MercoPress. South Atlantic News Agency
Argentine economy picking up spurred by manufacturing and construction
Argentina's economic activity expanded 4.0% in June compared with the same period the prior year, government statistics agency Indec said on Thursday, the latest sign of economic recovery ahead of legislative elections in October. Read full article
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Disclaimer & comment rulesAnd the good old Argentine population want CFK back in power, do these people never learn?
Sep 03rd, 2017 - 10:14 am - Link - Report abuse 0Golfcronie,
Sep 04th, 2017 - 11:51 am - Link - Report abuse -1ahahahahaha ...in many countries the owl is synonymous with bad luck ... I touch my balls for superstition :) :) :)
I get my wife to touch my balls and it brings me luck.
Sep 04th, 2017 - 03:16 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Zero-point-four per cent improvement over a year. Wow. Indeed, very deserving of a MP story. Construction appears to be the locomotive that will pull Argentina towards its imminent resurgence!
Sep 06th, 2017 - 02:12 am - Link - Report abuse -2Meanwhile, the Macri government continues to play dumb while people and human rights organizations keep asking for the whereabouts of a citizen disappeared during a police intervention to quell a Mapuche demonstration in Patagonia.
Police also used extreme anti-riot measures and arrested 31 citizens demonstrating in Buenos Aires city for the return of 28-year-old Santiago Maldonado--something Argentines had grown unaccustomed in the last decade.
There is a long-standing conflict between the local Mapuche community and the Italian company Benetton, which has purchased over 900,000 hectares of land in the area.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/aug/08/argentina-santiago-maldonado-benetton-missing-activist
CFK has orchestrated the violence, trying to make Macri look like the dictatorship, while the reality is Chubut is run by Peronist political Oligarchs. Once again, Kamerad/Komrade Rique is delighted, revealing himself as a despicable “Man of Blood.” Too bad you can't go down there and join the fight, eh, “Kobarde?”
Sep 06th, 2017 - 12:25 pm - Link - Report abuse +1http://www.thebubble.com/santiago-maldonado-argentina-polarized/
@EM
Sep 06th, 2017 - 02:01 pm - Link - Report abuse 04.0%, not 0.4%, and MP reported it when the economy contracted last year. Anyway, aren't you pleased that Macri is finally spending some money on infrastructure and the manufacturing sector is starting to recover? Isn't that what you wanted?
As for the protesters, your own link says:
“On Monday, a march in Buenos Aires calling for Maldonado’s safe return turned violent when hooded protesters chanting “long live anarchy, death to the state” hurled Molotov cocktails at police, attacked a journalist and smashed the window of a television van.”
It's hardly surprising people were arrested in that case.
What do you think happened to Maldonado? The police arrested him and are secretly keeping him prisoner on the orders of the government?
@imoyaro
According to stories the raid was carried out by the Argentine National Gendarmerie which is under the control of the Minister of Security, so the disappearance would have nothing to do with the provincial government in Chubut, Peronist or otherwise.
DT
Sep 08th, 2017 - 03:24 am - Link - Report abuse -2The demonstration went on peacefully and after the end, out of nowhere appeared a group of people nobody knew and threw a few things around. At that point the police charged and arrested 31 persons. The next day the intervening judge had to release all of them when the police could not prove a single case of violence amongst these people. There is a strong possibility (and a long tradition in Argentina) to infiltrate individuals who give the police a reason to intervene.
Right now, most people in Argentina believe the police may have beaten Maldonado, killing him either accidentally or on purpose. If such thing happened, then the minister of security has been covering up, and by keeping Patricia Bullrich in her position, Macri has made himself liable.
Now, there is growing alarm even among allies in the Cambiemos front, and surprisingly even the ultra conservative Rural Society has asked Macri to let go Bullrich.
Meanwhile, the vultures of the allied media have been recklessly fuelling all sorts of theories about Maldonado--he would've seen in Chile, in Argentina's north, would be in Europe, or would've been killed in an attack to a Benetton worker.
To be continued.
@ golfcronie: ahahahaha ...you are my idol I admire you !!!
Sep 08th, 2017 - 07:27 am - Link - Report abuse 0”There is a strong possibility (and a long tradition in Argentina) to infiltrate individuals who give the police a reason to intervene.“
Sep 08th, 2017 - 11:47 am - Link - Report abuse 0That seems likely enough, but there are also groups who choose to protest violently, are there not? How does it benefit the government to cause violence after the demonstration is already over, when it is obvious that it is just a few people instigating it? It makes them look much worse than if there was no violence and didn't really disrupt the protest since it was already over.
”the police may have beaten Maldonado, killing him either accidentally or on purpose.”
That is what I was wondering, but a lot of the protesters had signs asking for him to be returned alive. If the police went too far and killed him while beating him, I would have expected the officers involved to be scapegoated by their superiors, or else some kind of cover-up to make his death look like an innocent accident. It seems odd to just act like nothing has happened and deny all knowledge.
If he was killed in police custody would it necessarily go all the way up to Bullrich, or be on her orders? Or are people angry because the government is not investigating the incident and the police officers concerned?
Also the press says a bunch of important companies in Argentina have signed a statement calling for a “prompt solution through institutional paths”, including La Nacion and Grupo Clarin. Seems like Macri hasn't much support on this.
And you didn't say anything about the economy, or are you not interested in that any more?
@EM: Argentina is famous for wasting time in stupidities unlikely, the Maldonado case is the classic example, how many people die in Argentina by the hands of crime and no one government does nothing to defender its citizens (also the corrupt police) so that I knew, this guy is a craftsman who joined the cause of Mapuches Indians who also represent the essence of the Argentine bum and find no better thing to do than cut roads, burn tires and do mess instead working, study and pay taxes , if the Argentine State grant what the tribe request I'm sure that Argentina it will return to the stone age, trust me !!!
Sep 08th, 2017 - 02:23 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@ Johny Colman
Sep 09th, 2017 - 08:31 pm - Link - Report abuse 0What you are doing here is a classic example of diversion.
“How many people die in Argentina...”
Yes many people die in criminal acts in Argentina. And your point is...?
”This guy...find no better thing (sic) to do than cut roads...“
So in your mind, does being a craftsman and joining the Mapuches' cause and not be ”working, study and pay taxes” qualify for disappearance without trial?
In any event, after trying to confuse the Argentines with a series of false leads, the government is beginning to change its discourse towards the possibility that the frontier police (Gendarmeria) that intervened against the Mapuches may have something to do with Santiago Maldonado's disappearance.
@DT
“...you didn't say anything about the economy...”
Well. You know the last one? The Unión Industrial Argentina (UIA), the main employers' chamber in the country, asked the government yesterday more protection against a flood of imports from Brazil.
The small and medium-size enterprises are asking the same thing since late 2015, but this is the first time the UIA, made up of the largest corporations, makes this sort of statement.
The larger picture is: raising unemployment and prices increases way larger than purchasing power in a generally speaking stagnant economy, with a large fiscal deficit, massive foreign borrowing to cover for operations. But you won't get this picture from reading MP, which has permanent pink glasses on. Foreign investors are doing well too because of the high interest rates being paid by a government that survives on borrowing, and that has most of the foreign press still singing the praises of Macri's “business-friendly” government.
Just like before the subprime mortgage crisis implosion most credit-rating agencies were happily reporting how well all was going.
@EM
Sep 10th, 2017 - 12:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Good if they finally investigate the police, but they should have done that in the first place. This government seems to be repeatedly surprised that people object to the dodgy things they are doing, you'd think they'd have learned by now. At least it shows they do respond to pressure from the public, I suppose.
And they are searching in the Chubut river now, that seems a sensible move. Speaking of Chubut I wonder where Think is? Maybe he's been disappeared too?
“A flood of imports from Brazil.” Isn't Mercosur supposed to be some kind of free trade area? So why were there tariffs against Brazilian imports under CFK? And has the government responded to the UIA?
@DT
Sep 10th, 2017 - 03:35 pm - Link - Report abuse -1You are right - the government should have separated the frontier police from the investigation right away - they didn't and that allowed the force to, among many other things, to wash the vehicles suspected in the kidnapping of Santiago Maldonado. For a month the minister of security Patricia Bullrich staunchly denied any police involvement and the president kept quiet, hoping for the public attention to look elsewhere, but just the opposite happened. The Chubut river is shallow as to allow walking on it, does not have strong currents at the place Maldonado disappeared, so either than the government nobody believes searching it will give any results.
Don't know about Think. I hope he's doing well. The Chubut province is large and I travelled hitch hiking around it - it's beautiful in the mountains and so it is on the seaside. The Chubut River valley is an oasis of life as it runs through the dry prairies.
Sorry I don't know details about Mercosur policies. The general problem with Macri policies is excessive opening to imports that is killing the local enterprises. Macri uses this to reduce inflation, but in time this leads to too many dollars flying out of the country, which combined with massive foreign borrowing inevitably leads to a repayment crisis.
You may have seen in MP comments section much criticism, when CFK was in office, about Argentina being a “serial defaulter.”
Well. What's happening right now is the slow build out of conditions leading to another payments crisis and the possibility of another default. The 1976-1983 military dictatorship used a similar procedure to keep an appearance of prosperity during its first years while they were quashing any real or potential opposition, but the consequences of it caught up with them later, and that is when they decided to go for the Malvinas in a bid to remain in power forever.
Yes, they should have had someone else investigate. That they didn't suggests they either didn't consider the possibility the police were responsible, or just didn't care. It surprises me the minister would defend the police so strongly, my experience is that officials are only too happy to blame their subordinates for any problems.
Sep 10th, 2017 - 09:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Wikipedia says “Some of the people at the camp managed to flee by crossing the Chubut river, which passes through the property, and hide in a nearby forest. Maldonado could not cross the river because he cannot swim.” If the river is shallow enough to cross on foot, it seems like a good reason to search it. A non-swimmer could easily try to cross in that situation but get into difficulties and be swept away. Also if he died in police custody what did they do with his body?
It must be nice to have lived when it was safe to hitch hike. People back in the 60s and 70s seemed so optimistic despite living with the threat of nuclear war.
It's ironic because CFK claimed to support regional integration and increasing trade between developing countries instead of eg the US, but she had tariffs against the other Mercosur countries. As for Macri, if he can increase exports to match it wouldn't be a problem, but I don't believe he has (yet).
I agree with you that the foreign borrowing is a long term threat, but it's a difficult choice. If he cuts borrowing he has to either raise taxes or cut spending, and neither will be good for the economy, or make him popular. It's easy to say borrow less, but if you were in charge, what would you cut or tax more to make up the money?
Invading the Falklands would have worked, if the Junta hadn't misjudged Britain's response. It seems to be a common thing; Germany twice thought Britain wouldn't fight and were wrong. What is it that makes other countries misjudge us?
Also, would you prefer Argentina had won the war, although it would have allowed the Junta to stay in power for a few more years at least?
@DT
Sep 10th, 2017 - 10:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“...would you prefer Argentina had won the war, although it would have allowed the Junta to stay in power...?”
I saw a losing proposition on either outcome, which kept me from sharing the enthusiasm of my country people at the time. Aside from individual acts of courage and sacrifice from combattants, the top Argentine military showed absolute disregard for the life and well-being of their mostly 18-year-old, conscripted soldiers. They had grown confident by catching unarmed civilians in the middle of the night, torturing them and throwing them off aircraft--however, facing a professional army became a very different matter.
“...if you were in charge, what would you cut or tax more to make up the money?”
Borrowing is not bad in itself, and I agree it can be done when funds are brought in to increase a country's repayment capacity, as in borrowing for required infrastructure projects.
In the case of Argentina, the borrowing is mostly unhealthy: it pays high interest rates and is being used to pay for operations. Banks, financial institutions and insiders are the only ones benefitting from it--the population will be saddled with this large long-term debt.
The problem is, with all the massive borrowing, no improvement is being made to the country's economy--just keeping the lights on. Instead of strengthening the domestic productive capacity, imports are killing such capacity. A large sector of the population sees its purchase power going down, which in turns reduces demand in good and services. Today's developed capitalist countries did not start at all by doing what Argentina is doing now, or they would not have the structural power they have today. As it stands, Argentina is a big guy with mud-made feet, which is sad to see even from afar.
@EM
Sep 11th, 2017 - 09:59 am - Link - Report abuse 0“What you are doing here is a classic example of diversion.”
A classic example of diversion for me is to express what I think, right or wrong, like it or not !
“Yes many people die in criminal acts in Argentina. And your point is...?”
My point is… I’ll be schematic:
Less corrupt cops = more security
Less “villas” = more security
Less protest marches = more security and calm
Less TV programs trash = more civil conscience
More education and respect for private property = more security
I remember the NY cops who writes on their patrols “To protect and serve” this might be an example.
The education starts from the State even more if people have a tendency to wander, there is a large percentage of people who would rather steal than work, I'm so sorry for this boy Santiago but there’s no time for another Che Guevara in Argentina
@EM
Sep 11th, 2017 - 10:15 am - Link - Report abuse 0Had you already moved to Canada by 1982 or were you still living in Argentina? Argentina hadn't fought a real war since the Conquest of the Desert nearly 100 years earlier, since then the army only dealt with uprisings and held coups; that can't be the best training. I watched a film on youtube where the soldiers were mistreated by their own officers, but I don't know how accurate it is.
I agree borrowing just to keep the lights on is unsustainable, but the problem is, if you stop then the lights go off. You didn't really answer the question, it sounds like you think he should keep borrowing but spend the money differently in order to build up the economy. Is that right? And you think protectionism is needed to help industries develop?
(By the way, it should be 'feet of clay' in English.)
@Johnny Colman
“Less corrupt cops = more security”
You think the way to get less corrupt cops is to ignore someone disappearing during a police raid?
And if the government is ignoring the issue, how else should the people get them to listen, if not with protests?
@DT
Sep 11th, 2017 - 12:35 pm - Link - Report abuse 0”You think the way to get less corrupt cops is to ignore someone disappearing during a police raid?....
Certainly not!!! But I know all about Argentina as my hands and I can tell you that if there is a corrupt officer then all the pyramid is rotten from the tip, in this specific Maldonado’s case if the State made a mistake, the State pays, the best way to ask for forgiveness is the resignation of senior officials and minister and obviously compensate the family of this supposedly missing.
The protests are useful with a good goal, this could be the exception, but cannot be a demonstration day by day paralyzing a whole city...
@JC
Sep 11th, 2017 - 05:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“if there is a corrupt officer then all the pyramid is rotten from the tip”
Are you saying that if the police were responsible for Maldonado's disappearance or death, it must have been on Bullrich or Macri's orders? What they need to do is find out who is responsible and more importantly make sure it doesn't happen again, and that is much more likely to happen if people make a fuss.
True that demonstrations become a problem if they are too common, and also lose their force, so it is up to people not to abuse them but save them for serious issues. Otherwise they will be like the boy who cried wolf; ignored when it really matters.
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