MercoPress. South Atlantic News Agency
Unasur sides with Argentina and warns about “global financial stability”
The Union of Southern Nations (UNASUR) expressed its solidarity with Argentina after US Supreme Court decision to dismiss the country’s appeal in its legal dispute with holdout hedge funds, rejecting “the behavior of speculative agents that endanger the agreements reached between debtors and creditors”. Read full article
Comments
Disclaimer & comment rulesUna who? I thought this was an English site Mercopress. Union of southern nations my arse. It's just another bunch, not even all of, South American nations. Nestor would be proud.
Jun 25th, 2014 - 12:09 am - Link - Report abuse 0...rejecting “the behavior of speculative agents that endanger the agreements reached between debtors and creditors, affecting global financial stability”.
Jun 25th, 2014 - 01:10 am - Link - Report abuse 0Umm, the whole purpose of the court ruling was to ENFORCE the agreements reached between debtors and creditors, specifically to ensure stability in the global financial markets.
Argentina is good at spinning this, but THEY broke the agreement, not the lending funds!
@2
Jun 25th, 2014 - 03:09 am - Link - Report abuse 0How doe ending the right to ANY negotiation bring “stability”?
No nation will ever again be able to renegotiate payment terms, at least in US jurisdiction. From now on, even ONE disgruntled bond holder can stop the entire global financial process if he or she is unsatisfied with the terms.
Just wait, it will be a lot of fun seeing how we go from one global crash to the next in the next 2 decades.
@3
Jun 25th, 2014 - 03:31 am - Link - Report abuse 0Stability comes from predictability. If you know what rules you are lending the money under, and know that you have force of law if necessary to get it back, you are willing to lend in the first place.
Argentina wants to issue bonds under THEIR laws, even though the whole world knows that they change them willy-nilly, or ignore their own laws when it's convenient for them.
Would you lend a billion $$ to someone who say they are going to make the rules about how they pay it back, and there is nothing you can do about it if they decide to not pay you?
Hmmm...?
The terms, conditions and wording in Argentina's bond issue were extraordinary circumstances because they were considered potential deadbeats and high risk. So what did Argentina do......fulfilled a financial prophecy. Any precedent setting in Argentina's case will be highly likely not to apply to others defaulting nations. No one does what they do.
Jun 25th, 2014 - 03:42 am - Link - Report abuse 0Hmmm... I don't care if anyone lends us money or not. I hope no one does, ever again. Better for us long term. It's a myth that countries need debt to do well, before the 1800s that was non-existent. You either lived within your means or you died.
Jun 25th, 2014 - 03:44 am - Link - Report abuse 0Argentina has become used to living with its own means in the last 15 years. But the rest of the world it completely dependent AND addicted to it.
If Britain was denied funds, it would collapse within DAYS, forget 15 years. Same for all other nations in EUia, NorthAmia, LattoAmo, Asia, etc.
Now, ALL of you have lost the right to negotiate under US laws. There you are at the mercy of the lender who calls all the shots now.
Either you submit and have no rights, or you avoid the US system. I'm sure the latter will be the case and very long term the US will fuck itself, but in the mid-term get ready for many economic collapses.
@6
Jun 25th, 2014 - 03:53 am - Link - Report abuse 0But you HAVEN'T been living within your own means in last 15 years now, have you?
You have been printing pesos until it came out of your ears to fund your deficit spending, along with all the “pay-out programs” your whacky leadership deemed necessary to throw around in order to keep getting elected to power so they could continue the mismanagement.
And, to top the cake off, you manipulated inflation and price data to hide what you were doing, in the hopes that the world would notice just how far above your means you really were living.
So now that bills are coming due, how are you going to pay for it all, hmmm?
Forgive tobi he is a product of an Argentine education....
Jun 25th, 2014 - 04:15 am - Link - Report abuse 0..lololololol....not to mention he has experienced nothing but his mommas affections which is why he hates women.
#6 Time to pay up troll!!! I hope they make a movie from this, good for movie watchers across the world to learn to pay their debts....
Jun 25th, 2014 - 04:15 am - Link - Report abuse 0Maybe we will pay, maybe we won't.
Jun 25th, 2014 - 04:21 am - Link - Report abuse 0@7
If you don't borrow, you live within your means. All of what you just said is irrelevant. No debt is created by printing money, it simply lubricates the economy further, of course when you lubricate too much (as most of you surely know, I would not have experience in this), you “prematurely” lose the plot. Sure I have always admitted Argentina is in economic decline, because history states that once you are rich you are bound to become poor, sooner or later.
@8
Jun 25th, 2014 - 04:31 am - Link - Report abuse 0Apparently Argentine text books have no requirement for facts or accuracy.
@9
Agree. There is tremendous entertainment value in watching Argentina's antics on the world stage. But I still feel sorry for all the poor chaps in Argentina who will ultimately have to pay the bill for all this.
Which brings me to:
@10
Actually, when you print money you dilute the value of it. But you then go out and spend it as if it still has the old value. That creates a debt because the poor guy now holding the pesos discovers that they are not worth as much as what he gave away for them in the first place. So to pay for the debt he has to charge even more to the next guy. That is called inflation (for those of you who were educated in Argentina...)
It is a form of debt. Inflation is the interest on the deficit when you finance it by printing money.
And you pay for every time you go shopping and discover that prices went up yet again...
@11
Jun 25th, 2014 - 04:36 am - Link - Report abuse 0We can function with inflation. If your countries can't fine. Don't force low inflation on us.
@12
Jun 25th, 2014 - 04:42 am - Link - Report abuse 0“We can function with inflation” ?
Well, if inflation is OK, why does your whacky leadership go all out to hide it? Threaten to jail reporters for telling the truth about it...?
Nostrils
Jun 25th, 2014 - 04:58 am - Link - Report abuse 0You are embarrassing yourself (again).
You clearly know nothing about economics.
Not everyone issues bonds under New York or even US law. That is just the first major mistake of your ranting on here today.
@14
Jun 25th, 2014 - 06:51 am - Link - Report abuse 0The fine print means nothing when there is PRECEDENT. The precedent is (regardless of what the rules are in print): if you borrowed under US law, you DO NOT HAVE THE RIGHT to negotiate with creditors, if you are a sovereign state.
Sure, bonds issued outside the US are not affected, which is why in the long term this will help sink the US financial system as all borrowing (and therefore interest), will go overseas.
Here are more honest “anglos” at work:
http://news.yahoo.com/kfc-girl-hoax-133756398.html
The precedent?
Jun 25th, 2014 - 08:09 am - Link - Report abuse 0What precedent?
The precedent is in New York law. Not Australian law, not UK law and not even Argentine law.
If people decide to not issue bonds in New York, then so be it.
In your juvenile and not fully functional mind, you probably believe that all bond issuances are the same. They are not. They are a contract between parties. If parties wish to avoid what has happened to Argentina then they need to address that in any future contracts.
However, there is a reason these bonds were issued in New York. Because Argentine law was not considered trustworthy enough.
Nostrils, you have got yourself all tied up in knots over something you can't change. You keep trying to defect the bad news on to anyone else however you aren't highlighting anything new, justly rehashed stuff that is known.
The fact is, there are 49 other state jurisdictions in the US other than New York. And there are over 200 countries.
Argentina has learnt a lesson. And the world will move on. This won't even be news in a year's time. Let alone 6 months.
It is highly unlikely that Argentina will default. Your government is just doing what it could have done several years ago. However its propaganda won't change, which is why people like you fall so heavily when reality doesn't match your indoctrination.
If you wish to generalise about all “Anglos” (a term that has no agreed definition) based on one story about a KFC hoax then that is your choice.
I however won't stoop to such stupidity. I don't blame you for every murder or robbery or problem in your city, your country or even your ethnic/linguistic group.
That would be like accusing you of biting people simply because a Uruguayan named a Luis does that. Quite farcical and juvenile when you think of it.... the biting and any comparison.
Toby doesn't understand economics. I am very sure neither logic nor economics are taught in their schools.
Jun 25th, 2014 - 10:12 am - Link - Report abuse 0He is clearly trying to talk about something he can't understand.
Weird he's online all night too?
I wonder why?
Well, it looks like the Rg holdouts, Italian holdouts, and 13 other investments funds have piled onto the negotiations. I think just what Argentina owes these people IMMEDIATELY is 1.5X more than they have in U$.
My oh my this is fun to watch!
@3, 6, 10, 12, 15. Perhaps it will teach those like argieland to negotiate honestly in the first place. But the argie approach was “We'll pay 25-30 cents per dollar or you get nothing”. That's not “negotiation”, that's robbery under duress. Since you can't live within your means, you'll be dying. Good! And you'll be paying, or else. And, on the contrary, states can negotiate with creditors. They just have to do so honestly. Not something argieland does!
Jun 25th, 2014 - 11:31 am - Link - Report abuse 0Argentina won't pay. They'll never see the money. Based on what I'm reading I'm more convinced of that now.
Jun 25th, 2014 - 01:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0When Singer has an army, then perhaps.
Argentina will pay.
Jun 25th, 2014 - 01:39 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@20
Jun 25th, 2014 - 01:48 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You like revenge huh? Good Anglo.
Argentina's new national anthem......I WANT TO GO
Jun 25th, 2014 - 01:54 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Argentina will pay.
Yankee based on history......tobi will make a great economic minister.........he knows nothing about everything.
@22
Jun 25th, 2014 - 01:57 pm - Link - Report abuse 0More revenge. Good Anglo.
See, I don't lie. I always said Anlgos are vengeful.
It does look like a default is immanent. I don't think they have the will nor the means to pay. Especially since the Italians and 13 other investment funds are going to be party to the negotiations.
Jun 25th, 2014 - 02:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Toby, quick question, since the LNG ships wait in Int'l waters until they receive the wire for payment, who owns the LNG as it makes its way into MDP port? 3 guesses.
brr
@24
Jun 25th, 2014 - 02:15 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Yes, they will just sit out there and not work out a round-about solution, they will just turn around and sail away from a client that has money (to pay them, real businesses, not others).
hahaaha. So naïve.
Titti boi tobi, everything you have posted in the past two years your government has acted in the complete opposite direction. You are quite a barometer......from here on in we shall call you the K index..........lolololol.
Jun 25th, 2014 - 02:24 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Comment removed by the editor.
Jun 25th, 2014 - 06:32 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Nostrils says:
Jun 25th, 2014 - 09:53 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“You like revenge huh? Good Anglo.”
Nostrils you really need to reread some, if not most, of your recent lunatic rantings and ravings. Revenge is something you seem extremely proud to rant about.
Yet again you call yourself an “Anglo”.
I like personal responsibility. You don't seem to understand that. Argentina borrowed money and Argentina needs to pay it back. How is that vengeful?
C'mon, you that clearly thinks he is superior in intellect to everyone on here. How is asking someone to honour their commitments vengeful?
You keep ranting and raving about how Europeans and North Americans should take responsibility for their past actions. But when Argentina should do the same thing then it is revenge?
How many languages can you say hypocrite in now?
@28
Jun 26th, 2014 - 03:17 am - Link - Report abuse 0WHERE IS THE PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY OF WHAT THE UK AND US DID IN IRAQ??????? WHERE ARE THE APOLOGIES? THE ARRESTS? THE WAR TRIALS? REPARATIONS???
ANYTHING???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
I know you have no answer, so don't bother.
Argentina is still going to pay, Nostrils.
Jun 26th, 2014 - 07:21 am - Link - Report abuse 0Good to see UNASUR sticking together and supporting Argentina...
Jun 26th, 2014 - 01:16 pm - Link - Report abuse 0well done..ummmmmm
Take it to the UN titti boi if it was such an issue for you.
Jun 26th, 2014 - 02:00 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Get your kneepads out tobi..........Argentina is about to meet the day of days for her blatant disregard to law and kirchner' outright criminal and managerial stupidity.
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