MercoPress. South Atlantic News Agency
“We'll be back with Cristina and we'll return to Malvinas”, pledges Maradona in Ushuaia
“We'll be back with Cristina, and we'll be back in Malvinas”, said Argentina's world football ex-star Diego Armando Maradona before leaving Ushuaia, in Tierra del Fuego where he spent mini vacations. Read full article
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Disclaimer & comment rulesPerhaps the old prison in Ushuaia could be returned to its former glory as appropriate housing for the manga of Kirchnerists soon to be convicted and sentenced.
Jul 15th, 2016 - 05:09 am - Link - Report abuse 0“We'll return to Malvinas”
Jul 15th, 2016 - 05:40 am - Link - Report abuse 0Has he ever been?
God is it a slow news month?
Jul 15th, 2016 - 07:32 am - Link - Report abuse 0I haven't yawned this much since the last brief, boring, irrelevant “Malvinas” news story.
Scipi, you are a blithering twit.
Jul 15th, 2016 - 08:53 am - Link - Report abuse 0Does he have his own canoe ?
Jul 15th, 2016 - 08:59 am - Link - Report abuse 0Seems appropriate somehow - Maradona, world famous cheat, liar and drug addict supporting KFC and the M....s myth
Jul 15th, 2016 - 10:40 am - Link - Report abuse 0At least we know what line he is taking on this.
Jul 15th, 2016 - 11:22 am - Link - Report abuse 0Another view from another moron...
Jul 15th, 2016 - 12:25 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“According to a document obtained in a raid in Santa Cruz, on June 10 in the two boxes he had $ 4,600,000. This amount far exceeds the funds received Florence by inheritance from his father. ”
Jul 15th, 2016 - 12:53 pm - Link - Report abuse 0They could build a large prison there with this money...or better yet...just chain them to the ground in an open field and put the money int0 education.
At 7,
Jul 15th, 2016 - 01:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0;-). Lol
He shoots, he scores. etc.
Jul 15th, 2016 - 01:50 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Rocio Oliva. Not choosy, is she?
Jul 15th, 2016 - 03:16 pm - Link - Report abuse 0¡IDIOTA!
Jul 15th, 2016 - 03:23 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The above article is really a non-story.
Jul 15th, 2016 - 03:31 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The real one is yesterday's street protests across the country against the “tarifazo” during which people of all walks of life told president Macri--after the courts did--to back off with his disproportionate utility bill increases.
Hey, even Clarin 0pinion writer José Bonelli is getting worried because:
-The dollar rain hasn't showed up.
-Inflation continues unabated.
-Recession spreads (Industry down 5 per cent in May, construction contracts 13 per cent in June).
-Business representatives worry about lack of compass, lack of economic plan and lack of investments.
All of which should be make islanders happy--Argentina will be busy for the time being and the Malvinas dossier will take a seat back. Unless Macri decides he needs to show an immediate achievement and moves to re-take the islands again...
Just kidding.
You are a broken record that just doesn't stop.
Jul 15th, 2016 - 03:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Are you happy with the economy in Canada anyway?
@14
Jul 15th, 2016 - 04:13 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Always critisizing but not able to put a positive spin on anything, what would you do with the mess that CFK left? Any ideas?
But never despair.
Jul 15th, 2016 - 04:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Macri government officials are feeling “increasingly bullish” about 2017’s economic figures and forecast that the country could grow by as much as “five to six percent” next year.
Econ Minister Prat-Gay had targeted a “20 to 25 percent” inflation rate this year claiming lifting the “dollar clamp” would not push prices up.
Although yearly inflation is now 45 per cent, Prat-Gay say his 25 per cent will be reached arrive “not much long” after the end of 2016.
“We will reach that figure between March 2016 and March 2017,” he was quoted saying by the BA Herald. Meanwhile, the dollar has jumped to 14.98 pesos.
Some sorcerer's apprentice.
Reekie is almost right: the present government is nearly as clueless as the KK governments. If such a thing were possible.
Jul 15th, 2016 - 04:42 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Here is how it looks on the heating gas front: prices for the average family for a monthly gas bill have gone from the price of one choripan, to the price of three choripanes, In other words, heating gas in most of the country is still essentially free when one takes into account the high prices that have to be paid to actually supply consumers by importing gas from Bolivia, from Asia via Chile (where the price is about four times as much as comparable Bolivian gas) and from other countries. It is one of the wonderful legacies of Kirchnerism: the KK's inability to effectively manage national energy resources, resulting in very high production and supply costs, and very low revenues after subsidies are considered.
So rather than consume half of the national treasury to pay for subsidies for gas for people who could easily afford to pay US$4 a month, the government reduced the subsidies so that people pay a tiny bit more, like the price of a pizza per month. Remember that 300 percent of nothing is still nothing. But argentos are so accustomed to getting so much for free that almost-free is not good enough. So they complained to the courts that the Macri government didn't hold public hearings when setting new rates with reduced subsidies. Apparently the fact that the previous government didn't hold public hearings when setting earlier rates is not a factor now.
So what to do? Nothing sensible, because this is Argentina. The Macri government is going to have public hearings to check that box, and the new rates will be limited to no more than three times what the earlier bills called for. But they made this move with characteristic Argie stupidity: the cap is not tied to consumption! So if you paid US$2 a month for 100 m3 of gas per month, for US$6 you can now burn 500,000 m3 a month - or more !!
Maradona is just another stupid coke-head...who cares what he thinks or says ?
Jul 15th, 2016 - 05:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@14 , 17 Reekie
Are you going to tell us why you decided to leave your beloved Argentina to go to a first-world country ?
@19 & 17
Jul 15th, 2016 - 06:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0That is a good question.
Quique, what did Canada have for you, that Argentina did not have for you, at the time you made your move?
@18 -- should have read 400 percent maximum increase and not 300 percent. Still the cheapest gas prices around even with the increases.
Jul 15th, 2016 - 06:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@17 “Although yearly inflation is now 45 per cent....”
Poor reekie, always sooo very far behind on developments.
The current annualised rate of inflation is around 38 percent, about what it was during the last year of Kirchnerismo.
Likewise the recession seen under CFK is continuing, with the outlook for the economy for 2016 at about negative 1.5 percent. Little has changed except there is just another set of argies running the country. And for that reason alone the economy is hosed.
#18 Marti
Jul 15th, 2016 - 07:20 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Like a reverse Robin Hood, the Argentine government has an agenda of robbing the poor--and the middle class--to give it to the filthy rich.
While he achieves it, Macri asks for patience and promises things will eventually get better.
The denial strategy can be understood. However, for Marti to expect MP readers to believe it is something else.
Firstly, Marti tells us Argentina must now buy gas 128 per cent more expensive from Chile instead of cheaper gas from Bolivia and implies it's Kirchner's fault. However, the Bolivian government said Argentina never asked to buy more gas.
Next, Marti notes Argentines still pay almost nothing for energy. Many agree--but the increases were too steep, too fast. And the public hearings that the government skipped mandates utility companies to provide detailed accounts justifying the increases.
“So they complained to the courts,” casually notes Marti.
And oh, surprise! The courts agreed with the citizens.
But never mind. Marti remembers us that ”argentos (sic) are so accustomed to getting so much for free that almost-free is not good enough.“
Conclusion: if people went to the streets yesterday, in some cases under rain, it's just because they've been soooo pampered. Which fits with Macri's advise: just dress warm.
Last but not least, Marti tells us that the new cap on rates will not be tied to consumption--true.
Next, he magically transfers Macri's responsibility to all citizens saying the decision is the result of the ”characteristic Argie stupidity.“
Marti, like Macri, is an expert sideshow trickster.
#19 Jack Bauer
”Why you decided to leave your beloved Argentina...?”
As I said before: NONE-OF-YOUR-BUSINESS. Got it?
Jack, Quique is ashamed to say the “real” or any reason he left Argentina. And he is utterly clueless to what actually happens in the real world inside Argentina apart from the clustered and slanted articles he may read. He has no information from his own personal experiences to speak of. Each and every day he wakes in Canada, he kisses the ground of the country that takes care of him.
Jul 15th, 2016 - 07:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0He understands that the Junta is long gone and he can return from exile, stand up for what he professes and fight for the changes he personally believes in.......or just bitch and stay in Canada and pretend he knows what life is like in Argentina.
Quique.....120 pesos for a kiddie matinee......good or bad?
We'll be back with Cristina and we'll return to Malvinas”,
Jul 15th, 2016 - 07:56 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Argentinians will land on the moon,
Argentina will rule the world, blah blah blah,
Apparently Argentina will be awarded the trophy for the worlds longest bullshxt.
Kirchnerist corruption inquiries have caught up with CFK's daughter. She was found to have US$4.6 million in her safety deposit box in a bank. The money is being impounded. Cristina's legal defence team complained to the government about the release of photos of the bundles of cash dollars. Maybe that will become the new norm: the KK objecting to photos of the evidence of their corruption.
Jul 15th, 2016 - 08:46 pm - Link - Report abuse 0-----
Reekie again: “Like a reverse Robin Hood, the Argentine government has an agenda of robbing the poor....”
-- Actually, it appears that the government is expecting consumers to pay for the goods and services they receive. This concept is rather novel and understandably incomprehensible in Argentina. As far as heating gas and the poor, Reekie conveniently forgets that the Macri government implemented a “tarifa social” which provides “free” (paid from public funds) gas for lower economic class consumers. Mustn't let reality get in the way of a good sob-story, though.
Reekie: “Argentina must now buy gas 128 per cent more expensive from Chile instead of cheaper gas from Bolivia and implies it's Kirchner's fault.”
-- Domestic natural gas production here and the ability to supply domestic demands fell precipitously during the Kirchner governments, and the result (the disaster) is what the present government inherited. That should not be difficult to understand. The numbers are something like this: for 2007, the year that CFK took office, Argentina produced almost 45 billion cubic metres of natural gas. Within two years of the CFK government, production was down to about 40 billion. By 2011 it was at about 38 billion and by 2015 down to about 35 billion. And so on. Consumption, on the other hand, actually decreased slightly since the economy bombed. Demand outpaced falling domestic supply, so Bolivia started selling all the natural gas they could produce, but lack of pipeline capacity resulted in the need to buy at higher cost from Chile.
#25 Marti
Jul 15th, 2016 - 10:31 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Again, Marti follows up and attempts to reproduce the job of Clarin here in MP. However, he is still divided between his irrepressible admiration for the neocon politics of Mauricio Macri and his contempt for Argentines in general.
Talking about the recent “discovery” of $4.6 million in safety boxes, he forgets to mention that CFK had already declared that amount.
“Kirchnerist corruption inquiries have caught up with CFK's daughter,” proclaims Marti in the best Clarinesque style.
He “forgets” to mention that Florencia Kirchner herself had requested that those boxes be open to end speculation by the media.
In any event, I will wait for the justice to have its say. Marti apparently already knows all about it.
The Kirchner government had chosen to subsidize the energy costs and Macri is choosing to do differently.
He choose to transfer $60 billion to the large agro exporters by eliminating most export taxes, while reducing subsidies (which won't fill that $60-billion hole) to make the population at large pay more.
That's his choice, he must live with it and far from me to even pretend to know better than those who live in Argentina. Is the Argentine people who depend on those services who are going to have the last word on the Macrista policies' impact on their lives.
England will return the Malvinas within 25 years.
Jul 16th, 2016 - 01:12 am - Link - Report abuse 0@26 Reekie: “...admiration for the neocon politics of Mauricio Macri ...
Jul 16th, 2016 - 03:06 am - Link - Report abuse 0You have a knack for reading everything wrong. If you actually read the words you would learn that my opinion of Macri's government is that it is very Argentine: bumbling, ineffectual, incompetent. That a government might expect people to pay for goods and services received is hardly neocon, whatever that is, but it is one of those fundamental notions associated with solvent nations and rational economies, albeit unknown in Argentina. Perhaps you could compare the prices paid per cubic meter of gas in France with that paid in Argentina. You'd learn that natural gas in Argentina is essentially free, and keeping it essentially free - and significantly wasted - through massive subsidies has contributed to high inflation, deficit spending, prejudicial balance of payments, and shortfalls in needed expenditures in other areas such as infrastructure, though of course we don't expect you to understand these impacts.
I had previously mentioned that Florencia Kirchner had said to go ahead and open the boxes containing the US$4.6 million. Its presence was already known to the authorities. But of course where that money came from is the stuff of Kirchnerist corruption.
Reekie ”He choose to transfer $60 billion to the large agro exporters...“
As previously explained to you, the withholding ”retenciones” on soy were reduced from 35 percent to 30 percent. And soy pays the bills in this country. Production of soy in Argentina was constrained due to Kirchnerismo's excessive withholding rates. With increased soy production the actual total amount in withholding revenues turns out to be higher now. And growers pay taxes on profits, to offset those sectors of the economy that are essentially nonproductive or noncompetitive.
“We'll be back with Cristina, and we'll be back in Malvinas”
Jul 16th, 2016 - 03:17 am - Link - Report abuse 0Who does he think he is, some sort of latter day MacArthur?
In fact, he is a has-been pledging to team up with a nobody and ‘return’ to a place that does not exist in reality, just in the minds of some delusional Argentines.
Skip’s right, if this is what passes for news in Argentina they really are a boring, sorry arsed bunch of losers.
Reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeekie will only be happy when rg is once again neck deep in some of that good ole bolivarian prosperity like uhh ... uhh . .. . Venezuela!
Jul 16th, 2016 - 07:15 am - Link - Report abuse 0Speaking of Moronna: Why is it that every greasy latam personality looks like a cartoon caricature of real life? Take Moronna's broad expansive forehead and Cretanous hairline - invention must yield to nature.
Gas prices and the poor....
Jul 16th, 2016 - 07:31 am - Link - Report abuse 0I read a scholarly paper a few years ago about the gas situation in RGland...
It seems the poor don't have access to gas....
No Maradona, you won't ever be back.
Jul 16th, 2016 - 10:10 am - Link - Report abuse 0You had your chance & blew it.
@31
Jul 16th, 2016 - 02:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Not only the poor, lots of people do not access to gas. Can you imagine the cost of bringing gas to every household in Argentina? Prohibitive no doubt with regards to size of the country.
@33 “...lots of people do not access to gas...”
Jul 16th, 2016 - 04:45 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Even here in sparsely populated Sta Cruz province, very few would be without access to gas. Not via pipelines, which would be absurd, but even at the tiny, remote one-family estancias 100 km or more from distribution points, you still see find bottled gas everywhere, which is certainly the most common supply method outside of the pipeline-connected areas. Bottled gas is provided with huge subsidies under the “Garrafa Social” system. In the north years ago I remember seeing the “garrafas” (gas bottles) of 10 kg capacity being provided for 16 argie pesos. Which was essentially free. Now I think the cost of a garrafa social is about 100 pesos, which is about US$6.50. Still essentially free. Compare that to US$17 they pay in Chile for an 11 kg (standard) gas bottle (observed price when I was up in Coyhaique, Chile, recently). Or about US$26 for that same 11 kg in Puerto Montt.
Interesting historical note on the subject of the development of gas use in Argentina: the British made it possible. During the 19th century, as during the rest of its history, Argentina was technologically deficient. And the most significant provider of technology to Argentina was for a century or more, the British. Without British technology, the argies would still be in the trees. The British engineer Bevans installed the first gas-fired public lighting in Buenos Aires during the 1820s. In 1910, three British companies were contracted for 20 years to supply public gas-fired lighting for Buenos Aires. Until WWII it was British coal that heated many Argie buildings. Argie attempts to mine and transport Argie coal became a showcase for absurdity.
In fact, in a curious and rather ironic way, the British taught the Argentines how to cook -- at least how to cook with gas. Starting in the 1920s, the British company Compañia Primitiva de Gas gave public cooking classes for how to cook using gas.
All Enrique Massot posts: You're a coward, aren't you? Run away from your country. Support a criminal regime. Rarely respond to valid points. Putrid views.
Jul 16th, 2016 - 05:45 pm - Link - Report abuse 0#28 Marti
Jul 16th, 2016 - 05:53 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“That a government might expect people to pay for goods and services received is hardly neocon...”
A government needs to take into account socio-economic realities of a country--such as people's capacity to pay--or it's bound to fail. Mechanically using recipes working in other countries may led to failure.
What counts, of course, is that the country goes ahead in spite of what anybody--myself included--may believe.
In regards to the utility bills increases, what we see is an incredible mess caused by measures taken without consideration for the country's socio-economic reality.
Macri basically gave the utility companies what they asked--and succeeded in uniting against him the courts, the legislature, the consumer organizations and many citizens.
Yesterday, the courts again confirmed the suspension of gas increases across the country.
Facing the first significant street demonstration and general backlash against his government, Macri has so far chosen denial, dismissing public hearings where the need and scope of tariff increases would have to be demonstrated. Incredibly, he has argued that public hearings were already held in...2004!
No, it's not a typo. It was 12 years ago.
That is not to say the Kirchnerist governments had the best approach to handling the energy dossier--but Macri was supposed to take steps to improve the situation--not to create a worse one!
A government of CEOs stubbornly directing resources and wealth to corporations while asking people to tight their belts is not a good recipe going forward.
But you cannot see it without understanding that the ruling class in Argentina is too backwards, too greedy to even develop a modern capitalist economy--their minds are still stuck in the semi-feudal agro-export model that gave them unlimited privileges in the 19th and first half of the 20th century, when they had an unlimited supply of uneducated rural workers and domestic employees working for peanuts in their mansions and estancias.
Reekie: “A government needs to take into account socio-economic realities of a country--such as people's capacity to pay--...
Jul 16th, 2016 - 07:13 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Actually it was the CFK government that did not take into account ”ability to pay.” Their system was across-the-board monstrous subsidies for all, without regard for ability to pay. And that government failed to hold public hearings on the matter. The result is that nearly half the national budget was spent on unnecessary subsidies for those who did not need subsidies. Contrast this with the Macri government implementation of a tarifa social for only those who actually need assistance.
@34 I'll try again... the poor in the cities don't have access to reticulated gas and therefore can't consume huge quantities heating their humpies so its just another failed kirchner policy. The gross overconsumption is by the better off...
Jul 16th, 2016 - 08:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 0What do they have in the shacks up the back of Ushuaia?
I'm paying $7000 ( about $10 US ? ) for 5kg in Pto Montt
Looks like it is time to “ means test ” everyone in Argentina to see who needs benefits or subsidies.
Jul 16th, 2016 - 08:51 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Stuff all to do with the thread... but..
Jul 16th, 2016 - 09:21 pm - Link - Report abuse 05kg lasts me 4 to 6 weeks cooking for two.
@22 Reekie
Jul 16th, 2016 - 10:11 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“#19 Jack Bauer
”Why you decided to leave your beloved Argentina...?”
As I said before: NONE-OF-YOUR-BUSINESS. Got it?”
Sorry Reekie.....you owe all of us an answer........if you praise the K governments, why did you leave ? OR, if you had already left when they came to power, why didn't you go back ?? Your refusal to answer is a strong indication that you have something pretty shameful, or embarassing, to hide....It's OK, you can come clean, we won't laugh at you .......(or at least we'll try not to...)
@38 “ the poor in the cities don't have access to reticulated gas ...
Jul 16th, 2016 - 10:31 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I would guess that a large proportion of the 'poor' do get bottled gas and at those very low subsidised rates. Haven't seen the numbers and if they were done by the CFK government they would not be reliable numbers anyway.
”What do they have in the shacks up the back of Ushuaia?“
- They have subsidised bottled gas. The maximum allowable price last year for a 10 kg garrafa in Ushuaia was 87 pesos , about US$5.80 and that rate was for anybody, not just those with limited resources. Basically free for everybody.
”.....I'm paying $7000 ( about $10 US ? ) for 5kg in Pto Montt.....”
That is about US$10, yes. About proportionate to the US$26 or so paid for the 11 kg size balon in Pto Montt (Chile). A whole lot more expensive than the tiny prices paid by those llorones in Argentina.
41 Jack Bauer
Jul 17th, 2016 - 04:33 am - Link - Report abuse 0“...you can come clean...”
Look, Jack. I appreciate your curiosity and would perhaps chat about myself sitting at a pub's table, drinking a few beers. But I am sure you will understand this is not the venue to write one's biography. And no, I do not owe you an answer.
Sometimes we deviate a bit abusing MP's tolerance--but at the end of the day, who we are should not matter but the ideas we post.
I will, however, strongly deny having anything to hide. It is true that we old people lived a good portion of our lives before internet and social media--so our past is difficult to track.
If anything, writers here should be happy to have a few dissenting voices. Otherwise this board would be too one-sided--and booooring!
Diversity is the salt of life and the essence of democracy--something I extremely appreciate.
Reeeeeeeeeekie, that is the oddest justification yet for your lies - diversity of opinion.
Jul 17th, 2016 - 12:45 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Some interesting material in English from the Argentine gas industry. The latest version I could find in English is for 2013 but the illustration is useful.
Jul 17th, 2016 - 03:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0http://www.adigas.com.ar/pdf/datosdelsector/precios_internacionales/Informe_Junio_2013_(Ing).pdf
(Year 2014 data shown here, in Spanish,under the article heading “Argentina - cheapest gas in the world” = http://www.adigas.com.ar/pdf/datosdelsector/precios_internacionales/Informe_Junio_2013_(Ing).pdf
Note in Graph 1, the average 2013 pricing with subsidies for residential gas in Argentina. We see pricing as US$2.73 per million BTU, or about one-tenth of the international average. Neighbouring Brazil pays US$46.20 for the same million BTU. Or about 17 times as much as Argentina. Chilean consumers pay over 11 times as much as those in Argentina.
Now do your own calculation and figure in that “massive” 400 percent increase that Argentines are crying about, but in absolute numbers and not weasel-percentages. Argentines are still getting their gas for next to nothing even after a “tarifazo.” This much has been pointed out in Argentine media.
The data does not discuss the immense economic hard caused to the country by spending between a third and a half of the national budget on subsidies that encourage poor building practices, and over-use and waste of nonrenewable energy.
The remaining graphs show similar effects for massive subsidies for commercial and industrial users in Argentina.
@43 Reekie
Jul 17th, 2016 - 03:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I haven't the slightest interest in your biography ; in view of your blind, insistent defence of the K 's, despite living in Canada - the opposite of Argentina - I am just curious as to why you 'left' Argentina.... there must be a strong reason, no-one just ups and leaves on a whim.....or are you so f*cking old (“we old people” - speak for yourself !) that you can't remember why you relocated ?
Your last sentence “Diversity is the salt of life and the essence of democracy--something I extremely appreciate”, given your defence of CFK, is somewhat contradictory ; presuming you believe your statement, you must really appreciate Canada. If that too, is true, and considering the enormous difference in quality of life between Canada and Argentina (especially during the 'K' era), how come you defend what the K's turned Argentina in to ?
Jack, Jack.
Jul 17th, 2016 - 05:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Diversion's not good. You keep me busy talking about me when I should be commenting about what's going on in Argentina right now.
Tell you what. Talk to Mercopress and tell them there is some kind of Argentina-born guy living in Canada who's bothering you and other MP commentators with opinions different from that of the majority here. Ask them to require posters:
1. To reveal their real name
2. To post their place of residence
3. To reveal their nationality as well as the place where they were born
4. If they don't live where they were born, they must explain why they “left.”
Isn't that smart?
Once MP incorporates those astute requirements, you will finally find out what's bothering you. Until them, I will not be able to further debate on the topic. Thank you.
I am of the opinion that people should be prepared to give some information about nationality and place of residence. Whether or not we know it, we do have prejudices from our background and upbringing which can slant our postings.
Jul 17th, 2016 - 07:11 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I have probably revealed more about myself than needed, but people can then judge what I say from my background. I am not pretending to be anything but myself. However, I would not agree with your points at 1 and 2
There are others who possibly are lying to give their posts more credence to a casual reader. For example, I would not expect anyone from the UK to promote the Arg. line, but we had “British Kirchner” telling us how wonderful she was -- an unlikely scenario.
#48 Clyde
Jul 17th, 2016 - 09:03 pm - Link - Report abuse 0My apologies, I was just trying to make a point with the post above.
Although I have already fulfilled points 1, 2 and 3--more than many here--some commentators want to know more, e.g. the reason I live here (Canada) and not there (Argentina).
It was to tell Jack that if he wants writers to disclose personal information, then he should ask MP to make a rule so that everybody is on the same boat.
The Canadian Broadcasting Corporation (CBC) online stories were so plagued by insulting and garbage-filled posts they recently began to accept postings signed with real names only.
”....The Canadian Broadcasting Corporation (CBC) online stories were so plagued by insulting and garbage-filled posts....
Jul 17th, 2016 - 10:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0-- I did not realise that there were so many argentines in Canada.
And all rgs lie.
Jul 17th, 2016 - 10:36 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I have been reading all these posts.
Jul 18th, 2016 - 03:33 am - Link - Report abuse 0I have two questions:
How does a former politician expect to return a disgraced and unpopular former President under investigation for money laundering and corruption back to power, on a promise of invading a neighbour, when Argentina has no military?
How does an obsolete Socialist and disconnected Canadian have understanding of events in Argentina?
It's all very amusing.
52. That's “Reeeeeeeeeeeeekie”!
Jul 18th, 2016 - 02:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0What is the count as of this month? I think we're up to 30 Kirchner/FpV ex-government officials indicted at this point. Some already convicted and sentenced. And that's not counting the likes of Baez and Maximo.
Jul 18th, 2016 - 03:34 pm - Link - Report abuse 0#50 Marti
Jul 18th, 2016 - 04:23 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Ha ha!
That's a good one!
We do love CBC here.
#52 Kanye
Good for you for reading and participating. It really is all quite simple:
1. a. “Disgraced and unpopular...”
A: Your assessment--not mine.
1. b. “...former President under investigation for money laundering and corruption...”
A: In spite of “explosive” denunciations, publicized search warrants and other procedures, after seven months the current government has little to show about Kirchnerist corruption--and so it keeps jumping from one “case” to the next.
1. c. Invading a neighbour...yada yada.
A: Don't worry about it.
Bonus 1: While Clarín and other Argentine concentrated media focused on alleged corruption of former Kirchnerist government, energy companies in Argentina were changing hands in January and February as friends of president Macri positioned themselves to profit from upcoming large increases in utility bills.
Bonus 2: Besides prompting judges to suspend all gas bills increases and tell users not to pay, the current government has accomplished the feat of getting Argentines to the streets to protest--just after seven months in power (a record). The pro-government media keeps trying to divert the public's attention from their economic penury--which is not considered at all amusing.
2. a. “...obsolete Socialist and disconnected Canadian?
A: Your assessment--not mine.
2. b. ”...have understanding of events in Argentina?”
A: Very simple, my friend. It's called interest and concern.
Happy?
#52 “How does a former politician expect to return a disgraced and unpopular former President under investigation for money laundering and corruption back to power, on a promise of invading a neighbour, when Argentina has no military?”
Jul 18th, 2016 - 06:16 pm - Link - Report abuse 0She is crazy. This answer fits all of the available evidence.
“How does an obsolete Socialist and disconnected Canadian have understanding of events in Argentina?”
He probably doesn't, but he allows his socialism to blind him to facts which is why he rarely answers valid points.
“It's all very amusing.”
Yes, it is. ;-)
@47 Reekie, talk of “diversion”, you are a master at side-stepping the issue..
Jul 18th, 2016 - 07:40 pm - Link - Report abuse 0As to your suggestion that I speak to MP, first of all, you don't have the power to “bother ” anyone, at least not me. and second, why are you so infantile as to even suggest it ?
Just curious why someone would defend the K's and their administrations, but would live in a country that is just the opposite. Believe even YOU can see the incongruity in this ; anyway, I don't see how disclosing one simple, uncompromising detail on why you relocated, is personal, to the point of refusing point-blank to discuss it. Strange.......I know you still won't answer, but please try to be more coherent in future, practise what you preach.
@51 Chronic: “And all rgs lie.”
Jul 18th, 2016 - 11:34 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Chronic, normally I'd object to that sort of statement, but it seems that you are onto something, and it has been recognised by others:
Article: “Why Lying Is Often Easier in Argentina”
http://americasquarterly.org/content/why-truth-so-hard-argentina
“....a well-known Argentine diplomat was doing what diplomats do – defending his government over rubber chicken and white wine. But this night was quite unusual, because the diplomat was openly and unapologetically defending a lie....”
Whether you wish to call it lying, or self-delusion, I guess depends upon your degree of charitability.
Thank you for sharing your predilection however I am generally immune to objection.
Jul 19th, 2016 - 02:02 am - Link - Report abuse 0Reeeeeeeeekie is the one who first penned it in mp.
Occasionally a good article in English pops up dealing with the moral turpitude of the Kirchners. This one is worth considering:
Jul 19th, 2016 - 02:37 am - Link - Report abuse 0http://www.economist.com/news/americas/21701531-new-president-puts-his-predecessor-her-place-erasing-kirchner-cult
”..... the Museo del Bicentenario (bicentenary museum) tells the story of the country’s leaders since the revolution against Spanish rule in 1810. Until recently, half its floorspace was devoted to exhibits about Cristina Fernández de Kirchner,....”
#58 Marti
Jul 19th, 2016 - 04:45 am - Link - Report abuse 0”Chronic, normally I'd object to that sort of statement, (All rgs lie) but it seems that you are onto something...”
Marti. You are becoming a softy.
Where is the self righteous person who proclaimed that Argentina will never be well governed as long as it's governed by Argies?
Come on Marti! You can do better!
Reeeeeeeeekie, go to rg.
Jul 19th, 2016 - 09:22 am - Link - Report abuse 0Embrace your motherland.
Reekie, on the observation “.....Argentina will never be well governed as long as it's governed by Argies..”
Jul 19th, 2016 - 01:56 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Still true. Argentines are what keep Argentina from becoming a great nation.
Read the article, Reekie. Then take a good look in the mirror. Discover what is the basis of the cultural and political DNA. It makes North Korean propaganda seem comparatively believable. Viveza criolla con corbata.
Article: “Why Lying Is Often Easier in Argentina”
americasquarterly.org/content/why-truth-so-hard-argentina
And for those who read cristiano: read about CFK's “Lie Machine”
http://casos.lanacion.com.ar/indec-la-maquina-de-la-mentira
Reekie
Jul 19th, 2016 - 04:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Your silence regarding # 57 implies consent. The first step in solving your problem.
#63 Marti
Jul 19th, 2016 - 05:40 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Interesting article.
Brian Winter starts with a “real-life story” involving an-unnamed diplomat speaking “at a dinner party in Washington seven years ago.”
Then, Winter tells us Macri is loved, “has become something of a hero abroad...On Wall Street in particular, Macri is revered.”
No s...t!
Next, Winter analyses the situation at home:
”...he remains fairly popular (but) suffered the first major “cacerolazo” protest...some of his biggest fans are growing worried.“
But never mind. Winter reminds us that Macri needs time to fix things, because the situation was sooo bad.
But was it? No according to Winter:
”The unfortunate thing is...Argentina’s economy never had the “benefit” of bottoming out under Fernández.“
So, what happened?
”Through currency controls, subsidies and some old-fashioned good timing, Fernández was able to hold things together long enough to avoid an outright debacle.“
(I love the ”some old-fashioned good timing” part).
So it's too bad a debacle did not occur. If it had, Macri would have had it easier.
Now, our journalist turned sociologist shows us the real problem--Argentines believe they deserve a better life!
“...the memory of glorious wealth, and the conviction that everyone deserves a fair share of it, is one reason why austerity has always been harder in Argentina than in most other countries.”
Bingo!
Welcome to the neo liberal dream of pairing Argentina's working class with its more destitute brothers in Paraguay or Peru so that corporations can make fatter profits.
Thanks Marti for providing us with a candid view of the neocon ideology.
http://americasquarterly.org/content/why-truth-so-hard-argentina
As usual, you missed the central theme while you were inventing others.
Jul 19th, 2016 - 07:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The topic was the unparalleled and inveterate capacity for Argentines for telling lies, and particularly about economic conditions in the country. Hence the line ““Why Lying Is Often Easier in Argentina”
And then there is ”The Lie Behind Argentina’s 'Growth' Model “
http://wolfstreet.com/2016/06/02/the-lie-behind-argentina-growth-model-political-manipulation-gdp-inflation-poverty/
The Economist's classic ” Don't Lie to Me, Argentina“
http://wolfstreet.com/2016/06/02/the-lie-behind-argentina-growth-model-political-manipulation-gdp-inflation-poverty/
”Look Who’s Lying About Inflation Again“
http://wolfstreet.com/2016/06/02/the-lie-behind-argentina-growth-model-political-manipulation-gdp-inflation-poverty/
And I was not aware that this one had been made available in English, but it's another classic:
”INDEC: The Lie Machine”
http://wolfstreet.com/2016/06/02/the-lie-behind-argentina-growth-model-political-manipulation-gdp-inflation-poverty/
#66 Marti
Jul 20th, 2016 - 05:00 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“As usual, you missed the central theme while you were inventing others.”
No I did not.
I read the whole article.
You just read--and loved--the headline.
“Argentines are what keep Argentina from becoming a great nation,” you proudly proclaimed. “Read the article, Reekie...It makes North Korean propaganda seem comparatively believable.”
Unfortunately you realized, a bit late, what really the article says, so you now come up with other links in a desperate effort to cover your blunder.
Too late, my friend.
Reekie
Jul 20th, 2016 - 06:18 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Re my # 64, ignoring me will not make your problem disappear....
Reekie, CFK lied about economic grown. CFK lied about inflation . CFK lied about the default. CFK lied about poverty rates. CFK lied about traffic fatality rates. CFK lied about crime statistics. Pretty much everything in the CFK government was based on lies. And of course you have no trouble defending the CFK government that was built on lies and corruption.
Jul 20th, 2016 - 09:54 pm - Link - Report abuse 0#57 Jack Bauer
Jul 21st, 2016 - 06:34 am - Link - Report abuse 0You are becoming a bit tiresome, but I'll try again.
My suggestion that you talk to MP was meant to say: if there is a rule making mandatory personal information disclosure in order to comment here, I will consider it.
In absence of such rule I do not see why on earth I should provide it at your request.
“Just curious why someone would defend the K's...but would live in a country that is just the opposite.”
Curious, indeed, that place of residence should determine someone's opinions. I know many Argentines living in several countries and they all think differently.
I do not see why living in Canada would change my assessment on the Kirchnerist governments.
My opinions are my opinions regardless of where I live and are nothing exceptional; in fact they are similar to those of nearly half of my compatriots who voted last November.
Again, this section is not a place to exchange information--even less personal information. Most posts are anonymous, which confirms the ideas posted are what counts--not who is behind such ideas.
“I know you still won't answer...”
You are correct on this one!
“But please try to be more coherent...”
I've been coherent--at least my MP posts have been.
“...in future, practise what you preach.”
I can only surmise your phrase above suggests that, in order to speak positively about an Argentine political movement I need to move back to Argentina. If that's the case, I could then ask MP commentators who sing the praises of the Macri administration to move to Argentina or shut up--which would be inane.
#69 Marti
Your posts are losing quality. This one above is quite childish and I will summarize it as:
”CFK...was bad...real bad...'cause I say so.
My answer?
If I only read Clarin I would perhaps side with you. I do read Clarin, but check other sources too. And no, CFK wasn't perfect but still hers and Nestor were the two best governments Argentina had in the last 100 years--wait till we can compare it with Macri's!
Reekie: “....And no, CFK wasn't perfect but still hers and Nestor were the two best governments Argentina had in the last 100 years-...
Jul 21st, 2016 - 01:55 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The most thieving, mendacious, and self-destructive governments imaginable. Perhaps when the bulk of the KK are in jail we can reassess the nature of those ”two best governments.“ In the meantime, reekie will continue to provide a classic and entertaining insight into the hollow core that is the peronucho mind.
Observations of others:
”Cristina Kirchner 'creating as many problems as possible for the new government' ?
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/southamerica/argentina/12037587/Cristina-Kirchner-creating-as-many-problems-as-possible-for-the-new-government.html
“Here's How Cristina Fernandez Is Destroying Argentina's Economy”
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/southamerica/argentina/12037587/Cristina-Kirchner-creating-as-many-problems-as-possible-for-the-new-government.html
The Crisis-Monger: Where Did Things Go Wrong for Argentina?
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/southamerica/argentina/12037587/Cristina-Kirchner-creating-as-many-problems-as-possible-for-the-new-government.html
“Kirchner Officials Face over 1,000 Cases of Corruption”
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/southamerica/argentina/12037587/Cristina-Kirchner-creating-as-many-problems-as-possible-for-the-new-government.html
Colombi: “No es fácil salir del desastre que dejó el kirchnerismo”
and on and on
Chances are, there is some real substance behind those stories.
@70 Reekie
Jul 21st, 2016 - 11:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“#57 Jack Bauer
You are becoming a bit tiresome, but I'll try again”.
Good to see that you are feeling “bothered”; We all know there is no mandatory rule about disclosing (truly) personal info, so stop being infantile.
“Curious, indeed, that place of residence should determine someone's opinions. I know many Argentines living in several countries and they all think differently.
I do not see why living in Canada would change my assessment on the Kirchnerist governments”
That is not the point. You're right when you say many Argentines live abroad ,
the difference being that they moved because they realized that under the K's, life would not be easy. And, as a consequence they don't defend the very governments that made them leave. That is why I am curious to know why you left. It seems a contradiction that you like Canada and all it has to offer, yet defend Argentina's K period, as if it were just as good as Canada....
““...in future, practise what you preach.”
”I can only surmise your phrase above suggests that, in order to speak positively about an Argentine political movement I need to move back to Argentina. ”
Wrong. I never said or even implied that you should move back to Argentina. As I said, just curious as to why you don't live there if you continually sing praise for the K's. So, if you thought / think the K's were good for Argentina, how could you possibly have wanted to miss out on the 'bonanza' ??
One simple answer and I'll leave you alone to your misery. C'mon Reekie !!
#72 Jack Bauer
Jul 22nd, 2016 - 04:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“You're right when you say many Argentines live abroad, the difference being that they moved because they realized that under the K's, life would not be easy.”
Jack, Jack. Life on Earth did not start in the 2000s, and Argentine emigration is not a new thing. Many Argentines emigrated or fled their country, especially at the end of the 1960s and 1970s.
Conversely, Nestor Kirchner implemented in 2003, for the first time, a program to attract Argentine researchers and scientists living abroad (Plan Raíces) that was later made law by Cristina Fernández. Until July 2011, the plan succeeded bringing back 834 scientists, and in 2013 the scientist number 1,000 returned. (Wikipedia).
“It seems a contradiction that you like Canada and all it has to offer, yet defend Argentina's K period, as if it were just as good as Canada....”
Jack: Just so that you know, choosing where to live is a decision based on numerous factors.
Now for assessing a government, there is something called intellectual honesty. If you have it, you assess the merits and flaws of a government independently of where you live. According to that, I have positively evaluated the two Kirchner governments--that is, I decided the positives outnumbered the negatives.
More importantly, my assessment of seven months of Macri government is that the negatives outweigh the positives. This could change in the future, of course.
Hey smackhead Maradona, British founded Ushuaia-so get your drug raddled ass out and return Ushuaia to Britain.
Jul 22nd, 2016 - 10:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@74. That's right. The surveys of the area were done by the British and the whole island is on the Falklands' continental shelf. The British even named the town Ushuaia. And of course the Beagle Channel and most of the other geographical designations. It's indeed time that not just Ushuaia but all of Tierra del Fuego be returned to the UK.
Jul 23rd, 2016 - 12:36 am - Link - Report abuse 0ÑOQUIS
Jul 23rd, 2016 - 01:04 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The Macri administration has let go many public workers in Argentina administration with the argument they were ñoquis (employees who don't work but show up once a month to get their paycheck).
In recent months, reports surfaced that sympathizers of Cambiemos, the party in the current government, were being hired and paid higher wages than those laid off.
Now, La Nacion and other media outlets in Argentina report that, after laying off several public workers and giving the remaining ones a seven-per-cent salary increase, the top authority of Argentina's Department of Insurances has given himself a wage increase of 50 per cent.
Superintendent of Insurances Edgardo Podjarny's wages are now 150,000 pesos, up from just over 90,000 pesos.
Just an example of Macri's new ways of managing the public purse.
Gad, you mean the Macri government is acting all argentine? I am totally shocked. Must be in their DNA.
Jul 23rd, 2016 - 03:11 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Now, for entertainment purposes only, Reekie will explain how the CFK government had less external debt than the present government.
@73 Reekie
Jul 23rd, 2016 - 09:46 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Thanks for showing a bit of honesty.....
I suppose that the bottom line of where I'm going with all this, is to show that while you evaluate two K governments positively - “ the positives outnumbered the negatives” - maybe one should consider that IF governed seriously, there might be no negatives, or only fairly insignificant ones.....
It's much the same as many say of Brazil, and I agree : despite the problems (the 'negatives') , it's great place to live , but it could be so much better (not just the few crumbs thrown at the largely ignorant population, just to fool them and keep them quiet......
#78 Jack Bauer
Jul 24th, 2016 - 03:58 am - Link - Report abuse 0No government--and I mean no government in any country--is going to be flaw-free. A government must manage large amounts of people--some good, some perhaps no so good, and some rotten apples.
Governments usually take one of two general directions: either to support increasing concentration of wealth and power on the few families representing the real power, or support wealth distribution to improve the lot of the less fortunate and the middle classes. The later will face the fury of those who monopolize power and wealth. The former will work to fill the coffers as fast as they can before people get too mad. The media accomplice will slow down the awareness process as much as they can, by providing diversion and smokescreens.
The example is blatant in Brazil, where president Dilma Rousseff was suspended on corruption allegations by people facing much more and more serious charges. We all know this newly found zeal for “corruption” is the latest strategy to topple progressive governments in case they threaten to be re-elected.
In spite of everything, Latin America is progressing--slowly and with setbacks--but we are much ahead than we were decades ago.
Mr Massott
Jul 24th, 2016 - 07:47 am - Link - Report abuse 0Very revealing.
I have a question:
Which other families were the Kirchner family, Timmerman, Kiciloff, Castro, Baez, Boudou, Lula and Maduros families helping to enrich?
Increased inflation, increased National Debt., increased unemployment, increased poverty, 11m below the Poverty Line, - during the reign of the Special K's!
A constant erosion of government health care and schools and education.
Doesn't that put those Special K's in the “Former” category?
@79 Reekie
Jul 24th, 2016 - 06:32 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“No government--and I mean no government in any country--is going to be flaw-free”.
Can't disagree with that... especially in the case of Brazil, however, when the so-called negatives are not just small bumps along the way, but instead are major issues which ruin the economy, fueling inflation, causing massive unemployment, using the government machine to hide the facts as well as to discredit the opposition, to try to gag the press, at the very least turning a blind eye to - if not participating in - the rampant corruption within her own party (PT) and the State -run companies (PB, Eletrobras, Nuclebras, BNDES...), it is hard to believe that the very few 'positives' outweigh the problems caused. The economic indices , plus the unemployment rate is there to prove it.....not to mention the ever-increasing millions living off official handouts, despite their being able people of working age ; and then again, we have those accused of corruption at the highest level, denying any wrondoing, being jailed as the evidence surfaces....it's just a matter of time before the people see Dilma for what she really is : just about the most incompetent, pathetic president any country could have, claiming the little good she's done 'outweighs' the mess she has caused for Brazil. Reading reports on Brazil, written by 'progressive' journalists, is quite different to living here and feeling the undeniable consequences of such gross mismanagement.
“The example is blatant in Brazil, where president Dilma Rousseff was suspended on corruption allegations”
“The example is blatant in Brazil, where president Dilma Rousseff was suspended on corruption allegations by people facing much more and more serious charges.
”....by people facing much more and more serious charges.”.....they are all going down, one by one, and although Dilma may not be the worst, she is by no means innocent in all this. Her time will come.
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