MercoPress. South Atlantic News Agency
Italian lawmakers support “a more relevant role” for Argentina in the Malvinas dispute
Forty-eight Italian senators and lawmakers expressed their public support for Argentina’s sovereignty claim over the Falklands/Malvinas Islands in a letter sent to UN Secretary General Ban Ki-moon, the Argentine Foreign Ministry announced on Monday. Read full article
Comments
Disclaimer & comment rulesThe Italian senate has 315 members , so 48 is hardly a quorum. Anyway , what's it got to do with them ?
May 15th, 2012 - 08:29 am - Link - Report abuse 0Foreign Minister Tinman received bunga bunga party invitation.
May 15th, 2012 - 08:44 am - Link - Report abuse 0Notice he was born in argentina, makes one wonder how many of those 48 were born there too. Also i bet the Italian president is not going to be happy that law makers are acting as foreign ministers on foreign matters, especially when the UK condems this act, which is a clear breah of the EU treaty. Can only see Italy distancing itself from these lawmakers and them being in hot water back in italy for their unofficial actions and declaration.
May 15th, 2012 - 09:13 am - Link - Report abuse 0.........and here we go again!!!
May 15th, 2012 - 09:26 am - Link - Report abuse 0A group of people who have nothing else better to do, trying to solve an issue that has already been decided.
Thanks, but no thanks.
So the Islanders have got to bend over and take a c**kshfting just because the Italian's want to help????
“ to act as mediator in the conflict”??? The only conflict lies in the heads of those Argentinian's who don't realise that “No!!” means “NO!!”
The Falklands are classed by the EU as a Special Overseas Territory so, as a signatory to the Treaty of Lisbon, it will never be the official Italian position.
May 15th, 2012 - 09:26 am - Link - Report abuse 0i think the UK government have made it plain and clear on the issue
May 15th, 2012 - 09:39 am - Link - Report abuse 0Sovereignty will only be discussed on request of the FI government
so i suggest asking the FI government, as the British government will not move from that statement
What is this “more relevant role”? It could mean anything.
May 15th, 2012 - 09:41 am - Link - Report abuse 0How about creating normal relations with the Falklanders rather than just whining about the place and pretending the FIG doesn't exist?
Italian MPs. What are they to do with the price of cheese. Nowt.
May 15th, 2012 - 10:48 am - Link - Report abuse 0The mighty Latinos seem to be ganging up on us. That reminds me - need to buy some more mosquito reppelent
May 15th, 2012 - 10:51 am - Link - Report abuse 0And UK MP's should support the return of Trieste and South Tyrol to Austria.
May 15th, 2012 - 11:07 am - Link - Report abuse 0No kidding.
Philippe
Is that a photo of Ricardo Merlo handing over the letter to Timmerman?
May 15th, 2012 - 11:18 am - Link - Report abuse 0.....or one of Timmerman handing over the bribe....ahem....'fee'..... to Ricardo Merlo?
Did they go to Italy to get tips on how to get out of corruption charges? If anyone should know, it's the italians. Next thing Timmermybob turns up in the Falklands with an “offer they can't refuse”. Bada bing.
May 15th, 2012 - 11:31 am - Link - Report abuse 0And yet again, we come back to the point that Argentina amended their constitution in 1994 stating they would not accept anything less than full sovereignty.
May 15th, 2012 - 11:31 am - Link - Report abuse 0Even if the islanders were to come to the table (impossible due to the insulting, aggressive and bullying approach from Argentina) there would be no mediation or negotiation as all Argentina would say is “ We want it all, we want it all.”
The only way Argentina can repair any bridges is to remove the full sovereignty demand from the constitution, recognise and directly converse with the FI government and immediately stop all blockades, threats and generally counter-productive stunts against the Islands.
I doubt that Argentina will ever get the Islands (their economic policies alone would undo all the commercial success the Islands have worked hard to achieve) but if they work really to improve relations, they may get back to a point where profitable joint ventures may be considered.
The Falklands issue was decided in 1850 when Argentina ratified a peace treaty with Britain formally acknowledging that there were no outstanding issues between them. Argentina then tried to rekindle their bogus claim to the Falklands in 1941.
May 15th, 2012 - 11:41 am - Link - Report abuse 048 out of 945 ..Even with the most corrupt government in europe and a country with the most cultural ties to argentina Tinman still only manages this amount.. how long can he keep his job
May 15th, 2012 - 12:11 pm - Link - Report abuse 0As Honoria explained to me on another thread, Argentina has absolutely nothing to bring to the negotiation that the Islanders need or want, so WTF should there be any negotiation?
May 15th, 2012 - 12:30 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Funny see you ilegal ocupants gettin irritated. You´d love to see some one speaking out saying “The Falklands belong to the UK”. haha
May 15th, 2012 - 12:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0No support to piracy!
@16 Simon
May 15th, 2012 - 12:45 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You took the words right out of my mouth :-) People are going to think we are some sort of double act!
But yes to reiterate the point what exactly is it that Argentina can bring to the table that we might want? And please let us eliminate the items that have already been discounted: hospitals, schools, 3 flights a week to B A, shopping, Spanish lessons.
Also no threats please because we are not listening to those. Come on people, give us some positive points that could really make a difference to our relationship.
@Islas Malvinas. We're not getting irritated. We're laughing at you!
May 15th, 2012 - 01:02 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@18 honoria
May 15th, 2012 - 01:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The simple answer is there is nothing that they can bring.
Their outlook is that the whole world is in debt to them, they can do no wrong, they are perfect, all their past mistakes were their fault.
@20 Leiard
May 15th, 2012 - 01:18 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I take your point but I would like to know if Argentina is able/willing to identify what is important to us. This sounds very one sided but we are not the ones making all the demands.
If Argentina wants the Falklands, they need to negotiate not with Britain but with the Falkland Islanders.
May 15th, 2012 - 01:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@ 22
May 15th, 2012 - 01:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0First..penguins !
18 honoria (#)
May 15th, 2012 - 01:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0May 15th, 2012 - 12:45 pm
I can only think of something negative: No more insults (squatters, pirates, etc.), no more threats. But positive things seem to be rather unnecessary.
Timmerman was just lucky to get those Italians before the Repsol issue broke, because looks like the Argentine lobby in Italy will be too preoccupied by the fate of Italian businesses in Argentina to even think about the Falklands.
May 15th, 2012 - 02:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0One would think that if Italian-Argentine Congress House of Representive member Ricardo Merlo was at all proud of his being an Argentine soldier in the Falklands War, he might have at least noted that on his web bio - but no. (http://www.ricardomerlo.com/chi-sono)
Similary, if that letter had any interest to the Italian Senate, one would think that it might be profiled on their website, or even in a database. But currently, its not even on Merlo's own website. - but no. (http://www.ricardomerlo.com/chi-sono)
Merlo's role as the rep of Argentine-Italians in South America (Associazioni Italiane in Sud America) has only got him as far as those 48 Italian politicos saying there should be Argentine-UK talks - which for them is a pro forma response that politically costs nothing and means less.
Pro-Malvinas Italian Senator Estaban Caselli has been churning out similar stuff over several years. (http://www.ricardomerlo.com/chi-sono)
In spite of Caselli usingThe only official, legal EU lable in Italian remains “Isole Falkland” (http://www.ricardomerlo.com/chi-sono)
@24 Simon68
May 15th, 2012 - 02:13 pm - Link - Report abuse 0In what way are positive things unneccessary? I believe that there are a number of areas that could be addressed in a positive way eg reinstating cooperation in fisheries. However there is a major hurdle in the way Argentina sees us which is why we get ridiculous comments about needing Spanish lessons and flights to BA. Even people who are well educated and who should be well informed make fooolish statements that achieve nothing ecxept to demonstrate their ignorance of us. Taking positive steps to appreciate who we are would be a big step forward.
26 honoria (#)
May 15th, 2012 - 02:25 pm - Link - Report abuse 0May 15th, 2012 - 02:13 pm
I consider myself relatively well educated, but I, like all Argentines, am completely ignorant as faras the lives of you Islanders are concerned. Could this be a fault on your part? Perhaps a lack of PR? I'm sure a lot of us here on the mainland would really like to know more about what it is like to live on the islands. At the moment our knowledge must come from John Fowler's excellent pieces in the Penguin News and Elaine Turner's articles. It would be really positive to have more information about how you live your lives down there.
Just a couple of thoughts.
So much for Argentina's “isolation”...Viva Italia =)
May 15th, 2012 - 02:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0A “more relevant role” for Argentina would be to STFU and go away.
May 15th, 2012 - 02:35 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Italy has had 62, yep, 62 governments since 1945. Thats one every 1.09 years. So be quick and make the most of this minor support, because some new lawmakers will be along any minute now. Of course you could argue, that with that many governments, they have a vast experience of international affairs, it's just internal affairs that stumps them!!!!!
May 15th, 2012 - 02:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0There is a very strong tie between the two countries. About 42% of the Argentina population is of Italian ancestry, and an Argentina citizen, if of Italian descent, can run for an Italian goverment office while living in Argentina.
May 15th, 2012 - 03:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@27 Simon 68
May 15th, 2012 - 03:24 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Apparently it is easy enough to get here, so why not come and see for yourself. There is no substitute for seeing with your own eyes. And anyway most people who are genuinely openminded leave here believing that the Islanders belong here and there is nothing which can be described as Argentine. Come in a friendly manner and you will surprised how nice Falklanders can be.
32 JohnCFI (#)
May 15th, 2012 - 03:29 pm - Link - Report abuse 0May 15th, 2012 - 03:24 pm
Thanks to Kretina's block on foreign exchange all trips are off for the moment, but once this horrendous pseudo-government hands in it's chips we will be down to visit. Meanwhile all the best.
Well I for one also look forward to Argentina having a new and perhaps more practical government. One that is prepared to work with the Islanders to better the lot of both nations, and put the stupidness of history behind us. It will be a long road but I am sure that if Europe could come to trust Germany after WW2, the Falklands could do the same with Argentina. The only thing that is sure is that the process will never begin as long as Kirchner and her ilk are in charge. The first steps will have to come from Argentina simply because the Islanders have no reason to trust Argentina, Argentina are the agressors, even today with its occasional incursions into falklands Airspace with fighters, and our waters with armed ships (I worry that one day Argentina doing that will go very badly wrong).
May 15th, 2012 - 03:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0More support for Argentina..Don't worry Brits, Pocklington stills support you.
May 15th, 2012 - 04:04 pm - Link - Report abuse 0:-))
http://www.pocklingtonpost.co.uk/community/nostalgia/pocklington-mayor-s-falkland-islands-trip-1-3530365
35 Marcos Alejandro (#)
May 15th, 2012 - 04:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0May 15th, 2012 - 04:04 pm
I think the support of Pocklington is far more important than 48 Italian legislators led by an Argentine escapee.
They have eyes and not see, have ears and do not want to hear. Unfortunately 500 years of history in Britain is the inventor of colonialism and imperialism. Argentina already had four British and invasions (1806-1807-1833 - Forced Return of 20/11/1845. Automatically shown in the decolonization committee of the UN. Of 16 cases of colonialism that is trying the commission. 10 cases correspond to UK including the Falklands and Gibraltar among others ... Do not say anything about it? it is evident who the colonialist and imperialist ...
May 15th, 2012 - 04:17 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The genocide carried out by indigenous Julio Argentino Roca does not invalidate the just claims of sovereignty of Argentina. Evidenced by the broad global support that is making and is just the beginning.
On balance. England in the course of its history, only 500 years, has committed genocide in the five continents of the world and is currently making humanitarian bombing civilians in Afghanistan, Iraq and Libya.
It has nothing to envy to Nazi Germany and has far surpassed. Along with the U.S. are the shame of the world and Europe in crisis.
@Raul oh holier than thou...............
May 15th, 2012 - 04:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Keep up - Libya is over, so is Iraq. As far as Libya is concerned I think the American phrase “payback is a bitch” springs to mind (Lockerbie, support for the IRA, Yvonne Fletcher eta al....)- I am glad that Gaddafi is dead.
Afghanistan - don't you keep up with current events or did'nt you see what happened in 9/11 2001? The Yanks asked for help and invoked NATO support. I am proud that we helped them, and Al -Qaeda is a shadow of what it was. I don't care about Afganistan any more, nation building has failed. They can't run the place properly, so we should exit stage left ASAP.
Iraq - I'm not convinced that it was a good use of our blood and treasure, I would have given the Yanks moral blessing and let them deal with it.
You have been pretty aggressive as a nation anyway - Beagle channel, Falklands anybody.............
The Italian government is a corrupt and unrelaible bunch, I would'nt count too much stock in their support if I were you.
37 Raul (#)
May 15th, 2012 - 04:38 pm - Link - Report abuse 0May 15th, 2012 - 04:17 pm
“Argentina already had four British and invasions (1806-1807....” Errr, Argentina became Argentina in 1816!!!
Rauol
May 15th, 2012 - 04:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You need to look up the word “Currently” in a dictionary. UK left Iraq years ago. Libya, I suggestthat free LIbyans would disagree with your opinion. Am I right in saying you think that UK history is no better than Nazi Germany? If that's what you think your out of your tiny, feeble, little mind and you need the services of a good phsychiatrist
36 Simon68 “I think the support of Pocklington is far more important...”
May 15th, 2012 - 04:51 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Brit, you should know that the Kelpers love their sheep and the world support Argentina.
“Sheep killed by pet dog” Thursday 19 April 2012
”Sgt Pete Rogers of Pocklington’s neighbourhood policing team said that incidents of sheep attacks by domestic dogs were ‘a very emotive and costly problem’
http://www.pocklingtonpost.co.uk/community/sheep-killed-by-pet-dog-1-4464692
41 Marcos Alejandro (#)
May 15th, 2012 - 04:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0May 15th, 2012 - 04:51 pm
What on earth has all that got to do with Italian legislators and their feelings about the Isole Falklands?
37 Raul “Argentina already had four British and invasions (1806-1807-1833 - Forced Return of 20/11/1845”
May 15th, 2012 - 05:05 pm - Link - Report abuse 0BBC
“Britain's 'forgotten' invasion of Argentina”
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/magazine/4779479.stm
@17 Here's a thought. Why don't you explain to your neighbours about how many people are included in your genocidal total? How many millions?
May 15th, 2012 - 05:24 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@20 I accept everything you say. How many times will every argie have to kill themselves?
@27 Here's a thought for you. Falkland Islanders are not argies. Falkland Islanders are not spanish. Think about everything you are. Chances are the Islanders are the exact opposite. They value freedom, democracy, lack of outside interference. They like being British, flying the Union Flag and being honest. Tell us about what you have to offer.
@37 Yaaaaaaaawn. Anything new? So much argie government BS by the argie braindead. Feel free to set out to sea and encounter a proper British vessel. Send messages about how the ocean floor looks as you're drowning.
Think we care about you? Forget it. You're just dead meat walking. Take deep breaths. Each one might be your last. You showed us the way. No warning. Overwhelming force. Just consider the difference between your concept of overwhelming force and ours. Yours is four naval task forces and 66,000 troops. Ours is 200 cruise missiles and 150 nuclear missiles. Go figure!
@37. Marcos, the propaganda machine in Buenos Aires has you captivated again. Front page news in the Buenos Aires Herald, to keep the electorate happy that the Falklands agenda is kept at the forefront for political purposes. Funny how this didn't make the news in Italy, funny how the Italian government have made no mention of it. Do you honestly think any sleep will be lost about what this bunch of nobody's have to say. Marcos, you lost at war, you were humiliated and beaten by a superior power that travelled half way across the globe to kick your ass and we are more than prepared to do it again. Get real and stop humiliating yourself.
May 15th, 2012 - 05:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Marcos 1850 argentinas forgotten treaty that settle all dispute including their claim to the islands. As for britians invasion of argentina.. Errn since when did argentina exist in 1806 - You were still a spanish colony and as we were at war with spain and napoleon at the time it was a legitmate act during war time and it was against the spanish not the argentines, but then argentines were the spanish back then you idiot. LEarn proper history instead of changing it to suite your argument - Ohh i forgot you argentines are good at changing history!
May 15th, 2012 - 05:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0need a “ referandum ” at the islands to see what they decide on !
May 15th, 2012 - 06:21 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@47 Pretty much a foregone conclusion -
May 15th, 2012 - 06:38 pm - Link - Report abuse 01) Status quo - remain a self-governing BOT 60-70%
2) Independence as a Commonwealth Realm (to counter the whole “loyalty to the Queen” thing) - 30-40%
3) Union with Argentina 0-2% (and dropping)
Plus, the chances of it shutting the Malvinistas up - 0%
| 48 |
May 15th, 2012 - 06:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0make a guileless referandum ,let's see the conclusion.
Once again tin man says, and panic ensues,
May 15th, 2012 - 07:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0We say
Prove it,
Show us this document
Or Soddy offy
.
17 Here's a thought. Why don't you explain to your neighbours about how many people are included in your genocidal total? How many millions?
May 15th, 2012 - 07:29 pm - Link - Report abuse 0AHAHAHA poor deluded ex empire...Millions??AHHAHHAH
At most there were 300,000 natives when the Spanish got to Argentina.Buenos Aires was founded by Spain..in 1536.MAlvinas, discovered and claimed by Spain,in 1530,was a dependency from Buenos Aires.HAving over 11 governors,some born in Buenos Aires...AHAHAHAHAH
ahaha
May 15th, 2012 - 07:37 pm - Link - Report abuse 0and we found it in 1529
so ha
51 And we control the Falklands it now jajajajajaja
May 15th, 2012 - 07:41 pm - Link - Report abuse 0On that basis USA is our territory as well cool, i love the US.
How is a colonial spanish claim to SA different to UK claim to Falklands explain??? Spain a european power claims the whole southern hemisphere. Argentina is still striving to expand into lands that dont belong to them, when did South georgia and sandwich islands ever belong to spain let alone RG's???
politicians of both countries should sit down and talk, and if there is agreement to intervene ..... another body ... (UN, beech)
May 15th, 2012 - 07:55 pm - Link - Report abuse 0and once this has to stop,,,,. and have peace ..
??
May 15th, 2012 - 08:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 054 - Why do we have to talk with RG's, they have never owned the islands.
May 15th, 2012 - 08:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Peace will come when RG's get over the Humiliation of losing a war 30 years ago.
We did have talks after the war and Nestor walked out on them, along with an agreement of joint development of oilfields. It doesnt serve a government intent of making propaganda and diversionary news to sit down in peace. RG's broke the agreement, the quest for talks is only in the hope that UK refuses, therefore sustaining the status quo and the Malvinos popularist card to play when things get messy in the RG's failing economy.
54@
May 15th, 2012 - 08:17 pm - Link - Report abuse 0why not talk about argentina,
you should come under british rule,
if not,
then no talky talky
we must seek dialogue ...
May 15th, 2012 - 08:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0sure in the islands there are people who benefit from these feuding with South America especially Argentina.
insurance for these sides also
the objective is to seek peace .... I do not care .... I care about the outcome to be defined .... we can not be waiting 80 years more .... maybe the monarchy no longer exists,,, ,,, really no problems we leave our children and grandchildren,,,,
@58. You are missing fundamental point. The UK and Falkland Islands are happily getting on with their lives in a peaceful way, there is nothing to talk about. Dialogue is required when their is a dispute, the UK does not recognise the Argentinian claim on the islands, therefore there is nothing to talk about. You should be more concerned for your children and grandchildrens futures in Argentina. The Falkland Islanders tell you again and again they want nothing to do with you. If you take a step back and look at the issue objectively you will see who the ones are causing the trouble and shouting and being unpeaceful. It isn't the UK or the Falklands is it!
May 15th, 2012 - 09:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Well I guess I'd better comment on this story. Hang...what story? Yawn.
May 15th, 2012 - 09:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Time to go home for my well earned supper.
around here says you did your house on the land of another owner,,, accuses you of this,,,,
May 15th, 2012 - 09:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0when I say dialogue
ie your politicians must show proof ...
as saying that owns the land
and some impartial international body that has responsibility must fail
End of problem ...
your children and grandchildren will live in peace and do not talk over the issue ...
tell me, it is better to a future war
I do not like to bury my children or grandchildren ...
is better than the politicians fix the problems now,,,,
@42
May 15th, 2012 - 10:23 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“What on earth has all that got to do with Italian legislators and their feelings about the Isole Falklands?”
Nothing what so ever Simon, par for the course for a cretin like Marcos, he probably thinks he's posting on a different thread (no that he ever posts anything pertinent anyway).
@48: If independence were the outcome of a referendum, it wouldn't immediately shut up Argentina, but it would shut up every other country that has sympathized with the bogus Argentine claims (due to anti-colonialism). The situation would be parallel to that of Belize (formerly British Honduras) and Guatemala. Before Belize became an independent country in 1981, most of Latin America supported Guatemala's claim to all of Belize's territory. As soon as Belize became independent, no country in the world supported Guatemala's claim. Guatemala whined for another eleven years before recognizing Belize in 1992. It would go the same way if the Falkland Islanders were to choose independence, but that is their choice to make, not ours.
May 16th, 2012 - 01:03 am - Link - Report abuse 0@53: Argentina never, ever claimed South Georgia or the South Sandwich Islands before 1941. That claim is even more bogus than their claim to the Falklands, which they signed away in 1849 (and ratified in 1850).
@56 “Peace will come when RG's get over the Humiliation of losing a war 30 years ago.” I don't think so. As long as the Falklands are not independent, it will be a winning domestic political strategy for Argentine politicians to claim the Falklands. That's why they've been trying since 1941 to revive the claim they officially gave up in 1850.
@58: No one in the Falklands benefits from Argentina's territorial aggression. Only Argentina's political class benefits.
@61: The proof is the 1850 peace treaty between Argentina and Britain.
if there is proof, you must submit an impartial body, to finish this novel,,,, and define who owns ----
May 16th, 2012 - 01:33 am - Link - Report abuse 0well I'll take my yogurt,,,,,,, I am one of the few Argentines who do not like the matte,,, bye
The significance here is the politcial alligence of the Italian Councilors who seem to be mainly on the far right. The other interesting fact is that Argentine Italians have their own representative in the Italian Parliment and he was an officer in a fascist military assalt in violation of international soverignty and two United Nations resolutions and its Charter. It's only right that such people give support to a fellow National Socialists in the Argentine regime.
May 16th, 2012 - 02:20 am - Link - Report abuse 0The Argentine uber nationalists continue to claim territory against the wishes of the people who live there. Their Nazi style regime is hiding behind an ever diminshing smoke screen and being exposed to the world for what it is.
@64: Britain offered to submit the Falklands dispute to the International Court of Justice five times (in 1947, 1951, 1953, 1954, and 1955) but Argentina refused every time because Argentina has no case.
May 16th, 2012 - 03:18 am - Link - Report abuse 0Has any one got any theories on why any attention is being paid to this small group of Italian politicians? Love of fascism, perhaps?
May 16th, 2012 - 05:16 am - Link - Report abuse 0@51: you know very well that there is absolutely no recorded evidence of Spain having spotted the Falklands in 1530, there are rumours, nothing else, as usual I ask you to provide evidence of this or shut up, you seem very good at writing down claims then never backing them up with actual evidence, I really hope you aren't a lawyer.
May 16th, 2012 - 05:21 am - Link - Report abuse 0Considering that fascism and the mafia both originated in Italy there are still some Italians with attachments to those concepts and the modern (cough,cough ) country that is most closely aligned to them ;Argentina.
May 16th, 2012 - 06:54 am - Link - Report abuse 0This is a non story ; 5% of the Italian lawmakers who have been cajoled ,screamed at ,cried to ,bullied etc (the Argie methods) decided to sign the letter ;95% did not sign .
It is the same type of news as they say about a plane crash at Heathrow.One plane crashing is news ;1,000,000 landing safely is not news.
@51 Funny little boy! Did you know that the Incas alone had 12,000,000 people? Typical argie approach. Kill millions of people. Keep no records. When someone asks, make up a figure. Shame for you that other people have better information. But don't be sad. On the face of it, you managed at least twice as many as Hitler! 11 governors, you say? Name them. With dates and references.
May 16th, 2012 - 09:36 am - Link - Report abuse 0@54 No point. The Falklands are British. There is no more to be said.
@58 Still nothing to be said. Oh wait. Argieland could try telling the world, publicly, that it will NEVER, EVER claim the Falklands, South Georgia and the South Sandwich Islands EVER again. See? No need for dialogue. And just a simple statement that argieland has spent around 160 years lying!
@61 NO. You don't like the way things are, YOU provide the proof we're wrong.
@64 If there is proof, YOU submit it! Could there be some reason you don't dare go to the ICJ?
@27 Simon68
May 16th, 2012 - 11:22 am - Link - Report abuse 0It's an interesting proposal that we should run a PR campaign in Argentina but I am not convinced that people would be of a mind to receive and process the message due to the stance of your government. Also I don't feel that we need to. For a country that makes so much noise about the Falklands I am astonished that zero effort is put into actually finding out anything about us. We do get Argentine tourists here and I would say their first reaction is as if they have stepped into a parallel universe. They came to see the Malvinas but found the Falklands instead. I think this shock is good for them as it presents the reality and destroys the fiction better than any PR campaign we could run. You should come and visit us Simon. we are good people when you get to know us.
#43 What a fascinating article Marcos, thanks, I look forward to the day our countries can be friends again
May 16th, 2012 - 11:32 am - Link - Report abuse 0#59 “Dialogue is required when their is a dispute, the UK does not recognise the Argentinian claim on the islands, therefore there is nothing to talk about”
Surely if the UK did recognise the Argentine claim, then there would be nothing to talk about as they would just hand the islands over; its because they don't agree that, like it or not, there is indeed a dispute and therefore a need for dialogue.
#56 “the quest for talks is only in the hope that UK refuses”
If you really believe that, surely you hink Britain should call Cristina's bluff?
71 honoria (#)
May 16th, 2012 - 01:07 pm - Link - Report abuse 0May 16th, 2012 - 11:22 am
Thanks for the invitation, as I said to JohnCFI, at the moment restrictions on buying foreign currency basically prohibit international travel, but as soon as Kretina gets her comeuppance we'll be down to visit you all.
I really do believe that a good PR campaign could change a lot of minds here. Just reading Elaine Turner's articles on the camp are enough to show people living here in Patagonia just how similar camp life is in the FI, and this certainly brings people together, when they can identify with the other person's lifestyle. Any way as I said before its just an idea.
@72 BK
May 16th, 2012 - 02:07 pm - Link - Report abuse 0So full of logic .. and something else.
BK, paint this scenario... if you had not stolen your neighbour's car and they demanded your car from you, you'd say 'I did NOT steal your car' you wouldn't then talk and talk and talk and talk to come to an arrangement to take your car in compensation for the loss of their car which is nothing to do with you, you'd stand your ground. An exact metaphor for argentina-anglo situation is a neighbour who accuses you of this crime who has lost their mind as they never even owned a car (but took a joyride in your car 30 years ago).
The UK is of sound mind whereas the Argentine mind has been mistreated... a lot.
As reported by the Argentinian press (well almost)
May 16th, 2012 - 02:45 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Ricardo Merlo, an Argentinian Veteran of the Falklands War and member of the Italian Parliament gets 47 of his best mates and Italian lawmakers COLLEAGUES to support Argentina in the British Falklands Islands sovereignty claim
Forty-eight Italian senators and lawmakers expressed their public support for Argentina’s sovereignty claim over the THE BRITISH Falklands Islands in a letter sent to UN Secretary General Ban Ki-moon, the Foreign Ministry announced on Monday.
A copy of the letter was delivered to Foreign Minister Héctor Titman by Italian lawmaker and BRITISH Falklands Islands war veteran Ricardo Merlo.
The letter allegedly reflects “the will of a group of lawmakers and best mates who, despite belonging to different political parties but are DRINKING BUDDIES, unanimously share the need to acknowledge that the Argentine Government’s has a more relevant role in the BRITISH Falklands Islands conflict.”
The Italian lawmakers praised Ban Ki-moon’s willingness to act as mediator in the conflict, something that has already been requested by several countries and international organizations.
However, they also warned that “they await, skeptical but hopeful, to see how the UK will react to the proposal and if, as Argentina has already done, the country will accept the UN’s mediation on the matter or will continue going its own way without paying attention to the calls for dialogue.”
Lawmaker Ricardo Merlo, born in Argentina and a BRITISH Falklands war veteran, also signs the letter since he represents those Italians living in South America in the Roman Parliament.
If CFK and argentina want to talk,
May 16th, 2012 - 02:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0then let them talk to each other .
and leave the brits alone .
@43 Your comment was very funny. Have you thought of going somewhere where it would be appreciated? Elements of the article, that you had to go back 6 years to find, were also funny. Not least because you clearly didn't read it. Even if we were to accept your questionable date for the existence of argieland, i.e. 1810, it immediately becomes clear that at least two of your so-called “invasions of argentina” were nothing of the sort. It is actually impossible to invade somewhere that doesn't exist! So the attacks on the still colonies of Spain were nothing to do with argieland. Remember your cuntry didn't start until at least 1810. But then there are some other “interesting” dates. The argentine declaration of independence in 1816? The constitution of 1826, that was mostly rejected? How about the constitution of argentina of 1853, except that Buenos Aires rejected it and pulled out? And how about 1862 when Buenos Aires rejoined? So 1806/7 were against the Spanish. Don't remember anything in 1833 except kicking a bunch of trespassers off British territory. And on 20 November 1845, an Anglo-French fleet defeated a bunch of rebel colonists. So, basically, congrats on the crap.
May 16th, 2012 - 04:48 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@49 “That in an Argentine-inspired poll in 1994, 87% of the island's population rejected any form of discussion of sovereignty under any circumstances, preferring to remain British.” So that's that!
@72 No dialogue until the Islanders want it!
Given the whole argie methodology, I'd be surprised to see any “dialogue” before the end of this century. Lying, cheating, whingeing, using force is no way to get anywhere. Surely the history of the last 200 years should tell argieland that Britain doesn't given in. Nor does it lose. But hey, maybe argieland wants another war and to lose another couple of thousand bodies. Argies should bear in mind that British weapons are light years more advanced than they were in 1982.
I have had experience dealing with Italian businessmen for four years at Caserta, near to Naples.
May 16th, 2012 - 05:50 pm - Link - Report abuse 0At one point a US$30k Unix based computer, one of ten, went missing during a delivery to the company I was dealing with. When I asked what they were going to do about replacing my machine I was told not to worry 'they were going to talk to the gardener'. I kid you not.
The 'gardener' who of course never did any gardening, was the local representative of the Mafia. I have no idea how much the company paid to get the machine back from the mafia, but when it arrived it has been stored in an outhouse that must have had a leaking roof: the carton was saturated with water and the machine was completely useless.
That is what you are dealing with in Italy.
@77: In January 1833, only the military force which had invaded the Falklands in October 1832 were required to leave. The British encouraged the civilian population of the Falklands to stay and all buy four of the civilians did in fact stay. The oft-repeated lie that the British expelled a civilian population in 1833 is just that -- a lie.
May 16th, 2012 - 06:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 078. They are Merlot's mates, his drinking buddies (pun intended). The guy has been chasing round for the last, God know how many years, attempting to sign everyone up. Best part of both houses told him to FCUK off.
May 16th, 2012 - 06:13 pm - Link - Report abuse 0How low will the stinking government stoop though?
Laughing stock the lot. They must think that the UN won't smell a rat. Even the Argee newspapers spelt it all out know they were dealing with a TIT here. Have you read their editorials? They think KFC, Titman and Diplomacy is pathetic.
Read the following link to the Nobel Peace Prize Adolfo Perez Esquivel on the dispute over sovereignty of the islands.
May 16th, 2012 - 06:18 pm - Link - Report abuse 0http://www.revistaenie.clarin.com/ideas/Adolfo-Perez-Esquivel-Malvinas-cartas_0_698330393.html
Won't if you don't mind. Prefer not to do links. If you have some points to score. no doubt you will find a way to get them off your chest.
May 16th, 2012 - 06:25 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Nobel peace prize winner tag fits with the ' 'give peace a chance troll message''
May 16th, 2012 - 06:27 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Why would anybody be intersted in Adolfo's ramblings.
Absolutely, wouldn't be interested. Somebody else bribed, pestered, plagued until they give in and agreed or an Argentinian.
May 16th, 2012 - 06:35 pm - Link - Report abuse 0A relevant role would be informing RG land how the UN works, and giving her special glasses to enable her to see the importance the UN places on self-determination and not RG colonialism.
May 18th, 2012 - 09:55 pm - Link - Report abuse 085# Self determination is not applied if it violates partially or totally the territorial integrity of other nations...
May 18th, 2012 - 11:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0this is what happens when you do not read the UN resolutions...
86: Please refer to FOURTH COMMITTEE APPROVES AMENDED OMNIBUS TEXT ON NON-SELF-GOVERNING TERRITORIES, wherein Vote on Amendment to Operative Paragraph 2 of Draft VI on Remaining Non-Self-Governing Territories ( “and where there is no dispute over sovereignty”), 61 in favour (included UK), 40 against (included Argentina), 47 abstentions: http://www.un.org/News/Press/docs/2008/gaspd406.doc.htm
May 19th, 2012 - 12:15 am - Link - Report abuse 0@86 The Falkland Islands are not violating the territorial integrity of Argentina as they haven't tried to invade Argentina.
May 19th, 2012 - 01:39 am - Link - Report abuse 0Argentina ignores UN resolutions, ie 502 in 1982 which demanded it left the Falkland Islands.
The main purpose of de-colonialisation is to promote independence, not to cede to another wannabe colonial power like Argentina.
And @86, see @87.
This is what happens when Argentina ignores the UN in 2008, but keeps revisiting 1965.
2008 is nearer to 2012 than 1965 is.
Argentina lives and is stuck in the past, influenced by the fascists of 1940s Italy and Nazi Germany who brainwashed Peron.
Comment removed by the editor.
May 19th, 2012 - 06:42 am - Link - Report abuse 0@52 Briton (#) #57 Briton (#) @76 Briton
May 19th, 2012 - 06:55 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Ignore what others countries are talking about the Islands, you ass is big enough to keep it inside. The brits have the choice to leave my country, what are they waiting for...You Jack the Ripple....
The Falkland Islands belong to the Falkland Islanders, not to Argentina or Britain. The British are welcome as long as the Falkland Islanders want them and no longer.
May 19th, 2012 - 09:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Argentina cannot expect the Falkland Islanders to welcome them with all of Argentina's past and present hostile acts against the Falkland Islanders.
90 SussieUS
May 19th, 2012 - 09:13 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You are so funny!
You Jack the Ripple. LOL
DID you mean 'Jack the Ripper' or Raspberry Ripple??
BIG LAUGHS ALL ROUND!!!!
@90 Is Jack the Ripple a kind of ice cream?
May 19th, 2012 - 11:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I guess the editor is a mohammed he is removing all may comments ha ha
May 20th, 2012 - 07:43 am - Link - Report abuse 0I wonder what their reaction would be if Britain interfered into Italian matters of an internal nature?
May 20th, 2012 - 02:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Two words: 'small beer'
May 20th, 2012 - 04:29 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Another five: 'Hector Timerman is a joke'
Another eight: 'I won't be buying any more Italian Red'
@73 Simon68(#)
May 21st, 2012 - 05:16 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Pioooouuuu! again.
You had the opportunity to visit the Islands prior to the invasion of 1982 and after Carlos Menen resumed the UK diplomatic relations. Why you waited all this time?
Patagonia has a 5 stars hotel in Comodoro Rivadavia such as the Lucania Palazzo Hotel which is the hotel where I stay when I visit my home town and 2 bedrooms apartments worth between U$S80,000 to U$S 200,000. plus very expensive houses and other real estate properties. Also, Comodoro Rivadavia has one Universityand daily flights to Buenos Aires. Can you find the same real estate properties and university in the Islands?
Sussie@97. Thank goodness, no holiday properties of that value in the Falklands. As for Universities, perhaps one day they'll have a branch of Cambridge, etc. Just think, if UBA (University of Buenos Aires) is in 38th place in the SA ranking, the University at Comodoro Rivadavia must be a joke. And why on earth would anyone want to go to Buenos Aires every day? I have to go once or twice a month, and even that's a drag. Sniffer dogs on the street now, in case anyone's got a dollar. Shop shelves emptying, violent crime and political corruption rampant.
May 21st, 2012 - 07:31 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I'm afraid Argentina may be headed for a complete collapse. If the military take over again, at least they won't have sufficient forces with which to terrorize the Falkland Islanders.
May 21st, 2012 - 09:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@98 Ynsere(#)
May 21st, 2012 - 09:32 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Well, tell me what university degree you have received from the UK or elsewhere that make you better educated than a graduate from Bs.As. or the Comodoro Rivadavia University? My physician in Comodoro Rivadavia was accepted to attend an US University like many others argentinian physicians working in the US have passed the Medical Exam to be license to work as Medical Doctors. Average yearly salary $200,000 +.
Quality of education is very controversial.
Here in the US there is a law to enforce quality of education on primary education years called “No Child left Behind” because of the disputed present educational curriculum from the primary, middle and secondary schools.
It takes my attention that the Islanders have the islands for 189 years but they hope “some day” will have a branch of Cambridge? Kind of slow ambition to succed.
Any hotel like the Lucania Palazzo in the future?
Comodoro Rivadavia real estate is very expensive that means the land worth more than the Islands these islanders are occupying for 189 years just to live a simple life. No monies. No class.
Saludos Susana Brown.
Susana Brown.
May 21st, 2012 - 09:51 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I think we need a little perspective here.
Your despicable 'government' is attempting to bully ALL 3000 of the Falklands (there are no Malvinas) islanders.
Can you get it now? 42 Million Argies have shit universities, 3000 Falklanders get to send their children to Oxford or Cambridge if they pass the entrance exams.
And what poor schmuck named Brown managed to win your filthy mouth?
Bet he has not got a degree from anywhere.
@101 ChristR (#)
May 21st, 2012 - 10:05 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I cannot control my 2 countries goverment decision on invasion such as the 1982 and the Iraq invasion of 2002.
The Islands belongs to the Islanders.
Yes, I am a graduate. My last name has not relationship to Guillermo Brown.
How about the brits calling the argentine leader with offensive words? Some of you have dirty mouth. I respond in the same way they insulted me and the argentine female leader. Take it or leave it.
Dear Sussie,
May 22nd, 2012 - 04:15 am - Link - Report abuse 0Please, don’t waste your time with “ChristRambo” as you can see he never been even near Oxford or any other place where you can consider there is any decent/fair education.
And British education is not good for low class.
You can find evidence of the poor British education just reading the posts of some posters here, they cannot even write properly their own language.
And don’t even ask them to have a conversation in other languages because they will die of headache.
Too much stress for such little brains, I guess.
Yours sincerely
Daniel Berger
DunniBurger
May 22nd, 2012 - 11:53 am - Link - Report abuse 0Oh! You ARE SO FUNNY!
But I must admit only 3 errors in the first paragraph and a spanish attempt at mangling the grammar in the first line of the second is a marked improvement. Been taking lessons have you?
I am having trouble learning Espanol. Having been 'at it' for six months I still find it difficult to use 50 words (of Espanol) when 10 would do (of English). :o)
But still, perhaps it will come in time. I have the intellect to succeeed after all. What a pity you are lacking it.
Let us 'talk' now about education. You tell me, although I have no evidence that allows me to believe you, that you were involved with servers at some time. However I bet you have no qualification to support that and could not, even in your wildest dreams, make it into membership of the British Computer Society. For your informationt the BCS is recognised worldwide for being the premier professional body for computer science and many other nationals are registered as members.
My education and qualifications have allowed me to become a Professional Electrical Mechanical Engineer.
I realise that with your limitations, the nearest thing you have of experiencing engineering is, as you say yourself, of people who are washer mechanics.
But sadly, some young people in Britain, despite having the chance to learn, reject the opportunities presented to them and fail to achieve any meaningful skills for life. I am sure you can sympathise with this given that you do not understand blob technology in any depth.
These young people of ours are still better educated than those in Argentina if the reports of the contempory press are to be believed: and who would lie about indoctrination within the schools?
BTW is Daniel Berger a German name? How can that be so when you claim to be Argentinian. Argentina, full of Germans, surely not! :o)
@ChrisR
May 22nd, 2012 - 06:55 pm - Link - Report abuse 01- I don’t want to discourage you but I know some English speakers that after 30 years in a Spanish speaking language cannot make a coherent sentence.
But I’m glad you are trying harder may be in 20 years we will be able to see from you a couple of sentence written in Spanish. Ha ha
2-Well is you are so smart on servers and IT here simple quiz for Newbie.
What the following does and on what OS I’m working? Is very easy the most dam starter can tell you that.
wget http://rfxnetworks.com/downloads/apf-current.tar.gz
tar -zxf apf-current.tar.gz
cd apf-9.7-2
/install.sh
3- “Daniel Berger a German name? How can that be so when you claim to be Argentinian...”
Yes, and I never claimed to be a fully Argentinian as you said. And for your records Germans can be also Argentinian, like Italians, etc.
“Argentina, full of Germans, surely not!”
Not full but very important, 3.5m German descendent at the moment in ARG, also you have newspapers only in German for local German community. http://rfxnetworks.com/downloads/apf-current.tar.gz
3er largest community in importance in ARG after Italians and Spanish.
And also with everyday presence in ARG. culture, education and cuisine.
For more information see:
http://rfxnetworks.com/downloads/apf-current.tar.gz
Anyway doesn’t matter I’m waiting for your replay about my quiz.
Will you?
DunniBurger
May 22nd, 2012 - 10:03 pm - Link - Report abuse 0But you cannot get into the BCS can you? Or any other international professional computer science registration scheme?
As for your little quiz on opening an unkown folder using winrar, and then to start installing some unknown file containing I don't know what onto my computer, then you are even more out of your tiny mind than I thought. Ha ha ha.
Try your partner in idiocy 'I don't Think aka The Turnip in Chief' he might fall for it but I most certainly will not.
@ChrisR
May 23rd, 2012 - 03:09 am - Link - Report abuse 0Christ, Christ, Christ...
“But you cannot get into the BCS can you?”
Wow!!!!!! and you learned there?
What for? To talk about things like you do without having any idea about it?
“opening an unkown folder using winrar” ha ha ha
Lesson 1: How to install APF firewall on Centos Enterprise-class operating system remotely in Shell.
wget rfxnetworks.com/downloads/apf-current.tar.gz
tar -zxf apf-current.tar.gz
cd apf-9.7-2
/install.sh
Lesson 2 configuration:
Oh! Sorry you didn’t pay the bill contact administration to follow learning lessons for starters on server management and configuration.
DunniBurger
May 23rd, 2012 - 12:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0When you lose the argument you have more twists and curves in you than a rattlesnake.
However, unlike you, rattlesnakes are deadly and I have to say, much prettier than you could ever be. :o)
@J.A.Roberts(#)
May 23rd, 2012 - 06:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The US position on the islands is neutral. Several countries have the same opinion on the disputed islands. If you don't like the name of Malvinas then you have the choice to ignore it. But what it takes my attention is why the UK PM Cameron does not terminate their diplomatic mission in Argentina. The amount of verbal abuse made publicly by the Penguin News and the english people dislike for the present female leader is sufficient for the UK to terminate the diplomatic relations with my country. Mexico and Venezuela have expelled US Ambassadors for making unacceptable comments. The argentine leader is the president of Argentina. She is in the same position like many others former and future argentine presidents has the rights to claim the islands or to stop british ships from entry argentine ports. The disputed islands might continue for years to come. But, what is simply unacceptable is the UK PM Cameron decision to maintain a diplomatic mission in my country after abusing the argentine female leader with offensive words. Can you tell me what the UK wants from Argentina?
Susana Brown
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