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Brazil questions Argentina's approach to China in military procurement

Thursday, April 16th 2015 - 08:12 UTC
Full article 36 comments

Brazil's minister of defense Jacques Wagner questioned Argentina's approach to China regarding military procurement, but discarded any conflict with Buenos Aires, since the country is a 'strategic and important partner' of Brazil. Apparently the issue was brought up by Jacques when he visited his counterpart Agustín Rossi in Buenos Aires last week. Read full article


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  • Britworker

    I think that Brazil are getting a little concerned about just what that crazy bitch in Argentina has promised the Chinese in exchange for all this military hardware.

    You can't be part of south american trading bloc if you have independently and arbitrarily promised all your contracts to China.

    Apr 16th, 2015 - 08:53 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Skip

    Interesting that Brazil's economy is so bad that they are slowing defence expenditure.

    Probably diverting some of it to riot police procurement.

    Apr 16th, 2015 - 09:22 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Britworker

    It's hysterical, these south american's come on here talking about their unity, it's a load of crap, they are all out for themselves.
    Nicaragua are building a ship canal, they will be destroying a massive swathe of virgin rain forest destroying the livelihoods of the local people. But the contract hasn't gone to a south american company, the Chinese are building it and bringing in thousands of their own contractors from China. The whole project won't benefit a single Nicaraguan.

    Apr 16th, 2015 - 09:39 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • darragh

    “the F17 Thunder offered by China and jointly manufactured with Pakistan, has been successfully combat proven” - can somebody tell me when the F17 was 'combat proven' - did I miss something when I was away?

    Apr 16th, 2015 - 10:49 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Britworker

    It can fly and fire a missile at a land based target = combat proven.

    Apr 16th, 2015 - 11:17 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ChrisR

    So the corruption has stopped Brazilian shipyards having navy vessels to work on thus effecting workers earning power and damaging the forward plans for defending the country.

    The chief crook Lula and DumbAss Dilma should be put against a wall and shot.

    As for combat testing the piece of junk that is supposed to be made jointly by the Chin and the warmongering Paki's, has anybody seen one flying yet?

    The test was probably a computer arcade game.

    Apr 16th, 2015 - 11:26 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • yankeeboy

    There's is no SoAm unity, unless people are united in their hatred of Rgs. I seem to be spending an awful lot of time with Peruvians/Colombians/Ecuadorians now and they are all giggles and smiles that they have an overabundance of Rgs working as waiters/bartenders in their countries now. How the “mighty” (only in their head) have fallen.

    Apr 16th, 2015 - 11:28 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Conqueror

    @4. Yeah, it was used in the anti-terrorist operation in South Waziristan. In 2009. The operation was largely ineffective.

    From the article: 'I returned from Buenos Aires with assurances that Argentina gives leading priority to its association with Unasur”, said Jacques'
    Sounds like Neville Chamberlain to me.

    'In November 2009, Pakistan signed a deal with China to buy 36 J-10B fighters in a deal worth around $1.4 billion.' Six years later, still waiting.

    Apr 16th, 2015 - 11:40 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Brasileiro

    Will we have to do what Argentina did? Ask for a little help China and Russia.
    Until it would not be bad idea. It would be a way to shorten the route to the East.

    Apr 16th, 2015 - 11:42 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • yankeeboy

    9. Except Dilma is coming to the USA to beg for help.

    I don't think Brasso realizes both Russia and China are failing just like Brazil.
    I hear an awful lot of people are wishing for Military Rule again, someone like Pinochet, hmmm who was it that said that would happen? Hmm Who?

    Apr 16th, 2015 - 11:54 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo

    Lula and Dilma's Workers Party has stolen BILLIONS of Dollars and they now need to blame it on a few scapegoats. At least Brazil has decided to purchase a SERIOUS reliable jet fighter that will also complement their aerospace industry.
    Their armed forces are the largest and overall second best in Latin America. In the future decade, they'll regain being the best armed forces in Latin America.

    Apr 16th, 2015 - 01:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • M_of_FI

    I thought the South Atlantic was a zone of peace, which is military-free? Or is that criteria only applied when it suits one particular country?

    Apr 16th, 2015 - 01:41 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo


    Not when oil, gas, fisheries and populist nationalism is concerned.

    Apr 16th, 2015 - 01:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Pugol-H

    “the J-10B, which is a more sophisticated model 'capable of challenging UK's Typhoon's“

    Hmmm, an often quoted remark, just how do they work that out I wonder.

    @11 Chicureo
    Just in time to fight the Amazonian Indians when they try for independence, no doubt.

    Apr 16th, 2015 - 04:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • psql

    @1 “You can't be part of south american trading bloc if you have independently and arbitrarily promised all your contracts to China.”
    Who say so; you? Clawn

    Apr 16th, 2015 - 05:12 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo

    #14 Pugol

    Ugly I admit, but a part of the Farming/Mining/ Forestry mafia that are murdering innocent Stone Age tribes with impunity. Saying that, Brazil has the responsibility to take the defense lead from Chile and focus on self defense as we have. Both Venezuela and Argentina have squandered theirs with useless purchases of trash that is unsustainable in the future years. (The AK-47s being an exception although the HK models are far superior.)
    I really think they need to retire their carrier, but invest heavily in destroyers. This is the time for Dilma to aggressively buy surplus USN vessels...

    Apr 16th, 2015 - 05:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Pugol-H

    @16 Chicureo
    Well the Saab Griffins are an entirely defensive fighter aircraft.

    A purchase which I was surprised at, thinking of them trying to project power over the “Blue Amazon”, I was expecting something with at least a longer range.

    Apr 16th, 2015 - 06:12 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo

    #17 Pugol

    They really don't need to be long distance capable, but with tankers they have more than enough to launch an offensive strike against any country on the continent. Brazil really does not need an aircraft carrier either. They instead need to defend their territory with land based proven fighters that also compliment their successful aerospace industry, which Saab seems to fit the needs nicely. Chile made a solid bet on our fighter purchase based on reliability, operating cost and generous training assistance from the United States. (We have 3 tankers, which give us the range to offensively attack any of our South American brothers.)

    Apr 16th, 2015 - 07:12 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Briton

    Would not an Argentine/Chinese alliance put south American peace in doubt,

    is this not CFK militarising south America,

    Should Brazil fear argentine s growing ambitions in south America,

    She cant have her Falkland's victory, perhaps she is eyeing up other pray,

    just saying like.

    Apr 16th, 2015 - 07:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo

    #19 Briton

    There are 5 military powers in South America. Brazil, Chile, Colombia, Venezuela and Peru. Over the past 20 years Argentina no longer has a viable, Air Force, Navy or Army. It would take a decade of them rebuilding and training their forces and massive spending of billions which they don't have. Brazil has the largest standing Army, a strong Navy and soon a very competent Air Force. I would not want to tangle either with Peru or Colombia. Argentina's friend Venezuela. Could provide valuable support to Argentina in an act of aggression, but I doubt even Maduro would be that stupid. Plus their Russian jets have been a nightmare to maintain battle ready.
    Chile continues it's defense strategy of being able to defend herself against Argentina, Bolivia and Peru at the same time if necessarily.
    Another seriously concerning problem for Argentina is that their entire officers corps are completely demoralized. It takes over a decade to bring in a new culture and esprit to any military.
    As I said before, the only thing still impressive in the Argentine Navy is their officers mess. White table cloths and elegant china with outstanding food. Only the French and British have something similar. The Army and Navy club in Buenos Aires is one of the best in the world.

    Apr 16th, 2015 - 09:05 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Conqueror

    @17. Oh, do tell how the Saab JAS 39 GRIPEN are entirely defensive.
    Tell us how 'entirely defensive' aircraft need air-to-ground missiles, laser-guided bombs and cruise missiles?

    Apr 16th, 2015 - 09:14 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Vestige

    automatically lowered odds of bae getting in on the nice juicy Brazilian(/mercosur/unasur) contract.

    Apr 16th, 2015 - 09:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ilsen

    Will Argentina ever get a grip[en] on its military procurement?

    Not without British say-so, methinks!


    Apr 17th, 2015 - 03:28 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Z-ville

    Well, I've said it before but it's worth repeating: As a Swedish taxpayer I don't want Argentina to get any fighter jet or anything else for that matter that they can't afford and I will have to pay for.
    Who in the world would sell anything to a country that is flat broke and has shafted every creditor for the past 40 years?

    Apr 17th, 2015 - 04:44 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Vestige

    And that's why there's China.

    Apr 17th, 2015 - 11:40 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo

    Argentina is under no threat from any neighbors and should concentrate building up an armed forces to support monitoring fisheries, environmental issues, drug interdiction, disaster assistance and Antarctica international scientific support.

    Instead their hobbling together a motley mishmash of junk including a non-functioning money pit icebreaker, decrepit Russian Arctic tugs, Chinese patrol vessels and an unproven Chinese jet fighter with questionable financing. They did make a good choice to support the new Embraer military transport.
    The Saab fighter would have been an excellent selection for Argentina if it was a responsible civilized country, but they can't even qualify for buying decrepit second hand Mirages.

    Apr 17th, 2015 - 01:24 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Pugol-H

    @21 Conqueror
    Swedish military thinking says swarms of Russian aircraft attack first, starting with all airfields military and civilian. They wanted a fighter that can land and take off from snow covered motorways, re-fuel from road tankers, re-arm and service from trucks that then disappear back into endless forests.

    Never intended to go any real distance or carry much of a ground attack payload.

    They have no plan to attack Russia.

    Whatever whistles and bell have now been added.

    @25 Vestige
    Brazil is well aware that selling Griffins to Argentina is not an option unless they re-designed out all British components (30% of the aircraft in terms of cost).

    A long, complicated and very expensive business.

    I guess Brazil chose to put their own interests first, over Argentina’s.

    Apr 17th, 2015 - 05:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Briton

    We could sell Argentina the F35,

    then again, would you sell matches to

    Apr 17th, 2015 - 07:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Z-ville

    It is an academic discussion anyway.
    Right now Argentina could not afford to buy a used paint ball gun from ebay.
    That is why the Whacky Leadership is trying to cobble together all these hare-brained “Creative Financing” schemes that all in the end means that someone else will have to pay for it since they can't.

    Apr 17th, 2015 - 09:05 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Vestige

    27 - Pugol H.
    What the hell are you talking about ... try reading again.


    Apr 18th, 2015 - 02:34 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Skip

    Well Chile and the Falkland Islands won't have anything to worry about if it is China arming Argentina.

    Argentina will run the equipment into the ground anyway as they always do.

    Apr 18th, 2015 - 05:14 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Pugol-H

    @ 30 Vestige
    Correction re:

    @22 Vestige

    not 25.

    Apr 18th, 2015 - 06:17 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Briton


    both are the same now...

    Apr 18th, 2015 - 07:35 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Vestige

    @32 Pugol-H
    Re; 32 “re;22”

    it still doesn't make any sense.

    complete non-sequitur.

    I think you'll find the Eiffel tower is actually in Paris and NOT Johannesburg.

    Apr 19th, 2015 - 01:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Pete Bog

    “And that's why there's China.”

    It has to be the J10 unless you want an aircraft without a seat.

    Apr 19th, 2015 - 06:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ilsen

    @29 Z-ville
    “Right now Argentina could not afford to buy a used paint ball gun from ebay.”


    best comment yet!

    *weeps with laughter*

    I Thank You!

    *still laughing*

    Apr 20th, 2015 - 02:33 am - Link - Report abuse 0

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