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Falklands' invasion in 1982, prevented an 'irreversible' solution for Gibraltar

Thursday, January 22nd 2015 - 05:24 UTC
Full article 47 comments

Had it not been for the 1982 Argentine invasion of the Falkland Islands, and the war that followed, Spain would have achieved through negotiations an 'irreversible solution' to the Gibraltar dispute with Great Britain, revealed Spanish diplomat, scholar and academic Jose Cuenca in his recently launched book, “From Adolfo Suarez to Gorbachev; an ambassador's testimonies and shared secrets”. Read full article

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  • LEPRecon

    Just speculation and your opinion Mr Cuenca.

    There's still that pesky thing called self-determination that would always get in the way.

    Why oh why is it so difficult for countries like Spain and Argentina to understand that the ONLY legal way they can possibly achieve their purported goals of gaining sovereignty over Gibraltar and the Falklands is by the people who live there voting for it.

    And both countries have a funny way of going about 'wooing' the people who live in Gibraltar and the Falklands, threats, intimidation and downright lies in the international arena.

    One can only conclude that neither country is actually serious about gaining sovereignty over these British Overseas Territories are in fact only using them as a tool to distract brainwashed populations from the terrible job that their respective governments are doing.

    And the world can see exactly what both nations are up to, hence why their so-called claims haven't advanced at all since the 1960's.

    Jan 22nd, 2015 - 05:54 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Lord Ton

    I suspect that his memory fades. He hasn't read - González M. A. The Genesis of the Falklands (Malvinas) Conflict 2014

    Jan 22nd, 2015 - 05:55 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Troy Tempest

    I'm sure he had no thoughts of the Falklands and did not see the parallels or the significance of Self - Determination, ever.

    Jan 22nd, 2015 - 06:03 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • brasherboot

    His comments don't make sense.

    Why did Thatcher bolster Gibraltar's defences over paranoia that Spain might attempt an invasion during the conflict?

    She could have simply told the Spanish the talks are on hold for the moment if this diplomat is right. Conjecture is what this is

    Jan 22nd, 2015 - 06:26 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • gordo1

    Bollocks! ¡Gilipollez!

    Jan 22nd, 2015 - 06:57 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Brit Bob

    Fairy tales. Next he'll be saying Gib has no territorial waters because of Utrecht.

    Jan 22nd, 2015 - 08:21 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Troy Tempest

    Yes, more wishful thinking.

    This controversial 'tag' might help sell books.

    Jan 22nd, 2015 - 09:30 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Leiard

    Gibraltar

    HC Deb 23 June 1982 vol 26 cc141-2W

    http://hansard.millbanksystems.com/written_answers/1982/jun/23/gibraltar-1

    Jan 22nd, 2015 - 10:14 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Britworker

    All these brave men saying what Mrs Thatcher would have done now she is dead.

    Clearly the issue wasn't important enough to confront her with when the Falklands war was over. Another day, another Spanish coward crawls out if his hole.

    Jan 22nd, 2015 - 10:54 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Leiard

    In London, Mrs. Thatcher's office issued the text of her comments as follows; ”We were hoping this time they (the border restrictions) could be lifted and we could enter into talks but, of course, not on sovereignty because the fact is that the whole of our belief in democracy, is that it is the people that matter”

    http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=2507&dat=19820624&id=P7dAAAAAIBAJ&sjid=wKUMAAAAIBAJ&pg=1897,4951453

    Jan 22nd, 2015 - 11:08 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Vestige

    just another postponement in the inevitable.
    http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:British_Empire_evolution3.gif

    Jan 22nd, 2015 - 12:55 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Conqueror

    @1. Just to add a little bit. There was the small matter of the Gibraltar sovereignty referendum, 1967 in which 95.67% of the voters of Gibraltar made their wishes known. 99.64% of those chose to remain under British sovereignty. And Snr Cuenca thinks the British government would forget or ignore that?

    Jan 22nd, 2015 - 12:57 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Vestige

    how much respect was given to the democratic desires of the Spanish removed from Gibraltar by the Dutch and British. I'm sure 99.64% of them had an opinion too.

    Jan 22nd, 2015 - 01:07 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Pete Bog

    @13 Vestige

    “How much respect was given to the democratic desires of the Spanish removed from Gibraltar by the Dutch and British”.

    What was the result of that referendum then?

    What about the democratic desires of the South American natives that were murdered/removed by the Spanish from their homelands?

    Jan 22nd, 2015 - 02:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • gordo1

    @13 Vestige “how much respect was given to the democratic desires of the Spanish removed from Gibraltar by the Dutch and British. I'm sure 99.64% of them had an opinion too.”

    Have you read the terms of the Treaty of Utrecht? Had you done so you would not have asked such a nonsensical question!

    Jan 22nd, 2015 - 03:57 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Clyde15

    #11
    Your reference brings up this.....“..This is a disambiguation page.”
    A useful piece of information to back up your nonsensical post.

    Jan 22nd, 2015 - 04:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ChrisR

    This idiot looks like the late, great, Leslie Neilsen but without the intellect.

    http://www.imdb.com/media/rm3200812032/nm0000558?ref_=nm_phs_md_4

    Jan 22nd, 2015 - 05:35 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Vestige

    Spain should roll over the border and offer a new treaty to sign.
    There'd be a treaty so all legal and above board...moral high ground and all that. Then Spain could have a Democratic vote.

    Jan 22nd, 2015 - 05:57 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Clyde15

    #18
    You mean do as ARGENTINA did in 1982....start a war ?

    Jan 22nd, 2015 - 06:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ChrisR

    @ 18 Vestige aka Brainless

    Still living up to the nick I gave you I see.

    Oh, dear, Spain to roll over the border? Yeah, in your dreams Brainless.

    Jan 22nd, 2015 - 06:50 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Conqueror

    Comment removed by the editor.

    Jan 22nd, 2015 - 07:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • gordo1

    @21 Conqueror - you are an ignorant fool! I am a proud Brit but also an hispanophile and your post “Sovereignty belongs to humans. Not to animals such as spanish. I've been there and the spanish aren't human” is vile and ad hominem and should be removed immediately by the moderator.
    Indeed, most of your posts are unwelcome due to their nonsensical content. So just f--k off!

    Jan 22nd, 2015 - 08:01 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Briton

    Spain should roll over the border and offer a new treaty to sign,
    1, Gibraltar will remain free forever
    2, Catalonians will get there independence
    3, Spain will give back all overseas land, that it stole
    `new treaty to sign=yep agreed

    Spain COULD have a Democratic vote
    but it wont...lol

    Jan 22nd, 2015 - 08:01 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • gordo1

    To the editor.

    Many thanks re @21

    Jan 22nd, 2015 - 08:38 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Briton

    Some interesting bit and pieces.
    A Galician was told that his wife was sleeping with his best friend…
    So he killed his dog.

    Why did 19 Galicians go to the cinema?
    Because the film was prohibited for under 18s.

    A woman, a man, and Menem are in a room. The man lowers his pants and shows his butt: “This is like the Amazon: impenetrable,” he says.
    The woman shows her breasts and says: “These are like the United States: untouchable.”
    Finally, ex-president Menem shows his penis and says: “This is like Argentina: it never gets up.”
    What is an ego?
    It’s the little Argentine we all have in us.

    Finally,
    The difference between the Germans and the argentines is the
    The Germans don’t have a sense of humor
    And the Argies, don’t have the Falkland’s.
    .

    Jan 22nd, 2015 - 08:42 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Conqueror

    After a legal treaty, how many times did spain attack Gibraltar? Not an ounce of honour or integrity. And let's not forget the animals that live in spain. Anybody seen any honesty or integrity? UNCLOS specifies territorial waters. 3 miles. Dishonest spain breaches international law. And I'll keep posting this until the TRUTH can be read!

    Jan 22nd, 2015 - 09:14 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Skip

    Vestige is funny.

    By all means Spain, roll across the border..... it worked so well for Vlad!

    Jan 23rd, 2015 - 05:50 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • LEPRecon

    @18 Vestige

    I see you've crawled out from under your rock.

    There are several reasons Spain wouldn't dare to 'roll' across the border and steal Gibraltar.

    1. They would be immediately kicked out of NATO - and Spain desperately needs to be in that club now - it pays for much of their defence.
    2. They would be suspended from the EU - invading a fellow EU member country is grounds for that - and the consequences would be no more money for Spain, unable to sell its produce (which the UK buys an enormous amount of), and it would be bankrupt in very short order.
    3. The British would immediately stop going to Spain on holiday - and Spain desperately needs the revenue from tourists.
    4. The UK would immediately invoke Article 51 of the UN Charter - the right to self defence - and if necessary remove Spain by force.

    But your scenario is dependant on the Spanish actually taking the Rock (which they've tried numerous times in the past and always failed), and the British not noticing the massive build up of soldiers and equipment in an area that isn't known to have large military bases.

    Of course the Spanish aren't that stupid. And if the Spanish were that bothered about wanting Gibraltar then they only have to woo the people who live on the Rock to agree to become Spanish. It can't be that hard surely?

    Oh wait, Spain is a failing country, that is only still going due to the charity of the rest of the EU. It's military doesn't have a huge budget and relies on NATO members (including the UK) to help out with fuel etc... (but then that's what allies do for one another - help each other out).

    I know that helping your allies out is an alien concept for Argentinians since you have no allies - just countries that throw you a bone by paying lip service whilst at the same time laughing at you behind your backs.

    Jan 23rd, 2015 - 06:40 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • gordo1

    @18 Vestige
    Are you quite witless? Before a new treaty is offered surely the existing treaty(of Utrecht) should be revisited and, perhaps, renegotiated. This will not happen but even if were to happen then the matter of sovereignty of the Balearic Islands would arise as Menorca, too, was ceded in PERPETUITY to Britain at the same time as was Gibraltar.

    Jan 23rd, 2015 - 07:01 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • BritishAlways

    Hahahaha poor deluded Spaniards like to convince themselves that they have been very close to clinching a deal on Gibraltar for the past 311 years!!!!!! We’ve heard all that before – utter nonsense. Nothing but total RACISTS in citing the old Treaty of Utrecht which bans Jews and Arabs from residing in Gibraltar. RACISTS and anti-democrats because they cannot conceive that we have a right to determine our own future. Bahhhh full of hot air and sour grapes. Florida and Menorca were exchanged for Gibraltar - it would take something really imaginative to resolve that.

    Jan 23rd, 2015 - 03:23 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • gordo1

    BritishAlways - you have a totally erroneous concept of the Spanish. Whilst they fail to accept the terms of the Treaty of Utrecht this is due to ignorance nothing else. In a way, in the case of Gibraltar. many have been brainwashed just as the Argentines have been over the matter of the Falkland Islands.

    My experience after many years of living in Valencia and in Andalucia I cannot accept that, as a nation, Spaniards are racists although the treatment of gypsies in Spain needs to be reviewed.

    Jan 23rd, 2015 - 03:56 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ChrisR

    @ 31 gordo1

    So, they are NOT racists?

    They just treat the gypsies like second class people.

    Great logic.

    Jan 23rd, 2015 - 06:39 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • gordo1

    @32 ChrisR

    The Spanish gypsies are treated as a separate people just as the British treat immigrants from Eastern Europe. Most of the blame can be placed on the gypsies themselves as they are not ethnic natives of Iberia and seek to maintain their own way of life.

    Jan 23rd, 2015 - 07:17 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Briton

    Gibraltar does worry me at times with their pro Eu, call,

    I hope they know what they are doing,

    Jan 23rd, 2015 - 08:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Skip

    “Most of the blame can be placed on the gypsies themselves as they are not ethnic natives of Iberia and seek to maintain their own way of life.”

    Ummmm no!

    Or does that means that I can now treat nearly 25% of Australia's residents badly because they are not ethnic natives or born here and try to maintain their own way of life?

    Gordo1 in one breath you say you can't tar an entire people as racist but then you go an tar an entire people as being most to blame for the actions of others.

    You have a very skewed worldview if you think those two claims don't make you a hypocrite.

    Jan 23rd, 2015 - 10:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • gordo1

    @35 I am only stating facts - I condone nothing!

    Jan 24th, 2015 - 06:41 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • BritishAlways

    Gordo – no one knows the Spanish better than Gibraltarians, we have been suffering them for the past 300 years!!!!!!! They renege on everything they’ve signed on Gibraltar and broken all treaties by their historic military and now political sieges. They haven’t got a clue of the meaning of democratic principles because they are still in a Franco mode. The present PP extreme right wing party is retrograde and totalitarian. Spain deserves better.

    Jan 24th, 2015 - 06:14 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Briton

    Do you notice how Spain and Argentina are exactly the same,
    except for the spelling...lol

    Jan 24th, 2015 - 07:37 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • gordo1

    @37 BritishAlways
    My mother was from Gibraltar but she was a total hispanophile! But then she lived there when there was no border and La Línea supplied all the domestic workers employed on the Rock and many unskilled and, indeed, skilled workers for HM Dockyard. For a Gibraltarian to state, as you do, “no one knows the Spanish better than Gibraltarians” is, of course, nonsense! What about the Portuguese?
    I think you overstate matters when you say “they are still in a Franco mode” - if you had seen, as I have, all the statues of Franco “toppling” over in the cities and towns of Spain you would, surely, have to agree that “Francoismo” is dead and buried except for a very few extremists here and there. You are, of course, biased because of the Gibraltar situation - I can assure that the average Spaniard - the man in the street - cares very little about Gibraltar.

    Jan 24th, 2015 - 08:14 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Pete Bog

    @18
    “Spain should roll over the border ”

    That would spell goodbye to Euro handouts which they need-also they can't even afford to keep more than a handful of Typhoons operational.

    The Spanish haven't the guts-they can sling a few boats around and that's it-once they were fired on, the white flags in their kit would come out in seconds.

    Jan 24th, 2015 - 11:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • BritishAlways

    Gordo the trouble is that franco is still buried in the Valle de los Caidos WITH HIS VICTIMS and the PP party franco idolisers refuse to remove the remains of the assassin elsewhere, and also refuse to investigate all the crimes committed. Can you imagine Hitler being buried with his victims???????? You say that the Spanish do not care about Gibraltar, if only that were true!!! But there is still hope that if Spain ever becomes a real democracy, Gibraltar can be forgotten in perpetuity.

    Jan 25th, 2015 - 10:40 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • gordo1

    @41 BritishAlways
    I must say that I disagree with you about any lingering influence Franco and his followers might have. The only favourable remark about Franco that I have ever heard after many years residence in Spain was that during his dictatorship petty crime didn't exist!

    Jan 25th, 2015 - 04:39 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • aussiesunshinee

    what a bunch of wankers!!! what useless posts!! and all about an imaginary
    situation!! GET A LIFE!! intread of wasting your time writing bull crap all day long on a shitty post................... waste of spaces the whole lot of you....

    Jan 25th, 2015 - 10:17 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • LEPRecon

    @43 aussiesunshine

    Well you 'contribution' doesn't appear to be anything but swearing an insults.

    Want to comment on the story or just continue swearing?

    No one forces you to come on here and comment, so feel free to go somewhere else.

    By the way, this imaginary situation was created by one of your 'compadres' so perhaps you should be 'raving' at him.

    Jan 26th, 2015 - 06:29 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Troy Tempest

    @44 LEPRecon

    “aussiesunshinee” from Spain @43 ,
    is really not one of the brightest of the Trolls.

    I have to laugh that most of his arguments hinge on clumsy lies, if outright diversion doesn't work.
    Then he gets righteously indignant when we scoff at him.

    Chuckle!!

    Jan 26th, 2015 - 09:26 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Skip

    Wow the truth must be hurting Sunshine.

    If only you had the balls to make it in a successful country instead of returning to your dysfunctional one.

    Jan 26th, 2015 - 10:40 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Troy Tempest

    Skip!!!

    Happy Australia Day, “Bruce”!

    Jan 27th, 2015 - 12:16 am - Link - Report abuse 0

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