MercoPress. South Atlantic News Agency
Plaque dedicated to English soldiers in Cartagena triggers strong controversy
A Colombian engineer smashed a plaque commemorating the death in 1741 of thousands of English soldiers in the coastal city of Cartagena just days after it was inaugurated by Prince Charles, said the mayor of the city who has now ordered its removal. Read full article
Comments
Disclaimer & comment rulesPerhaps if 'Hispanic America' had 'fallen into the hands of the British Empire' in 1741 its long term prospects might have been considerably improved?
Nov 09th, 2014 - 10:43 am - Link - Report abuse 0Ask Australia or Canada, for example.
PS: Cartagena is one of my favourite places.
Respect for Jaime Rendón & Dionisio Trujillo's acts....
Nov 09th, 2014 - 11:41 am - Link - Report abuse 0Very surprised that Prince Charles let himself be involved in such a pathetic gaffe...
He's better than that....
Respect for the Mayor for listening to the people, yes.
Nov 09th, 2014 - 12:27 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Good chap.
Respect for an act of violence to an inanimate object by Jaime? Laughable! What an attention seeking knob.
Immediate result of jaime Rendon's action....
Nov 09th, 2014 - 12:30 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The Engrish Pirate plaque is gone, gone, gone...
http://www.eluniversal.com.co/sites/default/files/styles/610x400/public/201411/placa_a_los_ingleses2.jpg?itok=8v6yR8aX
Yes. Because no one wants a vandalised plaque do they? Kind of gives the wrong impression. The tourists might think the locals are thugs.
Nov 09th, 2014 - 12:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0On today of all days - 9/11
Nov 09th, 2014 - 12:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0A replacement plaque will be quietly erected in a less public place.
This is the English way.
“Perhaps if 'Hispanic America' had 'fallen into the hands of the British Empire' in 1741 its long term prospects might have been considerably improved?
Nov 09th, 2014 - 01:11 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Ask Australia or Canada, for example. ”
...says the typical ignorant islander...
ask tanganyka, uganda, gambia, zimbabwe, jamaica and the list goes on, for example
(6) GeoffWard
Nov 09th, 2014 - 01:14 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Probably...
But not in Colombia...
Try Westminster, Old Grog...
Wow, 1741! And guess what, Jaime Rendón & Dionisio Trujillo etc are still playing the victim game! Too funny.
Nov 09th, 2014 - 01:42 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@7
But why on earth do so many of Argentines whine and cry about actually WINNING the supposed 'glorious victory' against the pirate empire in ~1806 and its consequences. Explain that to me?
You're like the monkeys in that Jungle Book song and dance scene: ' We wanna be like you oo oo, oobee do'. Alas, you weren't cut out to be a Canada, Australia etc, just doomed to be a bitter, envious, impotent nation addicted to banana politics with matching institutions; having the exact opposite 400miles away as a reminder of what not, must get right up your nose.
What I dont like about Mercopress is how they depend so much on extending and capitalizing on anglo-hispanic rivalry about pretty much non stories.
Nov 09th, 2014 - 01:50 pm - Link - Report abuse 0*1 perhaps if latin America had fallen into British hands..there would not be any
Nov 09th, 2014 - 01:57 pm - Link - Report abuse 0native Americans...
ask the native Canadians, Australians or Americans.
Just like to point out that this was designed and constructed by Colombians to honour the British who died in battle. They asked a visiting British dignitary to unveil it for them. Turns out some of the locals didn't like the text. Some idiot 'barbarian' ( ref: article) then decided to attack it with a hammer.
Nov 09th, 2014 - 02:02 pm - Link - Report abuse 0It is not an 'English' plaque. It is a Colombian plaque and the dispute is amongst Colombians. The local Mayor is trying to keep the peace.
11.That is just bullocks, that latin america is more brown than North America is due to the spaniards raping the hell out of indian women, that is all the difference to it.
Nov 09th, 2014 - 02:07 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I think the Americas would have being more interesting and healthy if other nations like the Netherlands, France, North Italy, Sweden and others would have established bigger colonies instead of the basically two large empires dividing the continent among each other.
well the good thing is that Plaque has been removed and a mistake like this should not be repeated. Heads should roll in the Cartagena Historical Society.
Nov 09th, 2014 - 02:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0and the so called -Barbarian- should be decorated in some way...as he is a true
Colombian hero and not this fool of mayor......VIVA COLOMBIA!!!!!!!!!
Interesting then that they have a statue to honour a prior Spanish Colonial Overlord, Blas de Lezo, in the same part of town. His local nickname is Old Pegleg.
Nov 09th, 2014 - 02:25 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Wonder what El Gran Libertador Bolivar would have made of it all?
Blas De Lezo is in every Colombian heart, Blacho, as he is known is Cartagena, Colombia. The hero that stopped the biggest ever British fleet assembled and won.....VIVA COLOMBIA...!!! and VIVA BLAS DEL LEZO..
Nov 09th, 2014 - 03:20 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Don't be silly, Think.
Nov 09th, 2014 - 03:32 pm - Link - Report abuse 0A royal visit determines many things. It does not allow for disrespect.
By supporting this vandalistic envy-driven act of vandalism, Senor Sthink and his bitter, envy-driven camaradas have shown they are no better than the Iraqi and Libyan gangsters who have desecrated British & Commonwealth war memorials in those god-forsaken countries. As the saying goes “people deserve the governments they get”. However Sr Stink has cleverly abandoned his broken-down Argentina in order to live as a bitter, envy-driven parasite amongst people he despises.
Nov 09th, 2014 - 04:31 pm - Link - Report abuse 0(17) GeoffWard
Nov 09th, 2014 - 04:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You say...:
“A royal visit determines many things. It does not allow for disrespect.”
That's exactly what I'm saying, lad...
That plaque is gone? good. I am sure the English would've claim Cartagena in a few years because of a plaque that they left somewhere there long ago.
Nov 09th, 2014 - 05:32 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Can they get rid of the English Ilsen too?
This event considerably predates the eventual liberation of Colombia and other S. American countries from Spanish rule and, no doubt, the British had their own self interests at heart when they attacked Cartagena in 1741 BUT subsequently the great liberator (Simon Bolivar) was more than happy to receive help from British mercenary soldiers in the overthrow of the Spanish colonial masters. In fact at one point there was even discussion of inviting a member of the British Royal family to become the titular head of Gran Colombia. Many of the early S. American liberation heroes spent time in London and Paris observing how parliamentary democracies worked with the view of introducing such systems into the newly liberated S. American continent. Unfortunately it was such a foreign concept to most of the people wielding power in S. America that, even to this day, you feel that it is not the natural state of affairs for many S. American countries.
Nov 09th, 2014 - 05:48 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I seem to remember an awful lot of huffing and puffing when a pane of glass or something got broken in the Argentine cemetery at Darwin. I believe in fact the cries went all way to the the Secretary General of the United Nations. But I am sure he'll be left alone to deal with important matters this time.
Nov 09th, 2014 - 06:00 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Geeeeeee.......
Nov 09th, 2014 - 06:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0In my time the Aides de Camp, Adjutants and Assistants provided to the Royals by the Foreign & Colonial Office were highly intelligent, cunning & haughty individuals...
It seems only “haughty” is left....
That's curious. Pretty much the same used to be said of the Argentine diplomatic service. If that's true, there must be plenty shaking of heads, rending of garments, and gnashing of teeth going on in there these days.
Nov 09th, 2014 - 06:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@ 20 Marcos
Nov 09th, 2014 - 07:02 pm - Link - Report abuse 0READ the article - “it was the idea of Cartagena's Corporacion Centro Historico historical society”.
So obviously very much NOT an English plaque. So you don't have to be frightened that the English will return to claim it one day.
hahahahahaa!
The Colombians won't be getting rid of me either. I always get a very warm welcome when I visit my lovely friends in Santa Marta.
oh, and the plaque will be returning when they have changed the text....
:-)
@21 Devonian
- very good post.
It often amazes me that posters like Marcos have very little idea of their own history. Then you have goons like FakeAussie shouting Viva Colombia from the sidelines, but is he rooting for the Mayor and the Corporacion Centro Historico, or the vandal he idolises?
It's a local dispute, the fool. They are all Colombians.
“A barbarian smashed it to pieces,” said de la Vega. “
Nov 09th, 2014 - 07:30 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“The important thing is to ... show the world that here, Hispanic America did not fall into the hands of the English empire he said.
Instead we fell to the glorious Spanish,
AND NOW LOOK AT US,
still, the expert historian at work.. lol
What can one say about governing LATAM?
Nov 09th, 2014 - 07:45 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Waste of time?
They can’t grasp parliamentary democracy?
They need failures from 200 years ago or more to salve their consciences for their failures of the present?
They can only see the present time with no concept of the future, never mind planning for it?
As for their memory of Bolivar it seems risible in the extreme, it only proves him correct when he said:
We have been ruled more by deceit than by force, and we have been degraded more by vice than by superstition. Slavery is the daughter of darkness: an ignorant people is a blind instrument of its own destruction. Ambition and intrigue abuses the credulity and experience of men lacking all political, economic, and civic knowledge; they adopt pure illusion as reality; they take license for liberty, treachery for patriotism, and vengeance for justice. If a people, perverted by their training, succeed in achieving their liberty, they will soon lose it, for it would be of no avail to endeavour to explain to them that happiness consists in the practice of virtue; that the rule of law is more powerful than the rule of tyrants, because, as the laws are more inflexible, everyone should submit to their beneficent austerity; that proper morals, and not force, are the bases of law; and that to practice justice is to practice liberty.
[Simon Bolivar: The Angostura Address (1819)]
Too much like the truth, even nowadays for many of the countries that make up LATAM.
Spanish descendants, on a different continent to their homeland, still having issues with what happened 270+ years ago? Move on mate.
Nov 09th, 2014 - 07:48 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Knocking down or moving statues of Christopher Columbus and his like, won't and never will rewrite history. It's just deluded thinking.
I've not been to Cartagena, hear its a nice place; first time I go, I'll be sure to pay my respects to all those poor indigenous peoples; wiped out, disposed, robbed and slaughted by all those pirate Conquistadors many years ago...Have they got a plaque?
26 Briton
Nov 09th, 2014 - 08:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“Sabas Pretelt de la Vega from the Corporacion Centro Historico said the plaque was intended to offer the English a tribute to their soldiers' lost lives in the battle...”
I think he sounds a decent enough fellow. What is amusing is that all the usual trolls come bouncing on here without actually reading the article and try to turn it into something other than a little local dispute.
Soon proved wrong and left with egg on their little hairy troll snouts.
27 ChrisR (#) What can one say about governing LATAM?
To return to Bolivar, one of his most famous quotes was from his deathbed “ to govern Latin America is to plough the sea”.
I may have paraphrased slightly there, but you get the idea.
(28) FI_Frost
Nov 09th, 2014 - 08:17 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You say...:
“ I'll be sure to pay my respects to all those poor indigenous peoples; wiped out, disposed, robbed and slaughted by all those pirate Conquistadors many years ago...Have they got a plaque?”
I say,...:
No need to travel so far...
You could start paying your respects to the hundreds of indigenous Yahgans; kidnapped, enslaved, deculturalized and left to die a miserable death in Keppel Island by those Anglo Pirates of Christ years ago...
Have they got a plaque?
No need... Their bones stick out of the sands and bogs of that Island...
off topic!
Nov 09th, 2014 - 08:20 pm - Link - Report abuse 0boo! hiss!
The Colombians placed a plaque and the Colombians removed a plaque.
Nov 09th, 2014 - 08:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Until Argentina, Colombia isn't trying to rewrite history.
And unlike Sunshine with his insincere VIVA COLOMBIA, I've actually been to Castillo San Felipe de Barajas. And I'm sure I'll see the new plaque when I get back there in July 2017 for the Los Andes taller I'll be attending.
Funny thing is, this is such a non-story that not even my Colombian flatmates knew about it.
Think - agree what the “Christian Missionaries” of the 1800s tried to do on Keppel is was pretty unchristian in our world as we see life today - BUT -at least they did not rampage about the Indian lands ethnically cleansing them as many Conquistadores did and your own Argentines did in southern Argentina a mere 150 years ago.
Nov 09th, 2014 - 08:41 pm - Link - Report abuse 0By the way, no bones sticking out of the ground on Keppel - those that died there then would have been given a decent burial.
@22
Nov 09th, 2014 - 08:42 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Your point is excellent, and the differences between the two “cultures”.
The Falklands war is within living memory. The deaths caused by the Argentine barbarism is still felt by mothers, fathers, sisters, brothers, wives, husbands and children....yet, the islanders allow respect for the Argentine dead. They allow a cemetery on their islands, they allow Argentines to visit to pay their respects to their loved ones, they even turn the other cheek when the Argentines use this grace to pull off cheap political stunts, and tell obscene lies to anyone who will listen....all this in the face of the Argentines still persisting with this ridiculous Malvinas myth.
Nobody alive remembers the Battle of Cartagena, it is resigned to history, and the fallen on both sides deserve respect. But how do our Latin friends react.....vandalism and disrespect. We should expect nothing different. Their inferiority complex is extraordinary. It flows from Think with every post he makes.
A bitter whining inferiority, a mock fury at any imagined slight even 300 years or more ago, and a blindness to his own and his adopted nations dishonour today.
Pathetic...
The islanders show a class the Latin nations seem not to have, whod blame them for not wanting to be governed by them.
Let us not forget that Colombia once belonged to the union of four countries:
Nov 09th, 2014 - 08:57 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Colombia/Venezuela/Panama and Ecuador.
Panama broke away with the help of The USA when the USA wanted to build the Panama Canal and Gran Colombia did not...... A half a century of USA intervention to weaken a South America and keep it under its boot.........
no wonder the South American leaders are welcoming Chinese and Russian delegations with open arms........
29
Nov 09th, 2014 - 08:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0agreed
34 Monkeymagic
Nov 09th, 2014 - 09:00 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Whilst I agree with most of what you posted above, especially with regard to the dignity and grace shown by the Falkland Islanders, I do think it is a little strong to tar all “our Latin friends ” with the same brush.
So I will repeat what I said earlier to Briton;
“Sabas Pretelt de la Vega from the Corporacion Centro Historico said the plaque was intended to offer the English a tribute to their soldiers' lost lives in the battle...”
I think he sounds a decent enough fellow.
He also disowned the stupid vandal by declaring him a 'barbarian'.
Equally, I do feel very strongly that anyone, anywher, who desecreates memorials to any war-dead should face castigation and penalties.
No offence, mind!
TWIMC
Nov 09th, 2014 - 09:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Some Anglo Turnips calling this renewed Engrish defeat in Cartagena for a “Non-Story”, I can see.....
....Just like King George II... that tried to airbrush the biggest naval defeat the World had seen (Admiral Vernon's fleet was bigger than the Spanish Armada!) from Engrish history...
He even ordered all the coined “Victory Medals” to be destroyed...
He didn't succeed there either...
Look carefully at this beauty and tell me what's wrong with it, long term brainwashed Anglo Turnips...:
http://media.liveauctiongroup.net/i/10597/11265394_1.jpg?v=8CE5DF87A2164A0
Chuckle chuckle
(33) Islander1
Them bones were sticking out in the sixties....
Have any of you Kelpers been there since and buried them?
38 HAHAHA!! Good one, mate!! One of the most important chapters in British
Nov 09th, 2014 - 09:20 pm - Link - Report abuse 0history and here we have Monkey magic speaking from his behind...hahahaha
and we have Anglotino stating that ¨his Colombian flatmates have not heard
about the news..hahaha. these Colombian flatmates remind me of the imaginary friend of Klaris Cliff in the book who framed klaris cliff.hahaha
Anglotino introduce us to your imaginary Colombian flatmates...hahahahah
Those spanish conquistadors topped the table when it came to barbaric murdering of native populations .... statues of them everywhere ... a nice big one of hernandes in cartegana the city's founder who made his fortune inca grave robbing
Nov 09th, 2014 - 09:36 pm - Link - Report abuse 0uneducated fools they only wanted to commemorate the fallen in a lost battle ... being humble can b respectful
@38 A 'renewed English defeat' ? Don't be so ridiculous man.
Nov 09th, 2014 - 09:37 pm - Link - Report abuse 0READ the article - “it was the idea of Cartagena's Corporacion Centro Historico historical society”. The Colombians placed a plaque and the Colombians removed a plaque. They asked HRH Prince Charles if he would do them the honour of unveiling it. Which he did. Then some local vandal hit it with a hammer. The twat.
Now they are going to put in a new plaque.
All this shows is that you really need to get a Grip(en), if the UK allows it!
http://www.defensenews.com/article/20141108/DEFREG05/311080014/
(*hat-tip to Briton who originally posted the link elsewhere)
Well, you do enjoy a bit of 'whataboutery' don't you ?
haha!
never heard of ´hernandes´...but I have heard that the founder of Cartagena was DON PEDRO DE HEREDIA.......UMMMMMM
Nov 09th, 2014 - 10:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 0One is respectful when the plaque conmemorates ALL lives lost in battle..not only the English.
Maybe the historical centre in Buenos Aires should send a plaque to London conmemorating the Argentinians soldiers who lost their lives in the invasion of the Falklands/Malvinas..and place it near Nelson in Trafalgar square...
let´s see what the reaction would be of the Londoners!!!!!????
Seems that some people didn't think this through.
Nov 09th, 2014 - 10:13 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Wouldn't it have made more sense to commemorate both Spanish & British (or is it only English?) soldiers who died in this disorganised attempted invasion?
lt would be like the Russians putting up a plaque to all the brave German troops killed at Stalingrad.
lt was bound to cause controversy, and almost certain that some Colombian would deface it.
l can't imagine what the Historical Society was thinking.
Commemorate ALL soldiers killed or not at all.
btw- the Colombians have every right to be proud of their ancestors defence of their city.
Aussiesunshine
Nov 09th, 2014 - 10:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Seems like it is you who are talking out of your arse. London is full of memorials and plaques commemorating those who were considered “enemies” at the their time.
German, Japanese, Indian.....
The Falkands too...a large memorial of soldiers who were victims of Argentinas greed.
The British honour bravery of their enemy, and their were brave and honorable Argentines in 1982...just none of them were in government and none were senior offices.
Yourself and “think” are also without honour, or self-respect, which is a shame for you...and those who know you.
The knob-end with the hammer should be ashamed of himself.
Nov 09th, 2014 - 10:39 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Fake Aussie thinks he should get a medal.
Says a lot more about FakeAussie really.
1.
Nov 09th, 2014 - 10:53 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Even if they had taken the city, it would have benn just another Gibraltar enclave. The Spanish empire was vast and could call on large militias at any given moment. I don’t think Britain had the man power to conquer large portions of South America. They where never good at large continental warfare, but just at sea and low density warfare.
Imagine all, an exactly similar situation, the plaque of only argentinian soldiers, nmaed one by one, in a London city being honoured by our president and the mayor of the UK city and why not making also a visit to Fragata Libertad if it was posible to get the frigate there....
Nov 09th, 2014 - 11:12 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@47
Nov 09th, 2014 - 11:17 pm - Link - Report abuse 0What's the difference between 1741 and 1982?
we didnt invade england, 8000 km away from SAm, Arg tried to recuperate Malvinas, thats the difference.
Nov 09th, 2014 - 11:23 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Maybe it was the same chap who vandalised the little Argentinian dolly on the Falkland Islands? What's the matter with him?
Nov 09th, 2014 - 11:38 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@46
Nov 09th, 2014 - 11:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Interesting point you have there.
Cartegana would have made a very nice 'Gibraltar', which was probably the plan at the time. The English were more interested in strategy than 'land-grabs' when it came to South America. That is why the privateers were licenced by The Crown to raid all the Spanish ships bringing the Aztec and Inca gold back to Europe.
Which paid for the Navy, meaning further adventures in India, Hong Kong, Singapore, Austalia etc.
So, nice one, cheers!
51.
Nov 10th, 2014 - 02:15 am - Link - Report abuse 0I dont know how truth there is in that, ironically the gold was cursed.
American gold and plate is what bankrupted the Spanish Empire. Even when Cortez hammared the Aztecs, the richest country in the world was Venice/ Nothern Italy and hundred years later by the early seventeenth century the largest economy in the world was not Spain but the Ottoman Empire.
It was just the cause of massive inflation. Spanish Hapsburg output remained the same and they defaulted some time round after losing the Netherlands.
It makes me laugh when the latam sopha lefties who know f all about economic history like Eduardo Galleano blame Europe and say that their wealth is made o stolen gold.
42
Nov 10th, 2014 - 09:02 am - Link - Report abuse 0There is a well kept cemetery for the fallen argentines on the falkland islands .... plenty of landmines left behind also so people can't forget.
43
Are the colombians ancestors Spanish ?
@52
Nov 10th, 2014 - 09:19 am - Link - Report abuse 0Good point. Who would have believed, until Spain proved it, that it's possible to steal so much you impoverish yourself?
Hi, Hans.
Nov 10th, 2014 - 10:26 am - Link - Report abuse 0I learned about this in Exploitative Capitalism (101, I seem to remember)
- it's called Social Cost and Private Gain !
It's no zero sum game and there are many outcomes - frequently the Private Gainers are taken off the game board.
@49:
Nov 10th, 2014 - 10:31 am - Link - Report abuse 0“we didnt invade england, 8000 km away from SAm, Arg tried to recuperate Malvinas, thats the difference.”
No, you tried to invade and occupy British sovereign territory when it was clear a fair negotiation wouldn't favour you in the outcome.
That's the truth of what happened.
“Even if they had taken the city, it would have benn just another Gibraltar enclave.”
Nov 10th, 2014 - 10:51 am - Link - Report abuse 0What a shame for the poor Cartagenans that they didn't succeed. We would have the pleasure of watching today's Colombian government and the usual leftist rabble suspects at the UN's “de-colonisation committee” making periodic self-righteous proclamations that Cartagena should be returned to its “rightful owners”.
The Cartagenans would then hold a referendum in which 99.9% would vote to remain British.
The past is in the past,
Nov 10th, 2014 - 08:23 pm - Link - Report abuse 0south America is what it is, for what ever reason it is today,
now then, tomorrow is a different story ?
Idiots claiming that Argentina never tried to invade England. Spain was plotting to invade “England” for a long time and despite all the stolen gold from South America, you failed.
Nov 10th, 2014 - 08:50 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The Spain, France, USA alliance which included Buenos Aires lost massively despite the fact they out numbers the British alliance 2 to one.
The British alliance freed Holland, Northern Italy and Switzerland. We successfully defended Canada, Haiti, Britain and Germany from your attempts at imperial expansion. Your invasion forces never managed to reach Britain and your leader was left exiled and imprisoned.
Now don't you feel you should apologise for your attempt to conquer, enslave and oppress most of Europe and many other territories you imperialist lackeys of France and Spain (and USA).
Why should we ever give you back the gold you stole from the rightful inhabitants of South America and tried to use to enslave us.
@59 RICO,
Nov 10th, 2014 - 09:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I'm hearing ya.
Since the gold was stolen from the native peoples of the Americas, it was fair game for our Privateers(& Pirates, ! lol!) & we looted it.
l'm sure our Viking ancestors & the Aztec & lnca ghosts would have approved.
On their Armada there were more Priests than Gunners & in their cargo was enough ready made nooses to hang all the men & boys of England.
The women & girls were to be sold into slavery.
l have utterly NO SYMPATHY for the dead of the Spanish Armada.
They got what they deserved.
59.
Nov 11th, 2014 - 12:41 am - Link - Report abuse 0If there was a lackey of the Habsburgs was England & Poland. It was pretty much France, Nothern Germany, Netherlands and Sweden that bared the forefront of the whole of Europe. And you are ignoring the mastermind of Cardinal of Richelieu.
It was France after all that destroyed the cowardly Spaniards in Rocroi and ended the 30 year war.
Britain did f- all in continental Europe to fight the Habsburgs.
The English trying to invade another's LAND?
Nov 11th, 2014 - 01:50 am - Link - Report abuse 0Surely a case of mistaken identity. The English never have invaded anyone, according to them!
“You think I'm an ignorant savage
And you've been so many places
I guess it must be so
But still I cannot see
If the savage one is me
How can there be so much that you don't know?
You don't know
You think you own whatever land you land on
The earth is just a dead thing you can claim
But I know every rock and tree and creature
Has a life, has a spirit, has a name
You think the only people who are people
Are the people who look and think like you
But if you walk the footsteps of a stranger
You'll learn things you never knew, you never knew...”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4i0HDygKdLM
@63
Nov 11th, 2014 - 09:40 am - Link - Report abuse 0According to who, exactly?
Still, it's encouraging to see you're getting your history from Disney these days. That looks like a step up. Just be prepared for the shock when the dastardly Anglos shoot Bambi's mother.
Would the British build a monument to the Luftwaffe pilots who bombed countless civilians during the Battle of Britain?
Nov 11th, 2014 - 10:28 am - Link - Report abuse 0@64
Nov 11th, 2014 - 11:29 am - Link - Report abuse 0No. But ask again in about 300 years.
People seemed to be losing sight of the fact that this plaque was meant to be a gesture of friendship and respect from the local people to the British.
Nov 11th, 2014 - 02:53 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Unfortunately one of these locals found it so unacceptable that he felt the need to hammer it a few times.
There is an idiot in every town. I am sure the majority of Colombians have no bad feelings towards the British.
Well, they would hardly be welcoming a bloody great warship into their port if they did, would they?
Can you imagine what HMS Argyle could be doing if she had been deployed in anger, not friendship?
All this is distracting from the fact that the UK and Colombia are enjoying the best relations they have had for many many years.
Long May It Continue!
Fuckem!
Nov 11th, 2014 - 07:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0why should colombians respect english invasors, that they repelled???
Nov 11th, 2014 - 11:24 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Probably those english invasors would have subjugated them, why should they respect them with a plaque??? Put the plaque in England and end of history.
Umm Malen, the plaque was placed BY the COLOMBIANS.
Nov 12th, 2014 - 06:40 am - Link - Report abuse 0Why are people so stupid?
Placed by the Colombians to commemorate a battle between the English and the Spanish. Remember the Spanish? The people that subjugated most of South America?
Nov 12th, 2014 - 09:21 am - Link - Report abuse 0doh!
make a statue to Shakespeare colombians, better than to those invasors
Nov 12th, 2014 - 11:29 am - Link - Report abuse 0Yes make a statue to one of the world's most famous writers.
Nov 12th, 2014 - 11:47 am - Link - Report abuse 0An Englishman!
Spanish invaders or Portuguese invaders?
Nov 12th, 2014 - 12:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Hi guys , my apologies for chipping in but I can’t help to intervene in a good fight !
Nov 12th, 2014 - 03:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@60 isolde
Cartagena battle, the biggest defeat on the British Navy to date . Fact.
More than 50 British ships and 18000 British soldiers and sailors lost .Fact.
Decisive Spanish victory .Fact
Spanish Armada
Battle of Gravelines 600 dead and 4 boats lost .Fact
One the largest storms in century hit the armada after the battle .5000 Spanish dead by drowning and execution from the English when shipwrecked arrived to the Irish land . Fact
English casualties 8000 .mainly to disease fact
use another example honestly.....
@74 Spanish Mole,
Nov 12th, 2014 - 09:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“and God sent the wind & they were scattered”
Your facts are undoubtedly true, l'm not disputing them.
My point was what the Spanish lnvasion forces intended to do to the English.
Genocide of the English, pure & simple.
Somewhat like the Argentines had in store for the Falkland lsland population.
So because Spain wanted to obliterate (half)of my ancestors, l have absolutely NO sympathy for the Spanish casualties.
l do however, have great sympathy for the Spanish horses that were confined below decks.
Especially when the Armada was in the North Sea or once they had rounded Cape Wrath & were being hit by the Atlantic storms.
As l once said before, on this site, it must have been hell on earth for those poor creatures.
Drenched in freezing sea water, confined in a heaving, rolling hulk, slammed repeatedly against each other.
There would have been broken bones, splintered legs, loose equipment rolling each time the ship rolled.
Finally to sink.
True, the English in lreland did execute many survivors & often were enthusiastically assisted by the local lrish.
l remember reading that some Spaniards crossed from lreland to Scotland to escape.
And yes, l agree, Cartagena was a disaster for the British.
As l said, earlier on, the Colombians have every right to be proud of what their Spanish ancestors did in their defence of Cartagena.
Credit where its due.
That is an honest answer, Spanish Mole.
Peace.
@75 Isolde
Nov 13th, 2014 - 09:53 am - Link - Report abuse 0Genocide is a strong word ,nevertheless it is what we did in South America.
Very good reply
Isolde - very poor English, genocide at the hands of the Spaniards, ye got a lucky break of the storm. Lest us not forget which queen emptied her jails and captives and let them loose on the Iberian peninsula during the Napoleonic Wars. I am very happy to see that the plaque was smashed. What the heck was that Cartagena mayor thinking of. Traitor at best. It would be like erecting a plaque for the perps of 9-11.
Nov 13th, 2014 - 11:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@77 Sallus,
Nov 14th, 2014 - 09:39 am - Link - Report abuse 0lt seems that your grasp of history is somewhat shaky.
The storm certainly helped, but we had harried & captured/sank quite a few ships before the storm(s).
The Spanish fleet was intending to capture the lsle of Wight & use it as a base.
They were not able to do this due to being driven off by the English fleet.
Credit must be given to the bravery & seamanship of the English sailors.
Credit must be given to the superiority of design of the English ships.
We also sent the fireships in at Gravelines.
Those Spanish ships not burnt, cut their ropes & abandoned their anchors in their frenzy to escape.
The lack of anchors & the poor metallurgy of the surviving anchors ensured that many galleons came to grief on the west coasts of Scotland & lreland.
The Spanish fleet was technologically inferior to the English.
Some of the Spanish ships had been constructed for use in the Mediterranean.
Not sure but l think l read that some of them were Galleys with oars.
Completely unsuited to warfare in the Atlantic.
Spanish cannon balls were too small, so the small balls were dropped in molten iron to increase their size.
Result:- the outer iron coating was brittle & shattered on impact.
No penetration of the English hulls.
Poor casting of the Spanish anchors. Many snapped when the galleons were trying to avoid being swept onto the wild lrish shore.
l could go on.
*********************************************************************
Which Queen emptied the jails in the Napoleonic wars?
There were Kings on the throne at that time.
So what, anyway?
Do you think that war is an honourable profession?
War is war, & whatever it takes.
*******************************************************************
l agree, why put that plaque there?
lt was always going to cause controversy.
The plaque was put there by the Colombians as an act of friendship and respect to the UK.
Nov 15th, 2014 - 12:30 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Maybe they didn't expect the reaction of ONE idiot who could only express himself with a hammer, not a pen?
Isolde, I wouldn't bother taking the bait from Sallus/US Air Farce. Probably Stevie hiding behind another screen-name as usual. The tosser.
79 - Ilsen, who is Stevie? I have seen Farce's posts - anyways down by the barnyard. It would be like the English giving the Germans a plaque for their dead in the Battle of Britain; better still, the English giving the Argies a plaque for the dead in the Falklands. From what I hear in Bogota and Cali, there are great many Colombians upset over the whole thing. Did you see Isolde's excuse for the English's noble acts of War? This was the act of one idiot Mayor.
Nov 15th, 2014 - 03:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Hi Stevie!
Nov 15th, 2014 - 07:18 pm - Link - Report abuse 0:-)
Can everyone just agree this is an internal Colombian matter and stop blathering about lots of other wars?
Agree or disagree with the Mayor, it is a Colombian issue.
@ 79 ilsen,
Nov 15th, 2014 - 09:24 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You are correct of course, re Sallus.
Even if not Stevie, it is still a misinformed anti-British creature.
Facts don't mean too much to that sort of idiot.
@ 80 Sallus,
Are you real?
Do you think war is a game?
What is honourable about killing people?
You are demented to think like that.
Or you enjoy it,
ln which case you are a psychopath.
Adios Stevie.
@82 Isolde
Nov 15th, 2014 - 11:02 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I agree with what you said there.
And I also agree it is time to say
“Goodbye Stevie”. This constant string of false personas is not only cowardly, it is also very boring.
82/83 - Ilsen=Isolde: You just don't get it. Latin America still has resentment against Colonial intentions. That plaque is permanently removed and will not be replaced. People in Colombia are pissed. Here is an excerpt from the Cartagena councilman David Munera:
Nov 16th, 2014 - 01:23 am - Link - Report abuse 0“Se trata de una afrenta para la ciudad, es un error homenajear a los invasores, agregó.” here is the translation for you.
“This is about an affront for the City, it is an error to honor invaders, he added.”
This is not an ill informed anti British creation, this is an actual reflection of Latin American feeling, it is an entire continent. To boot, it is also pretty shameless to bring Camila Parker Bowles to an official visit. Colombia is over 90% Roman Catholic as holds extra marital affairs with disdain. That man with a hammer probably avoided further protest. My analogies went right over your head.
Still don't know who Stevie is...lost me.
Jesus how stupid can people be.
Nov 16th, 2014 - 02:07 am - Link - Report abuse 0COLOMBIANS
PLACED
THE
PLAQUE
Now tell me, which words are confusing you!
@85 Anglotino
Nov 16th, 2014 - 02:59 am - Link - Report abuse 0Stevie:Sallus still doesn't get it. This is a Colombian issue and nobody outside of Colombia gives a shit. Except this Argentine troll.
The Brits certainly don't care that a Colombian Mayor is having a little local problem about the text of some plaque. It is not even on their news radar. They don't care one way or another.
There is nothing to 'get'. He doesn't realise how un-important this is to 99.9% of the British population.
He thinks that because a few people post on this incredibly niche site that they represent the the entire UK population.
The ignorance of these trolls is shocking!
The real world has no interest in the local politics of Lat Am.
#86, Ilsen, why so angry? You obviously aren't a Brit or you wouldn't be replying to these posts regarding a local Colombian issue. As you stated
Nov 16th, 2014 - 03:38 am - Link - Report abuse 0“He doesn't realise how un-important this is to 99.9% of the British population”
Here is an article for you to peruse, it is in Spanish and I think there is a Portuguese version as well, but I highly doubt you speak anything other than London lower class Cockney English. Please enjoy:
http://www.elheraldo.co/bolivar/alcalde-de-cartagena-acepta-retirar-placa-en-honor-ingleses-172714
Te lo sugiero, tal vez abreras los ojos.
Oh do sod off Stevie.
Nov 16th, 2014 - 04:47 am - Link - Report abuse 0You say I am no British but then say I only speak Cockney.
I know all your silly games, and frankly, my dear, I don't give a damn.
COLOMBIANS
Nov 16th, 2014 - 04:52 am - Link - Report abuse 0PLACED
THE
PLAQUE
Thick Stevie,
Nov 16th, 2014 - 10:08 am - Link - Report abuse 0Read the post just before mine.
You can read, can't you?
nit-wit
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