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PM Cameron 'emotional and nervous' about Scottish independence referendum
British Prime Minister David Cameron said over the weekend he was feeling “emotional and nervous” about the September 18 Scottish independence referendum. Read full article
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Disclaimer & comment rulesGuess we'll know how good these polls are in just 3 weeks.
Sep 01st, 2014 - 11:51 am - Link - Report abuse 0The people will decide.
As a Geordie I'm not bothered either way, I can see why they want it but a lot of us south of the border are in the same boat and hate the Tories.
Sep 01st, 2014 - 12:37 pm - Link - Report abuse 0It would be interesting to see what happens in London if they do vote yes. Then you can accurately say the country literally falls apart under a Tory government lol
Why do you hate the Tories? Labour has made us 1)the most indebted nation in the world by head of population and 2)allowed so much immigration without limit that our city streets are full of beggars from Eastern Europe and other climes. UKIP and the LibDems are just comic relief and would be quite unable to solve all the problems caused by Blairism and the Labour Party.
Sep 01st, 2014 - 01:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@ 3 gordo1
Sep 01st, 2014 - 01:35 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“Why do you hate the Tories?”
It's a Geordie thing which goes back to the Jarrow March.
I have no idea which “boat” he thinks he's in but having another Labour government will ensure it sinks out of site next time.
Why would someone who so ardently believes in SELF-DETERMINATION be such a nervous wreck? Shouldn't he be relaxed, confident, and proud?
Sep 01st, 2014 - 02:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Why would an Anglo be so “emotional”? I thought Anglos didn't allow their emotions to take over.
Why is everyone so unsure about this vote? I thought it was signed, sealed, and delivered that there was no way in he!! “yes” could even have a shot.
I guess it would be a shame for the people of Scotland in the long run if they believe Salmond's fairy tale. It's their decision but I like the Scottish people so I wouldn't wish them a bleak future.
Sep 01st, 2014 - 03:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I'm not, if the Scotch go they go! No coming back either. If it doesnt happen this time theres always 5 years time for another go. Prize is....no more socialism, prosperity and far fewer scroungers, hence lower taxes. Independence for London and the South!
Sep 01st, 2014 - 03:12 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@5
Sep 01st, 2014 - 03:31 pm - Link - Report abuse 0nervous because like a parent you care for your children if and when they leave the nest but your still mature and understanding enough to let them leave if they want to or when they disagree with you...that is the whole truth of self determination..
if they want to go,let them go if they want to stay but with changes..sit and negotiate...
but negotiate and talk rationally are the key words..
Personally I think the whole referendum has been done with rationality on both sides of the argument to be fair..it is an emotive subject both for and against.
Everyone has emotions but to solely act on them is folly...look at the arg prez and listen to the lunacy that leaks out once in a while..would you want to do business with a nation who is represented by a person who is slightly schizophrenic?
David Cameron is more likely to be nervous that Scotland will vote NO and send 50-odd Labour MPs to Westminster again...either that or he is selflessly promoting the Union because he truly believes in it.
Sep 01st, 2014 - 03:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Personally, I hope Scotland votes for Independence, as it would be a hoot trying to watch Salmond deliver what he believes is “Scotlands Sovereign right”
I watched the live TV debate and Salmond is either clueless or a liar.
He seemed unaware of the difference between currency union and 2keeping the pound”. This is terrifying. Nobody has ever said Scotland cannot keep the Pound, what theyve said is no to currency union. Salmond chose th soundbite and assumed whoever he was trying to impress was too stupid to tell the difference.
Salmond seemed unaware of the difference between currency union and sharing the assets of the Bank of England. Nobody has ever said Scotland couldnt have its share (8%) of the assets of the Bank of England. What it said no to was currency Union. Salmond chose to lie, and in doing so showed contempt for his supporters.
Two critical economic arguments and Salmond chose lies and soundbites. Is he an Argentine?
However, other than near guarenteeing a Tory majority at the next election, then electoral reform making the constituencies equal sizes (a massive current benefit to Labour), we should be without tax, borrow, spend Socialism in England for a generation. Pity, as it seems to be going so well in France!!
Anyone got popcorn...!
@8
Sep 01st, 2014 - 03:48 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Argentina is not interested in doing business with you or anyone.
Scottish Independence will be good for England and Scotland.
Sep 01st, 2014 - 03:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Even if Scots vote no this time there will be another referendum in 5 years time. Best to split now before we all get bored to death by another debate about Scottish jobs, Scottish Oil, Scottish Whiskey, Scottish Welfare payments and whose currency the Scottish will borrow. So do it but do it now.
@3
Sep 01st, 2014 - 04:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Its not just the Jarrow march as Chrissy says, why would anyone up here like the Conservatives when they took away our Jobs in heavy industry, ship building, coal mining etc - laying waste to entire communities, that's where the hate comes from and the same can be said for the Scots. I will agree with you on immigration but it seems the Tories are doing a fine job at stemming the flow.
@4
I expected something like that from you Chris, top marks kiddo.
Carry on :D
@10
Sep 01st, 2014 - 05:17 pm - Link - Report abuse 0For once we are in agreement...
Btw if that is your viewpoint towards the rest of the world..then why are you on here ranting and rambling?
What are you trying to achieve?
@13 We are the only social life he has.
Sep 01st, 2014 - 05:21 pm - Link - Report abuse 0My point here is to counter the insults and opprobrium towards my country by filthy foreign fiends.
Sep 01st, 2014 - 05:21 pm - Link - Report abuse 0They stop the vitriol, I stop my truth slapping, and I go away never to be seen again.
@14
Sep 01st, 2014 - 05:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I agree
I wont be in Scotland on the 18th, but my YES vote will be.
Sep 01st, 2014 - 05:23 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I'll be wearing my kilt on the 18th.
Yes or No? If its a NO vote, - I'll at least be able to sleep sound knowing I voted YES.
@15
Sep 01st, 2014 - 05:30 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Ahh I see..according to you The insults are without foundation and you perceive yourself as some sort of crusader against people who not only insult your persona/nation but who you think are foreign and therefore abhorrent?
And the only way to correct this is to completely agree with your viewpoint because that's the right and just answer?
@17
Good luck either way for the vote. At least your putting your mark down.
@ 12 Frankdrebin
Sep 01st, 2014 - 05:40 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I have no idea how old you are but I am 68 and know exactly why the heavy industries failed and died throughout the UK. Other countries allowed their industries to be free from unions and invested in their shipyards due to the tax incentives they got.
Please tell me how many tax incentives did “The pound in your pocket is exactly the same” Harold Wilson give out? He had devalued the GBP 10% at the time the lying bastard. How many damaging strikes were there on Tyneside during his ‘reign’ as Prime Minister? Who was it took the jobs in mining? Step forward ‘King’ Arthur Scargill and the damage he did with his militancy and determination to break Thatcher..
The Blessed Margaret kicked you lot in the nuts due to your union leaders carrying on beyond the red stop lights of public opinion: why do you think she was re-elected and lasted for so long? Had the union leaders been willing to change there would still have been job losses in the nationalised industries because they are always overstaffed but the industries themselves MAY still be here apart from the world of manufacturing was changing at the same time.
You are like the argies: it’s always somebody else’s fault.
Incorrect, my intellectualy un-noetic thinker.
Sep 01st, 2014 - 05:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0YOU came to the totally erroneous conclusion that foreigners ceasing all insults of my country is tantamount to agreeing totally with my viewpoint.
That is the typical EUian / NOrthAmoan mindset: my way or the highway. You respect nothing and no one who is not European or North America, you think of them (us) as inferior, not worthy of your breath.
All you need to do is stop the insults. You can think what you want of us, and disagree with us 100%. I could care less. That does not require insults.
Stop the insults, and I leave.
5 4n conTroll
Sep 01st, 2014 - 05:55 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Well said.
What happen with “self determination” Mr.Camoron?
Another reason to vote YES:
English rocker mom joins ISIS, vows to 'behead Christians with blunt knife
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2739006/Revealed-How-middle-aged-mother-two-Kent-used-girl-rock-band-reinvented-jihadi-threatening-behead-Christians-blunt-knife.html
@20 You will never leave. You have nothing else in your life.
Sep 01st, 2014 - 05:57 pm - Link - Report abuse 0OMG, Germans, French, British, and Italians are joining ISIS at alarming rates to commit atrocities.
Sep 01st, 2014 - 05:57 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Meanwhile they are close to starting WWIII in EUROPE (again).
As I always said, and everyone always knew, you can put lipstick on a pig, but....
Europeans were bound to return to their genetic calling: war, genocide, and disease. 60 years of interlude do not change 3000 years of the same pattern.
@20
Sep 01st, 2014 - 05:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0We'll it must do you berk, because it is the nature of debate and discussion, if they didn't totally agree how could people respond without you taking it as an insult?
Has it ever occurred to you that some of the insults have foundation? Why is it Argentina is in this mess? Bearing in mind this has been going on for how many decades?
Bet you will blame this all on someone/thing else
So let's recap
Basically what your saying is
If you agree with me post away
If you don't- don't say anything because I'll be offended
You don't respect people have a different viewpoint on the world and you can't take it when they disagree..
Personally I think you need to have a bit more confidence in yourself and take a bit of on the chin..stop with it with all the woe is me I'm from Latam....feeling sorry for myself...how can the world be so cruel?
Btw my in laws are Bolivian so wtf you know about respecting something different from the eu or USA...
PS when do you qualify as Latam or argentine? What are the standards required?
21. And if the Scots let the Muslims in the same way they did in London and England ?? They are even more left wing than the brits. When they find out they cant pay the welfare for their ageing populations and oil will not be able to sustain them they will open the door to the Middle East youth to pay for them.
Sep 01st, 2014 - 06:17 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@24
Sep 01st, 2014 - 06:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 0No. When they call argies “inferior, dumb, stupid, crooks, etc” then I react.
@26
Sep 01st, 2014 - 06:29 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Well personally I wouldn't go that way, this is a debating ground.
If people need to resort to that then ignore them tbh, writing off a whole nation on the actions of a few is a bit much, even for my pallet.
Yes no yes no shake it all about,
Sep 01st, 2014 - 06:42 pm - Link - Report abuse 0No yes no yes so many things to spout,
lolol
3 weeks 3 weeks 3 weeks,
don't be impatient..
Anyway back on topic....
Sep 01st, 2014 - 06:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Personally I think it won't happen, too many questions left unanswered and giving a response along the lines of “it'll be alright on the night” isn't good enough.
Why haven't the scots government done any research prior to the referendum date and given the scots a proper brochure so to speak? Or better yet get in power then speak to the uk government and set a date like 2015/16. It would have been allowed due to the universal nature of the vote surely? That would have been better for the voters?
Mr salmon is already preparing his humiliation speech of being beaten,
Sep 01st, 2014 - 06:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0but hey
its just a set back he will remark...lol
Chris R @19
Sep 01st, 2014 - 07:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You hit the nail 100 % on the head !
@26 Crooks - yes - that's why RG land is rated down in 106th position in the Global Corruption Index.
Sep 01st, 2014 - 07:50 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@ 19 ChrisR
Sep 01st, 2014 - 08:13 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I'm only 34 so slightly before my time with regards to Wilson devaluing the pound.
I'm not a moaner Chris and I'm merely stating fact that “we people” (northerners) dislike the Tories for the reasons I stated in post 12. I will agree though, the unions went mad and contributed to their own demise. Thatcher could have taken the unions down a peg or two but she chose the destroy them and put up barriers blocking investment. Ship yards closed in shady deals involving the government. Brand new (profitable) Coal Mines with billions of tonnes in proven reserves shut and demolished within a year. Makes sense doesn't it?
Absolutely no need to turn this into a North vs South slagging match Chris, I posted a comment and you jumped on it as you have done in the past. Everyone on this board is entitled to their opinion.
More coal mines closed under Wilson than Thatcher
Sep 01st, 2014 - 09:18 pm - Link - Report abuse 0number of miners out of work more under Wilson than Thatcher
UK economy shrunk more under Wilson and grew more under Thatcher
more days lost to strikes under Wilson than under Thatcher
3 day week
winter of discontent
All Labour, and the unpopular policies needed to fix it and return UK to growth under the Tories.
But fool me once.....
Banking crash
Exponential borrowing
Huge public sector spending
Uncontrolled immigration
All New Labour
And the unpopular policies to return the UK to growth...yep, the Tories again.
The vote will be NO, I doubt there will be another stab in 5 years, Scotland will have just about devolved everything by then that there will be no desire to go through all of this again and I don't think the rest of of country will allow it due to economic and investment insecurity. This is Scotland's time, they have had 2 years to make this choice, longer to be fair, I don't think that there are many undecided voters at all, that's rubbish, they make their choice now and live with the result.
Sep 01st, 2014 - 09:35 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The UK isn't all about Scotland's issues, we in England want our own parliament too and with the rise of UKIP, the political landscape in the UK will change dramatically over the next 5 years, including leaving the EU, which well over 50% 0f the population want to do.
@34
Sep 01st, 2014 - 09:35 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Don't want to piss on your fire.....
But mass immigration was caused by thatcher removing border controls and the banking crisis by deregulating the banks with Reagan pestering her.....
The public spending et al is a fair shot.
Just saying........
Btw immigration is needed to stem the flow of how shall we say.. Us Brits not banging them out quick enough? We need a effective tax base to pay for the pensioners on top.... Baby boom and all.....but good news! In about 2020 or so we'll overtake ze Germans as the leader of European growth!
This is a difficult situation. Initially, I read the history, considered the scotch I had been acquainted with and realised they were headed for disaster. I felt sorry for them. But, as time has passed, I have come to recognise the reality. In brief, the scotch have revealed themselves to be ignorant, ungrateful and off with the fairies.
Sep 01st, 2014 - 10:15 pm - Link - Report abuse 0But there is financial reality. The departure of scotchland will see a reduction of £1.6 billion per annum in the UK's EU contributions. The end of the scotch Barnett formula subsidy will save £9 billion. Difficult to say how much the UK will save on welfare and defence. Certainly billions.
So now it seems that the departure of scotchland is good for the UK.
@5. The Prime Minister of the United Kingdom has a responsibility for the whole nation. He cares. In a proper society, one even cares for the mentally deranged.
@10. Excellent. All we want to do is steal everything you have. Of course, we'll pay for it. Is that “stealing”? But YOU have nothing we NEED that we can't get elsewhere.
@15. If you go away, you'll never know what WE say, will you? Might WE say nothing “nasty” for six months, until you've gone? And then start again. Telling the truth. Are you really going to sit there 24/7, 365 days a year? Have you thought of getting a job?
@20. Have you ever thought that, if you make it to 50 years of age, you'll look back and regret what you think of as “a life”? Most of it spent in someone's prison.
@21. Hey ho, dicko. She likes the sun and wants to behead Christians. Off yo argieland then. By the way, a referendum indicates self-determination, thicko. Unlike the bought votes of argieland.
@23. Of course you can put lipstick on a pig. Strange how you whinge about others insulting your “country” and then proceed to insult. By the way, what shade do you prefer? Eye shadow?
@26. You have a problem with the truth?
@33. What you're saying is that you're living 24, or more, years ago. When you were 10! Time to grow up!
Conqueror,
Sep 01st, 2014 - 11:24 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“Scotch” is a drink.
And the next time you start whining about the Scottish, just remember the Scots Guards on Tumbledown, OK?
@38
Sep 01st, 2014 - 11:40 pm - Link - Report abuse 0There were other nationalities you know, remember them too, pity they didn't let the Gurkhas at them Argies.My Uncle in ww2 served with them, they would approach unseen and tell by the way your bootlaces were fastened whether you were friend or foe.
........................Say all you like...it's not your call.................
Sep 01st, 2014 - 11:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0...I've got my polling card.....;-)))
Will you, won't you, will you, won't you, will you join the dance?
Will you, won't you, will you, won't you, won't you join the dance?
@39
Sep 02nd, 2014 - 12:31 am - Link - Report abuse 0My old man had friends who served with the gerkhas during the Korean War with the same story... They would feel for the way your shoe laces were tied up.. One way.... Cheeky firecracker in the fire....other way. Kukri across the throat....
Later on when they met up in Hong Kong they would get pissed and the gerkhas would do the same stunt (tieing their shoelaces this time) to unknowing peeps in the bar....... And they would all watch them fall over!
God bless all
l have nothing but praise & admiration for the Gurkhas.
Sep 02nd, 2014 - 09:31 am - Link - Report abuse 0To me they have been perfect gentlemen.
l would trust them with my life.
this is what the indians and nepali think about your beloved gurkhas:
Sep 02nd, 2014 - 12:18 pm - Link - Report abuse 0”If it was not for the english bootlicking slavish sikhs and gurkhas, the british would have been driven out of india. In the war of 1857, the sikhs and gurkhas(the little people) served as as front line troops of the British and attacked of our own people who were trying to put an end to british empire in India. These rascals died for england killing their own countrymen.
Even today ones sees the so many sikhs settled in britian. I guess the british paid the bootlickers by allowing them to settle in britian.
Then we have the foreign nepali gurkhas - with born servant mentality. still serving the british.
It had been the british policy to use native troops anaginst the natives and the sikhs and gurkhas are the prime examples of that. ”
Of course Cameron is nervous -
Sep 02nd, 2014 - 01:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0he doesn't want to go down in history as the man who presided over the destruction of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland.
Because that is what a Yes vote means -
the UK is sleepwalking to its own destruction at the hands of the men and women presently abiding in Scotland - oh, and their children that the Scots have allowed to vote for/against this destruction of nations.
“Gentlemen, we have placed the future of these great nations in the hands of children!”
“May God forgive us all”
@43
Sep 02nd, 2014 - 03:02 pm - Link - Report abuse 0And that really irks you that people from different cultures still buy into that way of thinking....the heretics.....the heathens....the fools!
Tell me what way should they think?
Btw the price we paid was being a tolerant society not a racist one which you eschew...it's what we fought wars for....but you wouldn't really know that now would you?
How is uncle eichmann?
And also I would love you to say that to a Gurkha to his face.....
43,
Sep 02nd, 2014 - 06:32 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Yet perfectly ok for you argies to try and enslave the islanders,
pot-kettle-black.
@ 33 Frankdrebin
Sep 02nd, 2014 - 07:31 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“I'm not a moaner Chris and I'm merely stating fact that “we people” (northerners) dislike the Tories for the reasons I stated in post 12”
I answered your points with my post @ 19.
As for support to my post I refer you to posts @ 31 brucey-babe; @ 34 Monkeymagic; @ 37 Conqueror
Finally, it is not a North versus South slagging match but more like “Welcome to the Reality History Channel” for you.
I am 68 and have a good knowledge of politics that happened in the 1700’s up to today, so your age is no excuse for knowing the truth about Wilson.
@43 paulcedron,
Sep 02nd, 2014 - 08:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0That would be just someone's opinion.
Probably yours too.
As Ekeko in post #45 says,
l would love for you to say what you said to a Gurkha's face.
l too, would love to be there when you said that.
You wouldn't live long(& it would be entertaining!).
Jealous, resentful little microbe, aren't you?
As [43] is a lone voice amongst 6 billion plus opinions it is irrelevant
Sep 03rd, 2014 - 10:56 am - Link - Report abuse 0but one tends to suspect that if 43 knew a Ghurkha was in the vicinity ,, he would wound not be...lol
I would be very surprised if the undecided voted for independence. Human nature is to avoid change and they need a very big swing in what has been pretty consistent polling to get to a Yes vote.
Sep 03rd, 2014 - 11:10 am - Link - Report abuse 0I do find it fascinating, it is like liberal CA trying to break away from the USA and thinking they can afford to keep up everything without the whole country pouring $ into its coffers. Most people in the USA would wish them a fond farewell and sadly watch it all fall apart. They wouldn't be let back in either.
Silly pipe dreams, progressives never learn.
Many people have many opinions,
Sep 03rd, 2014 - 11:21 am - Link - Report abuse 0the argies on here are using the Scottish question more and more to avoid and distract us,
or just to change the subject,
ignore them , the referendum will decide
It's a bit like the central states of the USA opted for independence.
Sep 03rd, 2014 - 08:29 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The USA ceases to exist.
I recollect that the southern states opted to be independent - this led to a civil war.
These is no desire of the English to wage a war with Scotland simply in order to protect and defend their united kingdom.
But there seems to be a deep and unspoken silence by the Scottish that their vote will destroy not only Great Britain but also the United Kingdom.
Do the Scots realise that their decision will have such massive impact on ALL parts of the United Kingdom - all our nations are seriously damaged, not just Scotland.
Their decision - if Yes - could destroy the strength of Scotland, N. Ireland, Wales, IoM, the Orkneys, the Shetlands, even the Channel Isles!
Their decision - if Yes - could destroy Scotland, N. Ireland, Wales, IoM, the Orkneys, the Shetlands, even the Channel Isles!
They debate with that old Labour prat - but do those debating even try to look at this larger picture? Not one bit!
No they are willing to destroy that which took a thousand years to create.
And they let their children decide to do the destruction.
These under-age Scots will do more damage to the United Kingdom that the whole of the world of Islam and the Muslim extremists could ever do.
And we are watching - mesmerised, like rabbits in the headlights - whilst it happens.
Agreed.
Sep 04th, 2014 - 09:48 am - Link - Report abuse 0Better together .
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