MercoPress. South Atlantic News Agency
Catalonia human chain demands Madrid a referendum on independence
Hundreds of thousands of Catalans held hands in a 400-km human chain across their region to press the Spanish government to let them vote on breaking away and forming their own country. Read full article
Comments
Disclaimer & comment rules¡Viure Catalunya lliure!
Sep 12th, 2013 - 02:27 am - Link - Report abuse 0I feel another Gibraltar deflection coming on.
Sep 12th, 2013 - 02:42 am - Link - Report abuse 0Viva Escocia libre!!!
Sep 12th, 2013 - 04:02 am - Link - Report abuse 0@3 Stevie,
Sep 12th, 2013 - 04:23 am - Link - Report abuse 0The difference Stevie, old mate, is that we won't stop or even try to stop, the Scots becoming a separate country, if thats what they want.
Ba gum, we'll even SUPPORT their wishes.
Will Spain have the same attitude to Catalonia?
Thats the $64million question.
Somehow, l doubt it.
So your remark is exposed for what it is showing.
You're trying to be a smartie-pants but falling flat on your face.
The Scots don't even want “freedom” - they've worked out how expensive it is.
Sep 12th, 2013 - 04:54 am - Link - Report abuse 0There isn't a cat in hell's chance that Salmond will win that vote. He's turned it into an obsession at the expense of everything else.
While I sympathise with Catalonians they've got no chance either.
If Scotland wants it....its going to get it, we all live in a free democratic country.
Sep 12th, 2013 - 05:14 am - Link - Report abuse 0As for Catalonia, the Basques never got anywhere, Andora is free.....who knows? As long as Spain remains a country supplying peppers, tomatoes, cucumbers and waiters, us Brits are all in favour of it.
Stevie
Sep 12th, 2013 - 05:30 am - Link - Report abuse 0“Viva Escocia libre!!!”
Scotland got its referendum.
Care to verbalise your support for a Catalonian referendum?
He won't be so keen when Chubut asks for it's independence .....
Sep 12th, 2013 - 06:08 am - Link - Report abuse 0Recent polls have only 1 in 4 Scots in favour of independence.
Sep 12th, 2013 - 06:18 am - Link - Report abuse 0Support catalonian independence bid if only to annoy the spanish goverment.
Sep 12th, 2013 - 07:03 am - Link - Report abuse 0Right to self determination
As a Scotsman, living in Finland, I am fully against independence. All my family members back home are also against it. The only people for it, appear to be stout nationalists, who only ever leave Scotland to follow there chosen football team.
Sep 12th, 2013 - 07:04 am - Link - Report abuse 0The majority of Scots that are for independence, have never worked outside of Scotland.
If Salmond does win his nationalistic vote and the Union disbands (seriously doubt it), then so be it. Britain will still continue to move forwards and upwards. However, Argentina will still be the country it is, and continuosly fail at all and everything it tries.
I love it when Spain bang on about Gibraltar when there are 3 separate autonomous parts of Spain, well not really Spain that want to be free Galicia, Catalonia & the Basque country, Spain is shrinking so while Madrid occupies it's self with the tiny rock, others are planning referendums, good luck to Catalonia, seems no one wants to be governed by the Spainish , not even the Spaniards.
Sep 12th, 2013 - 07:15 am - Link - Report abuse 0Monarchies are just a thing of the past, completely out of date, get rid of them and the world will be a better place.
Sep 12th, 2013 - 07:36 am - Link - Report abuse 0@13
Sep 12th, 2013 - 07:53 am - Link - Report abuse 0The best countries on earth to live in, in terms of quality of life are Monarchies.
Norway, Sweden, Denmark, Britain, Netherlands, Belgium etc, etc. To name a few.
The worst countries in the world are Republics. “If it ain't broke”
North Korea, Somalia, Congo, China, Argentina etc, etc To name a few from a very long list of crappy undemocratic republic shit hole's
“If it ain't broke”
13. Monarchies are the only thing holding the middle east together.
Sep 12th, 2013 - 07:53 am - Link - Report abuse 0Your posts are like a idiot with tourettes, they pop up with no bearing on the current conversation and are mostly un-intelligible.
@11 A.J.R
Sep 12th, 2013 - 07:57 am - Link - Report abuse 0Well said ACE.
Scotland is a great country whether it is with the rest of the union or not, however when it is part of the UK it is part of something even greater.
All the plans from Salmond seemed to say - we want independence but we want the pound - we want independence but we want the protection of the UK just not have nuclear missiles in scotland - we want independence and we want all the oil - we want independence and we want the rest of the uk in the same time zone as us - we want independence but we want the queen (for a bit) - we want independence but we want BBC - we want we want.. Well the truth is that Salmond hates parliament in England and what SNP are offering is so diffuse that he wants an independent Scotland being cocooned and looked after by the rest of the UK. However at least in the UK, Scots get a say. But please don't leave the fold - we are much greater together! Oh and hope the vote (if it happens) in Spain truly represents the people.
@3 As Elaine has pointed out, polls now show that 25% or less of Scots are now in favour of independence. They've realised that Salmond is just a mouth that's always open. There's neither a brain or a mind behind it. Subject after subject, he has been to shown to lie or have no idea. The EU, defence, employment, industry, gas & oil, welfare benefits, currency union, trade with UK, nationality. He has nothing. He makes statements and then the relevant body refutes what he says. Pity really. We could save a lot of money without Scotland. But the majority of Scots know which side their bread is buttered. Salmond may soon be looking for political asylum. Before the Scots lynch him. Piano wire, butcher's hooks and lamp posts will be very popular next year!
Sep 12th, 2013 - 08:28 am - Link - Report abuse 0@13 Have you counted how many monarchies there are? About 35. People seem to like them. And the alternative? You get dimwit places like argieland, Bolivia, Ecuador, Zimbabwe, Iraq, Iran, Russia, Bulgaria, Egypt, Haiti etc. And the basic fact? It's called self-determination. If the people want a monarchy, who are you to say they can't have one? If you think you can, it's called dictatorship!
Saor Alba!
Sep 12th, 2013 - 08:57 am - Link - Report abuse 0@14 Nice set of colonial gangsters you've got there. Thank God we are the broken ones
Sep 12th, 2013 - 09:15 am - Link - Report abuse 0@ 15 Tourette syndrome is a neuropsychiatric disorder, how can you use it as an insult? The fact that you use a disorder or a disease as an insult shows what type of person you are, always with mouth full of dirt.
@19
Sep 12th, 2013 - 09:45 am - Link - Report abuse 0“ Nice set of colonial gangsters you've got there. Thank God we are the broken ones”
Right..............Have you lost the argument?
You would think that Nostrils would at least try to say something different and use a different writing style when he posts as Gonzo.
Sep 12th, 2013 - 10:13 am - Link - Report abuse 04
Sep 12th, 2013 - 10:20 am - Link - Report abuse 0Is it Christmas….have I favoured the gods…..my cup overfloweth…I don't know where to start!
Who is We?….“we won't stop or We'll support”
You appear to want your cake and eat it…..from you, it's normally Our Oil, Our Land, Our Business….keep your nose out…blah blah!
What makes you think you have a say in the affairs of the UK…do you have a seat in Parliament, an MP?
You don't have squat …it is the Falklands that is a colony of Britain not vice versa…Know your place.
How little you understand the psyche of the English, Cameron is gambling on the good sense of the Scottish people to know, without stating what will happen if they do vote the wrong way!
Every Englishman's home is his Castle, England is an island fortress, throughout history Scotland has been seen, through English eyes, as a security liability, an accessible back door, a weakness into this fortress.
The Spanish in the 1715 and the French in the 1745….If Scotland wants to become Johnny Foreigner…it will get that status, a border crossing will be established…everything coming in will be scrutinised as it is in Dover etc….passports, visas….what is your purpose coming here etc….exactly like Gibraltar, there will be no backdoor entrance for any Foreigner, terrorist or interloper into that particular castle.
Ever travel through Europe and notice the lack of fences, hedgerows etc…..Not in England everything is defined… bordered…secured against trespass!
You will also realise what Mr Think means when he says the English Navy the English Airforce etc.
Salmond will be asked how he is going to defend his airspace, territorial waters….with No Navy and No Airforce and no means to get one with his share of the National UK debt!
The Scots have heard nothing yet….but as it gets closer….they will!
Watch that space!.....and don't think you understand the English because you live in one of it's Colonies...
The English psyche is either you are with us, or you are against us....concerning England!
@22 Lovely comment. Indescribably erudite. Mostly rubbish. “Johnny Foreigner…it will get that status, a border crossing will be established…everything coming in will be scrutinised as it is in Dover etc….passports, visas….what is your purpose coming here etc….exactly like Gibraltar, there will be no backdoor entrance for any Foreigner, terrorist or interloper into that particular castle.” Quite right. Foreigners are trash. Britain (excluding Scotland) is God's country. Foreigners know that they are trash. Why else would they whinge, criticise and nitpick? Jealous?
Sep 12th, 2013 - 11:37 am - Link - Report abuse 0“Ever travel through Europe and notice the lack of fences, hedgerows etc…..Not in England everything is defined… bordered…secured against trespass!” Yeah. The Germans complained that fences, hedgerows etc jammed their tank tracks.
“Salmond will be asked how he is going to defend his airspace, territorial waters….with No Navy and No Airforce and no means to get one with his share of the National UK debt!”
The minor problem is that Scotland already owes England in excess of £2 quadrillion. Will Salmond be paying that back? With a loan from argieland?
“and don't think you understand the English because you live in one of it's Colonies...”
England doesn't have any colonies, tonk toy. Certain UN “trust” territories are designated as British Overseas Territories. Particularly where the UN has accepted Britain as the “trustee”. Such a shame that imperialist, colonialist faggots without a neurone or synapse between them feel “entitled” to promulgate their lies. Still, from around the world, shit floats together. There's latam, Iran, Syria, Russia and their “supporters”.
23
Sep 12th, 2013 - 12:11 pm - Link - Report abuse 0...how funny, the only thing you could disagree was the term colonies and how long have they been known as BOT's and how long as Colonies.....
“Prior to 1 January 1983, the territories were officially referred to as Crown colonies”..☚ ....take note of that word!
“What's in a name? That which we call a rose
By any other name would smell as sweet.”
A bit like the less controversial name of Sellafield from Windscale......
@24 How do you manage to be such a wanker? Of course, you're a prat. New constitutions. New arrangements. But argieland isn't intelligent enough to see the difference between “A” and “B”. The nuclear missiles will leave you dependent on mutants.
Sep 12th, 2013 - 01:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0In the “real” world, “mutants” are annihilated. And, if they get anywhere near, I will kill them.
#14 Conor J.
Sep 12th, 2013 - 02:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Conor, your list of republics failed to include the following.
USA, France, Germany, Italy, Austria, Switzerland, Czech republic, Finland, Ireland, Singapore, South Korea. All pretty awesome places to live.
Then theres Brazil, Russia, India, China and South africa.
In fact pretty much all of the countries in the American continents are republics. (Ill get to Canada)
Anyway - referendums. Catalonia wont break with Spain, but Spain would do well to give them their referendum and give them reasons to remain as connected.
Scotland ... unfortunately... won't break from England and Wales, I may well be putting money on that soon. Salmond should have gone for devo-max, it baffles me why he didn't. Although the figures for how many Scots would risk national political embarrassment and large changes to their politics just to get away from Londons blue-blooders will make interesting reading. Ill -guess- 35% have the hairy bagpipes to try it, while overall (inclusive) ~65% would probably prefer separation.
Ah yes, Canada, and Australia for that matter - now theres two upcoming referendums to look forward to. Republic referendums.
They'll be popping up in ~ 8 - 10 years imho. As will my champagne corks.
That'll be two more constitutional monarchies to disappear off the map, leaving....oh ...i dunno, about 5? or 6?
@22 A_Voice,
Sep 12th, 2013 - 03:04 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Well l was going to reply but Mr Conqueror has done it for me & very well too, l might add.
Thank you, Conqueror.
You do realise, A_Voice that your jealousy is showing & it sounds like l'm getting to you! Excellente.
FYI, it IS our land, oil, business etc etc & you CAN keep your nose out.
Brick wall for you malvinistas, mate.
There will NEVER be any compromise. Get it?
27
Sep 12th, 2013 - 03:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I can see that hurt.....didn't like being told to keep out of British affairs!
You are not British...don't even have a British Passport...living in British Territory..
I see...
26 Vestige (#)
Sep 12th, 2013 - 03:54 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Not quite sure what you have against Constitutional Monarchies? It is of course a self evident truth that different countries have different histories, cultures, and traditions. Some countries are Republics others not. I am happy to live in a Constitutional Monarchy. The centuries long, continuity of our ancient institutions is a defining element in our culture and informs all aspect of our national life, from literature to politics. . However I am fully aware that our countries are different. It doesn’t bother me that the USA, Germany or even Argentina are Republics. That’s up to them.
Perhaps you should take more pleasure in the rich diversity of the human experience and let go of rightous dogmatism. It does you little credit.
Not sure why you think Canada and Australia will be Republics within 10 years? There are no plans for any referendums and its hardy a burning issue in either country. The new Australian PM is a staunch monarchist but it didn’t figure during their election. I’m not sure why any non-Canadian or Aussie would have an opinion on the matter.
Interestingly few Catalonians are Republicans. In Spain, like the UK, the Monarchy can represent, and speak for the whole nation in a way that a purely ideologically partisan elected President like Kirchner cannot.
'Catalunya libre' - a project which ought to be supported by the Falkland Islands, Gibraltar and FCO.
Sep 12th, 2013 - 04:30 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@ 29 “...the Monarchy can represent, and speak for the whole nation in a way that a purely ideologically partisan elected President like Kirchner cannot.” Are you sure? I know that to you people against your Monarchy are worthless, but they exist, there is life beyond the tip of your nose, not that you care, but still... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qXDlmzqzadU
Sep 12th, 2013 - 04:38 pm - Link - Report abuse 030
Sep 12th, 2013 - 05:00 pm - Link - Report abuse 0'Catalunya libre' - a project which ought to be supported by the Falkland Islands, Gibraltar and FCO.
Don't look for support there, in the words of Falkland Island's Dick Sawle.....
“It is hard for me to comment on Catalonia as I have little knowledge of the details of the Catalan situation. A stronger stance from Britain over a problem that affects Spain and Catalunya would, I imagine, be politically difficult.”
....and
”What is clear to me is that the situation of Catalonia is very different to that of the Falklands. For example, there is no territorial integrity argument with regard to the Falklands, but a powerful argument perhaps with Catalonia. Our economy is completely separated from that of the UK (apart from the costs of defence), whereas that of Catalonia is arguably hard to extricate.”
Sorry....no support from us....do see yourself out!
#29 Rupert
Sep 12th, 2013 - 06:00 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Show me where is this “righteous dogmatism” which I'm supposed to let go of.
“Perhaps you should take more pleasure in the rich diversity of the human experience” - you don't know anything about me, perhaps you make assumptions.
As for Canada and Australia, the republican movements in both countries are smart, dedicated, and tireless. Both countries have multiple public polls in preference of a republic over the monarchy. You very likely will see a referendum (again) soon enough. These are large scale popular political movements, perhaps larger than monarchists would like to believe.
And should either country choose to be a republic, the republicans in the other country will be granted a great advantage in an already closely contested battle.
The last Australian PM was a republican, the present a monarchist, this is not a deciding or necessarily influential factor. They'll time it right in both countries. Of that you can be sure, you should familiarize yourself with the opposition.
Republicans in Australia managed 45% with the burden of public complacency, change of status-quo, and division within their ranks back in the 1999 referendum.
You can be certain with their unified approach and younger voters they'll clear that 6% easily. A change of monarch will only make it easier for republicans in both countries.
It will certainly become “ a burning issue ” around that time if not considered so already.
(from looking at certain online comments alone it would seem at least somewhat burning at present)
In Britain the monarchy may well be able to speak for the whole nation, in a republic you have the chance to rise to that office and do so yourself.
@28 A_Voice,
Sep 12th, 2013 - 06:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You assume far too much.
Most of which is wrong.
But why should l provide you with information merely to defend myself from the likes of you?
Dream on.
34
Sep 12th, 2013 - 06:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0....and you don't protest enough....where was the outrage, where was the I'm British, I could live and vote in Britain......I'm not wrong
You are a foreign national...maybe married to a brit....
You don't fool me!.....a stranger in a strange land....
@33
Sep 12th, 2013 - 07:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You seem to forget Vestige that the UK is a de-facto republic as Her Maj has no real power, while the PM and Parliament hold the true power.
The vast bulk of Britons are either Royalists or see no real need to change anything, being a republic is in no means a democratic or equal and un-corrupt system.
“If it ain't Broke” These lands have been watched over by Kings for thousands of years and in this islands history of Monarchies going back to the beginning of humanity arriving on the island we have had a republic for 11 years.
Thousands of years of Kings and Queens and 11 years of Republic.........I see no need to change anything. The monarchy is value for money, hugely profitable, un-corrupt, and above all it carries with it a torch of multiple millennia of history that has defined this Island, the Empire and the World that it created and we live in today.
@36 Nothing like a de-facto Republic, there is Republic or there isn't Republic. “the Empire and the World that it created and we live in today.” That's the true definition of the colonial mindset. Rusty rusty.
Sep 12th, 2013 - 07:48 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@37
Sep 12th, 2013 - 08:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 0No its the definition of an empire that created the greatest cultural and economic change in history (Industrial Revolution) a process which allows you and I to communicate with each other thousands of miles apart. Without the Empire and the Monarchy at the top of it, the modern world would not exist.
# 32 You carefully avoided mention Gibraltar and the FCO. Friendly covert financial support from the three to help Catalunya, which is exactly as close to France as it is to Spain.
Sep 12th, 2013 - 08:11 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The inhabitants of the adjacent portion of southern France, Pays Catalan, are members of the same people.
Vestige
Sep 12th, 2013 - 09:02 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Please stop commenting on the republican movement in Australia because you clearly have no idea what you are talking about.
You made this mistake on another thread and you are doing it here.
“Ah yes, Canada, and Australia for that matter - now there’s two upcoming referendums to look forward to. Republic referendums.
They'll be popping up in ~ 8 - 10 years imho.”
I won't speak for Canada, but there will be NO republican referendum in Australia for the next 10 years. We just elected a new government that is led by an avowed constitutional monarchist and considering the swing they won't be out of power until about 2022, so no referendum for you.
You clearly have no idea how Australia's constitution works because you are so glib about referendums and the monarchy in our system.
Referendums need a double majority. And with only 8 out of 44 referenda successful in the past 112 years, your wishful thinking based on you despising our monarchy isn't going to be enough.
Also you have no idea how the Australian federation works. Unbeknownst to you, Australia states are sovereign states (just like countries) and our Queen actually has a personal relationship to each state and their constitutions. Therefore each state would have to have to become an effective republic. You clearly didn't know this. Australia may not be a single constitutional monarchy, but a collection of 7. There's a potential constitutional crisis waiting to happen. Our system is built on a written constitution like the US and also conventions like the UK constitution. It always makes me laugh when foreigners such as you pretend that to understand this.
A referendum can only really be called when the House of Reps votes for it. As the current leader of this house is an avowed monarchist, there will be no referendum supported by him.
It is like you believe the Australia’s continuing multiculturalism and immigration can only lead to a republic. Many immigrants to Australia embrace the monarchy. It sometimes has a bearing on their choice of country. My Colombian flatmate loves the monarchy and went ape when the Queen visited recently. He is an avowed republican regarding his own country but is quite happy with his new country’s monarch.
Sep 12th, 2013 - 09:03 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“As for Canada and Australia, the republican movements in both countries are smart, dedicated, and tireless.”
No they are not. They are fringe movements that people may have an opinion on but, at least in Australia, they totally underestimate people’s disdain for their motives and this was show in their last attempt. They are not dedicated nor tireless, they are hardly even known.
“These are large scale popular political movements, perhaps larger than monarchists would like to believe.”
This is where you are wrong. There is not “large scale popular political movement”. It honestly doesn’t register in Australia.
“Both countries have multiple public polls in preference of a republic over the monarchy.”
An opinion poll is just that, an opinion poll. When asked a question, people will answer because the idea is just that, an idea. It is not a policy. And opinion polls in Australia are now showing a more ambivalent and less republican trend. Also these polls are not scientific nor are they held by the government, so each one can not easily be compared to the other as they ask different questions.
“The last Australian PM was a republican, the present a monarchist, this is not a deciding or necessarily influential factor.”
I love how you prove me right. That is a HUGELY influential factor.
Honestly it is MASSIVE!
No referendum has EVER passed unless there was bipartisan support. NOT A SINGLE ONE.
Even if the Prime Minister supported it, it would likely fail unless the leader of the Opposition ALSO supported it.
“Republicans in Australia managed 45% with the burden of public complacency, change of status-quo, and division within their ranks back in the 1999 referendum.”
Sep 12th, 2013 - 09:05 pm - Link - Report abuse 0God give me strength you know nothing! I love how the reasons for the 1999 failure are always so simple. But they tend to ignore the fact that a very large percentage of the population were not supportive of any republican model. There is not guarantee that any future referenda would be able to coalesce around a single model or that they would not be just as divisive; partly because the whole reason for change is that they don’t like the current system. And by denigrating the current system you will alienate those that support it.
Only 42.5% of the electorate voted yes. There was an extremely high informal vote and half a million didn’t vote.
HOWEVER……
“You can be certain with their unified approach and younger voters they'll clear that 6% easily.”
6%. PMSL! Please jump on Wikipedia at least.
“unified approach”
There is still no unified approach. Even now, 15 years later. Reconciling people that believe in a directly elected head of state and a parliamentary elected head of state will never disappear.
“younger voters”
What younger voters? Those that are 18 and voted for the first time last week will more than likely be almost 30 by the time a referendum is possibly held.
In 1999 the median age was 35.
Now in 2011 the median age was 37.
And by 2026 is estimated to be 40.
Where are these mythical younger voters coming from?
“clear that 6% easily”
Statistically speaking, that referendum could have had 89.7% vote yes and still failed! You clearly do not understand our system. So you could double the vote and STILL fail.
So please stop talking about a subject which you clearly don't know shit about!
@35 A_Voice,
Sep 13th, 2013 - 05:02 am - Link - Report abuse 0lf it pleases you to think that, go right ahead.
Far be it from me to burst your bubble.
You will just never know, will you?
Snigger.
43
Sep 13th, 2013 - 05:52 am - Link - Report abuse 0If you could burst my bubble, you would revel in it....
...but it's a small place ..someone would know you were telling porkies...
making it difficult to tell an outright lie!....simple logic!
That's you...joined the list of wannabes...✔
I like to separate the wheat from the chaff.....Snigger!...Smug mode!
@44 A_Voice,
Sep 13th, 2013 - 06:12 am - Link - Report abuse 0You spin the same yarn as sr Think.
l would say that you are at the top of that list.
A wouldbe if you couldbe!
Logic is never simple & l have no reason to lie.
But feel free to rave on.
Voicy, old chap, you are becoming boring.
Time to move on to more serious things.
45
Sep 13th, 2013 - 08:18 am - Link - Report abuse 0Seriously, I can't wait for your next 'serious post'...Oops, my bad...first serious post Ya' Silly Bint!
Bom bom bom.....another one bites the dust!
What can I say?....
Shaddap You Face....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sFacWGBJ_cs
Dear Anglotino.
Sep 13th, 2013 - 11:41 am - Link - Report abuse 0Im going to correct you on pretty much everything you wrote.
If I miss any its for lack of time, and Ill be happy to return later.
“We just elected a new government that is led by an avowed constitutional monarchist and considering the swing they won't be out of power until about 2022”
Its 2013, if you think the same people will be in power up to 2022 think again. There is zero reason to assume so. A swing doesn't indicate with certainty, the winner of the next election. They are individual events, dependent on humans.
“You clearly have no idea how Australia's constitution works because you are so glib about referendums and the monarchy in our system”
Yes I do, heres a very simple example of how the republic referendum works.
www.docstoc.com/docs/80159823/The-Australian-Constitution---Referendums---Double-majority
“”Referendums need a double majority“ - not among the population they dont. A simple majority, along with a majority of states will do fine.
51% overall is enough once 4 states are obtained.
”You clearly didn't know this. Australia may not be a single constitutional monarchy, but a collection of 7“
- This is meaningless, do you think these mini monarchies could exist within a republic? I doubt even the queen would agree to that, not that she'd have a say by that point.
”A referendum can only really be called when the House of Reps votes for it“
Yes. As happened in 1999, with an over two thirds majority.
”My Colombian flatmate loves the monarchy and went ape when the Queen visited recently“ - good for him, hope he had fun, he's 1 person.
One - As for Canada and Australia, the republican movements in both countries are smart, dedicated, and tireless.”
Anglo - ”“No they are not”
One - Mmm, yes they are. They have high profile politicians, ex generals, academics and celebrities among their ranks, they caused a referendum in 99 and are still here in 2013.
“They are fringe movements” - Ah yes, with fringe national referendums.
“They are fringe movements ... they totally underestimate people’s disdain for their motives and this was show in their last attempt”
Sep 13th, 2013 - 12:27 pm - Link - Report abuse 0- Disdained, yet 45% of Australia voted for their campaign. Sorry, doesn't make sense.
Anglo: “This is where you are wrong. There is not “large scale popular political movement”. It honestly doesn’t register in Australia”
- mmmmm yes it does, thats why its in the news, thats why Australias last prime minister was a republican. Open and vocal about it too. And the last treasurer too.
And many members of the ruling party.
(just a little quote I like) Channel 10.
“It's been a big year for royal visits in Australia how, have all these royal visits been received and has monarchism now edged ahead of republicanism?”
Has 'monarchism' edged ahead of 'republicanism' - yes, in that order. Not the other way around.
Anyway - whats left?
“An opinion poll is just that, an opinion poll” - Yes. True indeed.
And a referendum which gets 45% support is a referendum which gets 45% support.
“opinion polls in Australia are now showing a more ambivalent and less republican trend”
- yes they are recently. royal weddings and births may have something to do with that, fortunately republicans will be timing the referendum for a time when the royals are fresh out of babies and weddings.
I expect the death of HM will also have an interesting result on the opinion polls. King Charles anyone ? A modern Aussie man with a king ...chuckle chuckle
Mmm..anyway.. some suggested reading:
www.independentaustralia.net/2011/australian-identity/republic/analysing-newspoll-australian-republicanism-not-in-decline/
www.aph.gov.au/binaries/library/pubs/rp/1998-99/99rp25-1.gif
On NZ -
“To be frank, I think it would come as a great relief to all of us,” said Charles. “It would remove the awful ambiguity we have at the moment. It seems to me that it would be a lot easier for everybody if you all had your own completely independent head of state” - King Charlie.
Oh dear ....Vestige..now has a...Vest1ge
Sep 13th, 2013 - 02:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Been there......
I had to do it buddy, I ran out of pwning space.
Sep 13th, 2013 - 02:37 pm - Link - Report abuse 050
Sep 13th, 2013 - 03:36 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Right you are squire.....
There are no current plans for either Australia or Canada to offer their people a referendum on abolition of the monarchy. I see little evidence of any real passion to do so. On the other hand 400,000 Catalans came out in support of a referendum on independance, now thats impressive. Obviousy many people across Catalonia have strong views on the subject. The difference in strengh of feel is clear.
Sep 13th, 2013 - 05:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 052
Sep 13th, 2013 - 06:05 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Out of a Catalan population on 7.5 Million....if this reflects the the interest in a referendum...I can't see it happening!
Yes very clear!
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