The London-based South Atlantic Council today made a call “for a new understanding of sovereignty” thirty years after the cease-fire that ended hostilities between Britain and Argentina. Read full article
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name of the Topic:Jun 13th, 2012 - 01:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
Preparando el terreno para ir Pidiendo la Palangana
Reality is comming... regards
Thanks but no thanks will be the popular answer from almost everyone.Jun 13th, 2012 - 01:55 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
I've followed this dispute for 30 years and have never heard of the South Atlantic Council.
If you don't get a mention in Wikipedia and your website is this feeble (http://www.staff.city.ac.uk/p.willetts/SAC/INDEX.HTM) I'm guessing you can safely be ignored.
What a nonsensical proposal!Jun 13th, 2012 - 01:56 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
Fail!Jun 13th, 2012 - 02:01 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
It sounds like an overcomplicated bureaucratic nightmare waiting to happen. Far easier and simpler to tell Argentina to go screw itself. It's not like they can do anything about it.Jun 13th, 2012 - 02:01 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
What a load of uninhibited nonsense from the “Emeritus Professor”. He clearly fails to understand that if Argentina were allowed to place its flag on the islands and the British military presence were removed, the Argentineans would send troops to the islands and that would be the end of the story. No Islander in their right mind would wish to be a guinea pig for his academic experiment.Jun 13th, 2012 - 02:08 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
Let's talk again about an all-too-familiar subject: Prof. Peter Willetts and his linguacious morals. Let's start with my claim that Prof. Willetts believes it's perfectly okay to open the floodgates of denominationalism. More than anything else, such beliefs shed light on Prof. Willetts's moral values and suggest incontrovertibly that he would have us spread insensitive views.
May God, in his restraining mercy, forbid that we should ever do this most jealous and reckless thing! As I've said before, his philippics are based on two fundamental errors. They assume that the government (and perhaps he himself) should have sweeping powers to arrest and hold people indefinitely on flimsy grounds and they promote the mistaken idea that the worst types of subversive hell-raisers there are are inherently good, sensitive, creative, and inoffensive.
In closing, although this post has been lengthy there are still a large number of comments about Prof. Peter Willetts that I have had to leave aside. I didn't even begin to mention, for instance, that Prof. Willetts is unable to remove his mental shackles. Anyway, the important point is that Prof. Willetts exists in a state of intellectual hibernation.
I particularly like their Occasional papers section.Jun 13th, 2012 - 02:15 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
Fourteen years elapsed between the latest paper and the previous one. I guess he needs quite a while to chew the cud.
If I were being cynical or uncharitable I'd describe him and his pronouncements as a self appointed joke.
Shared sovereignty. Just as George Galloway was arguing right before his historic victory in Bradford =) Certainly a goood starting point for negotiations and giving peace a chance =)Jun 13th, 2012 - 02:15 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
This principle would exhist in utopia and everyone following the rules. In the history of the world when has that ever happened. Thanks but no thanks. Oh BK your a nob!Jun 13th, 2012 - 02:18 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
Let's talk about British_Kirchnerist's monographs. Let's talk about them in a very specific and personal way. There are a number of reasons British_Kirchnerist isn't telling us as to why he wants to condemn innocent people to death. In this post, I will expose those reasons one-by-one, on the principle that it amazes me how successful he has been at manufacturing outrage at his opponents by attributing to them all kinds of sick paroxysms.Jun 13th, 2012 - 02:21 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
History will look back on that unfortunate success with profound regret and wonder why the people of our time didn't do more to point the high-powered fire hose of truth at British_Kirchnerist's belligerent, hypocritical philippics to wash away their multiple layers of fetishism.
Perhaps our answer should be that British_Kirchnerist shouldn't blow the whole situation way out of proportion. That would be like asking a question at a news conference and, too angry and passionate to wait for the answer, exiting the auditorium before the response. Both of those actions paint people of different races and cultures as loopy alien forces undermining the coherent national will.
Finally, whatever your thoughts or feelings about British_Kirchnerist are, I urge you to ignore the semiotic patterns that he utilizes to subvert the thread.
He is still a nobJun 13th, 2012 - 02:27 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
Let's look at this logically, taking Peter Willetts' suggestions one-by-one.Jun 13th, 2012 - 02:36 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
• Argentina having symbolic title to the land, flying their flag at their war cemetery, but having no authority over the Islanders;
Ans: The argies can fly their flag at their war cemetary. Provided FIG has given permission and the cemetary hasn't been removed to argieland. Argies don't do symbolic title.
• A local legal office deciding who would possess South Atlantic citizenship and the right to reside in the Islands;
Ans: Why? FIG does this quite well. Are the citizens of all countries bordering the South Atlantic to give up their individual citizenships?
• An autonomous local legislature;
Ans: It's called FIG.
• The Canadian Ministry of Foreign Affairs handling diplomacy;
Ans: I have nothing against Canada, but why?
• A multi-lateral regional organisation managing fishing;
Ans: Presumably where larger countries get more rights?
• A unique multi-actor system of all the stakeholders regulating oil and gas
Ans: That would be a good one. Are argieland, Uruguay and Brazil going to hand over their rights?
• US financial institutions maintaining the dollar as the Islands’ currency.
Ans: That has to be a joke. Why would the Islanders give up the pound sterling?
And, overall, once this variegated mess has been put in place and everybody has had 3 or 4 years of arguing about where their authority begins and ends, who is looking after the Islanders' defence? Who is going to stop the argies storming ashore, one way or another, and taking over the whole shebang?
I accept that this is only an example, but it misses one important consideration. This matter will not be resolved until the argies are stopped. Stone dead. Once and for all.
Let the Islanders declare independence. But as a member of the Commonwealth with relevant treaties, e.g. defence, with Britain. Falklands grants Britain ownership and free use of military bases and pays for forces.
BK is indeed a nob.Jun 13th, 2012 - 02:41 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
The first thing I want to bring up is that British_Kirchnerist likes vilifying our history, character, values, and traditions. That's the most damnable thing about him.
But I'm more inclined to believe that those of us who are still sane, those of us who still have a firm grip on reality, those of us who still think that British_Kirchnerist's belief that national-security interests can and should be sidestepped whenever his personal interests are at stake is pure and total fantasy, have an obligation to do more than just observe what he is doing from a safe distance.
We have an obligation to act honorably. We have an obligation to make efforts directed towards broad, long-term social change. And we have an obligation to get him off our backs.
Okay, this post has become much too long so I'll just jump right to the punchline: British_Kirchnerist's yeomen have discounted their brain as a useless organ.
Who Prof Willetts or BK?Jun 13th, 2012 - 02:45 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
Personally I think they're both nobs. Though Prof Willitts may be just a naive fool. Nah he's a nob too. Argentina won't settle for less than everything, and the British won't let them have anything unless the people of the Falklands wish it.
Prof Willetts forgets it is the islanders who get the right to say what happens to their land and resources, not Buenos Aires and not London, and certainly not some ineffective council chosen by his imbecilic theory. His theories also completely ignore that one thing that can't be quantified and controlled - human nature.
Prof Willetts try going out and living in the real world! Theories and their practical applications are about as close as the Earth is to the Andromeda galaxy.
Both BK and Willetts are nobs. Niether understands the real world.Jun 13th, 2012 - 02:46 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
The small problem is Argentina cant be trusted .Jun 13th, 2012 - 02:46 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
8 British_KirchneristJun 13th, 2012 - 02:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
Peace already has a chance - it's going on right now - or has another war kicked off that nobody noticed?
This is the Professors latest musings: http://www.staff.city.ac.uk/p.willetts/SAC/OP/OCCPAP11.HTM - i'd recommend skipping the first 3/4s of it.
The funny bit is that even though he rejects 19th century concepts of sovereignty he seems amenable to the Argentine attitude that they just want somewhere to plant their flag.
17 IdlehandsJun 13th, 2012 - 03:00 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
There are prissy criminal masterminds. There are rats who walk like men. And then there is British_Kirchnerist. Of those, I think that British_Kirchnerist is the most parviscient because if he sincerely believes that he has his moral compass in tact then he must be smoking something illegal.
It is high time for someone to bring British_Kirchnerist to justice.
@18 - Logorrhea Alert.Jun 13th, 2012 - 03:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
Don't worry, people like BK who are always talking about revolutions and how they are revolutionaries, are usually the first against the wall when those revolutions occur.
It's a pleasant thought isn't it? :0)
19Jun 13th, 2012 - 03:27 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
Skewered with an RG flag pole would be a fitting end for him.
What the Prof also ignores is that this dispute is not like the Israeli/Palestinian problem where a solution is desperately required and people are dying every day.Jun 13th, 2012 - 03:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
His complex solutions are far more effort than simply saying NO to Argentina and nothing much will happen or change because of it - other than maybe a marginal increase in the sale of earplugs
You have to love these academics, they still believe in fairy tales.Jun 13th, 2012 - 03:31 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
Self Determination @ 16Jun 13th, 2012 - 03:31 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
Agreed. Argentina would storm out of the room as soon as it didn't get its way. They're good at that. Back to square 1.
Prof..... Go back to sleepJun 13th, 2012 - 03:37 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
Speaking as someone who works in/for academia, the impressive sounding title Emeritus Professor loosely translates as someone who is senile enough to keep turning up to work even after we've stopped paying him, but not so senile as to not be able to find his office.Jun 13th, 2012 - 03:46 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
What his musings sound like is a completely unworkable hodgepodge of farminig out everything to seven different (and probably competing) authorities, with an Argentine flag on top. The odds of any sane person going along with the first part of the description are about the same as that of getting more than a tiny fraction of Falkland Islanders to go along with the second.
Academics just love a little attention. Their suggestions do not have to have any place in reality, they are just theories designed to stimulate discussion and a little publicity.Jun 13th, 2012 - 03:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
B-K undermines his credibility by sounding like a love-sick teenager drooling over an idol. I still believe he is a wind-up merchant.
25 RufusJun 13th, 2012 - 03:54 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
Love your translation - I never knew Emeritus meant old duffer put out to grass.
I assumed it was an additional title reflecting some sort of academic attainment.
I can't see why Prof. Willets bothered, there is no Falklands/Malvinas problem.Jun 13th, 2012 - 03:56 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
The Islanders want to be British, on British territory, and that is exactly what the situation is now.
What on earth is the point of making complicated suggestions about flags and cemetries as Argentina's claim to the Islands is based on lies?
@25 RufusJun 13th, 2012 - 04:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
You've pretty much hit the nail on the head - someone - possibly in their 'eighties-who turns up for half a day a week.
Their webpage is part of the staff pages at City University in London ( see http://www.staff.city.ac.uk/p.willetts/SAC/INDEX.HTM ) but it rather sounds like a one-man show trying to be helpful at a time when Argentina are well and truly Kebabbed (to use Neil Kinnock's phrase).
It will of course get seized upon by Argentina as being an august body of high ranking British intellectuals ...blah blah blah. How did it make its way into MercoPress?
Things are fine and dandy as they are - and getting better!
A hairbrained idea that might have been okay before 1982. Before the continued aggression by the aggressive Argies.Jun 13th, 2012 - 04:11 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
Can someone tell me please? Isn't the South Atlantic Council the same organisation that those two dickhead Rocky and Bullwinkle were/ are part of? I haven't heard of them for a while but they were talking a pile of crap in the 90s.Jun 13th, 2012 - 04:41 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
I can't quite remember their names. Maybe Bullrich and Conrado or something? Does anyone remember them?
Wondered how long it would take for Bk to mention George Galloway...love it. Rgs argument consists of diverting atention from the original topic and mentioning a mad British mp, hope plastic face has more up her sleeves for the UN. I am hoping for the normal ill thought out contradictory lies and ranting, don't let me down you mad humiliated rg president.Jun 13th, 2012 - 04:46 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
BK admires George Galloway - enough said !!!!!!Jun 13th, 2012 - 04:56 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
Joe Bloggs @ 31Jun 13th, 2012 - 05:05 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
Does the name Conrado Etchebarne Bullrich (a.k.a. Conrado E- Bullrich) ring a bell?
i have a better proposal how about Prof Peter Willetts gives up 80% of his house and belongings and shares them with the local gangsters, the regional police force Yemen immigrants and tibetan monks, im sure they will get on real good to the point that its is no longer his home and all identity lost.Jun 13th, 2012 - 05:12 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
Sometimes professors are retired for a reason.Jun 13th, 2012 - 06:16 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
Haha I loved this part from the webpageJun 13th, 2012 - 06:16 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
The SAC logo was designed by Brian Hargrove of BH Designs.
Its a logo a 4 year old could come up with in MS paint
34 ynsereJun 13th, 2012 - 06:16 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
Ah yes, thanks. That's one of the names? There was another one too wasn't there? I thought they were a duo. Did one of them come down one time or not? Maybe at around the same time as that TV journalist, Grondona, or whatever his name was. Not that I am associating Grondona with them.
Was Bullrich claiming to be part of the sth Atlantic Council?
@12 ConquerorJun 13th, 2012 - 06:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
Another great post. You have been quite diplomatic recently, makes a refreshing change ;)
Also I suspect BK is female!
It seems to me that the FIG are perfectly capable of administering the Islands. I hope they will continue to expand in running their own foreign policy, with help from HMG. Just defence left. Another step toward Independence. Should they ever wish it. None of this could ever work as the Argentines want everything regardless of whether they are justified or not. Why not put the Falkland Islands flag up in Patagonia? Didn't FI's settle there before Argentina?Jun 13th, 2012 - 06:57 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
Please support this new page aimed at covering Falklands current affairs and keeping the Falklands free of Argentine rule! Please sign in and click the like button on the page to subscribe to our news feeds -Jun 13th, 2012 - 07:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
So United Kingdom of Argentina and FI (Arg Flag waving here)...Jun 13th, 2012 - 07:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
Dollar currency will make happy someone here ha ha
Perhaps the Argentinians want to share the soverignty of Buenas Ares with us? After all we invaded it once - in the early 1800s.Jun 13th, 2012 - 09:01 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
Don't reward aggression.
Don't compromise with evil.
Defend freedom and self determination.
No negotiaton with Argentina over a land they only ever occupied at gunpoint (1771 and 1982) or by setting up garrisons to try and claim squatters rights (1833).
@37 I thought the logo was just the Mercopress pepes putting the flags together. Didn't realise that required the efforts of BH Designs.Jun 13th, 2012 - 09:29 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
Bk - give peace a chance. Erre the FI are at peace. It was Argentina that broke the peace and is currently the aggressor. Peace is a state of being that exists in the Falklands and will be maintained by allowing the Islanders to decide their own future.Jun 13th, 2012 - 10:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
Thought this faintly ridiculous left-wing group had died years ago !Jun 13th, 2012 - 10:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
Dwindling on it would seem.
12 ConquerorJun 13th, 2012 - 11:02 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
The Canadian Ministry of Foreign Affairs handling diplomacy;
Ans: I have nothing against Canada, but why?
As I Canadian I have to ask the same question!
@BeefJun 13th, 2012 - 11:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
You cannot reason with the deluded. BK can only be condemned.
Maybe by next week, BK will promote the sort of behavior that would have made the folks in Sodom and Gomorrah blush. Rabid predictions aside, this would not be an impossible scenario if his grotesque hastily mounted ideas were to gain ascendancy in our society.
Contrary to the impression that temeritous, malodorous polemics offer new, innovative, and advanced ideas, there is little new in their propositions. I would like to go on, but I do have to keep this post short. So I'll wrap it up by saying that BK has a long, irrationalism-infested history of attempts to create a Frankenstein's monster.
28 Simon68 The Islanders want to be BritishJun 13th, 2012 - 11:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
That's fine, they can be British in Argentina like you for the last 45 years and tens of thousands more. Nothing special with those few hundred British living in Malvinas.
Did anybody force you to change your nationality Simon?
Sorry Marcos - no sovereignty, no islanders, no land, no resources, not even a penguin turd. Your silly country is getting absolutely nothing. Feel free to cry about it for another 180 years.Jun 13th, 2012 - 11:18 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
Looks like Britain is going to be very busy...Jun 13th, 2012 - 11:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
Spain to go to UN over Gibraltar sovereignty
And if your dysfunctional Malvinista minds were capable of rational thought, you'd recognise the lesson that Spain provides. They've been whining about Gibraltar for over *300* years and got absolutely nowhere too. You've got a long and pointless road ahead... :)Jun 13th, 2012 - 11:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
if the band wagon is big enough,Jun 13th, 2012 - 11:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
they will all want to jump on it.
Marcos Alejandro @ 51Jun 14th, 2012 - 12:38 am - Link - Report abuse 0
Britain is ALWAYS busy, because it's a world power, and it's a world power because it's always busy. Argentina could also be a world power if it put its efforts into intelligent endeavours and its politicians were more sophisticated.
Sorry Marcos - no sovereignty, no islanders, no land, no resources, not even a penguin turd. Your silly country is getting absolutely nothing. Feel free to cry about it for another 180 yearsJun 14th, 2012 - 01:35 am - Link - Report abuse 0
uk is FINISHED! poor deluded exempire,bankrupt to the core..
And if your dysfunctional Malvinista minds were capable of rational thought, you'd recognise the lesson that Spain provides. They've been whining about Gibraltar for over *300* years and got absolutely nowhere too. You've got a long and pointless road ahead... :)
uk is FINISHED poor deluded pirates!
conqueror etc..what clown...
I really had a good time reading the brits STUPIDITY here!
44 GreekYoghurtJun 14th, 2012 - 03:12 am - Link - Report abuse 0
You misunderstood - it refers to the logo on this page: http://www.staff.city.ac.uk/p.willetts/SAC/INDEX.HTM - ie 3 Circles with SAC in the middle. Must have taken all of 30 seconds to knock up. At least they don't waste resources.
12 Conqueror and 47 ZhivagoJun 14th, 2012 - 04:05 am - Link - Report abuse 0
As Canadian, I'm happy that our rep to that recent OAS General Assembly in Cochabamba spoke against the Argentine resolution, but can't see a useful role in the Falklands.
Seems what Willetts and Co is proposing smacks of turning the Falkland Islands governance into some sort of a condominium - like what Britain and France had with New Hebrides until Vanuatu independence in 1980 - and what Gibraltar voted NO to in their 2002 joint-sovereignty referendum.
@51 Marcos “Spain to go to UN over Gibraltar sovereignty”Jun 14th, 2012 - 07:50 am - Link - Report abuse 0
It's just the PM here jumping on the bankwagon of deflection but unlike Argentina a lot of the Spainards have no interest in Gibraltar sovereignty.
Where I work we have about a dozen emeritus professors, they even have their own suite of offices (which was a library until the university built a better one). It's known to everyone (including the emeritii) as God's Waiting Room.Jun 14th, 2012 - 08:12 am - Link - Report abuse 0
Most of them are all right, and treat it as a social club rather than anything else. I think the youngest is in his mid 70s.
@56 I'm relatively sure that Microsoft office smart-shapes or whatever they're called could whip out that logo in less that 20 seconds.Jun 14th, 2012 - 10:07 am - Link - Report abuse 0
Some educationalists are clearly complete social retards when it comes to aesthetics and design. That's why they're in education and not business I guess.
Absolute nonsense - argentina has no claim, so why should they get anything? Kipling and payment of danegeld spring to mind.Jun 14th, 2012 - 11:57 am - Link - Report abuse 0
South Atlantic CouncilJun 14th, 2012 - 03:53 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
Promoting communication and understanding
between Argentina, Britain and the Islanders
Which Islanders? Shetlands? Orkneys? St Helenians?
how amatuer can a webpage be?
Malvinas/F@kland Argentina’s flag waving and with share administration with Bolivia and Venezuela with supervision of Cuba.Jun 14th, 2012 - 11:12 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
Sounds pretty good for me anyone in support of this motion?
63 DanyBerger: Could be a joke with punchline ...but the cooks were British. Rather than having any role for Evo's Bolivia, Chávez' Venezuela or Castro's Cuba, Falkland Islanders might prefer shared administration between Iran and Syria, with supervision by Russia...Jun 15th, 2012 - 12:07 am - Link - Report abuse 0
@JohnNJun 15th, 2012 - 04:28 am - Link - Report abuse 0
Come on John don’t say that so quickly Evo Morales in person will provide you clothing like he did with Sean Penn.
He seems to be very happy.
Please support this new page aimed at covering Falklands current affairs and keeping the Falklands free of Argentine rule! Please sign in and click the like button on the page to subscribe to our news feeds -Jun 15th, 2012 - 11:56 am - Link - Report abuse 0