploit it.
I like to reaffirm this again for the hard of reading. The Ukraine is not a NATO ally. There is an agreement with the us, uk and Russia affirming Ukraine's neutrality.
Why do you think the Ukraine affair is soley down to the uk? Why do you think that the us lead campaign in Iraq is now down to the uk intelligence services and by default the insurgency in Iraq? I could counter argue and say why didn't the us say these things in regards to the two countries to its partner?
I would say the value based on your hate filled diatribe is one of mutuality. I.e they are both in this together.
Based on your 4th amendment issue...speak to the agencies involved and ask them... You know who they are... From what I can see your so vastly in the know about the worlds failures only having one master or reason it shouldn't be too difficult now should it?
Hepatia.
Jun 15th, 2014 - 08:31 am - Link - Report abuse 0You make some quite outrageous statements that are completely against current thought in the modern world.
Fortunately, I am open minded and willing to consider alternatives.
So please post some actual proof supporting your statements above.
otherwise everything you say will be doubted or ridiculed.
Hepatia.
Jun 15th, 2014 - 10:01 am - Link - Report abuse 0I kind of agree with the others. What you preach is less fact and more wish fulfillment. The fact is that the US and the UK are very strong allies in terms of defence and security. Far stronger than any comparable alliance in Latin America. There are numerous points of close cooperation which include everything from Trident Missiles to base sharing to a whole range of “secret squirrel” stuff at GCHQ.
The pivot to Asia is also dependent on the cooperation of Australia which is a commonwealth country which has even closer ties to the UK.
The truth is that the US and the UK are allies today, were allies yesterday and will be allies tomorrow. Even if the Latin American faction in the State Dept try their very best their efforts would be nothing when compared to the depth of history, cooperation and personal relationships that has existed between the US and UK since the Second World War.
That being said I think there is room for a more muscular British Foreign policy which puts our interests above those of the EU and is a little less sycophantic of the US. The problem with having such close relationships is occasionally they get taken for granted as some new Latin American policy wonk in the State Dept gets a bright idea.
Just once in a while I think it would be better if we seized the initiative on some things going on in Gibraltar and the Falklands and instead get our adversaries to react to what we do. If they push us we push back harder. Keep that up for long enough and pretty soon it stops being fun for them and they learn to leave alone.
@109 Hepatia,
Jun 15th, 2014 - 10:14 am - Link - Report abuse 0lf, as you say, no to all three scenarios that l suggested, what are you going to do ……hypnotise us?
Make us feel sorry for Argentina's ridiculous “claims” & just hand our land over to them?
Don't think so, try again.
ln the late 19th & early 20th century, we were at our peak & the US could not have dictated anything to us.
We had the most powerful navy in the world.
Please elaborate. lt should be interesting.
l think that you are clutching at straws.
#111
Jun 15th, 2014 - 11:24 am - Link - Report abuse 0“ The policies that impact most on the return of the Malvinas within the next 25 years where commenced in the summer of 2012. ”
What were these?
By the way, it does appear that you are not a native English/American speaker. You keep using “where” instead of the verb “were” ..indicating a Hispanic flavour.
In her interview with Jeremy Paxman, the “pivot to Asia” was discussed.
Ms. Clinton said that as they had defence treaties with Asian countries and that serious problems were arising there, they had to put more effort into that area which probably had been somewhat neglected in the past.
She said that the UK/USA alliance was as strong as ever as the two countries had the same basic outlook on world problems.
The USA trusts the UK to hold the fort in Europe as it has to put more effort into China's attempt at domination of the East Asian region with the possible outbreak of hostilities between China/India and countries with whom the USA has defence treaties.
Tut tut, you guys must give 109 Hepatia
Jun 15th, 2014 - 05:53 pm - Link - Report abuse 0More credit for his information from his influences,
I will ask you two questions which are relevant. In the late 19th and early 20th centuries the US removed from the UK its ability to project power
We all know the United States navy forced at gunpoint the royal navy to give up its power,
Boy, any argie school kid know this
And their air force removed the RAF with one stroke, the little British just caved in to American demands,
And if 109 Hepatia says the Falklands will be returned to argentine, then so it will, as he says [peacefully]
Apparently the British are at this moment in time arranging to just hand over all its south Atlantic territories to the mighty argentina for the sake of peace,
After all chaps, who can argue with a projected geniuse…
.lol
Ooh has Hepatia dropped in any hints on how he/she is privacy to high level and secret government information yet?
Jun 15th, 2014 - 09:46 pm - Link - Report abuse 0That one was a good one. Just like El Diego they are told this information in confidence and then blab it on here.
I read you posts and I say to myself, “Is this woman for real?” I get the feeling that you cannot be this ignorant about US history and are just trying to “wind me up”. I is very difficult to have an intelligent conversation with you if you really are this misinformed. At the very least I think you should read some US and American history, otherwise what is happening and what will happen is just going to appear as an jumble of confusing events.
Jun 16th, 2014 - 04:17 am - Link - Report abuse 0Anyway, to give you the benefit of the doubt, you are wrong. What I'm referring to is standard text book US history. I can remember learning it as a young girl in high school. The end result was a doctrine known as the Roosevelt Corollary and this period in history is regarded as part of Roosevelt's (and Grover Cleveland's) legacy.
Somebody said that the US and UK have shared a long history. Well, that mis-characterization didn't last long. The US has quite a different view of the US - UK relationship, both historically and presently, than, I suspect, the UK does.
Your options are so narrow as to be ridiculous. Nobody believes that any of those events is going to happen. You need to think outside of the box in which your mind is currently imprisoned. And you should forget about Argentina all together. It is not central to what is going to happen. Its only role is to receive the Malinas when they are returned.
So, my two questions remain. Of the two the second is the most important.
Also remaining are the original questions. Does the UK administration really believe what it reported? I suspect not. That is I think the UK administration is lying to the committee.
#120
Jun 16th, 2014 - 06:02 am - Link - Report abuse 0Is this the doctrine that replaced us troops to intervene in South America as and when it felt like it instead of European ones?
Is this the doctrine that got dropped and replaced more or less back to Monroe because it was an outright failure and showed the us had its own imperialist attitude?
You haven't explained what US policies in 2012 will force the uk to peacefully or not hand over the falklands ( btw against the un resolutions in place allowing the falklanders to choose their own future).
Like I said if this was the case a) the uk and argentine press would gave been on it like a shot and b) Argentina would either go into overdrive stating this fact or go very quiet knowing something is coming round the corner.
This is no fiscal or political change from the us in regards to this issue. The uk doesn't hire the destroyers or subs to defend the islands from the us. The us stays officially neutral and hasn't changed from that position since the reinstatement of Monroe. If it did like you say in I'm assuming in 2012 why hasn't this become public knowledge?
My head is fine it's not imprisioned at all... I'm not rambling plucking dates and ranting in 25 years something which may or may not happen without giving some sort of reason or logic, or accusing whoever or whatever is lying but sticking to some vague, non descript mantra without backing it up.
The commitee is just reaffirming to one of its allies the potential useage of not only the falklands but also others bots if the USA gets stuck and needs to crash somewhere.
@120Hepatia,
Jun 16th, 2014 - 07:37 am - Link - Report abuse 0l don't know if you are responding to me or not in post # 120.
You don't make a lot of sense & have not explained any of the wild assertions that you made.
So l am thinking that YOU are the wind up merchant, i.e. a troll.
One thing though, we did manage to get you to post a bit more than your “returned to Argentina in 25 years” mantra.
ln conclusion, you say that l/we are misinformed, while l say that you have proved nothing & know little about the USA.
Ergo you are a troll & shall be henceforth treated by me as one.
Go read some history books Hepatia.
@122 lsolde
Jun 16th, 2014 - 05:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Hepatia will post a lot of wild assertions, when challenged will never answer directly.
Hepatia - “I is very difficult to have an intelligent conversation with you if you really are this misinformed”
The person who is providing incorrect information, with the intention to misinform, is Hepatia herself.
Her usage of the “Roosevelt Corollary” shows how little she learnt in high school. The British applauded this (the US would help collect their debts), the Latin American countries hated it.
A good article to read from the Roosevelt Institute.
“The “Special Relationship” between Great Britain and the United States Began with FDR.”
http://www.rooseveltinstitute.org/new-roosevelt/special-relationship-between-great-britain-and-united-states-began-fdr
Some say that with power , influence , allies , and such,
Jun 16th, 2014 - 05:45 pm - Link - Report abuse 0the British via directly or indirectly now control via the above more area of land mass than ever before.
?? With argentine permission of course ?? lol
Hello Everyone,
Jun 16th, 2014 - 08:50 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Most of the arguments offered in this discussion are totally irrelevant.
Reason: The US and almost all the industrialized world is up to its eyeballs in debt to China. If the PRC were to foreclose tomorrow, all modern society would collapse and the effect would be one of 1929, multiplied to the nth degree.
So in 10 or 20 years’ time economic circumstances may force the US to DEFENSIVELY arm itself to the teeth and return to its former isolationist’ past, keeping its nose well out of foreign squabbles, simply because the present superpower will then have no other option.
Some ‘gurus’ predict a looming PACIFIC RIM WAR. Perhaps we’re already seeing its initial skirmishes? –FOUGHT OVER CERTAIN PREVIOUSLY UNWANTED ISOLATED, SMALL, BARREN ISLANDS; WHICH HAVE SUDDENLY BECOME HIGHLY PRIZED BECAUSE THEIR SURROUNDING SEAS ARE THOUGHT TO COVER HUGE HYDROCARBON DEPOSITS.
Does that remind anyone of anywhere in particular, situated only JUST outside the Pacific Rim?
Cheers!
Jim, in Madrid.
I don't believe the PRC will 'foreclose' at anytime in the near future simply because the rest of the 'western' would would cease trading and isolate it and continue trading amongst themselves. Some might say this would be a good thing. What would China do anyway? Doesn't have the military power to threaten the entire 'west'.
Jun 16th, 2014 - 09:34 pm - Link - Report abuse 0No need for scaremongering.
Cheers!
Ilsen, in London (at present)
Hahaha what happens to the Chinese economy if it “foreclosed”. The Chinese economy would take much much longer to climb out of that depression.
Jun 16th, 2014 - 11:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Scenario:
China forecloses-export markets disappear-bankruptcies of most exporters-massive unemployment-housing market collapses-social unrest in cities as floating population starves......
And that is just the start. China has a vested interest in preventing its export markets collapsing.
I love hearing how pig-ignorant some people are when it comes to China.
PS: few countries are up to their eyeballs in debt to China. A meme is not a fact.
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