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Cristina Fernandez in court declares she is victim of “judicial and media prosecution”
Argentina's ex-president Cristina Fernandez de Kirchner fended off corruption allegations in court on Tuesday, claiming she was the victim of “judicial and media persecution” backed by economic forces, at a politically delicate time for the recession-hit country. Read full article
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Disclaimer & comment rulesDidn't Cristina call the Falkland Islanders ''squatters'' and doubted that they had ''rights'' ?
Mar 08th, 2017 - 10:36 am - Link - Report abuse +2Well let's see if she's correct:
Falklands – Usurpation & UN Resolutions: https://www.academia.edu/21721198/Falklands_1833_Usurpation_and_UN_Resolutions
Oooh. Someone was telling porkies.
Life's tough when you export precursor chems to Mexico to be processed into Meth by the cartels for export into the US. Or hamstring Argentine Corporations so they are are forced to fold under tariffs and taxes. Or send La Campora thugs to slash farmer's silobolsas by night to spoil their crops. Or release violent felons to serve as muscle at Victory Party events, and assault tourists from “enemy” nations. Or drive the Electric services into the ground by limiting charges so that maintenance is not affordable, while allowing neighborhoods to tap electric power illegally for free. Did I mention, siphoning money off public works projects? Sorry, my vision is blurring typing this out...
Mar 08th, 2017 - 10:46 am - Link - Report abuse +2http://cdn.emgn.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/09/Addams-Family-Trivia-EMGN4.gif
“A few supporters rallied in her support as she arrived at the tightly guarded court” Wow. Everyone knew she was appearing in court today so where were her thousands of supporters? I suspect they don't turn out unless they are paid.
Mar 08th, 2017 - 12:23 pm - Link - Report abuse +3CFK - always the victim - thinks applying the law is persecution. That is an interesting defence and one other criminals should adopt. “Yer 'onour, you are persecuting me just coz I robbed an old granny outside the Posy Office”. Hmmmm.
Look on the bright side, there was no violence from the “Usual Suspects.” A statement in itself, and always a plus! ;)
Mar 08th, 2017 - 12:43 pm - Link - Report abuse +2Los Sauces!!! Bahahahaha! Does Fat Max spread it on his pies?
Mar 08th, 2017 - 02:08 pm - Link - Report abuse +2@EB
Mar 08th, 2017 - 02:30 pm - Link - Report abuse +3Perhaps they ran out of choripanes and Quilmes?
Perhaps she’ll get suicided, shoot herself in the head then quickly remove all GSR, before falling down dead.
Mar 08th, 2017 - 04:44 pm - Link - Report abuse +2Except shooting herself in the head might not kill her, won’t hit ant vital organs up there.
I say Quique (Enrique) should return and support her in person. Perhaps he can sleep outside her apartment on Juncal in hopes she will throw some money.
Mar 08th, 2017 - 07:35 pm - Link - Report abuse +2Quique, isn't it getting unbearable living in a country as bad as Canada for the past 40 years?
I'm waiting for Enrique to appear with one of his diversions, or protest that Evita K should be immune from prosecution by her “enemies”, representatives of the People of Argentina.
Mar 09th, 2017 - 01:32 am - Link - Report abuse +2However, t's unlikely he will try it on by saying “she didn't do it”.
Enrique has a right to hold his opinion but it is wildly at odds with the reality in Argentina. Go easy on him, he has just found out Santa Claus isn't real, there is no Easter Bunny and CFK was just another corrupt Argentine President, not fighting for his idealised equal society but a liar intent on lining her own pockets.
Mar 09th, 2017 - 12:35 pm - Link - Report abuse +3His argument of 'but look at Macri' means nothing because Macri is exactly what we expect from an Argentine President. The problem is he is a believer in an falsehood name Kirchner. She wasn't better, she was worse.
I wonder how long before the Trump voters realise the same about him?
Fancy blaming others for her misfortune , unheard of in Argentina.HaHa
Mar 09th, 2017 - 12:51 pm - Link - Report abuse +2Trump and Kirchner has a lot in common. Hopefully The Chief Cheeto in the WH follows the same path.
Mar 09th, 2017 - 02:38 pm - Link - Report abuse +3The difference between Trump and CFK in this case, is Trump was filthy rich before he became President, in fact before he ever entered politics.
Mar 09th, 2017 - 04:08 pm - Link - Report abuse +3Seriously, how much would you have to pay to bride Trump compared to CFK?
Trump SAYS he is filthy rich but how can you believe anything he says. Besides what rich man has ever said, ah I have enough now. Look at some of the deals he did in Azerbaijan and Georgia…..
Mar 09th, 2017 - 05:53 pm - Link - Report abuse +3CFK... Awwww! Diddums.
Mar 09th, 2017 - 09:42 pm - Link - Report abuse +2EB
Mar 10th, 2017 - 01:37 am - Link - Report abuse +2Enrique can think what he wants. The prosecution of CFK is not the political persecution that Enrique paints it as.
Once her former accomplices start finger-pointing and running for cover, the truth will come out.
Her conviction by legal process of the Judiciary and her Argentine “peers”, will make it very difficult for him to support her as a patriot.
In the meantime, it is a useful tool of the Enrique types to polarise the Argentine public against Macri.
@ Kanye
Mar 10th, 2017 - 10:06 am - Link - Report abuse +2I told him as much. He has a peculiar idea of applying the law and thinks if it happened in the past it should not count. Let's try that defence “Yer 'onour, you shouldn't be prosecuting me for the crimes I committed these last eight years because there are people committing crimes now”. For someone living in a primarily law abiding country like Canada you have wonder why Enrique has such a skewed idea of a justice system. Except the Argentina he talks about is some fantasy he has woven in his head and nothing like the reality.
EB
Mar 10th, 2017 - 03:47 pm - Link - Report abuse +1You point out what should be an obvious irony to Enrique.
Given that he admits to being about 70 now, and he was forced to flee or exiled from Argentina during the Junta and before the Falklands invasion in '82, that puts him living in Canada for 40 years at least. More than he lived in Argentina.
I would suggest, and it IS only speculation, the thing that Enrique is hanging onto is his animosity and desire for retribution against his perceived “class enemies” who incarcerated or tortured him.
As Enrique was a Socialist, or Communist, and possibly even a violent activist, freedom fighter, or terrorist, the moneyed establishment were likely protecting their interests against people like him, as would be expected.
The now bitter ideologue was the one forced to leave Argentina.
I don't get the impression from his writings that Enrique has the same issues with the largely egalitarian and classless society of Canada, where he has spent the majority of his life.
One only wishes he could learn something from that.
For example, Canada recognises the French sovereignty of the two small islands just off the coast of Canada, St. Pierre and Miquelon.
@ Kanye
Mar 10th, 2017 - 04:13 pm - Link - Report abuse +3Pure speculation but it is possible that EM cannot ever go back to Argentina. When people are in the later stages of their life they often long to go back to their roots and it is possible that he doesn't have that option. Otherwise why would he not return to a place he is so emotionally invested in? He seems to believe that the Kirchners aligned with his idealism (though they didn't) so why not go back during the K's decade? Airfares between Canada and Argentina are perfectly affordable and one can live cheaply there. Or is it that he just couldn't face the reality and prefers to maintain his fantasy?
I have said many times that I have had some fantastic times in Argentina. I am not Argentine but I would feel rather upset if I could never go there again, so I imagine it would be heartbreaking for an Argentine so beloved of their homeland.
CFK is going down the same road that Lula did.....first deny all accusations....when the proof of the crimes starts to surface, still deny the charges....when you can no longer deny anything, try to justify it by alleging “, but everyone else did....”....when that doesn't work, claim you are a victim of political persecution....when the judges in charge of the investigation ignore these ridiculous claims, you file a petition to declare the whole prosecution illegal....when that is denied by the judges, you lauch yourself as a presidential candidate in 2018, so that when you are whisked off to prison, you can once again claim you are a victim, and call upon your army made up of illegitimate social movements, of ignorant innocents - who'll do anything for R$ 30 and a sandwich - to protest and to disrupt law & order...the script never changes.
Mar 10th, 2017 - 04:30 pm - Link - Report abuse +3@JB
Mar 10th, 2017 - 06:29 pm - Link - Report abuse +6The added bonus in Argentina is that you cannot be prosecuted if you hold office. That is why the useless lump Maximo is in office. As a university drop out (like his mother) he has no qualifications or skills beyond sticking drugs up his nose and stirring up thugs.
EB
Mar 10th, 2017 - 10:37 pm - Link - Report abuse +1Unfortunately, while Enrique resides in his romantic fantasy that The K's are leading Argentina's proletariat against a great injustice, he is supporting corrupt thieves.
He repeats the K propaganda that CFK is another Evita and Macri is deliberately punishing the poor and middle classes.
He is doing his best to stir up discontent that Macri has not turned the economy around completely to profitability.
He tells us “wealth should be re-distributed”.
He is obsolete or pure bonkers, but his message is destructive.
“He is obsolete or pure bonkers, but his message is destructive.”
Mar 11th, 2017 - 12:43 am - Link - Report abuse +1He is a wrecker and saboteur...
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/8c/SABOTAGE_CAN_OUTWEIGH_PRODUCTION_-_NARA_-_515321.tif/lossy-page1-1200px-SABOTAGE_CAN_OUTWEIGH_PRODUCTION_-_NARA_-_515321.tif.jpg
....or he's just an Argy ex-pat with an opinion...
Mar 11th, 2017 - 06:02 pm - Link - Report abuse -2Drama Queens much...
Nothing wrong with an opinion seated in reality. Reading is nothing. I can read about space travel, then form an opinion. How solid of an opinion would you say that is? Others think combat is a breeze, of course, those who never form those opinions. Point is, his opinion on Argentina from reading news in BC, Canada is as solid as a piss hole in a snowbank.
Mar 12th, 2017 - 03:52 pm - Link - Report abuse +3I've lived in England, hell I was educated there...
Mar 12th, 2017 - 07:28 pm - Link - Report abuse -1I don't live there any longer, but do you think Kanye's opinions of England would be more solid than mine...?
I would lose him in a second...
You're pulling a trump and changing the point, which is Quequi, not Kanye. I still say Quequi should return and support Kirchner if he thinks so highly of her.
Mar 13th, 2017 - 02:34 am - Link - Report abuse +3Wow. I did not know I could become subject of discussion on an MP thread!
Mar 13th, 2017 - 06:25 pm - Link - Report abuse -5My dear fellows: I do appreciate the attention, but what matters here is, are we having an objective view of what's going on in Argentina?
If you tell me you care just about a rat's arse about Argentina and wish all Argentines were done with, then there is not much to talk about, right?
If you are convinced that all Argentines are lazy anyway and no matter what government they have the county will fail, there is no use in wasting time debating anything Argentina.
If you are against human rights for all or for certain people, then I am not interested in talking to you. Do not engage me.
Now, if you have a genuine interest in Argentina in the context of a Latin America in search of its own destiny and believe its people deserve improved life conditions, then we may be able to debate about the different directions the country may take.
Elaine, for example, has shown some sensitivity and expressed some interesting points in previous posts, such as that Argentines are not obsessed by work. She is right. However, and probably due to the Argentines she knows, she comes up with the idea that Argentines are all lazy. That's not true. Argentines, like everybody else in the world, like having a job or their own business, and want to have a future for them and their families.
Full disclosure: I do have family members and friends in Argentina with a diversity of views, which gives me a good sense of things in addition to the domestic formal and social media. I believe what is now taking place in my home country will become an interesting showcase of the differences between Kirchnerist and Macrist approaches to government. Analysing it, however, requires an open mind, free of rigid ideological corsets that are difficult to apply to a such a special country as Argentina.
@ EM
Mar 13th, 2017 - 08:12 pm - Link - Report abuse +4“However, and probably due to the Argentines she knows, she comes up with the idea that Argentines are all lazy.”
Don't start lying about me. I did not say that and you are well aware of it. You are just trying more distraction. I commented extensively about the reasons for the well-known attitude to work by Argentines and why. I am not repeating it again here, just check the other thread about the prosecution of CFK.
This thread is not about different political ideology but the criminal activities of CFK.
@Reekie
Mar 13th, 2017 - 08:22 pm - Link - Report abuse +4I too have family in BA - hard working, btw - and when I've posted on matters concerning Argentina, I've kept my opinions limited to CFK and Kirchnerism, as a form of government, without denigrating the image of the argentines, as people....the 'lazy' exist in every country, but when a government , to booster its popularity, employs thousands of useless, inefficient government bureacrats, or resorts to handouts to the unemployed who aren't interested in looking for a job - in exchange for unconditional support - this creates laziness....paid for by the taxpayer ; this is what cannot be ignored, or swept under the carpet. So, keeping the conversation focused on CFK, her family and her cronies, she had 8 years, after her husband's 4, to implement her 'ideas', or 12 in total.....first, if she was so successful, then why did reality in Argentina, until 2015, not reflect this 'success' ? second, if you think it did, then why did her candidate lose the election ?, and third, since you are judging her only after two terms, or 8 years in office, don't you think that Macri deserves at least half that time to allow his policies to mature ?
ElaineB:
Mar 14th, 2017 - 03:57 am - Link - Report abuse -2Well...here's your writing:
“...if you spent any time in Argentina you would understand very quickly that they spend more energy avoiding work than actually working.”
I agree you did not write the word “lazy,” so if you say you did not mean that I'll accept it with my apologies. You demonstrate knowledge about Argentines and some understanding of our culture and I appreciate that.
By the way, people who support president Macri are calling to a demonstration on April 1st.
A good opportunity to check how much support still remains for the president, especially after the hundreds of thousands who demonstrated last week in opposition.
@ EM
Mar 14th, 2017 - 06:17 am - Link - Report abuse +2You are still trying to distract and not comment on the criminal activity of CFK.
Actually Kamerad/Komrade Rique, you have done nothing but support criminality. Your constant asides about “crushing the empire,” use of Castroist insults like “Gusanos,” make it abundantly clear where you are “coming from. Here's hoping you get everything you deserve, ”Gusano.”
Mar 14th, 2017 - 07:43 am - Link - Report abuse +1@ EB
Mar 14th, 2017 - 07:05 pm - Link - Report abuse -3Actually I do have a comment on “the criminal activity of CFK.”
I believe you said you live in the U.K. and that in that country people are presumed innocent until proven guilty.
Your casual way of declaring the guilt of someone as CFK at a time when her trial is at its early stages sounds inconsistent for a British citizen. You sound more as an Argentine citizen writing in English.
Why?
Because for all the progress my home country has had in the last decades, there is still a very bad habit in the Argentine media, and that's to report on people as “thieves, criminals or murderers” from the moment suspects are aprehended.
@EM
Mar 14th, 2017 - 08:06 pm - Link - Report abuse +3So now you think I am an Argentine? I will take that as a compliment if you think my opinions reflect the average Argentine regarding CFK's criminal activities. You see, if you had spent any time in Argentina you would know that the average Argentine is fully aware of her criminal activity and thieving. If you understood the mind-set of the average Argentine and the 'native cunning' you would understand that there is a certain admiration for anyone who breaks the law. They accept the idea of laws but don't think they apply to them individually. So they know she has been stealing vast amounts of money to line her own pockets but they just don't make the connection that it is THEIR money she has stolen.
EM, you are a very naive chap. You are an idealist not a realist and since you will never set foot in Argentina you can dream all you want about a mythical version of the place. The reality is very different. You won't be happy until Argentina resembles Venezuela. You are happy to sacrifice Argentinians for you ideology. Fortunately, you are irrelevant there.
@EB
Mar 15th, 2017 - 01:47 am - Link - Report abuse -3Good, Elaine. Good.
You have just shown that you are not here to debate. You sound like those old ladies from Barrio Norte chatting about their domestics. You are here, for some reason, to do the same thing Clarin and Co. are doing in Argentina:
When people question Macri's damaging policies, generate some news about Cristina and try to instill the idea that all the bad that is happening now is her fault. Clever, but only a short-term resource.
You have no real arguments other than bashing Cristina. In spite of your claims, you don't care about what happens to Argentines--otherwise you would not be negating what happens today.
And finally, to complement your lack of argument, you resort to the old trick of attacking the messenger with MP's commentators hypocrit cliches, e.g. “you don't live in Argentina therefore you know nothing about,” and the like.
Oh, and I am not “sacrificing” anybody to ideology. People in Argentina are struggling to buy food and that is not ideology. On one point you are right: I am irrelevant in Argentina--just as you are. It's up to none other than the Argentines to decide their destiny. I am just trying to understand their situation--something you are not even attempting to do.
@ EM
Mar 15th, 2017 - 12:34 pm - Link - Report abuse +1“You have just shown that you are not here to debate. You sound like those old ladies from Barrio Norte chatting about their domestics. You are here, for some reason, to do the same thing Clarin and Co. are doing in Argentina:”
I thought you said on another thread that we should not get personal and yet you do it all the time.
I you want to understand I suggest you get on a plane and go and live there for long periods of time over several years and you will start to have a foundation. You simply cannot achieve that in the comfort and security of Canada.
Enrique,
Mar 15th, 2017 - 04:12 pm - Link - Report abuse +1The people “struggling to buy food” are the same ones that CFK stole from, simply to line her own pockets and those of her WEALTHY accomplices.
She was sure to clean out the Reserve to prop up the failing Peso, leaving nothing for the social programs, healthcare and education.
She lied about the poverty in Arg to cover that up, and had her government disallow reporting on the statistics of the true numbers of poor.
A liar and a thief, she would have perpetuated her disastrous policies as long as she could get away with it.
- and you support her and demonise her opposition and the independent media.
Yep - “Ideology over People”
That's you, Enrique.
@TT
Mar 15th, 2017 - 06:07 pm - Link - Report abuse -1You could have tried to blame CFK 15 months ago, when president Macri was enjoying high levels of popularity and people still believed his promises of improvement.
It's a bit late to try to deflect responsibility from this government by blaming the previous one. For a whole year, Macri was free to do as he pleased. Now that the results of one year of “free-market” measures are beginning to show, Argentines are taking to the streets.
And that, my dear friend, is not ideology and not the fantasies of some Argentine living in Canada. This is happening right in downtown Buenos Aires, my friend. Go and inform yourself. You might be surprised.
As we say, Argentines are not eating crushed glass anymore.
@EB
Read the papers, Elaine. Stop living in the past. Even better, read today's papers. Not even Clarin can hide the disaster anymore. Today, the illustrious newspaper informed that there were three access points--Puente Pueyrredon, Panamericana and Autopista Bs. As.- La Plata where citizens filled the roads, stopped traffic and put up kitchen soups. A crisis is looming.
@Enrique Massot
Mar 15th, 2017 - 06:12 pm - Link - Report abuse +1Ask yourself how it was that CFK and the people around her became so very rich on just their salaries, with no declared business interest of such huge value?
Or are they just the smartest investors on the planet.
As we say, if it’s got feathers, can float, looks like a duck and goes quack, it probably is a duck.
@EM
Mar 15th, 2017 - 08:22 pm - Link - Report abuse +1Read the papers? Is that how you get your impression of Argentina? I guess you have no choice as you cannot go there and see the reality.
@Reekie
Mar 15th, 2017 - 08:56 pm - Link - Report abuse +1must admit, you are quite versatile when it comes down to changing the subject in order to not face it head on......so if you want to engage in some 'serious' debate, I suggest you start by replying to my 3 questions, posted 2 days ago......if you need a bit more time to 'invent' an answer, I can wait...
Enrique,
Mar 15th, 2017 - 09:23 pm - Link - Report abuse +1What everybody said 15 months ago, is still true today:
CFK during her Presidency took the country to bankruptcy and defaulted on loans.
She grew rich while she lied and hid the poverty figures of 11m+ Argentines living in poverty and the number increasing.
Please tell us, does Pravda say she is guilty, or an innocent philanthropist?
@EB
Mar 16th, 2017 - 04:45 am - Link - Report abuse 0So, how do you inform yourself? You go to Argentina and attend Congress meetings, speak to people from different social levels, speak directly to politicians, ministers, lawmakers, to president Macri, attend forums and street demonstrations, go to university lectures, hospitals, police stations and charitable organizations, run the streets and talk to neighbourhood organizers to get a full, first-hand picture?
That is just great, Elaine. I fear I don't have the stamina to do all that, but congratulate you on eliminate the middle man and believing nothing but first-hand information.
Today it would have been the perfect day for you to be in Argentina. Street demonstrations happened in several provinces as well as Buenos Aires. Gosh you would've been busy going from province to province to get a first-hand view!
@TT
I don't know, TT, if Cristina is guilty or not. I understand a judge has incriminated her and is looking at the case. Although the said judge has not a very good reputation, I trust if there is something he'll find it. Then we will see.
@ Troy (good to see you back again), ElaineB, Pugol-H, imoyaro.....
Mar 17th, 2017 - 07:18 pm - Link - Report abuse 0So much for serious debate....looks like Mr. Enrique Massot, kindly referred to as Reekie, is unable to answer the questions... honestly....so he prefers not to.
He has proved he's full of it....what a disgrace.
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