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Montevideo, September 30th 2023 - 14:09 UTC

 

 

“The Falklands problem is not the Islanders or the English, but us Argentines,” points out Cisneros

Sunday, September 17th 2023 - 08:09 UTC
Full article 27 comments

The Falklands/Malvinas will eventually be returned to Argentina but that is going to be a long, long road, forecasted Andres Cisneros a retired Argentine diplomat expert in the Falklands/Malvinas dispute and deputy foreign minister with Guido Di Tella in the nineties. Read full article

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  • FitzRoy

    In which way do the Falkland Islands cost the UK public? The only financial input from the UK is in defence, and even that is a minuscule amount, less than 1% of the annual defence budget.

    Again, this chimera of the handing back of Hong Kong. The situation was entirely different. Hong Kong was leased from China for 99 years and by agreement was given back, but look at Hong Kong now. The fakery of respecting the citizens' wishes was completely ignored. The same fate would befall the people of the Falklands, were the islands given to Argentina.

    And, there are three governments involved here, not just the Argentines and the “English”, but also the Islanders ourselves. Not negotiations can progress without the inclusion of the Falkland Islands Government. Whether or not the “issue” of “reclaiming” the Falklands is part of the Argentine Constitution or not, it is part of our Constitution that we have the right to self-determination. We do not wish to become a part of Argentina.

    In 1973 and 1981, the people of the Falklands were ignored. Ridley made a grave error in making a case for handing over the islands. At no point have Islanders wanted to be gifted to Argentina. At the time Ridley's idiocy was protested and today, our future is decided by the populace, not the UK Government.

    Sep 17th, 2023 - 08:33 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Roger Lorton

    Return?

    Never belonged to Argie land

    Sep 17th, 2023 - 09:17 am - Link - Report abuse -1
  • Veteran

    Brave man. He is likely reflecting the new sentiment and common sense change in direction under Milei's future leadership?.

    Sep 17th, 2023 - 09:28 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Steve Potts

    In 1975, lease-back was proposed for the first time. It was an Argentine suggestion in response to a British proposal for joint development of economic resources of the south West Atlantic. The Argentine Foreign Minister also proposed that Argentina should occupy South Georgia and the South Sandwich Islands. That proposal was unacceptable to Britain, and the absence of talks on sovereignty was unacceptable to the Argentines. For some time following that, there were no negotiations. (Margaret Thatcher, Franks Report, Hansard HC Deb Vol 35 cc 789-870, 25 Jan 1983).

    On 26th and 27th February 1982 the British and Argentine governments held a meeting at ministerial level in New York. Mr. Richard Luce, Minister of State at the Foreign and Commonwealth Office and Ambassador Enrique Ros, Under Secretary of State , Ministry of Foreign Affairs and Worship, Buenos Aires attended. Also present were two Falkland Islands’ Councillors Mr. Blake and Cheek. Mr. Luce made the British position clear from the outset stating, we had no doubts about British sovereignty over the Falkland Islands and their Dependencies. The wishes of the Islanders themselves were paramount: that was why he felt strongly that the Islanders should participate in the talks. No changes could be made without their consent and that of the British parliament. (Anglo-Argentine Ministerial Talks on the Falklands New York 26/27 Feb 1982, 820226 FCO Cnv UK-Arg NY PREM 19-0613 f68. Pdf).

    Negotiations for the Sovereignty of the Falklands Between the United Kingdom & Argentina, 1967-1982:2XPGS https://www.academia.edu/106413074/Negotiations_for_the_Sovereignty_of_the_Falklands_Between_the_United_Kingdom_and_Argentina_1967_1982

    Sep 17th, 2023 - 09:39 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Juan Cervantes

    I wouldnt read too much in to it Vet, the country has been indoctrinated with lies about the mythical Malvinas for so long it would probably take 50 years for the people to be deprogrammed, G&H is a prime example of that, he may be brave but will get shouted down but the fanatics,

    Sep 17th, 2023 - 10:48 am - Link - Report abuse -1
  • Roger Lorton

    Vet, at best Cisneros is considered eccentric in Argentina. Slightly barmy would be the British designation. And, as with all Argies, he's bit inclined to get his facts wrong.

    There was a “hypothetical' suggestion made to Peron by the British Government in June 1974.

    It stated, quite clearly, ”before final agreement the Islanders would have to be formally consulted and their acceptance sought by some form of popular representation...”

    “The Argentine counterproposal certainly has constructive features… and we note his evident flexibility and readiness to compromise… (However) If the Foreign Minister and President Peron insist on including recognition of Argentine sovereignty in the basis for initiating talks, the islanders will refuse to take part: and we cannot move without them.” [FO 7/2700]

    The failure of this approach had little to do with Peron's death.

    https://falklandstimeline.files.wordpress.com/2023/07/1972-to-1982.pdf (from about p.15)

    Sep 17th, 2023 - 11:16 am - Link - Report abuse -1
  • Chicureo

    It's null and invalid question as the Falklands do
    not wish to become a part of Argentina.

    Madame and I have returned to the farm and are preparing for the festivals tomorrow.

    We have two whole hogs ready for roasting which we estimate will require 14 hours on the fire.

    ¡Saludos de Panquehue!

    Sep 17th, 2023 - 12:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Brasileiro

    A good solution to the issue would be to compensate the families of the islanders who wish to remain British.

    Let Argentina offer 5 million pounds sterling to each family that wants to leave the Islands and return to England.

    Just something to think about.

    Sep 17th, 2023 - 02:03 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Monkeymagic

    Bras

    Argentina is a bankrupt failed state.

    Lets say there are 1000 families on the islands and all of them were prepared to accept $5m to either become Argentine or leave (I doubt all would, but you might get a majority), where does Argentina find £5bn?

    Put it to the islanders...they'd want it in cash (USD or GBP), upfront!

    Sep 17th, 2023 - 02:30 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Juan Cervantes

    Bras, the islanders are no less South American than you. why should they leave their home,
    should all you Portuguese Brazilians go back to Portugal, talk sense man.

    Sep 17th, 2023 - 02:31 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Brasileiro

    Well, it's true that Argentina doesn't have money, but it has credit. Brazil and China have huge foreign exchange reserves in dollars.

    I am absolutely sure that, with the majority of islanders accepting, an agreement could be reached in this regard.

    Of course, just something to think about.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jDWahg4odAY&list=RDMM&index=6

    Sep 17th, 2023 - 02:37 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo

    Brasileiro

    Obviously your zeal and passion has overcome common sense. Think carefully with clear mindset and I think you'll will realize the Falkland islands will never relinquish their rights.

    * * *

    Besides the two hogs now roasting, the tables and chairs are being set up and we are pleased with the progress for tomorrow's festivities.

    ¡Saludos de Panquehue!

    Sep 17th, 2023 - 02:56 pm - Link - Report abuse -1
  • Bud Spencer

    Mr Brasil, the islands belong to the islanders, not Argentina, Argentina has never owned the islands and never will, yet you believe their lies, just because Buenos Aires wants them does not make it right. it may take 2 generations but one day Argentinians will wake up and see the truth,

    Sep 17th, 2023 - 03:08 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Brasileiro

    Where is your heart, Chicureo? In the manure of the bodies of the Chilean dictatorship, or in the hope of a better life for everyone?

    What is money and life for if not for all of us to be happy!

    Venezuelans were forced to leave their homes because the United States and United Kingdom stole their money. What my thinking offers is just the opposite.

    What is democracy?

    Sep 17th, 2023 - 03:12 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo

    Brasileiro

    My country was liberated from the Marxist Allende disaster 50 years ago.

    Today Chile is a vibrant thriving democracy with a stable economy.

    Venezuelans destroyed their economy on their own, not because of either the USA or the UK...

    * * *

    The beverage stands has arrived with will insure us with cold beer and Coke on tap.

    ¡Saludos de Panquehue!

    Sep 17th, 2023 - 03:50 pm - Link - Report abuse -1
  • MalvinasArgentinas H&G rights

    Inconvenient truths of the Islas Malvinas # 28

    Britain has three times offered a lease- back or other arrangements on Malvinas, and none of them were accepted by Argentina.

    Perhaps one of the insightful British citizens realizing the travesty of the Malvinas colonialism was public servant John Troutbeck who noted in a memorandum that the opportunistic attack on the Malvinas, and their possession only contributed to show Britain as a common ‘bandit’. Look it up, this memorandum does exist, according to the HuffPost:
    https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/john-wight/argentinas-claim-over-the-falkland-islands-is-legitimate_b_2407749.html

    The Islas Malvinas usurpation is costing Britain more than they bargained for in financial terms, and perhaps even more concerning, in its international relationships, including but not limited, to former allies. Britain’s manipulation of the UN resolutions 2035/1514 etc didn’t sit well with some other governments, as it’s impossible to pass British citizens as ‘colonized, subjugated conquered people inhabiting the Falkland Islands’ (Malvinas), when it is well known they are one and the same: just British citizens. The referendum didn’t change that status neither, and it certainly is not an argument for self-proclamation. To pretend otherwise is just to add another insult to people’s intelligence.

    Sep 17th, 2023 - 04:03 pm - Link - Report abuse -2
  • Brasileiro

    You're still late, Chicureo. Chilhe remains poor and has no prospects.

    And getting worse.

    Sep 17th, 2023 - 04:04 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Tænk

    TWIMC...

    In the first paragraph of the first comment on this thread..., Mr.“FitzRoy” shows clearly who is living in Fantasyland...:

    He candlidy asks...:
    - “In which way do the Falkland Islands cost the UK public? The only financial input from the UK is in defence, and even that is a minuscule amount, less than 1% of the annual defence budget.”

    Let's do the math for him..., shall we...?...:
    - If them Engrish are using...: “A MINUSCULE AMOUNT, LESS THAN 1% OF THEIR ANNUAL DEFENCE BUDGET.” on the defence of some “2,400” souls with Belonger-Kelper Status in windblown Malvinas..., as he himself tells us......

    - We can then..., quickly & easily calculate how many Northern-Brittons can be equally quality-defended with the remaining 99% of the Defence Budget.....:

    99 x 2,400 = 237,600...

    Juppppppp...
    - That would be just enough to quality-defend the ~260,000 souls in Wolverhampton, West Midlands, England, Great Britain, United Kingdom from any Argentinean overpowering attack...

    Chuckle..., chuckle..., chuckle...

    Sep 17th, 2023 - 04:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo

    Brasileiro

    2023 Ranking: Chile leads Latin America in global competitiveness - InvestChile July 2023

    Dear Tænk

    Who do you predict becomes the next president of your dear country?

    Just curious...

    ¡Saludos de Panquehue!

    Sep 17th, 2023 - 05:05 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Tænk

    Hermanito...

    - The person directly responsible for the triumph of Mauricio Macri in 2015..., i'm afraid...

    - Anyhow..., if a milico zángano can evolve into a productive farmer..., why wouldn't an 100% egocentric politician be able to evolve into something a bit more emphatic...?

    Saludos....

    Sep 17th, 2023 - 06:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Chicureo

    Dear Tænk

    I was wondering because the American journalist really has made the interview go completely viral worldwide...

    ... curiosity has made the candidate become a reality..

    The weather here for tomorrow's celibation is perfect!

    ¡Saludos de Panquehue!

    Sep 17th, 2023 - 06:42 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Monkeymagic

    I am afraid Mr Fitzroy got his decimal place in the wrong place....the cost to defend the Falklands is about 0.1% of the UK defence budget. So using Thinks “maths”....and an accurate number of Falkland island “souls” 3793....

    It equates to 3.8million other Britons. Rather more than the population of Wales.....

    Sep 17th, 2023 - 09:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Roger Lorton

    Feeling ignored HeavyGoods? Nobody responding? There may be a good reason for that. Perhaps you should try more facts and less crap?

    Nothing was usurped from Argentina. Argentina had no rights. Argentina has never managed to occupy and hold the islands for more than a few weeks. Not at any point in its history. America threw you off in December, 1831. Britain did the same in January, 1833. If you cannot hold on to a territory, you cannot claim that it is yours.

    The UN? No UN resolution for 35 years. The last was in 1988, and it was answered to the satisfaction of the UN - otherwise they'd have adopted another. The C24 deceives you. Adopts a Falklands resolution in June of every year, only to abandon it in August when it thinks no-one is looking. And 193 members of the UN say - nothing.

    Argentina's supposed support is just so much hot air.

    Sep 17th, 2023 - 10:44 pm - Link - Report abuse +1
  • Juan Cervantes

    MM. only a clueless Gimp like stink can come up with barmy figures like that, he cant even get the population correct, but at least he has got his love fest with the other clueless indoctrinated child to look forward to,, they should form a creche. LMFAO,

    Sep 17th, 2023 - 10:53 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • The English Pirate

    Well, you can't return something that never was, but I'm glad that self-reflection has kicked in. The argentines are definitely the problem. Do let us know as soon as you're a “a serious, respectful, reliable, trust worthy country, with a strong economy and the right friends in the world, instead of a disoriented, begging, friendless country”. I'll wait.

    Sep 19th, 2023 - 01:17 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Falklands-Free

    Not ever will we fall into that trap again of befriending those that showed absolutely no respect to us in 1982.
    It will never happen , no matter the charm they try to use, we are never going to accept their claim or becoming any part of Argentina.
    The quicker they realise that the quicker normal relations with the whole of south America will start.
    Instead of trying these old tactics, go the the ICJ plead your case with them and firmly accept the decision.
    We have nothing to loose on what ever decision they make because either way we wont be joining any part of Argentina.
    Time the whole world started to realise just what in reality Argentina is like. In their statement they admit they are at fault. So the rest of the world start taking notice of what we are saying.

    Sep 21st, 2023 - 03:48 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Pugol-H

    It’s not really a ‘cost’ as such to the defence budget to defend the S. Atlantic, they are deployable forces which if they were not there, they would be somewhere else like the Med, middle east, Rumania or even the far east.

    If you closed the MP base next month you would not save a penny, but merely add the cost of moving everything somewhere else.

    And if the base was closed we all know what would happen, there would be Argy settlements on S. Georgia within a week, Argy ships would be patrolling Falkland’s waters and that would just be the start.

    If the ‘cost’ were ten times as much and 1% of defence spending, or more, this would not be a problem to the British, such is the importance they attach to defending the Islanders rights and the strategic location in the S. Atlantic, not least in securing access to the British Antarctic territories.

    Posted 5 days ago - Link - Report abuse +1

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