MercoPress. South Atlantic News Agency
Malvinas next of kin in Falklands for maintenance jobs at Argentine cemetery
A group from the Malvinas fallen soldiers next of kin Committee is travelling this Saturday to the Falkland Islands for the upkeep and maintenance of the monument at the Argentine cemetery in Darwin. Read full article
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Disclaimer & comment rulesHeres hoping its not a publicity stunt, and a geniune expression of love for there fallen soldiers.
Dec 03rd, 2011 - 04:31 pm - Link - Report abuse 0so year after year argentina and argentines try as hard as they can to make life hell for the islanders, but the moment they want to ship some of the very same men who tried in 82 to subjugate them to a genocidal third world nation, for what looks like another propaganda stunt aimed at furthering the attempts to hurt them, the islanders are expected to accommodate them and act with kindness?
Dec 03rd, 2011 - 04:50 pm - Link - Report abuse 0still this is not to be unexpected, given argentina's quite delusional entitlement complex. the same nation which thinks it had the god given right to conquer and exterminate vast tracts of land and yet scream how unfair it is for Britain to beat it to the Falklands, clearly expects that it's unprovoked attacks and shrieking hostility towards the islanders does not matter, and that while they treat the islanders with nothing but hatred, treachery and contempt, they must be treated with utmost respect and reverence by the islanders.
in my opinion the islanders should simply block this and every future visit by any argentine, and make preparations to perform a burial at sea in argentine waters of ALL argentine remains so long as argentina continues it's policies against the islanders
maybe then argentina will fully realize just how unwanted it is in the Falklands, and will finally learn some desperately needed humility
2 Braedon. No Argentine should be on those Islands not one. Turn them back when they land and tell them to take the remains with them, because as long as just one dead Argentine soldier remains on the Falklands then he will be used for propaganda purposes along with his family.
Dec 03rd, 2011 - 07:27 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I think its going to far in saying that they should be buried at sea. I am sure their family's would rather have them in their own local cemetery so that they can visit them whenever they wish after all its not the fault of the ordinary person in Argentina that they are bullied by successive Governments in Argentina into performing every year in this fashion...
Its showing a little disrespect to these soldiers many who did not want to be there in the first place to just dump them into the sea.
God I must be getting soft in my old age to be saying such things.
if a wall is built arround the graves,
Dec 03rd, 2011 - 08:11 pm - Link - Report abuse 0what is to stop it being turned into a shrine, and covered in argentine flages, or graffiti,
just a thought .
3 Britishbulldog
Dec 03rd, 2011 - 08:29 pm - Link - Report abuse 0you're saying that Argentina used this for propaganda, you have no idea, mate!! , Margaret did not use the war to save her government in 82, The Gordito Cameron's wants to celebrate 30 years of Malvinas war,It is not propaganda!! He wants to send to our Islands the prince up for trinning , that is not propaganda. This Gordito wants to save his decline of his government!!
Argentina wants is to recover the Malvinas Islands peacefully and already has big support and right now goes by the USA with Mr Arguello!!! mate
a5 Kiwisarg ---- Your of your head mate, your scumbag country invades our peaceful islands and we are supposed to sit back and let you do it? WTF was Margaret supposed to do roll over and let scumbags bring their kind of murdering totalitarian regime to OUR islands.
Dec 03rd, 2011 - 10:15 pm - Link - Report abuse 0And lets get one more thing right while we are at it the Falklands never belonged to you thieving murdering scumbags as Argentina did not exist when we populated the Falklands as well you know. So the only way to gain them is to once more invade where again we will kick your arses GET IT MATE.
As for that slimy lying toad of a so called Ambassador you have going to America, you will find that when he enters any rooms in Washington those rooms will empty pretty dam quick as Americans cant stand liars as well as us British.
As for the Prince coming to his training its our prerogative to send any military service personnel to any of our lands to either train or to do any other kind of military duty.
And why should we not celebrate the ending of the Falklands conflict where we not only kicked your scumbag arses but totally humiliated you in front of your so called friends that actually would stab you in the back as soon as look at you get it yet MATE you have no friends just countries that surround you waiting for you to fail again so that they can once more laugh behind your back.
And you will find MATE that if you insult my country you get it back double quick MATE
@ 5 Kiwisarg First i would like to just say, that i totally agree that the families of the fallen, should have every right to pay their respects, and its something Britain has and should allow. This i dont think is propaganda, but just a simple ceremony .
Dec 03rd, 2011 - 10:31 pm - Link - Report abuse 0BUTthe prince being stationed there is no propaganda, he is treated exactly like any other soldier is, and this treatment is also applied to where and when he is stationed . Thatcher did not go to war purely to save here government, but it did have that affect, and she probably knew that it would. But i do not believe it was her only intention, where as it was the juntas intention and Galtieri's. The celebrations are not propaganda, because most people here dont even realise that Argentina hasnt given up her claims to the islands, or some in case that there was a war.
How is bringing the Argentine Junta to its knees in defeat and paving the way for flawed democracy within Argentina in any way British Propaganda? Thats just doing you a favour.
Dec 03rd, 2011 - 10:35 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Celebrating the preservation of UN Charter Human Rights in both the Falkland Islands AND Argentina for the last 30 years isn't British Propaganda, its common sense.
Sending a pilot on a duty is sending a pilot on a duty is sending a pilot on a duty, if you think its British Propaganda, ask some Russian Sailors about it.
The Coalition Government of Cameron and Clegg is going to end anyway, since it is highly unusual for more than one political party to be in power here in the UK, so Cameron is not saving something that is going to last, it will either be Cameron, Clegg, or Milliband in power after the next election, not a Coalition.
The Government consists of all political parties here, opposition MPs sit on Committees that make decisions alongside Coalition MPs, can't see that system of Government changing, certainly not declining anyway, and all members of the Government are usually elected to Parliament here by the public. In Argentina I understand you President just picks a load of yes men (and women) that may or may be her own family, and gives them Government responsibilities and a fat salary, no public gets to elect these people, so when you talk of a decline in a Government you're obviously thinking of the Argentine system of politics, where you just discard unqualified people, but here we like stability, and people we have elected to run the country. You have a narrow view of Government, which is understandable given the flawed system you live under.
Arguello is unlikely to get invited anywhere important in Washington, even if he sends begging letters, they don't like incompetant professional liars in the US, at least if they lie about anything there's plausible deniability, Arguello just makes a stupid grin and hopes no-one notices.
I seriously think you're a billy no mates
Tired old stuff from the new CELAC I see :-)
Dec 04th, 2011 - 12:02 am - Link - Report abuse 0How surprising :-)
http://falklandsnews.wordpress.com/2011/12/03/standard-stuff-from-celac/
CELAC is just the Chavez Buddy Club, he's such a good role model, I'm sure joining that particular club will open loads of doors, usually exits mind.
Dec 04th, 2011 - 01:38 am - Link - Report abuse 0Something more for Argentin to complain about !!
Dec 04th, 2011 - 01:40 am - Link - Report abuse 0http://falklandsnews.wordpress.com/2011/12/04/european-union-octs/
Argentines are good at building walls not so good at building bridges.
Dec 04th, 2011 - 01:51 pm - Link - Report abuse 08 wireless we dont have vitalicous in the government like you have in the house of lords (who elects these lords, by hereritage or accomodation), and we elect directly with peoples vote for president, you indirectly by the house of commons as far as I know.
Dec 04th, 2011 - 02:37 pm - Link - Report abuse 0and about the use you make of democracies, inútiles called by a great language analizer (Chomsky), that says your democracy and diplomacy is falaz.
www.pascualserrano.net/noticias/cargos-vitalicios
http://maniobradelpoder.blogspot.com/2011/08/eu-gran-bretana-democracia-falaz.html
13 malen
Dec 04th, 2011 - 06:25 pm - Link - Report abuse 0''we dont have vitalicous in the government''?? Isn't that a kind of muffin? I'm not surprised you're feeling hard done by. The House of Lords is bound to have a shockingly aristocratic biscuit. You're just jealous because your upper house hasn't been going since 956 and therefore no vitalicious for you.
As for Noam Chomsky, at least the UK has a democracy and diplomacy worth remarking on. I doubt he'd waste his breath on that serial liar Arguello.
the cámara alta (senadores) the cámara baja (diputados) the president here are directly voted by people in elections. and nobody has vitalicious periods, they can renew one period (4 years), no more.
Dec 04th, 2011 - 08:15 pm - Link - Report abuse 0your lords are vitalicious and not elected by the people.
and Chomsky I knew & read him as lingüistic analizer only, not his politics “incursiones” that are very interesting (he wrote a book about the theme)
http://maniobrasdelpoder.blogspot.com/2011/08/eu-gran-bretana-democracia-falaz.html
hope it functions
what is to stop it being turned into a shrine, and covered in argentine flages.
Dec 04th, 2011 - 09:13 pm - Link - Report abuse 015 malen
Dec 04th, 2011 - 09:17 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I know what you mean, but 'vitalicious' is not a word.
And they aren't my lords; we have our own government.
Happy reading with Chomsky. He's the ultimate radical; if you want to read about the US controlling the world for oil, he's your man. Should be right up your street.
@15
Dec 04th, 2011 - 09:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0So who voted the junta in,the same junta that the crowds worshiped in the plaza de mayo in april 1982
Jealousy and envy that’s all it is ..
Dec 05th, 2011 - 12:39 am - Link - Report abuse 0it's not funny to see this dreadful class of aggresive banter ... the saddest thing is that i have friends and relatives from UK that read this and have to apologise...
Dec 05th, 2011 - 08:00 am - Link - Report abuse 0people, both UK and Argentina: no myths at all, no war, no threats, the XXth century is loooooooooooooong gone now... can we, for god's sake, learn to live like human beings?
i deeply reject war, jingoisms, racism, pointless arrogance, whims over reasons, force over logic, threats over maturity and responsibility.
goverments are dreaful everywhere, people is not...
and for those who still insist about myths, brainwash, massive madness, whims, i suggest you to read this work, and by the way, you might learn a little of a fine language called Castellano-español, as well as i learnt English.
http://www.facebook.com/groups/AAFMRP/doc/10150358728888792/
UK WAS one of the beacons of culture and civilisation, and deserves to be it again, by acting with greatness, maturity, decency and friendship... i'm sure it is possible!
Kind Regards.
We still are ! :-)
Dec 05th, 2011 - 08:16 am - Link - Report abuse 0@ 20 don't apologize, you've done nothing wrong.
Dec 05th, 2011 - 08:18 am - Link - Report abuse 0http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B4vZpejXVFE
20
Dec 05th, 2011 - 11:36 am - Link - Report abuse 0Britain remains one of the beacons of truth, honesty, fair play, culture and civilisation. Not perfect by any means but far better than anything Argentina has produced. All Argentina has achieved is to abuse and pervert democracy with a succession of corrupt dictators and facists. Britain's resolute and determined defence of the Falkland Islands is to ensure that Islanders can continue to live in the treasured way they know and believe in.
If you were a serious individual you would support the Islanders right to their own culture and civlisation and instead lecture and cajole your fellow Countrymen to allow the Islanders to live in peace. If you are unable to understand or appreciate the Islanders right to determination then like many of your ilk your opinion and views are worthless.
Walls at the Argentine Cemetry wil only be daubed with propoganda. Al you need to do is look round teh battle sites following a visit from the next of kin. They spray pianted one of teh mountain sites with the usual phrase. Plaques are stook to rocks. I wil certainly be adding my name to the list of those objecting. It is coming close to the point where anyone with an Argentine passport should not be permitted into the Islands. Our small voice is being smothere by the shouting and lambasting of the bully across the waters.
Dec 05th, 2011 - 03:05 pm - Link - Report abuse 023
Dec 05th, 2011 - 08:32 pm - Link - Report abuse 0a beacon of culture is demonstrated with present and actual facts, and a clear understanding of this every-day-a-smaller-world phenomena... a new challenge for friendship, mutual respect and comprehension, and seriousness... i'm not pleased with recent strikes, cuts and riots in UK at all, we here know it very well... only a troubled mind can enjoy other people's suffering..
i support islanders' right to their own culture, nobody can validly be opposed to that, they're part of mankind, as well as we are, the persons in the continental area...
but we all know that there is one single point that cannot be negotiated, this is not a popularity contest, i do not dequalify other opinions just because they come from persons with different ideas.. i read, analise, search for background info and give my opinion in the end...
many overlapped facts, situations, acts along history have provoked this present level of confusion and mixed ideas about rights, justice, equity, and fairness... a lot of feelings are involved... but a lot of powers and lobbies are gambling over us -arg and islanders- in order to satisfy their own interest, regardless international law, bringing tensions and problems to an area of the world already packed with them...
i claim for sense and honesty in a decent and ellegant way to solve this... the largest mutual and more satisfying commitment ever reached: 1971 memorandum of understanding... if it could be possible, why can't be possible again? i'd really love to see that happen ...(me and my english-speaking, UK rock lover friends :)
24 those paintings in mountains are wrong... i wouldn't have made it... i have noticed aboul local's sensitivity to this kind of situations.. my apologies...
there's a lot of sensible people around here that actually love to know and meet islanders... i'm one of them... i have a falklands-born friend (a Manga drawing artist and teacher)... a case wich shows a hopeful way to do things.
kind regards
I'm not confused ... the Islands are British. Argentina has never had a claim. Can't get much clearer than that!
Dec 06th, 2011 - 07:43 am - Link - Report abuse 025
Dec 06th, 2011 - 09:14 am - Link - Report abuse 0Couldn't disagree more, if I read your English correctly.
The only thing I can pick out of that is that Sovereignty is non-negotiable which is the UK's final and often stated position.
After Argentina's invasion of these Islands in 1982, the situation became far more complex than you care to mention. Recent Argentine aggression and attempts at a blockade have not helped either. Again you say nothing.
If you were truly decent, honest and “elegant” you would come up with a bit more from the Argentine side and stop waffling on about strikes, riots and cuts in the UK which are irrelevant.
i don't want to argue with you, even though you seem to attack me... the thing is that, after a long time of research i couldn't find enough reasons to hold britain's case.. i'm sorry---- there's a majority of documents, evidence, facts and situations that are in favour of argentina's case... no emotions at all, just strictly attached to information available for everyone who can read and speak in english, french and spanish..
Dec 06th, 2011 - 10:07 am - Link - Report abuse 0no hard feelings.. i try to find the correct answer to this matter...maybe you can't read that link in nº 20 'cause it's in spanish...there are english sources too... i recommend you to take a look at them.
we all win with friendship, fairness and cooperation...
just look this (arg case)
and this (bristish case)
Falklands were settled by people who want to remain British.
Dec 06th, 2011 - 11:47 am - Link - Report abuse 0No emotion no antagonism just plain decent, honest facts.
Turning to friendship, fairness and cooperation............nice in theory but in practice look no further than the 1982 war started by Argentinian facists and ever since the petty attempts at a blockade. If you weren't so polite and I didn't know better I'd say you were a complete hypocrite.
Best regards
Riverplatewriter, If the majority of documents, evidence, facts and situations are in favour of Argentina's case then why has your government done everything it can to avoid taking Britain & The Falklands to court.
Dec 06th, 2011 - 12:29 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Sooner or later Argentina is going to have to put up or shut up.
http://www.icj-cij.org/homepage/index.php?lang=en
Riverplatewriter
Dec 06th, 2011 - 01:40 pm - Link - Report abuse 0OK I'll bite, though I reckon I know who this is anyway.
Argentina claims that in January 1833 the population of the Falkland Islands was expelled and replaced by British settelers.
So...
Argentina also claims that in August 1833, a group of patriotic Argentines rebelled against British rule. Errr, weren't they expelled 8 months before?
If you actually look at the historical documentation.
Pinedo, commander of the Sarandi, documents the people who stayed and the people who evacuated. 4 people chose to leave, please note this was their decision.
Onslow commander of HMS Clio notes in his log, his efforts to persuade the population to stay.
In March 1833, Vernet sends his deputy Matthew Brisbane to the Falklands. Meeting with Captain Fitzroy of HMS Beagle, he makes it plain he is there to further Vernet's business interests only.
Both Fitzroy and Darwin document their meeting with members of Vernet's settlement.
Thomas Helsby maintains a diary throughout the period, documenting daily life in the settlement, Helsby was Vernet's clerk.
The Falklands Census records the names of settlers, members of Vernet's settlers including Manuel Coronel, Carmelita Penny nee Simon, Antonina Roxas still resident. Antonina Roxas became a major land owner in the Falklands.
The historical documentation, including material in the Argentine national archives, flatly contradicts the Argentine expulsion myth.
Moreover, Britain did not colonise the Falklands till 1841. Until then the population was largely based on those from Vernet's settlement.
Argentina also places great emphasis that Vernet was an “Argentine Governor”. He also claimed to work for the British, urged the British to send a permanent garrison and asked the British for their permission for his enterprise.
Did you know that?
RPW - a) get a shorter name
Dec 06th, 2011 - 02:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0b) try some extra reading, but be warned, it may ruin your day :-)
http://falklandstimeline.wordpress.com/
As to the main picture,
Dec 06th, 2011 - 04:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 0sadly those crosses may well be added to, by the time Argentina-
gives up the ghost .
32 a shorter name? copy and paste it! easy!
Dec 07th, 2011 - 02:17 am - Link - Report abuse 0i read that timeline, but contradicts other british sourced timelines in certain points... i'm writing one of my own.. i'll let you know.
31 when a territory is transferred from one power to another for differen reasons, people living there have the chance to remain or to leave... but the fact is that the previous United provinces Authority was ousted by Onslow and a few civilians remained there, true, but under British sovereignty, that's clearly different...
Maria Angelica Vernet is the Buenos Aires Cabildo Museum Curator... she's a genuine Vernet's descendant i'll ask her...
http://timelinesdb.com/listevents.php?subjid=234&title=Falkland%20Islands “Britain ousted a small group of Argentine settlers and seized control of the Malvina Islands.”
#34 That link happens to be incorrect.
Dec 07th, 2011 - 08:49 am - Link - Report abuse 0Argentina clearly claims the population was expelled and replaced. By your admission this is untrue.
This is a fundamental part of Argentina's claim, its used to justify ignoring the rights of the islanders to claim they supplanted a previous population.
They didn't, its a lie.
So if as you claim, Argentina's claim is sound, why does it have to be built on a lie.
i'm strictly attached to sources and versions, i'm not the owner of the truth, i can see that both versions need to be confirmed and furtherly documented..
Dec 07th, 2011 - 09:16 pm - Link - Report abuse 0but the main issue still exists: was Onslow's presence and acts at falklands legitimate? were those reasons according to law in that time? civilians that remained didn't have the chance to keep their Argentine status... the other ones that left, maybe, refused to accept UK authority over them... i'd like to find their descendants and ask them..
let's not forget the1790 nootka sound treaty, 1823 United Provinces recognition as a State by UK treaty (by that time south american revolutionary armies already kicked spain out of America, and conquered their independence, 1825 peace and trade treaty ... and obviously 1965 UNGA 2065 resolution.. these documents cannot be all wrong, it's not logic..
You dodged the question. It is a lie, it is untrue, its a claim based on a lie.
Dec 07th, 2011 - 09:32 pm - Link - Report abuse 0So if as you state the claim is “legitimate” why does Argentina resort to a lie.
Its a lie, this is nothing to do with “versions”, documentary evidence from the period flatly contradict it. I point to documents, British and Argentine, that demonstrate it is a lie. Please point to a document from the period that backs up the 20th Century Argentine claim.
Further, there is documentary evidence that shows those members of Vernet's settlement preferred to be under British protection. Funnily enough Vernet asked the British to set up a permanent garrison.
1790 Nootka Convention.
As an argument to justify Argentina's claim, this was concocted by Paul Groussac in the 1880s - nearly a century later a French emigre to Argentina concocted this ridiculous argument. Points of fact. A treaty between Spain and Britain, neither ever applied it to the Falklands, Britain has never acknowledged it applied to the Falklands, there are ICJ precadents that specifically rule it out and there is a clause in the treaty that frees Britain from any obligation when a 3rd party (Argentina) intervenes. Spain also unilaterally repudiated the treaty in 1795 and whether it was re-enacted by the Treaty of Madrid in 1814 is debatable. Whatever way you look at it, its irrelevant. And btw if it is prima facie evidence, why did Moreno forget to mention it in 1790.
The treaty of Friendship, both Britain and the USA when they signed their respective treaties recognising Argentina made it plain that they recognises the territory the Republic possessed, not the treaty it claimed.
All UN GA resolutions simply recognise a dispute, they do not pronounce or make any judgement on sovereignty.
#30 UK refuses to recognise ICJ compulsory jurisdiction in disputes arising before january 1st 1974 (Falklands-Malvinas dispute: 1833)--- tell UK to change this and maybe we could start to believe in its case...
Dec 08th, 2011 - 01:50 am - Link - Report abuse 0http://www.facebook.com/l.php?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.icj-cij.org%2Fjurisdiction%2Findex.php%3Fp1%3D5%26p2%3D1%26p3%3D3%26code%3DGB&h=VAQEl0UwMAQEbhxgEkDT16hklJL5CJj7mXhf2cWRem_ECKg
it says “1. The Government of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland accept as compulsory ipso facto and without special convention, on condition of reciprocity, the jurisdiction of the International Court of Justice, in conformity with paragraph 2 of Article 36 of the Statute of the Court, until such time as notice may be given to terminate the acceptance, over all disputes arising after 1 January 1974, with regard to situations or facts subsequent to the same date...”, therefore UK refuses to negotiate... well... take your own conclusions.
Facebook?
Dec 08th, 2011 - 09:05 am - Link - Report abuse 0Oh and you dodged the question. Again.
And the new question, where is the contemporary documentary evidence supporting the Argentine expulsion myth, when so much contradicts it.
treaty with spain,
Dec 08th, 2011 - 02:08 pm - Link - Report abuse 0so how does that work with the relationship between bloody mary =
and that philip, or the spannish bloke, do we not inherit it first,
just a bloody silly thought .
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