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Sweeping changes in Falkland Islands general election

Friday, November 6th 2009 - 13:12 UTC
Full article 102 comments

The Falkland Islands electorate wanted change, and effectively returned eight new names for the Legislative Assembly on Thursday’s General Election. Read full article

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  • welkin

    Punishment vote in Malvinas.

    Is this a light of hope for freedom and friendship??

    Nov 06th, 2009 - 09:14 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • j

    With the such bill luxton they are back several decades. Even worse than mike summers. I don't know what the others think.

    Nov 06th, 2009 - 09:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • jorge

    It was me above.

    Nov 06th, 2009 - 09:23 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • J.A. Roberts

    jorge, exactly what happened when you guys voted in the rabid and crooked Kirschners...

    Nov 07th, 2009 - 01:35 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • welkin

    Jorge, is more important the message of the voters than what Luxton or the others think. The message of the people in Malvinas is very clear, they want a change, they want not only new faces, they want new ideas. And they are saying that the last 4 years policies are a failure. The people is saying that new approach and new ideas to the same old problems is needed; if not they will fail again and islanders will loose another train and in four years we will see again eight new faces.

    Nov 07th, 2009 - 03:35 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Justin Kuntz

    Right.

    You've spent months decrying the FIG claiming it isn't democratic, the people kick them out and all of sudden you seem to have realised it is.

    One thing that won't change is the FIG won't suddenly turn round and decide to become part of Argentina. Don't you get it, the people don't want to be part of Argentina.

    There won't be any resolution until Argentina matures.

    Nov 07th, 2009 - 06:25 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Nicholas

    Can someone please explain to me, because of curiosity, why on earth do Argentines (and I'm sure not all of them) care so much to annex the Falklands to Argentina, while their country is in reality (not if you believe the government “numbers” ) plagued with high unemployed, high inflation, deficits, high public and foreign debt and incompetent legislators?

    Nov 07th, 2009 - 08:29 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • welkin

    long story Nicholas.

    you will find lot of material to read.

    Nov 07th, 2009 - 10:00 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Luis

    Nicholas, i will explain you quite simple, imagine that your neighbor push the wall that divide your property from his, and build a garage in the space he took from your property. Now, you might be in a good economic position, or you might be chased by the bank or something, i dont care, but no matter whats your economic situation, that place, where the garage is located, belongs to you, no matter what. Even if you are rich, you will claim that space becouse you paid for it.
    With malvinas its the same thing. They expelled us in 1833, but not only that, they keeped a 90% of the population of british origin until these days restricting the natural inmigration from the continent.

    Nov 07th, 2009 - 01:13 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • J.A. Roberts

    To paraphrase Luis:

    There was no wall, and the land belonged to the neighbour in the first place so he was perfectly entitled to build a garage on it.

    Everyone knows only the illegal garrison was expelled in 1833, all the rest stayed, some for several decades.

    Please stop peddling lies.

    Nov 07th, 2009 - 02:53 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • neil rogers

    We see again the Islanders right to self determination being infitrated and undermined by British colonialist interests!
    Graham Bound astutely noted in his report on the election how the Chief Executive worked unscrupulously to infiltrate the Islands' administration with imported British agents!
    The Islanders must preserve their integrity by pursuing Independence and freeing themselves from vested British interests and their agents!

    Nov 07th, 2009 - 05:45 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • J.A. Roberts

    Neil, I bet you also believe in UFOs...

    Nov 07th, 2009 - 11:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Justin Kuntz

    You know what, the comments from the Argentine side today are just so ridiculous they don't need a riposte. What utter bollocks.

    I see they expelled us is repeated again, no matter how many times you repeat a lie it doesn't become true.

    Nov 08th, 2009 - 02:38 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Peace please

    Argentina. Please have some pride in your country. You have never experienced war on your soil because if you had you would realise that it is horrendous. Take note of what is happening around the world and be grateful for all you have. The British Falklands will always remain & you could be a good neighbour. History tells us that you are not very neighbourly with Chile, Uruguay or Brazil. Bully comes to mind, so discard the idea of being Hitler followers and practise being the Catholic country you brag to be. Life will be so much better once you are civilised. P.S. There are many Argentine soldiers from the Falklands War who apologise for the part they were forced to play. Please respect them ...... they know only to well what they are talking about and deserve respect from the whole Argentine nation. Let's make 2010 a turning point when Argentina closes the door they allow this aggression to filter though. Life will be so much better in your country by allowing aggression to leave your mind thus freeing up your thoughts with more kindly deeds. Love Thy Neighbour for instance.

    Nov 08th, 2009 - 10:58 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • welkin

    “You have never experienced war on your soil because if you had you would realise that it is horrendous.”

    Books don´t bite peacemaker. I´ll give you some clues so you can look for yourself. 1806-1807; 1833; 1845-1850.

    If british falklands remains the claim remains; is like a mirror. The claim is not against you is only against your political and military link with London, say goodbye to that link; like all your neighbours did in the past, be citizens not colonial subjects, and I bet you that peace will come alone. Britain is a strange body in south atlantic; south atlantic belongs to argentines and kelpers.

    Nov 08th, 2009 - 03:27 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • J.A. Roberts

    “say goodbye to that link... and I bet you that peace will come alone”

    Everyone knows that “peace” you speak of is under an Argentine flag.

    You STILL don't get it Welkin. Why don't you just listen to the Islanders here and in other fora, and stop telling them what they are (under the colonialist yoke etc). The Islanders might not trust the FCO much, but believe me, they trust you Argies a 1000 times less.

    Nov 08th, 2009 - 09:34 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • welkin

    They must believe in their forces, not in FCO or arg. They must believe in their forces to expell the british that are the only cause of the conflict. Argentina showed in ´82 that she hasn´t enough force to expell them yet; now the only one in position to do the work are the islanders, please don´t wait for argentina to have the force to do other people´s work.

    PD: I´m not speaking of a peace under argentina´s flag, I´m speaking of peace under the flag the islanders choose and argentina could accept, those are the two conditions for peace. I think that argentina could accept and independent flag but not a british flag.

    Nov 08th, 2009 - 09:46 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • J.A. Roberts

    Welkin, you really are struggling to get it into your head.

    The Islanders WANT to remain BRITISH. The British garrison would not be there to protect them otherwise.

    As for your PD. You must be one of a very small minority of Argentines who believe that. If that really is the case, then why does your constitution not have a clause saying “the Falklanders can be anything they like except British”? The fact is you constitution says the Falklanders will be Argentine whether they like it or not...

    Nov 08th, 2009 - 10:12 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • welkin

    For me it´s ok if they want to remain a british colony, but please don´t ask for peace when you are sustaining the cause of the conflict alive; and please don´t blame Argentina for the situation and for your choice.

    Argentina constitution is not an obstacule. As I said before in this forum; Argentina Constitution only ask for sovereignty but doesn´t say that it must last forever. Give us sovereignty and in the same moment ask for your independence; Argentina will give it.

    Nov 08th, 2009 - 11:08 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • jorge

    Welkin,
    I recomend you to read luxton “new ideas” then we talk.

    J.A. Roberts said, “jorge, exactly what happened when you guys voted in the rabid and crooked Kirschners...”

    I agree with you man!

    Someone said, “Don't you get it, the people don't want to be part of Argentina.”

    This guy will never understand that we just don't care what they want. We claim our land. We respect their interest, not their wishes.

    peace peace said, “History tells us that you are not very neighbourly with Chile, Uruguay or Brazil.”

    You are living in the past. That was 30 years ago and there were mutual misgivings among all Southamerican countries not just argentina.

    “There are many Argentine soldiers from the Falklands War who apologise for the part they were forced to play.”

    There are the same in the UK part. Many ooficials says that UK one day has to sit to negotiate the soverignty question. Some of them even say UK has to just hand over the islands. Many of them really don't like to spend money to defend you and much of the british media don't support UK side.

    Nov 09th, 2009 - 01:13 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • J.A. Roberts

    jorge, I'm glad we agree on something!

    Still, the “it was our land” argument is false. This has been proved many times over. The Falklands were never “part” of Argentina. That is just a lie perpetuated by the Argentine government.

    And once again Welkin. Where in your constitution does it provide for Falkland Island independence? Which Argentine politician has ever said the Falklands are free to become independent? I'm sorry, but that goes against every statement by Argentine politicians and Argentine policy now and in the past. Malvianas Argentinas (at any cost and whether the Falkland Islanders like it or not) has been your position since the 1940s when this ridiculous “claim” was revived.

    Nov 09th, 2009 - 01:21 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Peace Please

    No matter that there has been a complete change of Councillors, EVERY CANDIDATE that stood, stood for FALKLANDS WILL BE BRITISH FOREVER. There was no divide. Each and every one of them ticked the box on that front.

    We were very lucky to have such a good pool of candidates to choose from. Maybe we could lend some to Argentina and teach them how to run a democracy.

    The vast majority of Argentine soldiers from 1982 thought they were coming to liberate the Falklands ....... a bit of a shock to find we did not speak their language, were British to the core, ........ I bet they were glad to return home and bin the rubbish history books that had been forced on them for so long.

    Bottom line, Falklanders standing for election will never be including in their manifestos a desire to 'occupy' Buenos Aires just because they fancy sovereignty. Civilised nations do not behave in that manner. Tell your dictators to concentrate on the welfare of each and every citizen in Argentina and help contribute to world peace. P.S. Don't tell me I don't know what I'm talking about, I know enough about Argentina to know that the majority of citizens are getting a raw deal. Love yourselves and you will learn to love your neighbours.

    Nov 09th, 2009 - 02:01 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • jorge

    It is not a lie. The only lie here is your self-determination.
    24 countries of group RIO supported our claim this week. Are all of them liers?

    “The Falklands were never ”part“ of Argentina. That is just a lie perpetuated by the Argentine government.”

    Malvinas fueron, son y seran argentinas!!! For ever!!!

    Malvianas Argentinas (at any cost and whether the Falkland Islanders like it or not) has been your position since the 1940s when this ridiculous “claim” was revived.

    The only ridiculous thing here is the UK expenditure of 3000 Crown subjects!!!

    Nov 09th, 2009 - 02:03 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • jorge

    “Maybe we could lend some to Argentina and teach them how to run a democracy.”

    Otro caradura!!! You can't teach anything. You are not a democracy. Until now You had no councillors, just 8 clowns.

    “I bet they were glad to return home and bin the rubbish history books that had been forced on them for so long.”

    Ignorant!!! Why don't you ask veterans what they think about.

    “Tell your dictators to concentrate on the welfare of each and every citizen in Argentina and help contribute to world peace.”

    Argentina has peace keeping forces in several parts of the world to help maintain peace unlike you that invade Irak And Afghanistan.

    “Don't tell me I don't know what I'm talking about, I know enough about Argentina to know that the majority of citizens are getting a raw deal. Love yourselves and you will learn to love your neighbours.”

    You don't know a bit about Argentina. You just put “argentina” on some kind of Wikipedia and start talking nonsenses.
    You show with your comments that you are just an I-G-N-O-R-A-N-T!!!
    And why don't you put your name? Because that “peace please” is not believable at all.

    Nov 09th, 2009 - 02:17 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • khh

    Well I met a couple of Arg vets of the 125th infantary reg here in the FALKLANDS 6 months ago. They both broke down in tear when talking about the war, could not apolagise enough for what there country had done to ours. Had nothing good to say about the Argientine goverment at all. You may ask were they putting it on? Well raw emotion works in many ways, anger or gilt. and theres was gilt for what the Arg Goverment had done.
    And lets face it you have never had a modern war on your home land.I tell you it is were different.

    Nov 09th, 2009 - 06:35 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Justin Kuntz

    Jorge,

    Keep up the ignorant bile filled rants, you do more to convince the islanders they wish to remain British than anything else.

    Nov 09th, 2009 - 07:08 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • welkin

    Please don´t talk about war as victims, the only victim here is justice.

    You talk but you forget that Argentina is a peacefull country, we don´t understand war, you saw that in ´82. In the contrary britain is a butcher country, a militarist society, britain has her hands cover with blood; they bullied every part of the world; even our part of the world. Do you think it´s possible we can tolerate this situation in our shores?? We are an unarmed nation, we only want to trade, develop and interact. We need a Malvinas britain free. Keep your govermen, but your goverment without external influence, we don´´t want your land, we want peace; and with the butcher in our shores that´s imposible. Please, if you really want to keep living in peace start living in 21stcentury. You call us bully boy. But the real bully butcher is britain, your reputation precedess you, we can´t tolerate in the land of freedom and peace such a threat to our safety and freedom. Be britain if you want, but please don´t ask for peace when you don´t give it.

    Nov 09th, 2009 - 07:30 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • jorge

    khh,
    I think(know) you are just inventing. Show me who those veterans are. I dare you!

    J.K. said, “Keep up the ignorant bile filled rants, you do more to convince the islanders they wish to remain British than anything else.”

    I don't have or want to convince islanders. I don't care what they wish. Don't you get it yet?
    As I said many times, it is not only Agentina persuing the withdrawal of UK from there. It is a sub-continental interest you'll notice more often in coming years.

    Nov 09th, 2009 - 07:59 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Peace please

    Gosh, this constant demand telling Falkland Islanders that they are not British and have no sovereign rights is very tiresome. I'm just wondering if any of the anti Falkland bashers have ever had their sovereignty or nationality threatened?

    Visit the lovely city of Santiago and ask the average man in the street what they think of Argentine politics, or just read their daily papers, I don't think you can consign the bully behaviour of Argentine to the history books of 30 years ago as was suggested above .... it's still current. Shame on you. If you wish to add value to the world, stop bemoaning the Falklands, head straight to the Argentine Rulers of today and help them sort out the incredible problems they are facing. Argentines have been blessed with a great country .... help them sort it out.

    Nov 09th, 2009 - 10:41 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • JustinKuntz

    “I don't have or want to convince islanders. I don't care what they wish. Don't you get it yet?”

    You illustrate Argentina's attitude perfectly, whilst they may talk soothing platitudes on the surface, their feelings toward the islanders are ones of utter contempt and naked racism. Trust Argentina to respect their wishes? Yeah right.

    Nov 09th, 2009 - 04:05 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • welkin

    No one is saying that you are not british and that you have no rights; keep being british but with no britain.

    I don´t understand the relationship between your peace demand (giving nothing) and your observation about argentine politics & argentine reality...are you saying that the day we have fine politics and be a better country you will want to be you will be argentines ?? Fine, let´s wait, we can do it.

    Nov 09th, 2009 - 06:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • J.A. Roberts

    welkin,

    It's been said before. The Falklands are not Britain. They are a different jurisdiction. They have their own laws. They control their own immigration. British citizens do not have an automatic right to live there.

    Please get over the fact that the Falklands are not Britain, that they are not controlled by London and the Falklanders are not under some colonialist yoke. They do not want to be part of Argentina. Why can't you just get over that and live with them as neighbours?

    When did you last travel to and stay for any time in the UK welkin? Just interested...

    Nov 09th, 2009 - 07:18 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • JustinKuntz

    Actually no, a nation that has respect for self-determination and democratic processes would not be pursuing an illogical irredentist claim. It would also engage with the islanders on matters of mutual interest.

    “keep being british but with no britain. ”

    Keep being Argentine but without the rhetoric.

    Nov 09th, 2009 - 07:20 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • khh

    Be real jorge, I will give you no names because i dont want them found face down in a ditch a few days later.
    Does any one remember the Concordia Bay incident in christmas 2000. When a shit load of specialist military equipment was discoverd out there ,All brand new. I was in the infantry at the time and saw what they had. It was ARG special forces through & through. You talk of peace and want to talk but what you sent was a war party.
    Get it through your head we want to be British, We want the British Army here.

    Nov 09th, 2009 - 08:21 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • welkin

    if the falklands are not britain I don´t understand why they are called in london as BOT (euphemism of colony); why they are still sending an unelected governor with ultimate executive functions, why they still runs all foreign affairs, why a british officials wrote Malvinas constitution without a democratic consultation in the islands; why british military the; why british reivindications over continental shelf, etc, etc.

    yes we can live as neighbours, but neighbours with kelpers not with britain, britain to europe please, not here. For me it´s ok if they don´t want to be part of Argentina, we can accept that, but please don´t ask us to accept britain presence here in south cone. One hand wash the other and both wash the face.

    I traveled to UK in 2000 and 2005; to Malvinas in 2004; what´s the point??

    Nov 09th, 2009 - 08:30 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • JustinKuntz

    Welkin,

    The latest constitution was in fact written by the islanders themsleves, they were fully consulted in a democratic manner. The British military is only there to provide a defence guarantee in light of past Argentine aggression. The British Government provides foreign representation because the FIG is a bit on the small side; though noticeably they represent themselves at the annual farce at the UN. The British announcement over the continental shelf was a requirement under the UNCLOS. Of course you view everything through jaundiced eyes, you're so full of hate that you can only see things in a distorted way. Checking a few basic facts would mean you look less like a prat.

    Its what the islanders want, if you don't like it, then to be honest tough. Their choice, Argentina lost the right to comment when it sought to use force.

    Nov 09th, 2009 - 09:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • J.A. Roberts

    I was just interested in if you had travelled to the UK welkin because of the way you describe the British. A militarist society, butcher country etc. That's not how I would describe the British, but if you are trying to say they are not cowards and are prepared to face up to their responsibilities then you are correct.

    I find it ironic that you have a problem with a BOT near the southern cone, but apparently have no problems with a full-blown French colony on the continent. I never hear Argentina shouting about what an insult French Guyana is? Double standards?

    Nov 09th, 2009 - 09:27 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • welkin

    French Guayana is not a treat to Argentina; and that colony exists previous all moderns countries in south america. They are like a relic from 17st century european colonial domination.

    Malvinas as a colony, (I´m glad you accepted it as a british colony) exists since our post-emancipation process. Malvinas pre 1833 was an emancipated and republican territory, free from any colonialistic and extraregional power. Malvinas in 1833 went backwards in south american´s history clock.

    Nov 09th, 2009 - 09:41 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • welkin

    I forget it.

    Please we don´t want your “bravery” or your “responsabilities” in our shores. Perhaps iraquies or afghans needs you now, as in the past indues, zulus, red skins, chinese, aussie aborigins, maories, and the list goes on. No please, don´t ask argies to accept britain here; we want peace and britain is not a synonim of that.

    Nov 09th, 2009 - 09:50 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • JustinKuntz

    Patagonia pre-1885 wasn't part of Argentina, nor were the pieces of Patagonia you stole during the War of the Triple Alliance.

    Double standards?

    The Falklands are not a colony, they have moved forward a long way towards full independence. The only stumbling block is the threat of a recalitrant and bullying neighbour.

    And talking of double standards, its ironic that you criticise “17st century european colonial domination” yet espouse Argentina does the same in the Falklands.

    Double standards indeed.

    Nov 09th, 2009 - 09:51 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • J.A. Roberts

    Welkin, Please show me where I said the Falklands were a colony? You put words in my mouth, something I would never have the arrogance to do to you and don't pretend you thought BOT = colony, we all know you are not that stupid.

    You think it's OK to have a colonial anachronism exist on your continent because it was there “before modern south american countries”. How confused are you? You are just twisting and turning but making no sense. Just like your government when presented with the facts concerning the Falkland Islands.

    And please don't bring up past colonial wars. For two reasons: 1 The UK has long stopped being a coloniser and has a long history of giving independence to ex colonies, most of which remain on good terms and 2. Argentina is just as guilty of colonial expansion and bloodshed. Until you have truly washed your own hands of Mapuche blood and atoned for the slaughter of other innocents you have no leg to stand on. You were committing genocide right up till the 1920s. Go and ask the Napalpis (if there are any left). You are just as guilty. You have just made yourself look like a fool...

    Nov 09th, 2009 - 10:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Islander

    All this Argentina with only peace etc- how come then the Typhoon Eurofighters here are regularily scrambled to intercept Argentine jets flying directly towards the Islands from Argentina? Of course as soon as they know the Typhoons are airborne then the Argentines turn around and run for home each time! Argentina today talks peace? I dont think so.

    Nov 10th, 2009 - 11:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • jorge

    peace please said, “Visit the lovely city of Santiago and ask the average man in the street what they think of Argentine politics, or just read their daily papers, I don't think you can consign the bully behaviour of Argentine to the history books of 30 years ago as was suggested above .... it's still current. Shame on you.”

    Why don't you ask the average man in the whole world about what they think of the British?

    Justin (racist) Kunts said, “You illustrate Argentina's attitude perfectly, whilst they may talk soothing platitudes on the surface, their feelings toward the islanders are ones of utter contempt and naked racism. Trust Argentina to respect their wishes? Yeah right.”

    You are the racists. You prevented argentine passport holders to enter into Malvinas almost 20 years. Nobody did that with german citizens after WWII. NAKED RACISM.

    J.A. Roberts said, “They do not want to be part of Argentina. Why can't you just get over that and live with them as neighbours?”

    Sorry to disapoint you, but that will not happen.

    khh said, “Be real jorge, I will give you no names because i dont want them found face down in a ditch a few days later.”

    jajajajajajajajajajajajajajajajajajajaja!!!!!!!! What could I tell you! You are not serious.

    “Get it through your head we want to be British, We want the British Army here.”

    Well, why don't you bring more of that? When british tax payer get tired of you they will give you an ass kicking!!!

    Islander said, “All this Argentina with only peace etc- how come then the Typhoon Eurofighters here are regularily scrambled to intercept Argentine jets flying directly towards the Islands from Argentina? Of course as soon as they know the Typhoons are airborne then the Argentines turn around and run for home each time! Argentina today talks peace? I dont think so.”

    Where did you get that? my god!! Is that what the soldiers tell you?
    Islander, with all the respect, I advise you to raise your head a bit more to see what happens out there. Trust me.

    Regards.

    Nov 11th, 2009 - 08:56 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • J.A. Roberts

    “Sorry to disapoint you, but that will not happen.”

    jorge, I think you guys will be the ones more disappointed in the end...

    Nov 11th, 2009 - 10:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • JustinKuntz

    Ah Jorge, no, I've never felt the need to resort to racist insults, or insults in general. They trip all too readily from your tongue. Don't judge people by your own low standards.

    Neither is there anything racist about a travel ban on the nation that resorted to naked aggression and launched an unprovoked invasion, then tried to subjugate the population with random deportations, imprisonment and internal exile.

    And in response to suggestions of living in peace and mutual co-operation...“Sorry to disapoint you, but that will not happen.”

    Doesn't disappoint anybody, they're used to it. Just expect to become irrelevant.

    And finally, I note that yet again you patronisingly turn around and tell someone living there they don't know what is happening, when you sit 400 odd miles away. I think you should consider taking your own advice.

    Nov 11th, 2009 - 10:57 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • khh

    Well, why don't you bring more of that? When british tax payer get tired of you they will give you an ass kicking!!!
    Remember jorge it was you who got your ass kicked.
    It is your country that is no good at war. pussys

    Nov 11th, 2009 - 10:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • jorge

    J.A. Roberts, I don't agree with you on that.

    Khh, are you 8 or 9? You talk as if uk had had a flawless victory. May be the conveyor is greeting you from the bottom of the sw atlantic together with the gral. belgrano. Of course my country is not good at wars. I have to congratulate you because uk is very very good at it. It shows it every day! And you tell us pussys. Well, you are just a little worm which only due to the oxygen is free.

    Nov 12th, 2009 - 04:36 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • jorge

    I meant “which only breath due to the oxygen is free” And justin (propagandista de cuarta) kuntz, you couldn't justify what I said. You practised racism against argentina almost 20 years. Did you like the way I put your name this time? Was it original?

    Nov 12th, 2009 - 04:44 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Jammy G

    You're right about one thing Jorge, khh is a little worm.

    Nov 12th, 2009 - 08:34 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Peace please

    Gosh, reading all the press reports today from Argentina, I don't think you could even convince the average good Argentine that they deserve the mess Argentina is in. Tell me one good reason why the Falkland Islanders would wish to share your Mrs K.?

    And just for info, Argentines are welcome to come to the Falklands. They present their Argentine passport and it is stamped as everyone else is, ie with a Falkland Islands stamp, to enter this British island. The Falklands also welcomed the Argentine Families Association on their pilgrimmage.

    We are not anti Argentine, ie if any country in the world is out hunting down little Islands, we are just not for sale. And we will never go out hunting down other countries to try and claim sovereignty.

    So how about sending blogs to Mrs K to sort out Argentina instead of wasting energy trying to create a history portfolio that even your Granny would probably tell you is Argentine propoganda.

    Nov 12th, 2009 - 09:38 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • JustinKuntz

    Jorge there is nothing racist about a travel ban on a country that resorted to naked aggression and launched an unprovoked invasion, then tried to subjugate the population with random deportations, imprisonment and internal exile. Thought I may have to restate it, since its obviously gone over your head.

    Even though there was a travel ban, the islanders still facilitated the visits of the families of the bereaved. And I'm still yet to hear a formal apology from the Argentine Government for launching its unprovoked attack.

    Nov 12th, 2009 - 05:03 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Billy Hayes

    perhaps you will hear a formal apology from argentina the day we hear the same apology from uk for launching its unprovoked attack in 1833.

    but don´t worry, we don´t need any apology only the malvinas hand back. you want an apology?? yes, that day!!

    don´t worry fake-peaceplease, k will leave soon; then you see. We can wait and work to a be a better country to have malvinas back; in the meantime we will continue claiming as usual.

    Nov 13th, 2009 - 02:21 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • lola

    I don´t understand, you have a nick “peace please” but your message is all the contrary. You are not asking for peace, you are asking argentina to surrender her claim, that´s not the same. If you ask for peace you must be asking for a deal and not talking nonsense about argentina, passports or how we tell our own history.

    PD: the only country that have been hunting little island around the world have been britain, you are the perfect example of that: a british living in malvinas because of that. I don´t see argentine islands in north atlantic or in the pacific or anywhere else; can you say the same about britain???

    Nov 13th, 2009 - 02:43 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • J.A. Roberts

    Billy, please stop peddling lies.

    There was no unprovoked attack in 1833. The illegal Buenos Aires garrison was removed, peacefully, and most of the civilians stayed on, some for decades afterwards.

    Nov 13th, 2009 - 02:55 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Billy Hayes

    hahahaha...illegal?? who said it was illegal?? if it was illegal why didn´t they ask first or why didn´t they give an ultimatum to BsAs?? please give me more information about the trial that declares buenos aires garrison as illegal.

    well, in 82 argentina did the same....british illegal garrison was removed, bloodless, and all the civilians stayed on.

    Nov 13th, 2009 - 03:15 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Billy Hayes

    1833 invasion was unprovocked; but 82 events were provoked, provoked for 150 years of usurpation.

    Nov 13th, 2009 - 03:28 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Islander

    Billy , so 1st April 1982 was bloodless? Then tell me Why did Argentine Forces hit the British barracks here in the night with phosphorous grenades and heavy gunfire? Why did some Islanders only survive because they lay flat on the floor in their homes while Argetnine machine gun bullets came in through the walls barely 45cm above floor level? Luckily the British Marines were already out guarding other places. Argentine Forces Meant to maim and kill- that was very very clear - luckily they missed. And afterwards - if Argentina meant the Islanders no harm - they why did your Military gestapo Police have a list of several hundred Islanders who were due to be deported to Buenos Aires and “dissappeared” in July 82 - luckily Britain won the war or many of us would have soon been dead. AS for the silly phrase “get the malvinas back” - how can you get something back that was never clearly internationally legally yours? Some of the British side claims may be a bit questionable also - but in the 21st century it is peoples and self determination that are the accepted international democratic principles - otherwise why are Arg troops part of the UN in places like Cyprus?

    Nov 13th, 2009 - 04:43 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Islander

    Jorge, Sorry mate - I live here - thats why I know a bit more about the reality than you - yes the jets are scrambled quite often to meet and head off unidentified aircraft coming from Argentina - sorry it is a fact,we talk to the pilots, and the Commanders here say it openly as well - and sometimes passing the airport you see and hear it happen. So your Country still threatens military aggression.That is why UK maintains strong forces here.

    Nov 13th, 2009 - 04:51 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Justin Kuntz

    Ah there we go, no apology just more of the same excuses for a senseless war that cost the lives of nearly a 1000 young men, and at least that many have died by their own hand since. The excuse being apparently that in the 21st Century Britain is supposed to apologise for something done in the 19th, that something which didn't actually happen.

    What happened in 1833, was that Argentina ignored numerous protests about its intentions in the Falklands, pissed of the Americans and the British finally solved the matter. We didn't go ashore guns blazing, we anchored in the harbour and politely asked the garrison to leave. However, contrary to modern Argentina garrison, the settlement (all 27 of them) were unmolested. This was of course because Vernet had sought permission from the British for his venture, one of the inconvenient facts that get omitted from the Argentine version.

    And the other big lie, elevates HMS Clio to a Frigate, outgunning the tiny Sarandi. Clio was a Brig-Sloop, the smallest ship in the Royal Navy, with 18 guns versus the 14 larger guns on the Sarandi.

    Now Onslow could have humiliated Pinedo but no he didn't, he handed Pinedo back his colours, for the period a most magnanimous gesture.

    So if Argentina is offended by the exchange of polite notes in 1833, then perhaps its time you grew up.

    Nov 13th, 2009 - 06:50 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • khh

    Yes Billy, Islander is right about everything, your commandos launched a murderess attack on the Moody Brook Barracks. They planed to kill every Marine in there. But the boot was on the other foot on 2nd April. It was our Marines who Inflicted HEAVY casualties on your troops. The history books may say only one Argientine was killed on 2nd April but the reality it was very diffrent. x1 Amtrack Hit with a rocket ,18 killed, x1 landingcraft sunk in the narrows, ?killed. the fighting around Goverment house was hard on your troops, one marine sniper is said to have killed 3. Not many people know of the Amtrack but it happend, that I can assure you. But of cause it was wisked away sharpish and coverd up.

    Nov 13th, 2009 - 07:20 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • khh

    Prehaps I will mention South Georgia later, and the defence the Royal Marines made!!!

    Nov 13th, 2009 - 07:23 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Billy Hayes

    2º april was bloodless for british personel and kelpers, that´s the reality that matters and that was a political objetive, it was planned to be a bloodless disembark. What come next is another history.

    grow up?? well, argentina is not who is stuck in time, colonial times are over inthe world and in the region 200 years ago, my friends. Perhaps kelpers must grow up and be something different than colonial subjects.

    Nov 13th, 2009 - 09:29 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Peace please

    I'm sure Welkin & Luis you are fine people but you are so uneducated when it comes to the Falklands because of your poor history classes. You can't be blamed for this but I have to reiterate that Falkland Islanders are very happy with their country. The aggression towards the Falklands, coming from the Argentine Government, you should try not to associate yourselves with. When I talk about peace, there is no way that Falkland Islanders would be aggressive towards neighbouring countries or go heaven forbid, invade a foreign land. We need the British Forces to defend us from Argentine aggression but you sure as hell don't need an army to defend yourselves from us because we are not into territory claiming. I'm sure you will visit the Falklands one day and think “what on earth was I rattling on about”.

    Nov 13th, 2009 - 11:06 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • welkin

    what´s your problem?? me or the message?? you are BSpeaceplease.

    you talk about agression?? why don´t you look the agression britain did to us; you are the perfect proof of that every day you live in malvinas; why you see the history with one eye?

    you are lying when you say that the only reason why britain is here is to defend you; you are a lier.

    You are the excuse for them not the real cause. If not, why they claim antartica, georgias, sandwith, and the aregentine continental shelf.....there is no people living there, no selfdetermination there...the real cause is colonization of other people resourses.

    You see, you are a lier when you ask for peace but you don´t say anything to bring peace, all the contrary you only want one side surrender; and that´s not peace.

    If you want peace please say how you will bring justice to south atlantic, if not don´t ask for anything you are no prepared to give.

    Nov 13th, 2009 - 12:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • J.A. Roberts

    Welkin, so why are there only 4 Typhoons if Britain is not there to defend? ONLY FOUR.

    As for the continental shelf, it does not all belong to Argentina. And anyway, how many people are there in the bit of Antarctica Argentina likest to show on the back of their passports? So much for respecting international treaties...

    Nov 13th, 2009 - 04:29 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • welkin

    hey; who is using my nick??? jejejejeje; I didn´t write the 64 message.

    Anyway, what´s the relationship between what fake-welkin is saying and the four typhoon?? I think, roberts, that your are completely missing the point.

    hey fake-welkin!!....(Billy Hayes??) stop using my nick...jejejejeje
    you are the uneducated, not me.........ups.

    Nov 13th, 2009 - 06:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • J.A. Roberts

    @ el verdadero welkin,

    I'm sorry. How am I missing the point?

    Nov 13th, 2009 - 07:00 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Billy Hayes

    sorry welkin, yes, I used your nick, I used your nick beacuse I´m uneducated. Sadly it is not the first time that in this forum meesenger is hit instead the message.

    Roberts, you are not missing my point, you are supporting it.
    The 4 typhoons, the military personel, the governor, the british agents, FCO activity, kelper unvoted constitution, etc., are not in Malvinas to defend selfdetermination, selfdetermination is a mask; the kelpers are an excuse. The real cause of that presence is territorial ambition; resources ambition to sustain the british decadent world position.
    There is no selfdetermination in antartica to defend, or in georgias or in sandwich...so, why is britain there?? I answer you....for the same reason that they are in Malvinas...greed.

    Nov 13th, 2009 - 08:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Expat Kelper

    Billy Hayes,

    Clearly not the real Billy (silly Billy...yes) but the El malvinense sidekick and supporter no doubt unless you are cloneing regularly.

    If the Brits are in the Falklands as a result of greed please tell me where the profit is? There has been none whatsoever in the last 176 years.

    There is also no certainty of any gain in the near future either. If and a big if there is oil confirmed then the islanders will be the main beneficiaries not the UK Government.

    All beyond your concepts, I understand this of course. Ha, Ha

    Nov 13th, 2009 - 09:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Billy Hayes

    I don´t know where is the profit, you tell me or better, ask your colonial master about this point, why they are claiming argentine & chilean antartica; and why they are selling fishing licenses in georgias and sandwich.

    But please tell what are your masters doing in georgias, sandwich, antartica and continental shelf if selfdetermination is the cause of british presence in Argentina´s region. whose selfdetermination?? penguins?? ilex??

    Perhaps I´m silly, like most of argentines of good will, but I prefer to be silly and not a lier and an hypocrite.

    Nov 13th, 2009 - 10:01 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • J.A. Roberts

    Sorry Billy, but after 60 years of giving away independence to the colonies, reluctantly at first, sure but it has been done and any territory which has asked for independence has got it. The UK also has a pretty good relationship with the vast majority of its ex colonies, so your views about the UK territorial ambition rings a bit hollow...

    The Falklands and their dependencies remain British because THEY have asked for that and that is how it will stay until THEY decide otherwise.

    Nov 13th, 2009 - 10:23 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Expat Kelper

    Billy,

    It is patently obvious how little you understand about this situation.

    Both Chile and Argentina are Johnny-come-latelys to Antarctic claims and cannot produce any evidence whatsoever of their prior substantive occupation giving them hegemony over the area.

    My personal view is that the Antarctic in any event is to all intents and purposes de-facto international territory and will effectively remain so. In the meantime all participants reserve their position as always.

    Fishing companies buy licences from the controlling powers I expect they don't give a sh1t who that is. On the other hand if it was your country they would also have to add to their costs the time honoured bribe and other corruptions surely?

    Self-determination is the civilised consequence of the British presence in the Falklands not the cause. Do wake up Billy.

    SGSSI have no prospect of self-determination and will remain British Overseas Territories.

    Of course they could possibily become a future part of an alliance of British territories in the South Atlantic. OMG what would you do then?

    Nov 14th, 2009 - 01:04 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Islander

    Billy, where are you coming from? 2nd April 1982 was planned as a bloodless operatoin? I thought some of us had shown you the evidence that it was very much planned as NOT bloodless purely by luck it was as far as our side was concerned. As for all this stuff about us as colonial subjects etc etc like 200 years ago - WE wrote our Constitution- UK lawyers then finetuned it.We stopped being a Colony - as the world knows a traditional colony years ago- We elect our Government which makes all decisions on government inside the islands,laws,taxes etc etc. The Governor has no vote-he can only vote if there is a tie 50-50. UK would let us become independent tomorrow if we wanted it. But we dont because we know we would last just a few days until your side invaded again and then we would be a real Colony of Argentina -a Colony is a territory where another power rules over the local people and often against their wishes - and that is exactly how it would be if Arg ever took over.
    Yes there is a problem between the Islands and Argentina - some of us on these pages agree it needs a new approach to find a solution acceptable to both sides. You just seem to believe only in the one thing that will never ever happen - Argentine takeover of the Islands.
    As for the seabed claims etc in Antarctic waters - ALL countries are obliged to make them under the current UN ruling - or loose your right to any of them. Thats why UK,Chile and Arg have all made them. In reality nothing more will happen -as it is a disputed area - the UN will just leave it as it is. The others are right - in practise the current type of Antarctic Treaty will just carry on with no boundaries formally recognized by any claimant.

    Nov 14th, 2009 - 09:57 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • BillyHayes

    Please, islander, tell me where you read from me that Malvinas should be an argentine colony. I´ve never said that. You only know colonial situation so you think that this is the only situation that exists.
    I believe in your autonomy, I believe in your rights, I believe that Argentina & Malvinas can build a situation of peace. Perhaps we can build, in future, a confederation situation, or perhaps a super autonomical Malvinas with symbolical sovereign ties with Argentina. I don´t think that nobody in Argentina wish to rule over you....your masters are lying you, or you are a lier; or you don´t understand argentine feeling about Malvinas.
    The problem, as most of my fellow countrymen are saying here are the british, not kelpers; build your own country as you want but you must understand that we can´t tolerate british political & military influence.
    The british are like chamaleons, in Malvinas they are there because of selfdetermination, in georgias and sandwich because of a force situation, and in antartica becacause they sailed first there....jajajaja....and they said that this is more important than living next door to antartica with a natural conexion.
    British are using you as an excuse and as you tolerate that you are connivers.

    Nov 14th, 2009 - 08:03 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • J.A. Roberts

    “I believe in your autonomy, I believe in your rights”
    So why can't you believe that the Falkland Islanders have chosen (through and open democratic process) to remain British (for the time being)?

    “symbolical sovereign ties with Argentina”
    Why does this even need to happen? Why can't you just interact with the Falkland Islanders as they are? Why does there always have to be Argentine sovereignty in the mix somewhere?

    “I don´t think that nobody in Argentina wish to rule over you”
    So why does the Argentine constitution advocate exactly that?

    “build your own country as you want”
    Argentina constantly denies the Falkland Islanders this right.

    “we can´t tolerate british political & military influence” Well then drop your claim and allow the Falkland Islanders the freedom to become independent without the threat of Argentine aggression.

    “The british are like chamaleons”
    Argentina is pretty good at this too, changing colour to suit the situation...

    British are using you as an excuse and as you tolerate that you are connivers.
    In one breath you are say you believe in the Falkland Islanders right to autonomy and rights but then you accuse them of being “connivers” (whatever that means) when they exercise those same rights. You are more than a bit confused Billy.

    Nov 14th, 2009 - 09:20 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Islander

    Billy, I am glad that you do believ in our rights and autonomy and yes one day there needs to be a solution that might include a method where we/UK offer Arg sovereignty and Arg simultaneosly devolves it to the Islands so all sides can claim their principles respected and we end up a small independent nation with links to both UK as commonweath member(like a little NewZealand) and Argentina in trade and S America etc. But I think that may be some time yet as there are hardliners on both sides.
    Britain and Defence is only here for one reason - we want them to be because of the threat we are in and Britain respects our wishes, they are not here because they want to be! I am sure that Britain would far prefer to not have forces here and the cost. Their political influence is only in that as most of us are decended from there many generations ago - it is natural that we look to base our systems on their legal and political systems. You have had 200 years to change all your systems to purely Argentione ones but I expect that in early days many of them were also similar to Spanish ones - it is natural.
    One thing I am starting to see from these forums is that there are some Argentines who say we Islanders are not the problem - it is that we are British that is the problem? If this is correct then there is some hope for a future solution - but it needs to be understood that while the official Arg policy remains as at present , then we have to look to a large friendly power to protect us - and that is naturally Britain.

    Nov 15th, 2009 - 08:30 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Billy Hayes

    Fine, but the problem is that we don´t see that britain is here only to protect you, that´s why I talk about Georgias, Sandwich, Antartica, and the continental shelf. You are saying one thing and in Argentina we see another, we are seing a world power trying to dominate most of the south atlantic, under the excuse of 2500 people selfdetermination they are trying to dominate an area with resourses to 40millon people. That´s the reason of Argentina´s policies. Britain presence is the cause of Argentina´s policies, they are not here protecting you they are causing the conflict; they are the reason of your need of protection. It´s like a paradox.
    If the only problem is your security, your fear, your lack of trust, there are international mechanisms, succesfull international mechanisms, for example blue helmets.

    Nov 15th, 2009 - 07:21 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Justin Kuntz

    Sorry Billy but that is BS. Britain had virtually no presence in the Falklands prior to 1982, the sole presence was the 40 Royal Marines of NP 8901 and there were only there because of Argentine terrorism in 1965. The sole reason for Britain's presence is to deter further aggression and the British would be content with zero presence as there was prior to 1965.

    The British presence is not the reason for Argentine policies, the British did not cause the conflict. The conflict was started and is sustained by Argentina resurrecting an illogical 19th century irredentist claim and constructing national myths on that basis.

    The British are doing nothing to dominate the area, there are 4 Typhoons to provide a minimal defensive posture that is all.

    As to the other areas, Argentina only contrived a claim to South Georgia and other territories in 1947. They had been British for a long time before that.

    Nov 15th, 2009 - 11:24 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • J.A. Roberts

    Billy, the Falkland Islanders have very good reason to fear and distrust Argentina, so the problem is not only theirs but also Argentina's behaviour in the past and in the present. Please accept responsibility for the problem, because you certainly are responsible for causing it.

    What can't you just treat the Falklanders as neighbours, much in the way you treat Chile and Uruguay and Paraguay etc? Why can't you?

    Nov 15th, 2009 - 11:32 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • nitrojuan

    Chile isnt a good example for argentina. Here in the Argentina Patagonian they came to health, job. Santiago wont be never like the rich Buenos Aires, chilean women went to BA to work in our houses, like chilean men came to Patagonia to work in farm & hards works. If you go to Rio Gallegos or Ushuaia you could compare a civilate culture and City to the disaster of Punta Arenas (like a CentralAmerica city). I cant image living in a dictactorship island like the Malvinas. For me and many inmigrants (american, paraguayan , uruguayan, chilean, italian) Argentina is the best place to live.

    Nov 16th, 2009 - 03:36 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Islander

    Billy, JK and JJR are correct, the british forces are only here to prevent further Arg military agression against us. Arg sends atill at times sends its Air Force jets towards the Islands,its warships have steamed through the fishery zone and shone searchlights at civilain ships demanding they indentify themselves - all this in outside anybodys territorial limits for some examples.As for blue helmets - they can only police a place after a war and with consent of both sides - they do not stop wars- look at many of the atrocities against civilians in Bosnia - Blue helmets just stood and watched as they had no power. We need a power that we know will protect us.

    Nov 16th, 2009 - 08:39 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Islander

    Nitrojuan, Since when do we live in a dictatorship here? we have a democracy as well and just elected a 100% new Assembly to make our Laws - Uk does not make laws here and the Governor does not even have a vote in a meeting - unless their is a 50/50 tied vote.

    Nov 16th, 2009 - 08:43 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • nitrojuan

    Islander you live in a farse and a Circus in Stanley,and you know that. We (argies) learnt that with forse didnt recover anything & my fathers generation learnt that the dictarships never works in any part of the World. We lost a lot of things with that stupid war. For generation the claim of our Malvinas will be more strong, but make sure that you didnt need an Air Force in times of peace. Malvinas is the bridge that UK needs to Antarctica (the great reserve of waters) and you are the toys. If UK interest really you (and dont have really doubt about their sovernity), maybe now you are a free commonwealth nation with 200.000 inhabitants, like Tierra del Fuego Province with that population in a Federal System. (sorry for my english)

    Nov 16th, 2009 - 10:42 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • J.A. Roberts

    nitrojuan,

    Why don't you go to the Falklands to see for yourself before telling a Falkland Islander how Falkland Islanders live! They don't live in a farce or a circus. Get your facts right.

    Nov 16th, 2009 - 06:36 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • JustinKuntz

    I think you'll find that the British Government is already committed to granting independence to any BOT that requests it. It has increasingly devolved Government to the territories themselves.

    Its up to them to determine their own future.

    Nov 16th, 2009 - 09:16 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • nitrojuan

    Mr Robert, worse than a Circus, Malvinas are similar Cuba and their governor like Fidel. Maybe one saturday I ll visit Malvinas via Rio Gallegos, but the problem will be when they try to print the FALKLAND PIRATE STAMP in my passport to entry in my own country and part of my own Province (Tierra del Fuego, Antarctica & South Atlantic Islands).

    Nov 17th, 2009 - 09:53 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Wuzzie

    Nitrojuan. I think you are a bit muddled. The one thing that Argentina did gain after the 1982 War was the overthrow of their dictator and thus sparked the beginning of democracy for Argentina, not as we know it, but nevertheless, it was a start. Now if you were to focus your energy on developing your own democracy, where there's hundreds of years to catch up on most of us, Argentina might make progress & friends ~ just stop being aggressive neighbours. I doubt you will convince anyone in the world to become an Argentine unless they are desperate so just count us out as well. Falkland Islanders will not be trying to convert you to join us. You will forever have to have your passport stamped like people from all over the world (that's what civilised countries do). And I'm quite happy to have my passport stamped when entering Argentina (should that happen). Non of this is a big deal but how democracies work. There will be many fine Argentines that are more educated in Falkland affairs that would probably tell you that it is time to get off your soapbox.

    Nov 17th, 2009 - 11:51 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • nitrojuan

    Of course Wuzzie, like we have many kelpers that came to live here in Argentina cause the dictartoship in Malvinas. We are in the XXI century now, where colonialism is so far. We have internet in the Continent and we can see what happend in Malvinas (forse to being a country that never will be), It isnt a close community like eighties anymore. You need to participe in this great community calling W-O-R-L-D, for that, how do you image Malvinas participate or introduce itself?? like a “Colony” ??, a free country?? I dont think so.

    Nov 18th, 2009 - 01:21 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • nitrojuan

    And Wuzzie, we will not convince to anyone to live in Argentina, they came alone all the XX Century. And the time to convince the kelpers was in the nineties with Di Tella, you lost that oportunity, now are times to intense diplomatic job, how do you see living in your country: United Kindom.?? Maybe it gives peace to you and think living without shame occuping foreing lands.

    Nov 18th, 2009 - 01:37 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Islander

    Nitrojuan, you still have this fantasy that we live under the forced control of a colonial Britain and do whatever the Governor says! If you have internet access to us you will indeed see that what you think is rubbish! and about 75 years out of date. Our Governor is appointed by the Queen - just the same as the Governor General of Australia - are you saying they are still a clony as well! But the Governor here has no vote(uness a tie when he has casting vote).Only people who vote on our Laws are our elected assembly members.
    The only only reason the British Airforce are here is because of the frequent threats from Argentina, same for all the British Forces here.
    I live contendedly and in good patriotism in the land my family has been born in for up to 8 generations- my homeland- under the principles of self-determination as laid down in the UN Charter.

    Nov 18th, 2009 - 09:17 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • nitrojuan

    Islander: Australia, NZ, Canada are really nation of people, Falklands Islands are an artificial UK state forse to create, compare for ex: welsh people whose came in Chubut Province in Argentinian Patagonian, they decide to be a part of this nation, keep their culture, like other inmigrants Arg. gave that oportunity and they didnt invade the land to the future robotic phrase of “self determination”. I have been educated in an english inmigrant town “Ranelagh” near Buenos Aires City, in Ranelagh Community School and Argentina have some of british influence that I admire (like commonwealth nations system) but Argentinian and other free countries cant understand and Imagine to support the Invasion and colonialism of UK in our land. Imagine Argentinian people invaded in 1833 Tasmanian Islands , grown argentinian descendant (with the arg forse) in that australian island and said cause self determination of the people Tasmania will keep Argentinian.. That is increible.

    Nov 18th, 2009 - 10:16 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • J.A. Roberts

    Once again nitrojuan,

    There was no invasion in 1833, the illegal garrison was removed and the majority of the civilians remained, some of them for decades. It was not Argentine territory. Please get your facts correct and stop believing Argentine government propaganda.

    Nov 18th, 2009 - 03:40 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Luis

    Islander, Australia is an independent nation recognized by the UN, so you should not comparising your case with them.
    And you should realize that you are not a people who were colonized by britain, you are britain!!!! ergo, you are the colonizers not the colonized. Huge difference.
    You've been there for 8 generations maintained by the status quo and the systematic inmigration control who keep  of the population of british origin.
    Tell me something if we colonize a territorie implanting our own, and letting only argentine and uruguayan citizens to establish there for, lets say, 300 years. Do you think possible that after those years its inhabitant longest generation will be other than of Uruguayan or Argentinian origin?.

    Nov 19th, 2009 - 01:17 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • jojo

    Luis, Do you not realise that colonizing is exactly what happened to Argentina? Most Indians were either murdered or replaced by Italian, Spanish and other immigrants. “Argentina as a nation” is not what the indians wanted for their future (were they ever asked?), but it was the plan of the colonizers. And now you want to colonize us as well?

    Nov 19th, 2009 - 01:56 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • nitrojuan

    Mr.Claus or jojo: you are right, but that was the primate thought of “Tarra Nulis” : Invasion of the stronger side, like Spain, UK, France, with natives (that they didnt considerate them person), Uk with Argentinian in Malvinas. In Malvinas applies the principle of “Uti Possidetis iure”, you can founds books about that.

    Nov 19th, 2009 - 02:40 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • J.A. Roberts

    nitrojuan,

    The principle of “uti possidetis juris” has absolutely no relevance to the Falkland Islands. You have just demonstrated that you have no idea what the principle actually means.

    I think you should read some of those books you write about and I would also suggest you read a few about international law, particularly those which define the “uti possidetis juris” principle and how (and more importantly when) this principle developed in international law.

    Nov 19th, 2009 - 05:18 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Luis

    Jojo, colonization is not happening to Argentina for almost 200 years.Dont confuse yourself.

    Nov 19th, 2009 - 07:52 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Islander

    Luis, where did you get the idea that only UK people are allowed into the Islands? Uk people face exactly the same immigration rules here as Argenines do.We - the Islands and our Govt(not UK) control our immigration policy. Not everyone here who has permanent residence and nationality rights are of british descent - there are Chileans,Uruguyans and even Argentines who have been here for some time and now have qualified for the same rights as those whose ancestors came here in the 1840s. We are one of those things called Democracies. These peoples and others who were not originally british have joined our country just as those welsh etc did in your patagonia, no difference.
    Colonization in Argentina did not end in 1810 - it ended about 1900 with the last of the Ona and Tehuelche Indians - a bounty was paid for their ears in Tierra del Fuego. Even today so many in your country refer to the indigenous peoples surviving in the north as-Los Indios- rather than fellow Argentine citizens.

    Nov 19th, 2009 - 10:36 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • JustinKuntz

    Utis Possidetis Juris was a principle agreed among South American nations at the Conference of Lima in 1848. It basically agreed to set the borders of South American countries at the limits of the Spanish colonies they derived from. It is an accepted principle of International Law that you cannot compel a 3rd party to be tied by an agreement to which they were not a party to.

    And Luis, the definition of colonialism is the domination and subjugation of a native people, with the imposition of an alien culture. Precisely the Argentine intentions for the Falklands.

    Nov 19th, 2009 - 05:45 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Luis

    Islander, you said:
    “”where did you get the idea that only UK people are allowed into the Islands?“”
    Well i think that the fact that 90 percent of your population is of british origin gives me a tip.
    The fact that from the foreign born migrants that lives in the islands, the people who traveled from the united kingdom(the other corner of the globe) represent 56.2 percent and from Argentina represent 1.5. I see a pattern here dont you?.
    http://www.migrationinformation.org/datahub/pdf/FALKLAND ISLANDS.pdf

    Justin, definition of colony for you to learn:
    http://www.migrationinformation.org/datahub/pdf/FALKLAND

    Nov 20th, 2009 - 03:45 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Islander

    Luis, on that basis please look at the ethnic origen make up of Argentina,s population - I think approximate 70% spanish/italian and only 30% original people? Using your argument you should also be telling the Australians to go back to UK and other places and leave Australia for the few remaining original natural population there?
    Some folk are so living in history and the past - others try to live with today and todays world.

    Nov 20th, 2009 - 04:18 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Wuzzie

    Luis, re your comment above. If you track down the census for the Falkland Islands you will note that there are many, many different nationalities in the Falklands. And the mother country of these nationalities are not aggressive towards the Falklands. Hint, hint.

    Nov 20th, 2009 - 05:49 am - Link - Report abuse 0

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