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Four Argentines plan to swim the Falklands' Sound on an “identity cause”

Monday, February 15th 2016 - 06:55 UTC
Full article 117 comments

Four Argentine amateur swimmers have been training for over a year preparing for the crossing of the Falklands' Sound which separates the two main islands, West from East Falkland. The purpose of the crossing is to bring attention on the 'delayed' process of identifying the remains of Argentine soldiers buried in the Falklands under a headstone that reads “Argentine soldier, known only to God”. Read full article

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  • Roger Lorton

    Traditionally, protesters walk around holding banners don't they? Or lie down in the road, or somesuch. Not actually go out for a holiday and to enjoy themselves. I may be old fashioned.

    Feb 15th, 2016 - 08:25 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • gordo1

    When is Argentina going to negotiate with the Government of the Falkland Islands for the repatriation of the remains of their fighting men? They were shown no respect by their superiors when alive - why cannot their remains be shown respect and some dignity now? The disputed sovereignty of the archipelago should not be an obstacle to a demonstration of decency!

    Feb 15th, 2016 - 08:50 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Islander1

    WHEN will Argentina grow up over this issue and face REAITY?
    If They really want this to be done then they ned to:
    1-Contact the authority with jurisdiction over INTERNAL affairs in the Islands - they are the Falkland Islands Govt.
    2- Have ready to hand over a list of signed support in this from EVERY family.
    concerned.
    3- Be able to provide clear evidence and description of what will be physically involved at then cemetery- ie disinterring - OR just making ONE small drill hole a matter of less than 10cm wide down to each body to extract a tissue sample?

    If the former - probably forget it as opinion here will be very against it. If the latter - then maybe.

    Grow up Argentina over this issue.Stop playing politics with humanitarian issues.

    Feb 15th, 2016 - 09:38 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Englander

    Idiots.

    Feb 15th, 2016 - 09:39 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • lsolde

    Give them an inch & they will take a mile.
    Tell them to swim in one of their own lakes.

    Feb 15th, 2016 - 10:14 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Caledon

    Despite what these people say.This is just a cheap publicity stunt. There's an easy solution to this.Refuse to stamp their passports and detain them until the next outgoing flight then simply deport them.
    “Some families have refused blood samples” .They're admitting they haven't even received the support of some of the next of kin and interestingly have refused to give a satisfactory explanation for this refusal.
    I can think of a no more bizarre event and their excuses for carrying out such an event utterly banal.
    A heartfelt plea to FI Immigration..Please..Please .Stop them from embarrassing themselves.

    Feb 15th, 2016 - 10:49 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ChrisR

    “It's a non political cause and with no profit purpose”, says Ganim.

    Lying argie twat.

    Feb 15th, 2016 - 11:10 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • R. Ben Madison

    Perhaps they could do a fundraiser in Argentina to pay for removing the land mines?

    Feb 15th, 2016 - 11:49 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Moody Brook

    As a true Brit and ex forces I salute you. It is very important to idenitfy the fallen no matter which side of the conflict they are from. Let us all hope the politicians responsible are able to make this happen. It matters not who is raises this issue if I was there I would helm the safety boat for them , common decency, and respect, for all our fallen.

    Feb 15th, 2016 - 12:23 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • The Voice

    Political stunt! They could have dialogue right now if they simply talked to the Falkland Government.

    Twats

    Feb 15th, 2016 - 12:55 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Marti Llazo

    Shouldn't have much trouble staying above the surface, given the way that greaseballs float. I'd put a containment ring around them, though, to control the pollution in the Sound.

    Feb 15th, 2016 - 12:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • zathras

    My understanding, and someone correct me if I'm wrong.

    Is the delay is because Argentina has failed utterly to talk to the Falkland Islanders on this issue.

    I understand some missive may have been sent to the UK FCO, however they said you should talk to the Falkland Islanders directly.

    For some inexplicable reason, although Argentina likes to talk about and at the Falkland Islands. Actually talking to the people who were born and live their is somehow impossible.

    You want to do something on someone else's land. Would not the sensible and infinitely logical thing to do, talk to the people?

    Feb 15th, 2016 - 02:11 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Marti Llazo

    @12 “ Actually talking to the people who were born and live their is somehow impossible.....You want to do something on someone else's land. Would not the sensible and infinitely logical thing to do, talk to the people?”

    -
    In Argentistan there is no word for “logic,” nor even the vague notion for what the civilised nations consider to be “reason.”

    Or as we say here,

    El sueño de la razón produce argentinos.

    Feb 15th, 2016 - 03:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • yankeeboy

    Send them home.
    Why are they even allowed in The Falklands?

    Feb 15th, 2016 - 03:36 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • chronic

    @9. No.

    What's important in any conflict is to make sure that your enemy dies for his cause.

    Feb 15th, 2016 - 03:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Conqueror

    @9. I can understand the feelings of a soldier. But try to understand how PEOPLE feel. Argieland, without valid cause, invaded peaceful Islands that had never done argieland any harm. It perpetrated various war crimes. Or perhaps you don't think forcibly deporting members of the population or holding more members of the population, including women and children, in a hall without food or water is acceptable? How about siting argie weaponry around occupied civilian homes? How about painting the Red Cross on various buildings, vehicles, vessels that had no connection with medical aid? By comparison, I learned recently that Julian Thompson, OC 3 Commando Brigade, refused to allow the British military hospital to be painted with the Red Cross because of its location amongst military installations. Medical personnel were therefore subject to massive risks because of the need to comply with the laws of war.

    Feb 15th, 2016 - 04:12 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • chronic

    16. Regarding 9. I doubt he thinks at all.

    Feb 15th, 2016 - 04:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Marti Llazo

    @15 “What's important in any conflict is to make sure that your enemy dies for his cause.”
    --

    Not necessarily. That ends up producing “martyrs” and incites others to prolong the conflict. The death of Arturo Prat was the best recruitment tool that Chile ever had and that effect did not end with the conclusion of the War of the Pacific.

    In modern armed- conflict theory perhaps the most important factor is to destroy the opponent's will to continue fighting. Sometimes that can be done without massive fatalities.

    Feb 15th, 2016 - 04:31 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • chronic

    When you are facing you enemy - what I said.

    Feb 15th, 2016 - 04:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ChrisR

    @ 18 Marti Llazo

    I think you are misunderstanding the core belief of any armed force at war.

    “Your country doesn't win by you dying for your country. Your country wins by making the other poor bastard die for his.”

    I just love the armchair fighters, mainly yanks, who think that drones and automation can win wars and then they show us videos of drone action 'supported by troops' who have just cleared a building and gotten a high level activist out for “questioning”. Why couldn't the 'drone' do it?

    And as for awarding medals to the drone pilots sitting in America, dear me, they have some stupid non-combat experienced “Senior Officers” who need a bayonet up their arses to show them what combat is.

    It's always boots on the ground that carry the day in vital 'actions'.

    Feb 15th, 2016 - 07:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • chronic

    20. +1

    Feb 15th, 2016 - 07:56 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • LEPRecon

    @18 I agree with Chris on this. Chronic's words were a paraphrase of the statement made by General Patton:

    “The object of war is not to die for your country but to make the other bastard die for his.”

    You don't win wars by being nice. People die. Soldier's die.

    Current NATO doctrine is generally more interested in wounding soldiers. Not because they're being 'nice' but because it takes up more of the enemies resources to care for a wounded man than it does for a dead man.

    That is why NATO standard rounds are 5.56mm, which are less likely to kill someone out right (although they could bleed to death without medical intervention), than the 7.62mm rounds (which were used in the old SLR's during the Falklands war).

    Of course this only really works if your enemy actually cares about the people fighting for them. Unfortunately groups like IS don't give a damn about their own people so would probably either leave them to die or if they're feeling humane they'd despatch them on the spot.

    Yes if you read the doctrine it states undermine the morale and the will of the enemy to fight. However, the best way of doing that is twofold. 1stly by propaganda.

    In the Falklands the UK bigged up the Ghurka's already big reputation so the Argentine's ran away rather than face them.

    2ndly, by WOUNDING or KILLING the enemy. In most cases you take out the Officer's and NCO's first, leaving the troops demoralised and afraid. If that doesn't work you kill even more. One of the most frightening ways to be killed is by bayonet, which the British Army have down to an art form. I've seen interviews with Argentine soldiers who still couldn't believe the British charging them through a hail of small arms fire and bayoneting them and their friends. They said it was inhuman and frightening. That's how you undermine morale.

    However it is still KILLING people that has that affect. War isn't nice. You can't sanitise it to make it nicer, you just change words and phrases to make it more PC.

    Feb 15th, 2016 - 08:12 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Briton

    If the islands government allows it--so be it.

    seem odd but fair.

    Feb 15th, 2016 - 08:25 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • chronic

    Stoner purportedly liked the .223 because the much lower recoil aided aimed automatic fire. The current generation could barely handle the .308 let alone the 30.06. The M14 is a beast to wield on full auto.

    Feb 15th, 2016 - 08:34 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • LEPRecon

    Forgot to add that like others on here I believe this to be yet another publicity stunt. If they want 'movement' on this cause they should be looking at Buenos Aires and not the Falkland Islands.

    When the Argentine government finally grows up and starts treating these dead men and their families with some respect, and starts treating the Falkland Islanders with respect too, then and only then can there be 'movement' on this issue.

    And perhaps these Argentines should be asking awkward questions of their government and military, such as WHY weren't they identified at the time? What kind of evil person do you have to be to REFUSE to identify the remains of your own soldiers? Soldiers who died on a political whim, on an unjust cause, directed by scum who didn't care if they lived or died, and didn't even give them the minimum they could've done...their identities to take with them into the great hereafter.

    I mean the Argentine government doesn't even pay for the upkeep of the Argentine cemetery. It is the Falkland Islands Government and the families of the dead that do it.

    But the Argentine government or people don't pay one peso to look after the graves of these dead boys. They have no say in the matter.

    So unless and until the families of the Argentine dead ALL agree to the identification, and unless and until the Argentine government stops behaving like a spoiled teenager and speaks to the ONLY people in the world who can give permission to collect the DNA samples, namely the Falkland Islands Government, then this will remain a none story.

    Like others, I believe that the FIG shouldn't allow these idiots in, not unless they've got INSURANCE, proper safety boats, properly trained rescue crews and their rescue boats should fly the Falklands flag (no Argentine flag should be allowed at all because it isn't a political stunt - honest!), then they can do it.

    But saving these idiots from their own stupidity shouldn't be at the Falklands taxpayers expense.

    Feb 15th, 2016 - 08:40 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Marti Llazo

    @22 Most of the above content is “popular wisdom” and not doctrinal in the better militaries. Or at best, outdated. But mostly false, such as the reasoning for the selection of the 5.56mm round. The selection was based on a number of factors, including the need for more firepower per kg of kit carried, the need for a lighter weapon, and on and on. The notion of the 5.56 being less lethal than the 7.62mm round at normal engagement ranges has no foundation except as urban legend.

    And you've seen far too many war films: your “quote” by Patton is a movie invention.

    Wish I could tell you for whose military I spent more than 30 years in combat arms, psyops, and other units, breaking things and hurting people, and as an instructor, but I won't.

    Feb 15th, 2016 - 08:48 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • chronic

    Ever been to APG?

    Feb 15th, 2016 - 08:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Marti Llazo

    @27 - Back in the 1960s I met COL Garrett there (APG) and got to inspect some of his “collection.”

    Feb 15th, 2016 - 09:03 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • chronic

    I worked in D.C.

    I've played there many afternoons.

    So, did you ever visit Sand Hill?

    Feb 15th, 2016 - 09:08 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Marti Llazo

    @29 (U) During Operation Granby we worked with US forces and the OGA from Persian Gulf ports. They were sanitising and sending Iraqi (Chinese- and Soviet-made) ordnance to Sand Hill at Benning. We had some interest in the still-operational ZSU 23-4 that the US Marines had captured.

    Nothing to do with the present Falklands article - sorry.

    Feb 15th, 2016 - 11:36 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • LEPRecon

    @26

    Strange, but current NATO doctrine is about what I've stated. Unless you count NATO members not being in the 'better' militaries in the world.

    Yes there were other factors in choosing the 5.56mm rounds as you stated, BUT the overriding one is that if you wound an enemy rather than kill him then you tie up the resources of the enemy logistics chain who have to case vac him & care for him.

    Patton quote came from a website called Brainy quote.

    I don't watch war films. You see I've served in the military too. I've been to war, although my role wasn't to 'kill' people, as I was a medic.

    In the British Army you are taught NATO doctrine, just like you are taught international law (such as the Laws of Armed Conflict), and the truth is that a lot of doctrine was rewritten for the sake of political correctness.

    For instance, my elder brother was in the infantry. He went on to become a sniper. Now when he started his course they were all given a manual call 'Shoot to Kill'. It was doctrine. Half way through the course all their manuals were collected in, and given back to them 24 hours later. However, despite the manual having the same content it was now called 'Shoot to Live'.

    Political correctness. It is required (as I'm sure you appreciate after all your years service) to fool the media and the general public that actually we are the 'good' guys. So directing us to 'close with the enemy and kill him' (as was original doctrine) doesn't sit well the general public's image of what the good guys should do.

    Saying you are going to 'undermine the morale of the enemy and erode his will to fight' is a PC phrase meant for general consumption by the media and the people.

    The only ways to undermine the enemy is propaganda and taking out their leadership. Why else is the US sending drones to kill the leaders of IS?

    Yes if you can get them to surrender without a bloodbath on either side is proof that doctrine works.

    You also haven't used a British SA80 which is heavy.

    Feb 15th, 2016 - 11:37 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Voice

    I still don't understand it...
    If a family member never returned...they know where they are...in the cemetery at Darwin...
    Does it matter which exact grave...?
    RIP does mean Rest in PEACE...
    Time is not running out...the living will join the dead and the mystery will end....

    Feb 16th, 2016 - 12:43 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Marti Llazo

    @32 “ I still don't understand it...If a family member never returned...they know where they are...in the cemetery at Darwin...”

    No, you clearly don't understand. Neither this nor so many things.

    Unlikely you've ever been in a theatre of operations where people and bodies go missing. It's not quite as tidy as, “well, of course the parts were mostly picked up and neatly buried. ”

    If I am not mistaken, more war bodies have been recovered in recent years and I recall one found not long ago on West Falkland.

    People go missing in wars. Of course, in Argentina their disappearance by the thousands was in recent memory a matter of your government's policy and practice.

    Feb 16th, 2016 - 01:13 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Voice

    Yawn...everyone is now a soldier on here...
    Or gifted with sight....
    You know fcuk all about me...so don't presume you do...
    One thing I do understand...
    Your bitter hatred....it consumes you and is prevalent in all your posts...
    I'm guessing you must have had a formidable body count in your “theatre of operations”....as you could easily bore me to death....

    There are tens of thousands of soldiers known only to god, buried in France my relatives included...
    We don't dig them up...we know where they are...we remember them....

    Feb 16th, 2016 - 01:28 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • LEPRecon

    @34 Voice

    You must be very insecure and naive to be so threatened by Marti. I've read his posts, what hatred? If you're reading hatred in his posts then it is you that is putting it there.

    What he states in his post @33 is absolutely spot on. War isn't clean. War isn't nice. It isn't like the movies. As a medic I had to collect body parts. I mean how do you tell which bit belongs to the 2 soldiers just blown up or to the suicide bomber that just detonated, or the civilians who were unlucky enough to get caught in the middle?

    Well they're all collected and DNA testing is done at least to identify the soldiers (which is easier to do because getting DNA to compare against is easier), but the rest is just buried together. Even so I guarantee there are British and US servicemen's graves that probably have more than just the body parts of the person whose name is on that grave. As Marti said, it's messy.

    Regarding the Falklands, those Argentine bodies can only be identified IF all the families agree to it. That is just common decency.

    Many of the families of the Argentine fallen whose grave read “Argentine soldier known only to God” have chosen a grave and decided that their son is in that grave. Emotionally it would be very difficult for them to find out that actually their son wasn't in that grave, and even the bigger fear that their son wasn't in any of the graves.

    As for your assertion that we don't dig up soldiers known only to God, that isn't entirely true. There have been occasions when DNA testing has been done to identify remains (though usually in those they have a high suspicion of their identity but not actual proof) comparing it with DNA of their descendants.

    Yes it isn't on a mass scale, but it is possible. That is why I have no problem, assuming there is full agreement from ALL of the families involved, and that Argentina doesn't try to politicise it, for testing to be done.

    It may bring closure to some.

    Feb 16th, 2016 - 07:49 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    TWIMC
    Some loose comments about some loose comments....

    (1) Roger Lorton...
    As I said before to you... Todo Cambia

    (3) Islander1...
    We could as well say...:
    Grow up Malvinas over this issue. Stop playing politics with humanitarian issues...
    Couldn't we...?

    (5) Isolde
    W'll just want our 4,700 sq mi back..., dahling...

    (9) Moody Brook
    And I salute your ethical standards Mr. Brook...
    But let us not let them high standards be misused to perpetuate the vicious circle of war...

    (26) Martillazo
    Nice to see an Anglo Keyboard Warrior Corporal as you..., setting an Anglo Keyboard Warrior Private as (22) LEPrecon straight about the 5.56mm calibre...

    (32) & (34) Voice

    Sometimes I understand the Turnips that THINK that I am a sockpuppet of yours...
    I could easily (with some minimal changes) easily have written your two above posts meself...

    Feb 16th, 2016 - 10:29 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Marti Llazo

    So Voice had relatives in a war a hundred years ago. (Yawn). His expressions of expertise on these matters suggest that he got no closer himself than watching a parade.

    If your greaseball cohorts want to do any digging on the islands maybe they should do it in the hundred-plus minefields you left behind. In fact the removal of the mines should be a precondition for allowing any argento visitors. Not that anyone would really trust you to do a decent job of it, any more than the cleaning up any of the other shite you left behind. Or are the placements of those argento mines also “known but to god”?

    Feb 16th, 2016 - 10:50 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Voice

    “His expressions of expertise on these matters suggest that he got no closer himself than watching a parade.”

    What expertise would that be???
    The belief that the remains should rest in peace..does that require an expert...?
    How exactly does that relate to watching a parade..?

    I realise you feel the need to at least make some sort of a retort after being slapped down...but please, save the nonsensical remarks...
    ...and try not to squeeze your hate into every single comment...

    Feb 16th, 2016 - 11:14 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Marti Llazo

    @38 Your belief that human remains should stay where they fell is not quite as universal as you might wish it to be. But your being Argentine prevents you from that sort of understanding.

    Likewise your lack of comprehension on other matters, or even the ability to follow a thread, has been amply demonstrated on numerous occasions, and suggests a significant degree of diminished capacity.

    Feb 16th, 2016 - 12:23 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    (5) Isolde...

    You say...:
    “Tell them to swim in one of their own lakes”

    I say...:
    Why..., it's much more fun to swim in the open seas with the company of a pretty (&) tough English lady...
    http://m24digital.com/2015/03/15/por-la-paz-un-argentino-y-una-inglesa-nadaran-juntos-a-las-islas-malvinas/

    Feb 16th, 2016 - 01:32 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Voice

    39
    ...“But your being Argentine”

    Are you trying to say I'm being Argentine, in which case it would be “You're”...
    or are you trying to say I'm Argentine, in which case it would be “You”....
    Either way, what is the basis of this insight...?
    Didn't I say...didn't I mention about folk being either a soldier or being gifted with sight...
    I reckon the diminished capacity concerns your grammatical skills...

    ps.
    Do you have access to a poll that has given percentages of those in favour of soldiers being buried where they fell as opposed to those against...?
    Thought not....
    Your opinion...no doubt...

    Feb 16th, 2016 - 02:32 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Marti Llazo

    @41 Wrong again, Voz. The “your being Argentine” is quite correct.

    As in “your being habitually stupid” and “your being chronically uninformed.”

    Some help for your having problems with English:

    http://www.usingenglish.com/forum/threads/217626-appreciate-your-being-here-appreciate-you-helping-us

    Feb 16th, 2016 - 03:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Voice

    The adverb “here” in the example is confusing you...
    ...and
    ”As in “your being habitually stupid” and “your being chronically uninformed.”
    is incorrect...

    As in “you're being habitually stupid” and “you're being chronically uninformed.”
    is correct...
    Did you graduate from high school...? I think not...

    Feb 16th, 2016 - 03:41 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Terence Hill

    43 Voice, V0ice, Vestige, Think et al, sock-puppeteer extraordinaire
    I hate to break-up your frenzied “sock-puppetry”
    “Did you graduate from high school...? I think not…”
    ”It used to be we thought that people who went around correcting other people's grammar were just plain annoying. Now there's evidence they are actually ill, suffering from a type of obsessive-compulsive disorder/oppositional defiant disorder (OCD/ODD). Researchers are calling it Grammatical Pedantry Syndrome, or GPS.“ https://illinois.edu/blog/view/25/76120
    “Grammar Pedantry Syndrome” is a form of OCD in which sufferers need to correct every grammatical error.” https://illinois.edu/blog/view/25/76120
    “A pedant is a person who is excessively concerned with formalism, accuracy, ... Asperger syndrome often have behaviour characterized by pedantic speech.” https://illinois.edu/blog/view/25/76120

    Feb 16th, 2016 - 05:18 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Voice

    Sock puppetry...?
    Do you have any evidence of this...?
    Your own opinion or being sheeple like and going with the flow...?

    As for the Grammar Police...
    http://en.mercopress.com/2016/02/10/montevideo-stanley-an-integrating-and-necessary-air-link#comment430467
    Who is that..?
    that's right...
    Can give, but can't take.....;-))))))

    ps.
    I know you now really concentrate on your ”Your and You're when you post....how helpful have I been to you...;-))))

    Feb 16th, 2016 - 05:40 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Peronist Myth

    @ 41,43

    Marti is correct, Voice is incorrect.

    In the sentence, “But your being Argentine prevents you from that sort of understanding”, 'being' is being used as a noun.

    The word 'your' is therefore being used to indicate possession of 'being Argentine'.

    It is equivalent to saying “But your Argentine nationality prevents you from that sort of understanding”.

    Hence 'your' is correct.

    Feb 16th, 2016 - 05:53 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Terence Hill

    45 Voice, V0ice, Vestige, Think et al, sock-puppeteer extraordinaire
    “Do you have any evidence of this…?”. Already answered: http://en.mercopress.com/2016/01/22/macri-cameron-coincide-on-new-relationship-falklands-left-for-further-on
    post #72 “My definition is based on my empirical knowledge gleaned from your numerous postings under various aliases. I am totally satisfied with my conclusions. Moreover, I have used this form of address innumerable times, with unconditional acceptance by you.” You failed to rebut my assertion. Which means by your acquiescence you have endorsed my statement as true.

    Feb 16th, 2016 - 06:07 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Voice

    No it isn't the same...
    “But your Argentine nationality prevents you from that sort of understanding“
    is correct...
    Being is the past participle of the verb... be...
    It is a gerund...
    The noun ”being“ is like a Human being....
    ”But your being Argentine”... is incorrect...

    Feb 16th, 2016 - 06:18 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Terence Hill

    45 Voice, V0ice, Vestige, Think et al, sock-puppeteer extraordinaire
    More of your lying as in “Who is that..? that's right...Can give, but can't take.” What the hell are you babbling about, as I never posted on that thread. en.mercopress.com/2016/02/10/montevideo-stanley-an-integrating-and-necessary-air-link#comment430467

    Feb 16th, 2016 - 06:30 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Marti Llazo

    Voice, your considerable arrogance is again blinding you. So let's look again:

    I have before me the Cambridge Companion to Jorge Luis Borges, edited by the competent, which reads in part, ”.....a group of Uruguayan intellectuals were bringing together a group of essays on their extraordinary late fellow countryman and decided to invite the narrator (despite his being Argentine, and as such something of a rival) ....“

    Likewise, in Hemingway on a Bike, by Eric Freeze: ”I do make too much of my being Canadian....“

    Similarly, one writes in correct English, ”your being Argentine,“ ” her being Greek, “ ”their being Cholivians,“ ”my having an MA in English Literature, “ ”your having screwed the pooch again, ” and so on.

    Feb 16th, 2016 - 06:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Voice

    49
    I didn't say you did...Always jumping to incorrect conclusions...
    It's not difficult to see I was referring to Marti correcting Mr. Think's grammar..
    I was returning the favour....
    as for...
    “My definition is based on my empirical knowledge gleaned from your numerous postings under various aliases. I am totally satisfied with my conclusions. ”
    so no evidence then...just your opinion...
    50
    So...after scouring the internet...not one learned example of “your being anything...”
    What's MA stand for...My Ass...?

    Feb 16th, 2016 - 07:08 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Terence Hill

    45 Voice, V0ice, Vestige, Think et al, sock-puppeteer extraordinaire
    Since your post was specifically addressed to me your implication was abundantly clear. It was intended to disparage me. As I made crystal clear my opinion was based on my empirical observations. Which you have failed to refute, thus providing the conclusive evidence that you are a “sock-puppeteer”. “He who is silent is thought to consent. Thus, he who keeps silent is assumed to consent; silence gives consent. In law, the silence of a party implies his consent.. A maxim of crime and consent. qui tacet, consentit-lit. he who is silent agrees. Thus, who keeps silent consents; silence means consent; silent consent is same as expressed consent; consent by conduct is as good as expressed consent. This is an implied term in law....”
    SOMA'S DICTIONARY OF LATIN QUOTATIONS MAXIMS AND PHRASESA Compendium Of Latin Thought And Rhetorical Instruments For The Speaker Author And Legal Practitioner

    Feb 16th, 2016 - 07:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Voice

    52
    I can see that amongst all your other failings, you do not know how to link to an exact comment on Mercopress....
    http://en.mercopress.com/2016/02/10/montevideo-stanley-an-integrating-and-necessary-air-link#comment430467
    Comment no 430467 is Marti's comment on that thread...and only his comment, it is the first comment that shows on the page when you follow the link...
    Here is a link to my mention of this @45
    http://en.mercopress.com/2016/02/10/montevideo-stanley-an-integrating-and-necessary-air-link#comment430467
    See my post at the top of the page that is showing..
    In providing a link to the exact comment no...there can be no misunderstanding as to whom I was referring...
    The problem is you are just to stupid to realise this...
    Also because I don't refute your stupidity of calling me various names...doesn't prove that I am those various names...
    You have failed to highlight one piece of evidence that I have more than one name...

    Is it the ellipses that have you fooled....?

    Look, no ellipses, I'm now Terry Hill!

    Feb 16th, 2016 - 08:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Islander1

    Think-36. No we Islanders do not have to do anything over the unnmaed graves - not our problem at all.

    We respect them as they are - God knows who they are, and they have lain in peace now for 34 years. Its your side that is stirring the pot and playing politics
    with the dead.

    Feb 16th, 2016 - 08:29 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • lsolde

    Quite so, lslander1, that they don't even respect their own dead, shows the type of people that we're dealing with.
    Despicable people.
    @36 & 40, Thinkless,
    Unfortunately for you, its not your land.
    So you can't get anything “back”.
    As l said before, go swim in one of your own lakes.
    We don't want you polluting our seas.

    Feb 16th, 2016 - 08:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Terence Hill

    53 Voice, V0ice, Vestige, Think et al, sock-puppeteer extraordinaire
    “you do not know how to link to an exact comment on Mercopress….”. You can perpetuate your little frauds as much as you want. There is total of 86 posts on the thread you're referencing. Your post indicates
    a aberration from the norm, like post #xx. So keep it simple stupid. “There can be no misunderstanding as to whom I was referring…” Oh contraire, you had every intention of misleading. I am well acquainted with your practises. Like when you quoted from Nauru v. Australia. A case that was subsequently withdrawn, so there was no final judgement. As if it were the definitive international law, instead of just a pleading by one of the parties. “You have failed to highlight one piece of evidence that I have more than one name.” I have met my requirements, it was your failure to refute that leaves you irrefutably condemned according to the precepts of legal burdens, sock-puppeteer.

    Feb 16th, 2016 - 09:00 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Marti Llazo

    @51 “after scouring the internet...not one learned example of “your being anything...”

    It's always amusing to see your having failed again, Voz. This time it concerns your having been unable to do fundamental scouring.

    Some easy ones that the editors quite liked:

    ”Guess there's no doubt about your being English, George.“
    --- P G Wodehouse

    ”... other writers of Indian English Literature, or does the fact of your being British set you apart? “
    --- Studies in Contemporary Literature

    ”It was never about my being from Egypt and your being American, about our coming from opposite ends of the spectrum ...“
    -- Dinarzad's Children: An Anthology of Contemporary Arab American Fiction

    ”.... your having found the link is commendable, but now I have to wonder if that payaso Voice is still annoying the staff ”
    --Mercopiss Greatest Hits, vol III

    Feb 16th, 2016 - 11:21 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Voice

    56
    Sure Terry...I mislead you by providing you with an exact link to a post that was not written by you...
    That really makes sense...not...

    57
    That's a lot of desperate trawling through the net...
    Have you found one in Standard English..? Some might call it Queens English...
    So far you have American Vernacular (Peggy) same story...“'Gee! That's going some, isn't it? Wants amputation, a name like that. I call it mean to give a poor, defenceless kid a cuss-word like--what's it?”
    ....Indian English and Arab American Fiction...

    “your being habitually stupid”
    ”your being chronically uninformed.”
    You are indeed...

    Feb 17th, 2016 - 12:22 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Terence Hill

    58 Voice, V0ice, Vestige, Think et al, sock-puppeteer extraordinaire
    Remind me again who wrote in response to my preceding post? Which was about people who are overly concerned about irrelevant minutia. That are suffering from a condition known as “Grammar Pedantry Syndrome” is a form of OCD in which sufferers need to correct every grammatical error.”
    “As for the Grammar Police...en.mercopress.com/2016/02/10/montevideo-stanley-an-integrating-and-necessary-air-link#comment430467 Who is that..? that's right...Can give, but can't take…..” What relevance does a third party have to an issue that you're unable to rebut? It is your modus operandi in all similar circumstances, which is deflect, by moving the goal-posts to some other irrelevancy.

    Feb 17th, 2016 - 12:53 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Voice

    I would have thought that was obvious Terry...
    @41 I was correcting Marti's Grammar as he had flippantly corrected Mr. Think's Grammar on the other thread...
    @45 I was showing you exactly where he was flippantly correcting the Grammar...
    tit for tat...
    Your own persecution complex led you to the incorrect conclusion that it must be your previous grammatical errors that were the subject...
    You were the third party...

                                                      ...you are hard work....

    Feb 17th, 2016 - 01:27 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Terence Hill

    60 Voice, V0ice, Vestige, Think et al, sock-puppeteer extraordinaire
    “Led you to the incorrect conclusion that it must be your previous grammatical errors that were the subject…” The only person that has never made mistake is the person who has done nothing. As I expect to make mistakes they're of no significance to me. Your colossal ego still thinks you can interpret on behalf everyone else. So since nobody has died and made you God, I'm dragging you screaming and kicking back to the only relevant issue, your Grammar Pedantry Syndrome. It's what you do deviously applying your fallacies and your fraud to everything you touch. In order to deflect from any the issue on the table that you're unable to refute, you will change any and all of the subject matter, and revert to an argumentum ad hominem.

    Feb 17th, 2016 - 02:29 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Roger Lorton

    Think - you cannot have 'back“ something that you've only ever had for short periods as a result of attempted theft. Argentina has invaded on two occasions - 1832 and 1982. Hardly the basis for a claim.

    As for the idiocy of swimming for the dead. Perhaps, if Argentina got its relatives in order first - with all agreeing on what they want - something could be done. The FIG are not unwilling.

    And while the world may change Think, having a holiday for a ”good cause” remains a nonsense.

    Feb 17th, 2016 - 06:14 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Peronist Myth

    @ 48

    Gerunds can be used as nouns, hence the possessive 'your' in Marti's perfectly valid sentence.

    Feb 17th, 2016 - 12:50 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • LEPRecon

    Hey Think!

    Finally crawled out from under your rock. And for what? More of the same old, same old. Statements without validity. The spreading of lies and half-truths. The editing of statements and links to try and bolster your 'position'.

    Yet through all this you avoid answering questions directed to you.

    Remember this one, Think? How long does someone have to live in a country to be considered that nationality?

    You've been avoiding answering that one for years, haven't you?

    And Voice, please remember that people who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones. Such as attempting to pick up other people for grammar when your own isn't perfect, and they're a hell of a lot smarter than you.

    Also, everytime you try and divert a thread with your supposed huge grammatical intellect instead of actually backing up your statements with facts or offering a counter argument, it's obvious to everyone that you've lost.

    You should be used to that by now though, having been losing the argument for years. And what have you, and Think and all the other sock puppets got out of it?

    NADA. Nothing. Zilch. The Falklands are still British. Kirchner showed the world just how pathetic Argentina is when you are so afraid of 1,000 military personnel, short range missiles, and of course the 'Death Star' T45.

    And as many people have pointed out. Argentina cannot have something back that you have NEVER legally held title to. You tried to steal the Falklands twice. And failed miserably both times.

    Feb 17th, 2016 - 01:01 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Voice

    Says the Irish/Italian...
    What would you know about English...?

    Feb 17th, 2016 - 02:40 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • mollymauk

    Voice - maybe you're [contraction] just being your [possessive] usual obnoxious, contrary, “argue with anyone just for the sake of it” self, or maybe it is your being [gerund] far more ignorant of the English language than you think, that makes you look such an idiot here.
    I have yet to find one reference that supports your view of the “your” debate.

    Feb 17th, 2016 - 04:15 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Voice

    ...and you have yet to find on that doesn't...
    Conjunction+determiner+gerund+adjective...nope...

    Feb 17th, 2016 - 04:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Marti Llazo

    Let's see how long Voice will continue to be argentine on this point.

    1. Use a possessive pronoun preceding a gerund

    Examples:

    - Everyone at the conference appreciated your being a serial asshole.
    - We were not the least bit surprised by your having lost that little war, and the one before it as well.
    - Was your having been dropped on your head as a young child deliberate on the part of the kangaroo that raised you?
    - Is your continuing objection to the rules of English grammar a matter of congenital deficiency or the aforementioned “accident”?

    Feb 17th, 2016 - 08:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Voice

    Why not apply the your rules of English Grammar and see what happens...
    “But your being Argentine”
    Conjunction+determiner+gerund+adjective.
    Replace the adjective with another adjective...
    “But your being stupid”
    Conjunction+determiner+gerund+adjective.
    Yeah that is really good English Grammar....

    Fool, you are now boring me with your idiotic attempts to be right..
    Begone you imbecile...

    Feb 17th, 2016 - 08:30 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • The Voice

    Yaaaaawn… ..zzz , not proper English but totally appropriate.

    Feb 17th, 2016 - 10:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Skip

    So did they arrive?

    Did they swim?

    The article says “this week” and the week is running out.

    Feb 17th, 2016 - 11:07 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Marti Llazo

    The contemporary literature seems to be replete with illustrative examples:

    “It was said in the village that his being lost in thought was far less likely than his being unable to find his way home from school.”

    “This affliction from which you suffer, this veritable pox of your being consistently argentine, regrettably appears to have no known remedy.”

    “His having a prediction for committing the most amusing sorts of errors was neatly complemented by his being wholly unable to recognise such proclivities, even after extended explanation and his having been examined by a number of noted specialists. ”

    Feb 17th, 2016 - 11:30 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Voice

    If you want to embarrass yourself writing poor grammar because you have seen other folk use it...go ahead...
    The English grammar rules apply, and were applied with the change of adjective and as all can see....it doesn't work...
    I have learned something...
    You are definitely not English...
    If you are ever in need of some remedial English lessons let me know....
    Bloody foreigners...

    Feb 18th, 2016 - 12:40 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Marti Llazo

    Still haven't learned, have you? How very argentine of you.

    Your having failed to learn, or being unwilling or unable to learn, is one of the most cherished traits of your having spent too much time in your little backwater.

    Lo que es más, existe un aspecto de la gramática castellana que es casi igual, o sea, el uso del pronombre posesivo con el verbo haber :

    Che, ¿viste que tu haber fracasado está a la vista de todos?

    Feb 18th, 2016 - 01:09 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • FitzRoy

    Regardless of everything being said on here, these guys will not be swimming Falkland Sound. Their being Argentine won't change anything; they haven't asked for permission to enter privately owned land; the idea of doing it to raise awareness is merely a smokescreen. Once again the dead are being used for “political gain”. The Falkland Islands Government and the UK have asked the International Red Cross to begin identifying the unnamed dead, Argentina has resolutely refused to speak to the FIG - the failing rests purely with Argentina. Had the dead been given identity tags at the start of the invasion and had their officers not removed them in the first place, none of this would have happened.
    I am well aware that there are more than a few malvinistas who will say that the British removed their discs, but that is not the way war is fought by British soldiers. Unlike Argentina, the British show respect for those that gave their lives in war, wherever they come from.

    Feb 18th, 2016 - 01:11 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Voice

    74
    Save your Spanish for the Spanish version of Merco...
    This is the English version, comments must be in English...something you know very little about...
    Are you having difficulty reading as well...?
    Nobody is impressed...
    Foreigner...

    Feb 18th, 2016 - 01:36 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Marti Llazo

    Voice, your inability to deal with proper English grammar suggests that perhaps you ought to migrate to the Spanish or other version of the forum.

    You won't be missed.

    Feb 18th, 2016 - 02:00 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Voice

    More like...your inability to deal with English grammar properly suggests “your” an idiot...and witlessly boring to whit...

    Feb 18th, 2016 - 09:22 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Peronist Myth

    I suspect that Marti will continue to write in the way he does on account of his being entirely correct in this matter.

    Google ‘possessive pronoun plus gerund’ and you will find a whole host of material explaining this. Here, for example, is the very first result I get:
    http://www.getitwriteonline.com/archive/022205posscasegerunds.htm

    Of course, you may already have done this...

    Feb 18th, 2016 - 11:50 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Marti Llazo

    @78 “ to whit” ?

    His having expressed a willingness to dig a deeper hole, the better to conceal the toes he has fired upon, is supplemented by his being enamoured of still greater error.

    Feb 18th, 2016 - 12:30 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Voice

    Explain why one would be right and one would be wrong...
    But your being Argentine
    But your being stupid
    Conjunction+determiner+gerund+adjective.

    Feb 18th, 2016 - 12:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • LEPRecon

    Voice

    Yet you dig yourself deeper and deeper into that hole.

    And when you realise you're wrong instead of being a man and admitting it, and laughing it off, you viciously attack, except that your attacks are more pathetic than vicious.

    For instance, @65 you bring up my Irish and Italian ancestry, which I have never hidden. Why would I?

    But I am English. I was born in England, I was raised in England, English is my native language (and the native language of the majority of people in Ireland too - in case you missed that).

    So what does my ancestry have to do with the fact that you were wrong? That your understanding of grammar is wrong?

    This is the same question I asked Think, and he refused to answer it (as it would blow ALL of his arguments, such as they are, out of the water).

    How long does someone and their families have to live in a country to be considered that nationality? 1 generation? 2 generations? 5 generations? 10 generations? 20 generations?

    Are you going to be man enough to answer that question? Or are you going to continue like a child refusing to accept that you made a mistake, and you continue to make even bigger mistakes, and thus continue to make a fool out of yourself.

    It's up to you. Be a man or be a fool.

    Feb 18th, 2016 - 12:45 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Peronist Myth

    The sentence under disussion is not, “But your being Argentine.”

    The sentence under disussion is, “But your being Argentine prevents you from that sort of understanding.”

    The latter is correct English.

    Feb 18th, 2016 - 12:53 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Voice

    82
    Was just highlighting.... why you are so touchy about the question you keep asking Mr. Think...
    You are only one generation English...virtually an immigrant...
    That's not really English is it...
    More like an Italian Paddy that happened to be born in England...

    Feb 18th, 2016 - 12:55 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • LEPRecon

    @84 Voice

    Oooh. How am I 'one generation English'? What does that mean? What is 'one generation' English? Do you perhaps mean 1st generation English?

    My mother is Irish. That is true. But when she was born Ireland was part of the United Kingdom and therefore she has British citizenship from birth, as well as Irish citizenship from when they became independent. There are lots of people in the Republic who have, or are at least are entitled, to dual citizenship (I betcha didn't know that did you?).

    My father's great, great, great, great, great grandfather (I may have one too many or few 'greats' in there) was Italian. So how does that make me 'one generation' English? Please do enlighten me with your 'wisdom'.

    There you go again jumping to conclusions and once again making a fool out of yourself. Don't you ever get tired of that?

    And again this question. What does my Irish/Italian ancestry have to do with the fact that you were wrong about grammar?

    And if my ancestry doesn't make me English, then I would suggest that the majority of people living in Argentina aren't Argentine either. That is why Mr Think won't ever answer that question as it blows all his bluster about squatters and implanted people out of the water.

    Anyway you decided to go on being the fool. How sad. Well not really. We can all do with a laugh, and your pathetic struggles and your obvious racism, do make me chuckle.

    Feb 18th, 2016 - 01:29 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Voice

    I am not wrong about the grammar...
    Anyone with a decent English education would have written the sentence thus...

    “,but being Argentine prevents you from that sort of understanding.”
    not
    “But your being Argentine prevents you from that sort of understanding.”
    Argentine is the adjective being used instead of stupid...
    “But being stupid prevents you from that sort of understanding.”
    Would you say...?
    “But your being stupid prevents you from that sort of understanding.”
    Of course not...

    Feb 18th, 2016 - 01:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Marti Llazo

    Your [Voice, of course] insisting upon continuing your errors reveals not only your lacking a proper education, but your being resistant to any sort of learning.

    Our being amused by your awful argentine arrogance remains undiminished.

    Feb 18th, 2016 - 03:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Terence Hill

    85 LEPRecon
    The person that posts under the following aliases Voice, V0ice, Vestige, Think et al, suffers from Grammar Pedantry Syndrome. ”There's evidence they are actually ill, suffering from a type of obsessive-compulsive disorder/oppositional defiant disorder (OCD/ODD). Researchers are calling it Grammatical Pedantry Syndrome, or GPS.“ illinois.edu/blog/view/25/76120

    Feb 18th, 2016 - 03:42 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • LEPRecon

    @88 Terence

    Yes I've noticed that. It's very strange that they all fall back on it when they know that they've lost the argument. No not strange, predictable. Just like it was predictable that Voice would start letting his nasty little racist jibes in, because he's losing the argument, he's not a clever as he likes to 'Think' he is, and nothing he has said has altered the fact that he was wrong, and made himself to look a fool.

    Back on topic though.

    If these Argentine's are allowed to do this, then they should be told in no uncertain terms that any attempt to politicise it would see all their media being seized (such as mobile phones, camera's etc...) and these politicised images erased.

    And I still believe that any of the vessels that they use for rescue (assuming that they've actually even thought of that) should have to fly the Falkland Islands flag.

    However, I doubt this attempt will go ahead, all they are usually good at talking the talk, but not so good about walking the walk, or they won't make it across, because let's face it the South Atlantic isn't exactly the local swimming pool, and storms can appear out of nowhere.

    But I shall follow this story with interest, but these guys would be better off swimming the River Plate to bring attention to the fact that it has been the Argentine government who has constantly blocked these attempts of identifying the dead, not the British and not the Falkland Islanders.

    Feb 18th, 2016 - 03:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Voice

    87
    I don't know how many times I have to prove that your grammar is poor...

    “But your being Argentine prevents you from that sort of understanding.”
    The possessive “your” is superfluous as the possessive “you” is already there...

    “,but being Argentine prevents you from that sort of understanding.”

    You will never see the second is better grammar than the first because you don't have an English education and basic rules were not drummed into you with the edge of a rule...
    I almost said ruler, but that also was frowned upon even though folk commonly make that mistake...
    In fact, the whole sentence is poor grammar...
    It would be better thus...
    “,but being Argentine prevents you from attaining that sort of understanding.”

    Are you learning yet...?

    Feb 18th, 2016 - 04:01 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • LEPRecon

    @90 Voice

    You've made so many mistakes that I can't believe you're still flogging this dead horse.

    In British English the word 'ruler' would be correct, in none British English, who knows? Because you're not British you don't understand that you are making little mistakes that would get past none British English speakers and writers, but don't get past British English speakers and writers.

    So in the UK we call it a ruler, not a rule. So it would be correct grammatical English to say it was drummed into you with the edge of a ruler. Yup, absolutely correct English.

    Also, being that you have been taught English as a second language (not a two language) you fail to realise that native speakers of languages often use slang in place of what you consider the 'proper' English.

    Just like, for instance, people in Spain speak proper Spanish, but people in Argentina don't. But what they do speak is a localised variation of Spanish that has evolved separately, and that doesn't make their version of Spanish wrong, just different.

    You see language and grammar are not static things, they evolve over time. What might have been correct at one time will no longer apply 50 years later, or even sooner than that given the world we live in today.

    So are you learning yet? Do you understand that you were wrong and they were right. It's all to do with what they wanted to convey to you, which you misunderstood because it wasn't how you were taught. Yet it was still correct.

    So your this one is better than that one is irrelevant. Learn to evolve Voice.

    Now, what about these Argentine idiots who want to drown themselves in the Falklands Sound over something that the Argentine government has been blocking. Any thoughts on that?

    Or are you going to keep flogging this dead horse because you are incapable of learning, incapable of admitting that you're wrong, and incapable of admitting you've lost the argument, hence the diversion attempt...which is so very, very amusing.

    Feb 18th, 2016 - 04:34 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    Wooooooow....

    ~50 comments about grammar...!
    Wish I knew back then, at school, how fun it can be...
    Chuckle, chuckle, chuckle...

    Feb 18th, 2016 - 04:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Peronist Myth

    Voice,

    I refer you to the suggested Google search in my previous post. In fact, I’ll paste here the opening sections of the very first link that comes up :

    “Using the Possessive Case with Gerunds

    Can you identify a problem in any of the following sentences?

    1. I appreciate you taking the time to read our year-end report.

    2. The revised plan would result in the family paying for services that previously would have been covered by the public insurance program.

    3. All child safety seats must be properly installed to reduce the risk of a child being injured.

    In each of these sentences, we need to use the possessive case to modify a gerund. The correct phrases, then, are (1) “your taking,” (2) “family’s paying,” and (3) “child’s being.”

    A gerund is a verbal--a word that is formed from a verb and retains certain characteristics of a verb (e.g., tenses, the ability to take an object) but no longer functions as that part of speech. A gerund always functions as a noun. It is formed by adding “ing” to the verb.

    Because a gerund functions as any other noun does, we must use the possessive case of nouns that modify it. We would write, for example, “My sister’s singing always pleases my father.” In this sentence, “singing” is the gerund and “sister’s” is the possessive noun modifying it.

    etc...”

    So Marti's sentence remains entirely valid.

    Feb 18th, 2016 - 04:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Terence Hill

    My OED v4.0. defines ruler thus, so the pedant better write to Oxford Publishing and tell them he knows better. Oops! he's talking to himself again.
    “3.3 †a.3.a = rule n. 17. Obs. b.3.b A straight-edged strip or cylinder, usually of wood or ivory, used for guiding a pen, pencil, or marking-instrument in forming straight lines upon paper, etc.”.
    ”At least that’s the conclusion of two researchers writing in the current issue of the Journal of Syntactic Cognition. A team led by L. Malevich and H. D. Lo studied the fMRIs of self-identified grammar sticklers as they were exposed to a variety of solecisms ranging from split infinitives and sentence-final prepositions to phrases like between you and I and apple’s $2.49 a bag.
    The fMRIs of the language purists showed markers of brain activity also commonly observed in OCD/ODD patients, along with several surprises: Wernicke’s and Broca’s areas, the parts of the brain associated with language, were actually smaller, or exhibited reduced activity, in grammar sticklers and language purists, than in normal subjects. DNA analysis showed they also had a higher likelihood of having the FOXP2.1 gene than the general population (Len Malevich, Hi Ding Lo, et al., “Correlation of instances of grammatical pedantry with the expression and suppression of an underlying FOXP2.1 gene” JSynCog 34.3: 1135-39). …the authors suggest that strict adherence to grammar rules is a safety valve for GPS sufferers, helping them avoid full-blown OCD/ODD episodes: “If you mark out sentence-final prepositions with a red pen and regularly change the passive voice to active, that’s more socially acceptable than repetitive hand washing, the incessant touching of doorknobs and parking meters, or refusing to step on sidewalk cracks.”

    Feb 18th, 2016 - 06:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • dab14763

    Voice
    'But your being Argentine prevents you …..'
    is right.
    'being' is a gerund. Gerunds are nouns
    'being Argentine' is a gerund phrase. Gerund phrases are noun phrases. Gerunds and gerund phrases take possessives in formal English
    'But you being Argentine prevents you…..'
    is also right. But it’s informal. Using object forms with gerunds is known as 'fused participle'
    And using object instead of possessive can sometimes lead to ambiguity
    ‘I saw him crossing the road’
    Is right
    'crossing' is a present participle, not a gerund
    It means I saw him as he was crossing the road
    If I say
    'I like his singing'
    It's clear that what I like is the singing
    But if I say
    I like him singing
    Do I mean I like the singing? Or I like him as he sings?
    Originally the present participle had a different suffix from the gerund. The two merged in form but not in use.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/-ing

    Marti
    '@41 Wrong again, Voz. The “your being Argentine” is quite correct. '

    Right. If you followed it with a verb:
    'your being Argentine PREVENTS'
    No verb and it sounds like you’re saying
    You're being Argentine

    As in “your being habitually stupid” and “your being chronically uninformed.”

    No. Contraction of 'you are' should be ‘you’re, not ‘your’. 'being' is a present participle, not a gerund. The two situations are different

    Voice
    “But your being Argentine”
    Conjunction+determiner+gerund+adjective.
    Replace the adjective with another adjective...
    “But your being stupid”
    Conjunction+determiner+gerund+adjective.
    Yeah that is really good English Grammar....

    Adding a verb to both makes both correct
    But your being Argentine PREVENTS .....
    But your being stupid PREVENTS ....
    ‘being’ = gerund
    Without the verb, correct form is ‘you’re’
    ‘being’ = ‘present participle’
    A verb on only one, then they’re not analogous statements
    Try googling:
    1) gerund possessive
    2) gerund phrase
    3) difference between present participle and gerund
    4) fused participle

    Feb 18th, 2016 - 06:34 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Voice

    ruler
    [roo-ler]
    Spell Syllables
    Examples Word Origin
    noun
    1.
    a person who rules or governs; sovereign.
    2.
    Also, rule. a strip of wood, metal, or other material having a straight edge and usually marked off in inches or centimeters, used for drawing lines, measuring, etc.
    3.
    a person or thing that rules paper, wood, etc.
    4.
    Astrology. the planet primarily associated with any sign of the zodiac or any house of the horoscope:

    “Ruler” is just a 15th century variation of “rule,” which comes, via French, from Latin “regula,” which meant a measuring stick, a diminutive derived from “regere,” to straighten, lead, or guide. The word “rule,” comes from the same source, but is more metaphorical.

    As I previously said...
    “But your being Argentine prevents you from that sort of understanding.”
    is poor grammar...
    “But being Argentine prevents you from that sort of understanding.”
    is better
    It is quite unnecessary to repeat possession...

    “,but being Argentine prevents you from attaining that sort of understanding.”
    is better still...

    Feb 18th, 2016 - 08:36 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Skip

    So still no swimmers?

    Feb 18th, 2016 - 08:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Marti Llazo

    @9 5 As in “your being habitually stupid” and “your being chronically uninformed.”

    No. Contraction of 'you are' should be ‘you’re, not ‘your’. 'being' is a present participle, not a gerund. The two situations are different

    ------------

    Actually in “your being habitually stupid,” “your” is a possessive pronoun. It is to be understood as “your state is one of unceasing and unmitigated habitual stupidity.”

    Likewise, in “your being chronically uninformed ” - the 'your' is not just a possessive pronoun but one that is jealously possessive. The phrase is to be understood as “your condition is one of being unerringly regular and consistent in your legendary capacity for remaining uninformed, which may be convincingly verified at a molecular level.”

    Some other examples using the gerund phrase

    “Your having raised the white and celestial blue banner left no doubt as to the unsuccessful outcome of the campaign.”

    “Your having insisted on keeping the matter in the public eye has resulted in the matter being kept in the public eye. ”

    “Your having confused 'wit'' with 'whit' has only reinforced the prevailing perceptions.”

    Feb 18th, 2016 - 08:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    This Engrish Grammar discussion is over, lads...

    Mr. Dab14763 at (95) has spoken so clearly that even I can understand it...!

    And, as Mr. Dab14763 is a professionel Engrish teacher, I Think he's worth listening to...

    Feb 18th, 2016 - 10:31 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Voice

    Damn right Mr. Think...
    As soon as I read his lengthy post, I thought...damn I'm out-gunned by a pro...
    ...time for a sharp exit....
    Still it was fun while it lasted...
    Though it's quaint my being Argentine, don't you think...?
    Not that I care one whit...
                                                        ;-))))))))))))))

    Feb 19th, 2016 - 02:05 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Terence Hill

    99,100 Voice, V0ice, Vestige, Think et al, sock-puppeteer extraordinaire
    Sock-puppetry alert, the one hand is talking to the other again.

    Feb 19th, 2016 - 02:53 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    (100) Mr. Voice

    You are a Pragmatic ........................................................................................... poster.

    Feb 19th, 2016 - 06:38 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • lsolde

    Mr Think----Mr Voice!
    oh dear, aren't we so formal?
    Which one is at the front in this panto horse?

    Feb 19th, 2016 - 09:20 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Troy Tempest

    Isolde,

    With this panto horse there is no 'front'.

    Feb 19th, 2016 - 10:59 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Martin Woodhead

    This is a matter for argentina and the falklands goverment along with the red cross to sort out.

    Feb 19th, 2016 - 12:03 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    (103) Isolde babykins...
    Not being formal, daling...
    I just like Yankee Film Noirs...
    I do suspect Mr. Voice does too...
    https://m.youtube.com/watch?list=PL76F71A171D523B72&params=EAEYATgBSAFYB2ILNFc1S2hmSkhGXzRoAA%253D%253D&v=GLPJSmUHZvU&mode=NORMAL

    Feb 19th, 2016 - 03:42 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • The Voice

    Talking to yourself again Think ..tsk tsk . Lets face it no entertaining films ever came out of Argieland or Scotland, both cultural deserts.

    Whats top of the pos there? Georgia Swing by Jelly Roll perhaps?

    Feb 20th, 2016 - 01:16 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Voice

    Trainspotting....D'oh...

    Feb 20th, 2016 - 01:24 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Troy Tempest

    108 voiceThink

    Social comment - a tragedy. D'oh.

    Feb 20th, 2016 - 03:17 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • The Voice

    Oh, I forgot that one. Danny was English anyway. Great Scotch subject, drugs and all that… Wouldnt say it was entertainment, just a glimpse of everyday Glarsgow life.
    Anything by the Coens entertains me. That Italian blokes films arent clever, but they obviously have appeal to the Rednecks

    Feb 20th, 2016 - 10:04 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Voice

    I'm sure Irivne Welsh is Scottish...
    Or do you think it was created from thin air...

    Feb 20th, 2016 - 12:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • The Voice

    No, it had to be written by someone who knows Glarsgow with a Scotch pal doing the screenplay Can you name a good 100% Scottish film?

    Feb 20th, 2016 - 02:01 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Voice

    It was based in Edinburgh....

    Feb 20th, 2016 - 02:07 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • The Voice

    I heard thats in Scotland too. :-) But more civilised.

    Feb 20th, 2016 - 03:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Troy Tempest

    Why are we bothering with voice's public display of masturbation.

    None of his self-determined meandering are relevant.

    Feb 20th, 2016 - 03:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    TWIMC...

    Speaking about good, funny movies...

    Guess wich movie just won the “2016 Brutish Academy Film Award” in the“Film not in the Engrish Language”?

    http://www.bafta.org/film/awards/film-awards-winners-in-2016#film-not-in-the-english-language---wild-tales

    Chuckle, chuckle...

    Feb 20th, 2016 - 04:30 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • The Voice

    Well aware of that Think, we watched the ceremony. Well done Argentina but I dont Think it will be gracing our cinema screens any time soon.

    You might enjoy 'Youth'. You could even follow Harvey Keitel, everyone would be soooo grateful

    Te heh heh

    Feb 20th, 2016 - 05:37 pm - Link - Report abuse 0

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