MercoPress. South Atlantic News Agency
Kirchner couple fortune climbs 20.6% in one year totalling 14.5 million USD
The fortune of Argentine presidential couple, President Cristina Kirchner and her immediate predecessor and husband, Nestor Kirchner jumped 20.6% in 2009 totalling the equivalent of 14.5 million US dollars, and soared 700% since they first took office in 2003, according to their latest income statements delivered to the country’s Anti Corruption Office. Read full article
Comments
Disclaimer & comment rulesnice work if you can get it
Jul 09th, 2010 - 05:22 am - Link - Report abuse 0Everything open to public scrutiny as it should be in a democratic country.
Jul 09th, 2010 - 06:31 am - Link - Report abuse 0Like here with Tony:
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/top-stories/2010/01/31/tony-blair-s-45million-fortune-115875-22007050/
Or here with David:
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/top-stories/2010/01/31/tony-blair-s-45million-fortune-115875-22007050/
Or here with Nick:
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/top-stories/2010/01/31/tony-blair-s-45million-fortune-115875-22007050/
Or good old Mark:
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/top-stories/2010/01/31/tony-blair-s-45million-fortune-115875-22007050/
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/top-stories/2010/01/31/tony-blair-s-45million-fortune-115875-22007050/
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/top-stories/2010/01/31/tony-blair-s-45million-fortune-115875-22007050/
Need I to continue??
..... if I was a rich man, diddle diddle diddle diddle diddle diddle dumm .....
Jul 09th, 2010 - 06:40 am - Link - Report abuse 0ooops, not sure if I missed a 'diddle' out?
Yes Rich people are rich people......but........
Jul 09th, 2010 - 07:07 am - Link - Report abuse 0I had forgotten what bas**** Sir Mark Tatcher was/is.
Hey, anyone knows if this couple is available as business consultants? They are really good! Now I understand why Argentina is such a rich country!
Jul 09th, 2010 - 11:56 am - Link - Report abuse 0What about the accounts in Caracas, Miami and Havana? The Argentinian assets pale in comparison to what they really have after all the years stealing $ from the province and country. The reported amount is just what they couldn't hide. Just like every other Argentinian “ruler” they will be in prison soon after they lose their last “election”.
Jul 09th, 2010 - 12:00 pm - Link - Report abuse 0And the money kept rolling in from every side
Jul 09th, 2010 - 12:27 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Eva's pretty hands reached out and they reached wide
Now you may feel it should have been a voluntary cause
But that's not the point my friends
When the money keeps rolling in, you don't ask how
Think of all the people guaranteed a good time now
Eva's called the hungry to her, open up the doors
Never been a fund like the Foundation Eva Peron
[Chorus:]
[Workers:]
Rollin' rollin' rollin', rollin' rollin' rollin'
Rollin' rollin' rollin', rollin' rollin' rollin'
Rollin' rollin' rollin', rollin' rollin' rollin'
Rollin' rollin' rollin', rollin' rollin' rollin'
Rollin' on in, rollin' on in
Rollin' on in, rollin' on in
On in
:-)
(6) fredbdc
Jul 09th, 2010 - 12:30 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Any proof of what you are saying from Wachingtón.
Or do we have to trust your “Word of Honor”?
[Che:]
Jul 09th, 2010 - 12:39 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Would you like to try a college education?
Own your landlord's house, take the family on vacation?
Eva and her blessed fund can make your dreams come true
Here's all you have to do my friends
Write your name and your dream on a card or a pad or a ticket
Throw it high in the air and should our lady pick it
She will change your way of life for a week or even two
Name me anyone who cares as much as Eva Peron
[chorus]
Rollin' on out, rollin' on out
Rollin' on out, rollin' on out
On out
:-)
Everything open to public scrutiny as it should be in a democratic country.
Jul 09th, 2010 - 12:50 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Like here with Tony:
www.mirror.co.uk/news/top-stories/2010/01/31/tony-blair-s-45million-fortune-115875-22007050/
Or here with David:
www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1191155/Claims-David-Cameron-30m-fortune-sit-uneasily-taxpayers-So-truth-money.html
Or here with Nick:
toryardvaark.wordpress.com/2010/04/28/nick-clegg-makes-a-small-fortune-from-house-sale-in-europe/
Or good old Mark:
www.independent.co.uk/news/mark-thatcher-accused-sources-say-he-got-12m-pounds-from-arms-deal-signed-by-his-mother-1441851.html
www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article4493287.ece
news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/4169557.stm
Need I to continue??
Your claim of democracy in Argentina is a bit overstated. When an executive branch humiliates and threatens the Judicial branch and the media I wouldn't call it democratic.
Jul 09th, 2010 - 01:39 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Let's see, where to begin, U$300+Million missing in interest payments from Santa Cruz's deposits in Switzerland, they say the $ is in Havana, U$ 90+ million in “brokerage fees” for Arg exports to Venezuela account in Miami I think, “buying” (stealing) Arg gov't land at pennies on the $ then reselling and or renting it to others...
I think that is enough for now.
(11) fredbc
Jul 09th, 2010 - 01:53 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You said it all:
“I wouldn't call”
“they say the $”
“I think, “buying”
”I think that is enough”
Just your own opinion,
not one proof.
Just Wind and Gas....
As my worth opponent Hoytred would call it
Quick Search will turn up:
Jul 09th, 2010 - 02:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0http://momento24.com/en/2010/05/28/edward-arnold-accused-kirchner-for-the-use-of-funds-in-santa-cruz/
http://momento24.com/en/2010/05/28/edward-arnold-accused-kirchner-for-the-use-of-funds-in-santa-cruz/
Land deal...see above article
Funny how all of these cases are with the same prosecutor, I wonder how much $ he has outside of the country. Carrot or stick, take the $ or die is more like it.
As I said these cases will not be brought forward until they lose their last election. That is how your country works.
Again.. accusations, nothing concrete...
Jul 09th, 2010 - 02:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You are wasting my time miserably....
Nothing but pure gas.......
Did I hit a nerve?
Jul 09th, 2010 - 02:40 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The only reason the cases are not moving forward is because the prosecutor and his family would be in serious danger. I guess we just have to wait until next year when CFK loses the next election to see who is proven correct.
Hit a nerve?
Jul 09th, 2010 - 02:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0A submariner guy like you.
Pleeeease.....
Some reports which I have read state that their worth has grown 2,300 percent. Also, I have read where the money in Santa Cruz was $500 million and deposited “overseas” more than 15 years ago, so with interest it should really be a huge number. I have also read that he and his ex-chauffeur have the only signature authorities on the Santa Cruz money; the ex-chauffeur is now an enormously rich “business man” in Argentina.
Jul 09th, 2010 - 03:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0And I have read that the Moon is made of green cheese
Jul 09th, 2010 - 03:50 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Some observers don't agree! They think is made of blue Stilton! :-)
When I read the last letter I received from a friend who had been on the moon, he confirmed that it is neither, but basically made of rock!
Jul 09th, 2010 - 04:05 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Let's see now. Question for the class.
Jul 09th, 2010 - 05:24 pm - Link - Report abuse 0If the combined annual income of a couple is US$136,000, how do they increase their assets by US$4,441,772 in one year?
@20
Jul 09th, 2010 - 06:23 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Did they find some money down the back of the sofa
Anybody knows if Sir Mark is involved in the Falklands Oil Bonanza?:
Jul 09th, 2010 - 06:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0www.independent.co.uk/news/mark-thatcher-accused-sources-say-he-got-12m-pounds-from-arms-deal-signed-by-his-mother-1441851.html
www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article4493287.ece
news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/4169557.stm
[Che:]
Jul 09th, 2010 - 07:14 pm - Link - Report abuse 0And the money kept rolling out in all directions
To the poor, to the weak, to the destitute of all complexions
Now cynics claim a little of the cash has gone astray
But that's not the point my friends
When the money keeps rolling out you don't keep books
You can tell you've done well by the happy grateful looks
Accountants only slow things down, figures get in the way
Never been a lady loved as much as Cristina Kirchner
[chorus]
Rollin' on out, rollin' on out
Rollin' on out, rollin' on out
On out
[Che:]
Eva!!!
When the money keeps rolling out you don't keep books
You can tell you've done well by the happy grateful looks
Accountants only slow things down, figures get in the way
Never been a lady loved as much as Cristina Kirchner
I see from a few days back that the World Bank poured US$17.9 million into Latam. How much has stuck to the Kirchner fingers?
Jul 09th, 2010 - 08:16 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Sorry class. If you didn't get this as the answer to 20, you've failed.
FREDBDC.
Jul 10th, 2010 - 01:15 am - Link - Report abuse 0It does not sorprise me your idiot assertion, it's fany how you swallow all the crap that you hear from the media, and dont discern absolutly anything, if you would have unless one line of obejtivity, you would know that what you say is just crap, if you ant to know about the situation of my country, why dont inform your self with diferent points of view, the kirchner are not saints, they made big mistakes, but i must recognize too that there is a great progress in my country since 2003, beside most oponent politic partys are really worst than them.
On the other hand, the cause by illicit enrichment was closed because the counters from the suprem court of justice affirmed that the kirchner didn't enrich their selve in an illicit way, i dont know if is it true or not, because i am not a public counter, but the same judge that desisted the kirchner from that cause, is the same who has under process to an ex minister of the government, and restrained hes goods, so, that judge is not funtional to the kirchnerism.
Isn't the anti-corruption investigation unit run by the executive branch and is a political appointee? In the last 8 years they have not brought 1 case to conviction. Since Argentina is one of the most corrupt countries in the world how do you think this is possible? Also the cases are not closed they are shelved, that's very different.
Jul 10th, 2010 - 01:35 pm - Link - Report abuse 0FREBDC, you are wrong again, the cause by illicit enrichment was closed, but there are some other causes that are shelved, beside, what part dont you understand that this judge is the same who has under process an ex minister of the governmnet, and restrained hes goods, beside he has under investigation too other cases of corruption of diferent politicians, in fact, mauricio macri is under process too, (the intendant of buenos aires city), he is acused of illigal spionage, there is a document of 70 pages where the judge justify hes decition.
Jul 10th, 2010 - 03:16 pm - Link - Report abuse 0On the other hand, if we are going to talk about corruption, i wont never deny the mountain of corruption cases that there are in argentina, but dont hipocrite fred, your country is not a paradise neather.
Beside your knowleadge is still little, in the last 8 years, there were politicians who were in prison and were restrained their goods too, your ignorance, and your lack of objetivity is everyday more evident.
Axel, I know about Macri, it is no surprise that he is being harassed by the Kirchners through the courts. He is the only candidate that could probably win in the next election cycle. The only corruption cases that have come to convictions are people that the Ks want to get rid of. Congress just started investigating the Ks for the 15% brokerage fee that was paid on the exports to Venezuela or has that been shelved too?
Jul 10th, 2010 - 06:55 pm - Link - Report abuse 0FREDBDC:
Jul 11th, 2010 - 01:08 am - Link - Report abuse 0One more show of your ignorance and lack of objetivity, you have no idea about how macri started to be involucrated in that cause, find out, and after we can talk, anyway if it makes you happy, keep on believing all the crap that you hear from the media, beside all the politicians that were in prison were minister from menem's government.
Beside the export fee betwen arg and venezuela is in the hands of the justice, it was not shelved, if you really find out, you'll see that it's just a politic operation, i insist that you must listen to diferent points of view, not just one, and after you have to get your conclutions, maybe some day your short mind can understand it.
Time to repeat myself:
Jul 11th, 2010 - 03:29 am - Link - Report abuse 0Everything open to public scrutiny as it should be in a democratic country.
Controlled by the proper authorities, the oppositions free press, the international “eye” etc. etc. etc..
Like here with Tony:
www.mirror.co.uk/news/top-stories/2010/01/31/tony-blair-s-45million-fortune-115875-22007050/
Or here with David:
www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1191155/Claims-David-Cameron-30m-fortune-sit-uneasily-taxpayers-So-truth-money.html
Or here with Nick:
toryardvaark.wordpress.com/2010/04/28/nick-clegg-makes-a-small-fortune-from-house-sale-in-europe/
Or good old Mark:
www.independent.co.uk/news/mark-thatcher-accused-sources-say-he-got-12m-pounds-from-arms-deal-signed-by-his-mother-1441851.html
www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article4493287.ece
news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/4169557.stm
Need I to continue??
“Time to repeat myself:”
Jul 11th, 2010 - 09:16 am - Link - Report abuse 0Thats a first!
And to repeat the awkward question that was ignored:
Jul 11th, 2010 - 11:23 am - Link - Report abuse 0If the combined annual income of a couple is US$136,000, how do they increase their assets by US$4,441,772 in one year?
By doing exactly as described in the article above?
Jul 11th, 2010 - 11:39 am - Link - Report abuse 0Axel, so are you confirming that in 8 years not 1 of Kirchner's people has been put in jail for corruption? And Menem's people were convicted AFTER he left the Presidency? I think you are making my points for me. That is what I have been trying to explain to you in all of these posts!
Jul 11th, 2010 - 12:29 pm - Link - Report abuse 0If you don't think the Ks are behind the Macri harassment you are extremely naive.
I don't think your command of the English language allows you to participate fully on this board.
If the combined annual income of a couple is US$136,000, how do they increase their assets by US$4,441,772 in one year?
Jul 11th, 2010 - 02:37 pm - Link - Report abuse 0By doing exactly as described in the article above!
Jul 11th, 2010 - 02:46 pm - Link - Report abuse 0No, Twinky.
Jul 11th, 2010 - 04:38 pm - Link - Report abuse 0What the article talks about is the position described by the accounts that were submitted. Not quite the same thing. Who chooses the accountants?
And going back to no.5, who said Argentina is a rich country? The Kirchners are rich. And who controls what the people get told about Argentina's wealth? Would that be the Kirchners?
Anyone notice a common thread?
(35) I love mathematics....
Jul 11th, 2010 - 04:42 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Problem:
”If the combined annual income of a couple is £ 136,000, how do they increase their assets by £ 4,441,772 in one year?”
Solution:
1) The couple has stable jobs, expense account, free house, free car, free plane, free helicopter.
2) The couple owns some property that can be use as collateral and they have some friends and family that can act as guarantors.
3) They go to their Local Bank and borrow a sum amounting to the double of their annual income. (I did precisely the same some years ago, before my second divorce :-)
That gives us: £ 136,000 (income) + £ 272,000 (loan) = £ 408,000 (capital)
The couple invests their £ 408.000 in “ROCKHOPPER EXPLORATION PLC” stock, buying it at the *52 week (1 year) low price of 30p per share. (408.000 ∗ 0.30 = 1.360.000 shares)
They get 1.360.000 Rockhopper shares for their money.
The couple sells their 1.360.000 Rockhopper shares at the *52 week (1 year) high price of 369,5p per share. ( 1.360.000 x 3,695 = £ 5.025.200)
They get £ 5.025.200 for their shares.
They go to the bank and pay back their loan with a 25% interest ( £ 5.025.200 - £ 272.000 (loan) - £ 68.000(interests) = £ 4.685.000
The couple walks out of the bank with £ 4.685.000 in their pocket.
Easy
*All “ROCKHOPPER EXPLORATION PLC” stock info can be checked on following link:
http://uk.reuters.com/business/quotes/chart?symbol=RKH.L
Or they can buy public land from the province they control for ArG$1/hectare when it is really worth U$1000/hectare. Quickly resell part of it and use the remaining funds to build a Hotel and rent out the other part for more annual rent than they paid just a few months earlier.
Jul 11th, 2010 - 04:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0BTW the land in question was not on the market but it happened to be available to the Ks.
That is a lot easier and you don't need crystal ball like you do in Think's imaginary scenario.
Capitalism is beautiful ..... isn't it!
Jul 11th, 2010 - 04:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0”Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure nineteen pounds nineteen and six, result happiness. Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure twenty pounds ought and six, result misery
Jul 11th, 2010 - 06:53 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The Ks are well and truly in the happiness camp
39 fredbdc - It is even easier when it is illegal for anyone to buy government land without a very lengthy process, congressional approval, open bids, etc. Quite simply, it was illegal for K to buy the land in the first place. Ah, the Argentina way - ignore the constitution and the law, then do what you want; this used to be called anarchy, not democracy!
Jul 11th, 2010 - 11:18 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Think, I hope you are joking, although with the Argentinian history of crony capitalism you probably don't know what else to call it. We call what they did corruption here in the first world.
Jul 11th, 2010 - 11:51 pm - Link - Report abuse 0(43)
Jul 12th, 2010 - 02:48 am - Link - Report abuse 0Best piece of hypocrisy ever!!!
Only a “Rolex Submariner Yank” could utter it!!!
Crony Capitalism????
Did anyone say Crony Capitalism????
Wall Street 2008 Anybody???
First Word????
Sure????
think as broke out in question markitis
Jul 12th, 2010 - 05:42 am - Link - Report abuse 0Breaking News:
Jul 12th, 2010 - 08:06 am - Link - Report abuse 0Falklands Oil and Gas Shares Down nearly 50% Today
I love Mondays!!!
http://www.stockopedia.co.uk/content/falkland-oil-and-gas-disappointed-by-dry-well-at-toroa-prospect-44627/
44 Jealous much? A country with so many economists and psychologists should be able to get it's self into some sort of order. It is sad that the corruption will keep you a 4th world country for as long as I am alive.
Jul 12th, 2010 - 11:53 am - Link - Report abuse 0(47)
Jul 12th, 2010 - 12:20 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Jealous :-))))))
I'm beeing “ironic” about“ your lost ” Sub“
I use a Calatrava as ”Beater”....
Sure you do, no one ever lies on the internet! BTW I never told you what kind of watch your countrymen were trying to steal. It is good that you can search for expensive watches though because I am pretty sure you have never even seen a Patek in person much less own one since there is only 1 retailer in your whole country.
Jul 12th, 2010 - 12:35 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I have thoroughly enjoyed reading the comments, particularly Think's claiming that others are the ones blowing hot air...and what is wrong with opinion Think? we have to read yours constantly... I guess you dont like people speculating about your wealthy/corrupt leaders, but you are more than happy to prattle on about Britians “strong” links to Nazism, how the Queen is the one actually controlling the British Government, and other bouts of crap “wisdom” you seem to churn out. but when we offer an opinion on the very plausable (strong) possibility that Argentina's leaders are growing rich while in power. the numbers are in the article above, and the economist run an article on your leaders too. but Britain being run by the Queen is more plausable, isnt it? Laughable. But hey, thats you, we wouldnt enjoy this debate without your nonsense. Keep it coming Think, makes us ponder the twisted logic Argentina loves to preach.
Jul 12th, 2010 - 12:35 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Think here
Jul 12th, 2010 - 01:57 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Well lads.......
The moment finally arrived...
My account has been “Regulated” (Closed:-)
Too much “Foul language I suppose???
After too many years with censorship in Argentina I don’t “think” it’s funny so..... ....
Let’s see if they delete this farewell!
(Sending this from a new account just to say good bye to the “intelligent ones”)
Take care
FREDBDC.
Jul 12th, 2010 - 10:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You keep on understanding just what you want, firstly, find out how macri started to be involucred in the cause by illigal spionage, there is a denounce against him.
Beside, what part you dont understand that the same judge who superseded the kirchner in the cause by illicit enrichment, is the same who has under process an ex minister of the government, and restrained hes goods, if that judge would be so funtional to the government, the cause against the ex minister would be shelved dont you think?.
On the other hand, if you think that the kirchner handle the justice in the way they want, you should know that on dicember of last year, the justice paralized 4 important decitions that were very important for the government, if some people insist on that assertion, it's evident that they are parroting crap.
Finally some of the ex ministers of menem, were sentenced before kirchner takes the power in 2003, so, what you are saying is just ignorant, i insist that you should inform your self with diferent points of view, and after get your conclutions, everychanel, newspapers, jornalist omit information, that's why it's so important to hear diferent opinions, use your brain and be objetive once and for all, i am not kirchnerist, there are many aspects that i dont like from the kirchner, but it does not mean that i am not going to recognize many of the achievements that we have since 2003.
“We intend to get involved in politics, and for politics you need money, a lot of money”, was supposedly the reply of the current Argentine president.
Jul 13th, 2010 - 06:54 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Why?
different day/year/government, same old presidential policies. yawn!
Jul 14th, 2010 - 09:46 am - Link - Report abuse 0@ fredbdc
Jul 14th, 2010 - 10:06 am - Link - Report abuse 0You are the typical Hypocrite Yank (or yank wannabe as I can see you dancing salsa like crazy in Miami)
“Since Argentina is one of the most corrupt countries in the world”
Not mate US is and far far, far, more corrupted that many South American countries.
Just to provide you a sample of the level of corruption in USA let me refresh your memory over resent corruption scandals. Do you? Well doesn’t matter I will show you anyway.
Blagojevich arrested, accused of 'corruption crime spree' over appointment
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/28139155/
Your bailout stuff is another huge case of corruption.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/28139155/
Wow this is corruption on high level.
Try to make an investment touching some sectors and you will see how you have to pass for the office of Mr. Kissinger and pay some sort of special services. Later he will deliver the envelopes to the right senator or policymaker to oil the wheels of free entrepreneurship and free market in US capitalist freedom.
Have you ever heard of Enron corruption scandal, Bernard Madoff and the SEC, etc.
Your country is so corrupted that you can even note that because is a matter of every day to day way of life.
And corruption is a kind of action in both ways, corrupted is who accept a bribe and who pays for it or offers it.
Your pay everywhere did you note that?
Continue dancing salsa is the best you can do on these days mate.
Nico didn't answer my question directly but I think 55 is a good guide. In politics, you need a lot of money to corrupt people, and the government, and the system. At least you do in South America.
Jul 14th, 2010 - 10:18 am - Link - Report abuse 0@harrier61
Jul 14th, 2010 - 11:31 am - Link - Report abuse 0Don’t be hypocrite please in UK corruption is widespread as in any other country in the world.
The problem is that you society don’t even talk out it I know that after been living for a while in UK.
Some of your MP members coming from wealthy families avoid paying taxes.
They have made ah hock laws to get away with it.
We call this corruption and in UK is also the same.
John Major ex Prime Minister was caught receiving money from Arabs countries to fund his campaign in the 90.
Your MP’s used taxpayer money for personal use they even passed the bill of the xxx Dvds personal expenditure to the poor taxpayer.
Your MPs get succulents incomes paid by consultant companies to give speech abroad, a good way to lavish bribes.
The strange thing is that these consultant companies are linked with bankers and industries that have received favors from the respective administrations.
Do you really believe that someone will pay 250k to head to hear G. Brown on how to be successful on economy? Or Tony Blair on how to make a peaceful world or talk about peace in the Middle East?
Come on wake up you cannot be so foolish. Do you?
For more information ask your local Miliband and his relation with the Bilderberg group.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PXGlf-v4ZzY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PXGlf-v4ZzY
So the salary been paid by the taxpayers is used to see their maters for consultation about how to rule the country to serve in the best way powerful interest.
This is corruption mate they are selling you for a few Quids.
Think about who has more corrupted leaders and them come back.
Would you please?
@NicoDin
Jul 14th, 2010 - 12:27 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You do make a good point, corruption is pretty much everywhere, but in varying degrees. There was the expenses scandel in the UK, where a number of polticians managed to scam a few thousand here and there. That is indeed corruption, however, the scale of corruption of your country's LEADER, is not in the thousands, but in the millions.
Here's one for you NicoDim, the Transparency International index. A value of 10 = least corrupt and a value of 0 = most corrupt.
Jul 14th, 2010 - 05:40 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Argentina 2.9 (105 places below the least corrupt country on earth)
United Kingdom 7.7 (16 places below the lest corrupt country on earth)
At least we get rid of corrupt MPs, like we did in the last election... you just elect their spouses...
What Nico doesn't understand it that all of those cases have or will be prosecuted. Whereas in Argentina they are cheered and given as an example of how to get ahead!
Jul 14th, 2010 - 07:24 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Corruption is endemic to the Argentinian Society. They like it and don't want to get rid of it. It is much easier to pay a cop $20 pesos rather than dealing with the ticket. Then they wonder why building a gas line costs 3X more money than in the US even though the labor, supplies etc are much cheaper in Argentina.
@J.A. Roberts
Jul 15th, 2010 - 01:44 am - Link - Report abuse 0Transparency International is a joke they (according with their own papers) measures perception of corruption.
Most of their survives are conducted on multinationals like Siemens, IBM, Kraft Food, etc.
They ask to CEOs what is they personal opinion or perception of corruption.
The director is a Canadian that by change has one of the less level of corruption in the world. And others from the boards are Africans may be that explains why moroco has less corruption than Argentina. haha
The problem is that theses CEOs pay bribes like the cases of Siemens and IBM in USA and in Argentina and in UK and in Italy an everywhere to gain contracts. The problem is that you don’t want to admited.
So its is very curious that they multinationals based on they own countries are not counted on theses survives else the index would be very different.
IBM and Siemens for example have been involved in several cases of corruption around the world.
If you believe is this fine you are showing your level of intelligence you have mate. What can I say pure crap.
@fredbdc
Your level of stupidity over take any Yank parameter I never pay any bribe in my entire life in Argentina and to be more precise I never was asked to pay anything than the charges due to law in any public office, etc.
My perception is that US is one of the most corrupted country in the world to the level of Russia close to the mafia. The police is corrupted, the government is corrupted, the FED is corrupted, Wall Street is the temple of corruption. The problem is that Yanks don’t wanna see it
This is the kind of brutal and corrupted country you live mate http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mMNYJcfcf_o
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mMNYJcfcf_o
Enjoy it and be aware of the MIGRA may be is going for you right now.
NicoDim, Transparency International has its critics, but in general it's not far off. There are other indices which give an indication of corruption...
Jul 15th, 2010 - 06:39 am - Link - Report abuse 0The Open Budget Initiative:
UK 1st, ARG 25th
Internet Centre for Corruption Research:
UK 16th, ARG 109th
Global Integrity
Does not rate the UK, but ranks ARG 70th and gives it a “weak” assessment.
I think we're getting the picture and I see you like youtube videos of brutality. How about the brutality you Argies mete out to your “grones”:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QV5OGsyOcPw
@J.A. Roberts
Jul 15th, 2010 - 08:50 am - Link - Report abuse 0mete out to your “grones”? Grone? Is some sort of new British expression? I don’t get it mate?
This is an English forum do you remember that? Please say it in English and may be I’ll understand you.
Anyway about police brutality kicking Niggers, Paki and Musi. It is in English mate you use these words in Britannia every day and your Royal family use it too, “My little Paki Friend” who say that?
So may be is in your official vocabulary. I’m right?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=63w98Nioz2w
here the translation for you so you can understand what is all about : )
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=63w98Nioz2w
Come on express your self freely little Nigger hassen
You do a good job in the British press to portray them as the source of every crime
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=63w98Nioz2w
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=63w98Nioz2w
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=63w98Nioz2w
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=63w98Nioz2w
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=63w98Nioz2w
Ah! British the most hypocrite people in the world after the yanks of course.
mete out to your “grones” haha
Yep, NicoDim, there are racists all over the world, including the UK and the British Royal Family, but that does not mean there are none in Argentina - the country which welcomed Nazi war criminals.
Jul 15th, 2010 - 12:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0One think I can say about the UK is that we have laws against racism. Argentina in the other had enshrines racism in its constitution. Read Article 25 of your own constitution and weep with shame!
Nico, I don't know how you got away with not paying bribes to the police. More often than not, my driver had to had to give the police $20 pesos when we left the freeway to go home to La Lucila after clubbing. If he didn't give him the money the Police would stop us and search the car. We were not hiding anything but I wanted to get home so It was just easier to pay. My Argentinian friends told me not to complain because it would only make matters worse since they knew who I was and where I lived.
Jul 15th, 2010 - 01:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Today Arg. is the first country to aproval de gay marriage in Latam, and 10th in the world. Gays Uruguayan and people from Malvinas (with their Arg Documents) can marry here too in a real develop country. If the Malvinas people want to leave their dictartopship regime (like Cuba) could make their documents in a real free socity in Ushuaia (Capital of TDF, Antarctica & South Atlantic Islands Province) . All press around the world have shown this new , except Mercopress of course.
Jul 15th, 2010 - 04:21 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Perhaps MercoPress didn't want to give everyone a field day about homosexual Argentines. But since you've opened the topic..........
Jul 15th, 2010 - 07:11 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I understand that there were lots of protests. “Thousands of demonstrators gathered outside Argentina's congress to protest against a proposal to legalise same-sex marriage.” Amongst them were a large number of deep sea squid protesting that if Argentines could now do it to each other legally, night time beach life would end as this was when the squid rose to the surface to service the Argentine population.
Now “a real develop country”. Developed into what? Let's see. Argentina is banned from the world's money markets. Argentina employs “unwritten” trade restrictions, even against fellow members of Mercosur. Argentina's GDP is only slightly better than Venezuela's.
According to Wikipedia, GDP(PPP) per capita for Argentina is $14,560
GDP(PPP) per capita for Venezuela is $12,201
GDP(PPP) per capita for Falkland Islands is $25,000
GDP(PPP) per capita for the UK is $34,619
and GDP(PPP) per capita for the USA is $46,381.
There are ways in which Argentina is “developed”. It has racism (see the Constitution), it has paranoia, it has anxiety (63%), it has more psychiatrists than any other profession and it is nationally delusional. Oh, and it had millions of its people who fled to the EU because they saw no hope for the country.
And it has the Kirchners. There's a real nail in the coffin.
@J.A. Roberts
Jul 16th, 2010 - 07:23 am - Link - Report abuse 0Did I say that we are not racist? Did I say that we are perfect? Did I say that we are the best?
No I have always said that you are worst than us and that you are a bunch of hypocrite. Like many European living in Europe. That in Europe are afraid to say coloured but here are very please to say the most racist comment about the immigrant in Europe. That’s all mate.
“One think I can say about the UK is that we have laws against racism”
We have also the some laws here. Have you ever heard about INADI?
http://www.inadi.gov.ar/
Sorry but now I have an appointment with Mr. Fredbdc the pure uncorrupted Yank good blesses him.
Mr. Fred good mac or big mac.
You are a tremendous hypocrite “my driver had to had to give the police $20 pesos when we left”
You pay so you are so corrupted like him mate “My Argentinian friends told me not to complain because it would only make matters worse since they knew who I was and where I lived”
This is a lie, so please do this when the police officer asks you the bribe. Ask him his police ID if he refuses (he cannot by law) call 911. Or give me his ID number and the exactly position were the uniformed guy is in duty.
I have a friend judge that pleased will take care of him.
You will surely be called to testify and may be you will have a case against you for Coecho according with the article 256 to 259 (Artículo 256/59) of our code of penal law.
The guy can receive 6 years of prison plus life sentence to access to any public service duty.
Your Argie friend is an Idiot or may be he has some cannabis in his pocket. What is illegal here.
May be they have learn from you guys.
http://www.inadi.gov.ar/
http://www.inadi.gov.ar/
So can you stop to play the victim please, you are so corrupted as this guy mate.
No NicoDim, you implied that we are hypocrites but you are not, which is patently untrue. In fact, it is you Argentines who are hypocrites because you discriminate on an official basis.
Jul 16th, 2010 - 08:12 am - Link - Report abuse 0Your constitution is RACIST, yes, the Argentine constitution discriminates against NON EUROPEANS. Read Article 25 you dimwit! I defy you to find any British law (not newspaper articles or youtube videos, I mean legislation enacted by parliament) which discriminates on the basis of race, when you can do that then you will be perfectly entitled to call us hypocrites.
The ball is in your court.
Nico, I don't need to make stuff up. I have plenty of horror stories about Argentina that I could be on here all day.
Jul 16th, 2010 - 09:57 am - Link - Report abuse 0It wasn't just one friend wary of the police, it was everyone I knew. I was told not let them into your house or let them know what you do because they are the ones planning most the crimes. Do a search on my mugging story post in Recoleta. I am sure the cops were in on that one.
@J.A. Roberts
Jul 16th, 2010 - 12:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 01- You don’t have any written constitution to start with so there is not place to check anything.
2- You are racist, xenophobic and like Nazis the history has many probes about that.
3- You hate brownies, Pakis, Hindy, Polish and everything that you consider foreigner.
You have a racist party called BNP Nazy lovers
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FNGb85OtoTQ
The most ironical thing is that your racist leader Griffin and his followers is that if you put a turban on their head they will be confused with a Pakistani here haha
The little arrogant speaks about the western world, haha he is pretty in the east for me.
You have a little Adolf Hitler there are you aware of that?
And yes I call you Hypocrite because you are and it is part or your culture.
Sorry if the mirror doesn’t shows what you want to so be shown.
: )
@fredbdc
I don’t need a search or stories I need the exactly position and the number of the ID police of the official you are accusing of bribe mate. It is quite simple you are obligate as a resident of this country to report any crime even if you are a foreigner and your friends too.
You have been a witness and party of a crime conducted by a public servant and all with responsibilities has to face their responsibilities.
You should do it in USA and you should do here my friend is the law.
So here where to can find more information or make your formal complain.
The police officer will be investigate for the Internal Affair department and put out of duty immediately.
You can do it anonymously under the new program I don’t remember the name now I was told but here.
0800-999-83589 denunciasai@mseg.gba.gov.ar
That's not true NicoDim. We do have a written constitution, it's just not all in a single document. Anyway, I see you declined my challenge to point out any British legislation which discriminates on the basis of race. The rest of what you provide has absolutely no relevance. You Argies are just as guilty of casual racism as any other nation - including the UK:
Jul 16th, 2010 - 02:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racism_in_Argentina
But what is most astounding is that you continue to discriminate on the basis of race in your highest laws... read Article 25 of your constitution you idiot!
I did report the mugging, it took about 4 hours sitting in a filthy police station with all of them standing around b/sing and smoking without one open window. Only 1 computer with a small green screen was used by 3 different people loads of paperwork and I never received one follow up call. BECAUSE THEY WERE IN ON IT!
Jul 16th, 2010 - 05:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I did report it to the US Embassy though and they were not surprised.
@J.A. Roberts
Jul 17th, 2010 - 07:52 am - Link - Report abuse 01- I never decline to any challenge specially if involves to kick stupid British @arsssss.
What about your racist legislation since 1962?
British Immigration acts 1962-1996
“They were denied their right to enter their country of citizenship, contrary to international law, entirely on the grounds of race and colour. White settlers from Kenya were welcome. Asians with UK passports were not...”
“ the idea of 'birth and ancestry' in the 1968 Act. New terms of 'Patrial' and 'non-Patrial' were introduced in the 1971 Act. This marked a clear division between Citizens of the UK and Colonies who were white and those who were not. Patrials had the absolute right of entry, non-Patrials were subject to immigration control. The direct link of descent by blood with the UK became the essential requirement for entry. Most non-whites could not meet this requirement. The 1971 Act came into force on 1 January 1973, While Britain was actively closing the door on non-white people from the Commonwealth, it opened its borders to nationals of European countries.”
You will fine here a good explanation about how racist your are.
http://www.ncadc.org.uk/archives/filed%20newszines/oldnewszines/Old%201-50/news18/62.html
2-You have not any written constitution mate everyone knows that but you.
UK has a set of confused an vague laws based on Common law (based from the middle age), laws promoted by the house of lords and jurisprudence that’s all.
Known as well as a de facto constitution lets say something like the Argentinean Juntas (gobiernos de facto also known).
A compilation of some sort of written laws doesn’t mean that you have a written constitution. May be a legal system but not a constitution.
You are still in the middle age mate, you are still a monarchy with full prerogatives and very racist indeed.
BTW where can I buy a copy of your constitution?
Have you ever read it? Or course not because doesn’t exist.
Once again NicoDimit you fail to point to any British law which discriminates on the basis of race.
Jul 17th, 2010 - 12:31 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The best you can do is point us at the opinion, yes, thats right nothing more than an opinion, of a Mr Cajil. I'm sorry, but that doesn't really cut it, please the law... don't forget you have racial discrimination enshrined in your highest law, the Argentine constitution.
And as for our constitution being unwritten, what a load of tosh! You even say it yourself: “A compilation of some sort of written laws”. So if the laws are written then the constitution is written, no? Don't confuse “unwritten” with “not in a single document”. And if you think that constitutions in a single document are somehow better, then let me just use Argentina as an example: You have had a single document (correct me if I am wrong) since 1859, but that hasn't stopped bouts of dictatorship, some of them quite lengthy and massive, I mean MASSIVE, human rights abuses against Argentina's own citizens. I wonder how must feel to have your own countrymen push you, alive, out the back of a Hercules into the Atlantic. Fun?
“You are still in the middle age mate, you are still a monarchy with full prerogatives and very racist indeed.”
Jul 17th, 2010 - 01:07 pm - Link - Report abuse 0English law is the legal system of England and Wales, and is the basis of common law legal systems used in most Commonwealth countries and the United States .
Thats 55 nations who use our “primitive” law system.
I'd also like to point out that every nation under the queens monarchy is more posperous than Argentina.
@J.A. Roberts
Jul 18th, 2010 - 11:58 am - Link - Report abuse 0This opinion is pretty valid read your govt. acts.
And this opinion is a much peace of valuable information than your opinion about our stated of art constitution mate. What the hell do you know if you have not idea how your political system works.
Only a moron can say that UK has a written constitution. Or that our constitution discriminate any race.
“So if the laws are written then the constitution is written, no?”
No you are wrong any constitutional lawyer can tell you that.
The constitution is the mother of all laws and not other law can go against that where basic rights are clear expressed.
Here how the world see your system of government, this is from US so don’t tell me that is from Fidel Castro or the axis of the evil eh!.
http://www.state.gov/r/pa/ei/bgn/3846.htm
UK
Government
Type: Constitutional monarchy (this doesn’t mean you have a constitution else you are a monarchy constituted)
Constitution: Unwritten; partly statutes, partly common law and practice. See? Unwritten any UK lawyer can tell you that.
So my friend you have a house without proper deeds (where your rights of property are clear expressed) else you have an internal condom’s rules. That’s all that the rulers can change easily to their wish.
Your set of law is a mess and you cannot do a legal step without consultation with any of the 3 guys “Vernon Bodganor”, “Peter Hennessey” and “Robert Hazel”.
“Unit name: Constitutional and Administrative Law Unit
Britain has no written constitution or comprehensive Bill of Rights, and is found partly in conventions and customs and partly in statutes. Conventions are rules and practices which are not legally enforceable but are regarded as indispensable to the working government; many which are derived from the historical events through which the British government has evolved.”
Fragment from textbook David Hoffman (Somerville College, Oxford).
next Zethe
What exactly is your point here? Anyone can tell you that our consitution is unwritten. Works fine for us.
Jul 18th, 2010 - 04:23 pm - Link - Report abuse 0If you are suggesting that because our constitution is unwritten it is somehow flawed. Again: 55 nations use our “primitive” law system. I believe that makes it the most wide spread in the world.
We still have a constitution Nico. It's just unwritten. Meaning it's not on a large peace of paper signed by the queen and prime minister, the word “unwritten” is something of a misnomer as much of the British constitution is embodied in the written form, within statutes, court judgments, and treaties. The constitution has other unwritten sources, including parliamentary constitutional conventions and royal prerogatives.
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