MercoPress. South Atlantic News Agency
Falklands historic events commemorated by Atlantic Patrol HMS Richmond
As part of her Atlantic Patrol Task (South) deployment, HMS Richmond has visited San Carlos Water, the scene of the amphibious landings during the Falklands War of 1982. The site is also the final resting place of HMS Antelope which was tragically lost on 23 May 1982. Read full article
Comments
Disclaimer & comment rulesI find it rather sad that there appears to have been no mention of the Battle of Coronel, which was the cause of Sturdee's squadron being sent to the South Atlantic.
Dec 29th, 2013 - 09:31 am - Link - Report abuse 0Perhaps it is just me and because my grandfather lost a lot of friends at Coronel.
At least the Falklands have a history to be proud of unlike The Dark Country.
Dec 29th, 2013 - 10:16 am - Link - Report abuse 0#1 Coronel was fought ~2000 km away in the Pacific Ocean.
Dec 29th, 2013 - 11:25 am - Link - Report abuse 0@ 3
Dec 29th, 2013 - 12:38 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Quite agree. It is just that I, almost always, mentally connect the two plus the fact of course that the British vessel's that survived Coronel were actually at the Falklands. Before anyone jumps on my back, I know Canopus was aground (deliberately).
The two battles are directly connected as part of that naval canpaign against Von Spees squadron and Cradocks squadron was based at the Falklands and I think the plans for the commemoration of the centenary inclue Coronel also.
Dec 29th, 2013 - 02:55 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Biggugy. I have done considerable research into the personalities involved at Coronel. Would it be too much to ask for the name of your grandfather?
The Canopus was not involved at the Coronel battle and there has been endless speculation as to whether her presence in the line would have made any difference. The fact that she was 300 miles away to the south can be blamed on one man, Canopus chief engineer who told his captain that the ship could only turn 13 knots when she was quite capable of doing 16
On Craddocks death ride in the Monmouth and the Good Hope at Coronel only two ships escaped, the AMC Otranto and HMS Glasgow which latter was also in the Falklands battle and eventually destroyed her adversary SMS Dresden at Mas Afuera island in 1915
Kit Craddock and most of his crew knew they hadnt a cat in hells chance. His ships were manned by a scratch crews of reservists who had had only one practice shoot since being called up.As happened at Coronel, most of the guns on the Monmouth and the Hope couldnt be fought in a heavy sea.
Put this against Spees squadron whose crews had been together for many years and had won the Kaisers cup for naval gunnery three years running. A very gallant folorn hope and Craddock deserves his memorial in York Minster
Slightly off tack, 2014 also marks the 70th anniversary of Operation Tabarin ( Naval Party 497) commanded by the picaresque Capt Victor Marchesi RN in the ship William Scoresby. You can look him up on google so I wont elucidate unless asked to. After the war Operation Tabarin was rechristened into the present day British Antarctic Survey.
Also coming up is Shakletons epic voyage to South Georgia in the lifeboat James Caird and the subsequent rescue of his crew at Elephant Island by the Chilean
@1 I can understand your disappointment in the circumstances. But consider. In wartime, many activities take place as a consequence of what has happened before. How far back would you want to go? For instance, the United States dropped the atomic bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki because it had experienced high levels of casualties in “island-hopping” across the Pacific. The Americans estimated that their casualties would be between 1.7 and 4 million dead and wounded. How many invasions of Pacific islands should be mentioned? And should it be only American invasions or should it be the previous Japanese invasions as well? Don't feel bad.
Dec 29th, 2013 - 03:30 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@3 The Battle of the Falkland Islands took place BECAUSE Britain sent a large force to track down and destroy the German cruiser squadron that had been victorious at the Battle of Coronel. It could have taken place anywhere. But the Germans, short on ammunition and coal, decided to raid the British supply base at Stanley. So the Germans decided where they would be destroyed.
@4 Stick with it. The Falkland Islands WAS a direct result of Coronel. But remember that Rear-Admiral Sir Christopher Cradock understood that his orders were to fight to the end. And he did. It might have been relevant that a friend of his was awaiting court-martial for failing to engage a superior enemy. We British don't take defeat well. Most of WW2 took place because of the Channel Islands and Norway.
A few inaccuracies there Conqueror. Yes Milne was awaiting court martial for allowing the Goeben and the Breslau to escape. I didnt know he and Craddock were friends but the ensuing rumpus may have influenced Craddocks decision. As to friends, Craddock and von Spee had fought shoulder to shoulder in China and Craddock had a medal bestowed on him for those efforts by the Kaiser
Dec 29th, 2013 - 04:29 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Perhaps you should read the signals between Craddock and the Admiralty. They are extremely ambiguos and Craddock didnt know what the hell his instructions were, so Craddock was left to his own sometimes faulty judgement. Who was the originator of those signals? Fisher? No it was the First Lord, one Winston Spencer Churchill.
“Most of WW2 took place because of the Channel Islands and Norway”
I thought it had something to do with the German invasion of Poland. Care to elaborate on your Norway/Channel Islands theory? I would be interested to hear a fresh point of view
British make party with everything. Seems Bahia.
Dec 29th, 2013 - 05:11 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Their world collapses, and they make party. Interesting.
England. I don't know you, but beautiful picture.
@9 Brasileiro I appreciate that sometimes your English is a bit deficient and one tries to make allownces for that.But your ultimate posts have been almostly completely incomprehensible
Dec 29th, 2013 - 06:16 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Mercopress does have a site to post in Spanish or Portuguese on which your comments have been conspicuous for their absence
I could not meddle in British affairs. Malvinas is America, thank God.
Dec 29th, 2013 - 06:40 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@5 Redpol
Dec 29th, 2013 - 07:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Frank Henson. He was on the 'Bedford' when she struck the rocks in 1910. I still have the post-card he sent his father to say he was safe, sent in Japan marked, in his hand, 'via Siberia'. I am not sure what his rating was at the time of that 'Bedford Incident'. He was a seaman gunner perhaps a Leading Hand or P.O.2. I know he was a leading hand in 1901 and a P.O. not sure 1 or 2 in 1914. (Canada Post 'lost' his service record which did not endear them to me, all we have left is is Certificate of Wounds and Hurts for when he was wounded at Gallipoli [Swiftsure], it does note he was 'sober' at the time. My sister has it). He joined the RN in 1895 as a Boy Class II. His first trip to sea was under sail and he claimed to have heard an 'old fashioned' broadside fired. Incidentally I believe 1985 was also the year that the last 'all sail' squadron left the UK; HMS Raleigh was, I believe the flagship. I stand correction on these last two points.
Ah HMS Richmond, my first ship and such a fine ship she is!
Dec 29th, 2013 - 07:18 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Sounds like it was a special day for all involved who were given the chance to remember our fallen.
Comment removed by the editor.
Dec 29th, 2013 - 07:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0One should always be proud of a nation that is willing to give its today—for your tomorrow,
Dec 29th, 2013 - 08:02 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Thank god for Great Britain,
.
@10 Brasiliero
Dec 29th, 2013 - 08:07 pm - Link - Report abuse 0As we all know Malvinas is a Spanish derivative after the French Îles Malouines. Sounds fairly European to me. Infact most S America names are Spanish/Portuguese etc. Again sounds European to me. Why not prompote some indiginous Indian names for a change.
how cool is this...
Dec 29th, 2013 - 08:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0....with a lack of adversaries... we have Brits attacking ex-Brits and on the other thread Anglo's attacking Anglo's....feck all for me to do....think I'll go on Yahoo and wind up the Yanks...they're always game and gullible....
Brasileiro...if you are using Google translate...write Portuguese translate to Spanish then cut and paste the Spanish to the left and translate to English....
Portuguese to English turns out nonsense.....
...only if you are stuck...that is...;-)))
In first hand.......
Dec 29th, 2013 - 10:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 0https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XkfRqnsyS0o
..and the Scotch attacking them all, how novel! And, giving advice to a Brazilian? Think is so versatile...
Dec 29th, 2013 - 10:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The only thing Scotch will be attacking...is my throat at Hogmanay...single malt preferably..;-))
Dec 29th, 2013 - 11:11 pm - Link - Report abuse 0People are people to me...some good, some bad, some stupid and some with a dentures and boot polish fetish...no names....;-)))
That's with me? I have some teeth yet!
Dec 29th, 2013 - 11:14 pm - Link - Report abuse 0https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r2j279pZxTY
No Brasileiro not you....that's Faz.....;-)))
Dec 29th, 2013 - 11:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0this is precisely why the end of the malvinas colonisation has to be “negotiated” - as Argentina demands.
Dec 30th, 2013 - 12:14 am - Link - Report abuse 0i am sure these kind of ceremonies will be allowed to continue but they still need to be agreed upon nonetheless when the sovereignty is handed over.
Troneas,
Dec 30th, 2013 - 12:37 am - Link - Report abuse 0Who's going to hand over sovereignty?
The Falkland Islands government say they won't do it.
The British government say they won't do it.
Will Mickey Mouse do it? After all, he's got as much power and authority over the Falklands as Argentina does.
@22 Troneas
Dec 30th, 2013 - 01:45 am - Link - Report abuse 0“this is precisely why the end of the malvinas colonisation has to be “negotiated” - as Argentina demands. ”
The end of the Falklands colonisation by Imperialist Argentina was negotiated by British troops in 1982.
The end of the Falkland Islands as a colony was in 1982-the Islanders themselves have negotiated their increased powers and increased self-autonomy from the UK government.
Therefore Argentina are irrelevant and they can demand what they like. Unless Argentina can demonstrate incontrovertible historical evidence that proves their case, or get the UN policy on self determination and the Independence of former colonies reversed, their demands are as effective as a fart against a battleship.
“they still need to be agreed upon nonetheless when the sovereignty is handed over.”
No they won't.
If sovereignty is handed to anyone it will be the Falkland Islanders when they are ready to form an independent nation.
Argentines not born in the Falkland Islands have no rights in the Islands whatsoever.
@18 & 19.
Dec 30th, 2013 - 12:29 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I recomend any of the MacAllan's.
Took few bottles (and my kilt) with me, as I'm in Brasil for Houghmany......
@ 24
Dec 30th, 2013 - 12:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Pete, I am sorry but I have to partially disagree with your statement:
“Argentines not born in the Falkland Islands have no rights in the Islands whatsoever.”
What about those who although not born in the Islands but who have 'qualified' to be considered Islanders, normally I believe through marriage?
22,,
Dec 30th, 2013 - 12:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0No you wont get them,
If they were given, just because someone wants them,
Then Argentina itself also becomes open to any other country, who wants her,
Democracy is not just for Christmas its for life..
.
#25 My favourite is Laphroaig, but I'll take a MacAllan. I'm off to Rhu tomorrow, never miss it. After that its Celtic Connections and then Chile in February. Have a grand time.
Dec 30th, 2013 - 01:46 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@11 Interesting.If he entered the RN as a Boy Class 2 in 1895, that means he was probably born about 1871. I cant findany casualty lists for HMS Swiftsur at Gallipoli.Notsurprising as that was a major cock up opratedfromthe Greek islands of Mudros, Lesbos and you guessedit CHAOS!
Dec 30th, 2013 - 04:03 pm - Link - Report abuse 0But with so many effulgent flatulent sparks being emitted from the backsides of some of the posters on this thread, perhaps its a bit off topic to discuss Frank Hensons carreer
If I find out anything more about him I will let you know in a quiet moment
HMS Bedford
Dec 30th, 2013 - 05:24 pm - Link - Report abuse 0http://www.wrecksite.eu/wreck.aspx?110185
http://www.wrecksite.eu/wreck.aspx?110185
images of some of the crew.
http://www.wrecksite.eu/wreck.aspx?110185
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
contents
http://www.wrecksite.eu/wreck.aspx?110185
…………………
WAR MEMORIALS ONLINE
http://www.wrecksite.eu/wreck.aspx?110185
HMS Bedford
Names 16 men but no Henson,
Just being helpful…
.
Thanks Briton. I had hoped that it might be a lead into another ship HMS Dotorel which blew up at Punts Arenas in 1881 with the loss of 143 lives in a similar accident to that of the USS Maine. A very long shot and milesoff the mark.
Dec 30th, 2013 - 06:18 pm - Link - Report abuse 0These may help in searching,
Dec 30th, 2013 - 06:40 pm - Link - Report abuse 0http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/
its sometimes hard to trace a person, without going into research to find him,
but glad I could help,
happy new year..
.
@ redpol & Briton.
Dec 30th, 2013 - 10:31 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I would not expect him to be on any memorial, as far as I am aware he was uninjured in that 'Bedford Incident'.
He was born in 1880. One of my cousins has recently discovered that he rowed for the RN, I believe at Henley, could be erroneous I have not seen the proof.
He was not physically 'on' the Swiftsure at Gallipoli when he was wounded. Should I be able to recollect his 'Certificate of Wounds and Hurts' anywhere near correctly 'he was cox'ain of a steam pinnace sent to recover some boats. As I understood it they were some of the boats used for landing the troops but the crews had been killed or incapacitated. According to his description for his part in the landings he had 6 whalers behind him each with 60 men in them, no landing craft in those days, and as I understand it the steam pinnace towed them 'in' and cast them off turning away, or backing off, just in time to avoid grounding herself. He reckoned not one of the 360 men behind him made the beach and that their bodies were 'washing about' for days afterwards. Not a pleasant story.
Anyway in carrying out his orders he was hit by a 'spent bullet or piece of shrapnel' in the upper body. I did hear that when he got the pinnace 'back' his boots were full of blood, but I have no confirmation.
Should I remember his service record correctly his first ship was 'Ganges' which back in those days was still the old '3 master'.
When my grandfather returned to duty after recuperating his first ship was HMS Chester, after Jutland. Somewhere in the family there is a picture of my mother sitting on the barrel of a gun, supposedly 'Cornwall's gun. Again I cannot verify.
Ello ello ello...wots goin on er then?...Riots in BA...no power....no water...no crapper..?...Ohh dear those stuborn “Kelpers” could share in all this Argie
Dec 31st, 2013 - 02:34 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Ello ello ello...wots goin on here then..?Riots on the streets od BA...no power...no water...no crappers..etc etc...And once again the Arjuntinian gov; blames some one else...And to think,those stuborn “kelpers” could share this paradise ......if only...!lol....!
17
Dec 31st, 2013 - 02:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Excellent.
Brazil is large and is is getting bigger... Glad.
England is small and it is shrinking ... Glad.
Thank José, Brasil is part from our world and words. Fidelity, Dignity and Fraterniteé. God Save South América!
Dec 31st, 2013 - 03:46 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@26 Biguggy
Dec 31st, 2013 - 03:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“What about those who although not born in the Islands but who have 'qualified' to be considered Islanders, normally I believe through marriage?”
Not a problem with those Argentines-they have expressed a desire to settle in the Islands and become Falkland citizens, so they must have rights in contradiction to what I expressed in my previous post.
People born in the Islands must have the predominant say now they have moved on from being a colony.
I don't think Argentines with no Falkland connections should have a say in how the islands are run.
@Brasileiro
Dec 31st, 2013 - 05:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“God save South America!”
It certainly needs saving.
Your country and anglosphere needs more.
Dec 31st, 2013 - 06:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Everyone knows that Jesus is an Anglo and not a South American. Ergo, so is God.
Dec 31st, 2013 - 07:04 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Why is that you say?
Well it is because they could not find three wise men and a Virgin in South America. Boom. Boom!
That includes Brasilerio of course, his or her next one will be his or her first
Well, it's an Oldie but a Goldie.
With apologies to the wiser of our South American contributors on here, you know who you are.
A happy and prosperous New Year to one and all. May your sorrows be few and your joys many.
Happy New Year and peace on Earth to one and all.
Dec 31st, 2013 - 07:46 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Best wishes to all you Falklanders and the folk on South Georgia, you are not forgotten. I hope one day to visit again. The places you live are so special. Lets keep them that way.
Peace for all, Happy new 2014 year!
Dec 31st, 2013 - 10:14 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Sounds good to me. same back.
Dec 31st, 2013 - 10:23 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Happy New Year people! Feliz Año Nuevo. Feliz Ano Novo.
Jan 01st, 2014 - 04:06 am - Link - Report abuse 0@markhumphreys tweet:
Jan 01st, 2014 - 06:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Indeed.1827 map shows the Falklands. Does not show any place called “Argentina”.
https://twitter.com/markhumphrys/status/418446697992159232/photo/1
Biggugy
Jan 01st, 2014 - 07:01 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Frank Henson
Thats a fascinating story of a life. Have you ever thought of writing it up? Think you should!
So here goes with a few notes on your comments which may need verification
HMS Chester and the Cornwell gun. I think this 5.5inch naval gun is stored at the Imperial War Museum at Duxford and a copy of your photo would certainly be of interest to them
Boy 1st Class Jack Cornwell is at the age of 16years and 4 months the youngest ever recipient of the Victoria Cross for heroism. All the gun crew had been killed but he stayed at his post though mortaly wounded and may have fired the last shot from his turret which sank the German SMS Wiesbaden at Jutland.
HMS Swiftsure at Gallipolli. I think your grandads part from the description was the landing at W beach at Cape Helles which massacre has been much overshadowed by the derring-do of the ANZAC division and the soldiers slaughtered in the boats were from the Lancashire Fusiliers.A thoroughly botched operation under the command of the worst of the donkey generals Hunter-Weston in conjunction with his equally inept naval counterpart Admiral de Robeck.A further ship the Clyde, a collier was also used in the landings.
Perhaps the poster on this blog of that name could inform us more fully?
HMS Ganges This was a training ship and when that ship was finally broken up, the name was transferred to a shore training establishment closed by the MoD in 1976.
For many years the mainmast of the old Ganges was the principal feature of that stone frigate.
The land is now a housing estate and I think in 2009 the mast was still there but very dilapidated and in urgent need of repair
Doch an doris 2013 and wishing you a prosperous 2014.
45 JohnN
Jan 01st, 2014 - 08:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Try this one, circa 1800's.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/8e/English_imperialism_octopus.jpg
@ 46
Jan 01st, 2014 - 09:50 pm - Link - Report abuse 0One of my cousins is digging a little deeper into our grandfather's history.
I am not sure who has, or even if it still exists, the photograph of my mother, sitting on Cornwall's gun.
Somewhere at the back of my mind I have a recollection of my grandfather saying that the troops in 'his boats' were from a North Country Light Infantry Regiment. Close to the Lancashire Fusiliers, perhaps? Seems to be too much of a coincidence.
One of my mother's uncles, by marriage, was an instructor at Ganges in the late 40's early fifties. Much younger than my grandfather.
My grandfather died when I was 17, pushing 55 years ago now, so some of my memories may be a little hazey.
Thank you for your input.
@48 Only too pleased to help. There was a corporal who earned a VC in that op who later rose to the rank of Lt-Col in that debacle .
Jan 01st, 2014 - 10:41 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Look up “Six VCs before breakfast”
But I cant find anything about the Swiftsures boats. No matter she was there, supporting the Euralsalus in the landing
As I said, write it all up. I for one would be most interested and anythingI can contribute I will do so gladly
I think W beach was subsequently renamed by General Ian Hamilton Lancaster Beach but whether the name has stuck I dunno
Happy New year everybody!
Jan 02nd, 2014 - 12:55 am - Link - Report abuse 0Mines was fairly mental..
Hit in the neck by a dodgy shamoolie.
If i'd died? Trust me, lying on a Brasilian beach, in my Kilt, with a 12 year old bottle of Macallan in my hand, - surrounded by curious post-adolescent young women would have been the way to go.
@50 - Ha, haven't heard 'shamoolie' for a while. They did tend to have a mind of their own.
Jan 02nd, 2014 - 04:39 am - Link - Report abuse 0Has this paper shut down?
Jan 02nd, 2014 - 12:42 pm - Link - Report abuse 0It's not publishing anything new.
perhaps nothing new has happened lol.
Jan 02nd, 2014 - 12:54 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Demands probe into recent earthquakes in Falklands / Malvinas are linked to oil exploration.
Jan 02nd, 2014 - 02:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0http://es.mercopress.com/2013/12/29/piden-investigar-si-recientes-sismos-en-falklands-malvinas-estan-vinculados-a-exploracion-petrolifera
Another earthquake for the islands....yes, the sooner the better!
Jan 02nd, 2014 - 11:39 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Latest!!! Earthquake now attributed to actions of pensive Patagonian from Chubut. Seismic disturbance caused by said subject stamping about while pullulating petunias in his parsnip patch
Jan 05th, 2014 - 01:07 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Commenting for this story is now closed.
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