MercoPress. South Atlantic News Agency
Malaysia jet killing 298 was apparently downed by Ukrainian separatists
A suspected Russian-made surface-to-air missile downed a Malaysia Airlines jet in a separatist-controlled corner of eastern Ukraine on Thursday, prompting the Kiev government to denounce an “act of terror” that killed all 298 people on board. Read full article
Comments
Disclaimer & comment rules“ Apparently ? ” Are you kidding ?
Jul 18th, 2014 - 06:36 am - Link - Report abuse 0It is rather conclusive evidence so far.
Russian advisers, Russian separatists, in Russian controlled Donetsk, using Russian supplied weapons, shooting down a civilian aircraft from 33,000 feet into Russian-controlled territory, close to the Russian frontier, then having a conversation about it in Russian, one day after admitting the shooting down of a Ukrainian transport aircraft.
Being an civilian aircraft with 298 passengers, 100 of which were AIDS specialists attending a conference in Melbourne, Australia, it is rather hard to stay neutral on the matter.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2696847/They-shouldnt-f-g-flying-There-war-going-Ukraine-intelligence-officials-release-phone-calls-claim-PROVES-Russia-shot-Flight-MH17.html
The separatists got the black box to Moscow straight away, so we can forget a truthful account where that is concerned, I understand these missiles leave a some sort of trail behind them, so that should provide the best evidence.
Jul 18th, 2014 - 07:04 am - Link - Report abuse 0I don't think this will pan out well for Russia at all.
KFCs new best friends - says it all. The International Pariahs Club.
Jul 18th, 2014 - 07:41 am - Link - Report abuse 0The silence of the trolls…
Whether the FDR and CVR have any definitive information or not, their greatest value will be in knowing that the rebels sent them to Moscow. If that proves to be what has happened then that would speak volumes. And if Moscow doesn't immediately refuse to handle them and insists they go to the proper investigators then that also will speak volumes. Still, at least CDK will still be their friend - and Snowden.
Jul 18th, 2014 - 08:14 am - Link - Report abuse 0Your place in history is guaranteed Putin.
Jul 18th, 2014 - 08:21 am - Link - Report abuse 0And it isn't what you have been hoping for you vain little man.
This is what happens when you give sophisticated SAMs to rebel groups without the intelligence support to actually identify what's being aimed at.
Jul 18th, 2014 - 08:30 am - Link - Report abuse 0This is negligent homicide. I don't believe they thought “let's bring down a Malaysian passenger jet” the thought process was probably more along the lines of “something's in the sky, let's see what this button does”
Russia could end up crippled by this. Although it is a massive country with a huge military it has an economy smaller than Italy. It simply cannot sustain economic warfare or a prolonged military action.
Won't need the flight data to determine what occurred. Most of the relevant details are already in the public domain. Some of the separatists at the site have already apologised to Australian journalists.
Jul 18th, 2014 - 08:44 am - Link - Report abuse 0There are still dozens of bodies strewn across the crash site. This makes me furious. What was Russia thinking giving missiles to these morons??!!
@6 The first round of sanctions by the US and the EU against Russia were agreed two days ago. I imagine Putin will be dreading the next round of sanctions.
Jul 18th, 2014 - 08:58 am - Link - Report abuse 0I have been watching coverage on RT International to see if their coverage could get any ghastlier, it couldn't!
Jul 18th, 2014 - 09:03 am - Link - Report abuse 0It transpires that the missiles are probably those captured by the rebels from the Ukrainian military. However they would probably have needed Russian experts to teach them how to use them. These are not hand held SAMs (which couldn't reach that altitude anyway) they are trucks with launchers
Jul 18th, 2014 - 09:08 am - Link - Report abuse 0Sky just aired amateur footage of the crash, with a translation of the background conversation from the people filming it, rather enthusiastic about it.
Jul 18th, 2014 - 10:01 am - Link - Report abuse 01st man. “wow that's precision.”
2nd man. “yes, good job they brought those rockets here.”
So it seems that the local populace knew who shot it down, what shot it down, but did not know what it had shot down.
Putin has blood on his hands.
And yet, if we read various articles, we can see the comments from the clowns. And no-one should avoid making the connections. Shoot down a Malaysian airliner, either directly or by proxy, and why wouldn't you support a dictatorship? No-one should ignore control of a territory by a terrorist organisation. What does this make latam? Too much to suggest that Russia should feel shame. Can't find any trace of shame anywhere in its history.
Jul 18th, 2014 - 10:22 am - Link - Report abuse 0@10
Jul 18th, 2014 - 10:59 am - Link - Report abuse 0Where have you read that it has transpired to be a launcher stolen from the Ukranian military as opposed to one clandestinely supplied by Russia. I thought that was still one of the big unknowns, I haven't read anything different?
So what options are there to respond to this? Sanctions don't seem to be enough and who is going to bomb the rebels? Will Russia sit by and let them destroy the rebels?
Jul 18th, 2014 - 02:41 pm - Link - Report abuse 014
Jul 18th, 2014 - 02:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The simple fact is that Russia will always be insecure about who is in control of the Ukraine, as soon as the war is over which will probably have Kiev imposing its control over Donetsk and defeating the rebels, the Russian influence will slowly return behind the curtains. That is If they dont go out for a all out invasion now.
Best solution is the Finlandization of the Ukraine, in which the Russians agree to allow the Ukraine to establish FTA and immigration agreements with Europe, and adopt western like governance and system, liberalization of trade but in exchange never really join formally western institutions like the EU and NATO, promise to Russia they will never allow US or western bases in Ukraine and give up their foreign policy all together, just be neutral buffer country between Russia and the West.
Its not fair for the Ukranians free determination and acceptance as a sovereign country but it is the most pragmatic solution there is.
This is mostly fault of the EU for not having a foreign policy apart from expansion towards the East and giving people false hopes and expectations and yet at the same time not being able to provide security nor understanding the reality of these countries.
13 Britworker
Jul 18th, 2014 - 03:05 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“@10
Where have you read that it has transpired to be a launcher stolen from the Ukranian military as opposed to one clandestinely supplied by Russia. I thought that was still one of the big unknowns, I haven't read anything different?”
According to July 18 Vancouver Sun newspaper:
A week ago, a pro Russian Seperatist leader posted pictures of a Buk on his social media site, bragging about stealing it.
Now, the picture has suddenly disappeared and they deny they have any such weapons.
29/6/2014 Russia's ITAR TASS reports PRO-Russian Separatists have gained control of the BUK anti-aircraft missile system.
Jul 18th, 2014 - 03:18 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Plane shot down
17/7/2014 Russia's ITAR TASS reports PRO-Russian Separatists have never had control of the BUK anti-aircraft missile system.
@16-17
Jul 18th, 2014 - 04:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I understand that but the Russian border is 25 miles away in separatist controlled land, I suspect a great deal of hardware has crossed that border in recent months, I don't think anyone at the present time can be sure about the specific delivery vehicle or it's origins.
15. I cant agree. I'm no fan of the EU but the real villain here is Russia. Russia seized Crimea, Russia is arming the separatists and Russian propaganda from their highly disreputable news agencies is encouraging armed dissent in Ukraine. Why should the people of Ukraine have to suffer Finlandisation or be unable to choose a destiny which hasn't had the full approval of Moscow? Why shouldn't Ukraine choose a partnership with a group of nations which share democratic values as opposed to be forced into a marriage with a 70's throwback like Putin? Russia needs to get over itself. There is no security threat to Russia from Ukraine. There may be an economic even or a cultural threat from the west but that's more to do with the current moral weakness of the current Russian regime. There is no imminent military threat from NATO since most EU countries have been cutting defence budgets and until Russia intervened in the Ukraine the USA has been drawing its forces down from Europe. There's certainly no “Cassus Bellum” in Ukraine and certainly no reason for people to die. Unfortunately Russia is now going to reap the reward for electing what they once believed was a strong man but was instead a feckless thug...
Jul 18th, 2014 - 04:16 pm - Link - Report abuse 019.
Jul 18th, 2014 - 05:01 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I'm not trying to excuse Russian behaviour but It’s that to answer your questions you have to understand Russian history, geography, its strategic interests and how their mindset works.
NATO should not have expanded into the East in the first place as the Western powers had agreed not to do at the end of the Cold war.
It’s the same principle that applies to the Russian interests in the Caucasus and Central Asia. Russia will always try to anchor itself as far as possible from its plains and its core undefendable lands; this has being a principle defense policy since the first Romanov Tsars . Conquer or be conquered. And if this is not possible, place a buffer state around your territory or else destabilize the regions around you and have the border factions fight each other.
It is after all, a country that has enormous internal challenges and threats and the existence as a Federation is questionable in a long term future if it liberalizes and de centralizes.
innocent until proven guilty...
Jul 18th, 2014 - 05:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 0If the rebels fired the missile it has got nothing to do with Russia whether they supplied the missiles or they were stolen.......
The West has been slowly pushing Russia against the wall first by NATO
installing the ANTI BALLISTIC MISSILE DEFENCE in Rumania, Poland, and Spain. Then the elected government is overthrown in Ukrain and installed with a puppet unelected government from the west which made Russia move in and protect their navy bases in Crimea which they did.....
Russia has counter attacked by reopening their bases in Cuba and shorly will be opening more bases in Nicaragua and Venezuela......On my judgement I can identify the aggressor nor matter how much of a dictator Putin maybe....
and of course hollywood has got its machinery rolling anti Russian propoganda like the new _24_ TV show having The Russians and Chinese as the bad guys and trying to destroy Jack bauer.......
and as who fired the missile against the civilian plane well.........
History, culture and language all provide a strong case for Crimea to be part of Russia. For that Putin can't be blamed. What he can be blamed for is backing the pro-Russia fighters trying to destabilise other parts of Ukraine.
Jul 18th, 2014 - 05:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 0This particular incident is a disaster for Putin. At a time when the US is pushing the EU for more sanctions on Russia, a plane full of EU citizens is shot down.
@7 Heisenbergcontext
“What was Russia thinking giving missiles to these morons??!!”
Indeed. And once the mourning is over the victims families might start to ask what a commercial fight was doing over a war zone. I am sure it is normal practice, but could it be construed as negligent? We could see more airlines fitting SAM counter measures in future.
@14 Klingon
Sanctions take time. The Russian stock market was crashing prior to this.
The rebels are already being destroyed. It is very easy for the West to provide very specialised help to the Ukrainian forces with in Ukraine.
With what I am reading and hearing on this subject, the BUK 21 is a sophisticated item of military equipment.
Jul 18th, 2014 - 05:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0One cannot just hop into it and operate it, let alone drive it without a minimum of 2 months training. This is not plug and go, or stealing the car keys from Papa from the cupboard for a neighbourhood joy-ride in the Toyota.
Looking at Google Earth, the launch site mentioned in the transcripts is a mere 18 km from the Russian frontier with Ukraine.
Another report mentioned that Ukraine military came under “rocket fire” from a village on the Russian side of the frontier earlier this week.
I think the evidence is that the Cossack unit mentioned was responsible, believing the Malaysian civilian aircraft to be a Ukrainian military cargo aircraft, but looking at the above, another possibility arises that this launch either came from the Russian side, or that the BUK rockets were activated and launched by Russian advisers. Ultimately, we will know the facts.
Cabeza Amigo (Nr.15) I agree with you 150% about this illustrating Russia's insecurity very clearly. The original problem for the Russians was the Ukrainian people wanting to join the European Union, and a strong-arm action against Yanukovych to prevent that, which they continue to exert pressure on using masked Russian military advisers and troops. Here is the latest result of such paranoia: Another shooting down of a commercial aircraft, with multi-national loss of life, which Putin ignores with a waive of the hand.
@23
Jul 18th, 2014 - 05:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Seeing as there is no upside for the Russian government to shoot down a civilian airliner, why would they put this kind of equipment in the hands of the pro-Russia militia?
You would think that the separatists requirements would be met by shoulder launched units.
@24
Jul 18th, 2014 - 06:17 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Hmmm, that's a little naive of you. I dont think anyone believes this was a deliberate intention to shoot a civilian airline down, obviously they thought it was something else and shooting aircraft down belonging to the Kiev government is very much in the interests of the Russian Federation.
24-
Jul 18th, 2014 - 06:23 pm - Link - Report abuse 0To give the winning, or upper hand to the Russian separatists. Clearly, the aim is for Russia to take more territory, if not r-absorb all of the Ukraine.
Listening to the speech in the UN today by Russia's envoy Churkin, they do not care about the consequences, only about having a free hand in the Ukraine.
@Britworker
Jul 18th, 2014 - 06:40 pm - Link - Report abuse 0That is what I am saying - I don't believe the Russians would shoot down a civilian airliner. It weakens their hand internationally. The neutral countries will reconsider their position. It will push the EU to join the US in more sanctions against Russia.
I can't understand why the Russians would provide this kind of system to the separatists when short range missiles would serve their needs.
@27
Jul 18th, 2014 - 06:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Er, not sure you are getting this! Russia and the Ukraine separatists are hell bent on destroying the current Kiev government and that DOES include shooting their military planes out of the sky, which is exactly what they thought they had done and were very happy about it, until they realised it was a civilian airline they had misidentified. So:
Russia very happy that a plane had been shot down
Russia not very happy it turned out to be a Malaysian 777.
Yes? Do you get it now?
They are Russian, over kill, Soviet style!
Jul 18th, 2014 - 06:51 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@28 Britworker
Jul 18th, 2014 - 07:12 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I am getting it fine.
The prospect of a civilian airliner being shot down is bad for Russia so why give the weaponry capable to do so to the separatists. This was foolish by the Russians. The aircraft the separatists have been shooting down have been flying at lower altitude.
Do the separatists really need to have missiles that can shoot down an aircraft at 10,000m altitude for the nature of the campaign they are fighting. The answer I think is “no”.
And if for what ever reason they must have, then they should at least know how to use it.
The fact that international airlines have been flying this route suggests that the assumption was that such sophisticated air defence was in the hands of the competent authorities, i.e. the Russians, not the drunk Cossacks at the road block.
30
Jul 18th, 2014 - 07:42 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“Do the separatists really need to have missiles that can shoot down an aircraft at 10,000m altitude for the nature of the campaign they are fighting. The answer I think is “no”.”
I think you need to remember that the BUK SAM can also hit targets at less than 10.000 mt altitude!! That is the reason they have it. If it didn't serve their purposes they would not use it.
However It's a legitimate question to know why was Malaysian and other airlines flying over that zone
BUK missile launcher photographed trucked on trailer back to Russia Friday, no doubt to conceal and destroy the evidence from investigators:
Jul 18th, 2014 - 07:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 0http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2696975/Putin-blames-Ukraine-loss-Flight-MH17-298-innocent-souls-DOESNT-deny-Russian-separatists-shot-missile-McCain-warns-Hell-pay.html
Seen and photographed Friday being trucked back to Russia. Note that 2 of the 4 missiles on the BUK are missing. That same BUK was filmed and photographed moving up 1 day earlier to the villages of Torez and Snizhne, near the crash site.
One of the more brainless, unimaginative stories being floated by Russia Today, is that the West somehow dropped the bodies on the field, sprinkling them with passports.
And the source of the bodies according to RT ? The previous missing flight of Malaysian Airlines (370) that disappeared back in March. Idiotas completos !
Mr. Vlad, the friend of Latin America.
@CD
Jul 18th, 2014 - 08:05 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I think they just demonstrated why the BUK doesn't serve their purposes!
33.
Jul 18th, 2014 - 08:17 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Their logic is, the more and the more sophisticated weapons they have, the better. And the BUK was serving their purpose when they hit down the Ukrainian AN-26 just a few days ago. Other than that I think you are giving to much credit to the Russian militants line of thinking. Its not sure yet whether if the Russian supplied it or the rebels captured the piece.
This SAM is pretty widespread in the Former Soviet sphere of influence
Putin phoned Obama to talk about the security of the civil planes flying in the zone minutes before this was known
CD...
Jul 18th, 2014 - 08:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Fcuk Russia's insecurity and your support of them (Putrid)
They thought nothing of invading Poland and Finland and their drive into the West carving up all the Eastern Bloc countries...
Why pander to their whims...they have a third rate Economy and a third world lifestyle ...
So they have Nukes...so what, it's the only reason anyone listens to them,
North Korea have them too...big deal...
Isolate them...build shields all along their border and ignore them....
They don't have the money for any prolonged conflict....
The West have the means and they should do it.....
The Yanks are a bunch of Fannies...can an American citizen buy a Kalashnikov from Kalashnikov.....Yes they can...great Sanctions....
Russia was invaded buy Vikings, Tartars, Teutonic Crusaders, Mongols, Turks, Lithuanians, Poles, Swedes, French, Germans. I think that they understand their history and limitations when defending their country far better than a throwback like you.
Jul 18th, 2014 - 08:57 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Stalin was just trying to appease Hitler when he did so but the carving up of eastern Europe obeys the traditional defence policy of Russia that Im refering too.
The world is changing far more faster than we realize. What was true or believed 10 years ago is now turning completely upside down. Cyber warfare and weapons in space may will may make Nuclear arsenals useless in seconds. Geography still matters and will do so for the foreseeable future, that is the only few certain things.
And besides
They have the nukes.... and the Second largest army of the world you buffoon.
The AK's that are in the black market or the americans buy are mostly Chinese made.
Findlanization is a solution that has proven to work. Its not going to be you and Conqueror nor any other keeboard warrior guarding the Eastern borders.
Oye, Cabeza -
Jul 18th, 2014 - 10:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0According to TASS, RT, and US news media, Mr. Putin first contacted Mr. Obama to inform him “ that a plane had crashed in the Ukraine. ” That was once he was back on the ground.
Prior to that he was reportedly in the air, returning from the BRICS meeting here.
Another of the stupid comments from RT is that the Ukraine was targeting him, with a jet, and that he was in the same airspace region as the Malaysian Airliner. The Ukraine states that they had no jets up, as one had been shot down only the day before. But it is clear that the separatists, or Russian advisers were targeting aircraft, hunting the skies, and openly bragging about it. And again, they had no friend or foe signal (transponder) capability, to distinguish civilian aircraft, and were blindly targeting anything in the sky that moved.
Given the fact that they were, then it could have been possible that Putin could have been shot down by his own pro-Russian forces, by mistake, in that scenario.
For that reason alone, I think that the Cossacks, and the GRU advisers identified and recorded yesterday, will vanish, never to be heard from again, probably with a bullet in the back of the neck.
I do understand what you are saying regarding Finland as a buffer zone. However, would you accept being Finlandized in your own country ?
I think if I was Ukrainian I would accept that the big neighbor holds real leverages over the country, I would accept the most pragmatic solution as long as it allows the country to develop itself and move forward.
Jul 18th, 2014 - 11:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I think the historic fault line here begins with the Mongol conquest. It was really the Kievan Principality in Ukraine where Russian culture was born. But they where conquered for more than 200 years by the Golden Hoard and later on the Poles and Turks, so the Duchy of Moscow and the Republic of Novgorod remained independent in the north and later established themselves as power houses of what is now the modern Russian state. It makes much more sense for me that Ukraine be a single country with European Russia from the Carpathians all the way to the Urals, with its capital in Kiev therefore the country wouldn’t have developed this historic obsession of conquest and the country would be far more decentralized and European like and a lot of blood and lives would have being spared and the strategic geopolitical weakness of Russia would have being solved.
Cabelo-
Jul 19th, 2014 - 12:57 am - Link - Report abuse 0I appreciate your thoughts and comments.
Were I Ukrainian, there would be very good reasons I would want to stay away from Russia and being annexed again by Russia.
In 1932, the then Soviet Union began collectivizing farms and food they produced for Moscow. By 1932, the starvation deaths caused by the forcible collectivizing resulted in “only 4 million dead ” according to the official Soviet records. In other words, one could farm the land, but could not eat anything grown from it.
The actual number was probably double that, closer to 7.4 million dead, but not the 12 million that Ukraine estimates it to be. Many were also forcibly relocated to Siberia during that time.
Then along comes the carnage and further butchery of World War II, and Ukraine is again a victim, first by the Germans and then again by the Russians. Once again today it is Russia annexing, by force, with lives lost.
The EU scares Mr. Putin and Russia, to the point of him threatening the Ukraine, and then for the lack of a better word invading it in the Crimea. What is going on now is a slow-motion theft, by force of the Ukraine, resulting in the trigger-happy reaction yesterday with the BUK.
Were I Ukrainian now, I would want to either leave the Ukraine, or put something in place to prevent Mr. Putin, or his imperialistic successors, from invading.
Finland as you know was ordered to submit and immediately invaded by Soviet Russia at the outbreak of WW II. A number of nations help prevent that, including Germany, but in the end Finland submitted to the Soviet Russian demands.
We have a large number of Finns living in Fortaleza, by the way. Fortaleza at 25 C year round, is surprisingly appreciated more than Helsinki in December, at minus -20 C. They like it here, and the get along well with Cearences., as citizens are called in this state.
None that I have talked with speak very highly of either Mr. Putin, nor Russia.
It's a pity the US doesn't keep Argentina in line like CabezaDura thinks Russia should keep Ukraine in line.
Jul 19th, 2014 - 01:50 am - Link - Report abuse 0Perhaps it is time for a US invasion and the Finladisation of Argentina.
39.
Jul 19th, 2014 - 02:05 am - Link - Report abuse 0I don’t think anybody around Russia will speak highly of the Russians the same answer you can expect from Poles, Rumanians, Hungarians, Bulgarians, or the Baltic countries folk.
Unfortunately you have to be realistic about the following and that is the Russians will be there for the time being and they enjoy significant leverage and influence on these countries. They own, banks, businesses, electric grids, ports and so on in many of these Border States. In the case of the Ukraine even the political elite have ties with Moscow; both Yanukovich and Timoshenko had their honeymoons with the Kremlin, we all know that the FSB is very active all over the place. They have their Russian minorities all around Eastern Europe and Central Asia which they can puppeteer at the Kremlins disposal to cause trouble and unrest, and of course they have their Black Sea, Caspian and North Sea fleets… They have the gas cartel in control of your country and national trade balance and budget is compromised as a result of this, and if that wasn’t enough Germany the economical engine of the EU is dependent on their energy as well as many other Western Countries who are going throw their own crisis.
On the long term the US is destined to abandon Europe in the short term and in the midterm leave the Middle East to focus on the Asia Pacific region.
I think the best thing they have is each other eastern European countries, as NATO dissolves you will have another Warsaw pact, but this time looking towards the East instead of the West.
The airliner was shot down by a Russian SAM system by separatists backed by Russia. This is a crime against humanity and it has the Russian bears paw prints all over it. The buck stops at its President – Putin. The cant and hypocrisy spouted by the few trolls and Russian apologists on this site reflects the same anti-western mindset that we have seen over other issues.
Jul 19th, 2014 - 02:38 am - Link - Report abuse 0The question that has been (correctly) asked here is “Who allowed these morons access to a sophisticated SAM system when they are manifestly unqualified to operate it? It is apparent from the intercepted phone conversations that they were just shooting with absolutely no consideration being given to target identification and discrimination.
Let us not forget that a week ago the Russian president was in Argentina signing over Russian nuclear technology to another bunch of irresponsible morons – the Argentine government!
Is this modern Russia’s gift to humanity?
I've just learned something from you, Cabeza.
Jul 19th, 2014 - 04:32 am - Link - Report abuse 0“ They have the gas cartel in control of your country . . ” ? They do ?
When did that happen to Petrobras and Brasil ?
42 downunder
Jul 19th, 2014 - 04:57 am - Link - Report abuse 0Exactly right.
Well said, Sir.
Hello Russia, this is 2014, your phone calls were intercepted and we all saw your BUK being driven back over the border minus a few missiles. You might have state controlled media there, but we saw and heard everything and you are rumbled.
Jul 19th, 2014 - 07:42 am - Link - Report abuse 0Now there is a world army of forensic crash investigators heading for the site and you won't be able to hold them off with one drunken peasant with a gun.
Truth will out!
You know, I'd be accusing Pooty of personally ordering the downing of the aircraft because he wanted to kill a bunch of scientists involved with controlling AIDS. His policies on gays is well known. I know, I know, but as we say here,“ He may not be guilty, but let's watch him deny it!”
Jul 19th, 2014 - 08:28 am - Link - Report abuse 0Today I learnt that my neighbours and their 3 kids were on board MH17.
Jul 19th, 2014 - 01:03 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Truth is already out but it's revealing to watch the Russian reaction via the Russian media. I dont know about you but I hate being lied to. If there was any sort of honour or nobility in Russia then they should man up, tell the truth and apologise for what's happened. The fact they don't and they lie and they obfuscate tells you all you need to know about the childlike Russian character. My wife comes from one of the Baltic states does anyone from Latin America want to explain to her how her small country doesn't have the right to determine it's own future because it might scare the poor old, paranoid Russian bear? If the same right to self determination exists in the Baltic then it should also apply in Ukraine. Russia is scared of the west not because there is some existential threat but because it suits the Russian leadership to be scared of the west. They need a big bad enemy in order to define themselves. It's not good enough for Russian apologists to buy into their paranoia. Reality is reality and fantasy is fantasy. You can follow the lead of Mr Putin if you want but in the end the only thing you'll end up doing is demeaning yourself.
Jul 19th, 2014 - 01:34 pm - Link - Report abuse 047 Anglotino
Jul 19th, 2014 - 04:29 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“Today I learnt that my neighbours and their 3 kids were on board MH17.”
Sorry to hear that, Anglo.
A good example that this is not some abstract victimless crime.
There were REAL and INNOCENT victims,
and THEY ARE OUR NEIGHBOURS AND FRIENDS !
What will be done about this, now?
The majority of these separatists are not Ukranians, they are exactly what they were in Crimea, Russian Special forces, sent in by Putin.
Jul 19th, 2014 - 06:02 pm - Link - Report abuse 0He is responsible for the death of 298 innocent men, women and children and he will probably fucking get away with it, because no one in Europe has the balls to stand up to him and he knows it.
And they insult the world by Robbing the dead,
Jul 19th, 2014 - 06:48 pm - Link - Report abuse 0pathetic and disgusting,
Putin should be ashamed, but he aint,
all those that support Russian actions should be ashamed, but they aint,
yet apparently the Eu still refuses to enforce stricter sanctions,
very bad..
Russia must be heavily sanctioned and Putin ostracised from all global fora.
Jul 20th, 2014 - 02:08 am - Link - Report abuse 0As the truth emerges I grow more disgusted.
47 Anglotino
Jul 20th, 2014 - 04:29 am - Link - Report abuse 0“Today I learnt that my neighbours and their 3 kids were on board MH17.”
Sorry to hear that Anglotino, that moves the whole tragedy very close to you!
24 Condorito
Jul 20th, 2014 - 05:23 am - Link - Report abuse 0Intercepted Russian comms have indicated the BUK missile launcher was being operated by a Cossack crew, who by the apparent mistake were not fully competent. The BUK has given the Russian supported terrorists several successes in the last week. They successfully shot down an Antonov transport, a helicopter and a fighter. Unlike shoulder fired short range heat seeking missles these radar guided, long range, Mach 3 units offer one shot one kill results. The fatal mistake of shooting down the Malaysian passenger plane was in all likelihood an incorrect identification of the jets transponder, several other passenger planes had been flying the same route but lucky for them the crews of the other BUK launchers were better trained and possibly Russian regular forces. Putin will try his best to wash his hands of this, but a crime of this magnitude cannot be left unpunished and like Sen. John Mc Cain said “there will be hell to pay”. Hang on Ruskies there's a shit storm headed your way.
I think that the Russians sometimes use the name Cossack as a word of derision, they probably meant that system was being operated by Donetsk Russians.
Jul 20th, 2014 - 05:37 am - Link - Report abuse 0Which to my mind lends more authenticity to the intercept.
Just found out the Venezuelan Foreign Office has announced that the USA and their NATO allies are responsible for this tragedy. The minister for Foreign Relations said that the Dogs of War were unleashed to cause instability in the region...
Jul 20th, 2014 - 08:20 pm - Link - Report abuse 0https://cloud-1405708206-cache.cdn-cachefront.net/pena-ajena-ridiculo-mundial-regimen-de-maduro-acusa-eeuu-y-la-otan-de-tragedia-del-malaysia-airlines/
( first published in El Universal)
... what the heck has it got to do with them anyway? Announce your condolences for sure, but as for the unsubstantiated statements of blame?????
What is the matter with these people?
The only people who give a flying ferk about that mad bastards opinion are the other mad bastards, fortunately, he carries about as much influence in international spheres as the zit on my arse!
Jul 20th, 2014 - 08:50 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Interesting how Ukranian int releases another intercept concerning the black boxes, footage shows what is clearly a black box being recovered and behold, the separatists then hold a press conference admitting they have them and saying they will turn them over.
Moscow must be spitting blood at yet another ferk up!
It is disturbing that the EU has allowed this to happen in their area of responsibility. It does not bode well for the future.
Jul 21st, 2014 - 01:08 pm - Link - Report abuse 0that the EU has allowed this to happen in their area of responsibility
Jul 21st, 2014 - 01:35 pm - Link - Report abuse 0?????????????Who's
#598 Hepatitis C you must be so proud of your new found friends....the Russian.
Jul 21st, 2014 - 02:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 058 Hepatia/ British Bomber sock
Jul 21st, 2014 - 03:34 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Futile attempt to shift blame
58 Hepatia (#)
Jul 21st, 2014 - 04:02 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Pat yourself on the back on how they Russians have the black boxes and have the terrorists stealing bodies to deny forensics.
When the russians build their bases in SA, maybe SA jets will start falling for the skys. You are a bunch of begging whores seeking crumbs from wherever and whomever will toss them to you. You may getaway with defaulting on debt with the West..............try it in the east.
They're desperate, Poppy.
Jul 21st, 2014 - 06:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Rational thought or consequences do not enter into it.
I was reading the people in Moscow have been dropping signs and notes in front of the Dutch embassy asking for forgiveness. Not one sentiment for the Argentine's....as she fears pissing off the dick that know controls Argentina.
Jul 21st, 2014 - 06:53 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Kretina, wipe off your lip it looks disgusting.
Have you noticed how the silence from CFK is deafening...
Jul 21st, 2014 - 08:00 pm - Link - Report abuse 0It seems that the Russian billionaires are not too happy with comrade Putin.
Jul 21st, 2014 - 08:54 pm - Link - Report abuse 0http://money.msn.com/business-news/article.aspx?feed=BLOOM&date=20140721&id=17790840
Poppy
Jul 21st, 2014 - 09:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Interesting article
Do you think that Argentina will simply walk away from Western creditors leaving their debts unpaid, now that they think they can get funds elsewhere?
I think Cretina will do pretty much anything to avoid payment, and then try to 'spin' it for the domestic audience that that she has 'saved' them.
Jul 21st, 2014 - 09:50 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Sadly, I predict, that many will accept it and blame others when the lights go out...
That is what they are hedging their money on. She is thinking screw them all. However she is too incompetent to know Argentina still needs to buy from the west.
Jul 21st, 2014 - 10:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0http://en.mercopress.com/2014/07/18/malaysia-jet-killing-298-was-apparently-downed-by-ukrainian-separatists#comment339904: The point is what is the EU doing to oppose the RF. Nothing. The question is why not!
Jul 22nd, 2014 - 02:11 am - Link - Report abuse 0Hepatia/BritishBomberSock
Jul 22nd, 2014 - 02:18 am - Link - Report abuse 0The question is:
“ why do you support Russia?”
Hepitis A,B or C?
Jul 22nd, 2014 - 01:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 0.....politics and war is more complicated than the primordial comprehension of an simple Argentina and Russia is exploiting that. However Putin will soon realize that he seriously erred.
By simply trying to understand Russia and the broader picture of things doesn’t necessary mean passing judgment, excuses for its behavior nor avoid recognizing Russia's crimes.
Jul 22nd, 2014 - 01:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I think this a good reference and far more detailed and better explination than mine as to why Russia does what it does and what may come of the federation in the future.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HE6rSljTwdU
Winston Churchill:
Jul 22nd, 2014 - 02:45 pm - Link - Report abuse 0First broadcast on the 1st October 1939
“I cannot forecast to you the action of Russia. It is a riddle wrapped in a mystery inside an enigma; but perhaps there is a key. That key is Russian national interest.”
----------------------------------------------------
So everything changes, yet nothing changes.
Plus ca change!
Gullible CD.....
Jul 22nd, 2014 - 05:13 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The same argument could be applied to most countries in Europe....France can not be defended, it can be invaded through Belgium, Switzerland, Germany, Italy, Spain, The North Sea, The Atlantic and Luxembourg....
It was interesting to hear a Russian admit that Russia embarked on a policy of Ethnic cleansing and Genocide as though this was a natural thing to do....
Ah... those Russians...
74.
Jul 22nd, 2014 - 06:11 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Exactly
75. France is actually pretty well defended in geographic terms. From Italy by the Alps, Spain by the Pyrennes. Germany the have the River Rhine and Vosges forests and the Ardennes up North.
In the Battle of Bulge well defended like the German armies did in early 1945 caused havoc to the incoming Americans and allied forces. So the Ardennes is a good enough defense asset on either side.
It’s only by the Low countries European plane gap that has been France's Achilles heel historically. But overall France has beaten Hapsburg/Catholic league encirclement for centuries; it destroyed the Spanish armies of Rocroi from the Spanish Netherlands.
General Turenne feed catholic Germans, Italians and Spanish steel and lead for years on these barriers.
And on the Atlantic coast it is true that sea faring peoples invaded like the English and Viking raiders. But they were only successful in periods of French internal division and civil war. Despite a good navy Britain never had a good continental European army, safe for Marlborough era and the 100 years war.
Ps. And Shirvan is not Russian, he is from Azerbaijan
France was so well defended it fell to Germany in only six weeks...Netherlands and Belgium in even less.....
Jul 22nd, 2014 - 07:57 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Yeah Britain have never had a good army...not quite sure how they defeated the Ottoman Empire.. the Chinese...and your favourites the Russians at Crimea...vastly outnumbered in all cases....etc....must have been given that Empire of theirs....
Yes, I cand of was predicting and expecting you will answer back with the case of WWII. And the Germans invaded a sovereign independent country like Belgium in order to invade France from the Nothern European plane.
Jul 22nd, 2014 - 08:42 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Yet France first under Charlomagne and then under Napoleon conquered Germany... So yeah all said.
France for most of its history as a modern national state was circled by the Hapsburg family that controlled the Spanish and Austrian Empires. And had to fight the British on the overseas.
I think that history has already proven them the best fighters in Europe.
BTW if Russia didn't have that strategic depth that we talk about and Hitler hadn't made some stupid mistakes Britain would have fallen in less than six weeks.
Would that be the best fighters that were defeated at......
Jul 22nd, 2014 - 08:57 pm - Link - Report abuse 0a clue might be....“Hydro-toilet”
...weren't they beaten in Canada as well....
Cheese eating Surrender monkeys...French word BTW...Surrender....
If's and ands were pots and pans.....
If Hitler could have taken Britain...he would....
...that would have been a first in the last...let me see...oh yes.....Thousand years and that's not beaten..that's invaded..;-))
Britain was invaded by the Germans.... and the French... and the Italians... and the Danes...and the Dutch
Jul 22nd, 2014 - 09:07 pm - Link - Report abuse 0But Scotland was invaded by the Irish and then by the Norwegians and English and then a Italian charlatane told them they could invade England and place a King. And it might have worked if the King was English.... But there was a German king in London and it didn't work quite well then did it..
Britain hasn't been invaded since 1066...that's nearly a thousand years....
Jul 22nd, 2014 - 10:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Britain fights it's battles in other countries....
WRONG mister voice Britain was invaded in 1688 by William of Orange though your history books call it a “revolution” and a glorious one too!! LOL
Jul 22nd, 2014 - 11:29 pm - Link - Report abuse 0LOL you talk about French cheese eating as surrender monkeys
Anyway Culloden must have been a awful and bloody sight... Just think about all the Scottish cowards running so fast with their skirts in the air where revealing their ugly and hairy behinds to the English dragoons that cut them down to size under the orders of the Hannover king...
I hate to be mean to your country but you incist in these lies and arrogance so I will make it simple for you.
Scotsman and everything Scottish is overrated, you were always a poor, bankrupt and isolated country when England had to bail you out… Now you will return to this status as soon as you go independent. Hard truth for you is that you were nothing without the English navy and English economy. There wouldent be a such thing as scots diaspora in the world without a English navy. Scotland wasn’t invaded more because it’s a pile of rock and too poor for anybody to bother too much about it.
Get in line moron I had enough of you
There was no invasion of a Dutch army....they were welcomed ...Protestants..you see!
Jul 22nd, 2014 - 11:40 pm - Link - Report abuse 0How many posts does it take for CD to become unhinged and start to call people names....when he disastrously starts to lose an argument...
Same pattern all the time.....
Haha...I've now got you supporting the English that you were against a few posts ago.....
It's great to see you turn on Scotland now....because you think it will annoy me....
Wrong on that account...;-)))
..you are such a sore loser....is it time for you to do a disappearing act..again as I'm getting tired of wiping the floor with you....
CD...the Russian apologist....
Yeah whatever you say Mr random voice .....
Jul 22nd, 2014 - 11:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0It was pretty much a Dutch army interfering with internal affairs in London. Dutch soldiers patrolled the capital for over a year. But go ahead, brand it whatever you wish. Its invasion under any dictionary, but I guess that if the Spaniards had successfully landed in England and replaced Elizabeth I with their puppet and English catholics would have joined in and welcomed the Spaniards forces marching over London your history books would have called it a “revolution” too...
..give it up CD...you do not understand the English...
Jul 22nd, 2014 - 11:57 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Anything and Anyone, but Catholics!
William of Orange was a preferred option to the throne...simply because he was not Catholic....
Catholics were and are a minority...So there would never have been enough support for a Catholic puppet...
As if there was no protestant English noble in 1688 that could claim the throne... That would have been a proper revolution in the book.
Jul 23rd, 2014 - 12:05 am - Link - Report abuse 0Other thing is a foreigner with a foreign agenda, foreign army foreign navy dictating terms in London. That is the hard truth...
It’s not a matter of what the people were more inclined to welcome a Catholic invader or a protestant one, it’s a matter that they were invaded.
He also had his share of Scottish massacres this William of Orange.
I don't have the time or the inclination to teach you British History....
Jul 23rd, 2014 - 12:48 am - Link - Report abuse 0Suffice to say that there has to be a legitimate heir to the throne..any old noble will not do.....he was the only protestant one next in line...
You also make out there was a war between Scotland and England..there wasn't, they were in a Union. It's called the Jacobite rebellion...an attempt by Scottish Catholics to put a foreign Italian/Polish Pretender on the throne...
It was very much a Protestant/Catholic feud and Culloden was fought very much between Scottish regiments and clans that were for and against....
There were hardly any English there.....
So Culloden ...a battle led by an Italian using Scots against a German using Scots and mercenaries and Irish and a few English ...that doesn't constitute a Scotland England war!
In fact there are more people visiting Ikea at Braehead (Glasgow) on a weekend than took part in the battle...
When you have studied and understand the complexities of British politics at that time..then you can debate it....even then you will never understand the mindset...
It's late and so I'm done...
Unfortunately I probably know too much British history for your liking Voice. And this is your weakness and your problem, you think that you could lie about France and call them surrender monkeys and it ended up coming back to you. France has a more glorious military history than Britain has, and that is not to mention the Scotlands history.
Jul 23rd, 2014 - 01:02 am - Link - Report abuse 0They were mostly English you pathetic Scottish liar, catholic or not they were certainly Scots that run like rabbits and died that day plus not to mention all the Scots that the Royalists killed after the battle by Englishmen. You are still whining in songs today about the battle, there was even a band in Argentina that evocates the Jacobite disaster. And not make me talk about how Cromwell hammering the Scots.
In Europe at those days all battles there is a component of foreigners on either side or mercenaries
Yes you are definetly done...
There you go with your ignorance again Cromwell also hammered the English..
Jul 23rd, 2014 - 01:13 am - Link - Report abuse 0That's why it's called a Civil War....
We all know you are just a Googleite....
You are always only one post and Google from ignorance...;-)))
Oh and one more thing.....I don't want you to look stupid...but who said I was Scottish...;-))))
I rather think you were “done” there......one should never ASSUME...
Google ?? LOL I checked a military book at my dusty side of book shelf to see the component of the English army... yes English army lead by a German, otherwise I didn’t need to research anything. Obviously google will prove you wrong anyway.
Jul 23rd, 2014 - 01:29 am - Link - Report abuse 0Poor voice too stupid, to ignorant. On one thread playing the patriotic “yes” Scotsman and on another one hiding his nationalist side to avoid assuming that they are nobody and were always a joke...
Are you a immigrant from a close by Russian country, I don’t blame you for feeling like you do, but lie and attack other countries as cowards when you had to take refuge in Scotland...
If that is the case your ancestors were probably cheering on mine as they marched on Russia.
Nah you didn't...you Googled Scottish battles and saw Cromwell had invaded Scotland, not realising that he had also invaded England....being a Civil War....
Jul 23rd, 2014 - 02:00 am - Link - Report abuse 0You can't fool me CD...;-))
As for patriotic “YES” Scotsman..show me or forever hold your piece.....
Refuge...? I'm free to go wherever I like...unlike you that has never been out of your own Country....don't pretend you have...but it's OK to dream...one day eh!
If you want to Google a Scotland/England battle..try Bannockburn....them English sure did run in that one....
I didnt. Do you think I google along as it goes ?? LOL!!
Jul 23rd, 2014 - 02:13 am - Link - Report abuse 0Voice one thing is consulting in the internet some details, numbers and precise facts, but what you completely lack to have an argument is processed and elaborabote thinking and logic which is based on real base knowledge. If I had to google to reply to you all this stuff I would take hours to answer you in a assured manner, which actually happens to be your case.
I have being outside of Argentina. And if I hadn't why would I deny it?? You on the other hand obviously come from some Russian border or Eastern European country or perhaps some displaced minority within the Russian Federation but you fail to admit this. That you are a refuge doesn't mean you cant go wherever you like. I think that your comeback is more revealing than you think.
90 CD2
Jul 23rd, 2014 - 02:26 am - Link - Report abuse 0Well argued, AND researched , it seems.
I don't like everything I'm hearing, but you certainly have A_Voice on the ropes.
His posts have now descended to name-calling to intimidate you, and squirming to get out of his fix.
His whole reason for posting here, is show how clever and marvelous he is.
Didn't work this time. Now he's not interested.
93.
Jul 23rd, 2014 - 02:37 am - Link - Report abuse 0Yes I was being pretty civil until he started getting dirty and offensive in #79.
That’s is when I have to pull my gloves off.
Then he victimizes and as he feels humbled he goes on about me doing my research on google.
But sorry if I hurt anyone’s feelings
Good to see the UN working the way it's supposed to. As soon as the Security Council voted “unanimously” to support the resolution calling for the separatists to relinquish control of the crash site and release the remains “the atmosphere on the ground started to change.” ( SMH ).
Jul 23rd, 2014 - 07:09 am - Link - Report abuse 0The bodies have finally started to make the long trip home. It was also gratifying to see Frans Timmermans speaking with passion in support of the resolution and in support of the many Dutch victims. Bravo.
94
Jul 23rd, 2014 - 09:19 am - Link - Report abuse 0oh dear oh dear....PMSL at CD here.....what did I say about ignorance....??
“Yes I was being pretty civil until he started getting dirty and offensive in #79. ”
See what happens when you are unable to Google and haven't got a general knowledge of history....
You couldn't understand what I was saying @79 because you couldn't Google it...so you assumed I was being offensive....;-)))...Hydro-Toilet...;-)))
You have just proved my point.....
Why doesn't everyone tell him....the battle the French were beaten and surrendered is.....clue “Hydro-Toilet”.......Water-Loo......;-)))))
No, I actually did get that. But thats not the part I was refering too.
Jul 23rd, 2014 - 01:48 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Anyway Voice. Other than desperate self bolstering and many ;-)))))'s and .......(empty phrase).......(empty phrase)......
You dont seem to have anything interesting, smart or educated to say.
PS.Be careful when you pick up your fights with when you are independent though. This time France will not coming to save you when you fight the English.
I see that Australia is planning to invade the Ukraine. So, if a country that is over 10,000 miles away can take action against the Russians where are the Europeans who are next door? They are waiting for the US to save them.
Jul 23rd, 2014 - 01:55 pm - Link - Report abuse 0So what part of my post @79 was dirty and offensive...?..are you French...?
Jul 23rd, 2014 - 02:13 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I'm afraid you dropped a clanger and there is no hiding it....
You stick to Google and I'll stick to exploiting your ignorance, bigotry and fanatical support of little dictators.....
...am I the only one that can see through your charade of Anti-Anglo gibberish....
...you have even got Anglo's on here supporting you...
Way to go CD...I'm impressed....I really don't see a difference between yourself and Toby....
Ooo ....that terrible West.
...almost forgot...;-))))
@98
Jul 23rd, 2014 - 02:32 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I wouldn't characterise the suggestion that Australia might form part of a peace-keeping mission to secure the crash site as an “invasion”. If that's what you meant.
In any case The Netherlands are expected to take the lead, as it should, and the last time I checked the Dutch are...European. Right?
OMG you are so desperate and such a bad butt hurt loser, it must be you the one doing all the googleing as you go along; perhaps there were things you didn't even know about before and now you fantasies are up side down.
Jul 23rd, 2014 - 02:40 pm - Link - Report abuse 0As I already explained to you if I had to research all this stuf on google it may take me hours or even a day to answer you.
“Bigotry and fanatical support of little dictators. Anti-Anglo gibberish. And now I am parallel to the likes of Tobi... LOL yeah right.”
You know very well yourself that that is not true
Poor man that resorts to baseless accusations when someone has wiped the floor with you.
You obviously feel intimidated and resent educated people
I see you failed to explain what was dirty and offensive...thought so.....
Jul 23rd, 2014 - 04:00 pm - Link - Report abuse 0...hey CD I've got some grapes for you...they are a little bit sour, but should suit you fine...
As I recall and anyone can appreciate this thread begun with the concept of geographic barriers to defend a country... And why Russia was shaped this way.
Jul 23rd, 2014 - 04:38 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You replied that France is an indefensible country, and I explained politely why France is not an indefensible country like Russia is, I gave examples and elaborated further.
And then you decided to make a case about WWII and I replied and rightly so France dominated Germany twice in the past (and far longer than a couple of years Germany did in the 1940s). And then when you run out of arguments you came up with all this talk of surrender monkeys talk..
You decided to be offensive towards me, as you probably know by now many of my family and ancestors did fight and served in the French armed forces. And from where I am you standing you stupid fool??? From a boxing sack the Russians (which you don’t even want to admit from where are you from originally) or the boxing sack of the English??
You must understand that you will only get what you give.
You also may recall that my grandmother was of French lineage, having the surname Aimés....
Jul 23rd, 2014 - 04:57 pm - Link - Report abuse 0That doesn't mean I can't slag them off.....and I don't get insulted by other people doing it....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FUjGf2Grrus
104.
Jul 23rd, 2014 - 05:02 pm - Link - Report abuse 0But I was talking about geographic barriers that set the defence policy of countries... What has your bile and crap you came up with in response got to do with anything other than just be offensive and stupid??
Look at Europe country, so weak, pity, pathetic. Kill European person, Europe country make no consequence, Russia laugh to bank.
Jul 23rd, 2014 - 05:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0China have no problem with Europe country. We one day attack, invade, easy win China.
...you swallowing the complete crap that Russian expansion was because it was unable to defend itself....utter codswallop...
Jul 23rd, 2014 - 05:34 pm - Link - Report abuse 0the true mark of the gullible.....
You have a problem of believing everything you watch on YouTube....
It created it's own weakness by expansion...every country in Europe has had the same problems with invasion...it doesn't explain the Russian paranoia or mindset...
yeah Russia had it bad....along with everyone else....
The Voice happens to be correct on this item,
Jul 23rd, 2014 - 06:40 pm - Link - Report abuse 0William of orange did not invade England, he landed went to London and become king,
no war , no conflict, England then still not invaded since 1066, unless you include the ???
Another but of history...
And there you go again, you just can’t help being a throwback and not tolerating other people’s views.
Jul 23rd, 2014 - 06:41 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“It created it's own weakness by expansion...every country in Europe has had the same problems with invasion...it doesn't explain the Russian paranoia or mindset...”
No it’s not the case at all. The Russian core only is the land size of central Europe alone. But you just don’t have the knowledge of Eurasian history to debate with me and you just don’t want to learn anything. You dont have any other grasp of basic economic concepts or even logic. And if I continue to explain and elaborate you will keep on and on throwing a fuss and being a sore butt loser and trying to take things down at your level. I actually have to charge you for trying to teach you
And you always try undermine other peoples sources, if its Google its because its Google, if its YouTube if it is YouTube, if it is Zeihan its because he’s American… And if its my own knowledge well no, that can’t be either it must be a case that I’m influenced somehow somewhere or I follow some kind of agenda…. what are your own sources may I ask appart from your dreams and bile ??
You are a throwback and you will always be one.
...like you could teach me anything....apart from how to faun over jumped up dictators....
Jul 23rd, 2014 - 07:07 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I bet your analyst Zeihan never saw the trouble with Crimea and the Russian involvement of shooting down civilian airlines, coming....
Bit of an urgent revision on American Isolation will be on the books..I reckon...
Told you it was all fanciful dreaming....can't second guess World Events....
Back to the Cold War...and back to the drawing board for him and his badly thought out lectures.....
Still he was always fool the gullible.....
I don't want to say I told you so....actually I do....
You should think logically before you jump on the bandwagon.....
Maybe I should give you some lessons in Lateral thinking.....
...course I'd have to charge you......
Well you have to swallow this last one because he actually he DID foresee the trouble with Russia and Ukraine
Jul 23rd, 2014 - 07:21 pm - Link - Report abuse 0minute 6:10 the video was up loaded over a year ago but the lecture is as far back as 2011.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C_TRM67hA5A
But then go ahead brand it as if he didn't go as far as predicting the aircraft that was shot down, that it was a Malaysian airliner and it was doing the flight from Amsterdam to Kuala Lumpur the 17 th of July 2014 flying over Donetsk by a BUK SAM... You have become far too basic and predictable for me.
http://en.mercopress.com/2014/07/18/malaysia-jet-killing-298-was-apparently-downed-by-ukrainian-separatists#comment340359: I have seen no report of Dutch forces.
Jul 23rd, 2014 - 09:46 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Any force inserted into the Ukraine will not be a peace keeping force. At the very minimum it will need to be a peace enforcement operation. In any case the report only mentioned Australian forces invading and seizing territory.
112 Hepatia/British Bomber
Jul 23rd, 2014 - 11:34 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“...only mentioned Australian forces invading and seizing territory.”
you are trying to mislead.
Let's not mince words.
You lied and the Russians lied.
It was Russian Military in disguise as civilian militants who invaded and seized territory in the Ukraine.
Check Mate UK hypocrite. God TTT say this back in legendary time he living on Earth, now here proof:
Jul 24th, 2014 - 01:50 am - Link - Report abuse 0http://news.yahoo.com/britain-still-exporting-arms-russia-023042537.html
UK Cameron excoriate France sell weapon gun ship Russia... He go 5 minute later sell weapon gun Russia.
English person no shame. Check mate, End story.
@112
Jul 24th, 2014 - 03:30 am - Link - Report abuse 0A peace-keeping force employed exclusively for the purpose of securing a crime scene is not an invasion, particularly if done with the consent of the nation on who's soil it takes place. I stand by my post and question the sincerity of your own.
#114 I must say that you are smarter than than tobi..........and yet dumber than a rock.
Jul 24th, 2014 - 03:29 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Did you get your daddy off yet? He's tweeting he is horny.
@116
Jul 24th, 2014 - 07:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You are pathetic an non-intelligent no brain. You only insult.
I just put article, UK say France bad sell weapon to Russia, then UK sell weapon to Russia,
Will you ever admit this is wrong behavior to call other country out and then you do same ????
116 Captain Poppy
Jul 24th, 2014 - 09:56 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I hear the Ukraine people are chanting “Putin's terror, Russia's shame!”
By the way, do cockroaches make noise?
I thought I heard a scuttling vermin noise.
Nah...
Captain,
I won't be responding to anymore Nostrils posts.
If I see them, I won't be reading them. He's too screwed up, mentally.
117
Jul 24th, 2014 - 10:48 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The English is getting better...still using Yankee spellings...for a EUian..?
...though I preferred it when you had boobs....;-)
118 Troy
Jul 24th, 2014 - 11:42 pm - Link - Report abuse 0RE:
“Captain,
I won't be responding to anymore Nostrils posts.
If I see them, I won't be reading them. He's too screwed up, mentally.”
--
I am taking the same view.
The poor lad needs professional help. Obviously he has been bitten..
... by Reality.... and it has sent him into a sick state of mind.
Probably best left alone until his poor Mother can scrape a few pesos together to get him into therapy.
Ahh well, synonymous with Argentina at large.
I blame Cristina.
Really, I do! The Mad Bitch is hurting her nation beyond belief and they still lap it up....
Sad but true.
@119
Jul 25th, 2014 - 02:59 am - Link - Report abuse 0I decide yesterday integrate better with Englishman, this is by Hans Neisiund suggested to me yesterday, so change name from Nose of Confucius. I go night school improve English, integrate better with English person. Slowly rise English quality.
Another passenger jet crash yesterday. This one in Africa. The French have already sent a military unit to secure the site.
Jul 25th, 2014 - 08:27 am - Link - Report abuse 0Not being funny now, does this mean we can expect one in Latin America next week or so?
What the heck is going on?
Troy, ilsen....
Jul 25th, 2014 - 01:17 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I agree....whether is is the African during the Libertad seizure.....a pope, Chinese, and Englishman or whoever...it's old and childish and tiring.
To everyone else I suggest all you non Argentine supporting trolls to ignore #121 aka tobi fro Mendoza.......his 15 minutes ends on Wednesday and this is his final curtain.
tobi take a bow but not in front of your daddy.
Chuckles with Captain!
Jul 25th, 2014 - 05:16 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Comment removed by the editor.
Jul 27th, 2014 - 05:12 am - Link - Report abuse 0Commenting for this story is now closed.
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