MercoPress. South Atlantic News Agency
Royal Navy invests £348 million in three new offshore patrol vessels
Steel was cut this week for the first of three new Royal Navy offshore patrol vessels (OPVs) at a ceremony in Glasgow. The vessels, which will be used by the Royal Navy to undertake various tasks in support of UK interests both at home and abroad, will be built at BAE Systems’ shipyards under a £348 million contract that has protected more than 800 Scottish jobs. Read full article
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Disclaimer & comment rulesNot totally correct article- 1st in the Class was HMS Clyde - current Falklands Patrol vessel. these are really Mark 2 more advanced vessels of same class.
Oct 13th, 2014 - 09:39 am - Link - Report abuse 0Being built to keep the yards ticking over till the type 26 contract starts finally somebody is learning if you want skills like sub or ship building not to vanish you actually need to build things.
Oct 13th, 2014 - 09:55 am - Link - Report abuse 0@1. Sorry. These vessels will be the Forth subgroup. Longer. But, like Clyde, they are undergunned. Where is the 'proper' gun? 30mm cannon? There should be FOUR of those. Where are the missile systems? Where are the torpedo tubes? Where is the equipment for depth bombs? What about minelaying? Why will there only be three? The Gibraltar Squadron alone needs FOUR.
Oct 13th, 2014 - 11:09 am - Link - Report abuse 0I am not sure that 4 of these could maneuvre safely at the same time, at speed in the confined space of Gib territorial waters, there is not a huge area to patrol.
Oct 13th, 2014 - 11:59 am - Link - Report abuse 0So these vessels are the same size as most of the vessels in the Argentine fleet with the small advantage that their systems work and they don't sink in rough seas / calm seas / harbour / tied up at the dock*
* delete as appropriate depending on your confidence in the Argentine Armada.
No point in having any weapons at all on the Gibraltar based ships. The UK got has made it clear that Spain can do whatever it likes and they still won't be fired.
Oct 13th, 2014 - 12:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 0#3 it's a patrol boat not a combat vessel If you were going to arm it seriously I presume you'd want a serious sensor fit then your looking at half a billion pounds a hull which is what the type26 frigates are priced at.
Oct 13th, 2014 - 12:45 pm - Link - Report abuse 0These are meant to Bob about doing bread and butter naval work the 30mm is their to persuade the dim that it's time to give up etc not fight warships with.
3 - Conq - thanks update, I was not sure if there had been other similar build after Clyde already. Agree with 6 - they are patrol ships - a prescence, with lots of comms onboard, ability to carry and insert Commandos etc, and dissuade pirates-light attack craft etc.
Oct 13th, 2014 - 01:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0They are not meant to stand in the battle line as such.
Have any of you guys come across the plan for a fleet of smaller vessels (“Black Swan class sloop-of-war”)? Basically cheap customisable (for different missions) OPVs.
Oct 13th, 2014 - 01:56 pm - Link - Report abuse 0One alone would be vulnerable, but a constellation of 4 (each with different capabilities) would make a formidable system.
I think that the RN's problem is not so much the lack of ships but the difficulty in attracting recruits. The Army and RAF seem to be OK but the number for the Navy has fallen. It is a bit of problem attracting youngsters for a long term career when they see arbitrary staff cuts for serving personnel. who thought they had a long term career only to be told thanks but get out..
Oct 13th, 2014 - 02:18 pm - Link - Report abuse 0#9
Oct 13th, 2014 - 03:04 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Interesting... I must admit my cousin is currently looking to leave the RN after 10 years service. I've also just interviewed a young man who is currently in the RN looking to leave to undertake a Physics degree.
@6. Yeah? And where is the backup combat vessel? Why don't you compare with a WW2 motor torpedo boat? Vosper Type IIs. 22 metres, 40 knots, 49 tons, 2 18 inch torpedoes, 57mm main gun, 20mm Oerlikon, 2x.303 machine guns. These should be combat/patrol vessels. Enough firepower to discourage a frigate. Might not be enough to defeat one. But what if FOUR upgraded patrol boats attacked?
Oct 13th, 2014 - 03:55 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@10. Interesting. Is your cousin looking to leave the RN because the faggots in Westminster won't let the RN destroy the enemy?
This contract should have been awarded to Portsmouth, we should not be putting all our eggs, skills, expertise and money in one basket, we may in time regret it.
Oct 13th, 2014 - 04:24 pm - Link - Report abuse 0What you mean is that ALL the vessels should be built in Portsmouth, which, in effect is putting all your eggs in one basket which is OK as long as it is an English one.
Oct 13th, 2014 - 05:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Why don't you at least have the guts to change your name to Englishworker.
I could at least respect you for stating your opinions in a believable context instead of using the prefix Brit. when you obviously mean English.
Sunday, October 12, 2014
Oct 13th, 2014 - 07:07 pm - Link - Report abuse 0OPVs that come with lots of questions - UPDATED
http://ukarmedforcescommentary.blogspot.co.uk/
340 million seems rather a lot for a less protected ship,
Read this interesting article.
[ come gentlemen]
all eggs in one basket, until some twit steps into the basket and wahey
no ship building..?????
I agree with Clyde. All the skills and expertise are up in Scotland, not in Portsmouth.
Oct 13th, 2014 - 09:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0However, I do believe that the shipyards in Newcastle should be reopened and the government should spread the building of these vessels around. This would have the impact of producing the required number of vessels in half the time.
I don't believe that Portsmouth would be a good option. Newcastle and Scottish ship yards are relatively close and could share/swap work and workers as required.
Of course it would require either someone from the Scottish site to train the Newcastle workers, or for the Newcastle workers to go to Scotland for a while, to relearn the trade, but it is an idea that would work.
However, financially I don't believe that the government (regardless of what party they represent), would be willing to invest the money to get a second shipyard going.
So, in the interest of keeping the nation safe, then Scotland, with all its expertise, will keep producing the ships.
Its just common sense.
The referendum is OVER. Bae have said that their preferred site is the Clyde for building the RN vessels..as a COMMERCIAL decision. If it was “government led” and they had preferred Portsmouth, then what is there to stop them from changing their mind and investing in that location ?
Oct 14th, 2014 - 09:04 am - Link - Report abuse 0Job losses are hard to take especially when it means the end of an historic industry but there is not enough work to go around. The Govan yard is due for closure with the loss of jobs.
Rebuilding the Tyneside yards would cost a fortune and add considerably to the unit costs of the patrol vessels and the proposed new frigates. It all comes down to costs and affordability. We can't turn the clock back to the days when the RN ruled the waves. The British economy cannot afford a large navy to patrol our interests overseas and protect our colonies. We have to prioritise the threats to our country and establish forces to counter them. Apart from the Falklands and possibly Gibraltar, defence action would be actioned inside an alliance such as NATO.
Black swan went bye bye very silly idea and the yanks followed that idea and ended up with the hideous littoral combat ship or little crappy ship which is not very little but is seriously crap.
Oct 14th, 2014 - 10:33 am - Link - Report abuse 0The answer too small boats is not another small boat it is a helicopter with missiles as figured out by the RN in the 50s and proved by them in the first gulf war with the destruction of the Iraqi navy such as it was by Royal Navy lynxes.
The ship can operate a helicopter which if you feeling exceptionally anti social could be an army Apache as they are all maranised with folding blades etc etc.
That will destroy anything with 200 miles of the ship
With stablished 30 mm chain gun hellfire missiles rockets and a radar system
16
Oct 14th, 2014 - 01:35 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Just to pull you up on a few points. It wasn't the English that wanted this Union destroyed, it was the Scots. I would still have been British should you have broken away, Britain would have carried on quite happily without you, so my profile name will stay the same thank you.
Your fishy duo in charge up there do not by any means think this referendum is over. They a mixing the bottle already. The problem is that the Labour Party still want their Scottish MP's to vote on English only matters because they would lose voting power in England, that is utterly unnacceptable to me and most people in England who will be voting for UKIP in our masses next year. Therefore when your extra devolved powers are voted on in the house of commons over the next few weeks, they are likely to get blocked if the west Lothian question is not once and for all resolved.
Sturgeon has already said if this the case she will push for another referendum. Also if the English vote to leave the EU she said she will push for another referendum, so I'm sorry, the matter is anything but over.
We all know why Portsmouth was closed in the run up to the referendum, it was to secure the votes of the Scottish ship builders who's future was secured as the sole British shipyard - that was a mistake!
try to invest those 348 million pounds to help the 13 million brits who live under the poverty line, you imbeciles.
Oct 14th, 2014 - 04:51 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@19, last year the British government spent £338B on healthcare and social welfare (that's approximately HALF of the annual budget, as compared to the 4.8% we spent on defence).
Oct 14th, 2014 - 05:34 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I'd suggest getting a sense of financial perspective, but looking at the state of the argie economy i'd say that is probably a non-starter.
#19
Oct 14th, 2014 - 05:38 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Conversely, if the Clyde yards were closed in favour of Portsmouth then that would have been seen as a political decision to placate English voters. You obviously have special insight to cabinet papers and a mole in Bae.
As to the West Lothian question, nobody in Scotland would object to English MP's only voting on constituency matters that affect England only. The SNP don't vote on English matters in Parliament. You will also have to ban Welsh and N.Ireland MP's
However,“ English” matters have ramifications for the rest of the UK.
Have a read at another point of view.
theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/sep/24/english-votes-english-laws-absurdity-separatist
As to UKIP voting to leave the EU,t overseas investment came to the UK BECAUSE we were in the EU. Pull out and the same line you were preaching to the Scots, that all the money and jobs will be transferred to England could be visited on YOU as companies relocated to Europe.
#19
Paul, when your country can pay it's debts and sort out it's nepotism and corruption. come back and we may listen to your siren call....until then go and do something useful such as playing with your yoyo.
grandpa clyde
Oct 14th, 2014 - 05:45 pm - Link - Report abuse 0and when the uk pays its huge debt with argentina (3.5 billion dollars of...1945) you can also come back and we may listen to your siren call.
In reality
Oct 14th, 2014 - 05:56 pm - Link - Report abuse 0the government should invest billions in totally re-building the shipyards [5] at least,
with the most up to date robotic advance technical electrics etc etc that it can, to make British ship building the best in the world and perhaps more competitive,
in Fact, because we give billions to aid , billions to the EU , and everything else FREE to whom wants it, we cant afford to invest in British industry..
just my opinion.
Infant Paul. What 3.5 million of debt. How about Argentina recompensing the UK govt. for the destruction it caused when it started the Falkland's war.
Oct 14th, 2014 - 06:13 pm - Link - Report abuse 0We let you off very lightly.
And compensation to the 60 million British people that had hurt feelings brought on by argy dictators.
Oct 14th, 2014 - 06:20 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@21
Oct 14th, 2014 - 07:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You seem to be bought into the idea completely that Scotland should get to have absolutely everything it wants, but the English should settle for a lot less because it's much fairer that way.
Well I don't, it's not democratic and 55 million English voters are not going to tolerate it. You are asking me to read a Labour party newspaper that doesn't like the idea of 41 labour MP's in Scotland not being able to vote on solely English matters, well what a surprise that is, do you have any more radically obvious news clippings on the issue?
The Heywood and Middleton by-election should give you the temperature of English feelings currently in Manchester where I am from, a solid labour seat as near as dammit lost, that is absolutely unheard of in a deprived area of Manchester, it's astonishing in fact.
I actually never advocated closure of the Scottish shipyards, the conservative party did if you voted for independence “British ships are only built in Britain”, I seem to remember being said. That aside, I don't see why we couldn't have kept a smaller viable shipyard in Portsmouth or Newcastle or even Liverpool, this smaller contract could have been fulfilled in a smaller English shipyard, it seems illogical to me to keep investing heavily and building ships in a country that within 10-15 years will probably leave this union if the leaders of the Scottish Parliament are to be believed.
You seem to be bought into the idea that only England matters in the great scheme of things and should get what they want and sod the rest..
Oct 15th, 2014 - 08:50 am - Link - Report abuse 0So now you blame the Scots for what “ English” labour MP's are doing ?
How convenient to find a scapegoat in Scotland !
This is a pointless argument. You have a point of view that will only accept figures that reinforce your prejudices which are now almost based on a racial level. I probably have equal prejudices although I don't vilify the English people as a whole ...some segments yes.
As for deprived areas, on the BBC news this morning, Glasgow came out as the most deprived place in Britain with 20% of the population below the poverty level. Even people in employment were having to apply for food parcels because of poverty wages..
All this in a Parliament dominated by English MP's doing a wonderful job with the economy.
What you say about more shipbuilding capacity is probably correct but financially not viable. Under Tory rules, the work will be given to whichever place can build the cheapest. Building 3 ships in three different yards would add to the costs. Look how they gave the contracts for 4 RFA Tankers to S.Korea. These could have been built in the UK BUT they went to the cheapest bidder. No UK yard could compete with the price.
No UK yard even bid for the contracts.
Oct 15th, 2014 - 10:26 am - Link - Report abuse 0The yards are full and the money is in system integration not cutting steel.
The Danes actually had the steel hulls of their latest warships built in Lithuania and saved them about a third and had the highly skilled stuff done at home.
340 od million is still to much to pay,
Oct 15th, 2014 - 01:11 pm - Link - Report abuse 0how much did brazil pay for hers
@27
Oct 15th, 2014 - 08:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Ahh, the preserve of the far left, when all else fails call em racist, that will shut them up. I can understand that this may be topical way of doing things where you are from, but the rest of the country has moved on.
By the way, it wasn't me voting for a Nationalist state!
#30
Oct 15th, 2014 - 10:41 pm - Link - Report abuse 0And if you bothered to look you would have seen that 55% ALSO did not vote for a nationalist state.
Ah the province of the far right,if you disagree call them racist.
Tonight a Tory Lord says that disabled people should be given work but paid £2.0 an hour. This is the kind of people you are holding up as the future of England. Good luck to you. They will have children sweeping chimneys and 12 year olds working in the mills.
You probably have moved on. Immigrant workers are taking English jobs, it's all the fault of the EU
In most of the posts you have made, you continually chip in racist remarks about ALL SCOTS.
It's so ingrained in your psyche that you probably don't even notice that you are doing it.
#29 it's the cost of keeping the yard open to the type 26 is needed so the opv's are essentially free the cash was going to be spent anyway or there would be no warship producing facility left in the UK.
Oct 16th, 2014 - 10:46 am - Link - Report abuse 0Politics again,
Oct 16th, 2014 - 12:20 pm - Link - Report abuse 0they have a lot to answer for..
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