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Montevideo, August 18th 2022 - 10:48 UTC



Venezuelan Supreme Court bans Guaidó from leaving the country and freezes his bank accounts

Wednesday, January 30th 2019 - 10:03 UTC
Full article 131 comments

Venezuela's Supreme Court has banned opposition leader Juan Guaidó from leaving the country and frozen his bank accounts. The move comes amid an escalating power struggle, after Mr Guaidó declared himself interim president last week. Read full article


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  • Chicureo

    This is getting interesting...

    From the news: “About 20 tons of gold from Venezuela's central bank was ready to be hauled away Tuesday on a Russian airline's Boeing 777 that landed in Caracas a day earlier, a Venezuelan lawmaker wrote on Twitter.”

    Jan 30th, 2019 - 01:09 pm - Link - Report abuse +1
  • Brasileiro

    A Latin American country having exchange reserves deposited in an Anglo-Saxon country is a crime against the people.

    Jan 30th, 2019 - 03:16 pm - Link - Report abuse -1
  • Chicureo


    The true crime against the people is the corrupt squandering of Venezuela's incredible wealth and starving its populace. Shipping 20 tons of gold to Russia is a profanity!

    Jan 30th, 2019 - 03:47 pm - Link - Report abuse +1
  • DemonTree

    “Shipping 20 tons of gold to Russia is a profanity!”

    Why? They owe Russia money. You didn't complain when Argentina paid U$D4.6 bn to the vulture funds, and that's worth a hell of a lot more. You don't complain when other poor countries pay their debts to rich ones, even if their citizens are starving. Why have you suddenly found your conscience now?

    Jan 30th, 2019 - 04:44 pm - Link - Report abuse -1
  • Jack Bauer

    Don't expect anything sensible from “Brasileiro”........or from Terryble Terry...

    Jan 30th, 2019 - 04:46 pm - Link - Report abuse +1
  • Chicureo


    (You sometimes need to add DemonTree to you notorious list...)

    My two Venezuelan friends living in my neighborhood have already been invited to my home to open a 1991 Don Melchor Cabernet and celebrate when the bus driver falls from power.


    Yes, Russia and China are owed billions of Dollars... What happened to your moral compass?

    Maduro is following the great tradition of Latin American dictators when losing their grip on power, create had reliable exit strategy: exile in some hospitable foreign locale, in this case probably Cuba or Russia. If he fails to control the military backing him, he'll likely hastily flee in a quick flight to Cuba.

    If you believe in a true democratic society, the assets of Venezuela belong to the government, which is now constitutionally recognized under the control of Guaidó.
    Following that legal understanding you realize that Maduro exporting part of Venezuela's gold reserves outright theft.

    And... Yes, yes, yes... Squeak in rage all you want about Augusto Pinochet, but 1973 was a different time...

    Hopefully there will be no bloodbath of violence... ...hopefully...
    But “the tree of liberty sometimes need the taste of blood.”

    Jan 30th, 2019 - 08:20 pm - Link - Report abuse +2
  • DemonTree

    “You sometimes need to add DemonTree to you notorious list...”

    I only troll the trolls. Did I make you squeak in rage? ;)

    And I recognise as government whoever actually governs. Sorry if that's too pragmatic for you. The US and UK are happy to take payment of debts from dictators, sell them weapons and sign deals with them. Why should Russia be any different?

    I too hope there will be no bloodbath, but I'm cynical it will ever serve to water the tree of liberty. Violence in Iraq, Afghanistan and Libya simply led to more violence. And Venezuela will need a hell of a lot of rebuilding, even if they manage a peaceful transition of power.

    Jan 30th, 2019 - 09:56 pm - Link - Report abuse -3
  • Chicureo


    “And I recognise as government whoever actually governs. Sorry if that's too pragmatic for you.”

    No, I don't think you're a troll, just suffering from the mindset of your generation, just as I am by my own. .plus, as I've mentioned several times, I detest Marxists.

    If you've taken any notice, Venezuela is so poor, so desperate, and in such a mess that many people are eating out of garbage cans. Zoos are being broken into so that starving Venezuelan can eat the animals. Hospitals are short of basic medical supplies, like gloves and soap. People desperately wait in long lines for food. Women are actually being voluntary sterilized to avoid pregnancy, as the nation descends into a socialist hellhole. The level of hunger has become so terrible that the well educated, including children, have now resorted to prostitution to obtain groceries. For burials, caskets have become too expensive; families are burying their loved ones in plastic bags. Oh, and let’s not forget the return of polio in Venezuela.

    Maduro and his criminal government is guilty of crimes against humanity. Marxism at its almost evil worst. My Venezuelan friends here in Chile told me a long time ago that the only solution is a violent overthrow, including lining up the leaders against a wall and shot. I agree with you that it will take a decade for the country to recover if they have a sound governance.

    Jan 31st, 2019 - 12:06 am - Link - Report abuse +3
  • Think

    ****“ Ohhhhhh..., and let’s not forget the return of polio in Venezuela.”***... my hermanito Shileno urges us to remember...

    O'Really..., says reality...:


    Jan 31st, 2019 - 12:23 am - Link - Report abuse -1
  • Chicureo

    Estimado THINK

    What I read was ”La Organización Panamericana de la Salud (OPS) reportó un caso de polio en un niño indígena de dos años en el este de Venezuela.” It seems the report was false.

    Any other comments?

    Jan 31st, 2019 - 12:43 am - Link - Report abuse +2
  • Think

    ***“ Any other comments? ”***

    Go easy on the Don Melchior...
    It greatly impairs ones reading capacities...

    Jan 31st, 2019 - 01:14 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DemonTree

    The polio report being false is at least one thing to be thankful for. But I do know Venezuela is falling apart and hope they can get rid of Maduro and elect a competent government. As for Russia, it's obvious Maduro needs to keep on their good side, possibly for an eventual escape but more immediately for their veto on the UN Security Council. Unfortunately, the more pressure the US puts on him, the more he will turn to Russia and China for support.

    Jan 31st, 2019 - 09:49 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo

    Live TV feed of Maduro supporters marching in support of their Socialist paradise.

    Jan 31st, 2019 - 06:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Jack Bauer

    The 20 tons of gold, worth US$ 840 million, taken by a Nordwind plane fom VZ, allegedly to Russia....never arrived in Russia....or so Russia claims......I'd say it went to Cuba. Sounds like Maduro is planning his escape.....and has already sent his loot on ahead...if he is not caught and lynched while trying to escape, he'll spend the rest of his days enjoying the beaches of Varadero.

    Regarding DT, we disagree on a few things, and agree to disagree on others, but to be fair, I think he's well intentioned. Our disagreements usually occur because of his high degree of idealism, and my more pragmatic view of reality....but he does not resemble Terryble Terry in any one could possibly be so f'g arrogant and stupid. And Brazzo is just stupid.

    Chicureo, a '91 Don Melchor ? Think you'll be opening it pretty soon...'salud'!.....As to “Think's” thoughtful concern that it might “impair one's reading capacity”, don't let that worry's just that he's probably not in the habit of drinking good wine....his usual 'plonk' might well cause some temporary brain damage.....he stares through the bottom of his empty glass and thinks he's looking through binoculars...

    Back in 2012, I remember I was at a friend's house in Alphaville (a very-upscale neighbourhood about 30 kms from the center of São Paulo) and he had a wine cellar worth a fortune, and after drinking a few bottles from one of his vertical selections of Don Melchor -1992,1993,1994 - just to compare the different vintages, we almost opened a Petrus....luckily I wasn't too far gone to realize it would be stupid to open a Petrus after drinking all we already had......when the bus driver is kicked out, I'll make sure to toast to his bad health....with 'cachaça'.

    Jan 31st, 2019 - 06:32 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DemonTree

    “never arrived in Russia”

    Now that's interesting. Maybe he really is planning his escape? Let's hope so.

    I just googled Petrus... bloody hell! But Think did say he doesn't drink any more, whether expensive wine or plonk. (Or whisky.) There's something to be said for an unclouded mind.

    Chicureo, did you see the article saying we've signed a deal with Chile to keep the same terms of trade after leaving the UK? A small amount of good news at least, and we'll still be able to import wine and avocados.

    Jan 31st, 2019 - 07:02 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • The Voice

    The UK is the largest market by far for Chilean wine.

    Idealists have been responsible for the worlds worst wars and conflicts. Pragmatists like Pinochet and Mandela are hated by idealists but in both cases saved more lives and set nations on more humane and sensible tracks.

    Jan 31st, 2019 - 07:54 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think


    ***”(Gold) never arrived in Russia”***..., an Anglo Turnip says above....!
    ***” (Gold) ever departed from Venezuela“***..., I ask meself...?
    - Any witness from this ”departure”...?
    - Nayirah II..., perhaps...?

    Jan 31st, 2019 - 08:03 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DemonTree


    UK is the third biggest market, but one can't expect facts from a Peronist. Note that this agreement only continues the status quo with Chile, it gives us no benefits compared to staying in the EU.

    As for Pinochet, you think murdering 3,000 people and imprisoning and/or torturing 37,000 more was humane? And drastic, sometimes disastrous economic experiments were sensible? Says it all!

    Most wars are started for very pragmatic reasons, for power, money, or both. And the only person I have heard hated Mandela was your idol Thatcher. Not very pragmatic.

    And when are you going to explain how less free trade is going to help the UK economy grow?

    Jan 31st, 2019 - 08:13 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo

    Estimado THINK
    Jack DemonTree

    Yes, her falseflag testimony is a part of our naval war college curriculum PSYOP studies. The Kuwaitis played it absolutely brilliantly against the US and the world. Never underestimate those desert nomads...

    There is a very good possibility that the gold shipment is a crafty ruse. Putin most probably has FSB or most likely IPA services to support Maduro.

    DT, Actually it was more than 3,500 dead and the 37,000 is an huge over exaggeration. You might want to consult my Argentine neighbors however about their statistics... and yes, as I have said before, it was a tragic event and almost everyone agrees it was terrible. I didn't like Allende either, but you have to admire his self sacrifice to make himself a martyr...

    Today the police intimidated Juan Guaidó's wife and child today. Something may happen soon. It will probably not be a peaceful transition...

    *****. Switching to something more entertaining... *****

    DT, You need a gold bar to pay for a case of Château Pétrus Bordeaux. I've never had any either. I'm told its a ridiculously esteemed Merlot blend. As you know, Chile and Argentina have great reds... (Chile's premiums include Almaviva, Errázuriz, Don Maximiano, Seña, Montes Clos Apalta...) but we typically buy by the case directly from the winery excellent reds averaging 4.000 a bottle, (about $6) and put them away. We buy our Sauvignon blanc from the supermarket for (about $4 on sale.)

    My friend who lives in San Juan always brings us a case of Chandon (Argentine Moët & Chandon) and sadly brainwashed “she who must be obeyed” on the barbaric mimosa. (Sangria however is prohibited in our home after an unfortunate event early in our marriage.)

    Considering the rarity, and considering you only can get 4 goblets per bottle, I will switch the group from the DM to a much lower price but outstanding 2010 Viña Arboleda Carménère from the Aconcagua Valley.

    Jan 31st, 2019 - 09:08 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think


    You people make me remember my time as a wine snob in Europe...

    Me Scandi missus and I had a more than sound ethyilic thirst in those early Beatles days...

    Cellar was stocked with several Brane-Cantenac vintage crates.. and enough Franciacorta spumante to throw a decent party anytime...

    - Back to my clacier water.... hmpfffffffffffff......

    Jan 31st, 2019 - 09:45 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DemonTree

    I don't think it's a competition on whose junta was worse. Even if he only murdered half that number one can't say Pinochet was humane, and whatever his faults Allende killed only himself. I got the figures from the article published today, about the murder of your former president Frei.

    And yes, almost everyone agrees it was terrible.

    As for Guaido, seems strange to me that he hasn't been arrested. What are they waiting for?

    Re wine, that was one thing that really was cheaper in Argentina and Chile (sadly the pound doesn't go as far as it used to). When you buy it in the UK half the cost is tax; it's bad value unless you spend a lot, and I probably wouldn't appreciate it if I did.

    What was the unfortunate Sangria-related event?

    You've reminded me how great the water was in Los Glaciares - just filling our bottles from streams. Getting back to 'civilisation' sucked.

    Jan 31st, 2019 - 10:03 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo

    Interesting, PetroChina Co plans to cancel the joint PDVSA agreement out of a 10 billion dollar petroleum refinery and petrochemical plant project in southern China. No news about a gold shipment...

    God of Bacchus... Chateau Brane-Cantenac Margaux! All I've ever had were cheap and mediocre Bordeaux...

    To balance a heavy bodied red you'll need some of the good stuff to balance the palate: goat cheese, jamon iberico, olives, avocado, fresh grapes and marraqueta bread. I'm forbidden to imbibe the hard stuff, but there will be an open bottle of Venezuelan Carupano Anejo rum for the savages gifted me last year.

    DemonTree, my advice to a young man is if your want to learn one thing about the female gender, it is that they selectively remember with laser sharpness about every perceivable negative event. Getting wasted on sangria and opening up my bravado at my future in-laws resulted in a self imposed Dante's Hell. It was a warm day and the sangria was delicious. I blamed it on the drink and vowed never to drink it again.

    Yes, the news about Eduardo Frei Montalva came as a shock to us here. As you get older, you realize how little you understand the world you live in.

    I saw the news about the UK Chile agreement, we ship you avocados and the UK sends us beautifully maintained frigates. What a deal!

    Jan 31st, 2019 - 11:18 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    Mr. DemonTree...
    “Getting back to 'civilisation' sucked.”.... you say...
    I know what ya mean... Post Trail Blues the young ones call it nowadays...
    One of me grandchilds got a serious case of it after our last years winter stroll in Huayhuash...;-) ... Shicureo...
    Well..., you are still in time to fill that giant black hole in your enological universe..., hermanito...
    *** El Margó es de lo mejó... ***

    Honest..., Guv'...

    Feb 01st, 2019 - 01:25 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DemonTree

    Getting drunk at the in-laws - lol, oops. :) My bad sangria memory is actually of my Mum drinking it; it was our first real holiday abroad, a week in Menorca, and we went to some event that had free sangria. It's the only time I've seen her really drunk, and as a child the sudden responsibility of having to look after everyone with no sober adult in charge was very scary.

    I have my own embarrassing booze stories now, but not from drinking sangria.

    Wow. Did you do the trek?! How old are you really?

    Feb 01st, 2019 - 10:23 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo

    Estimado THINK

    Where in the hell did you figure that one out? I never commanded a vessel, but I retired from the reserve with one wide stripe and I'm the only reserve officer of my navy to have served “aboard” the HMS Ferret. If you can access my bio, you'll see me in my former glory.


    I love to talk about wine, but my health today severely restricts my consumption.

    Feb 01st, 2019 - 01:05 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Jack Bauer

    @Chicureo, DT
    Seems “Stink” is skeptical at the possibility of Maduro stealing 20 tons of gold...all depends whether one is prepared to believe Jose Guerra's accusation or not....but being a former Central Bank economist, and lawmaker, having ties with CB officials, makes it credible, until shown otherwise. But it wouldn't be the first time a dictator flees his country, taking a “small” reserve to guarantee a comfortable retirement.

    We didn't open that Petrus, but quite frankly, and as you implied, the price does not mean it's any better than a Don Maximiano Founder's Reserve, at a fraction of the price....unfortunately, the high taxation in Brazil, plus the importers'/middlemen's profits, makes the FOB price increase about 5 times, but you don't have to spend fortunes to drink good wine. The Montes Alfa cabernet sauvignon, or the Alta Helena cab sauv, both from the Colchagua Valley, and even less expensive, are delicious. A few years back I had a sauv blanc of Clava Quintay, and was surprised at its similarity with NZ's. Does Chile import any NZ sauv blanc ? When I was in Santiago 5 years ago, didn't see any in the wine shops.
    Luckily, nothing - except the prices of some - restricts mine.

    Feb 01st, 2019 - 04:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo


    Unlike Brazil, Chile really doesn't have a high import duty on wine, but we Chileans are very price sensitive. We have excellent wine at relatively cheap prices. Like throughout the world, Chile has recently exposed wine counterfeiting and buyers need to be skeptical of “special offers” on the internet. (An empty bottle super premium, like Don Maximiano Founder's Reserve can easily be sold for more than US7 according to a recent article.)

    The real Don Maximiano is 67 % Cabernet Sauvignon, 15% Carmenere, 8% Malbec, 7% Petit Verdot and 3 % Cabernet Franc according to their website, but a crafty counterfeiter can easily refill it with an average Merlot.

    As I said, we buy case lots directly from the wineries at a significant discount, but I stopped buying the premiums a few years ago.

    My wife last purchased at the Jumbo supermarket Cono Sur, Sauvignon Blanc, Casablanca on sale at about US4.50 a bottle. We eat a lot of seafood.

    Feb 01st, 2019 - 05:55 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DemonTree

    That picture Think posted was your rank in the navy? I googled it, but it doesn't really explain anything.

    And it's a shame about your health, but you've mentioned several times having a glass of wine in your hand, so i assume you can still enjoy it now and then?

    I don't understand why anyone would spend so much on a bottle of wine. You could probably live on that for a year in Brazil!

    Feb 01st, 2019 - 06:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    Ref. the Nayirah affaire...
    ***“ The Kuwaitis played it absolutely brilliantly against the US and the world. Never underestimate those desert nomads... ”***..., you say...
    Didn't know that Hill+Knowlton were sandniggas..., I say...

    Ref. Your rank...
    ***“ Where in the hell did you figure that one out?”*** ..., you ask...
    Well..., as you were drooling heavily about second hand Engrish frigates just above..., I thought I could just as well promote you to captain of one...
    Ain't it so you operate in the military...?

    Mr. DemonTree...
    What has age to do with taking a walk in the hills with the family...?

    Feb 01st, 2019 - 08:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DemonTree

    All this talk about wine is making me feel ignorant. Where do you even learn this stuff?

    ”With a length of about 130km (81mi) and elevations as high as 5,490m (18,012ft), trekking the Cordillera Huayhuash is not for the faint of heart.”

    Feb 01st, 2019 - 08:29 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    Wishwash..., Huayhuash is a piece of cake...
    But...,there ain't that many No.8 molecules around at ~5,000 metres ...
    Nothing a week acclimatisation in Cusco and a pound of Coca leaves can't remediate..., though...

    Feb 01st, 2019 - 09:13 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DemonTree

    I noticed the thinner air going up Etna, and that was only going from ~2000-3000m. Maybe some coca leaves would have helped? Trying to keep up with 3 fit young - and tall - students didn't. I think I'm starting to get old. :(

    Anyway, my grandma can barely walk to the shops, and she's the only grandparent I've got left.

    Feb 01st, 2019 - 09:29 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo

    Estimado THINK

    I suspected you somehow accessed my bio, but it's not available, even for your formidable skills. Although never having command of a vessel, your conjecture is correct. (My final rank was sort a pre-retirement gift.)

    It's foolish to underestimate those tribes of Semites symbolized by a crescent or star. I partially disagree however, because those ultra-wealthy “sandniggas” were extremely intelligent in quickly selecting their counter offense. (They have an office here in Santiago, and yes my government has used them as well, as they're exceptionally effective.) You'll then know probably their unofficial motto: “When sorrows come, they come not single spies, but in battalions” Those white collar diabolical mercenaries wrote the book on counterintelligence. Real bastards!


    Join a wine club or form one yourself. Try everything cheap and reasonably priced. Find the cépage you enjoy and will probably discover something special you personally like. Never drink wine with a vinegar dressed salad.

    Extremely rarely I'll have dram of the hard stuff. Growing up in a family that always had wine on the table with the exception of the Lenten season and it was perfectly acceptable for a 13 year old to be served wine. Pisco however was forbidden in my parent's home.

    I had some challenging health problems for awhile, but now my “Trouble and Strife” strictly rations my intake and I'm generally limited to moderate drinking and caloric intake. She' a wonderful lifelong partner but despotic as Mephistopheles.

    I was commissioned as a NATO equivalent rank of OF-1, actively served as high as an OF-4, then in the reserves as an OF-5 and finally retiring as an OF-6. My command for the most part my career was a desk. The only premeditated homicide I ever considered was of José Toribio Merino, but so many of us daydreamed of that glory.

    Feb 01st, 2019 - 09:51 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    Don't be paranoid Shicureo...

    How could an auld..., humble Patagonian socialdemocrat access any form of advanced encrypted Shilean military database...?

    Just a lucky shot..., or maybe a bit of conjecture inductive conclusive deductive reasoning...

    Like some years ago..., when I “guessed” the race & colour of both hounds from that other commander in here...: Mr. DoveoverDover...

    He wasn't very comfortable with that trick...

    Chuckle..., chuckle...

    Feb 01st, 2019 - 10:31 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DemonTree

    I've begun by looking in the cupboard and opening a dusty Chilean Merlot from 2010 (shows how often I drink wine). What do you do with the rest of the bottle, though? I find it never tastes as good the next day.

    My parents always let us try their drinks as kids, but none of us liked any of them. Advocaat was the vilest and I still hate it. Sadly I didn't get into drinking until I tried alcopops; those abominations must've been invented solely to appeal to children.

    “Never drink wine with a vinegar dressed salad.”


    “I'm generally limited to moderate drinking and caloric intake.”

    Oh well. I'm sure it's good for you. :)

    “My command for the most part my career was a desk.”

    Did you never get to fight, then? Was that disappointing or a good thing? My boss was in the air force, an engineer but he did go to Iraq and get shot at. He also served in the Falklands.

    So what can you 'guess' about me or JB?

    Feb 01st, 2019 - 10:35 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo

    Estimado THINK

    I have exceptionally good reason to be paranoid with you. Your ideological beliefs are an antithesis of mine, yet we surprising agree on numerous subjects. And yes, almost anything is accessible by many on a “secure” database. Anything! (Even my Dackel is suspicious of you!)


    I never served in an active theater of operations, but we constantly were involved in assisting strategic scenarios. I had for example a very high respect for the Peruvian navy, but was always involved in how we could best rapidly kill them. I was a cold blooded disciple of Carl von Clausewitz.

    If the dusty 2010 Merlot from 2010 is opened up to breathe for awhile and you serve it with cheese to enhance the palate. (Just as fatty foods like reds and meat, for example.) Combining acidic foods destroys the palate and you lose the ability to discern wine flavor. (The solution to a whole bottle is to enjoy it with a friend.)

    Seafood is the exception and lemon is obviously allowed, but generally balanced with butter or cheese. One of the great treasures of Chile is machas la parmesana, which are razor clams lightly roasted with melted Parmesan style cheese with a spray of lemon and chilled white wine.

    Sometimes we just have melon with slices of jamón ibérico and wine for dinner on hot days. Don't fall for the wine snobs that try to fool you with wine parings. In your country, I was informed by a pretentious waiter that I should not have my lamb with a heavy Bordeaux. It's unfortunate, but restaurants will normally sucker you with expensive wine. The best rule for ordering from a wine list is to choose the second cheapest. (there are exceptions however if you have an expense account and wanting to impress your guest)

    Feb 01st, 2019 - 11:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    Dear hermanito Shileno...

    IF my ideological beliefs are an antithesis of yours..., yet we surprising agree on numerous subjects as we do..., you should begin suspecting yourself..., as your Dackel already does...

    Just have a look at the despective way he looks at you..., dark-skinned Mischling...;-)))

    Feb 02nd, 2019 - 01:32 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • :o))

    The New Beijing-Moscow Axis:

    “Never against each other”: China+Russia have put aside longstanding tensions to cooperate & counter the U.S.:

    TO: USA & Co: Isn't it time to change your diapers?

    FROM: The Wall Street Journal:

    Feb 02nd, 2019 - 02:24 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo

    Estimado THINK

    Gott im Himmel! Now you have me suspicious, as I'm today noticing how my Herrenrasse Dackel does closely monitor my activities with the sharp eyes of the Sicherheitsdienst. Scheisse!


    Actually the Chinese are at least pretending to allow serious concessions to the Trump trade negotiation team. Yesterday, they announced as a good will gesture to immediately buy 5m tons of soybeans a day...

    ...the Russians are none to happy with the Americans withdrawing from the nuclear arms control treaty alarming even the Chinese. (Yes, Putin gave a strong counter reaction, but it's only scaring the Eurocrats..)

    Feb 02nd, 2019 - 06:11 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    Guuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuter Hund...
    The Brazilians have them boys from Brazil...
    The Shileans..., the teckels from Maule...
    And you surely call it “Otto” or “Fritz”...
    Chuckle..., chuckle...

    Feb 02nd, 2019 - 06:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DemonTree

    Well, Chile is supposed to be the Prussia of South America, right?

    Feb 02nd, 2019 - 09:50 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    Ermmmmmmmmm.... Nope...
    That was Bolivia...

    Feb 02nd, 2019 - 10:48 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo


    Don't trust THINK's diabolical propaganda. He's even eluded that my uber Dackel suspects me. Now when he growls I now feel inexplicably paranoid.

    The Chilean navy is/was/will always be modeled after our British heritage. The Almirante Cochrane, 10th Earl of Dundonald, named by Napoleon as Le Loup des Mers and greatest naval hero other than Horatio Nelson, founded my navy.

    Arguably, our airforce has been strongly influenced by the USA especially when you note we have lots and lots of those F-16 Fighting Falcons.

    But when you refer to our army, well just take a watch of the following and make your own decision.

    We encouraged the Aryans to settle in our southern lake district and in places like Frutillar, and it looks like Bavaria. (Their influence around San Carlos de Bariloche on the other side of the Andes is nearly identical.)

    Feb 02nd, 2019 - 11:42 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    By the way..., hermanito Shileno...

    You that profess such a luuuuuv and interest for the descendants of the tribes of Reuben, Simeon, Levi, Judah, Dan, Naphtali, Gad, Asher, Issachar, Zebulun, Joseph and Benjamin in Argentina....
    Have you read the last news about the chantapufi & putañero Nisman's case...?
    I will be expecting an apology from you to the memory of late Hector Timerman...., soon...., very soon...

    Feb 03rd, 2019 - 12:01 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DemonTree

    Seems like good choices of who to model the respective branches on. But I've never understood why Chile and Argentina wanted to let a bunch of Nazis move in. Also, I don't like that grey uniform at all.

    Have they learned something new about the Nisman case?

    Feb 03rd, 2019 - 12:29 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    Mr. DemonTree...
    I concord with you. Black is way classier...

    Feb 03rd, 2019 - 01:28 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DemonTree

    I wonder if that's why so many people seem to have a thing for them, or if it's just because of who wore them?

    Feb 03rd, 2019 - 09:56 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo


    “Hugo Chávez was proposing to solve the problems of twentieth century socialism, and claimed to be offering something different—the Bolivarian version of “twenty-first century socialism.” This would be the “socialism with a human face” and quite unlike the repressive, totalitarian bureaucratic behemoth of Marxist-Leninism. As Chavista Gregory Wilpert insisted in his 2007 book Changing Venezuela by Taking Power, under Bolivarian socialism “ownership and control of the means of production must be collective and democratic.” Cooperatives were to play a large part in this and, after 2006, so would the local communal councils.”


    I prefer my Anglophile influenced uniform. Lots of tasteful gold braid and buttons... Arguably, the greatest historical naval doctrine was British and without doubt the greatest military organization was Prussian. Things have changed, but traditions strongly continue in Latin America. (Your new redesigned “No. 4 dress” naval uniform looks “metrosexual” to me, but that's the idea I guess... )

    Most Nazis ended up in Argentina and Brazil. Juan Perón was a enormous admirer of Hitler's and Mussolini's Fascism. Germany. He served as a military observer in those countries prior to WWII. You need to remember however Latin America became a haven for the diaspora of Jews fleeing Europe when the USA actually refused many of them entry.

    Feb 03rd, 2019 - 05:56 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DemonTree

    Is that this uniform?

    I don't know about metrosexual, but it does look a lot like mechanic's overalls. Apparently they got rid of the buttons because they were uncomfortable under body armour.

    “Latin America became a haven for the diaspora of Jews fleeing Europe when the USA actually refused many of them entry.”

    That just makes it even weirder. And the USA prefers to ban Muslims now. The more things change...

    Feb 03rd, 2019 - 08:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    Shicureo..., hermanito Shileno...

    When the young Engrish DemonTree lad confronts you with the dictatorship deaths..., you point him east.., saying that we Argies killed far more than you...

    When the young Engrish DemonTree lad asks you about the immigration of Nazi escapees..., you point him east..., saying that we Argies took many more in than you...

    Remember..., when telling the Young Engrish Demontree lad about Jewish immigration to the Southern Cone..., to point him east and tell him that we Argies let many..., many..., many more in than you...

    You seem to have some unresolved issues with us Argies..., hermanito...
    Would it help if I..., as your big Argentinean brother..., gave you permission to set aside your inferiority complex for a moment..., relax and feel almost equal to us...?

    As you were..., commander....;-)

    Feb 03rd, 2019 - 08:54 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Jack Bauer

    I found the good wines in Chile inexpensive compared to Bzl...a D. Maximiano here costs US$ 150,00....not exactly an everyday wine. I've drank a lot of Cono Sur's wine, and I'm sure your familiar with Emiliana - their Gewurtztraminer is really pleasant .

    Re Alm. Cochrane, have read 16 books on him, a really impressive character ' n leader.

    Athough I've had the opportunity to drink some great (and expensive) wines, I wouldn't normally buy them....and just because they're expensive does not mean they'll always please you. When I used to work, 'n money was plentiful I'd take advantage of the very low taxes in the US and always bring back a few bottles of the top wines. Would never buy them here (now).
    If you really want to learn a bit about wine, before you take any course for beginners, may I recommend you read “Wine for Dummies” (by Ed McCarthy & Mary Ewing Mulligan)'s a very easy to understand introduction to the world of wine, claryfing many misconceptions and explaining what at first sight may seem complicated.....after this, and a few courses, you've got to drink....Start with the cheaper wine, then gradually become more ambitious..... vary regions, grapes etc...eventually you'll find what you like most, but with good wine, that could be a lot.. Don't give up, eventually it'll become 2nd nature.
    A common misconception : drink only red wine with beef, and white wines white's only a general rule, as has quite a few exceptions....however, a recommendation : don't drink red wine with sea fish. The secondary label usually mentions what food the wine harmonizes with.
    There are several ways to conserve wine from one day to the next, but it's never going to be as good as an hour after it's been opened and has 'breathed'.....the reason is that it oxidizes. I've found the best way is to cork it again 'n put it in the fridge....but one bottle ? do the ultimate sacrifice 'n drink it all ....if you can't, use what remains for cooking.

    Feb 03rd, 2019 - 10:27 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo


    Yes, that's the f-cking awful uniform. The Royal Navy wearing a Francophile beret?
    Both Lord Nelson and Cochrane must be “rolling in their tombs.”

    (Regarding my post below to THINK:
    You'll understand my jealousy.)

    Google the “MS St. Louis” to know how poorly the Jewish refugees endured.
    Anti-Semitism was very strong in the USA at the time.

    I sincerely have a great respect for educated Arabs. They actually saved ancient Western Culture during the Dark Ages. The problem is when you massively relocate them into a peaceful Western society and why right wing political candidates are winning in Sweden. Note their statistics for the Scandinavian paradise:
    - 7840 rapes last year, with half of victims being children
    - 2nd most reported rapes in the world (key word reported)
    - 1457 cars set on fire in 2017
    - 116 grenade attacks last 8 years
    - an obscene number of girls genitally mutilated
    - Record number of fatal shootings last year
    ...That's just Sweden...

    (Chile, like many Latin countries, have assimilated a small number post gulf war immigrants and they're doing fine. (key words: small number)

    Estimado Think

    From a wee lad, I've always been jealous of my neighbors across the border. Their strikingly beautiful women vacationing on our beaches, your big impressive Ford Falcons, the incredible culture of Buenos Aires... Your schools consistently humiliated our rugby team and of course, Argentine beef really is extraordinary.

    In fact, your navy is the genesis of why I became a naval cadet and was quickly promoted through the ranks. The fearsome ARA was a major threat for our decrepit inferior flotilla and young men in fluent English were given the red carpet as we were intensely allied to the Royal Navy. I joined because my parents were fairly financially insolvent at the time and I anticipated the adventure. I never imagined or desired being assigned the lackluster signal corps.

    Feb 03rd, 2019 - 10:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    Dear hermanito Shileno...

    You write above...:
    ”- I sincerely have a great respect for educated Arabs..., blah..., blah..., blah...
    - The problem is when you massively relocate them into..., blah..., blah..., blah...
    - Note the statistics for the (Swedish) Scandinavian paradise...,Lots of blah..., blah and then..., your usual “Pièce de Résistance”...:

    My -(spoiler alert!)- TRICK -(spoiler alert!)- question is...:
    What do educated (or otherwise) ARABS have to do with the genital mutilation of girls in Sweden...???

    Feb 04th, 2019 - 03:12 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo

    Estimado Think

    I assume you know about the crime problem in Malmö, but the FGM statistics are profane. (And yes, bla, bla, bla... my church consistently hid priests that raped small boys, so there is evil in all religions...)

    Google “Sweden female genital mutilation”. One example:

    My country obviously has better things than yours... Our seafood is a perfect example. Another of course is our independent central bank. Your country is like a fabulous state of the art Ferrari Testarossa with terrible drivers and mechanics to operate it.

    Regarding Timerman, as you know, I always had great respect for his father. It was very unjust for the USA to deny his son early medical treatment.


    Good advice. Don Maximiano here is roughly $60. Santa Emiliana makes terrific wines. Their better reds go for the $4-6 range by the case.

    As you know, Cochrane’s exploits were the inspiration for C.S. Forester’s Hornblower, Patrick O’Brian’s novels and the film “Master and Commander”, great stuff!

    Did you know that many historians believe Cochrane was secretly planning at one time to rescue Napoleon from Saint Helena island?

    Feb 04th, 2019 - 01:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    I repeat the question for my hermanito Shileno...

    What do educated (or otherwise) ARABS have to do with the genital mutilation of girls in Sweden...???
    The key word here being...: ***“ARABS”*** ***“ A R A B S ”***

    To make it even clearer to you...:
    What do educated (or otherwise) ARABS have to do with the genital mutilation of girls in Sweden..., practised mostly..., in its most brutal variations..., by the Somali (~70.000)..., Afghani (~50.000)..., Kurd (~50.000)..., Eritrean (~40.000) and Ethiopian (~20.000) communities...?

    By the way...:
    The least brutal form of female genital mutilation practised by a minority of racially Arab..., bad Muslim families is quite comparable with the male genital mutilation endured by most Yanks...

    If you know what that is...

    Feb 04th, 2019 - 03:46 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo

    Estimado Think
    The omnipresent Wikipedia defines a large part of whom I'm referring to burning cars in Sweden. You can google the videos and see they're almost all with that lighter brown skinned adherents to Allah. (It was not those ebony skinned Muslims from central Africa and it was certainly not the Semites that practice male infant circumcision.)

    You can google the videos and see they're almost all with that lighter brown skinned adherents to Allah. But you're very correct that the practice is not exclusive to Arabs alone. I'm not aware however of any Lutherans guilty, but Swedish statistics officially don't classify by race or religion.

    It's probably a cultural paradox for most of we Western thinkers that tolerate Judaism male genital mutilation, but find female genital mutilation abhorrent.

    So tell me THINK, what is your opinion and perspective?

    Feb 04th, 2019 - 06:18 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Jack Bauer

    Yeah, I'm familiar with Cochrane's interest is not only because he was a great man b4 his time..

    @DT (“Bzls 1st lady..”)
    Altho haven’t seen the Atibaia kitchen, budget was reportedly US$ 70,000, but apptly cost 1/3 less. Estadão link refers to the triplex inspection carried out by the Federal Police in 2016…at least 1, perhaps 2 yrs after it came under suspicion.

    By the state of the kitchen, with only the (“Kitchen’s”) custom-made cupboards installed (still covered in plastic) leads me to believe they were in the middle of the process, when work on it had to be halted, end 2014, leaving it unfinished.

    The reform started only after the construction of the Condo had been concluded, which reinforces the fact it was being done specifically for the future owner who, if not Lula, why not come forward to claim ownership ?

    The fridge cost R$ 8,037….3 times the price of a good one, like I bought 5/6 years ago. The bedrooms were furnished with beds/bunks, in line with any beach house. The elevator was obviously a very specific item to attend someone’s personal taste…the future owner's ?
    'n why would Marisa L go to the bother of supervising a reform for someone else ?
    But I suppose this all sounds absolutely normal to you.

    Dirceu got out because Toffoli, Lewandoski, Mendes (3/5ths of STF’s 2nd group) conceded him a HC…Lula’s dozens of HCs were rejected by the majority of the STF’s Plenary (11 judges). They weren't convicted for identical crimes. Why compare apples ‘n oranges ?

    The principle of a “freedom of access to information” law, was announced in the '88 Constitution (which PT refused to co-sign); in 2008 due to UN pressure for countries to adopt such a law, Dilma in 2011 signed another, # 12.527/11, regulating / modifying previous laws on the matter, i.e. it revoked # 11.111/05 ‘n parts of others (from 91).
    Yr link was just a bunch of photos (?), but B’s alterations in no way reduce the possibility of scrutinizing Govt accts.

    Feb 04th, 2019 - 06:38 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    Hermanito Shileno...

    If you wish to attack them Muslim Sandniggas... you don't need to use no false arguments... there are plenty perfectly good true ones around...

    - What my opinion and perspective is about what...???
    Fe/male genital mutilation...???
    Basically...: ***“Cada quién puede hacer de SU culo un florero”***
    (“Cada quién” being a consenting, informed adult deciding over her/himself..., of course)

    Feb 04th, 2019 - 07:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DemonTree

    Our army has worn berets for ages, so I don't see the problem.

    Re your link, I encountered the golf sauce on pizza and was appropriately baffled. There was also something called 'salsa inglesa', which turned out to be Worcestershire sauce. And I liked the dulce de leche - I have a sweet tooth.

    And FGM as commonly practised is not at all equivalent to male circumcision. But you do realise they'd cut up their daughters whether they're in Sweden or their home countries? Does changing the location make their crime worse?

    The fact there are so very many variables, plus the snobbish waiters etc is what puts me off. And I could drink the whole bottle, but I'm trying to be healthier. My friends mostly stick to beer or prosecco.

    Re Dirceu vs Lula, the former was convicted of more than one crime, and got a longer sentence than Lula, so it seems suspicious it was Dirceu who was able to get a HC.

    I looked up the freedom of information law, and found the references to previous ones, but they're all too long to easily work out what the difference is. Don't know what happened to my link, I'll try again:

    It says B's change will make it much easier to label documents secret and prevent them being scrutinised.

    Feb 04th, 2019 - 08:00 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    By the way..., hermanito Shileno...

    You say above...:
    ***“But you're very correct that the practice is not exclusive to Arabs alone... I'M NOT AWARE HOWEVER OF ANY LUTHERANS GUILTY...”***

    If me frail and weak memory doesn't decieve me..., I think that...:
    - ***“As recent as the 1950s, clitoridectomy was practiced in Western Europe and the United States to treat perceived ailments including hysteria, epilepsy, mental disorders, masturbation, nymphomania and melancholia. In other words, the practice of FGM has been followed by many different peoples and societies across the ages and continents.”***

    Well... the fifties are just some sixty short years ago... How old is it you where...?
    In simple Patagonian words..., the above means that Western doctors easily could have cut your mom's clit if she was depressed..., horny or just rebellious...

    The good..., not so auld Lutheran times...

    Feb 04th, 2019 - 09:13 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo

    Both of you, I concede...

    Armies have worn berets for ages, British sailors not.

    American's call 'salsa inglesa' (we call 'salsa golf') is thousand island.

    “Does changing the location make their crime worse?”

    Frankly continuing the debate with DemonTree and THINK is like reasoning between Pharisees and Philistines.

    Deleting the subject… ░░░░░░░░░░░░░ 98% complete...

    Feb 04th, 2019 - 10:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think


    You surely meant to write..:
    “Frankly continuing the debate with DemonTree and THINK is like reasoning between Pharisees and Sadducees....”

    Philistines were a whole different game alltogether... ( and they did not practice circumcision...;-)

    Feb 04th, 2019 - 11:39 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo

    Pharisees and Philistines. (I spell checked for the proper English spelling.)
    Do you know why Jesus spoke with the Pharisees? To expose their hypocrisy.

    I refer to a Philistine, inhabitants of Philistia, as an adjective, a person who is lacking in or hostile or indifferent to cultural values. They were also the sworn ancient enemies of the tribes of Israelites.

    Pharisees and Sadducees were of the same group of Semites who's contentious quarrels were one of the reasons Titus retook and destroyed much of Jerusalem and the Second Temple. Still now in 2019 their successors are just as quarrelsome and intolerant.

    Feb 05th, 2019 - 12:52 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    Yeahhhh..., yeahhh..., yeahhh...
    Jesus from Chicureo exposing Engrish Mr. DemonTree hypocrisy..., I see...

    Speaking about them Engrish and their new Navy uniform you dismiss as being “metrosexual”...
    Do you even know how a metrosexual Navy uniform looks like...?
    That's how...:

    Feb 05th, 2019 - 01:13 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo

    Only the Français of la Marine Nationale could wear such a ridiculous uniform, the École Navale no one should get into a bar fight with one as they'll probably get their ass kicked. They only admit the best and the brightest into the École Navale and they are highly competent.

    Feb 05th, 2019 - 02:47 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DemonTree

    Now THAT is a metrosexual uniform. But which of us is supposed to be the Philistine and which the Pharisee?

    Feb 05th, 2019 - 10:19 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    Shicureo..., hermano...
    Don't be such a Momio...!
    The Frogs are never ridiculous... they are Avant-Garde...
    Lok at all those world personalities wearing French Navy History...
    Doubt you will find many a famous person wearing a Shilean Pickelhaube...;-)

    Don't dispair if you don't know who the above portrayed people are... just ask your sweet..., french educated missus...;-)

    Feb 05th, 2019 - 11:12 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DemonTree

    “The Frogs are never ridiculous... they are Avant-Garde...”

    Some people might say those are one and the same. :)

    Apparently the Swedes also wear Pickelhaube:

    Feb 05th, 2019 - 01:04 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo

    Señor Pharisee and Mr. Philistine

    The pointy hat is an army fetish, our navy leans towards Anglophile fashion.

    As I said, anyone should dare criticize the uniform Français of la Marine, they should realize the wearer will kick their ass.

    Brigitte Bardot and Audrey Hepburn wore them fabiously!

    Feb 05th, 2019 - 01:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DemonTree

    Ah, so I'm the one lacking culture. Probably went to the wrong school.

    The pointy hat doesn't seem very practical, but it does have a certain style. Which do you like best?

    Feb 05th, 2019 - 01:39 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think


    Standing on one leg..., El Think..., the elder Patagonian fariseo..., says to you...:
    ***“What is hateful to you, do not do to your fellow”***..., that is the whole story..., the rest is blah..., blah..., blah..., go and learn... (Shab. 31a)

    (So truth that the young Jesus ladadopted it later..., hermanito...)

    Feb 05th, 2019 - 01:46 pm - Link - Report abuse +1
  • Chicureo

    Estimado THINK

    (DemonTree, I had to google it because I am also a Philistine...)

    “That which is hateful to you, do not do to your fellow.”

    ...and it seems Jesus did embrace the philosophy.

    ...wise sage...

    ...thinking of which...

    On the wall of the HMS Ferret' officer's mess, that struck me was:

    ”Never look to the uniform to find the man. The man makes the uniform, not the other way around. A uniform confers no knowledge, no excellence, it is the person underneath that adds value to the trappings. Honors or uniforms — they are a costume designed to broadcast a message, regardless of whether that message is true or not. A man’s actions, his contributions define him. This is an exhortation to never forget that who you are doesn’t matter, only what you do matters. So chase the beauty of accomplishment, do something rather than try to be something, and never evaluate a man by his epaulets.”

    Feb 05th, 2019 - 02:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    A bit loooong but basically right...
    Them Engrish surely embraced that wisdom from the greatest (Western) naval commander of all times...:
    Admiral Michiel Adriaenszoon de Ruyter...

    Feb 05th, 2019 - 04:25 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DemonTree

    Ah, the modern world, allowing anyone to pretend knowledge of any subject. (I googled it too.) Maybe it's true that I lack knowledge, but I'm not hostile to culture. Just was always more interested in science than the arts.

    And your quote sounds like good advice, just as Think's does.

    Never heard of him. Where do you come up with these things?

    Feb 05th, 2019 - 05:05 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    Friend of the family... ;-)

    Feb 05th, 2019 - 05:17 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo

    Estimado THINK

    You continue to surprise me.

    I'm apparently a Philistine because I had no knowledge regarding “The Raid on the Medway” especially since I graduated by my country's war college. I even have a book of Samuel Pepys...

    I'm also struck by Rudyard Kipling's poem, the first stance being:

    “If wars were won by feasting,
    Or victory by song,
    Or safety found in sleeping sound,
    How England would be strong!
    But honour and dominion
    Are not maintained so.
    They're only got by sword and shot
    And this the Dutchmen know!”


    Glad you appreciated the brilliant quote from your own countrymen.

    It's not your lack of education, but I do question some aspects of the moral Western ideological culture of both you and THINK.

    (And without google, I'd be as dumb as a rock.)

    Feb 05th, 2019 - 05:31 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DemonTree

    Show off. ;)

    You think we're too soft on the enemy du jour? Wanting to let the modern versions of the MS St. Louis land?

    Feb 05th, 2019 - 05:46 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo


    A long time ago I emphasized that although I strongly disagreed with you, I respected your right to disagree. (Yes, I know its a cliché.)

    Other than a naval commando, no self respecting British sailor should be using a beret. It's a moral affront to naval tradition. Obviously it's the touchstone of what is the decline of the once glorious RN.

    Meanwhile, it looks right now that your PM is about to incur a modern day Waterloo.

    Feb 05th, 2019 - 06:07 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think


    How strange that an Anglo and a Anglophile never heard of Engelands “most serious defeat it has ever had in its home waters”..., as Engrish historians put it.............

    Anyhow..., as I have said in here before..., that Engrish Admiral who has the dishonour of beeing the first naval commander in history to bombard a defenceless civilian town..., is not precisely my cup of tea...

    Just off the top of my head..., Shicureo...:
    De Ruyter never bombed no defenceless civilian town...
    De Ruyter started sailing at a much younger age than Nelson...
    De Ruyter fought..., commanded and won (specially against Engeland) more battles than Nelson...
    De Ruyter sailed ~ 20 years longer than Nelson...
    It took a mother fkucker cannonball to finish De Ruyter... It took a little bullet to finish Nelson...

    Feb 05th, 2019 - 06:14 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DemonTree

    Britain won WWI, but it was the beginning of the end for our empire. It would have been better for us to avoid the war altogether, and it surely was avoidable. Sometimes force is required but that doesn't mean we should be eager to resort to it.

    As for May, it's her own for for not taking a decisive path early on. By trying to please everybody she has ended up pleasing nobody and has lead us right up to disaster - and still shows no signs of turning back.

    We have a lot of history, and a LOT of wars. But in fact, the national curriculum at the time covered almost no history between the middle ages and 1914. I learned equally nothing about Britain's most famous naval victory.

    As for your 'first to bombard...' I find that highly unlikely. There were few rules of war in the old days. And the rest of your comparison doesn't mean a lot.

    Feb 05th, 2019 - 06:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    I wrote “Shicureo” at the top of my comparison list..., didn't I...?
    Things have different meanings for different folks..., ya know...?

    Feb 05th, 2019 - 06:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Jack Bauer

    With wine, the more you study, the more you realize how little you know....there are 100s of thousands of commercial labels in the world, not to mention the homemade stuff. One more reason to study the basics, to tell the snobbish waiters where to get off. As a matter of fact, wine is healthier than beer ....besides not giving you a beer-belly, red wine is full of flavonoids (anti-oxidants), which vary depending on the grape, region it was cultivated...'n it's a drink that goes well with a meal, without giving you that bloated feeling....on the other hand, you should drink what you like (the best wine is the one you like) but remember, as the saying goes “life's too short to drink cheap wine” (presumably meaning 'plonk').

    I never said that Brazilian law was can get 40 years for corruption, but can be out in 5 years for murder.....

    Regarding the 'freedom of information' law, while it looks like more civil servants (than b4) will have the prerrogative to classify documents, there are two considerations that come to mind : one, to what extent will this (further) restriction of access (to govt information) really increase what was already classified, and two, I very much doubt that any restrictions will apply to the usual government stats on the economy 'n other things of common interest.
    Not everything that goes on in government needs to be public knowledge. And presume that the period a document is rated classfied, can be less than the maximum periods of 25 or 15 years. Mourão claims it will simplify the previous beaurocracy (involved in trying to classify a document) which does not necessarily mean that 'more' information will be restricted, or what is, will make all that much difference to the public, going about its daily afairs.

    Many current historians consider Cochrane a better commander than Nelson. In those days, glory was measured by the amount of blood 'n deaths...more blood, more glory. Lot of good it did Nelson.

    Feb 05th, 2019 - 07:03 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DemonTree

    So does it make you say anything other than 'so what'? Nelson was killed in his prime, it's hardly surprising De Ruyter was able to spend more years sailing and fought and won more battles. And Nelson was killed because he lead from the front, but even if DR did the same, I doubt there were snipers shooting at ship's officers in the 17th century, given the (in)accuracy of firearms back then.

    Makes sense, and I usually drink cider which probably isn't too healthy either. We had wine with most of our meals in Argentina, but it's a lot cheaper there so easier to try a variety. (Though not always easy to remember which we liked.)

    Re freedom of information, it probably depends more on the attitude of the government than the specifics of the law, but making it easier to classify a document is bound to result in more documents being classified. It certainly won't help transparency, and in Brazil that's sorely needed. Not stats. but details of bidding for contracts etc are what need a light shone on them.

    Feb 05th, 2019 - 07:30 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    Mr. DemonTree...

    How can one ever expect (bad) history not to repeat itself if one doesn't (want to) know history...?

    Feb 05th, 2019 - 07:39 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo

    Estimado THINK

    Artillery in the form of ballistas and catapults used to siege port cities seems to be used throughout history. The Battle of Carthage seems especially brutal, but who knows, perhaps the Guardian's slander of Nelson is partially true.

    Nelson seemed impossible to kill, he was wounded several times, lost the sight of one eye and one arm before being hit by a single slug. Certainly he had great publicists. Almost every British student can cite: “England expects that every man will do his duty”


    Historians would mostly disagree with your conjecture. Muskets were inaccurate, but they targeted officers whenever they could volley.


    I'm too predudicial as a Chilean to make that call, although I think Arturo Prat is highly overrated, whereas I greatly admire his enemy Miguel Grau Seminario, el Caballero de los Mares.

    In one of the Hornblower novels, our hero is assigned the Nelson funeral barge. It was so well written, I still clearly remember.

    Did you read “The Wine-Dark Sea” by Aubrey-Maturin? It's my favorite of the seris.

    Feb 05th, 2019 - 08:45 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Jack Bauer

    If you make a conscious decision to enter the world of wine, I don't think you'll regret it....surely Australian /NZ /SAF wine isn't all that expensive in the UK...and they have fantastic wines. How about the wine made in the UK, from grapes imported from wine producing countries ?.....there's plenty of wine in “bag-in-box”, which is good for beginners and avoids waste (opening and not finishing a bottle).

    I agree that the use the government will make of the “freedom of Information” law remains to be seen, but to presume it's going to be used to deliberately hide information on illegitimate or shady activities is unfounded...

    “ bound to result in more documents being classified”. Why do you presume, just because the process is easier, i.e., less red tape, that govt officials will necessarily increase the number of classified documents ? that kind of talk is the expected initial reaction of the media which, considering how it loves to criticize Bolsonaro - because he represents change, something they weren't expecting, nor wanted - is speculating with the most negative scenarios....
    The simple classification, for the sake of hiding information, does not sound like Bolsonaro ; after his harsh criticism of the PT and the way they hid information on practically every BNDES-financed project abroad, is not likely to do the same thing.

    Fact is, even with what the left apptly considered an 'ideal' (?) “freedom of information” law signed by Dilma ('ideal', as heard no one complaining), was the public aware of all the shit going on with respect to dozens of billions of dollars in shady deals in Africa and around Latin America ? Of course not !!
    The fact the bank was being used to favour Lula's allies abroad (for which he was probably handsomely rewarded), and not Brazil, is pretty damning in itself. But I still see very little in the news about this, which undoubtedly, when the shit hits the fan, will make the Lavajato pale in comparison...

    Feb 05th, 2019 - 08:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think


    Cartaghe was a well fortified..., well defended fortress/city...
    Carthage was very much officially at war with Rome...

    Copenhagen was an open, defenceless civilian city...
    Copenhagen was NOT..., officially nor unofficially..., at war with London...

    So much so that Nelson's murderous flotilla was allowed to sail past the artillery of Danish Kronborg Castle at the narrow Øresund strait without a shot being fired just days before their treacherous..., coward attack to Copenhagen...

    Withouth the shadow of a doubt a “Terror Attack” targeting exclusively civilian targets...

    Feb 05th, 2019 - 09:27 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo

    Estimado THINK

    Interesting, and I like the Danes, but perhaps orthodox history has glossed over the event.

    Carthage was so obliterated, and it was forcefully defended, but the Romans brutally destroyed almost any trace of their society. The Romans wrote their history as almost all victors have... Perhaps that's also why we were taught little of the attack upon Denmark.

    Feb 05th, 2019 - 09:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DemonTree

    “Artillery in the form of ballistas and catapults used to siege port cities seems to be used throughout history. ”

    That's what I was thinking. But I don't know nearly enough history to know any specifics.

    I guess Nelson was lucky, until he wasn't. But I bow to your superior knowledge of muskets.

    However, unless it's been made into an internet meme, I doubt many British students would know that quote. I was serious when I said I learned nothing about Nelson at school, and everyone my age would be the same.

    I'm surprised you'd recommend the box-wine, I always assumed that was the cheapo stuff. I've had English wine from grapes grown here, but the tax isn't an import duty, it's charged equally on all wine. Here's a chart showing where your money goes:

    “Why do you presume, just because the process is easier”

    Cos I've met people? ;) It's not a big jump to think if you make something easier, people will do it more. As for Bolsonaro's criticism of the PT, doesn't every new government in Brazil claim they will end corruption and criticise their predecessor? And then they continue the same way, or worse. Why would B be any different? He's been in politics 30 years, he's an insider. Actions speak louder than words and so far he has only made it easier to hide information.

    Feb 05th, 2019 - 09:51 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo

    Estimado THINK

    What I always was horrified at the academy when we were studying the diabolical strategy for British naval surprise attack on neutral French Navy ships at the base at Mers El Kébir. “The bombardment killed 1,297 French servicemen, sank a battleship and damaged five ships, for a British loss of five aircraft shot down and two crewmen killed.”

    That and the bombardment of Dresden rank high up on the British moral conscious.


    Not only did the ancients use catapults, but the mysterious Greek fire weapon that was used as well. Go to:

    I'm saddened to learn your school skipped over Nelson. Did you ever see the movie “ Master and Commander: The Far Side of the World ”? It's absolutely brilliant! A minute and a half video:
    (The music in the background is what typically plays in my home as “She who must be obeyed” approves.)

    With all due respect to Jack, I'd stick with bottles until you find your passion. It's so damn hot here right now, I'm drinking fresh lemonade.

    Feb 05th, 2019 - 10:56 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DemonTree

    “British naval surprise attack on neutral French Navy ships at the base at Mers El Kébir”

    Now that we didn't learn about, though we all studied WWII. The firebombing of Dresden was covered, though.

    I'd have liked to learn more history; I've said before I think there should be some kind of overview course that covers the most important events. And some kind of political history should be compulsory, young people today are so clueless and half of them don't bother voting.

    I've heard about the Greek fire before, it's kind of crazy that they still don't know what it was exactly.

    And I haven't seen the movie, maybe I'll try and get hold of it. I wish it was hot here, I'm so ready for it to be summer again.

    Feb 05th, 2019 - 11:34 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo


    The fictional movie is well worth watching and has high marks for authenticity. In my youth, I missed many great opportunities to appreciate the arts and pursue philosophy. History however has been a consuming interest along with my agricultural studies.

    Feb 06th, 2019 - 12:08 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DemonTree

    I was interested in philosophy when I was young, but now it feels too much like chasing your own tail. History is always interesting though, what sort do you know most about?

    Feb 06th, 2019 - 12:33 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo


    Outside naval issues, I try to improve my general knowledge and appreciation of good literature. Just keeping up with technology is a battle alone, but our farm is now switching over to high tech farm management. We're now using drones to monitor individual health and water delivery by tree. Understanding that is study by itself.

    Feb 06th, 2019 - 01:02 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DemonTree

    Do (avocado?) trees really need that much monitoring? I suppose those drones are quite different to the acrobatic ones we have - do you fly them manually or is it all GPS controlled? At least you won't have the problem we are currently experiencing of the batteries not working properly due to the cold. Your farm must be in a warm area judging by what you're growing.

    As for naval history, the technology has changed so much over time. Is there much relevance to modern warfare of tactics used in long ago battles?

    Feb 06th, 2019 - 10:31 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo


    We are in the process to now monitor the individual tree sector area subsoil humidity, and preprogrammed self guided drones pickup RFID data point information, photo monitor tree leaf color (to detect disease) and actually report unauthorized intruders in the orchards to combat theft. This is all guided by AI with automatic updates to specific designated smartphones. There's lots more, but that's the highlight. Yes, it's warm where we grow.

    Naval technology is radically changing, including a dramatic exterior makeover of vessels as seen by the new Zumwalt-class destroyer class.

    Your country has been at the cutting edge of cloaking technology. that is capable of
    “If the enemy cannot see you, he cannot fire at you!”
    Developing new amazing technology to create false imaging of vessels, such as disguising an attack frigate as an innocent small coastal fishing ship.

    There are a number of new weapons on the horizon. Notably the electromagnetic railgun to launch high velocity projectiles and numerous versions of lasers, such as the AN/SEQ-3 Weapon System.

    Maritime protection is now greatly in handed by highly sophisticated drones investigating suspicious vessels violating environmental regulations such as overfishing. (These are nothing like you see in the news and some of them exceed 4m in length with see thru radar and sensors to inspect the interior of what the vessels contain.

    In my old department we were focused in collecting intel in real time transmission, but today the it's actually the mission to pursue internal encrypted stored data as well as to devastate the enemies operational electronic systems with such as similar to the Stuynex virus. It's actually now possible to remotely to critically disarm vessels through electronic warfare.

    It's rumored that new focused electromagnetic pulse attack technology now exists.

    Feb 06th, 2019 - 01:37 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Jack Bauer

    It’s the English historians who actually consider Cochrane a better commander, so little bias there. He was a strategist 'n the type of commander who never asked a man to do what he wouldn’t do himself…this earned him respect ‘n contributed to his victories. You'd find his “Narrative of Services in the Liberation of Chili, Peru and Brazil, from Spanish and Portuguese Domination” (2 vols) very interesting...shows a side of history rarely, or not, taught in schools.
    I’ve got 15 of the 21 books of Patrick O'Brian's Aubrey-Maturin series...ashamed to say they're still in their original plastic packing....need to start on them. A Horatio Hornblower series was put out on DVD, very good.
    (you, to DT :“ With all due respect to Jack, I'd stick with bottles until you find your passion”. Can’t disagree with that, just pointing out cheaper options for beginners)

    As I said abv, “BIB”, only for beginners. When they first appeared they were indeed to pack the 'cheapo' they've improved, but obviously not wine rated 'good', far less 'top'. By yr graph, it’s easy to see taxes are the villain. Much the same everywhere.

    Rgdng the latest ‘freedom of information’ law, your opinion is only a presumption of what might happen. While most new governments can’t resist blaming previous ones for their problems, using them as a generic excuse to divert blame, today, the facts, dates, causes are easier to pinpoint, so it’s harder to disown your own cock-ups.
    But in the recent history of Brazil (50 yrs ?), no govt’s actions were so prejudicial to the country as the PT’s. The BNDES had never been used in this way, ‘n with so much secrecy. Dilma even tampered with the economic stats…Not even moderate ‘petistas’ (hard to find) deny it. (Joke: teacher asks the student what free radicals are…answer : ‘petistas’ who aren’t yet in prison
    The fact B was an insider for 30 yrs, means he’s familiar with all the sh*it, not that he’ll adopt it.

    Feb 06th, 2019 - 05:35 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo


    Yes I too have the Hornblower set and I think the very fist episode was the best, but they were all very good. It's amazing the thin thread of similarity in the situations of discipline, going before a verbal examination for promotion and honor. I too remember the humiliation of being seasick and having vomit on my uniform while remaining at my post. Thankfully I spent most of my career on the shore.

    Regarding Patrick O'Brian's Aubrey-Maturin series, the author has a difficult cadence of writing that I first found difficult as reading even though my English comprehension is actually better than my native tongue. You have to forcefully endure the unusual style of narration, but after a chapter or so, you will quickly fall for O'Brian's narrative over C. S. Forester.

    Finally, I agree that there are some decent wines available in boxes, but it don't think he'd consume that within a fortnight, unless he has a drinking companion.

    As you probably know by the way how I've named my dear companion in the same address used by Rumpole, who enjoys cheap red claret at a wine bar on Fleet Street, within walking distance of the Old Bailey. His preference is of red wine of questionable quality, which he calls variously “Cooking Claret”, “Pomeroy's Plonk”, “Pomeroy's Very Ordinary”, “Chateau Thames Embankment”, or “Chateau Fleet Street”

    Enjoying wine is a lifestyle, a tradition and a culture linking us back over five millennia... Our worst common wine here is actually very drinkable. Rumpole would have liked them.

    Feb 06th, 2019 - 06:25 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DemonTree

    That Zumwalt-class destroyer is pretty weird looking. Almost like a submarine. And you'd think they'd want to keep the cloaking technology secret rather than publishing it on the internet. But it's a little disturbing that warships could disguise themselves as fishing vessels and tanks as cars. Seems very likely to lead to civilians being targeted accidentally.

    “my English comprehension is actually better than my native tongue”

    Odd. Does that mean you find English literature easier than Spanish? And is something like Don Quixote as different from modern Spanish as Shakespeare is from modern English?

    PS. I recognised your Rumpole reference, but only because my parents used to watch it.

    “today, the facts, dates, causes are easier to pinpoint”

    And why is that? Anything to do with more freedom of information and a free press?

    No one knows the future, all we can do is look at the evidence. Has B done anything I would consider positive yet?

    Feb 06th, 2019 - 10:51 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo


    It was another hot Summer day here, and had ceviche for dinner. Something we do is to mix small cubes of avocado with the marinated seafood, nicely balancing the lemon juice to complement the Sauvignon blanc. You should try it.

    Rumpole loved to quote William Wordsworth. If you can, Cervantes, Pablo Neruda, Gabriel García Márquez... should be read in Spanish, as Shakespeare, Joyce, Tennyson... In English. That's why my “trouble and strife” considers me a Philistine because I never made the effort to read Victor Hugo in le français...

    I live in an eccentric household where three languages are intermixed during the day. Many of my Grange schoolmates grew up in homes where they almost exclusively spoke English. Chileans don't even really speak proper castellano...

    I suggest try learning the lyrics in Portuguese of “Garota de Ipanema” (“The Girl from Ipanema”) and you greatly enjoy the bossa nova song.

    Actually the newest cloaking technology that currently is highly secret and is far more scary. Your SAS has an assault boat that mimics an ocean wave, even in daylight! Soldiers that look like small bushes in the wind, and of course things actually completely invisible to weapon targeting systems. It all exists today.

    Human vision is not so easy to fool, but the goal is to deceive electronic targeting abilities.

    Recently, a group of Israeli attack fighters used a Russian transport aircraft as a credible enemy target to lock on to and destroy, defeating the Syrian Russian built ground to air defense system. They strategically used stealth by coerced electronic radar to hide their own presence behind the Russian aircraft fooling the Syrians to destroy their Russian ally which was artificially imaged as an enemy. The press missed the whole story.

    The scary one is focused electromagnetic pulse tecnology.

    Feb 07th, 2019 - 01:30 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DemonTree

    How hot is hot where you are (Chicureo)? I've never tried ceviche, but I'd like to. And no way can I read those authors in Spanish, I struggle to get through a newspaper article. How hard is it for you to read French, or Portuguese or Italian?

    “Many of my Grange schoolmates grew up in homes where they almost exclusively spoke English.”

    Were their parents immigrants from English-speaking countries then? But it must have been nice for your kids being able to learn three languages easily. And I've heard that other Spanish speakers can't understand Chileans, I wonder why Chile was the country to change the language so much? It's not particularly isolated, is it?

    Re the Russian aircraft, are you talking about this incident?

    I don't know much about focused electromagnetic pulse technology, but I'm hoping they can soon find a way to block drones from going near airports. People are dicks.

    Feb 07th, 2019 - 11:48 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo


    Correct incident, but misleading narrative...

    The fated Il-20 was on a flight plan that was known by the Syrians and the Russian pilots were in communication while entering the defended airspace.

    You can't hide several fighter/attack jets behind a Il-20 to Russian/Syrian defense radar because the system is highly sophisticated. The IDF deliberatively “electronically painted” the transport as a target to fool the missile system to lock on the Il-20.

    The problem is that although the Russians support Israeli enemy, Netanyahu's government has also been in sensitive negotiations with Putin and Erdoğan for joint interests working together. That's why the IDF expressed “sorrow” over the deaths.

    My Grange friends were 2nd and 3rd generational Chilean families keeping their British heritage. Our British school is located next to a British country club.

    Our farms are located to the north of Santiago, with all of our avocados in the hillsides of the Aconcagua Valley. Current predicted high today in Chicureo is 33C/91F.

    I cannot read French literature, no matter how many times I've attempted. But I do understand phrases because the mother of my children insisted on using it in our home. Her English is impeccable although her parentage has no Anglo roots.

    All I'm certain about is that in today's world English is essential for almost everyone, but the richness of another language makes life far more culturally delightful.

    Feb 07th, 2019 - 01:21 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    Dear Shicureo...

    You above comment about you investing milllions of CLP's and a lot of your time in drone surveillance technology to protect your paltos..., made me somehow a bit..., “suspicious”...

    As with all of us in here..., Google helped to me to “desasnarme” about the issue...

    Basically the result was an expected one...:
    -The rich in Chile still have the (Pinochet's) constitutional right of “doing to their fellows what is hateful for them”..., in this case taking all their water without the minimum shadow of shame...
    Them drones are... of course..., an excellent way of controlling those stinky marxist eco-terrorist locals that want to drink water...

    Baaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaad boy....
    Camels and needle eyes come to mind...

    Feb 07th, 2019 - 04:36 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Jack Bauer

    You're right, wine becomes a life-style, brings people together. After retiring from shipping (freight, logistics), a good friend who imported wine mainly from AUS 'n NZ invited me to help him....this gave me unlimited access to dozens of great labels, some of which I would not have bought due to retail price. One of his many imports was BIB from AUS, under
    the name “Stanley's”. Came in 4 litre boxes (Chardonnay, cab-sauv, cab-shiraz), lasted easily 2 months (refrigerated) after breaking the tap's seal (as vacuum-packed, no air got in), which was a success in restaurants (wine by the glass, and for cooking), AFTER breaking their resistance. One of our big customers was the “Outback”. At home, a box never lasted more than 10 days.
    Remember seeing a few Rumpole episodes on US TV, years ago, and altho was familiar with the expression “she who must be obeyed”, couldn't recall from where. Agree, even the cheaper Chilean wine is quite good.

    “Anything to do with more freedom of information and a free press?”
    Not necessarily, not meant in that sense, but that after the internet and a lot of other communication technology, news moves at the speed of lightning.

    “all we can do is look at the evidence” and what concrete evidence do you have that leads you to believe that Bolsonaro is going to increase government secrecy ? and for what purpose ? this kind of secrecy is usually related to nat'l security 'n intelligence reports, not to everyday activities, normal govt beaurocracy, stats etc...I'm not worried about it, you shouldn't be either. But you refrained from commenting on the secrecy regarding the BNDES' “foreign” projects...why, because it was Lula 'n Dilma's doing ?

    Don't know what you consider positive, but everything I've seen is certainly better than the previous administrations, and to name just three - the appointment of qualified people to high-posts, the intention to sell off most state-run cos, 'n get the essential reforms done.

    Feb 07th, 2019 - 05:40 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo


    Penfolds Shiraz from Australia equals or exceeds any Syrah we produce in Chile.

    It's so hot here, I'm informed we're having carpaccio this evening with a bottle of Casa Marin, Miramar Riesling.

    Estimado THINK

    The DW documentary is very realistic and fairly accurate. (I loved how the narrator pronounced Llay-Llay) Water in fact has always been a critical issue and it's become catastrophic in the north were most of the documentary was taken.
    (They however fail to mention the large mining companies buying much of the water rights.)

    In the late 70's my father was able to take advantage of a CORFO sponsored trip to study Israeli agriculture. He returned convinced to heavily invest in the newest drip irrigation technology and buy as much rocky hillsides then used by goat herders available. We also continuously obtained large amount of water rights as they became available in the market.

    My father and uncle utilized CORFO loan subsidies using our remaining farmland as collateral and planted table grapes. Almost anything exportable was financed thru CORFO and profits were not taxed on exported product, only on the final returns giving thousands of growers opportunities to prosper. (Chile retains this tax policy and Argentina should adopt it as well.)

    The Llay-Llay area in the video is down river from us located close to San Felipe and Los Andes in the Aconcagua valley where water is plentiful for everyone, but farmers are strictly regulated on their irrigation usage by water rights.

    My sister and I made the radical decision to plant avocados because although table grapes were still profitable, vineyards require extensive labor. The insane eventual profitability was pure luck, and the popularity of our product is increasing each year.

    I know the Schmidt family and their orchards are nearly identical to ours. The poor rocky hillsides are ideal for avocado production. (They send all their children to the Colegio Alemán)

    Feb 07th, 2019 - 09:14 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DemonTree

    The internet, smartphones etc certainly have made a difference. Hopefully that means even if the government tries, they won't be able to cover things up in future.

    “this kind of secrecy is usually related to nat'l security 'n intelligence reports”

    And they'd never abuse the laws to cover up their own (dodgy) affairs? I thought you were the cynical one! I don't know enough to comment on BNDES - not what they were doing or why they kept it secret, or what the BNDES did previously.

    Positive would be improving the economy, medical care, education. Enforcing the laws protecting the Amazon (instead he's legalising the deforestation). Doing something to prevent more dam collapses. Reforming politics so it doesn't almost require corruption (difficult). Reducing violence of all kinds. It's too early for most of those, but I'm expecting things to get worse if anything.

    “My Grange friends were 2nd and 3rd generational Chilean families keeping their British heritage.”

    When poor people do that, it's called failing to integrate.

    “I know the Schmidt family and their orchards are nearly identical to ours.”

    And do you think the same? You've bought the water rights and too bad if your neighbours don't have enough to live on?

    What will you do when the glaciers melt and there is no more water?

    Feb 07th, 2019 - 10:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think


    ***“The poor rocky hillsides are ideal for avocado production”***...huhhhhhhh...?

    Now I better understand why you soooo much wanted those dams and high tension lines to ruin half of Patagonia...

    So you could pump water up them steep rocky hillsides to them damn trees with cheapo electricity...

    Really lad..., you..., the Shicureos..., the Schmidts and the other privileged Shileans should start to Think a bit more seriously about the environment..., and the rotos aguas abajo...

    Si no..................................
    Just saying...

    Feb 07th, 2019 - 10:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo

    Estimado THINK
    Tovarich DemonTree

    Your Socialist-Marxist governments took most of our land in the early 70's and we ended up buying marginal productive land and contributing to the economy. The big mining companies have been buying water rights causing the value to skyrocket.

    We pay more for our Chilean electricity by kilowatt hour than both of you do.
    My niece actually did a study utilizing solar power and found it unfeasible. She and my daughter are looking for viable solar lamp posts for farm illumination, but so far it's still being considered. (We do however have installed remote solar powered data point nodes to transmit RFID data.)

    We grow a healthy product to improve the health of our customers and no one in our valley is without potable water, not a single person. We comply with all the stringent GAP requirements including employee treatment:

    I have nothing to apologize for, as do the other entrepreneurial growers who took a risk on rebuilding our country's agricultural infrastructure.

    An excellent link about using drones from a company we first began using their technology:

    We now have invested in some highly expensive, but eventual cost effective hardware and AI software from an obscure small subsidiary of Rafael Advanced Systems that allow for AI multi-tasking drones that rigorously monitors everything.
    (We have, by far the best system in Chile and we're the only ones.)

    We're alerted in real time specific problems including unauthorized access to our property. Each day, we know the water transpiration of each tree sector, moisture content of the subsoil, plant health, etc...

    Enjoy eating avocados, they are beneficial to your health and provide great culinary satisfaction to millions of happy consumers.

    Feb 07th, 2019 - 11:13 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    Ayayay..., hermanito...

    Que cola de paja que tenemos hoy...!

    I'm sure yours and other well-off Shilean families suffered terribly during the shortlived socialist era in Chile...

    As I am sure that may more Shilean families have suffered a teeny wheeny bit more..., every day..., since the time of Diego de Almagro...

    And pleaaaaaase..., don't give me all that piss about you complying with all the laws and regulatives..., created, designed and approved by your very own people..., to perpetuate the Status Quo...

    It sounds to me ears as ridiculous as Diego Torres..., that Stumpy Weón at minute. 24:46 in the Deutsche Welle video...

    - I will follow your advice and continue enjoying one of my all time favourites..., el peruanísimo Pan con Palta y Salsa Criolla... ;-)

    El Think

    Feb 07th, 2019 - 11:57 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo


    The white we had tonight was too sweet. I remove my earlier endorsement.

    Estimado THINK

    Again, I completely agree that the largest water right owners should judiciously share their water of the severely drought affected valleys of Copiapo, Vicuña, Elqui and Ovalle with all the inhabitants of the areas. Especially from that giant exporting billion Dollar water eating monster named Codelco...

    Thankfully those alemanes, vascos, catalanes, palestino and my mestizo family are all farming in a water stable region. We are actually monitoring the precious stuff drip by drip... (Thanks to those Semite geniuses of the true arid desert)

    ...and I long ago posted to you my personal bias against those “dams and high tension lines to ruin half of Patagonia” Remember?

    We were taught long ago by our ideological betters that the needs of the many exceed the few. ...We were later told by those Chicago boys to adapt or die...

    Those diabolical regulations by the way were crafted by our Eurocrat masters at Tesco and Asda in the UK with the same damn ultimatum...

    The correct drone link is:

    Enjoy your el peruanísimo pan con Palta y salsa criolla.


    Feb 08th, 2019 - 01:38 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think


    ***“ ...and I long ago posted to you my personal bias against those “dams and high tension lines to ruin half of Patagonia” Remember? ”***... you say...

    My bad... I had you confused with that other hermanito Shileno..., Mr. Condorito...

    Feb 08th, 2019 - 02:23 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DemonTree

    “Those diabolical regulations by the way were crafted by our Eurocrat masters at Tesco and Asda in the UK with the same damn ultimatum...”

    So that's why you hate the 'globalists'. In your own country the wealthy businesses and multinationals have enough influence to block laws protecting workers, consumers, and the environment (but most importantly, laws that would stop them hiding their money abroad in tax havens) and dismantling those is also the main motivation of the big Brexiters here.

    Feb 08th, 2019 - 11:33 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo

    Estimado THINK

    Thank you for acknowledging the mistaken identity. (I haven't seen Condorito on the forum here in ages.)

    If I had the pro- HidroAysen stance, my Alianza Francesa sleeping companion would exile me. We generally like Piñera, but his proposal was very unpopular for the majority of my countrymen. The big mining companies were behind the ecological nightmare.

    Perhaps more confusing to some is that we also like most of the two terms of presidential guidance by Michelle. She surprisingly from the very beginning was friendly with our navy and we officially made her the godmother of one of our beautiful Scorpène submarines.

    Also, I would mention that the DW team, that did a very good job of documenting the Avocado industry, accepted the cordial tour by the large farm owners in Llay-Llay just off our national highway. The project is very impressive and I imagine the owners were thrilled to be interviewed by the Deutsche Welle.

    You see the problem of course, because it confuses those orchards in Llay-Llay with the problematic orchards further located in the north.

    To my misinformed Eco social justice warrior

    I would mention that we worry constantly about the changing environment as we survive each harvest on the edge of dramatic swings of climate change, but our drought cycle and temperature changes have been documented in our country over nearly a half millennia. Even the Incas were affected and had to adapt.

    We Chileans embrace 'globalists' because without international markets, we would die in poverty. The daily international market price of copper has always been a factor in our national health.

    Please tell me DemonTree how many Chileans were discovered in the Panama Papers scandal. When was the latest news report about Chilean businessmen blocking laws to protecting workers and consumers. Use Google and search.

    Didn't you yourself remark about the difference of food packaging between foods of Argentina and Chile.

    Feb 08th, 2019 - 12:50 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    Estimado Shicureo...

    Them orchads in Llay-Llay ain't that “unproblematic” either...:

    Even if unsporty and completely against the ethics of a gentleman angler..., I'd luuuuuuuuv to try one of these babies to localize them biiig elusive trouts in some of tbe nearby lakes...,h_978,al_c,q_90,usm_0.66_1.00_0.01/195338_fdef0821ab894b65b81068e97efe4a97~mv2_d_5184_3456_s_4_2.webp

    Feb 08th, 2019 - 01:17 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo

    Estimado THINK

    Fairly good study, but a bit outdated. Obviously things are not ideal, but nothing really is. Potable water available to 97% during the year of the survey in the community seems odd, but Llay-Llay has always been a poorer area. And full time employment is always preferable to seasonal labor, but that's one of the challenging paradoxes of rural life.

    I'm disappointed your lack commentary on our drones. Apparently an article about our implementation is being published in a future articles in Arutz Sheva and Agri Magazine, highlighting our commitment for “Advanced Agricultural Technology.”

    Your last link I can't seem to make it work.

    Feb 08th, 2019 - 02:37 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    We try again...

    Even if unsporty and completely against the ethics of a gentleman angler..., I'd luuuuuuuuv to try one of these babies to localize them biiig elusive trouts in some of my nearby lakes...

    Feb 08th, 2019 - 03:00 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DemonTree

    According to this, more than 100 Chileans or foreigners with investments in Chile were found in the Panama Papers:

    And speaking of food warning labels, didn't the food industry lobby manage to get the law implemented gradually, over 4 years, instead of immediately? Also giving them more chances to get it relaxed during that time?

    It is quite a paradox that after benefiting so much from globalisation, and encouraging it in your own country, you try to persuade others against it. What is your objection?

    Temporary work and low wages is an unfortunately familiar problem. A higher GDP is no benefit to a country when that is the result.

    Both your links worked for me. But our drones would not work for you; it's difficult to spot a person with their cameras, let alone fish.

    Feb 08th, 2019 - 03:56 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    ***“ But OUR drones would not work for you ”***


    Feb 08th, 2019 - 04:20 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DemonTree

    We have some fun drones to fly and do acrobatics with, I mentioned it earlier. Nothing like the ones Chicureo uses.

    Feb 08th, 2019 - 04:24 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    Evidently there are drones out there which cameras can spot fish...

    Feb 08th, 2019 - 04:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Jack Bauer

    AUS shiraz is unique. Fantastic aromas ‘n after-tastes. In 2016 while in Miami for Xmas ‘n my birthday, I treated myself to a Penfolds Grange (2009)...expensive but worth every drop. The Barossa Valley, where it comes from, produces many great wines from shiraz 'n others. Ever tried Penfolds Bin 28, a blend of kalimna 'n shiraz ? less pricy, abt US$ 20. Regarding ‘Riesling’, know what you mean....I prefer the 'mineral' riesling, with an aroma hinting of kerosene, ‘n citrus 'n spicy in the mouth.

    ”And they'd never abuse the laws to cover up their own (dodgy) affairs?”
    Glad you asked. That is EXACTLY what Lula (‘n Dilma) did…the dozens of BNDES-financed projects, executed by Odebrecht, worth billions of dollars - in Mocambique, Nicaragua, Bolivia, Perú, Uruguay, Angola, Venezuela, Argentina, Ecuador, Cuba - re which in many cases, only the ‘official’ cost is known, 'n details on payback period, interest etc, NOT disclosed. And the countries ? do you see a pattern ?
    IF the BNDES, a “Brazilian” development bank, had invested in Brazil, “wouldn’t it be loverly” ? There were tens of dozens of such projects, a ‘few’ of which can be seen in the link :

    Yes, your comments “Positive would be improving economy, medical care, education” are “cynical”…. 5 weeks in office ‘n you expect to see results ? so in yr book of rules, appointing serious people to head the Ministries, selling off inefficient State-owned cos, doing the reforms, is not important ? Looks like you have tunnel-vision when it comes down to Bolsonaro.

    Just fyg, the dams in MG are the responsibility of the MG State, not the Federal government's. But who, may I ask, was the governor from 2015/18 ? Pimentel, staunch ‘petista’. Who was president in 2015 (first dam burst ?) Dilma. Who'd been in power since 2003 ? The PT. You are sounding like the eternal it because B is anti-PT ? but relax, Moro is working hard on an anti-crime package

    Feb 08th, 2019 - 05:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo


    There has been numerous investigations, but none of those companies I'm aware of are being prosecuted by the Servicio de Impuestos Internos because the tax lawyers seemed to conformed to legal regulations.

    A quote from the lengthy article: ... los representantes del bufete panameño que los chilenos ya no estaban tan interesados en sacar sus capitales de Chile y que lo que buscaban ahora era traerlos de vuelta. Y que para hacerlo, muchos de sus clientes esperarían a la promulgación de la ley de repatriación de capitales que ya se discutía en el Congreso.”

    And that's the specific debate, just as throughout the world. Legally created companies waiting for better tax reduction. Trump encouraged companies to return profits back into the US economy by reducing the repatriated tax rate which resulted many US corporations returning roughy a half a billion of the over three trillion still held abroad.

    The first thing you learn in running a business in Latin America is that the most important person of a company is not the Chairman or CEO or even the CFO, but instead the tax lawyer...

    There is a thin line not to cross between tax avoidance and fraud.

    We've repatriated all our profits and paying our taxes because we have a philosophy to continuously pay debt and re-invest in our farms.

    Estimado THINK

    Nice picture of a drone, but wait to see the incredible what is better described as an small reconnaissance aerial vehicle (UAV) with a broad array of new and very technically sophisticated advanced electronics, including the 3DV Systems – ZCam.

    We were required to actually acquire a special operating permit from the Dirección General de Aeronáutica Civil.

    Feb 08th, 2019 - 05:48 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    Something like this...?
    Does it have is a superluminal warp propulsion drive system...?


    Feb 08th, 2019 - 06:12 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DemonTree

    That's pretty cool. Did you think for a moment that I was Chicureo? ;)

    Kerosene? Don't think I'd want to drink anything that hinted at that flavour!

    Is the BNDES supposed to invest exclusively in Brazil? Nothing wrong with investing in other countries - provided they pay you back. I'm guessing Vz is a write off, but what about the other projects you listed? Are they repaying their loans? And yes, I can see a pattern: Latin American allies, and former Portuguese colonies. Seems Lula was attempting a little empire building of his own.

    “5 weeks in office ‘n you expect to see results ?”

    I don't, that's why I said “it's too early for most of those”. And no, selling off state owned companies and appointing lobbyists and generals to the government aren't high on my approval list. I'll see what I think of the reforms once they are done. I do believe pensions need reform, but it could go well or badly.

    As for the dams, I don't blame B for them, he's only just taken over. It's just something topical that he could choose to address.

    But don't expect a liberal to be optimistic about a far-right government. In many areas his idea of good is my bad, so how can it possibly turn out well?

    “none of those companies I'm aware of are being prosecuted by the Servicio de Impuestos Internos because the tax lawyers seemed to conformed to legal regulations.”

    That rather implies tax evasion is legal in Chile!

    It's something countries need to work together on, otherwise it's a race to the bottom. The EU was starting to crack down by eg telling Ireland they must make Apple pay tax. And our government was looking at ending our own tax havens in OTs, before they got distracted by Brexit. First world countries are heading to the same place as Latin America: a few super rich and lots of poor with few rights and no job security, and in many cases no jobs. It's a bad prospect.

    Feb 08th, 2019 - 06:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    Mr. DemonTree...

    You ask...:
    ***“ Did you think for a moment that I was Shicureo? ”***

    I say...:
    Nope..., I just wanted to point out that you have a certain tendency to answer for others...

    Feb 08th, 2019 - 07:00 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Jack Bauer

    Yes kerosene. I won't try to explain it to you, instead, buy a bottle of a good “mineral” riesling, and drink it. Then we can talk again.

    The BNDES is supposed to invest in Brazil....and if it is presented with profitable ventures outside, why not (?), but not in detriment of during the PT era.
    VZ owes Brazil, USD 1 billion....when will we see it ? never. Cuba and Dilma fixed the “More Doctors' ” program, MAINLY to give Cuba the means to pay Brazil back for almost USD 800 million....great, it's tantamount to “I'll hire you, pay you an enormous salary - with taxpayer money - just so that you can pay me back”.
    Not only LatAm allies 'n former Portuguese colonies, but countries ruled by leftists, some of them dictators...which all fitted in with Lula's agenda.

    “I don't, that's why I said “it's too early for most of those””...OK, apologize. The Federal government owns 144 companies (after having got rid of some under FHC, and created more under the PT), and a lot of them, besides being monopolies, or competing with the private sector and racking up huge losses / bailed out with taxpayer money, are highly-inefficient, places for politicians to put their familiy 'n friends, with big salaries, who give back part of their salaries to the politician who indicated them....Pls note that Brazilian state-owned Cos in no ways resemble the UK's ...
    The Generals are far better administrators than unqualified politicians.

    Besides the dams being MG's problem to sort out, the Federal government has given invaluable help, reason why things are happening...a totally different approach....being run by Generals. The dam burst of 3 years ago - under Dilma - is light years away from being fixed...lack of prosecutions, deaths been taken lightly, fines unpaid, incompetence, victims still without assistance etc.

    Current govt is NOT far right-wing...who's feeding you this crap ? And what gives you the authority to decide the left is good, and the right is bad ?

    Feb 08th, 2019 - 07:27 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DemonTree

    Yesterday you replied to a post Chicureo wrote to me, and sometimes you've butted in when I've been talking to JB. I didn't mind, it's a public forum.

    But okay, next time I won't bother letting you know your link worked.

    Re Cuba, you could look at it as the doctors working to pay off the debt, but the money would have been better. I don't suppose you'll see that USD 1bn again either, but in the other countries it's Brazilian companies doing the construction, isn't it? The big bribers like OAS and Odebrecht. So doesn't a lot of the money come back to Brazil anyway? Seems to be half the reason Western countries (and China) fund projects.

    “Pls note that Brazilian state-owned Cos in no ways resemble the UK's ...”

    Most of ours were privatised decades ago. However, the Royal mail was sold off in 2013. They sold the shares for 330p each and by the end of the day they were trading at 455p - £1bn of public assets just gifted to the wealthy.

    Maybe Brazil can do better, and if services improve and prices drop, then I'll agree it was beneficial.

    Re the dams, surely there must be Federal rules on them? It can't all be left up to the states.

    “Current govt is NOT far right-wing...who's feeding you this crap ?”

    ...Every article in every newspaper? Including this site. If you disagree, what DO you think far-right is?

    “And what gives you the authority to decide the left is good, and the right is bad ?”

    That's backwards. I know what I think is good, and it's easy to see who agrees with me. On most subjects, it's the left.

    Feb 08th, 2019 - 09:05 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo

    Estimado THINK

    Enjoyed the link.

    We purchased a fairly sophisticated drone a couple of years ago and although we marveled with its performance, it was not sufficient for what our company needed.

    We needed to upgrade to an overall multi-UAV integrated AI system using real time monitoring of a large number of RFID data stations, monitor tree health as well as advise of unauthorized personnel, hourly water management, with a custom software program to manage the complete AI system management in RT that would only alarm us to our group of smartphones when norms exceeded their parameters.

    If a specific pump system motor is overheating, or the root subsoil sector is not optimal, an individual tree is unhealthy, or the transpiration rate is not matching forward reservoir storage or someone is stealing from our orchard or a number of other parameter issues, a group would be advised in RT. The female part of the clan wanted also something similar to a virtual assistant, similar to Siri.

    Our family consulted in companies in California, but the very best we encountered was from two companies in Israel. It made sense, because we wanted sophisticated aerial surveillance integrated with critical agricultural management specific to water management.

    Of course it was a typical bureaucratic nightmare requiring an approved export license from origin, registration and permission to operate by the DGAC. Then to build a permanent secure UAV base, and learn to operate the system after adaptation. Then educating the AI software to advise everyone by both text and audio alerts in Spanish.

    It's been expensive and a difficult learning curve to engage, but it's now working well.


    Appreciate the wine comments. What are the reasonably priced Chilean reds available in your market? Whites? What about SA and Europe?

    Today it's so hot, we're having a cold platter of cheese, melon and jamon Serrano.


    Our food consumer protection regulations are world accepted. So?

    Feb 08th, 2019 - 09:12 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    You are getting me worried..., Shicurito....
    The capabilities description of the “surveillance system” you are organizing sounds (almost) as a private EuroHawk Airforce....
    How far did you say Panquehue is from the Argie border...?

    Feb 08th, 2019 - 09:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo

    Estimado THINK

    Our operational ceiling is strictly regulated by the DGAC. Our drones would never be able to cross to Mendoza anyway, so relax.

    Those Semite technicians however do have a models that could do it however.

    One of those tribe members told about how their company became involved to remotely operated pumps. Farmers would walk at predictable frequency to turn on or off their irrigation pumps and snipers waited to pick them off. Motorola of Israel was the first company to automate irrigation due to necessity. The other manufacturer is Rafael Advanced Systems who's creation had nothing to do with peaceful objectives, but they too are also pounding swords into plowshares...


    Feb 08th, 2019 - 10:57 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Think

    Hermanito Shileno...

    Yá que los atavares del destino quieren que hoy en día ustedes estén arriba y nosotros abajo..., quiero dejar asentado que ..., I have too... loooong time ago..., upgraded to an overall multi-UGP(1) integrated NI(2) real time monitoring system that alarms me of any unauthorized treaspass or any other unusual occurrence in RT though multiple random frequencies between 6 - 33,000 Hz. when norms exceed their parameters...

    The male part of them even water me garden trees..., every single day...

    As permanent secure UGP(1) base they use my preexistent humble shed's porch..., they are competely intuitive and their NI(2) operates automatically in every language known to man...

    It's been cheap and pleasant learning curve to engage, and it has always worked well...

    (1) Unmaned Ground Picho...
    (2) Natural Intelligence

    As-salāmu ʿalaykum...

    Feb 08th, 2019 - 11:32 pm - Link - Report abuse 0

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