MercoPress. South Atlantic News Agency
“Chile not proud of Falklands war support”, but “proud of peace treaty with Argentina”
Defense minister Jorge Burgos said that most Chileans are not proud of the attitude of the Pinochet dictatorship when the Falklands/Malvinas war, but also admitted it happened at a very different and difficult moment in the relations between Chile and Argentina. Read full article
Comments
Disclaimer & comment rulesMr Burgos appears to have missed the bit where Argentina was planning on invading Chile and subjugating it under their dictatorship that had already murdered thousands.
Aug 18th, 2014 - 07:46 am - Link - Report abuse 0If anything Chileans should be proud of how their government acted in 1982. They acted in self defence from a brutal foreign dictatorship who would've shown them no mercy.
1
Aug 18th, 2014 - 07:58 am - Link - Report abuse 0The question is,
WHY Mr, Burgos is “missing the point” - things have changed, could it be that he is pandering to the Bolivarian league of socialists or whatever the BogusBond of Bolivarian Brothers call themselves, whilst chaining themselves to the deadweight of Argentina and Venezuela?
Typical Christian Democrat coward. How embarrassing for our country. Argentina is no friend of Chile. The Southern Cross joint military exercise is a farce as most of the Argentine equipment is barely functioning.
Aug 18th, 2014 - 08:04 am - Link - Report abuse 0“Next 29 November we are celebrating the 30th anniversary of the Peace and Friendship Treaty signed by the Argentina and Chile at the Vatican, which put an end to the Beagle strait and islands conflict”.
Aug 18th, 2014 - 08:32 am - Link - Report abuse 0Very nice. Maybe next year Argentina can celebrate the 215th anniversary of the Convention of Settlement - “Under this Convention perfect friendship between Her Britannic Majesty's Government and the Government of the Confederation, is restored to its former state of good understanding and cordiality.”
The question for me is why is he saying this at all? He seems to want to run with the fox and hunt with the hounds as the Olde English saying goes.
Aug 18th, 2014 - 11:29 am - Link - Report abuse 0If he wasn’t such an arse licker the “Southern Cross” jamboree would be a great time to annihilate what is left of the argie military and take back what belonged to Chile.
Cowards tend to make these sound bites in times of peace, the reality for Chileans at the time of the war was quite different to what it is now.
Aug 18th, 2014 - 11:33 am - Link - Report abuse 0Things have changed markedly since then. If we went to war with Argentina again, I doubt very much indeed that there would be anything we would want or need from Chile, other than keeping their nose out.
Just one T45 Destroyer can wipe out every military jet in South America if required. Pretty soon there will be BAE Taranis supersonic drones based on St Helena and can be flying over Argentina in an hour of take off.
Working with the UK to remove the Argentine junta was a very proud moment in Chilean history and quite probably saved their bacon in the process.
Sorry. @6 I should have said 165th anniversary, it was ratified in 1850
Aug 18th, 2014 - 12:25 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Pride is a sin and Argentina's regime today is one of the worst abominations this continent has seen.
Aug 18th, 2014 - 12:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@Chicureo
Aug 18th, 2014 - 01:08 pm - Link - Report abuse 0100% agree.
chileans: ass lickers and traitors.
Aug 18th, 2014 - 01:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0san martin helped them to get their independence.
in return they helped the pirates to re invade malvinas.
not a surprise they are despised in the whole continent
I agree the Chileans had to act AGAINST Argentina in 1982, given what Argentina attempted in 1977. I have absolutely no problem with Chile trying to undermine a quasi-proven threat, and I don't blame anyone for doing that.
Aug 18th, 2014 - 01:51 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I also agree Chileans are generally extremely ungrateful for Argentina granting them independence.
You can't have it both ways, on the one hand say you acted WITH Britain in the Falklands War because of a 'threat', and then actually deny what Argentina actually DID do in 1818. It shows their eternal lack of gratitude.
Furthermore, the UK is a quasi-threat to Argentina, and it is so hypocritical that the Chileans here blast Argentina's attitude towards the UK, that we should “talk” to them, etc. They are de facto an enemy that wishes harm on the Argentine people. No talk.
@ 10. But still not as despised as Argentinians. As has been said many times before Argentina has had the opportunities and the natural resources to become one of the most prosperous countries anywhere in the world. How have you managed to make such a bad job of it with all those natural advantages?
Aug 18th, 2014 - 01:57 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“How have you managed to make such a bad job of it with all those natural advantages?”
Aug 18th, 2014 - 02:00 pm - Link - Report abuse 0the answer is: perón, evita, perón, isabelita, lopez rega, the dictatorship. menem, kirchner, cristinita.
@12
Aug 18th, 2014 - 02:01 pm - Link - Report abuse 0It is an international perpetrated lie that Argentina has resources. We HAD resources, and for almost 100 years (1860-1950) we were one of the most prosperous. So it is another lie that we did not use that potential.
We do not have resources today to “re”develop. Argentina is in terminal economic downfall and it is not coming back in that area.
@ #11
Aug 18th, 2014 - 02:08 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Exactly what threat is the UK to Argentina? tell me when do you think we are going to invade or attack? Just how many assets do you think we have poised at the throat of Argentina?
@15
Aug 18th, 2014 - 02:13 pm - Link - Report abuse 0It's not a matter of how many assets you have or not have, or whether you have plans to attack or invade (I'm sure you have the latter though). It is about the history of Britain in the vicinity of Argentina. Multiple acts of aggression.
More contemporaneously, the UK's disregard of international law in Iraq is a major red flag for Argentina. It shows you do not respect international sovereignty.
Finally the UK insist on illegally acting on a supposedly frozen claim in Antarctica, when they signed a treaty promising along with all others to cease any attempts to buttress such claim.
Argentina has no reason to trust or call the UK a friend.
A lot of strange ambiguous statements....
Aug 18th, 2014 - 02:17 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“most Chileans are not proud of the attitude of the Pinochet dictatorship when the Falklands/Malvinas war,”
Sounds like politic speak...doesn't actually mention support...like the headline....
““I believe that as happened in Chile, a good percentage of the Argentine people are not proud, regarding the attitude of the Argentine dictatorship, ”
...and what is a good percentage...? Most or least....
History knowledge is definitely not a strong virtue of most argentinians...
Aug 18th, 2014 - 02:42 pm - Link - Report abuse 010 paulcedron (#)
chileans: ass lickers and traitors.
san martin helped them to get their independence.
in return they helped the pirates to re invade malvinas.
Answer: First of all... Chile has monuments of San Martin EVERYWHERE. Not only that, we have uncountable amounts of streets, schools, boroughs etc named after him. So it is definitely not true that we do not honour this man. What indeed we DO NOT honour is Argentina, because:
1. Argentina did not exist back in time when San Martin helped O'higgins to beat the spainards back in 1818. San Martin was the Governor of Cuyo, an independent state back then which was wary to Buenos Aires. Cuyo does not exist anymore, as it was annexed/subjected by Argentina decades later.
2. point and even more important: San Martin asked Buenos Aires for assitance in the liberation of Chile. What did Buenos Aires reply: “F*ck *ff”. That was their reply. Same thing did Buenos Aires say, when Chile was liberated and San Martin asked them to support the liberation of Peru. This was totally financed by the Chilean Government, 90% of the soldiers and 100% of the fleet of the liberation expedition was Chilean and lead under Chilean Flag. That for example is not honoured at all in Peru, but that is a theme appart.
So there is definitely no reason to thank an inexisting help of “Argentina” for any kind of inexisting support.
Comment removed by the editor.
Aug 18th, 2014 - 02:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Whooooo!
Aug 18th, 2014 - 03:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Something struck a nerve.
Probably the truth, always gets to them.
@18
Aug 18th, 2014 - 03:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 0What about the Scottish guy called Thomas Cochrane?
(Ex-Royal Navy)
Does he have any part in your defeating the Spaniards?
@20
Aug 18th, 2014 - 03:13 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Funny you never say that when all you British scum are flipping out about my statements about your country.
Believe the lies if you want.
Let me remind you the UK NEVER did anything worth a dime in 200 years in Argentina. Nothing. You are utterly irrelevant in our history.
19 Nostrils
Aug 18th, 2014 - 03:15 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“
” I live in Cuyo. “
Didn't you insist you lived in Mendosa ??
Near the ”San Martin Shopping Mall and Galleria“, perhaps.
A proud ”Cuyan” who has as much heritage and shared values with the 'Liberators' as I do.
Get off of San Martin's pedestal - you don't belong there.
The important thing is to recognise “realpolitik”. As feared, Bachelet is a craven, crack-licker. She is, of course, old and tired. Wonder if she could even understand how the UK saved Chile?
Aug 18th, 2014 - 03:18 pm - Link - Report abuse 0It's worth researching how many “Peace and Friendship” treaties, argieland has signed. For argieland, such “treaties” have the same relevance as forged IOUs.
Chile has now revealed its current attitude. So when we castrate argieland, let's castrate chile at the same time. “Friends” must be trustworthy at all times. Chile is no longer a “friend”. Treat it accordingly. No doubt the RN will open fire as appropriate. Let's just not get too close. But Chile may regret this betrayal.
@23
Aug 18th, 2014 - 03:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 0My family traces itself to the half-niece of a fourth cousin's great uncle of San Martin's maternal great-grandfather.
The facts are, CUYO was taken by Buenos Aires via a Spanish administrative decision in 1776. Lie 1 (ManRod ridiculous claim BUenos Aires “was subjected” Cuyo decades after 1816)
Lie 2: we were “subjected”. No, we gladly joined Buenos Aires to get away from the cowardice of Santiago's royalist stance.
Lie 3: Cuyo was an independent country in 1818. Ridiculous, farcical, immediately disprovable lie. WE NEVER WERE A COUNTRY.
@22
Aug 18th, 2014 - 03:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You ungreatfull little turd.
Look they gave you a lovely clock!
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Torre_Monumental
Nostrils
Aug 18th, 2014 - 03:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Stop slobbering, you'll short circuit your device!
25 Nostrils
Aug 18th, 2014 - 03:25 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“My family traces itself to the half-niece of a fourth cousin's great uncle of San Martin's maternal great-grandfather.”
How many Argentines say the same thing?
I thought you were related to Vernet...
@28
Aug 18th, 2014 - 03:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Bet the cnut cant trace his family any further back than his mum meeting his dad at the first MacDonalds outlet that opened there.
Paulecdron- its funny that the great MAJORITY of normal Argentines who vist the Islands in summer as tourists say that the Arg military invasion of 1982 was WRONG and should not have happened(sov claim apart)!
Aug 18th, 2014 - 03:35 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I meet and tlak with several hundred of them each summer as aguide - so I am talking FACTS - what are you talking? - the usual?
As for Chile,s position - since when is Chile looked down on is S America and by whom? Tell me whic are the 3 strongest and most respected economies in S America with good safe overseas investment records?
Then tell me where Argentina scores.
@26
Aug 18th, 2014 - 03:36 pm - Link - Report abuse 0That was not a British gift as far as I know. It was given to us by the Turks.
@toby
Aug 18th, 2014 - 03:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“You despicable ungrateful bastard.”
Not at all. I am sure those who see the wars of independence as anything other that the change of power from one European elite to another are very grateful for the planning, funding and key military personnel provided by the British that was fundamental to the independence of South America.
And let's not forget the Argie contribution. San Martin (both parents Spanish) starts his campaign after stepping off a British frigate, then forms an army in which 2/3rds of the foot soldiers are “free” sons of Africa. .. maybe there were some valiant Argies in the catering core.
30 islander
Aug 18th, 2014 - 03:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0most of the argentines think the war was wrong and should not have happened, not only the small bunch of argentines that visit the islets.
so what´s your point?
anyway, when a latin american country is in the middle of a conflict, (armed, diplomatic, economic, whatever) they expect the rest of latin america to support them.
the rest of latin america except chile, of course.
@29
Aug 18th, 2014 - 03:48 pm - Link - Report abuse 0No McDonalds didn't stop the English monarchy from getting around:
http://www.city-data.com/forum/genealogy/810100-yale-statistician-claims-everyone-european-ancestor.html
Now we know how they got the money for that nice plot of land in the middle of London. I knew Elizabeth II was so lazy during the daytime hours for a reason!!
@32
I cant't speak for Chile but the British did absolutely NOTHING for Argentina's independence. In fact, the two times they did do something proven in history books, it was to take it away from us.
Chileans didn't do squat either. So you are both tied there. Heck you didn't do anything for your own independence! Forget it for Peru. History records Chile did absolutely nothing there, and the Peruvians know it.
@11 “I also agree Chileans are generally extremely ungrateful for Argentina granting them independence.”
Aug 18th, 2014 - 03:51 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“Granted” Chileans indepedence? As in, they could have decided Chile would just continue to be a province of Argentina? Or, Argentine assistance was crucial to Chile in obtaining their independence from Spain?
@11 “Furthermore, the UK is a quasi-threat to Argentina”
But isn't Argentina a threat to the Falkland Islanders in that they want to take their home from them?
@14 “It is an international perpetrated lie that Argentina has resources. ”
Where did those resources go then? There are no more in the ground, they are gone?
25 Nostrils
Aug 18th, 2014 - 03:53 pm - Link - Report abuse 0““My family traces itself to the half-niece of a fourth cousin's great uncle of San Martin's maternal great-grandfather.”
Nostrils,
How many times have you said you PERSONALLY ,are NOT European and NOT European descent, have no heritage or shared values from Europe, are part of a distinct and unique culture , and share NO history??
Let me rephrase that, ” how many times did you stamp your feet in defiance and drone on about it?”
Now, you would tell us that you are the direct descendent of a noble Liberator.
Was San Martin AmerIndian, then??
@36
Aug 18th, 2014 - 03:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Yes, he wasn't 100% European. That is well-know he was in fact, a mestizo, even if it was in the slightest.
@35
For starters, had Argentina not defeated the Spanish forces in it's own territory, Chile would never have had a chance against the Spanish in their own territory. In a more basic sense, they would not have been inspired to move a finger had we not done so first.
They owe us INTELLECTUALLY and EMOTIONALLY even more perhaps than logistically.
Chile was never a province of Argentina.
@35
Yes we are. But even before that the UK attempted to take away land and water from us. Well before the Falklands was ever an issue. They have been a threat since our independence, which they tried to prevent.
@35
They no longer have the same value as 100 years ago.
@19 4n control
Aug 18th, 2014 - 04:03 pm - Link - Report abuse 01806-7, was the British fighting the Spanish, Argentina did not exist in any form at that time.
However Argentina has twice invaded British territory, in 1832 and 1982, only to be kicked out.
And you accuse others of “outrageous lies”.
Listening to you what seems to be irrelevant in your history, is yourselves.
Always someone else’s fault, from invading other people’s territories to defaults, none of it seem to have anything to do with you.
@33 paulcedron
Like Argentina supported Ecuador in its battle with Chevron, you mean.
@36 Troy Tempest
Surly you’re not suggesting he was “IMPLANTED” in S. America.
@38
Aug 18th, 2014 - 04:07 pm - Link - Report abuse 0There were no Spanish troops in Buenos Aires, and the town was not even a threat to you. So two lies in the same phrase from you.
YOU ATTACKED THE CITY OF BUENOS AIRES, not the Spanish army, not any military area that was a threat to you. The British could have chosen DOZENS of other targets if they really were interested in harming their enemy.
GET IT THROUGH YOUR HEAD BRIT: You had STOLEN the Cape from the Boers a year before, and so you just extend this thieving mentality to South America “if we took the Cape, we can take the River Plate too, right”.
You didn't count on the fact not only the CITIZENS would fight you, but they would defeat you, without any Spanish assistance.
38 Pugol
Aug 18th, 2014 - 04:16 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I am STATING that Nostrils contradicts himself and changes his story ( he lies) to support his current ejaculations.
He previously denied all accountability for the cultural values and actions of Argentine, by stating he was NOT EUROPEAN or DESCENDED FROM THE Evil European RACE.
ie. holier than thou!!
NOW, he wants to jump on the band wagon of being DIRECTLY descended from a EUROPEAN “HERO”!
You can't make it up !!!
It's all about their fragile egos...
LOL !!!
@40
Aug 18th, 2014 - 04:23 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Not liking the truth huh?
San Martin, Mestizo.
Britain? Stole South AFrica, almost immediately (what a coincidence) tries to take the River Plate (Spanish “enemy” nowhere to be found there).
Me, Winning.
38 pugol
Aug 18th, 2014 - 04:24 pm - Link - Report abuse 0have you ever read a history book in your whole life?
i guess NOT.
britain tried to invade buenos aires twice, when buenos aires was part of the virreinato del rio de la plata, cause the british always wanted these lands.
and they tried again in vuelta de obligado in 1845, but they failed...again.
so they had to resign themselves with the islets.
@toby
Aug 18th, 2014 - 04:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You really swallowed the glorious independence story.
The British had strangled the Spanish empire. Independence was on its way with or without war. When San Martin and Bolívar started their campaigns the Spanish could hardly resupply their paltry forces in South America.
Wars are often confirmations of economic shifts that have already taken place. The economic shift was that the Spanish empire was dead and Britain was the new super power.
The wars of independence brought loss and misery to rural communities and were a disaster for native communities. The rest is just jingoistic brainwashing to make sure you know who you are.
A British history book is like wingless glider or a submarine with a swimming pool deck.
Aug 18th, 2014 - 04:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0A contradiction in terms.
It's in the history books that the Britsh tried no less than THREE Times to take control of the waters of the River Plate, and a FOURTH AND FIFTH time through the Cisplatine War ARG vs BRA, and the Triple Alliance war which quite frankly they helped to concoct.
Fool me once, shame on me. Fool me five times...
The evidence is clear as night and day.
No Spanish in BA?
Aug 18th, 2014 - 04:32 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Then WTF did you fight a war of liberation against.
The SMURFS???????
@43
Aug 18th, 2014 - 04:37 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Really? Don't you say? lol
You really are the most despicable character here. You try your best to completely cast South Americans, and Argentnes in particular, as incompetent, good-for-nothing, deserveless, incapable, errant bumbles.
Nothing South Americans do is worth a crap.
Best example here: North American independence: glorious, South American independence: not worthy of mention or thought.
The British had strangled the Spanish.... really. So they take all the credit what a shock, you glorifying the superior European and dumbstriking the feeble irrelevant South American peasant.
You make me sick.
@14. You do still have some fantastic natural resources - some really fertile agricultural land, a very pleasant climate especially in the north of the country - ample sunshine and rainfall etc etc. If some of the money that the country made between 1860 and 1950 had been wisely invested in various industries or the development of some area of expertise Argentina could still be a wealthy country today. You seem to have a had a succesion of dreadful Presidents and political leadership but you get what you vote for so the population at large must take some of the blame for that state of affairs.
Aug 18th, 2014 - 04:41 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@47
Aug 18th, 2014 - 04:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The economic past is in the economic past. No point in rehashing it.
Agriculture is not a resource today, the 21st century. It brings no added value. No added value, no resource value.
Bajo: Please spout some more of that half baked, incoherent nonsense.
Aug 18th, 2014 - 04:48 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@19 ”it was more the fact Argentina had been fighting for 10 years plus (the British from 1806-1807, then the Spanish from 1810 to 1816, indirectly the French who were trying to strangle efforts). What absolute rubbish! In 1806/07, Buenos Aires was a colonial Spanish city; furthermore Spain and Britain were at war, thus the invasions of Buenos Aires by the British were never against Argentina, which did not yet exist.
Aug 18th, 2014 - 04:48 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Get your facts right, BOLUDO!
@50
Aug 18th, 2014 - 04:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Fact. Britain attacked Buenos Aires. Twice.
The PEOPLE of the city.
Period, end of story. No other version permitted.
@46
Aug 18th, 2014 - 04:54 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Don't get all worked up again.
Where have I mentioned North America? Making stuff up won't make what I say less true, but I accept the complement.
You are confusing South America with a European satellite colony. The people didn't want a war. Why do you think men were forcible conscripted in to the army? If it was such a glorious cause why didn't they flock to the army? The Mapuche fought against independence, because they knew it meant the very opposite for them. Independence meant tax revenues going to the new provincial endeavours rather than the crown. The new implanted European elites could then better fund their expansion into other peoples land.
It is interesting that you mention North American independence (sorry Canadians) as you seem to be as equally gullible as the USAians who swallow the “glorious” independence story of their land.
Do the British take credit for strangling the Spanish empire? Yes, of course. You don't really think that skirmishes down here had much to do with it do you? That would require a very egocentric view of the world ... ahh I see the the problem.
Then it is the end of a totally false version of what happened! Just another example of the lies, fairy tales and myths which Argentina utilizes to justify its totally false claim to the Falklands/Malvinas archipelago.
Aug 18th, 2014 - 04:54 pm - Link - Report abuse 037 Nostrils
Aug 18th, 2014 - 04:57 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“Yes, he wasn't 100% European. That is well-know he was in fact, a mestizo, even if it was in the slightest.”
Slightest - Indian
Mostly - European
Therefore, IF you claim to be his descendent, YOU are part European.
IF you say San Martin is a Hero, then you are saying a mostly EUROPEAN man is a hero.
YOU - are changing your story to suit your conceit.
@52
Aug 18th, 2014 - 05:00 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The British didn't do SQUAT. Spain had been declining for 1oo years after Phillip the V and the War of Spanish Succession which engulfed Europe.
(what a shock, Europe at war. Barbaric good for nothings).
They just took advantage of a wounded calf. As the British have ALWAYS done.
(When have the British actually defeated or conquered a SUPERIOR enemy).
The Mapuche are an irrelevant aspect of Argentine history. You seem to be applying Chilean historical parameters to ours. Maybe you should be a little more modest and concede it may not apply in another country outside of Chile.
People in Argentina FLOCKED to join San Martin. In Mendoza alone 18% of fit males signed up within 72 hours of the Army of the Andes being conscripted.
I really have no idea what you are talking about really.
“I really have no idea what you are talking about really.”
Aug 18th, 2014 - 05:07 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Of course you don't. You clearly don't have much idea about anything.
It seems that 4n conTroll has his own juvenile version of the history of Argentina! What a load of bollocks! Does he still wet the bed?
Aug 18th, 2014 - 05:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@39 4n control
Aug 18th, 2014 - 05:16 pm - Link - Report abuse 0So if there were no Spanish in BA who exactly did you have to fight to gain your independence from, the vulture funds? No that is still to come.
British Operations of 1806&7 in the River Plate, in the Cities of Montevideo and BA, were carried out in and against the Spanish vice Royalty of the River Plate.
Argentina did not exist in any form at that time.
I have never heard of a Uruguayan claim that the British invaded Uruguay.
“You had STOLEN the Cape from the Boers”
Really, those native indigenous to S. Africa Boers, like you stole Argentina from the Indians right.
@ 42 paulcedron
BAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
If the British had really wanted a colony there, then there would have been one there, simples.
To suggest the R. Plate was somehow too difficult for the British is laughable.
If you had ever read any history you would know that is what the Spanish thought about the Caribbean, the French about Quebec and the Dutch about the Cape.
All swallowed and digested no problem.
Or are you suggesting that Argentines are somehow harder than Boers or Quebecois.
BAAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHA
@55 4n control
“In Mendoza alone 18% of fit males signed up within 72 hours of the Army of the Andes being conscripted.”
Do you mean 18% signed up and the rest were conscripted?
Or do you mean 18% had been conscripted within 72 hours?
Suggest you look up the meaning of “conscripted” before you answer.
Did Nostrils just sign in as
Aug 18th, 2014 - 05:16 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“Condorito” @52 ?????
he did say, “USAians ”....didn't he ???
Condorito,
Aug 18th, 2014 - 05:20 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Can you believe the mass ignorance displayed by many of the posters on this site? Just incredible!
For those of you debating the factors for Argentina's recent economic decline, I recommend the below:
There was an article in the Economist that sums up the last 100 years of economic history that was titled “The Parable of Argentina”
http://www.economist.com/news/leaders/21596515-there-are-lessons-many-governments-one-countrys-100-years-decline-parable
Below is the beginning and last parts of the article.
A CENTURY ago, when Harrods decided to set up its first overseas emporium, it chose Buenos Aires. In 1914 Argentina stood out as the country of the future. Its economy had grown faster than America’s over the previous four decades. Its GDP per head was higher than Germany’s, France’s or Italy’s. It boasted wonderfully fertile agricultural land, a sunny climate, a new democracy (universal male suffrage was introduced in 1912), an educated population and the world’s most erotic dance. Immigrants tangoed in from everywhere. For the young and ambitious, the choice between Argentina and California was a hard one.
And then the final part...
The lesson from the parable of Argentina is that good government matters. Perhaps it has been learned. But the chances are that in 100 years’ time the world will look back at another Argentina—a country of the future that got stuck in the past.
And yes, this storyline should be focused about the stupid cowardice of Bachelet's government, but in the end it's nothing more than:
Yes, Cristina...bla, bla, bla........bla, bla, bla........bla, bla, bla.....yes the Malvinas are of course yours...Yes, Obama and that perra Clinton can't be trusted...bla, bla, bla.....
Completely meaningless, Argentina signed one with the British in 1850 and they have totally ignored the binding legal effect of the treaty ever since. Argentine truthfulness was correctly analyzed in 1832 by the US chargé d'affaires Francis Baylies “...that the US should sign no treaty ...for we would abide by it, and they would consider the violation no greater offense than a lie told by a schoolboy...” . A truism throughout this countries existence.
Aug 18th, 2014 - 05:48 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@ 47. Agriculture - not a resource. Crazy. We all have to eat. The world's population is increasing exponentially - forecast to reach 11 billion people by the middle to end of this century. They've all got to be fed and watered. Food and the ability to produce food will become a more and more important resource as the century progresses.
Aug 18th, 2014 - 06:21 pm - Link - Report abuse 0#62
Aug 18th, 2014 - 06:34 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You refer to the gibberish of #48, not 47.
Argentina has been blessed with nearly every type of national resource and cursed with governments from Hell...
Why now???
Aug 18th, 2014 - 06:34 pm - Link - Report abuse 0has he something to hide, is he being leant upon , is he being threatened , is Chile in future danger,
what purpose if any to bring this crap up now, over 30 years after the horse has bolted , the door is rotted and the farm sold of,, why ??
@Troy
Aug 18th, 2014 - 06:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“USAians”
It was a courteous (and too subtle) attempt to help toby understand that “North American independence” took a very different form in the different countries of North America.
@Chicureo
Good article. I remember that the CFK government took offence with it at the time. They are so sensitive to criticism. Perhaps they don't believe their own bullshit.
More important matters: Deep fried jurel sangüich with local Guayacan stout ... the size of the jurel coming ashore in Coquimbo has increased dramatically.
#64
Aug 18th, 2014 - 07:02 pm - Link - Report abuse 0To show “solidarity” with our Andean brothers. You won't see the Bachelet government condemn Venezuela for human rights violations either.
You should note that Chile's president received the majority of her higher education in East Germany, but she's always shown herself as a moderate leaning to the left. Pragmatic, somewhat fiscally conservative, and so far friendly to defense.
Do you know how to tell when a politician is not telling the truth?
When you see their lips are moving...
TWIMC...
Aug 18th, 2014 - 08:04 pm - Link - Report abuse 0So many “Buenos Aires” coming from Allende (Presente!) la cordillera in these days...
First my hermanitos Shilenos made me happy by cancelling that turnipy Hidroaysèn proyect that threatened to ruin one of my favourite rivers, the Baker...
Then all those other wise steps to distance my Shile querido from the nefarious Pinochet era and bring it more in line with the wishes and aspirations of so many of my Shilean compadres and ahijados ...
1) Educational reform... (Education for ALL)
2) Tax reform... (Just and proportional taxation)
3) Electoral reform... (The Momios will only get the representation they'll earn)
And now this..., verbatim from the Shilean Defence Minister ...:
“Creo que la inmensa mayoría de los chilenos no estamos orgullosos, para nada, de la actitud de la dictadura durante la guerra de las Malvinas.”
(“I believe that the immense majority of us Chileans are not proud, at all, of the attitude of the dictatorship during the Malvinas war...”)
”Buenos Aires from Shile, indeed...
It is totally irrelevant if Argentina existed or didn't. For sure did exist an entity that further in time become the current country. No Chile existed by that time as such, and no many countries in the world neighter, as Ireland by case. Can we say they dont exist? They dont have any right, do they? Is an easy way to ignore the history of the country and by that ignoring their rights as a society. UK took by force the islands and that will be a controversy for as long they decide to seat on table and repair this historical issue with another foreing country. Anything else is just decoration.
Aug 18th, 2014 - 08:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 065 condorito
Aug 18th, 2014 - 09:13 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You had me worried...
Now I sound like “Voice”, looking for 'socks' under the bed ...
:-)
Think, I wonder how long it will take your Shilean hermanetos to drag that fine country down to the Argentinian level where you get ever depreciating currency for doing nothing valuable at all until it resembles tbe turnip field you currently inhabit?
Aug 18th, 2014 - 09:21 pm - Link - Report abuse 0CONDORITO
Aug 18th, 2014 - 09:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Thanks for the informative maritime intel...
Fried fresh jurel “tipo salmón” sangüich with Guayacan stout
sounds fantastic. Which picadas would you recommend? (I wouldn't imagine you'd find jurel served at the Tololo Beach...)
Estimado THINK
I'm starting to worry about my mental capacity right now as I tend to be in agreement with many of the ”Buenos Aires” which included the cancellation of the Hidroaysèn proyect which was created when the Concertación (left of center) was in power and cancelled when Piñera (right if center) was recently president.
Almost everyone from the Alianza and the Concertación agree that Chile needs education, tax and electoral reform.
However, what I strongly detest is anyone, especially a representative of the Chilean government, apologizing for our support to defeat the Argentine military dictatorship's invasion of a peaceful nearly undefended group of islands, purely for political purposes. (Galtieri needed a diversion to get people's minds off the economic disaster...be honest)
Those “sons of whores” committed far worse human rights violations than what unfortunately occurred in Chile, including their infamous Operation Soberanía against my country only to deflect the enormous economic destruction that eventually resulted in a tenfold devaluation of your currency with foreign debt increasing at least fourfold and without doubt one of the worst financial crises in Argentine history.
So Think, why should Chile be apologetic for working by any means to secretly defeat Jorge Videla and Leopoldo Galtieri? Should we lay wreaths at their graves?
In my opinion, Chile's A-2 group that served during those years are all heroes, and their work should be praised, not shamefully apologized for.
68 bloporta
Aug 18th, 2014 - 10:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“It is totally irrelevant if Argentina existed or didn't. For sure did exist an entity that further in time become the current country. No Chile existed by that time as such, and no many countries in the world neighter, as Ireland by case. Can we say they dont exist? They dont have any right, do they? Is an easy way to ignore the history of the country and by that ignoring their rights as a society. UK took by force the islands and that will be a controversy for as long they decide to seat on table and repair this historical issue with another foreing country. Anything else is just decoration.”
Now that's just silly.
Argentina did not exist.
No indigenous Islanders existed.
Spain, France, and Britain “had history” on the Islands.
France withdrew, one way or the other, Spain ceded their rights to the British.
The Latin peoples on the continent, revolted against Spain - weren't we just talking about San Martin on a few threads... to proclaim themselves 'free of Spain' and Independent nations.
Spain ceded nothing to any of those rebel groups.
The rebels only took what they could hold, militarily.
nor did Spain bequeath the Islands to Uruguay, Chile, or Argentina, at any later date.
Only Britain maintained their claim, throughout.
Of the groups in South America, and the South Atlantic, only Britain “had history” there.
Sorry , Argentine, the Islands history, is not YOUR history.
The Spanish were there, it's part of their history, not Argentina's - you stole what you could from them on the mainland, and went a separate way.
@Chicureo
Aug 18th, 2014 - 10:16 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You are right, no jurel on the menu at Tololo. The picadas along the beach at Peñuelas have proliferated over the years and their prices have risen to the point that they are close to par with Tololo Beach. The best fried fish sandwich can be found in the port itself ... unfortunately they haven't discovered the stout combination - that's one of mine - one of the few occasions I like the stout chilled.
“So Think, why should Chile be apologetic for working by any means to secretly defeat Jorge Videla and Leopoldo Galtieri?”
This is a good question. Don't expect a good answer :(
@Think
Wise steps indeed.
But just consider that the “nefarious Pinochet era” education system allowed our secondary schools to climb to the highest rated in the region in PISA and our universities to rise to the top of the top 10;
and just consider that the “nefarious Pinochet era” tax regulation allowed us to become the wealthiest per capita country in the region;
and just consider that the “nefarious Pinochet era” electoral rules have allowed the centre left to rule for 20 of the last 25 years.
If these “buenos aires” bring as much success as their “nefarious Pinochet era” predecessors all is good, who wouldn't want that. Right now it remains to be seen whether it is “buenos aires” or just well intentioned hot air.
34 4n conTroll (#)
Aug 18th, 2014 - 11:20 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“Forget it for Peru. History records Chile did absolutely nothing there, and the Peruvians know it.”
Well, I suggest you (and all friends interested in history) to have a small look on this, I think it is quite clear and undeniable whom our friends from the north should thank:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom_Expedition_of_Peru
That's the difference between a lying troll like you on fire (because I was right with my points of San Martin, the governor of CUYO, seems I got a soft spot over there) and hard fact realities I deliver you.
Chile is responsible for the organisation of the Peruvian Liberation, but unfortunately the neighbourhood we have has never been very rational, neither thankful. Sometimes I ask myself what we have done to deserve this...
21 Escoses Doido (#)
What about the Scottish guy called Thomas Cochrane?
(Ex-Royal Navy)
Does he have any part in your defeating the Spaniards?
Answer: Yes, Cochrane one of the 3 big men responsible for the Liberation of Peru (not Chile), which were O'higgins, San Martin and Thomas Cochrane.
Cochrane is always present in the Chilean Navy and has reached the rank of Admiral in the same Navy, we always have a big ship named after him:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom_Expedition_of_Peru
Current Frigate:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom_Expedition_of_Peru
And ConTroll, like it or not... the first not rejected Argentinian constitution was created in 1853, way after the Chilean one proclaimed in 1818:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom_Expedition_of_Peru
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom_Expedition_of_Peru
Argentina as one did not exist before, as the rest of the ex provinces of the Vireinato de la Plata did not accept this, neither to be subjugated/tamed by Buenos Aires. Trying to opose this, is like saying that Italy existed even before Jesus birth, due to the Roman empire.
@54
Aug 18th, 2014 - 11:21 pm - Link - Report abuse 0What's so difficult? The San Martin ancestor who is our ancestor was THE lone native indigenous ancestor of San Martin. No discrepancy.
@56
I knew more about the world at age 10 than you do even now. It's not even fair how I am completely manhandling you. You are nothing but a British GLORIFIST. Everything the British ever did, even their farts, were glorious. Anything anyone else ever did is not worth a water toilet flush. Utterly abased and pitiful mindset. But I have seen it before. You simply want to curry favour with them and will act as a shameless toady to achieve this.
@58
The River Plate was too difficult for YOU BRITISH. You lost.
Let me repeat, you BRITISH LOST. Swallow the truth whole, even if it hurts you.
And yes, the Argentines obviously were harder than the Boers or the Quebecois. You defeated the latter two, and lost twice to the former.
IF and Whataboutery don't work in history. If you didn't send enough troops or ammo to win over the River Plate, then that's your fault for being FOOLS, for your war plans being utterly DIRE, for your fighters for surrendering... etc.
If Germany had not gone to war with the USSR, they would have crushed you... If a storm had not hit the Spanish Armada, they would have crushed you... if Rome had not waged war against the Parthians, they would have kept you as a province for at least 200 more years, if not more. You'd be speaking some British Vulgar Latin descendant now.
If Argentina had planned the war better: used it's entire navy, trained and deployed professional fighters and not young conscripts, if 50% more of the bombs from the Air Force had exploded...
If the USA had used its entire army in Vietnam (they would have won)
Everyone can do what-about... just accept it. You LOST.
@62
Yes, food/agriculture is NOT a resource. It is proven that it brings NO development. Whatever Chichureo says to act as your claque is irrelevant.
Argentina has no real resources that bring added value. Period.
“if, if, if...”
Aug 18th, 2014 - 11:27 pm - Link - Report abuse 0thats quite a good résumé for what your Nation Argentina stands for, not troll?
@74
Aug 18th, 2014 - 11:35 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Sorry to break it to you, but Chilean “history” does not apply in Argentina. I find it so amusing that the anti-argies here want to insist we “did not exist” before 1853, when it is clear WE believed we existed as a country (and that's all that matters my dear losers, since we had self-rule having defeated the Spanish, British, and French, and Brazilians). And further the REST OF THE WORLD at the time thought so too, since they signed treaties, waged war, or opened embassies.
The utter nonsense highlights how deep the hatred of Argentina blinds the fools that write such bunkum.
As for the constitution nonsense, well in that case then Chile did not exist before 1980. Good to know, that explains the utter juvenile attitude of ManRod.
@76
It's better than your Nation Chiles resume: “never, never, and never” (never be one of the world's 10 richest nations, never have world class music, movies, writers that are not poets, etc; never win a world cup)
“Chile not proud of Falklands war support”.
Aug 19th, 2014 - 12:01 am - Link - Report abuse 0- Defense minister Jorge Burgos.
Lets not have any more silly talk of Chile being GB's ally.
”...it was a different world, different circumstances”.
It doesn't matter. Argentina needs nor wants anyone.
Aug 19th, 2014 - 12:14 am - Link - Report abuse 0@74 Manrod:
Aug 19th, 2014 - 12:49 am - Link - Report abuse 0Not just Peru ........
Do some research min, check out his statue in Santiago CHILE.
His very wife was a Chliena.
They even do a battle reenactment in Valparaiso.
Thank Goodness that unlike the North Americans or the other South Americans, Argentina owes NO ONE for our independence. 100% from Argentines, by Argentines, paid by Argentines.
Aug 19th, 2014 - 12:55 am - Link - Report abuse 0@81
Aug 19th, 2014 - 12:57 am - Link - Report abuse 0What ?
Like o'Higgins?
Where did his folk come from?
LMAO!!!!
O'Higgins is a historical figure for Chilean History.
Aug 19th, 2014 - 01:00 am - Link - Report abuse 0Get your countries straight, my dear English vassal.
William Brown then?
Aug 19th, 2014 - 01:06 am - Link - Report abuse 0Your greatest Naval hero - IRISH.
I admire him greatly, although I don't feel he could be compared to his and my Celtic brother : Lord Thomas Cochrane.
English vassal?
LMFAOAY-ya dick!
vassal - A vassal or feudatory[1] is a person who has entered into a mutual obligation to a lord or monarch in the context of the feudal system in medieval Europe. The obligations often included military support and mutual protection, in exchange for certain privileges, usually including the grant of land held as a fiefdom.[2] The term can be applied to similar arrangements in other feudal societies. In contrast, a fidelity, or fidelitas, was a sworn loyalty, subject to the king.[3]
Aug 19th, 2014 - 01:09 am - Link - Report abuse 0Sounds like the exact status of Scotland to me.
@toby
Aug 19th, 2014 - 01:24 am - Link - Report abuse 0“I knew more about the world at age 10 than you do even now”
That poses the question, what happened? Did you fall in to an Argentine type decline after a promising start in life?
Surely I can't know less about the world than the poster who routinely celebrates his total ignorance of even what happens on his doorstep:
“Chile does not allow immigration” he states about the country that receives a massive amount of regional immigration.
http://en.mercopress.com/2013/11/21/pro-malvinas-militant-groups-told-by-winch-workers-to-keep-out-of-the-port-of-buenos-aires#comment288312
Nice one toby, keep comedy coming.
@86
Aug 19th, 2014 - 01:26 am - Link - Report abuse 0Celebrating ignorance is cognizance of it. You are ignorant and do not even realize it.
Your knowledge about Argentina is appalling.
@85
Aug 19th, 2014 - 01:28 am - Link - Report abuse 0September 18th.
I'm a yes voter you moron.
And I am also a yes voter for the inhabitants of the Falkland Islands to have you mongrels be kept away from them and their culture.
Shoo, shoo, nasty parasitic RG doggy...
@88
Aug 19th, 2014 - 01:31 am - Link - Report abuse 0Well, at least you are for self-determination for everyone who is not Argentine. Still hypocritical, but at least somewhat humane, even if you deny Argentines, sorry, mongrels, that right.
@88 millimetre (dodgy Nazi ancestry)
Aug 19th, 2014 - 01:42 am - Link - Report abuse 0You are self determined buddy.
Just stay away from the Falklanders .
Don't want them to catch anything from you impoverished flea bitten crowd that are vomiting the word malvinas all day now do we?
:)
#89
Aug 19th, 2014 - 01:55 am - Link - Report abuse 0You post that Chile “...will never be one of the world's 10 richest nations...”
Perhaps, but if you compare us to the rest of Latin America:
*You bash our culture. Chile has more Noble prizes in literature than any other Latin American nation. Argentina has none!
*Best overall managed economy.
*Chile is consistently rated to have the very best police force and least corrupt.
*The least violent and lowest crime.
*Least level of business corruption and highest in transparency.
*The best overall wine. (I like Argentina Malbecs, but...)
*Easiest Latin American country to do business with.
*Safest to invest in.
*Easiest to repatriate profits. (No controls on how much money I spend abroad as long as I pay my taxes.)
*The most stable central bank.
*The highest Latin American standard of living. (Yes, number 1.)
*As of 2014, the top Latin American University, La Católica, edging out the University of Sao Paulo. Universidad de Chile comes in at 6th. (Universidad of Buenos Aires is ranked at 19th place.)
*Chile ranks 1st in Latin America of the Human Development Report.
*Best airline in Latin America, LAN.
*Highest ranked Latin American Airport. (EZE ranks 15th.)
*Regarding the Chilean military, although not the largest numerically, easily the most professionally trained and equipped. Certainly the most lethal. (I cannot really can't compare Chile's forces to Argentina as their Air-forcemeat and Army only exist on parade grounds for show. As for the Argentine Navy... according to a recent article:
“The Argentine Navy is under-funded and struggling to meet maintenance and training requirements, as a result only 15 out of a total of 42 navy vessels are in a condition to sail. The 2013 defence budget allowed for the 15 operational vessels to each spend less than 11 days at sea, whilst the submarines averaged just over 6 hours submerged in the whole of 2012.”
Yes, yes, Argentina ranks number one in the world in...... Try that boast to get inte
This is the opinión of a leftist garbage Gvt. officer which has nothing to do with tha opinión of he most of the inhabitants of Chile. We all knew at taht time that if Argentina would win the Falklands war son they would turn to west to attack our territory because the military junta there was traying to keep the power by highlitning the nationalism against the neighbors......
Aug 19th, 2014 - 02:04 am - Link - Report abuse 0Don´t give any value to the words from this stupid guy that is part of a very decadent Gvt. that is leading the country to the disaster in all topics, from economic issues to foreign policies, through education, social and political schemes. Unfortunately, we have to suffer almost 4 years of this mismanagement.....
Poor Chilito lindo.....
@90
Aug 19th, 2014 - 02:15 am - Link - Report abuse 0No we do not have self-determination. The world is trying to shove itself down our throat, when we want nothing to do with any of you EUians, NorthAmoans, etc.
@91
Chile is indeed a bellicose threat to Argentina. Militaristic, right wing fascist, and with a national mentality of Argentina holding on to “its territory”.
Dangerous neighbors we have indeed.
@90
Aug 19th, 2014 - 02:41 am - Link - Report abuse 0Holy baby jesus...
Let me guess, - You actually think Jesus Christ is going to arrive here soon in the 'Rapture' don't you?
Because the 'rapture' is far more believable than this quote of yours below......
''No we do not have self-determination. The world is trying to shove itself down our throat, when we want nothing to do with any of you EUians, NorthAmoans, etc.''
I have been awaiting the TTT Rapture for many years now. Sadly He has not returned yet, but I can only hope that His return to cause the Great Purge will happen soon.
Aug 19th, 2014 - 02:44 am - Link - Report abuse 0Does it sound like allowing self-determination when nations all over the world are trying to force us BY STRONG ARM tactics to change our trade, debt, and economic policy?
@95;
Aug 19th, 2014 - 02:55 am - Link - Report abuse 0What are you on about regarding the TTT?
Please elaborate
TTT is the...
Aug 19th, 2014 - 02:58 am - Link - Report abuse 0ooops, sorry. Time to put on CNN international to watch coverage of the Somalian riots, I mean... the USA riots. Going to grab my hearts of palm and golf sauce!
And shootings all over the USA this weekend.
Oh boy its fun to watch from home these third world hellholes like North America!
Wow, what a conceited individual up are.
Aug 19th, 2014 - 03:43 am - Link - Report abuse 0Tosser argentino to the end....
Why is it OK for you and the others to say stuff like that about my country, but not OK the other way around?
Aug 19th, 2014 - 04:17 am - Link - Report abuse 0I have asked this question for the last two years, and I still have not gotten a response. Literally no response.
#72 bla,bla,bla.....your history is the never end history.....always come up some miracle to have reasons to stay still with the fingers there. Are just excuses. To much told. Remenber between the 60's and 70's were negociations to give back to Argentina some sort of sovereingnity or share the islands. That's facts. The UN says there is a controvertial issue over the island, what more do you need to understand is not a solved matter, and never will be until be decided one treaty among the two countries.
Aug 19th, 2014 - 06:24 am - Link - Report abuse 0And chileans who are very interested about who the island is belong, better you take care for the Pascua islands. There indeed are indigenous and they want to be free. Dont put your nose where no body call you!!
@99 BOLUDO
Aug 19th, 2014 - 06:48 am - Link - Report abuse 0Because no country is quite as bad as Argentina in EVERY way - other nations, of course, have their peculiarities but Argentina………………! Just tell us what Argentina has that the rest of us should envy.
100 bloopers
Aug 19th, 2014 - 07:11 am - Link - Report abuse 0“bla,bla,bla.....your history is the never end history.....always come up some miracle to have reasons to stay still with the fingers there. Are just excuses. To much told. Remenber between the 60's and 70's were negociations to give back to Argentina some sort of sovereingnity or share the islands. That's facts. ”
LOL... bla bla bla... malvinista....blowhard. :-D
Argentina NEVER owned the Islands
Argentina FAILED to negotiate a treaty PEACEFULLY in the 70's
Argentina FAILED to take them MILITARILY in the 80's
Argentina REFUSED to negotiate PEACEFULLY in London in 2013
“That's facts!”
Stop crying - Mummy should wipe your face.
# 102 Thanks for your support Troll Tampax...... :D
Aug 19th, 2014 - 11:04 am - Link - Report abuse 0(by mistake I posted this in other thread, sorry, it should have being posted here)
Aug 19th, 2014 - 11:31 am - Link - Report abuse 0Here we go again...
- Chile did what was useful for Chile back in 1982, period. I don´t see why we could have expected them to be on our side if we were about to attack them in 1978.
- The UK needed a hand and grabbed all available help. Nothing to cry about.
- We could complain, however, about Pinochet´s double standard back in the day; if he was with the Brits, then why not simply saying that? Not to mention how many Argentinian lives may have being lost thanks to Chile´s contribution.
- Even Brit sources don´t look at that joint campaign as something to be proud about: back in the day Chile was ruled by a dictatorship which also killed some of their own people and which committed a terror-style attack in the US. To be honest, I find Thatcher´s tea-party with Pinochet in 1998 as quite disgusting.
- Topics like these are only useful to fuel the ultra-nationalist Chilean feelings, deeply ingrained after years of Pinochet-style brainwashing. Just take a look at how some Chileans make fun of Argentinian KIA servicemen.
- It´s true that J. de San Martin had more friends and support from Chile than from Buenos Aires.
- It´s depressing to see how so many Chileans still see Argentina as a threat rather than a partner.
To sum up, topics like these make me feel like we are not moving a inch forward ... :(
@104 Seba
Aug 19th, 2014 - 01:17 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“ if he was with the Brits, then why not simply saying that?”
The answer is that he wasn't with the Brits. He was with Chile. As you mention, if that meant killing an opponent in front of the White House, so be it. If it meant allowing the Brits to put a radar in southern Chile, so be it.
“It´s depressing to see how so many Chileans still see Argentina as a threat rather than a partner”
We don't. I don't know anyone who does or ever read about a threat in the media. Argentina is currently only a threat to itself. But there is a latent threat from Argentina that comes from its expansionist aspirations.
@100 bloporta
“There indeed are indigenous and they want to be free.”
Are you are implying that self-determination is a valid option for a small island population?
If so I agree with you. The natives on Rapa Nui who don't want to be part of Chile, have a valid point - they were never given a choice. However, they are a minority of the inhabitants and if they voted tomorrow, they would remain with Chile. We take great care of the island. The navy supplies it every month and the locals enjoy many benefits that us Continentals aren't entitled to. Further to all this there are projects to deliver greater autonomy to Rapa Nui - a good thing indeed.
Just a thought ... if I were a Falkland Islander thinking about a future “free association”, Chile would be a much more interesting option than Argentina.
Amnesty International and Reporters without Borders for the first time ever have become involved in the USA. Possible human rights abuses, and clear evidence of intimidation of journalist.
Aug 19th, 2014 - 01:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0NorthAmoland: what an awful awful awful place.
105#
Aug 19th, 2014 - 04:39 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Indeed I am implying that self-determination is a valid option for a small island population “ who were free natives from the islands and were took over from another foreign country”.
If you are clever enough, the Malvinas are not remotely near of this situation.
Are you sure you take care of people from Rapa Nui?:
http://www.biobiochile.cl/2013/01/18/parlamentario-rapa-nui-afirma-que-lucharan-por-su-independencia-no-descartan-querella-ante-la-haya.shtml
Nothing in this story surprises me. Of course Chile did the right thing in assisting the U.K. in the F.I. conflict - it was in it's interests to do so.
Aug 19th, 2014 - 05:37 pm - Link - Report abuse 0It's only been sixteen years since Pinochet ended his 'tenure' as Commandante en Jefe of the Chilean armed forces though and praising him and his rule for the positive things he did - as referred to by some Chilean posters above - must be a bridge too far for many, particularly it's current President whose personal memories of the Pinochet regime are surely focused on the LESS positive aspects of the same.
@ Tobias
It's in your interests to be nicer to the Chilean posters you know. I'm sure there are lots of Chilean investors observing what is occurring on the other side of the Andes with great interest and fully aware that quite soon many Argentinian assets might be available at, shall we say...intriguing prices. You might end up with a Chilean boss.
@108
Aug 19th, 2014 - 05:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0That is your wild anti-argie imagination in fantastical mode. I will never have a Chilean boss, much less an EUian, NOrthAmoan. Certainly not Ozzer.
Relax, Oh Rapturous One, I am so NOT anti-Argie I don't even use the word 'Argie' to describe you and your compatriots, and I agree with you: I can say with complete certainty that you will never have an 'Ozzer' boss. Or even an Aussie boss. I wouldn't bet against the Chileans though...
Aug 19th, 2014 - 06:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Mmmmm
Aug 19th, 2014 - 06:13 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The aliens watching you lot right now, must be laughing there socks off, these humans have learned nothing over the centuries, and here they are, again arguing / debating over the past, instead of the present and future,
Conquering them will be a walk over,
They will be far to busy arguing to stop us, ha ha .
[ just passing on the message like.. ] lol
.
@75 4n control
Aug 19th, 2014 - 06:14 pm - Link - Report abuse 0There is no “IF and Whataboutery”, about it, the facts are simple and straightforward, even for you.
The only time in history when Argentinian ground forces have fought the British was in 1982, which we all know the result of.
Argentina did not exist in 1806-7 and therefore could not have defeated the British, could they. Undeniable fact which no amount of blithering can change.
Claiming Argentina have ever defeated the British is an “outrageous lie”.
If you look up you history you will find the Germans did try and crush us, for sometime before they went to war with the USSR, however they got such a battering they decided to invade the USSR instead, as it was much easier.
As for the Spanish Amada, well grape shot took care of the troops, fire ships took care of the fleet, and the most you can say about the storm was that it saved them from further humiliation at the hands of the English.
We Anglos (Germanic tribes) were not in “Britain” at the time it was a Roman province, that was the Celts. We were the ones who broke the Roman Empire (western anyway) causing it to retreat from everywhere.
While the Parthians were still filling their nails hoping they were not next.
As for Vietnam, you are correct (first time so far) that was the Americans, for the British look up Malaya.
Oh and your new boss is a man called Singer.
Rapturous? I am a disciple of TTT waiting for his return for many years now (legendary where the days when he single-handedly dealt with 16 posters at the same time-- and schooled them all in the fine art of rhetoric and debate), but I cannot bring the online Rapture. Only He can.
Aug 19th, 2014 - 06:15 pm - Link - Report abuse 0112==great
Aug 19th, 2014 - 06:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0113-- I am a disciple of TTT ==says it all really.
@113 4n conTroll
Aug 19th, 2014 - 06:30 pm - Link - Report abuse 0So what, IYO, will bring back the 'legendary' TTT to this corner of the digital landscape?
@112
Aug 19th, 2014 - 06:40 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I will get back to you in a little bit to educate you on your atrocious understanding of history.
@114
It does. You cannot win.
@115
The completion of the Grandillian Cycle of Trollism: when one troll from each of the major regions and cultures of the world (Africa, Greece, China, France, Germany, Rome, Brazil, Mexico, etc), has made an appearance in this website... then the alignment of Zeta Reticuli and a 3-D gamma ray burst from the primordial 4 dimensional black hole that creates the projection which is our universe... then the ray influx should cause an anoxic-ocean event which will trigger a Heinrich event which in turn will catalyze aNorth Atlantic Oscillation disturbance and create a NorthAmoan and EUian collapse.
At least I hope so.
What President Bachelet may not know is that Burgos is a malvinazi spy planted in her government. Nobody should be surprised by what he says. Never mind that he is totally illiterate in defense maters (even more than Pinera's Ravinet & Allamand). Please wait a little longer, and you'll see!
Aug 19th, 2014 - 06:40 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Philippe
@115
Aug 19th, 2014 - 06:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0What the Trekkie @116 says and what my Chilean boss say do no coincide. Only He can ordain my return.
The number of TTT impostors in the last 3 years has been by far the highest of any other screenname in this website. That shows the profound impact of his legacy, and why many of us await his return.
Aug 19th, 2014 - 06:56 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Giorgio B. Tsoukalos will give more details of his latest research on TTT's return in a few months when he makes his annual visit to Mercopress.
@116
Aug 19th, 2014 - 07:02 pm - Link - Report abuse 0That sounds rather complicated, not to say problematic. Alas a NorthAmaon collapse would bring the WWW servers to a crashing holt, thereby taking MercoPress 'off the air'. No Rapture. Sigh...
p.s. You're not building a giant laser in your bedroom are you? I think we should be told.
Argentina is now only a phytosanitary threat to Chile. (Hoof and mouth disease, phylloxera, med-fruit fly, etc...) Well, with a eventual financial collapse there will be a moderate impact on Chile's markets as well, but nothing worse than in the past.
Aug 19th, 2014 - 09:14 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Heisenbergcontext, I disagree with you, #109's new boss will probably be from Beijing. No self respecting Chilean I personally know would in the future take over an Argentine company. (Obviously agricultural, petrochemical and mining excepted.) Paul Singer already has got his hands very close in snatching Argentina's piggy bank, but he's not stupid.
#117 All Christian Democrats cannot be trusted. Not even as spies as they change their allegiance all the time.
@121
Aug 19th, 2014 - 09:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Your unwarranted arrogance is so pathetic.
Chile will not be taking over anything in Argentina. Your cash is out.
Second, you seem to think your “sanitary” status is superior because of something you as a society do. Wrong, you just have an environmental barrier and very few outsiders visit Chile. Neither are something to either be proud of due to own achievement or from self-interest.
Really, sorry to break it to you but you are nowhere above Argentina as you think you are.
Good news to see Chile and Argenina together with good bilateral agreements.
Aug 19th, 2014 - 09:41 pm - Link - Report abuse 0moreover they have the same history,language and religion.Too bad the British were able to brain wash Pinochet....but as an American president once said: They (dictators) are sons of a bitches but they are our sons of a bitches..Pinotchet was one of them.......and he was easily fooled by the Brits.....
they did it good ... ! they followed napoleon's advice the Enemy of My Enemy Is My Friend fair is fair.
Aug 19th, 2014 - 10:21 pm - Link - Report abuse 0After we liberated them from Spain , they paid us like that..!
@124
Aug 19th, 2014 - 10:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Who's “we” and “them”?
#122
Aug 19th, 2014 - 11:12 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Chile is just cleaner... We prefer you keep all those undesirable insects, plant diseases and worse on your side of the Andes, nothing personal.
What's got you with your panties all wadded up in a knot?
Is it that Chile has more Noble prizes in the arts than any other Latin American nation, or that we have the highest ranked university, the highest standard of living, being the safest? Remember, you are the one that started deriding Chile...
You know, Chileans sincerely like Argentinians, we just pity their political decisions. You called us a “dangerous war monger”... When do you think the last time we attacked another country? Repeat after me, Chile is a PEACEFUL country with a military that's well armed, exceptionally trained and highly equipped.
You point out: “Really, sorry to break it to you but you are nowhere above Argentina as you think you are.” You're very right... Chile is FAR ABOVE your pathetically governed bankrupted country. My socialist president in La Moneda runs circles around your wicked queen of Botox in La Casa Rosada.
@126
Aug 19th, 2014 - 11:24 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Nobel prizes are irrelevant, and really, you shouldn't go there anyway.
When did you start a war? How about in Laguna del Desierto, to which Chile tried to gain access to the east of the Andes divide?
Chile cleaner? I remember going to a Santiago pharmacy and the tooth brush I bought was filled with soot, or smog, or something. Not as clean as you think then.
I deride and insult EVERYONE and every country. So if you take it personal, that's your personal insecurity. A reflection on you not me!
*112 oh come on lad!! You lost some battles along the way....it was not all win,win,win.....and always about the Spanish Armada..let me tell you about another Armada (this one was British) Back in 1741 the British spies in Cartagena,Colombia sent Prime Minister Robert Walpole Some very good news.The spies told Walpole that Cartagena was there for the taking.¨There are only around 4.000 military personnel and if we hurry South America will be british and the best part is that the Spanish Admiral in charge is totally stuffed.He has one leg.one arm and one eye the poor bastard is a cripple.Walpole was all excited now at the thought of kicking out the Spaniards from South America¨.He organized a huge fleet 30.000 military personnel.29 ships of the line and 22 frigates against 6 ships of the line on the Spanish line as the spies had told him.Walport was delirous with the news that he minted different commemorative medals to celebrate the ¨victory against the Poor bastard Spanish Admiral (oh!! whose name was Don Blas De Lezo). In one of the coins Vernon (british Admiral) is shown looking down at Admiral Don Blas who appears to be kneeling.
Aug 19th, 2014 - 11:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0So off went the British fleet to Cartagena and capture the Spanish Empire...
¨hooray, hooray¨ one could hear the English King back at Windsor Castle deciding what to do with all that wealth but........
to cut a long story short:
The English lost 11.500 military personnel....spaniards 800 dead
The English lost 29 ships of the line...Spaniards 6
The English lost 22 frigates..Spaniards none.
not bad for a crippled..this Don Blas De Lazo. was he? oh! by the way: This British fleet WAS LARGER than the Spanish Armada.....ummmmmm
Next week I shall tell you how Lord Nelson lost his arm...(and nearly his life)
cheers.....
Pugol-H also “conveniently” forgets that other, not so famous Armada... I wonder why no one ever heard of them:
Aug 19th, 2014 - 11:36 pm - Link - Report abuse 0http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_Armada
”The English Armada, also known as the Counter Armada or the Drake-Norris Expedition, was a fleet of warships sent to the Iberian Coast by Queen Elizabeth I of England in 1589, during the Anglo-Spanish War (1585–1604) and the Eighty Years' War. It was led by Sir Francis Drake as admiral and Sir John Norreys as general, and failed to drive home the advantage England had won upon the dispersal of the Spanish Armada in the previous year. The campaign resulted in the defeat of the English fleet and eventually to a withdrawal with heavy losses both in lives and ships. The Spanish victory marked a revival of Philip II's naval power through the next decade“
”With the opportunity to strike a decisive blow against the weakened Spanish navy lost, the failure of the expedition further depleted the crown treasury that had been so carefully restored during the long reign of Elizabeth I. The Anglo-Spanish war was very costly to both sides, and Spain itself, also fighting France and the United Provinces, had to default on its debt repayments in 1596, following another raid on Cadiz. In 1595 the Spanish raided Cornwall in the west of England. In 1596 and 1597 two more armadas were sent by Spain but both were scattered by storms.[15] But the failure of the English Armada was a turning point, and the fortunes of the various parties to this complicated conflict fluctuated until peace was agreed on the signing of the Treaty of London in 1604.”
well there you go lad as 4n conTroll mentions you have another DEFEAT..
Aug 19th, 2014 - 11:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0STAY TUNED MORE DEFEATS WILL BE PUBLISHED..ummmm
And the most famous one of all?
Aug 19th, 2014 - 11:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norman_conquest_of_England
I'm looking forward as to how our “Germanic racialist” Pugol-H spins a historical event called “CONQUEST OF ENGLAND” into an English Anglo-Saxon victory!!
The famous Laguna del Desierto invasión consisted of one innocent Chilean border patrol policeman being murdered by a group of cowardly Argentine soldiers...
Aug 19th, 2014 - 11:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You no longer exist as an entity.
War is tragic, but that is what happens when you invade our territory.
Aug 20th, 2014 - 12:05 am - Link - Report abuse 0Interesting about The Laguna Del Desierto; apparently Great Britain has its snout in this part of Argentine and Chilian history. too. The International British Arbitral Award of 1903 awarded by King Edward of Great Britain awarded the whole lake to Chile WHICH THE INTERNATIONAL TRIBUNAL awarded it back to Argentina in 1994....now..if the Brits had not awarded the Lake to Chile this sorry incident would not have happened..would it? ummmmmm. (under what authority did Great Britain award the lake to Chile ???!!!...mind boggling these Poms.)
Aug 20th, 2014 - 12:27 am - Link - Report abuse 0@134
Aug 20th, 2014 - 12:33 am - Link - Report abuse 0That goes without mention... That's why I didn't. But yes in 1903 YET AGAIN the UK acting AGAINST Argentina. For the umpteenth time within 100 years.
And let's remember Laguna del Desierto lies EAST of the andes crest.
But it was our mistake to accept the Brits as arbitrators when one of the parties is their closest Latin American ally. Fool was on us.
#134
Aug 20th, 2014 - 12:40 am - Link - Report abuse 0I've never made a mockery of the dead that lost their lives serving their country. I have nothing but contempt for those who do so. You are a non-entity as well.
So just mentioning the incident is tantamount to insulting the war dead?
Aug 20th, 2014 - 12:43 am - Link - Report abuse 0Really...
131
Aug 20th, 2014 - 12:44 am - Link - Report abuse 0Out of historical interest, I must note that the Normans were also a combination of Norsemen and Germanic Franks....So it was a conquest of Germanic tribes by Germanic tribes....
...and for England it set the stage for the end of their isolation and the beginning of their global expansion.....
@138
Aug 20th, 2014 - 12:49 am - Link - Report abuse 0So it was the same people that set Europe back 1000 years when they sacked Rome (not because they were any great fighters... when you try for 800 years to sack Rome, I mean the odds are that one of those times you will succeed).
136* who is mocking the dead?? I am mocking your arguements on Laguna del
Aug 20th, 2014 - 12:51 am - Link - Report abuse 0desierto and its British past.........
I don't what Chichureo is on. In NONE of the post is there a mention of the dead Chilean carabinero, and the only time he was mentioned it was by him (and called the Argentine soldiers coward, btw).
Aug 20th, 2014 - 12:53 am - Link - Report abuse 0Which prompted me to state “war is tragic”, my only indirect reference to the slain man.
Who knows what's up there.
139
Aug 20th, 2014 - 12:54 am - Link - Report abuse 0Germanic tribes.....wanderlust and invasion it's in their blood...
Rome was a failed state anyway it had run it's course and had stagnated....no great loss..their time was over....
@142
Aug 20th, 2014 - 12:56 am - Link - Report abuse 0Failed state? It lasted longer than any nation in world history.
143
Aug 20th, 2014 - 12:58 am - Link - Report abuse 0....and had the biggest Empire I suppose...?
well what do expect from a guy who fiddled while Rome burnt!! Its like he started the bloody fire!! and the end of Rome....
Aug 20th, 2014 - 01:02 am - Link - Report abuse 0@144
Aug 20th, 2014 - 01:02 am - Link - Report abuse 0No, that was the Mongols, in area. It lasted 100 years though and had no lasting impact in language, engineering, governance, law, or anything else. Too fleeting.
...he was a bloody pyromaniac!! this Nero
Aug 20th, 2014 - 01:05 am - Link - Report abuse 0146
Aug 20th, 2014 - 01:12 am - Link - Report abuse 0There is tons of material available on the decline of Rome....it's all well known...
..like...
“Arnold J. Toynbee and James Burke argue that the Roman Empire itself was a rotten system from its inception, and that the entire Imperial era was one of steady decay of institutions founded in Republican times. In their view, the Empire could never have lasted longer than it did without radical reforms that no Emperor could implement. The Romans had no budgetary system and thus wasted whatever resources they had available. The economy of the Empire was a Raubwirtschaft or plunder economy based on looting existing resources rather than producing anything new.”
..like I said, stagnated and was doomed to failure...
*148...and then came Nero and burnt the place to the ground......
Aug 20th, 2014 - 01:14 am - Link - Report abuse 0It's sad to note that one troubled troll posting here is suffering from a multiple personality disorder.
Aug 20th, 2014 - 01:56 am - Link - Report abuse 0@150
Aug 20th, 2014 - 01:59 am - Link - Report abuse 0It's funny how everyone here accuses me of this “disease”.
Really... do you think if I wanted to have multiple personas, REALLY have multiple personas, that I would do a better job than to ALWAYS USE WORDS WITH THE SYLLABLE “TROLL” IN THEM? Or using the word “nostril” in another language to cleverly make plausible names in another language?
Do you little children think I'm really hiding?
150
Aug 20th, 2014 - 03:41 am - Link - Report abuse 0sad... and boring
@134 Spanish Sunshine. In 1903 both parties obviously agreed to abide by 'international arbitration'. The World Court System did not start until 1922. The fact that the second tribunal took place in 1993 obviously takes into consideration the international rules of 'prescription' and in the case of the Falkland Islands this is relevant 'uninterrupted continuous possession.' Other international legal principles also applicable are the erga omnes character of self-determination and 'extinctive prescription' which means that Argentina's failure to bring its sovereignty claims to the ICJ within appropriate time-scales, usually 30 years means that Argentina has acquiesced to British possession and no longer has a sovereignty claim. Oh what a wonderful thing international law is.
Aug 20th, 2014 - 10:08 am - Link - Report abuse 0@ 128 aussiesunshinee
Aug 20th, 2014 - 06:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Don’t claim to have won them all by any means, however we did win the ones listed, as described, and have never lost to Argentina.
@ 129 4n control
Yes, and by 1713 the Spanish had to sign Gibraltar over to us, then by 1770 Spain was so weak that when the British demanded the unconditional return of the Malvinas, they capitulated without even a fight.
@131 4n control
Here it is called the Norman Conquest.
Normans were Anglo-Saxon who settled in France when the rest were conquering what was to become England.
The clue is in the name NOR – MAN i.e. man from the north, Normans, Anglo-Saxons and Danes were the same people, genetically speaking.
One of the many insights into our history modern science has given us.
You should try reading some, sometime.
@ 136 Chicureo
Probably the same non-entity, two different manifistations.
#154 Pugol
Aug 20th, 2014 - 07:08 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The troubled mentally challenged adolescent troll suffering from a multiple personality disorder you speak of needs to limit himself to a maximum of two identities as he's presently confusing himself with numerous pathetic contradictions. I decided to completely ignore the hijo de puta when began ridiculing fallen soldiers.
*154 you don´t believe that the Brits took Gibraltar..do you?? It was a Dutch and British attack as Great Britain could not have done it on their own....simple as that. Oh!! and another thing..Gibraltar was taken in the name of Charles III of Spain.......but anyway the future will put everybody in their place.........
Aug 20th, 2014 - 10:32 pm - Link - Report abuse 0#154
Aug 20th, 2014 - 11:18 pm - Link - Report abuse 0See what I mean?
Not the sharpest knife in the drawer...
You do love licking English pudding don't you Chichureo.
Aug 21st, 2014 - 03:22 am - Link - Report abuse 0And for the record, don't try becoming a detective.
What does the battles between Spain and England in the 1590s have to do with anything in the 1700s. Countries rise and fall. Before 1600 the English nation was a non-weight and France, Spain, Germany (Holy Roman Empire), were far more powerful. So what? Things aren't static.
Pugol-H is so far up his own a$$ he believes any changes in global power balance due to the wheels of history turning are somehow the work of the English.
Wow, talk about an enormous delusion of grandeur.
@ 156. Spanish Sunshine. - It is solely up to the people of Gibraltar, as with the people of the Falkland Islands, to determine how and by whom they are governed. This is as per Article 73 of the UN Charter, numerous ICJ rulings that now have an erga omnes character. It is just as Ban Ki-Moon has said, 'the 16 remaining territories that still do not govern themselves must have complete freedom to determine their own future status. '. Comprende?
Aug 21st, 2014 - 03:57 am - Link - Report abuse 0#133
Aug 21st, 2014 - 05:46 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Yes it is and also when you invade OUR territory.
Yes the bottom line is that we have lost many battles but end up winning the wars.
You lot TALK a good fight but could not fight your way out of a paper bag...
158
Wow, talk about an enormous delusion of grandeur. Yes, you have just summed up Argentina perfectly.
wow, what total scum this guy is. Perhaps he should realise Argentina wanted land off Chile too, they did exactly the right thing at the time for their country, regardless if they supported either claim to Islands.
Aug 22nd, 2014 - 12:18 pm - Link - Report abuse 0101Gordo1
Aug 22nd, 2014 - 03:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“Just tell us what Argentina has that the rest of us should envy”
Total LATAM population : more than 500 million. Argentina´s : 41 (8 %). Total LATAM NOBEL prizes : 16. Argentina´s : 5 (31 %) Total LATAM NOBEL prizes in SCIENCES : 5. Argentina´s : 3 (60 %)
(Or, if it becomes more palatable to your envy, Argentina holds more NOBEL laureates in SCIENCES that the rest of Latin American countries ALL TOGETHER).
Top 10 Universities in Latin America: Chile has first position and 2 in the top 10. Brazil has 5, Mexico 2 and Colombia 1.
Aug 22nd, 2014 - 05:56 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Top ranked medical clinics, per capita income, stable currency, economy, corruption, crime, poverty, free speech....
In all Argentina is declining in the ratings that it once was ranked first...
Chile continues (and will continue) to be absolute first in ENVY.
Aug 23rd, 2014 - 02:34 am - Link - Report abuse 0164
Aug 23rd, 2014 - 03:19 am - Link - Report abuse 0You are fooling only yourself.
UN Human Development Index:
Aug 24th, 2014 - 11:11 pm - Link - Report abuse 037 ▬ Andorra 0,830 (reference)
41 ▲ (1) CHI 0,822
49 ▬ ARG 0,808
GDP per capita (2014)
CZK 18,857 (reference)
CHI 15,776
ARG 9,640
Export per capita
CHI 4848 USD
ARG 1904 USD
Child mortality (out of 1000, Worldbank 2013)
USA 7 (reference)
CHI 9
ARG 14
Students tertiary sector (% of total population):
CHI 5,7%
ARG 3,5%
PISA Education Score 2012:
Mathematics
CHI 427
ARG 388
Reading
CHI 441
ARG 396
Science
CHI 445
ARG 406
Corruption Index 2013 (Transparency International)
22. CHI 71
26. Austria 69 (reference)
106. ARG 34
Inflation 2014
CHI 2.8%
ARG 25,0%
The next one is a burner... not very known, but very representative for economic power comparisons:
Stock Market capitalization Jan 2013 (Million USD):
Santiago : 335,863.7
Buenos Aires: 42,064.1
Source: World Federation of Exchanges
Metro System Extension (2014)
Tokyo 193 km (reference)
Santiago 103 km (most extensive in South America)
Buenos Aires 51km
Metro passengers (2013)
Santiago 667 Million
Buenos Aires 310 Million
Murder Rate:
AUS 1,3 (reference)
CHI 1,7
ARG 5,5
We could continue listing all these Rankings, the point is most of you Argentinian lads keep dreaming of what is perceived of a great past and a supposed aspiration to lead something and you have not yet noticed, that we did not only surpass you... we literally f*ck you in every possible ranking, meassure and Kamasutra position. And the breach keeps getting bigger and bigger every minute that passes...
I congratulate you on all those Rankings. You deserve praise, indeed, for your accomplishments. You have been good pupils. GREATNESS is what you lack. And one of its surest tests is ORIGINALITY on GREAT matters. I repeat: We hold more NOBELS on Science than the rest of Latin American countries ALL TOGETHER. I see you as a LITTLE soul of a LITTLE man of a LITTLE country.
Aug 25th, 2014 - 12:07 am - Link - Report abuse 0Anything lately, ArgenMensch??
Aug 25th, 2014 - 02:12 am - Link - Report abuse 0Before you start - no the “Biro” was not an Argentine invention either.
Biro pen
http://www.ideafinder.com/history/inventions/ballpen.htm
http://www.ideafinder.com/history/inventions/ballpen.htm
“Swirling within and around the arc of these two lives, Moldova illustrates how citizenship and nationalism can be used in conjunction with patent laws and international/national corporate capitalism to peel away from individual innovators and entrepreneurs their ownership of intellectual property.
For example, Bíró handed over a sizable percentage of his shares to his Argentine partners to free his family from fascist Hungary.”
http://www.ideafinder.com/history/inventions/ballpen.htm
“Bíró filed a British patent on 15 June 1938.[5]”
Loving this thread!
Aug 25th, 2014 - 03:57 am - Link - Report abuse 0@ 167 Argenfellow (#)
Aug 26th, 2014 - 04:39 pm - Link - Report abuse 0repeating the Nobel Point from before? *Yawn* But ok, if you insist and it is your last and only argument... out of these 3 Nobel Prizes, one guy was French (Leloir, born in Paris and formed in the UK), he later claimed that his first invention (non-related to the Nobel) was much more relevant: “Salsa Golf” (Ketchup+Mayonaise): “If I had patented that sauce, we'd have a lot more money for research right now”
The other guy, Milestein, also ironically evolved and harvested his prices in the UK, based on his work in Cambridge. He died in same city. The UK should count that Nobel for themselves.
You talk about “Greatness”? Do you realize how silly you sound, basing this GREATNESS on 3 simple Nobel ? I mean, ok we also have 2, but we do not base or boast our identity on this. Our aspiration has never been to reach or boast this kind of Greatness, because we are rational people. Ok, you could talk about “Greatness”, if you'd have 101 (!) nobel prices like Germany, also arround 100 about the UK, Even South Africa has 11...
Greatness due to 3 Noble prices... oh my gosh. Hahahahahaha... Clown.
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