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Guatemala's congress strips president Otto Perez of immunity
Guatemala's Congress voted Tuesday to strip embattled President Otto Perez's immunity, clearing the way for him to be prosecuted over allegations he masterminded a multi-million-dollar corruption scheme. Read full article
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Disclaimer & comment rulesWhat a pity the Argentine people cannot get the argies in government to do the same.
Sep 02nd, 2015 - 12:31 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Turkeys and Christmas I suppose.
Corruption and latam go together.
Sep 02nd, 2015 - 01:14 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@2 Have you ever set foot in Latin America?
Sep 02nd, 2015 - 05:03 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@4. Picky about where I put my feet. Always important to avoid shit!
Sep 02nd, 2015 - 07:38 pm - Link - Report abuse 0A victory for the people of Guatemala.
Sep 02nd, 2015 - 08:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 0However, can anyone answer the simple question.
Why is corruption so endemic to Latin America?
I'm not looking for a 'bun-fight' and please, no racist comments, but can anyone explain this?
I obviously have my own views, and experiences, but would like to hear other peoples' opinions.
@5 Ilsen
Sep 02nd, 2015 - 08:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“However, can anyone answer the simple question.
Why is corruption so endemic to Latin America?”
Lack of moral principles...no honour whatsoever. When caught with your hand in the cookie jar, deny it...then tell lies...then accuse your accuser...or buy him off.
@6 Jack B
Sep 02nd, 2015 - 09:00 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Yup, I get that. Plenty of experience of that.
I agree it's cultural. But why so ingrained, for so long?
Other countries/cultures have suffered from this but managed to change.
I admit I am asking what might be considered a naive question, but I would like to see some open debate on this.
thanks Jack.
Anyone else have an opinion?
@7 That is a mystery of the ages. Nobody can explain why cultures evolve the way they do without resorting to really racist genetics (and just because it's racist does not necessarily mean it's wrong).
Sep 02nd, 2015 - 09:17 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@8 MM
Sep 02nd, 2015 - 09:37 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Thanks for your comment.
Some will blame the Catholic Church.
Some will blame Scillian/Italian/Spanish
Some will blame the 'caudillismo' ideals...
But surely such diverse nations that stretch from Mexico to TDF?
Magnus, I realise that you are being considered in your points about race, but compare the racial mix in Brazil to Guatemala. Personally, I don't believe race has anything to do with anything. A white/brown/black person who grows up in Europe/USA/Japan has a vastly different outlook than someone of any of those races that is born in the poorest regions of Africa.
So if it is 'nurture' not 'nature' then we arrive back at the 'it's cultural' point of view.
Which brings us in turn to my original question. Why?
Other comments welcome
@9 Ilsen
Sep 02nd, 2015 - 10:01 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“Some will blame the Catholic Church.”
Seems to be a reasonable connection......or is it just a mere coincidence that the Jesuits were the first educators in much of South America ??
It is often argued that the North European Protestants, (and similar), went to North America to escape persecution, to settle, to build a new country.
Sep 02nd, 2015 - 10:39 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Whilst the Southern Europeans, Catholic Iberians etc, went to South America in order to pillage. To exploit, and return their booty to Europe.
Could this be the root cause?
An implanted mind-set of, 'take what you can get, while you can'.
Or am I wrong?
Further comments welcome.
11 ilsen
Sep 03rd, 2015 - 06:00 am - Link - Report abuse 0You will find corruption whenever you mix an under developed country with powerful outside interests.
If you are a member of the elite of a poor country, it pays to join outsiders who will compensate your betrayal more generously than your own country will ever do.
And while the examples of corruption are more blatant in the developing world, there are corrupt practices flourishing even in countries as well organized as Canada. You just need the “right” mix of similar conditions. For example, at the municipal level, development corporations can finance enough members of Council, which gives them the power to divert to their advantage the local tax resources, eroding services owed to taxpayers. No need to speak Spanish for it!
@11 Ilsen,
Sep 03rd, 2015 - 04:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Besides the catholic church , which obviously had it's own agenda, you hit the nail on the head when you said “An implanted mind-set of, 'take what you can get, while you can'”........it is obvious that the attitude of those that went to North America to escape religious persecution, and of those that went to South America, was very different. Countries built on very different principles, that's why the under-developed world will carry on being so for a long time.
@12 Reekie
'You will find corruption whenever you mix an under developed country with powerful outside interests“.
Allow me to disagree. In the case of Latin America, I'll speak only for Brazil, where ”Corruption” equals the combination of corrupt politicians and a largely uneducated or poorly educated population. The corruption scandals being uncovered by the Ferderal Police every single day (as one scandal opens the door to another) have absolutely nothing to do with “powerful outside interests”...the cause is 100% internal, no use trying to find foreign scapegoats. That is what the wannabe dictators claim in order to divert public attention from their own malfeasance and mishandling of public affairs.
@ 13 Jack Bauer
Sep 03rd, 2015 - 06:30 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You have to understand that Kiki is playing to the argie book on lying: “blame the accuser,” the 'powerful outside interests'.
Clearly TDC does not have any powerful in-country interests does it?
Only TMBOA, the mafia, the RCC, the endemic corruption of the government and not forgetting the chief coke head, one Bogbrush himself!
:o)
thank you all for your responses.
Sep 04th, 2015 - 06:48 am - Link - Report abuse 0EM, yes but, why is LatAm the 'underdeveloped' one?
And is this poverty really an excuse?
Japan, South Korea and Malaysia were pretty much destroyed after WWII...
@15 Ilsen
Sep 04th, 2015 - 06:40 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“Why is LatAm the underdeveloped one ?”
Well, Japan's, S.Korea's and other south east Asian populations have a code of honour, not as present in the western world. There, it's a digrace to not be productive, and even worse to be caught red-handed, while unfortunately, we live in countries whose culture is intrinsically corrupt. The Portuguese and Spanish courts brought this mind-set to Latin America, and they implemented it with great success. Many politicians here in Brazil even used to brag about it, saying, “sure I steal, but I get things done”, counting on a system that made them virtually untouchable - until only very recently. The result of these Presidential political systems, separating the ruling class from the rest - instead of them 'serving' us, we serve them - is the cause of poverty, due to the fact that they don't have any real contact with the people, they are administering 'other' people's money - ours - and they are extremely careless and inefficient while going about it...so to steal money from an amorphous mass, isn't classified as criminal to them.
@16 Jack B
Sep 05th, 2015 - 01:32 am - Link - Report abuse 0Very interesting post. Thank you.
So, is there any hope?
Do you think it will ever change, (due to external pressure), or destined to remain the same forever, (due to internal cultural norms) ?
@17 Ilsen
Sep 05th, 2015 - 08:05 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Couldn't tell you.....I doubt that external pressure, other than the Brazilians realizing they are falling behind, would make them get their act together.....the pressure has to be from the population itself....but if anything is to change, first of all the mentality of the people needs to change. No more of this politically correct liberal approach, make people realize that hard work - honest - brings rewards, which does not mean that those who are truly destitute do not deserve help, but help to get back on their feet, not help to sponge of the taxpayer.
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