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Buenos Aires City surrounded by two million Argentines living in shanty towns

Tuesday, April 6th 2010 - 01:02 UTC
Full article 70 comments

Over two million people live in a thousand shanty towns in the surroundings of Argentina’s capital Buenos Aires in conditions of extreme marginality and precariousness, according to official data released by the weekend press. Read full article

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  • Hoytred

    Now of course, if Argentina managed to find some oil maybe this would all be different? Try talking to the Falkland Islanders as they seem to know how to go about these things.

    Apr 06th, 2010 - 06:02 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Beef

    They don't even need to find their own oil. They could try working in collaboration with the islanders and stop annoying the Chinese by restricing imports.

    Apr 06th, 2010 - 07:17 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Rhaurie-Craughwell

    These people live “in almost a thousand ‘misery villas’ (villas miseria), irregular settlements and other precarious urbanizations”

    Is that Argentine political speak for “Shit poor and living in dirt extreme poverty”?

    It always amuses me that these articles dealing with internal problems in Argentina are almost a waste land compared to stories on the Falklands?
    It proves what everybodys been thinking that the Falklands are a clever easy distraction to more pressing internal issues that the amateur presidency of the Jerkners have failed to adress.
    It draws the buggers like fireflies!

    But it seems that the Chief Parrot Squawked to her flegdlings too soon, a whole year before the presidential elections and she's played the trump card already.

    Apr 06th, 2010 - 10:45 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • fredbdc

    The villa are managed by bosses, they act like a mayor with their own police. The BA police are afraid to go into the villas. During election periods the Ks routinely give refrigerators, air conditioners, TVs to them and then offer transportation, food and beer to anyone who wants to go to a rally. This is how the Ks stay in power it is disgusting.

    Apr 06th, 2010 - 02:18 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • jorge!

    4. What do you think about Carlos Primero de La Rioja???? It started at that time!!!! This is not k's fault!!!

    Apr 06th, 2010 - 05:50 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • fredbdc

    Jorge I didn't say the Ks started the villas but they have grow tremendously in the last few years. Luckily there has not been an earthquake in BA it would look like Haiti.
    The Villa around Retiro had 2-3 story houses when I moved there and now they are 5-6 stories with no support. They are going to fall down eventually or burn because of the illegally installed electricity. Hard for Arg to claim its even 3rd world with a slum like that in front of a tourist destination.

    Apr 06th, 2010 - 08:13 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • jorge!

    6 fredbdc, maybe you are right but I don't agree to put all the bad things on K's back!!!

    Apr 06th, 2010 - 08:48 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • geo

    jorge , fredbdc ..
    I'm Brasilian ,writing from there.
    Brasilia and Argentina are not samely at this subject and stage,
    it is very normal that Governments' Populist Actions on these Vote Depots !- SHORT TERMISM-!! look at everywhere you would see it easily.

    no monetary sources., no ideality., no foresight.,no willpower.,
    no stability.,no social ethic.,no planning.,no organizations.,........

    not merely for Bras. , Arg. it's valid for all other countries !

    Apr 06th, 2010 - 08:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • jorge!

    8 geo, you could be right. What I mean is many people get influenciated by the interests of Media which Lack of objetivity doesn't allow us to discuss other important issues.

    Apr 06th, 2010 - 09:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • axel arg

    Like i said more than once, we are still a very unequal society, i live in san martin, it's one of the biggest citys from the province of buenos aires, and there are some important villas here too, anyway, if we want to make a fair critic of our situation, we can't take into account only the serious problems that we have, no one can denay the structural problems that we have since many years ago, but on the other hand, we must mention too that in 2003 our poverty's line was 53%, now it's 33, our unemploitment was 20%, now it's 10% (theese numbers belong to private stadistics, i dont beleive in the indec neither), as you can see there is a lot to do for our people yet, but i am sure that in spite of our shamefull politicians, our situation will keep on improving.

    Apr 06th, 2010 - 11:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • jorge!

    You are right Axel, but those number will never appear in Clarín, La Nación nor MercoPress?
    Only very well informed people will make a fair and costructive critic about the situation.

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 03:10 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • fredbdc

    With 30% inflation I don't see how you can be optimistic. The high inflation rate will throw a lot of people back into poverty and drive higher unemployment. I doubt your situation will improve the Ks have done everything they can to drive out foreign investment and further isolate Argentina. Peronism has driven your country from 1st world to 3rd world in 60 yrs, what makes you think anything can get you back on track?
    Remember you have been living the stolen money from the international creditors for the last 7 years, every country in the world word be temporarily better off for if they decided not to pay their external debt, but what happens now? There have been no structural changes and you almost have the same amount of debt you wrote off with nothing to show for it. Sorry to say and time will tell but I doubt you will see anything better in your lifetime.

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 06:34 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • gdr

    geo !! i accept your high level comment !!

    SHORT TERMISM at everywhere with ..corruption..fuss..whoopee..
    this is valid for all countries !!
    -----------------------------------------
    9 jorge ... lies....distractions....tide and bodies... what a racket !!
    -----------------------------------------
    10 axel...frankly, i must say that we are most successfull economy
    in the World since 2002 in Macro Developments !!..but this is not
    effectual to solve and sustain some real (Micro)needs !!

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 07:26 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • gdr

    frenbdc ! your #4 ,#6 impressions acceptable ! but # 12.. no !

    real -x%- Inflation fairly lower than -30%- ! Level of Inflation
    couldn't effect on living standarts directly .

    at Peron era ..the Global Capital had deceived us ,anyway
    they have acted “two-times” here !!
    but i accept that our admins have been timid and unstable !!

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 07:54 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • jorge!

    .......“With 30% inflation I don't see how you can be optimistic. The high inflation rate will throw a lot of people back into poverty and drive higher unemployment. I doubt your situation will improve the Ks have done everything they can to drive out foreign investment and further isolate Argentina. Peronism has driven your country from 1st world to 3rd world in 60 yrs, what makes you think anything can get you back on track?”......

    - You have to get your facts rights my friend. Peron saw poverty and did something about it that all the rest didn't.
    We had and still have the biggest middle class in L.A. thanks to his policy.

    ........“Remember you have been living the stolen money from the international creditors for the last 7 years, every country in the world word be temporarily better off for if they decided not to pay their external debt, but what happens now? There have been no structural changes and you almost have the same amount of debt you wrote off with nothing to show for it. Sorry to say and time will tell but I doubt you will see anything better in your lifetime.”........

    - Sorry to disapoint you, but I'm very confident about our country. I have something to believe it.

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 08:50 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • gdr

    by the way !

    fredbdc ! don't forget , UK Debts & Liabilities as --360 % of GDP -- !

    Anglo Saxophonic Media is very succesful while foaming this problem !

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 09:14 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • geo

    my congenial friend ... gdr , I want to add somethings at this subject .

    PART ( 1) : UK

    Public Sector Real Total Net Debt ( UK) :

    Public Sector Net Debts : 1.250 billions £
    Households' :
    Unfunded Pension Liabilities : 1.300 billions £
    Debts to Banks : 1.450 billions £
    Private Sectors' :
    total Debts to Banks : 2.200 billions £

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 09:42 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • geo

    PART ( 2) UK :

    Real GDP ( down )....Employment ( down) ...Industrial Production ( down)
    Real Weekly Earnings ( down)...Real Effective Exchange Rates ( down)....

    Current Account Deficit ( up) ...Budget Deficit ( up ) ...
    total Private and Public Sector Debts ( up ) .......

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 09:46 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • NicoDin

    @fredbdc
    “BA it would look like Haiti” no way my friend Buenos Aires is modern city with high standards in building. Antiseismic, fire proof, etc. Only the historic and old buildings may be can have an issue by an earthquake. But after seen what happen in Chile the older buildings has resisted very well but I can’t say the same about the new ones because more of them cracked. We build with solid Iron and concrete not like in US, Chile, UK and others that use wood.

    And by the way “The Villa 31” only holds 25.987 people (http://www.clarin.com/diario/2009/04/07/laciudad/h-01892787.htm ) 70% of the people living there are illegal immigrants from neighboring countries and its poor illegal constructions that you see in the can be found easily in European countries like Italy, Spain, UK, Turkey, Greece, etc.

    Villa 31 http://www.clarin.com/diario/2009/04/07/laciudad/h-01892787.htm

    Naples http://www.clarin.com/diario/2009/04/07/laciudad/h-01892787.htm
    http://www.clarin.com/diario/2009/04/07/laciudad/h-01892787.htm

    Buenos Aires
    Puerto Madero/ Recoleta
    http://www.clarin.com/diario/2009/04/07/laciudad/h-01892787.htm
    http://www.clarin.com/diario/2009/04/07/laciudad/h-01892787.htm
    http://www.clarin.com/diario/2009/04/07/laciudad/h-01892787.htm
    Palermo
    http://www.clarin.com/diario/2009/04/07/laciudad/h-01892787.htm

    Mar del Plata (Buenos Aires)
    http://www.clarin.com/diario/2009/04/07/laciudad/h-01892787.htm
    http://www.clarin.com/diario/2009/04/07/laciudad/h-01892787.htm

    Old Buenos Aires
    http://www.clarin.com/diario/2009/04/07/laciudad/h-01892787.htm
    http://www.clarin.com/diario/2009/04/07/laciudad/h-01892787.htm
    Buenos Aires Highway System
    http://www.clarin.com/diario/2009/04/07/laciudad/h-01892787.htm

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 10:02 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • NicoDin

    About the doubt by the writer of the article over INDEC.
    Well it’s easy to calculate it the size of the area of the survey is 307.571 km². with a population of 15.95 millions inhabitants and if the article states that there are 2 millions the calculation give me 13% what is equal to 2.08 million people.
    I don't understand you have any doubts is basic math.
    regards

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 10:05 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • NicoDin

    @ Rhaurie-Craughwell
    Bout you concern about our government and it’s inability to tackle the poverty issue.

    Let me tell you something please:
    The level of poverty in UK is 22% (in London is higher) and the poverty in the EU states is 23.5% according with Eurostat.
    And anyone who has being in Paris had saw the poverty surrounding Paris or any other city in Europe like Madrid, London, Manchester, Milan, Naples, Berlin, etc. like in the cities of US.

    US http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_F94f_Ycsjs
    Italy http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_F94f_Ycsjs
    Shantytowns in Madrid http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_F94f_Ycsjs

    Liverpool poverty and crime http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_F94f_Ycsjs
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_F94f_Ycsjs

    Continue down

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 10:08 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • NicoDin

    @ Rhaurie-Craughwell part 2

    Child poverty in UK http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e-0pAJyYb5M&feature=related more than 3 millions.
    Denying poverty in the UK
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e-0pAJyYb5M&feature=related

    Poverty in UK http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e-0pAJyYb5M&feature=related

    People living on the streets http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e-0pAJyYb5M&feature=related

    In London homeless and poverty is so common that they have their own magazine and they can’t realize that they are already living on poverty levels.

    UK has poverty problems since ever more places like the East End, Brixton, Clapan Juction, Manchester, etc. crime, social struggle and poverty is a thing of every day 20 years ago the tension growth to the level of a civil war.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e-0pAJyYb5M&feature=related

    London today is a more dangerous city than New Your (New York is very dangerous and ranks in the top of crime) London and NY are Iraq compared with Buenos Aires.

    I don’t really understand why English media is so shocking by 2 million poor in Argentina arriving to the extreme to write an article on this issue. Especially having 13 million poor in their own soil. Very strange.

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 10:14 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • NicoDin

    @fredbdc
    “BA it would look like Haiti” no way my friend Buenos Aires is modern city with high standards in building. Antiseismic, fire proof, etc. Only the historic and old buildings may be can have an issue by an earthquake. But after seen what happen in Chile the older buildings has resisted very well but I can’t say the same about the new ones because more of them cracked. We build with solid Iron and concrete not like in US, Chile, UK and others that use wood.

    And by the way “The Villa 31” only holds 25.987 people (http://www.clarin.com/diario/2009/04/07/laciudad/h-01892787.htm ) 70% of the people living there are illegal immigrants from neighboring countries and its poor illegal constructions that you see in the can be found easily in European countries like Italy, Spain, UK, Turkey, Greece, etc.

    Villa 31 http://www.clarin.com/diario/2009/04/07/laciudad/h-01892787.htm

    Naples http://www.clarin.com/diario/2009/04/07/laciudad/h-01892787.htm
    http://www.clarin.com/diario/2009/04/07/laciudad/h-01892787.htm

    Buenos Aires
    Puerto Madero/ Recoleta
    http://www.clarin.com/diario/2009/04/07/laciudad/h-01892787.htm
    http://www.clarin.com/diario/2009/04/07/laciudad/h-01892787.htm
    http://www.clarin.com/diario/2009/04/07/laciudad/h-01892787.htm
    Palermo
    http://www.clarin.com/diario/2009/04/07/laciudad/h-01892787.htm

    Mar del Plata (Buenos Aires)
    http://www.clarin.com/diario/2009/04/07/laciudad/h-01892787.htm
    http://www.clarin.com/diario/2009/04/07/laciudad/h-01892787.htm

    Old Buenos Aires
    http://www.clarin.com/diario/2009/04/07/laciudad/h-01892787.htm
    http://www.clarin.com/diario/2009/04/07/laciudad/h-01892787.htm
    Buenos Aires Highway System
    http://www.clarin.com/diario/2009/04/07/laciudad/h-01892787.htm

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 10:15 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • NicoDin

    @fredbdc

    Your statement: “With 30% inflation I don't see how you can be optimistic. The high inflation rate will throw a lot of people back into poverty...” is more an expression of desire than the real truth.

    First this is not the real inflation in Argentina this figure was made up by the right win and the media with same ideology to undermine the improvement of Argentina in all this years.

    Argentina since 2003 had reduced its external debts from 179 billions to 108 billions, had reduced unemployment from 49% to 8%.

    Argentina has the 2nd (Brazil has #1) lower deficit among the westerns countries and the 3er lowers in the world (Saudi Arabia #1 Brazil #2 Argentina #3).
    See deficit map BBC co uk http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/8214272.stm

    Argentina is among the 10 bigger emerging countries (but the BRIC countries) what are driving out the world from recession. Recession that UK and US plunged the world into it.
    Rank made by the FMI the eternal enemy of the Kirchner couple

    “The 10 biggest are Mexico, South Korea, Turkey, Poland, Indonesia, Saudi Arabia, Taiwan, Iran, Argentina and Thailand. In 2008 they had a collective nominal gross domestic product of $5.6 trillion in 2008, according to the IMF, larger than the GDPs of Japan or China.In purchasing power parity (PPP), their collective GDP was $8.8 trillion, larger than the economies of Japan and Germany combined. Indeed, these 10 non-BRIC countries constitute the worlds third-largest economic group, after the European Union and the United States.”
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/8214272.stm

    In fact the whole world is out of recession with the exception of US, UK, Ireland, Spain, Greece, Lets says the PIGBIS and Japan.
    regards,

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 11:03 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • gdr

    geo !

    (#17)plus(#18) means that UK ruined and on the brink of collapsing..

    seperated into ( 2 ) parts !? maybe into ( 3 ) parts ...!!

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 11:14 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • gdr

    # 19, 20 ,21, 22,23,24 ..

    nicotine made British smoky and crabby !!

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 11:22 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Rhaurie-Craughwell

    NicoDin I would say your speaking out your arse, Youtube come on mate! something a bout more substansive than that! If we used Youtube as a definitive source, then I could start saying 2012 will be the second coming!

    23% poverty; what poverty rate is this, real or actual? Please iterate Real poverty is defined as people who don't have items or access to facilities that the rest of take for granted.
    Actual poverty is defined is people living below what the country defines as poverty, usually 1/2 the national income.
    Seeing as we have a much higher average income, poverty in this country is generally defined in real terms even I could be defined as being in poverty, due to my remote location I do not have access to most facilities that people take for granted! TV, Supermarket etc.
    The poverty levels thus in this country were deliberately re-adjusted in 1998 to discredited the previous administration in this country, by applying real rather than actual poverty rates.
    As for the EU average, this should be taken by the fact that the EU inlcudes some very poor countries from Eastern Europe, pre 2005 the actual Poverty rate was standing at roughly 10-14%
    I see that you make a lot reference to London, but none to the North East of England, where most of the poverty in the UK is located due to the closing down of the Mines in the 1980’s.
    I don’t know what your on about Homeless people in London, but that’s a feature of all cities world wide, 4,000 isn’t really a groundbreaking number in a city of some 7 million. it’s probably equal to that of BA a city of 2-3 million in terms of % of population.

    As for crime you’ve morbidly hyped it up, I see that the Argentine government has an aversion to releasing violent crime figures, but I hear that anywhere between 20-30% of the cities population has been victim of Violent crime, and that’s just violent Crime. Compare that to London: http://www.met.police.uk/crimefigures/
    Roughly 10% of the capitals population has been a victim in o

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 12:42 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Rhaurie-Craughwell

    part deux

    Roughly 10% of the capitals population has been a victim in one way or another, and roughly 25% of that 10% figure has been violent.
    As for London, I’ve been there umpteen million times stacked to the brim with luggage and I’ve never once felt threatened, if you really want a violent city try rio-de Janiero and my personal favorite Johanesburg South Africa where within 2 weeks stepping of the plane I could feel the fear that gripped the city which was confirmed when I had a gun thrust in my face and threatened with instance death!

    As for the “civil war”, I do not see the social fabric of the state collapsing since then? It was hardly a civil war, young men not having enough sex during a very hot summer, a pretty explosive combination. What about your riots then? They seem to have happened pretty regularly on and off for the last 50 years or so, whereas our riots seem to be little more than localized social gireievences against the police or governmental policy, yours seem to be massive scale grievances against the whole system government, this country has never had a riot which toppled the government, how many have you had at least 3 to my knowledge!

    Overall I think the reason why the media is shocked mate because many of them are living on levels of poverty comparable to some African countries in shanty towns, and that the Government doesn’t release crime figures and even proper poverty figures, yet this is a country which has been presented as the richest and most European in South America.

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 12:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Rhaurie-Craughwell

    But this is where it differs Nicotine:

    In my country poverty is exploited and showcased to justify a governments spending plans, whereas in your country it's hidden because for your governemnts it's an embarrasment and scares them as it points to government inaction.

    take this phrase thats been spin doctored:
    ”These people live “in almost a thousand ‘misery villas’ (villas miseria), irregular settlements and other precarious urbanizations”

    in other words these people are living in Shanty towns, howver by saying Villas and irregular settlements and precarious Urbanizations, he is spinning a postive image to a negative probelem, so instead of shanty towns, shacks and slums, they are living in Villas!

    If he said these people are “In extreme poverty and living in shanty towns and slums”, it conjures up images of Africa and India, not exactly the issue you want to sell a year before the general election?

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 12:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • gdr

    Rhaurie !

    keep away from drinking , drugs , cigarettes please !!

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 01:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • gdr

    Rhaurie !

    keep away from drinking , drugs , cigarettes please !!

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 01:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • jorge!

    NicoDin said.........“I don’t really understand why English media is so shocking by 2 million poor in Argentina arriving to the extreme to write an article on this issue. Especially having 13 million poor in their own soil. Very strange.”.....

    - No it is not extrange. MercoPress will always highlight tha bad news about Argentina, there are many good news for us, but they wouldn't appear here nor in Clarín of course.
    Yours are very good comments!

    gdr, you know you are right, do you? :-)

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 02:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • fredbdc

    @Nicodin, I have family in BA, 30% inflation is correct its the 8% reported by the government that is a lie.
    I also wasn't talking about the new buildings I was talking about the slums (villas) that would be demolished.
    Since 2010 Argentina is not considered “emerging” any longer it is a “frontier” market so you moved from 3rd to 4th world last year sorry. Now you are ranked with Albania not Brazil.

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 02:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • jorge!

    Excuse me. Those qualifications are made by the same companies that always predict caos in Argentina and didn't say a thing about USA downturn in early 2009????

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 02:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • NicoDin

    @Rhaurie-Craughwell part 1

    Can you coulors or you are also blind?
    If you are not blind here a map of hunger in the world where UK and Argentina have the same colour as any industrialized country but UK very strange indeed for a so called “developed” country has more insufficient data than Argentina. What happen mate you cannot count your poor or you luck of IT infrastructure?

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Percentage_population_undernourished_world_map.PNG

    If you are not happy with source lets try with this Hunger map:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Percentage_population_undernourished_world_map.PNG
    Source United Nation (World food Program)

    Poverty level measure by income:
    “In 2007/08, 13½ million people in the UK were living in households below the 60% low-income threshold after deducting housing costs. This is around a fifth (22%) of the population.”
    Now has increased over 23% do you know that? or do you need and interview with Gordy?

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Percentage_population_undernourished_world_map.PNG

    Source Poverty Org UK

    Continue below...

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 04:51 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • NicoDin

    @Rhaurie-Craughwell part 2
    “Actual poverty is defined is people living below what the country defines as poverty, usually 1/2 the national income.” Well not UK takes 60% and Argentina takes a basket of basic goods and services that you need to have a decent life including housing, all services (water, gas, electricity, etc) plus scholarship for each member in age to attend to school, food, transportation, clothing and entertainment.

    For a family model or typical family or households conformed by a couple (Mother and father) and 2 children if a family has less income than that given enters into the line of poverty.

    In Argentina for 2007 the basic basket was 1000 pesos and basic salaries are higher than that was in 2007 around 1200 pesos plus social benefits or bonuses like a plus for each children at school, tickets for food, etc) lets say that the basket is 80% of the minimum wage.

    So one member of the family can support the rest. Of course you cannot live in Puerto Madero with that income but you are close to rent and apartment of 42 mt2 in Belgrano (Up middle class neighborhood).

    How can you live in Argentina with 1000 pesos comparing the quality of food and housing you will need in 2007 1600 pounds a week to live in the same way. Can you see the differences between your and our poor.

    “Seeing as we have a much higher average income” what? In Pounds terms you mean an overvaluated currency just for bankers.

    Continue below

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 04:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • NicoDin

    @Rhaurie-Craughwell part 3

    The minimum wage in Britain is 5miserables pounds an hour in 2010. So let’s say that a person works 8 hour you every day.

    During 5 days a week this is 40 hour a week (this is what a worker works in Argentina then is extra payment) a worker in UK would get 800 pounds per mounts. You are poor mate and if you live in London even more poor you cannot afford to pay the rent for a house with that money you end in a hole in Brixton sharing a bedroom with a couple of Jamaican dancing reggae.

    “As for the EU average, this should be taken by the fact that the EU inlcudes some very poor countries from Eastern Europe”

    Excuse me mate but as you see Britain is not in the Easter European country and already have 23% now.
    On who do you want to put the blame? Eh!

    Continue below

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 04:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • NicoDin

    @Rhaurie-Craughwell part 4

    “As for crime you’ve morbidly hyped it up, I see that the Argentine government has an aversion to releasing violent crime figures, but I hear that anywhere between 20-30% of the cities population has been victim of Violent crime, and that’s just violent Crime. Compare that to London...”

    Well this is what you believe according with the media propaganda you see or read but you asked for reliable statistics and sources of info. Did you?

    Killed persons over 1000 inhabitants well Argentina even appears in the ranks a mistake?
    http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_mur_percap-crime-murders-per-capita

    Argentina has reported crime over 100.000 inhabitants around 2100 half of Canada while Canada reports 4123 again we don’t appear in the map in the top ten Britain yes.

    http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_mur_percap-crime-murders-per-capita
    http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_mur_percap-crime-murders-per-capita
    http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_mur_percap-crime-murders-per-capita


    Did I make my homework? I guess so.

    Do you want and interview with Dominique Strauss Kahn to know how bad is Britain?

    So please next time believe me when a show you on Youtube its more simple.

    Regards,

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 04:53 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • fredbdc

    @ Nico... Could the statistics be skewed because crime is under reported in Argentina? I was mugged in broad daylight while sitting in a full outdoor cafe in Recoleta right in front of the Cemetery! I am sure you are familiar with the area. My friends thought I was crazy to report it because most likely the Police were involved and it could just make things worse. I don't know how you could believe Canada and the Scandinavian countries have a higher crime rate than in South America that is just insanity.

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 05:12 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • NicoDin

    @Rhaurie-Craughwell

    We are not talking about personal experience here, because I never have an issue in Argentina.

    “In my country poverty is exploited and showcased to justify a governments spending plans, whereas in your country it's hidden because for your governemnts it's an embarrasment and scares them as it points to government inaction.”

    Ah! this remember me a tale from a French men (very proud of France) when visiting Argentina he said after seen the city buildings, malls, etc.

    “ah ha (while pointing to a 5 year old Peugeot car in Buenos Aires) you can see that this is what you can tell that Argentina is a 3er world country because in France cars are brand new”. Hug? “Yes 3er world countries has old cars” He had done his statement. Did he?.

    Sorry mate I was in France and I saw Citroen 2 CV from 1970 in Paris. He start to say a fa.. a fa... well in France there is a lot of car collectors...

    I start to laugh (like I’m doing about you now, sorry) I asked and what car do you have in France?
    Talbot he said 1990 so you are a collector as well? He started to get red and then start to smile.

    You guys are amazing
    continue below...

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 06:14 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • NicoDin

    @Rhaurie-Craughwell

    We are not talking about personal experience here, because I never have an issue in Argentina.

    “In my country poverty is exploited and showcased to justify a governments spending plans, whereas in your country it's hidden because for your governemnts it's an embarrasment and scares them as it points to government inaction.”

    Ah! this remember me a tale from a French men (very proud of France) when visiting Argentina he said after seen the city buildings, malls, etc.

    “ah ha (while pointing to a 5 year old Peugeot car in Buenos Aires) you can see that this is what you can tell that Argentina is a 3er world country because in France cars are brand new”. Hug? “Yes 3er world countries has old cars” He had done his statement. Did he?.

    Sorry mate I was in France and I saw Citroen 2 CV from 1970 in Paris. He start to say a fa.. a fa... well in France there is a lot of car collectors...

    I start to laugh (like I’m doing about you now, sorry) I asked and what car do you have in France?
    Talbot he said 1990 so you are a collector as well? He started to get red and then start to smile.

    You guys are amazing

    You don’t know Argentina but I know Britain (Wells by the way a lots of sheep there, London, Birmingham, France (Paris, and blue cost in the south), Germany, Monaco, Switzerland, Italy, Spain, etc. so please stop to make a fool of yourself.

    Mate stop to read the British press will harm your brain your country has not a better standard of living than the Argentinean. Specially in Buenos Aires capital and main city what has a GDP of 96bn dollars and has a population of 3 million people permanent residents. Make you calculation this gives you a nominal income per capita of U$S 32.000 (Official Exchange rate) while you have U$D35,400 (PPP) but in a city 5 times more expensive than Buenos Aires. Here an apartment in a posh and expensive area close to Av. Libertador (50mts) and in front of the Campo Argentino de Polo like this
    http://www.youtube.com/w

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 06:18 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • NicoDin

    Here an apartment in a posh and expensive area close to Av. Libertador (50mts) and in front of the Campo Argentino de Polo like this
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aIfSnhOuTV8 cost in between U$S 70.000 and U$S 90.000 What can you buy with this in London a bedroom in Brixton.

    Middle class apartment 432 sq.ft U$S 69.000
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aIfSnhOuTV8
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aIfSnhOuTV8

    So please try to fool other one with your data from your 3er world press similar to our of course we have something in common on this matter.

    Try to impress the African with your fabulous stories and tales form UK I saw by my self how crappy country its is.

    Regards

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 06:20 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • geo

    PART ( 1 ) : in UK .....

    The number of Middle Class Families struggling to make ends meet has increased significantly ,with Debt Advice Agencies overhelmed with pleas for help from households in affluent areas of the country !!
    Since the Credit Crunch started there , has been a big increase in professionals and and home-owners coming for help !..
    The Middle Class is struggling with Mortgages , Secured Loans and Credits , Debts ! ..plunged into a personal debt crisis , as professional across the nation fail into --red--..which by cousing of spending beyond it's means !!....

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 07:17 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • geo

    PART ( 2) : in UK ...

    The Government, having encouraged youngsters into higher education that has saddled many with Large Debts is deeply worried..Graduate numbers are hitting a record high just as the number of Jobs is shrinking..almost 2 millions College Graduates are unemployed ( N.A.C.E)

    note : MI5 and Special Branchs have Higly Secret Contingency plans have been drawn up to counter the threat posed by “ discontent” in Britain !!.....

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 07:24 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • NicoDin

    @fredbdc Part 1

    Yes they have more crime than Argentina far worse as a national average I said that Canada double the reported crime and people killed over 1000 is far worse. Hey mate you cannot not miss to report a dead buddy.

    My brother was robed in Italy and he didn’t report the crime either, so many European don’t report crime as well. People selling drugs on the streets of London is a crime none report these guys because you can see him every day in the some street. Australians are scammed in London on their credit card by rent a car companies and the crime is not reported because her/he discover the scam in Australia.

    I’ve been living in London for a while and I was really scared to go out at night in London like in Buenos Aires. I go outside every weekend in Buenos Aires until 4 or 5 o’clock at night and I don’t see any problem.

    A friend of main always complaining about crime in Argentina (because the news here repeat the same crime 100 times) he and his wife went last year to US. He saw real crime there was so scary in Los Angeles or LA that after 7 at noon he didn’t go outside from the Hotel. He moved to Pasadena for this issue but he said that even though was better he was really insecure to make a normal life like in Buenos Aires.

    Continue...

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 08:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • NicoDin

    @fredbdc Part 2

    In London my car was crashed by and illegal Jamaican drunk without driver’s license or any documentation the police didn’t care they said to the guy to bring its documentation later to the police station. He never was seen again. A Rent a car company charge us 300 Pound for the car rented. Later came to our bank in Australia 3000 pounds we complained to the police and they said, well we need more cases to investigate. Ha ha. We discovered later that the car was also not ensured.

    Buenos Aires in becoming more insecure that is true but compares with the Buenos Aires from the ’80.

    The problem is the same as in London or in any major cities, immigration, since UK opens the doors to others Europeans countries firearms and crime has increase in violence and quantity plus the economies and social struggle to survive. Immigrants find easy to exploit the whole in the law and the system. Like you can find in UK a Pakistani or Jamaican with 3 houses obtained trough the housing benefit system I saw it by my self and was not in the news.

    Continue...

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 08:07 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • NicoDin

    @fredbdc Part 3
    So this people as you can see are Bolivian, Peruvian and Paraguayan new comers arriving to the Villa 31 not asking else demanding a housing solution to them.

    So lets put in this way I go to London with 1000 Argentineans all illegal and we invade Leicester Square with cardbox and we make our home there and then we demand an apartment there. How long can I survive without a kick in my head from a Bobby?

    Well in Argentina they can even get a home that is really crazy.

    Look I will give you a tip. If some day (I hope not) you need a very expensive treatment of surgery don’t worry.
    Come to Argentina I would recommend you Buenos Aires even if you are Illegal, foreigner or from Venus our system has the obligation to provide you all you need even if you are a foreigner. So people from other countries come here for a free health tour. While the normal Argentinean has to pay private health insurance because the public health service if busy providing services to foreigners. . It’s not crazy?

    Continue...

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 08:08 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • NicoDin

    @fredbdc Part 4

    The other day I saw in the news that the police got 10 criminals that where targeting tourist in the Airport.

    The 10 were Colombians, Argentina thanks the liberals and right win in the 90 (Menen Era) has imported more that 5 millions immigrants and all are in Buenos Aires and more than the 70% in shantytowns. To make labour more cheaper to multinationals. I know that you know that we know how stupid are these measures you have build Brixton that way in the 60.

    If you understand Spanish please hear like the Bolivian woman is complaining about insecurity. It’s no amazing?

    One says 3 month is Buenos Aires and she is demanding for a House, do you need one? Come on 3 month in Buenos Aires and you can ask for you home in a place where the square mts of land cost U$S 3000.

    And then I have to read this infamous article in the Mercopress about poverty and the shantytowns.

    By the way the writer of the article where is he from? I would like to say to the Peruvians, Bolivians, Paraguayan, Colombians, etc. that he is giving free houses and income support in his country.

    Regards,

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 08:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • NicoDin

    Oh! bloody I forgot to post the link to the video sorry.
    Do you need a house? ask for Macri haha
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dx9LJtOvzLc

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 08:16 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • NicoDin

    @geo

    Where are you from? UK?

    Don’t worry come to Argentina we provide free education in universities as well if you can get a residency here else you have to pay a little feed.

    Yes we also provide free education, free health care service (you would have to struggle with some Bolivians in the queue but don’t worry they are not dangerous). We are so generous that we provide free housing to some 3000 Brits in some Islands we are dummies. Ha ha

    Again the author of the article were is he from? Bolivian area waiting here...

    Regards,

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 08:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • geo

    Nicotine ~~ I am from Brasilia ..look at #8 please ..

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 08:42 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • gdr

    in UK ........

    in 2009, average of 34 % of children in Britain were living in relatively Low-Income households ! ..25% of children were living in workless households....

    Adults at risk(%) of Violance :

    men aged 16 - 24 : ....13%

    visited clubs..etc : .... 19%

    students : ..... 10%

    unemployed,mx ethnical.. : ..... 9%

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 09:03 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • NicoDin

    @geo,

    I see sorry by my silly question. You have an automatic residency as a Mercosur or mercosul member here I believe. So you have not problem to get free stuff. Vose fala spañol? gosh my Portugues is really bad.
    A shame.

    regards,

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 09:14 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • NicoDin

    By the way were are the British? Crying because they have discovered how bad is Britain? Come on guys the 3er is not so bad after all.

    My question is do they fall so fast or we are rising so fast? um...

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 09:21 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • axel arg

    FREDBDC, i can't believe how ignorant you are, anyway i dont need the pathetic predictions of a rediculous diviner like you, you should have seen the failed predictions of many soposed serious corporations made to argentina when the crisis started, you should know that not even one of those finally happened.
    On the other hand, you dont live here, you dont see our reality, there are plenty of aspects that you ignore about the progress of my country, that's why you just one more ignorant like many others, anyway let me tell you that in this country, we have all the time in the media corporations many idiot diviners who predict economic catastrophes since 2003 and finally nothing happens, obviously those are even worst than you, because they are powerfull, you are just what we call the tipical usefull idiot of the media.

    Apr 07th, 2010 - 09:57 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • jorge!

    NicoDin, you provided very valuable information, thanks!!!
    Brits desappear when they run out of arguments. that has happened several times here and regarding the person who writes the articles here, well they are from Malvinas, however they wouldn't recognize it and would say they are registered in Uruguay.

    Axel, lol, te re calentaste con el pobre fredbdc jajaja.

    Apr 08th, 2010 - 01:23 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • LegionNi

    Geo - “note : MI5 and Special Branchs have Higly Secret Contingency plans have been drawn up to counter the threat posed by “ discontent” in Britain !!..... ”

    This made me laugh so much... Highly Secret Contingency plans.... hmmmm can't be that highly secret if some random bloke from Brazil knows all about them.

    Were are you all getting these wonderful states from exactly?

    Apr 08th, 2010 - 07:43 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • jorge!

    it seems that the information has tuched a nerve!!!

    Apr 08th, 2010 - 10:01 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • LegionNi

    I'm just interested to see where these stats come from. Theres an election on you know. If these figures are reliable it may change the way I vote.

    So... anyone?

    Apr 08th, 2010 - 11:19 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • gdr

    MI6 november 2009 reported that :

    UK is broken -school system deteriorating- ,the Economy is in shambles
    collapsing, homelessness and poverty rates are expanding--
    yet we're nation- building in Iraq--Afganistan, sending economically
    distressed young people over (add) 3-5 thousands at an annual cost at a
    just few millions Pounds !!.....................

    British Army Programs and Recruitment Services target students
    as young as --11-- !,which includes a video game used a tool for
    Army Recruitments ,explicity marketed to children as young as -13-.!

    Apr 08th, 2010 - 11:26 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Christopher UK

    Good grief - why on earth does Argentina want to steal the Falkland Islands? They can't even get things right on the land they have already stolen!!!!

    Apr 08th, 2010 - 11:45 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • LegionNi

    60 gdr - Are you on the MI6 mailing list then lol?

    Apr 08th, 2010 - 12:12 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • fredbdc

    @nico I was in an Argentinian hospital once and never again. It was like a 1950s horror movie with old equipment, peeling paint, burned out lights. It was horrible I would not send my worse enemy there.
    What I think is really funny is you are trying to compare 1st world to 4th world. You have obviously never been to UK, USA or Europe otherwise you wouldn't be trying to make the comparisons.
    You may have free universities but you get what you pay for because UBA (supposedly your best university) doesn't even have toilet paper in the bathrooms.

    Apr 08th, 2010 - 02:08 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • LegionNi

    A United States federal judge ruled in favour of seizing 105 million US dollars from the Argentine Central Bank deposits in New York in order to pay the debt the country holds with two investment funds.

    The decision affects Argentine funds that have been frozen since 2006 and it was made known a week before a 20 billion USD debt-swap offer is launched, which remains from the massive debt default of 2001/2002.

    No wonder Argentina has such a poor credit rating.

    Apr 08th, 2010 - 02:45 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • NicoDin

    @ fredbdc

    Come on boy I know that some of our “Public hospital are really bad” but also in Europe and worse in USA.
    For Example I know Elephant & Caste hospital in UK is a crap.
    Doctors in UK are not very good, the problem with ours (the public ones) is that there are overcrowded because for the reason I’ve explain before (they are free).

    In Italy the health service sucks in Spain is the 3er world. USA is pretty bad (in fact some Americans says that Argentina service is good, ha ha) like hospital of the war all together.

    So named or show me your wonderful public hospitals so we can laugh a little bit.

    I will show few of our 
    http://www.fleni.org.ar/
    http://www.fleni.org.ar/
    http://www.fleni.org.ar/
    http://www.fleni.org.ar/
    http://www.fleni.org.ar/
    http://www.fleni.org.ar/

    I will be waiting to see some of yours.

    Regards

    Apr 08th, 2010 - 06:15 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • NicoDin

    @ fredbdc

    “1st world to 4th world. You have obviously never been to UK, USA or Europe otherwise you wouldn't be trying to make the comparisons.”

    I live in Europe and as many Argentines I am European. Who the hell do you think you are you talking with?

    You are the 1st world? Ha ha ha

    Looks pretty much Africa
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fwdi6T-0UpI&feature=related
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fwdi6T-0UpI&feature=related
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fwdi6T-0UpI&feature=related

    Come on this is the 3er world mate change your channel.

    Regards

    Apr 08th, 2010 - 06:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • jorge!

    LOL.

    Apr 08th, 2010 - 09:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • jorge!

    Brits cannot put up they are not what they were once. Then, they say that Argentina is the only country in the world that was first developed and now a developing one. You are in the same path my british pirates friends!

    Apr 08th, 2010 - 09:54 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • fredbdc

    @ axel Your are a typical narcissistic Argentinian,you are denying the effects, your country may not be crashing yet but you are seeing inflation at 30% and this month alone food inflation is 5.8%! Wages are not keeping up and people are having decreasing buying power and are getting agitated. When you depreciate currency there is a brief boost to the economy then it begins to fail. You are beginning to see the strains now. If the newest bond exchange fails they will let the peso fall to 6. If the exchange goes well you may get a couple more years of relative stability.
    @jorge you are not a very smart kid, you should learn when to keep your comments to yourself.
    BTW I live in Washington DC

    Apr 09th, 2010 - 01:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • axel arg

    FREDBDC, i know perfectly the reality of my country, i think i know much more than you because i live that reality everyday, no one can deny the hight inflation that we have, we live with it since 5 or 6 years, and finally there was no any economic catastrophe, anyway the goverment must find a solution for this problem, the good aspect is that we have many reserves in our central bank to stop a big crisis of the inflation level, my country is not going to finish with a hiperinflation like in 1989.
    Many serious economist who are against the government affirm this theory all the time, beside why dont you take care of your own problems from your country, i mean your terrible deficit, your unemployed level, i got enough of many pathetic diviners like you, who predict crisis all the time, and you couden't even predict your own crisis, beside i hold that you are an ignorant, because there are many achievements that we had since 7 years ago, and you have no idea about then, that's why you are just one more ignorant like many others.

    Apr 09th, 2010 - 08:15 pm - Link - Report abuse 0

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